Some comments / unsolicited advice: a) I'm jealous that this has got so much attention lol, probably from all the comments feeding the algorithm... and I'm adding to that now. b) Try not to be phased by negative comments, happens all the time, don't take it personally, and don't respond in kind (makes things worse). c) Some quick testing shows that this might actually be less laggy than traditional ss3 filters. I've also updated my design to use a copper bulb, while keeping it completely dustless and 1wt... and it outperforms both the ss3 and the one you shared. However, lag improvements are marginal. Not sure it's entirely worth the added build effort.
I'd be curious to see your design too. I'm glad someone actually did the testing before claiming falsities lol.I just don't let disrespect slide, whether it's towards me or someone else. Making em cry in the replies is funny to me, AND it feeds the algorithm for the video with more engagement. 100% I remain conscious that if the negative comments ever get to a point where replying to them takes away from my ability to reply to the GOOD comments such as yours, I'd have to start ignoring the negative. But, I'm having my fun farming while I'm small 😆
First of all best simplistic explanation of why redstone dust is laggy ive seen. Secondly VERY interesting design. Its small conpact lag friendly. Easy to build. Ill give it a try the next time i need a sorter. Currently automating everything at my base. Also just starting out a redstone basics series feel free to check it out!
you shouldn't need the extra comparator to power the redstone dust in the tileable slices. The power level should only go between 2 and 3 for a standard filter setup, so as long as the builder builds the system, then sets the toggle states, it would work exactly the same.
These are likely to break if they pick up items with specific timings or if the chunks get unloaded, as the copper bulbs can get stuck in the wrong state. Best way to lag optimise filters is to send bigger batches of items so they don’t change state as often. Presentation is very good though and it is an interesting idea :))
While testing this on my creative redstone world I kept running into this issue while using water to transport the items. Very likely to break, bulb needs to mess up once on the timing and it'll empty itself sadly.
i've tested this design using water to transport the items and as you said the copper bulbs can sometimes get stuck in the wrong state, this will make the filter empty itself and then splash a higher redstone signal into the next slices if you are not careful, emptying the other filters. The design is very lag friendly but unlike using a redstone torch to lock the hopper this design is not all that reliable
This is the model Tangotek worked out with Pearlescent Moon for her game, about 2 months ago. It was done cause there was a very specific space constraint when building it.
The video was nicely laid out. However, the lag of dust is not that high in the case of item filters. The only cases where you should be wary of dust lag is when it is being pulsed quickly with no prepowering. In the case of the standard filter though, the dust are only changing by 1ss, and not that often either given most sort at 1x and even with 2x, the filter will not be changing state that often. Toggles are way worse instead though, as upon unloading while running they are far more likely to break than standard filters. The other issue with the toggles is that the copper bulb isn’t even easily resettable. At least a piston toggle can be reset automatically, but if these get in the wrong state then the player has to manually change and find any broken ones
I appreciate this. Something else you may consider mentioning (unless you did and I missed it) is that you could even use oxidized copper bulbs and light up the area a bit and you'll avoid lag from lighting updates, I believe.
@@TheRealYeller I watched while eating lunch, so I was mildly distracted as well, lol. Very cool video, though. I intend to look into converting my filters over once I'm more established on my server and have the necessary materials, since it's a bit more expensive, but seems a lot more reliable overall.
I haven't tested how it interacts with chunk borders since I now that's one thing that broke the impusle filters I was using in MY storage system, though it should be much more resistant to unloading since it only has one dust per filter
A bit of a note on this, the recent lighting engine change actually means that to generate any noticeable amount of lag with lighting updates now requires you to be trying very hard. Filling the spawn chunks of a world with flickering redstone lamps now can run fairly alright, only struggling with rendering, not lighting
that's awesome! But in my eyes, lag that can be dealt with easily is lag that should totally be dealt with. While it may work well on singleplayer or a small server, I wouldn't wanna put that much stress on a server trying to load lighting updates for hundreds to thousands of players at a single time. Still a great change that makes it even easier to deal with :)
0:50 iirc after 1.17 or something (I don't remember the exact version) dust got some performance improvements. It doesn't cascade updates when powered the same way it cascades when depowered. Each dust goes from 0 to the desired value in a single dust update. So technically your pulse extender demonstration is pretty much what's going on.
Thanks to the ability to stack multiple filters on top of each other in a small space, it is probably the best filter to use in an automatic warehouse in the nether! Thanks to this, you will be able to bypass the 9K item speed limit of individual hoppers! You almost made me want to redo my main warehouse!
A lovely embark extending on intuitions and taking a stab at a fundamental storage tech component! Sounds like you're enjoying yourself thoroughly =]. From my experience, the lag from dust is minimal in comparison to the lag from the item entities moving around. Broadly, dust in a storage system is not the primary cause of lag or lag spikes-hoppers, pistons/chests on the client, entities tend to be the major culprits. I'd target those facets of the storage as well if your aim is to reduce strain on the computer. As much as I am one for every MSPT saved counts, MSPT is also a resource to be used. In this case, the advantage of traditional dustful item filters is that they have one stable state, whereas these copper bulb item filters have two stable states: one where the copper bulb is default on that you show here, and works as expected. But, dangerously, as you're aware, copper bulb filters are also stable when the bulb is default off which will drain the filter hopper-and it only takes one filter hopper to lose its blocker items to cause a cascade of errors =[. Poor input timings, unfortunate chunk unloading, or even just basic user error will lead to that second outcome with no way to reset the circuit without player intervention. Redstone often runs up against Murphy's Law: anything that can go wrong will go wrong =\. I'd personally argue those risks associated with a critical toggle state are not worth small MSPT gains. Are there any particular systems you're hoping to use this circuitry for? I see on your channel you've been playing around with alternative item filter designs.
