Finally Proper Machine Controls - Electrical Cabinet For My Mini Lathe
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 21 ก.ย. 2023
- Button foils on Ebay: www.ebay.de/itm/394895504865
This was a long one! Almost two years ago I begun the plannings of a proper electrical cabinet and electric machine controls for my Mini Lathe. The reason for this was that the original motor controls died all of a sudden. This seemed to be a common problem on these Mini Lathes and instead of buying a replacement circuit board for quite some money I decided to change to a completely new set of brushless servo motor and controller.
These sets are sold for a reasonable price intentionally for industrial sewing machines but they also work great in the use on small machine tools.
I chose a motor with 500W which is extremely powerfull especially on low speeds. After almost two years of use I'm still very happy with this decision.
The only thing which bothered me since back then was the motor control box which was just flying around behind the machine, impractical to reach and unsecure to use.
So I designed a custom electrical cabinet which a friendly colleague manufactured for me from solid 1,5mm sheet metal steel. As I wanted the look of industrial standard machine tools, I decided to install a proper main power switch and a double push button for starting the machine controls. In addition to that I installed an emergency switch and working hour meter in the new electrical cabinet.
For the electronics I got the kind support from Eaton, Klinger&Born und from Harting. Many thanks to the companies for supporting my work!
I finally had to made my own button foils for the motor control panel. If you are interested you can find them on ebay for your own projects. Link is below.
Eaton send me the double push button:
- www.eaton.com/us/en-us.html
- www.eaton.com/de/de-de/skuPag...
Klinger&Born provided me the emergency switch, main power switch and contactor:
- www.klibo.de
- www.klibo.de/nockenschalter?L...
- www.klibo.de/schuetz-abb-b7
- www.klibo.de/abb-not-aus-komp...
Harting for the Han 3A connectors:
- www.harting.com
Replacement button foils for brushless servo motor kits:
- www.ebay.de/itm/394878027994
Brushless servo motor for industrial sewing machines:
-www.ebay.de/itm/374728301900
I hope you enjoy this episode.
Feel free to comment and let me hear your thoughts and suggestions.
Thanks for watching my videos. Subscribe to the channel for more mechanical and machining content.
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/ wecandothatbetter - วิทยาศาสตร์และเทคโนโลยี
Engineering on the fly when you find missed calculations in the original design yet still pulling the project across the finish line is a skill set all on its own. I have enjoyed every video of this lathe's transformation and have definitely taken a fair share of notes for my own very similar machine. I look forward to many many more videos of this machine in action.
Thank you very much for your kind comment! I really do appreciate that. Happy to hear, you like it and could take some inspiration out of it.
We are happy that we could support the project. The video has become great. We are looking forward to further projects and have subscribed to your channel 🔔
Thank you so much for support! I'm really happy with how everything turned out und are really satisfied with the professional look of your connectors on the motor. Thank you so much for subscribing!
Eine kleine Warnung:
Ich habs dir glaub ich schonmal beim Motor-Umbau geschrieben. Die 5V von der Steuerplatine sind nicht safe. Das interne Netzteil trennt die 5V nicht von den 230V! (Ich hab den selben Servo) Also sind auf den Pinnen des Steckers am Schaltschrank 230V. Sei also vorsichtig! Am Schaltschrank nimmt man übrigens Buchsen und keine Stecker. Man macht das, damit man nicht auf stromführende Pinne fassen kann, falls der Stecker mal nicht eingesteckt ist. Was ja bei dir ja auch der Fall ist. (Ich bin übrigens Elektriker in der Industrie)
Schöner Umbau, ich muss meinen auch mal machen. Bei mir hängt die Steuerung auch nur an der Wand.....
Hi und danke dir für den Kommentar! Genau, das mit den potentiell gefährlichen 230V habe ich schon gehört. Kann ich mich da irgendwie vor schützen oder ist alles gut, solange der Schaltschrank zu ist? Und das mit den Pins betrifft den Sensorstecker oder? Beim Motorkabel habe ich darauf geachtet, beim Sensorstecker leider nicht. Danke für den Tipp!
Outstanding work as always, my friend. You are slowly turning the mini lathe into what we all wish it was from the factory.
