Out of curiosity I chucked together a list of tyre clearances for comparison, using models current as of August 2024. TIME really are down amongst old models and lower cost brands, imho the only one that is more conspicuous is the new BMC Teammachine. N.B. many brands don't say if the clearance is width as measured or the actual tyre size regardless of what it inflates to on a wide rim, so probably best to be conservative and assume all numbers are WAM. 35 mm • 3T Strada Italia • Argonaut RM3 • Enve Melee • Pearson 1860 Forge 34 mm • Cannondale SuperSix Evo • Cervélo S5 • Simplon Pavo IV 33 mm • Giant TCR 32 mm • Allied Alfa • Argon 18 Sum / Sum Pro* • Basso Diamante / Diamante SV • Bianchi Oltre RC • Bianchi Specialissima RC • Canyon Aeroad • De Rosa 70 • Factor Ostro VAM • Look 795 Blade RS • Orbea Orca • Parlee Z-Zero RD • Quintana Roo SRSIX • Rose Xlite 06 • Seka Spear • Specialized Tarmac SL8 • Trek Madone (gen 8) • Wilier Verticale SLR 30 mm • Colnago V4RS** • Condor Leggero • Cube Litening Air • Dare VSRu • Focus Izalco Max • Giant Propel • Merida Reacto • Merida Scultrua • Orbea Orca Aero • Pinarello Dogma F (new)*** • Scott Foil RC • Simplon Pide II • TIME Scylon • Wilier Filante SLR 28 mm • BMC Teammachine (2024, Redbull engineered model!) • Cube Litening Aero * Argon 18 website states 30c (32mm) so assuming that's 32mm WAM. ** Tadej Pogačar runs ~32mm WAM at the rear. ***** Ineos ran 32 mm WAM on the old Dogma despite officially being 28 mm limit, so probably quite safe to run 32mm WAM on the new Dogma.
I’m on a rim brake bike with SRAM red axs which I got for a huge reduction earlier this year and that’s why I’m not riding discs. At some point I’ll upgrade to something like an SL6 on the second hand market for a fraction of the new price. In addition I have no issues riding in groups when it comes to braking performance so why should I change 🤷♂️
There are riders who choose rim for reasons other than financial. I prefer the feel and performance of rim frames. If you are a competent descender braking should not be a major concern. I ride carbon rims with latex tubes as well. Gen 4 ee's should handle most clearance concerns. D1 Red axs still has mechanical braking levers available, which are compatible with E1 axs. I purchased a new 2023 Basso Diamante Rim, so there are a couple of Italian companies still producing them.
@@pierrex3226 @Eramsay121 covered it, but I ride several tires that when inflated measure 31 no problem. Yes ee's are about 400 each but there are numerous counterfeit versions out there so be cautious. The tire fitment would be dependent on the frame more than the brakes imo. Direct mount ee's to my eye on my frame could clear 32's easily.
Time need to offer wider clearances to future proof there bikes. If you watch the Nero show they’ve said a few times that wider is better without any real downsides. So limiting the bike to 30mm with all the new developments re wider rims and tyres seems like a bad move to me.
@@Floemo yep heard that one and it was good. Just thought Paul and the crew would do a better job, given their actual real life knowledge and experience with the brand.
The mountain biking conversation is interesting, I think the bike parks are driving more and more people to DH bikes or trail centres to e-bikes. Everything else is somewhat being lost in the UK at least. Then with Fox seeing a drop in sales, are Rock Shox seeing the same thing?
Well... I must be an anomaly, as I'm interested in the Colnago rim bike.. and ride a super lightweight XC bike. There's loads of us with multiple rim wheelsets in the loft, and boxes of old groupset parts, 20 year old DA parts can work perfectly despite marketing telling us they shouldn't. So in a way it could be a smart business move as they can corner the market for anyone looking for a new rim frame - some of us have ridden hundreds of thousands of miles on rim brakes and had no issues with them. I do think they missed a trick though - in a way this retro reissue didn't need to be a high-end performance product, it could be made with lower modulus, simpler profiles - more like a reissue of a C40/ C50 slim tubed and aesthetic, bring the price down under £3k... and of course it must have a spangly art-deco paintjob. I know loads of riders who'd be into this, think of it more like the fact theres a huge market for re-issuing old air cooled Porsches vs modern sportscars.