100% you are correct, but when I'm looking at busting lag, I'm trying reduce where I CAN. Can't really do anything about the lag caused by the hoppers in filter other than reducing the hoppers (already did that as far as I can with this layout) so reducing total dust updates was the only other way. I'm planning on using this in a storage system setup with a multi item sorter dispensing items at an interval of 8 GTS per unique item. By limiting the input stream of each unique item (or even batching items is even better for lag) it negates the breakage problems as long as it doesn't get unloaded while running 😀
redstone update also is only locked behind experimental features and are not a part of any update at this time. Working with current mechanics without experimental features still has redstone dust pretty laggy, and reducing that dust is pretty important for servers, especially those that run a vanilla experience with hundreds or thousands of players online at any gives moment
Mabe it's just me, but I wouldn't wanna spam togglestates on my sorters. There is a reason people tend to say "togglestateless" as an advantage. Imagine putting this in a larger system. If only one dust is powered for some reason (accidentally inputing a filer item into the system for example). Now you not only need to fix the filters, but you also have to reset the bulbs too, which is particularly bad because you can't easily power the bulb without breaking adjacent slices or accidentally flushing the filter items.
Make sure to either batch your items or limit the input stream to 1 item every 8 GTs. These would work well with a multi item unloader if that unloader is limited an item every 8 GTs for every unique item :)
Loved the video! Great explanation and even went and did the 2xhopper speed explaining how to set up the filter and all! Most tutorials forget to mention how to do thay 😂
So we are going from 5 dust updates/sorter to 1 for the tileable design. It would be interesting to see what difference this makes for a very large system.
there is one part of the lag I forgot to mention. Even just one dust provides block updates to all blocks around it, so its still more than one dust update per sorter, but much less than one that uses 2 or 3 dust per filter :)
@@TheRealYeller As people have been pointing out to Mojang for their redstone experiment already: The updates are not what makes dust laggy. In fact, it's only minimally worse than slanted rails in that regard. It's the way dust depowers from high signal strengths (which happens a lot like how receding water changes over time - it takes much longer when it covers more area - except that redstone repeats this within the same tick until nothing changes anymore). An item filter changes the signal strength only by 1, which makes it essentially as lag efficient as rails.
So whats the harm in trying to squeeze out some extra? You and a few others are dead set on the "its not THAT much more efficient" but so what? Your comments are helping no one, and are not constructive in the slightest. You have possibly the lowest brain capacity I've ever seen if you can't simply see that there is no harm in alternative designs. Don't like em? No one is forcing you to watch the video nor use the design, SO DON'T! Quit being a whiny lil brat in my comments and get on with your useless life
its funny you literally repeat exactly what I said in the beginning of my video. you even watch it or you ONLY sitting in the comments crying like a baby about a thumbnail and title?
Just gave it a little testrun and i am impressed, this is a great design for people on Multiplayer servers and solo ofc. point is i like it and it´s well designed !
@@TheRealYeller you dont even need it to set up the filter actually but i was hoping to use it just to change the redstone enough so that i could fit in a different sensor in ...decided to just space them out tho
If you use signs as your dummy items, you don't need 41 other items but 19 if I remember correctly, it has been a while since I last used auto storage. But still way less then 41. For stone it doesn't really matter but for more important items like diamonds, I like to lower the cost of the amount needed of the item in the system.
Careful not to do this while tiling as it will break adjacent slices if the filter overflows. Towards the end of the video I showed you can use nonstackable items as filler items to get your filtered items down to 18 :)
So, I recently designed a 1x and 2x speed one with similar designs as yours, but (including hopper and supportblocks) the 1x is 5x3 and the 2x is 6x4. Both are AB tileable and an AB slice uses 1 dust. That dust does update though, much like your tileable option.
Just silly idea, but if you do the dustless version you can make filter, composter, filter filter, composter, filter and you dont get your space halved but only one third will be wasted.
Should mention that the music is a little louder than it needs to be and competes with your voice for attention, especially with the speech-speed beat. Good video otherwise. This is a common thing I see on the site, even with huge channels, so don't be discouraged.
Yeah few others have said the same. It sounded fine while I was editing and after it was rendered, but after uploading, suddenly the music was much louder. Will certainly be toned down in the future :)
One question: Why? The design in the thumbnail is infinitely more expensive than the old one (per slice it requires 5 quartz, 14.25 redstone dust, and 0.25 blaze rods) and is way more annoying to built (upward-facing observer), not to mention toggle states (pulsed component state changes that do not naturally fall back into the correct state after an error) are an anti-pattern for making resilient contraptions that don't necessarily need to use toggling.
this does not break simple as. Build it right, and it works just the same as an impulse item filter with 3x LESS dust updates. This was ONLY designed to reduce dust updates, while maintaining overflow protection and tileablility. Use something else if you don't like it
@@TheRealYeller Oh, 3 less dust. Sure. You know that item filters are not exactly suffering from lag, right? It's a signal strength change of 1, which means the lag worst case of redstone dust doesn't apply. And, in fact, the copper bulb-based item filter approach was introduced back when copper bulbs were added in a snapshot. The people who know their storage tech immediately looked at the idea and found it to simply not be worth it - and that was with a smaller 1wt design than this. I'd argue that the amount of components this filter has means it's not actually any less laggy than the impulseSV version. I recommend *you* back up your claims with a proper test. The game has the tools with /tick sprint.
@@TheRealYeller Not as much as you seem to be crying about the criticism a youtube video received. It's okay to make mistakes, but not being able to handle criticism won't help your popularity. Or your mission, for that matter. I have a feeling you are now doubling down on the bad idea that the world is out to get you, but all people have been saying is that the design is trying to solve an issue that doesn't need fixing (redstone lag in item filters - that lag is way more important to fix in other types of contraptions), and it does so at a price that is way too high (materials and build effort). Granted, some may not have been particularly "diplomatic" about it, but that's no reason for that kind of response.