Thank you very much! I really do appreciate that. Yes, it's slowly becoming a real machine. And when I'm done, I probably need a bigger one :)
Great stuff. I believe that stopping all motion is sufficient as per CE requirements. Doing the same project but for WM210 now. Don't plan to dismember the original controls box since it shows RPM of the motor and not the spindle - and the only other function of that keypad is reverse which I rarely need. The analog control voltage for the RPM works weird, it's non-linear, most RPM modes are concentrated in 3-4V range. Another problem is noise on low RPM. But for under 100 EUR for motor with controller (and no need for power supply) I don't complain :) Good luck with your eBay undertaking. Consider selling some ELS, that will relieve you from some more time and money 😁
Hi and thanks for your kind comment! Yes, these kits are not the ultimate best option for our machines but for the price you get really a lot. A proper vfd drive or something would be better, but as long as I use it I'm very happy with the choice.
And yes, the ebay thing is just a try ;) I had to order 100 pieces of the foil, so a lot of these flying around now without use. Perhaps someone needs one but I know this is very special and probably no one will buy :D
Add a little timer of few seconds that switches all power off after pressing emergency switch. The way it is now it is just disaster waiting to happen!
Thanks for your comment! Do timers exist for this purpose? That sounds like a neat idea, thanks!
Not sure, but it is not too hard to DIY. @@WeCanDoThatBetter
@@WeCanDoThatBetter
Yes, the timer to maintain a function after turning off is an off delay timer. Commonly labeled as a TOF Timer Off Delay. The other type is an on timer labeled as a TON Timer On Delay. A DIN rail mount terminal strip style would fit well for your project as would a din rail base plug in style of timer.
An OFF Delay timer would work best to provide a maintained STOP function after the button has been released and prevent crazy shut down confusion.
You certainly have all the good qualities of a German engineer! Looking at the many YT videos about mini lathe upgrades it seems a more economical idea to save up money and buy a bigger one for double the price. Many of the upgrades seem to be expensive, and of course the bigger size can never be reached by upgrading.
Agree?
Fantastic upgrade and update!
Thank you very much!
Your Emergency Stop should ve a maintained function button and stay in off position after being pushed. Emergency Stop should prevent the machine from running while any control component has failed. Emergency Stop button being hardwired to de-energize the power of all outputs has been typical. Using control function to achieve a stop during an emergency when the components used can also fail and no longer stop the machine is looking for trouble. Be cautious with controls so you no longer miss potential nightmares.
A TOF Timer Off Delay is the one you're looking for to simulate a maintained function emergency stop button using a momentary function button.
Your wiring diagrams and a schematic would be useful to let others help with your controls.
Nice work. Keep improving.
Cheers.
Very nice job, well thought out and well executed!
Thank you very much! I really do appreciate that!
Congratulations for a great project.Thank you.
Thank you very much for your kind comment!
I liked the clean wiring job and the perfectly laid out space in the cabinet. An additional contactor between the motor and the driver may have worked as well to protect the driver and it would shut down the machine for good.
good call on the second contactor... nice one!
Hi and thanks for your kind comment! I really do appreciate that! And thank you for the tip with a second contactor. I'm not sure if it will fit in the cabinet but I will consider this :)
Awesome build! If you want the spray paint to cure faster and harder, I recommend baking it in an oven at 300 degrees for 1 hour. After it cools, the paint will smoothen out and harden to a durable finish rivaling powder coating.
For the ground cable, you want to maximize the mating of the wire conductors to the metal box. Securely screw it to bare metal by scraping the paint off and using locking washers that dig into the metal. Don't use heat shrink as it defeats the purpose of the ground which needs to be as conductive as possible. Always text the ground with a multimeter by ensuring there's continuity with the case and ground wire.
Finally, you need to add a flyback diode to your motor circuit. It will prevent back EMF from frying your components. The circuit board maybe salvageable. It's likely you killed a MOSFET or if you're lucky, a simple fuse.
Hi and thanks for the great tip with cooking the paint. I will try that next time. I even prepared the surface well before painting but the paint wasn't really durable though.
I would have loved to have a colleague offering me such a pretty sheetmetal cabinet 🙂 Really great video : entertaining and inspiring. Thanks.
Awesome. So neat.
I've recently got my lathe up and running with the same motor set, inspired by your excellent video on the the servo motor. Very happy with it so far, but I've done the same thing with my estop shutting down the power- the caution about it killing the controller is duly noted.
My next project is a belt guard with a built in hall-effect sensor for the spindle- the ratio of the motor to spindle pulleys is ~3.7:1, so having a display of the actual spindle rpm would be so nice
Thank you very much for you comment and feedback! Happy to hear the motor works great for you as well. Good luck for your projects.