I have no idea hat the decision makers at Time are thinking ??? Have they learned nothing from their own mistakes?? The Adhx was a great release but let down by the 38mn clearance , took them 2years and went to 45mm , why making the same mistake??? The winning formula formula in 2025 is easy, frame under 850g, all integrated aero optimized cockpit , room for 34mm tires , T47bb , $5500 max for the frame set. About the Colnago, all the rim brake purist should take a loan and buy one , ugly, overpriced, heavy , what is not to like?? Shimano , SRAM, Campy all offer rim brake electronic group sets , BB Evo 386 is not the only option that can handle any crank .
EXACTLY THIS: "The winning formula formula in 2025 is frame under 850g, all integrated aero optimized cockpit , room for 34mm tires , T47bb , $5500 max for the frame set."
TH-camrs generally say that if they put anything with the word "RIM" in the title, the video gets *10 the views. Imagine how much traffic Colnago has generated through its website with this release. I'd says that 99.999% of former Colnago buyers wouldn't consider a rim version, but on 'having a look', might think 'hmmm time for a new c68 in disc'.
Long live rim brakes and mechanical shifting! It's not a question of "reliving" anything. It's a question of living in style. Di2 and Disk Brakes are BS.
Agreed. Real world riders are fat and should be on 32C tyres. My rear tyre mesures 33.5mn, yes it looks like a tractor, and it's amazing on a deep 34mm wide wheel. From a resale value not clearing 32C is an issue. I'm not buying anything that can't clear that.
@@pierrex3226 did you see the NorCal video test on tire sizes? Very illuminating. TLDR; 32 was faster than 30, and 34 was slightly slower than 32 but faster than 30. All of this was done by Crit racers on a street course training layout they’ve been using for years .
@@albertosantangelo6872 well, that logic would say that 26mm (or the narrower tires used for decades) would be fastest and we *know* that’s not really true. Surface harmonics is a real thing - bouncing around isn’t conducive to speed.
TIME really do look to still be behind the times 😞 I suppose we have to accept the brand is still rebuilding, but even though the build quality may be peerless amongst carbon bike frames, it does feel very disappointing to hear that they went with low tyre clearance, classic geometry, and don't have an integrated cockpit. Still waiting for the killer combination of TIME's best attributes combined with LOOK's contemporary features and innovation. EDIT: to be fair, taller stack for aero with very bent elbows on the hoods sounds like it could be quite contemporary, so will be interesting to see the full details once it's released.
Why you need aero bike and big clearance. If comfort is so important, then try something like titanium bike with 35mm clearance. It is not much slower/heavy and defenitely more comfortable and durable
Coming from CX background much prefer disc over rim brake. Better stoping and control when technical then cantis. Plus not damaging rim with forcing micro debris into rim from pads when slowing. Not to mention wheel tureness was so critical with rim brakes. SRAM needs to take a week to a month off from product development and focus supply chain issues to fix it. Fix that then product development is easier and sales will come in better.
@@MapdecVodcastif your data are right the top tube and stack are almost the same as the new AdH X in size L…maybe I must wait the new Scylon instead of buying the AdH X 😂
The body language is hilarious and very insightful in this video. Unpicking who thinks he is the boss, desperate to be the boss etc. is not one you need an expert on hand for.
Rim brakes are the next big thing in cycling
watch this space
Out of curiosity I chucked together a list of tyre clearances for comparison, using models current as of August 2024. TIME really are down amongst old models and lower cost brands, imho the only one that is more conspicuous is the new BMC Teammachine.
N.B. many brands don't say if the clearance is width as measured or the actual tyre size regardless of what it inflates to on a wide rim, so probably best to be conservative and assume all numbers are WAM.