"Obsolete" and then Impulse comes right a back with a new revolutionary design by taking this and adding just 1 block of dust or something like that lol ~it would be funny if that actually happened.
that would be pretty hilarious. I already tried extending it to one block so I could get one item in the first slot, but alas, I haven't figured that out
Interesting video, hopefully with MoJang adding new redstone changes they could finally optimize chunk unloading with sorting systems. Or even just a new hopper block that allows filtering into chests but I think that'd ruin the fun of redstone.
comparator needs dust 💀 so it's actually not dustless but it's still way cheaper btw I don't call "redstone dusts" I call them "redstone wires" edit: I just see the word "kinda"
@@TheRealYeller but... the dust literally updates. not to mention the togglestate and extra cost. There are cheaper, smaller, more reliable, and cheaper alternatives that exist. You are being disingenuous and duplicitous by implying it's dust-updateless in any way, much less dustless.
watch the video dumbass not just the thumbnail. I showed true dustless. and so what if it has toggle states. none of that matters to the average player. The average player knows dust hurts their frames, so they try to stay from it. So what if there are better designs? USE THOSE INSTEAD THEN! No one is forcing you to use MY designs.
Thanks for the very good sorter, but I still don't understand why 41 sortable items are needed? I tried to do it in a different way by creating 1 sortable item and filling a funnel with 11 items each, and everything worked, but I didn't understand the difference, is there any difference, please explain?
You can set up the job block as a temp setup until the filter is setup. The job block can then be removed and you'll wanna quickly break and replace the redstone dust within 2 GTs and the filter should be good
@@TheRealYeller Thank you! I’ll have to see if I can pull of a sleight of hand on my bedrock server. 2 ticks is tight, but some trial might get her done.
Isn't light less of an issue now than before? Mojang reworked the lighting engine since Caves and Cliffs so micro optimizations around light updates may not be needed.
Most likely won't be needed, indeed. But it probably won't hurt, especially if build on a massive scale on a server with hundreds or thousands of players online at once :)
Ive been messing with item filters a lot recently and have been very annoyed at tile-ability, or the lack thereof at least. These will still work without the block gap, correct? Im trying to save space on my SMP with sorting mob drops
As long as you're using the tileable version shown, you don't need any gap between them, but be warned about using them for mob farms. Batch the item before sending them over the filters, or put them into a dropper setup limited to 8 GTs or they can break since they use toggle states. Batching is more important if you're using the 2x hopper speed ones
The pseudo dustless is already tileable. Unless you're talking about the tl2 wide tileable version. In which case you might be able to use some sort if a/b setup, but you still have to have the signal pointing directly into the side of the comparator with either a comparator or redstone dust. Just having a powered block, outside of a redstone block, doesn't work reliably
The mod is jade. The next couple videos I come out with are going to be going over the mods and resource packs I use. Links will all be available then 😀
No unfortunately that won't work. It'd just full power the note block. To tile you need to be able to observe the dust changing from 2 to 3. If it was just note blocks, they would just remain powered.
Would love to love your video, but THE BACKGROUND MUSIC IS TOO LOUD. I don't like music behind speech to begin with, but if it's unobtrusive, I can ignore it. Your music is too loud, and changes tempo and tone so much it's extra distracting.
I'm sorry it was fine in editing, but TH-cam IG decided the music needs to be louder. I'm looking at removing the music altogether for this video with the youtube editing feature *fingers crossed*
i wonder why doesn't the composter be replaced with item frame? i recently learnt about it and was wondering why it wasn't used on parts to replace the composter? is there any technical information about item frames that I'm missing out?
actually... that WOULD make it much more compact and make it totally dustless... Can't believe I missed out on that but I use ilmango's shulkerbox loader that uses that same thing xD. Edit wait no that would only work if you were wanting a FULL signal strength, but since we are carrying less than 15 signal strength, the signal will never carry. Certainly worth a video about some of these detection methods
This is nice, While harder to build it does remove the lag somewhat significantly if you tile them alot so its high effort high reward especially in a server And I love things that are high effort and risk kinda make the game more fun that way atleast for me...
Wouldn't having the sorter switched off when not in use be a better idea? Ive never built one as my ADHD brain would rather sort manually than commit to such a project.. but I am thanking that if you are only throwing in 1 inventory at a time wprth of stuff, you could just have it off, no? Then just go afk with a hot pocket for a bit
A building tutorial kind of messes up your watchtime when you can see how its made at any time in the video.. You don't have to make 10 minute videos either, this video would be better if it were 3 to 4 minutes. That being said, great video as always,!
I'm new to this channel. Some of these designs definitely won't work on Bedrock, but some look like they might. Do you test on Bedrock, or should I assume Java only?
Absolutely Java only outta me. My redstone doesn't work and I can't get the mods I want on bedrock. Vid coming soon on the mods I use that I think should be implemented into vanilla, though :)
I just built it on Bedrock and it doesn't not work, but the same can be said of the original Impulse filter which over time can miss items and act strangely, so needs extended testing to say for sure. It doesn't stop on 41 every time but this won't necessarily break it, either. I have a system using Ilmango's hopper minecart item filter converted for Bedrock which will also occasionally overdrain and that didn't cause any issues. I've even seen issues over time with the Bedrock-friendly version of the Impulse filter, though, from simply missing items to completely draining the filter hopper (I suspect that the latter has to do with chunks getting loaded or unloaded while it's actively working).
@@rvgn If you mean the one with the target block, that's the same I use (there was an earlier one that used soft inversion instead). It's more reliable than the Java version on Bedrock, but I've still had issues. Pretty sure those are more related to Bugrock than the actual design, though. Oddly, it does seem to be more reliable as far as not missing as many items when a water stream carries the items rather than a hopper chain.