I absolutely love the look and functionality of the Harting Han connectors!
Oh yes, so do I :) Not that this is necessary but it looks cool :)
Aren't those crimp pins tho
@@varjagg My bad, would it be better to call it the housing of the crimp pins?
@@dkfsamurai what I meant aren't those pins supposed to be crimped down not soldered
@@varjaggyes, but he mentioned it in the video. The crimping tool is very expensive for just a couple of connections so he just soldered them for now.
You are fast becoming the channel I visit first.
Thank you very much! I really do appreciate your support! :)
Very nice project. I recently upgraded to an 1100 watt BLDC motor and had a difficult time fitting everything into the original box. I would be interested in converting to a rear mounted control box similar to this. Thanks for the inspiration.
Thank you very much for your comment! I really do appreciate that. Good luck for your projects!
Yet another great video! You have set the bar pretty high with your videos. Sorry you had some not great things happen. Way to overcome them 👍🏻
Thank you very much for your comment! After the long time it tooks to build, I'm really happy now to have this project done.
@@WeCanDoThatBetter Are they ever really done though? 😉
Can’t wait for the next project.
Very nice. And very clean.
Thanks!
Nice job!
Thank you very much!
With the emergency stop issue not killing the motor you can put a hold in relay on the e-stop circuit, that breaks the supply to the motor. You can wire in so that pressing the green button operates the relay and it holds itself in, and the emergency stop breaks the connection to earth and kills the supply to the motor. When the e-stop is reset the relay won't set and hold itself in until the green button is pressed again.
Looks great 👍👍
Thank you! :)
Ist klasse geworden, gefällt mir. Mit dem Orginal Nähmaschinenschalter hättest du bestimmt auch was cooles bauen können. Dachte an so einen Schubhebel wie im Flugzeug in der Mittelkonsole. Wär bestimmt ein Knaller gewesen. Sehr gute Arbeit.
Vielen Dank für deinen netten Kommentar! Die Idee klingt natürlich auch cool, aber ich bin ganz glücklich mit dem Schalthebel am Bettschlitten. Das lässt sich super bequem und intuitiv bedienen :)
Very nicely done, I love the look of the controll cabinet! I bought the the same motor and an DRO kit but havent installed them yet.
A quick question, are the replacement button foils still availible? For me the ebay listing is closed.
Hi and thank you very much for your comment! Thanks for the hint with the ebay link. There are a lot available. Perhaps I have done something wrong in the ebay listing. I will check that and the product is hopefully available again soon.
I updated the ebay link. The button foils are now available again :) I hope it works now.
@@WeCanDoThatBetter Thank you the link works again. :)
Very nice. Great quality components as well (apart from the PCB)
Thank you very much! Yes, I'm very happy with the look and feeling of the new controls. It was definitely worth the effort. Really relieved to have this project finally done.
He speaks!
At least I tried ;)
Great video work and content.. Thanks..
Thank you very much for your comment! Happy to hear, you like it.
@@WeCanDoThatBetter I've been watching people add ELS (electronic lead screws ) via stepper/ servo motor to be able to cut any thread on demand..acme, British pipe, metric, standard, fine ,course etc..could even make custom thread pitches..I'm thinking it would be a nice improvement for my current lathe as I don't have the change gears necessary to cut every thread out there..
Do they not make emergency switches with multiple poles, so you can have it cut off power to the motor and the board, without letting either mix, and thus protecting it from the motor generating current?
Thanks for your comment! That sounds like a nice approach. I have to look if there are these types of emergency switches available.
awesome work sir! sorry about the circuit board!.
Thanks for sharing 👍
Thanks for your appreciation!
How is that motor running when you did not connect the A1 or A2 from the contactor? It should not work. would not pull in the contacts
Good job bro
Thanks my friend!
Very interesting!
Very nice!
Thanks!
The E-stop buttons on the big industrial lathes I used to run for an automotive assembly line DID NOT cut power to anything except the motors. Pressing one immediately halted all motion in the machine, and left the programmed g-code paused when the button was deactivated, so the machinist could hand-enter a few g-code commands to bring the machine back to a safe point from which to either continue the programmed cut(s), or restart from the beginning of the program .
Thank you very much for your comment! That is very interesting to know. From this standpoint, my E-Stop seems to work as suggested. The only thing might be the protection against restart which is not given at the moment.
Nice job
Thanks!
Why does this feel like deja vu? I...either remember this project, or someone has done a video exactly like it.