35 mm
• 3T Strada Italia
• Argonaut RM3
• Enve Melee
• Pearson 1860 Forge
34 mm
• Cannondale SuperSix Evo
• Cervélo S5
• Simplon Pavo IV
33 mm
• Giant TCR
32 mm
• Allied Alfa
• Argon 18 Sum / Sum Pro*
• Basso Diamante / Diamante SV
• Bianchi Oltre RC
• Bianchi Specialissima RC
• Canyon Aeroad
• De Rosa 70
• Factor Ostro VAM
• Look 795 Blade RS
• Orbea Orca
• Parlee Z-Zero RD
• Quintana Roo SRSIX
• Rose Xlite 06
• Seka Spear
• Specialized Tarmac SL8
• Trek Madone (gen 8)
• Wilier Verticale SLR
30 mm
• Colnago V4RS**
• Condor Leggero
• Cube Litening Air
• Dare VSRu
• Focus Izalco Max
• Giant Propel
• Merida Reacto
• Merida Scultrua
• Orbea Orca Aero
• Pinarello Dogma F (new)***
• Scott Foil RC
• Simplon Pide II
• TIME Scylon
• Wilier Filante SLR
28 mm
• BMC Teammachine (2024, Redbull engineered model!)
• Cube Litening Aero
* Argon 18 website states 30c (32mm) so assuming that's 32mm WAM.
** Tadej Pogačar runs ~32mm WAM at the rear.
***** Ineos ran 32 mm WAM on the old Dogma despite officially being 28 mm limit, so probably quite safe to run 32mm WAM on the new Dogma.
Good info. Well done. 👍
So basically we have 45 days to convince our wives that we need a new bike
And counting …
You guys should consider adding something under the microphones to to dampening the vibration coming from the table. Great chat as always.
Thanks for the tip. Sorry it got so noisy.
yep - every time you tap fingers on the table, or knock it with your hand/foot, a dull thud comes through the audio.
Please drop soon!
i cant find it on the website
If you guys get in the Skylon, can you test the tyre width with a number of wheels with differing internal widths?
I hope the new Skylon looks as good as the new adhx
I’m on a rim brake bike with SRAM red axs which I got for a huge reduction earlier this year and that’s why I’m not riding discs. At some point I’ll upgrade to something like an SL6 on the second hand market for a fraction of the new price. In addition I have no issues riding in groups when it comes to braking performance so why should I change 🤷♂️
There are riders who choose rim for reasons other than financial. I prefer the feel and performance of rim frames. If you are a competent descender braking should not be a major concern. I ride carbon rims with latex tubes as well. Gen 4 ee's should handle most clearance concerns. D1 Red axs still has mechanical braking levers available, which are compatible with E1 axs. I purchased a new 2023 Basso Diamante Rim, so there are a couple of Italian companies still producing them.
How much are legit EE calipers (pair)? And can you clear a tyre that measures 32mm? That sounds interesting
@@pierrex3226 EE Brakes are like $800 for a set, they're supposed to fit up to 31's but I reckon you could fit 32's depending on the frame
@@pierrex3226 @Eramsay121 covered it, but I ride several tires that when inflated measure 31 no problem. Yes ee's are about 400 each but there are numerous counterfeit versions out there so be cautious. The tire fitment would be dependent on the frame more than the brakes imo. Direct mount ee's to my eye on my frame could clear 32's easily.
Time need to offer wider clearances to future proof there bikes. If you watch the Nero show they’ve said a few times that wider is better without any real downsides. So limiting the bike to 30mm with all the new developments re wider rims and tyres seems like a bad move to me.
It was supposed to be released back in June?
Time CEO said first quarter of this year (source: Cycle Jerks Podcast)
Would be wonderful to grab an interview with the current Time owner, Tony Karklins and discuss their new facility and future aspirations.
We are talking about a factory visit when the South Carolina plant is fully open.
Marginal gains podcast has one with the Time owner.
@@Floemo yep heard that one and it was good. Just thought Paul and the crew would do a better job, given their actual real life knowledge and experience with the brand.