It's incredibly stupid what a player has to go through for the auto crafter to work, they could have made it much much simpler and that way many players would actually use it
I honestly have the opposite opinion. It's perfect how it is, working smoothly with redstone, and adding a completely new category of redstone. New things should always work first with existing mechanics, rather than adding a whole new system
this is a problematic fix for a non existing problem. First, the lag generated by item filters is so negligible, it doesn't even matter if you are using redstone dust in this case. Secondly, copper blocks are so sensitive to chunk borders, if you have half your filter in a chunk and the other half in another chunk, unloading one without unloading the other will miss up your copper bulbs, and break the filter, and fixing it won't be easy.
Sorry it was really quiet when I was editing it, but I guess it comes through much louder when its been processed :( Certainly won't be the same going forward
@@TheRealYeller well as a Bedrocker, I’d appreciate the tweak knowledge. I ask one favour. Your producing content for Minecraft Java please put that in your thumbnail. Nothing worse than finding something for your world. Pick the spot, collect the resources, follow the build instructions, build. Let’s face it some builds are quick most aren’t. But you spend all that time and effort. Only to find out it was a total waste of time because it wasn’t for the version you play. Thanks.
I wish I could, but YT removed the feature that allowed you to remove music from your background unless you have a copyright strike against the video. The only way around it would be to reupload the video, and YT HATES reuploads for ANY reason :(
Please STOP using such "busy" background music, and lower it way down from the level it's at now! I can't focus on what you're saying over the massive distraction of the music, and I wasn't even able to finish watching this video because of how distracting the music is.
@@TheRealYeller I can appreciate your sentimentality, but That's kind of up to Mojang/Microsoft and they already decided Java gets the Edition moniker. Obviously it's your video and you can do what you want and I respect that.
@@TheRealYeller I am a Java player and I would say that, unless you've tested it and found it works on both Java and Bedrock, you should always label which version it works in so that it is clear to anyone looking for tutorials. I'm not saying Bedrock is the one with the label or Java is the one with the label, I'm saying unless you know it's both, let the viewer know which it works in up front.
Some comments / unsolicited advice:
a) I'm jealous that this has got so much attention lol, probably from all the comments feeding the algorithm... and I'm adding to that now.
b) Try not to be phased by negative comments, happens all the time, don't take it personally, and don't respond in kind (makes things worse).
c) Some quick testing shows that this might actually be less laggy than traditional ss3 filters. I've also updated my design to use a copper bulb, while keeping it completely dustless and 1wt... and it outperforms both the ss3 and the one you shared. However, lag improvements are marginal. Not sure it's entirely worth the added build effort.
I'd be curious to see your design too. I'm glad someone actually did the testing before claiming falsities lol.I just don't let disrespect slide, whether it's towards me or someone else. Making em cry in the replies is funny to me, AND it feeds the algorithm for the video with more engagement. 100% I remain conscious that if the negative comments ever get to a point where replying to them takes away from my ability to reply to the GOOD comments such as yours, I'd have to start ignoring the negative. But, I'm having my fun farming while I'm small 😆
First of all best simplistic explanation of why redstone dust is laggy ive seen. Secondly VERY interesting design. Its small conpact lag friendly. Easy to build. Ill give it a try the next time i need a sorter. Currently automating everything at my base. Also just starting out a redstone basics series feel free to check it out!
8 sided squares video about the debug features also showcases it pretty well
@@ThylineTheGay thanks I don't think I've seen their videos I'll have to check em out
you shouldn't need the extra comparator to power the redstone dust in the tileable slices. The power level should only go between 2 and 3 for a standard filter setup, so as long as the builder builds the system, then sets the toggle states, it would work exactly the same.
You're right... I can't believe didn't see that xD
@@TheRealYeller with this fix, you can build this with one less observer, and a redstone torch to lock 2 hoppers, like basic item filter config
These are likely to break if they pick up items with specific timings or if the chunks get unloaded, as the copper bulbs can get stuck in the wrong state. Best way to lag optimise filters is to send bigger batches of items so they don’t change state as often. Presentation is very good though and it is an interesting idea :))
Good point. Though breaking should be mitigated by batching the items as you mentioned or limiting the input to 8GTs :)
While testing this on my creative redstone world I kept running into this issue while using water to transport the items. Very likely to break, bulb needs to mess up once on the timing and it'll empty itself sadly.
@@Shadow2hell thats why togglestate based is not good, if the togglestate control the locking. it is not reliable enoguh
i've tested this design using water to transport the items and as you said the copper bulbs can sometimes get stuck in the wrong state, this will make the filter empty itself and then splash a higher redstone signal into the next slices if you are not careful, emptying the other filters. The design is very lag friendly but unlike using a redstone torch to lock the hopper this design is not all that reliable
This is the model Tangotek worked out with Pearlescent Moon for her game, about 2 months ago. It was done cause there was a very specific space constraint when building it.
Was it during a livestream? I've not found anything about it
The video was nicely laid out. However, the lag of dust is not that high in the case of item filters. The only cases where you should be wary of dust lag is when it is being pulsed quickly with no prepowering. In the case of the standard filter though, the dust are only changing by 1ss, and not that often either given most sort at 1x and even with 2x, the filter will not be changing state that often. Toggles are way worse instead though, as upon unloading while running they are far more likely to break than standard filters. The other issue with the toggles is that the copper bulb isn’t even easily resettable. At least a piston toggle can be reset automatically, but if these get in the wrong state then the player has to manually change and find any broken ones
I appreciate this. Something else you may consider mentioning (unless you did and I missed it) is that you could even use oxidized copper bulbs and light up the area a bit and you'll avoid lag from lighting updates, I believe.
I did mention this, but as someone else has already pointed out, my music was a bit loud xD
@@TheRealYeller I watched while eating lunch, so I was mildly distracted as well, lol. Very cool video, though. I intend to look into converting my filters over once I'm more established on my server and have the necessary materials, since it's a bit more expensive, but seems a lot more reliable overall.