@@jerseybarrier64 Yes and please make time bring back components like seatposts and stems!
Don't forget to come to the Hammer Down Ride Center in Washington DC!! I'll get you set up on some TIME bikes....maybe even a Scylon!@@MapdecVodcast
@MapdecVodcast - maybe you meant 450 days? 😆 Any updates on the new Skylon?
lol. Yes. #freethescylon
4500 maybe 😅
Pirelli P zero are great but super fragile, I have a million cuts in my rear tire. Will probably switch back to Conti. Is there a new ADH Time coming?
I hope not. I don’t think it has a purpose when the Scylon launches.
The 4S version seems pretty robust to me and doesn't seem slow. I don't live in a flinty area though...
If you ask Time nicely would they be able to do custom features on their road bikes? I’m thinking mudguard mounts and SRAM udh compatibility
Ummm. This is apparently coming to the fluidity model.
@@MapdecVodcast I would lose my shit, new dream build
@@MapdecVodcast So no UDH on the new Scylon?
Paul, how does the new Ashville NC factory affect bike production at their factory in Slovenia?
Hopefully it just means they sell ore frames in the USA.
Will Time adopt the UDH in any of their bikes?
I hear it is considering for Fluidity.
Will it have a frame to fit my 85.5 cm seat height?
there is not a XXL on the geo chart.
@@MapdecVodcast 🙄
Will the Look 785 fit me?
The mountain biking conversation is interesting, I think the bike parks are driving more and more people to DH bikes or trail centres to e-bikes. Everything else is somewhat being lost in the UK at least.
Then with Fox seeing a drop in sales, are Rock Shox seeing the same thing?
I’d agree with that.
Well... I must be an anomaly, as I'm interested in the Colnago rim bike.. and ride a super lightweight XC bike. There's loads of us with multiple rim wheelsets in the loft, and boxes of old groupset parts, 20 year old DA parts can work perfectly despite marketing telling us they shouldn't. So in a way it could be a smart business move as they can corner the market for anyone looking for a new rim frame - some of us have ridden hundreds of thousands of miles on rim brakes and had no issues with them. I do think they missed a trick though - in a way this retro reissue didn't need to be a high-end performance product, it could be made with lower modulus, simpler profiles - more like a reissue of a C40/ C50 slim tubed and aesthetic, bring the price down under £3k... and of course it must have a spangly art-deco paintjob. I know loads of riders who'd be into this, think of it more like the fact theres a huge market for re-issuing old air cooled Porsches vs modern sportscars.
Yep. a £3k retro paintwork inspired frame. I could see the fun in that.
I have no idea hat the decision makers at Time are thinking ??? Have they learned nothing from their own mistakes?? The Adhx was a great release but let down by the 38mn clearance , took them 2years and went to 45mm , why making the same mistake??? The winning formula formula in 2025 is easy, frame under 850g, all integrated aero optimized cockpit , room for 34mm tires , T47bb , $5500 max for the frame set. About the Colnago, all the rim brake purist should take a loan and buy one , ugly, overpriced, heavy , what is not to like?? Shimano , SRAM, Campy all offer rim brake electronic group sets , BB Evo 386 is not the only option that can handle any crank .
EXACTLY THIS: "The winning formula formula in 2025 is frame under 850g, all integrated aero optimized cockpit , room for 34mm tires , T47bb , $5500 max for the frame set."
The Colnago is about marketing. It's got them in the news again and people talking about them. It gives Podgaca a rest before his next grand tour.
It certainly worked.
TH-camrs generally say that if they put anything with the word "RIM" in the title, the video gets *10 the views. Imagine how much traffic Colnago has generated through its website with this release. I'd says that 99.999% of former Colnago buyers wouldn't consider a rim version, but on 'having a look', might think 'hmmm time for a new c68 in disc'.
@@paulhshudson not as much as specialized or pinarello
Long live rim brakes and mechanical shifting! It's not a question of "reliving" anything. It's a question of living in style. Di2 and Disk Brakes are BS.
30mm tire clearance is a mistake, IMHO.
Agreed. Real world riders are fat and should be on 32C tyres. My rear tyre mesures 33.5mn, yes it looks like a tractor, and it's amazing on a deep 34mm wide wheel.
From a resale value not clearing 32C is an issue. I'm not buying anything that can't clear that.
@@pierrex3226 did you see the NorCal video test on tire sizes? Very illuminating. TLDR; 32 was faster than 30, and 34 was slightly slower than 32 but faster than 30. All of this was done by Crit racers on a street course training layout they’ve been using for years .
@@petersouthernboy6327nice video from NorCal but that has no statistical value. From a logical point of view 30mm is better for aerodynamics
@@albertosantangelo6872 well, that logic would say that 26mm (or the narrower tires used for decades) would be fastest and we *know* that’s not really true. Surface harmonics is a real thing - bouncing around isn’t conducive to speed.
@@petersouthernboy6327 yeah there is a trade-off between aero and vibration/rolling resistance etc, perhaps 30mm is the sweet spot for that bike
New TIME Scylon in 45 days? It's about time!
th-cam.com/video/44ithiPG5cc/w-d-xo.html
😂😂😂. I have seen it.
TIME really do look to still be behind the times 😞 I suppose we have to accept the brand is still rebuilding, but even though the build quality may be peerless amongst carbon bike frames, it does feel very disappointing to hear that they went with low tyre clearance, classic geometry, and don't have an integrated cockpit. Still waiting for the killer combination of TIME's best attributes combined with LOOK's contemporary features and innovation.
EDIT: to be fair, taller stack for aero with very bent elbows on the hoods sounds like it could be quite contemporary, so will be interesting to see the full details once it's released.
I can’t wait to ride one. Can’t imagine how that fork gets any stiffer.
Why you need aero bike and big clearance. If comfort is so important, then try something like titanium bike with 35mm clearance. It is not much slower/heavy and defenitely more comfortable and durable
30c is not wide enough for modern standards....
Maybe they will release a Scylon 45 later😂
Coming from CX background much prefer disc over rim brake. Better stoping and control when technical then cantis. Plus not damaging rim with forcing micro debris into rim from pads when slowing. Not to mention wheel tureness was so critical with rim brakes. SRAM needs to take a week to a month off from product development and focus supply chain issues to fix it. Fix that then product development is easier and sales will come in better.
So true.
Time Stamps please!
From your description the new Scylon looks more an all round bike than an aero bike, much like the new Madone
Yeah. you are right there.
@@MapdecVodcastif your data are right the top tube and stack are almost the same as the new AdH X in size L…maybe I must wait the new Scylon instead of buying the AdH X 😂
This takes TIME!
#freethescylon
@@MapdecVodcastmaybe they read the comments (tyre clearance?) and made some changes…maybe…😂
@@MapdecVodcast Do you have a ballpark price estimate for a frameset?
@ between £5000 and £600”
@@MapdecVodcast I’m buying it at both prices if it fits 😆
Still waiting! 🤦♂️
#freeTheScylon it’s in paint now apparently….
@@MapdecVodcastit’s like waiting for Christmas. God I hope it’s affordable
Does SRAM Axs rim (red and force) shifters not work with the new SRAM red axs rear and front mech?
That works ok. I was sure the rim brake levers had been discontinued.
Aaaaany updates?
yes.... but I am not allowed to say.
@@MapdecVodcast Still waiting. :) There is a local shop in my vicinity that sells Time bikes (got a ADHX45 there
"Hoping to keep it under 5 grand". 😳 Oof.
You could say that SRAM is going to put a stop to business. ROFL
😂
The Scylon uodate is a little disappointing in my view
@@vincesorrentino7871 Time is about engineering not marketing 😂
The body language is hilarious and very insightful in this video. Unpicking who thinks he is the boss, desperate to be the boss etc. is not one you need an expert on hand for.
Oh. Do tell.
@@MapdecVodcast Thanks for the reply after so many snubs. I am sure your expertise will work it out.