I haven't tested how it interacts with chunk borders since I now that's one thing that broke the impusle filters I was using in MY storage system, though it should be much more resistant to unloading since it only has one dust per filter
A bit of a note on this, the recent lighting engine change actually means that to generate any noticeable amount of lag with lighting updates now requires you to be trying very hard. Filling the spawn chunks of a world with flickering redstone lamps now can run fairly alright, only struggling with rendering, not lighting
that's awesome! But in my eyes, lag that can be dealt with easily is lag that should totally be dealt with. While it may work well on singleplayer or a small server, I wouldn't wanna put that much stress on a server trying to load lighting updates for hundreds to thousands of players at a single time. Still a great change that makes it even easier to deal with :)
great video, but a little hard to hear you over the music
Noted!
0:50 iirc after 1.17 or something (I don't remember the exact version) dust got some performance improvements. It doesn't cascade updates when powered the same way it cascades when depowered. Each dust goes from 0 to the desired value in a single dust update. So technically your pulse extender demonstration is pretty much what's going on.
Thanks alot, specially whit that 2x hopper speed filter, we needed new tech
Specially with how big some of this storage tech was getting 😆
Thanks to the ability to stack multiple filters on top of each other in a small space, it is probably the best filter to use in an automatic warehouse in the nether! Thanks to this, you will be able to bypass the 9K item speed limit of individual hoppers! You almost made me want to redo my main warehouse!
A lovely embark extending on intuitions and taking a stab at a fundamental storage tech component! Sounds like you're enjoying yourself thoroughly =].
From my experience, the lag from dust is minimal in comparison to the lag from the item entities moving around. Broadly, dust in a storage system is not the primary cause of lag or lag spikes-hoppers, pistons/chests on the client, entities tend to be the major culprits. I'd target those facets of the storage as well if your aim is to reduce strain on the computer.
As much as I am one for every MSPT saved counts, MSPT is also a resource to be used. In this case, the advantage of traditional dustful item filters is that they have one stable state, whereas these copper bulb item filters have two stable states: one where the copper bulb is default on that you show here, and works as expected. But, dangerously, as you're aware, copper bulb filters are also stable when the bulb is default off which will drain the filter hopper-and it only takes one filter hopper to lose its blocker items to cause a cascade of errors =[.
Poor input timings, unfortunate chunk unloading, or even just basic user error will lead to that second outcome with no way to reset the circuit without player intervention. Redstone often runs up against Murphy's Law: anything that can go wrong will go wrong =\. I'd personally argue those risks associated with a critical toggle state are not worth small MSPT gains.
Are there any particular systems you're hoping to use this circuitry for? I see on your channel you've been playing around with alternative item filter designs.
100% you are correct, but when I'm looking at busting lag, I'm trying reduce where I CAN. Can't really do anything about the lag caused by the hoppers in filter other than reducing the hoppers (already did that as far as I can with this layout) so reducing total dust updates was the only other way. I'm planning on using this in a storage system setup with a multi item sorter dispensing items at an interval of 8 GTS per unique item. By limiting the input stream of each unique item (or even batching items is even better for lag) it negates the breakage problems as long as it doesn't get unloaded while running 😀
Redstone update greatly reduced lag, but with working on older mechanics, it will reveal if anything will break on newer updates
redstone update also is only locked behind experimental features and are not a part of any update at this time. Working with current mechanics without experimental features still has redstone dust pretty laggy, and reducing that dust is pretty important for servers, especially those that run a vanilla experience with hundreds or thousands of players online at any gives moment
Title: "Dustless"
Thumbnail: "Dust"
Video: both
Mabe it's just me, but I wouldn't wanna spam togglestates on my sorters. There is a reason people tend to say "togglestateless" as an advantage. Imagine putting this in a larger system. If only one dust is powered for some reason (accidentally inputing a filer item into the system for example). Now you not only need to fix the filters, but you also have to reset the bulbs too, which is particularly bad because you can't easily power the bulb without breaking adjacent slices or accidentally flushing the filter items.
to each their own
Glad to find this right before I started my storage build
Make sure to either batch your items or limit the input stream to 1 item every 8 GTs. These would work well with a multi item unloader if that unloader is limited an item every 8 GTs for every unique item :)
Amazing. Great to see new innovation on the old filter tech.
The other comments covered it - clear and helpful, why and then how. Thanks mate!
Imagine trying to explain this to someone who hasn’t “played” Minecraft before.
Item Filter Revolution before GTA VI
Loved the video!
Great explanation and even went and did the 2xhopper speed explaining how to set up the filter and all! Most tutorials forget to mention how to do thay 😂
So we are going from 5 dust updates/sorter to 1 for the tileable design. It would be interesting to see what difference this makes for a very large system.
there is one part of the lag I forgot to mention. Even just one dust provides block updates to all blocks around it, so its still more than one dust update per sorter, but much less than one that uses 2 or 3 dust per filter :)
@@TheRealYeller As people have been pointing out to Mojang for their redstone experiment already: The updates are not what makes dust laggy. In fact, it's only minimally worse than slanted rails in that regard. It's the way dust depowers from high signal strengths (which happens a lot like how receding water changes over time - it takes much longer when it covers more area - except that redstone repeats this within the same tick until nothing changes anymore). An item filter changes the signal strength only by 1, which makes it essentially as lag efficient as rails.
So whats the harm in trying to squeeze out some extra? You and a few others are dead set on the "its not THAT much more efficient" but so what? Your comments are helping no one, and are not constructive in the slightest. You have possibly the lowest brain capacity I've ever seen if you can't simply see that there is no harm in alternative designs. Don't like em? No one is forcing you to watch the video nor use the design, SO DON'T! Quit being a whiny lil brat in my comments and get on with your useless life
its funny you literally repeat exactly what I said in the beginning of my video. you even watch it or you ONLY sitting in the comments crying like a baby about a thumbnail and title?
wow the double hopper one is very cool
Thank god people like you exist, because I'm too stupid to build redstone on my own . -.
There's a difference between stupidity and ignorance. You just haven't had anyone explain it to you in a way you understand yet!
Crafted way too many sheers a while back. Now I have a use for them. =)
you can use froglights instead of the white concrete to make it light up to never change light level
Just gave it a little testrun and i am impressed, this is a great design for people on Multiplayer servers and solo ofc. point is i like it and it´s well designed !
Glad you like it!
It would be interesting to try the old design with the new redstone experiments
Very cool design, I’m gonna use some of these in my world
And also, instead of 41 useful items, you can put 11 flags as a filter item and 1 useful item. Useful especially for rare items
I Wouldn't recommend doing that for the tileable version tho, as that will 100% break adjacent slices
1:42 Say no more I am subbing without you saying sub
bruh i did not think of the composter system on the back XD thank you this might fix my problem i was having hahah
You actually don't even need it outside of initially setting up the filter :)
@@TheRealYeller you dont even need it to set up the filter actually but i was hoping to use it just to change the redstone enough so that i could fit in a different sensor in ...decided to just space them out tho
If you use signs as your dummy items, you don't need 41 other items but 19 if I remember correctly, it has been a while since I last used auto storage. But still way less then 41. For stone it doesn't really matter but for more important items like diamonds, I like to lower the cost of the amount needed of the item in the system.
Careful not to do this while tiling as it will break adjacent slices if the filter overflows. Towards the end of the video I showed you can use nonstackable items as filler items to get your filtered items down to 18 :)
@@TheRealYeller Yeah yours is smarter.
>Build dustless item filter
>Look inside
>Dust
So, I recently designed a 1x and 2x speed one with similar designs as yours, but (including hopper and supportblocks) the 1x is 5x3 and the 2x is 6x4. Both are AB tileable and an AB slice uses 1 dust. That dust does update though, much like your tileable option.
Just silly idea, but if you do the dustless version you can make filter, composter, filter filter, composter, filter and you dont get your space halved but only one third will be wasted.
Love the explanation and the design. Easy subscribe
Should be called minimal dust. Clearly not dustless yet.
the 2 wide tileable IS dustless. Dustless and dust updateless are used interchanchably since they are effectively the same
Clickbait, existing.
@@jjeshop it's not clickbait if the watcher doesn't understand what it means
it's effectively dustless
Should mention that the music is a little louder than it needs to be and competes with your voice for attention, especially with the speech-speed beat. Good video otherwise. This is a common thing I see on the site, even with huge channels, so don't be discouraged.
Yeah few others have said the same. It sounded fine while I was editing and after it was rendered, but after uploading, suddenly the music was much louder. Will certainly be toned down in the future :)
@@TheRealYeller I love it when programs behave the right way the first time without any wrench smacking.
One question: Why?
The design in the thumbnail is infinitely more expensive than the old one (per slice it requires 5 quartz, 14.25 redstone dust, and 0.25 blaze rods) and is way more annoying to built (upward-facing observer), not to mention toggle states (pulsed component state changes that do not naturally fall back into the correct state after an error) are an anti-pattern for making resilient contraptions that don't necessarily need to use toggling.
Why NOT?
this does not break simple as. Build it right, and it works just the same as an impulse item filter with 3x LESS dust updates. This was ONLY designed to reduce dust updates, while maintaining overflow protection and tileablility. Use something else if you don't like it
@@TheRealYeller Oh, 3 less dust. Sure. You know that item filters are not exactly suffering from lag, right? It's a signal strength change of 1, which means the lag worst case of redstone dust doesn't apply. And, in fact, the copper bulb-based item filter approach was introduced back when copper bulbs were added in a snapshot. The people who know their storage tech immediately looked at the idea and found it to simply not be worth it - and that was with a smaller 1wt design than this. I'd argue that the amount of components this filter has means it's not actually any less laggy than the impulseSV version.
I recommend *you* back up your claims with a proper test. The game has the tools with /tick sprint.
so what? you gonna cry about a youtube video?
@@TheRealYeller Not as much as you seem to be crying about the criticism a youtube video received. It's okay to make mistakes, but not being able to handle criticism won't help your popularity. Or your mission, for that matter. I have a feeling you are now doubling down on the bad idea that the world is out to get you, but all people have been saying is that the design is trying to solve an issue that doesn't need fixing (redstone lag in item filters - that lag is way more important to fix in other types of contraptions), and it does so at a price that is way too high (materials and build effort). Granted, some may not have been particularly "diplomatic" about it, but that's no reason for that kind of response.
Hermitcraft is gonna change forever. When it comes to storage systems.
And when it becomes 1 block
And smaller at the same time
If you're worried about light, why not use frog lamps instead of glass? I'd guess it's just an example for 'ease of use'
Very much could use frog light instead of glas. I just used glass so it's easy to see what goes where 😀
Great video!
Check the description!
Someone who watched this video made one even better :)
And he was able to explain some of the intricacies better than I.
"Obsolete" and then Impulse comes right a back with a new revolutionary design by taking this and adding just 1 block of dust or something like that lol
~it would be funny if that actually happened.
that would be pretty hilarious. I already tried extending it to one block so I could get one item in the first slot, but alas, I haven't figured that out
to me and any other average player overstacking and ssi has 0 meaning dude
Interesting video, hopefully with MoJang adding new redstone changes they could finally optimize chunk unloading with sorting systems. Or even just a new hopper block that allows filtering into chests but I think that'd ruin the fun of redstone.
comparator needs dust 💀
so it's actually not dustless but it's still way cheaper
btw I don't call "redstone dusts" I call them "redstone wires"
edit: I just see the word "kinda"
Dustless Item Filter, all you need is 1 redstone dust. Should maybe change the title to dust update less
Dustless and dust updateless are used interchangeably. They are effectively the SAME
@@TheRealYellerDust update at 5:50 btw
literally watch 10 more seconds. You're SO close
@@TheRealYeller6:26 “And a redstone dust…”
just cuz your tiny brain doesn't know what "dustless" means, doesn't mean you're right :)
that is so unnecessary. i love it
Dustless
Look into it
Dust
dustless just refers to not having dust updates
@@TheRealYeller Yeah I know, I just found it funny. Anyway, great video !
@@TheRealYeller but... the dust literally updates. not to mention the togglestate and extra cost. There are cheaper, smaller, more reliable, and cheaper alternatives that exist. You are being disingenuous and duplicitous by implying it's dust-updateless in any way, much less dustless.
watch the video dumbass not just the thumbnail. I showed true dustless. and so what if it has toggle states. none of that matters to the average player. The average player knows dust hurts their frames, so they try to stay from it. So what if there are better designs? USE THOSE INSTEAD THEN! No one is forcing you to use MY designs.
If you want people to use other designs so bad, then make you own damn video instead of joining the others, crying about MY video
Oh, am I here by 380 subs at the next big redstone youtuber? Lol
You betcha! I won't stop til I reach the top, then I'll keep on goin!
Thanks for the very good sorter, but I still don't understand why 41 sortable items are needed? I tried to do it in a different way by creating 1 sortable item and filling a funnel with 11 items each, and everything worked, but I didn't understand the difference, is there any difference, please explain?
The 41 items is the overflow protection so it doesn't break the ones next to it when tiling them.
I want to use your double-speed, but without using any job blocks to get your power level to 2. Any ideas?
You can set up the job block as a temp setup until the filter is setup. The job block can then be removed and you'll wanna quickly break and replace the redstone dust within 2 GTs and the filter should be good
@@TheRealYeller Thank you! I’ll have to see if I can pull of a sleight of hand on my bedrock server. 2 ticks is tight, but some trial might get her done.
Isn't light less of an issue now than before? Mojang reworked the lighting engine since Caves and Cliffs so micro optimizations around light updates may not be needed.
Most likely won't be needed, indeed. But it probably won't hurt, especially if build on a massive scale on a server with hundreds or thousands of players online at once :)
Ive been messing with item filters a lot recently and have been very annoyed at tile-ability, or the lack thereof at least. These will still work without the block gap, correct? Im trying to save space on my SMP with sorting mob drops
As long as you're using the tileable version shown, you don't need any gap between them, but be warned about using them for mob farms. Batch the item before sending them over the filters, or put them into a dropper setup limited to 8 GTs or they can break since they use toggle states. Batching is more important if you're using the 2x hopper speed ones
I don't like dust, it makes me sneeze
Would it make the semi dustless version tileable by alternating the redstone dust and concrete block on the top?
The pseudo dustless is already tileable. Unless you're talking about the tl2 wide tileable version. In which case you might be able to use some sort if a/b setup, but you still have to have the signal pointing directly into the side of the comparator with either a comparator or redstone dust. Just having a powered block, outside of a redstone block, doesn't work reliably
can you give me a link to the "block indicator".. the mod that shows you information about the block you are looking at
Thx
The mod is jade. The next couple videos I come out with are going to be going over the mods and resource packs I use. Links will all be available then 😀
Use two noteblocks for the tileable one instead of a block and dust? Or will that not work?
No unfortunately that won't work. It'd just full power the note block. To tile you need to be able to observe the dust changing from 2 to 3. If it was just note blocks, they would just remain powered.
ooor mojang just fixes redstone dust
It be great to see those changes make their way into snapshots instead of just experimental features... *fingers crossed its soon*
Dustless, but there's one piece lol
As I've said to plenty of others already, dustless only refers to no dust updates
The music made it kinda hard to hear
cool video but lower the music next time
100% wish YT didn't remove the feature that let's us remove background music :( gotta love losing experimental features when you need em
Ok, this is the best thing I've seen since the WAIFU
Also, this isn't better just because of less redstone dust, this is better because of *no redstone torch*!! Those things are painful to work with.
Would love to love your video, but THE BACKGROUND MUSIC IS TOO LOUD. I don't like music behind speech to begin with, but if it's unobtrusive, I can ignore it. Your music is too loud, and changes tempo and tone so much it's extra distracting.
I'm sorry it was fine in editing, but TH-cam IG decided the music needs to be louder. I'm looking at removing the music altogether for this video with the youtube editing feature *fingers crossed*
I don't think this is worth the materials.. but nice to see the possibility
could you please tell me the texture pack you are using? it looks so clean
Its a mix of vanilla tweaks and 64x faithful and a few others.
I can almost hear the music can you be a lil quieter
i wonder why doesn't the composter be replaced with item frame? i recently learnt about it and was wondering why it wasn't used on parts to replace the composter? is there any technical information about item frames that I'm missing out?
actually... that WOULD make it much more compact and make it totally dustless... Can't believe I missed out on that but I use ilmango's shulkerbox loader that uses that same thing xD.
Edit wait no that would only work if you were wanting a FULL signal strength, but since we are carrying less than 15 signal strength, the signal will never carry. Certainly worth a video about some of these detection methods
@@TheRealYeller ooh, i see! looking forward to more of your content man :D
Music could be a bit quieter
Seems good to me
This is nice, While harder to build it does remove the lag somewhat significantly if you tile them alot so its high effort high reward especially in a server And I love things that are high effort and risk kinda make the game more fun that way atleast for me...
Btw, the lag is barely noticeable in the case of an item filter, so it’s higher effort for barely any difference if at all
Wouldn't having the sorter switched off when not in use be a better idea? Ive never built one as my ADHD brain would rather sort manually than commit to such a project.. but I am thanking that if you are only throwing in 1 inventory at a time wprth of stuff, you could just have it off, no? Then just go afk with a hot pocket for a bit
You'll want to set these up before hand. Just throwing items in and hoping they fill like a normal impulse sorter will break them :(
What's the mod at 1:29 that shows some tabs above the hopper inventory?
It's called inventory tabs. I have a couple video coming thay will explain all the mods and resource packs I use :)
A building tutorial kind of messes up your watchtime when you can see how its made at any time in the video..
You don't have to make 10 minute videos either, this video would be better if it were 3 to 4 minutes.
That being said, great video as always,!
You're probably right, but its less for watchtime, and more for practicing talking on "camera" :)
do I still need to leave one tile of space for items that stack to 16 with this design?
nope. works exactly the same as the impulse sorter as long as you don't put extra filler items :)
I'm new to this channel. Some of these designs definitely won't work on Bedrock, but some look like they might. Do you test on Bedrock, or should I assume Java only?
Absolutely Java only outta me. My redstone doesn't work and I can't get the mods I want on bedrock. Vid coming soon on the mods I use that I think should be implemented into vanilla, though :)
I just built it on Bedrock and it doesn't not work, but the same can be said of the original Impulse filter which over time can miss items and act strangely, so needs extended testing to say for sure. It doesn't stop on 41 every time but this won't necessarily break it, either. I have a system using Ilmango's hopper minecart item filter converted for Bedrock which will also occasionally overdrain and that didn't cause any issues. I've even seen issues over time with the Bedrock-friendly version of the Impulse filter, though, from simply missing items to completely draining the filter hopper (I suspect that the latter has to do with chunks getting loaded or unloaded while it's actively working).
it is not relogproof on bedrock. like at all.
@@sambuma my go-to design is from silent whisperer. It's similar to impulse's but gets rid of the repeater. I've never had any trouble with it.
@@rvgn If you mean the one with the target block, that's the same I use (there was an earlier one that used soft inversion instead). It's more reliable than the Java version on Bedrock, but I've still had issues. Pretty sure those are more related to Bugrock than the actual design, though. Oddly, it does seem to be more reliable as far as not missing as many items when a water stream carries the items rather than a hopper chain.
you have amys baking company level of bad pr my bro
You gonna cry about it too? Need a tissue?
@@TheRealYeller how nice to care about your local commenter yes please i would like a tissue👍
Nice
It's incredibly stupid what a player has to go through for the auto crafter to work, they could have made it much much simpler and that way many players would actually use it
I honestly have the opposite opinion. It's perfect how it is, working smoothly with redstone, and adding a completely new category of redstone. New things should always work first with existing mechanics, rather than adding a whole new system
Personally i like the challenge
kind of obsolete in new experimental version
how so? dust will still be giving SOME updates, just reduced. This will only get even LESS lag with the experimental updates
@@TheRealYeller yes, but now that it's (extremly) less lagy, it's even less worth it to use these expensive materials
to each their own
Am a Redstoner on bedrock so
this is a problematic fix for a non existing problem.
First, the lag generated by item filters is so negligible, it doesn't even matter if you are using redstone dust in this case. Secondly, copper blocks are so sensitive to chunk borders, if you have half your filter in a chunk and the other half in another chunk, unloading one without unloading the other will miss up your copper bulbs, and break the filter, and fixing it won't be easy.
Also having "Dustless" in the title and Dust in the thumbnail? make me think this is an early April fool's video.
So what?
Watch the video there is dustless. Don't cry about there being a dust in that either because "dustless" just refers to no dust updates.
omg the music is so damn loud
Sorry it was really quiet when I was editing it, but I guess it comes through much louder when its been processed :(
Certainly won't be the same going forward
World download? I would like to mess with these,,,
Description is updated with a world DL :)
@@TheRealYeller thank you
So Bedrock or Java?
Java. But can work with a few tweaks on bedrock
@@TheRealYeller well as a Bedrocker, I’d appreciate the tweak knowledge. I ask one favour. Your producing content for Minecraft Java please put that in your thumbnail. Nothing worse than finding something for your world. Pick the spot, collect the resources, follow the build instructions, build. Let’s face it some builds are quick most aren’t. But you spend all that time and effort. Only to find out it was a total waste of time because it wasn’t for the version you play. Thanks.
Does it work on bedrock?
Maybe? I dunno. I only play on Java. Can't understand redstone on bedrock LOL xD
It works with a few tweaks. But its almost 1 to 1
Just a comment on the video editing: lose the background music or turn it waaay down. It's fighting with your voice and very distracting.
I wish I could, but YT removed the feature that allowed you to remove music from your background unless you have a copyright strike against the video. The only way around it would be to reupload the video, and YT HATES reuploads for ANY reason :(
Ooooooooooo
Just use sodium lol
I use ALL the performance mods, but not everyone is lucky enough to be ABLE to use mods
Claims "dustless", proceeds to use dust. 🤦
Dustless refers to no dust updates. Sorry your tiny brain can't handle that
@@TheRealYeller why do u keep insulting people for not knowing the proper definition?
@@TheRealYeller dustLESS means no dust at all, so if your brain is so big whos that possible you cant handle these small details
@@Nebula_Kakapo Because he knows he's wrong and insulting people makes them focus on that instead.
@@Krymms no... he's right. the point of going dustless is to prevent dust updates.
Please STOP using such "busy" background music, and lower it way down from the level it's at now!
I can't focus on what you're saying over the massive distraction of the music, and I wasn't even able to finish watching this video because of how distracting the music is.
Might want to flag this as Java edition, since "Minecraft" refers to bedrock edition.
Nope. Java is, always has been, and always will be the original version. Bedrock needs the flag
@@TheRealYeller I can appreciate your sentimentality, but That's kind of up to Mojang/Microsoft and they already decided Java gets the Edition moniker. Obviously it's your video and you can do what you want and I respect that.
@@TheRealYeller I am a Java player and I would say that, unless you've tested it and found it works on both Java and Bedrock, you should always label which version it works in so that it is clear to anyone looking for tutorials.
I'm not saying Bedrock is the one with the label or Java is the one with the label, I'm saying unless you know it's both, let the viewer know which it works in up front.