? interesting. I only made a video on the motor upgrade a few months ago and used almost the same intro here but apart from that I don't know where you could have seen it :)
The emergency switch should be in series with the the (nc) stop button.
If it was connected that way before, the circuitboard is going to die again from using the regular stop button, as they just do the same thing.
Hi. Ich mag deine Videos. Du bist wie ich, ein Perfektionist. Immer alles schön ausgeführt und ist am richtigen Platz. Ich persönlich kriege zum Beispiel eine Krise wenn eine Teil schief ist oder ein kaum sichtbaren Kratzer hat. Andere sagen, ja man sieht doch nichts. Nein, mir reicht schon das ich das weiß das da ein Kratzer ist. 😂😂😂
Ich denke wir sind uns da sehr enlich. Schreib bitte ob ich da richtig liege oder nicht.
Schade das ich kein Englisch kann, ich hätte gerne ein paar Sachen im Videos verstanden.
Der Schaltkasten ist echt super geworden. Wenn ich dich richtig verstanden habe, du hast es selbst designt? Super gemacht.
Ich wünsche dir alles gute, bleib gesund.👋
Hey can i add a servo motor similar to urs to my drill press?? will it work??
Nicely done. Hard lesson on the controller😢
Thank you very much. Yes, that was frustrating. But the positive thing is, you don't have to make the same mistake again :)
Most excellent.
Do you have the dimensions or the mounting location of the front plate of the motor? Im interested if it can fit in my mini mill.
Great job! I would love to know the color of the paint you used.
Thank you very much! The color is called "Resedagrün" RAL 6011. It is the standard machine tool color back in the days here in Germany.
@@WeCanDoThatBetter Awesome thank you! I have been looking for the name for a while. I appreciate it! Keep up the great work.
Another nice job once again, I think it may have been better to replace the fuse with a circuit breaker no need to change or buy fueses just a matter of drilling one more hole to mount into your box.
Thanks for your comment and the tip with the circuit breaker. Are there circuit breaker that small to fit in the cabinet? The space is very limited here but it would be a cool thing not having to change the fuses.
Yes, there are circuit breakers that small I have one fitted in the original box on my mini lathe where the old fuse holder came out of..@@WeCanDoThatBetter
I'm pretty sure there are ones that size, but there are differences in how the two parts behave, and you can buy various types of slow or fast blow fuses based on your requirements.
@@WeCanDoThatBetter - the circuit breakers require a round hold about 12mm diameter. They are only about 50mm deep. They look like a panel mount black fuse holder.
Use the ZM-7205A driver for this motor. It's better solution.
Thanks for this tip! Had to look it up but it sound really promising. I definitely keep that in mind!
perfect work, look no further man.
Thanks for the compliment! :)
Good work! Seems like you will be replace the entire machine piece by piece 😂
Thank you! Yes, I think that's the task ;)
Как всегда все на высшем уровне снимаю шляпу спасибо за видео
Many thanks to you! I really do appreciate that!
Что-то про реверс я не увидел вы его реализовали?
I showed this in the detailed video on the motor upgrade. For reverse you have to press the yellow button on the control panel.
What connectors did you use?
M14 and Mimi fit Jr?
I used Molex Mini-Fit Jr. for the connections to the circuit board. Harting Han 3a for the connection to the motor with a Q12 pin insert und for the sensor cable I used M8 sensor cable and connector (PHOENIX 1500334 - SACC-E-M 8MS-3CON-M8/0,5
I believe there are so-called brake capacitors that can pick up the back wash electricity from an emergency stop. Probably would be a safer way to solve this problem.
Good work, thanks for sharing. The voice-over is great, but can I suggest you get a pop filter for your microphone? You’re getting quite a lot of popping noises, particularly on ‘P’ and ‘B’ sounds.
Thank you very much for your comment and feedback regarding the audio voice over. I recorded this without the dead cat on the mic. I will try with the dead cat on next time ;)
@@WeCanDoThatBetter I think you’ll find it makes a big difference. 👍
Great job! Can you share the link or model name of motorkit?
Thank you very much! I will add the link to the motor in the video description.
just look up brushless sewing machine motor kit on ebay 600w model is a good start
@@arronjohnston742 Exactly
Awesome!
Shame to cover up all that wiring art in the box..but the outside is incredibly nice too!
Thank you very much for your kind comment! I really do appreciate that!
19:44 - you didn't screw down the controller's output transistors. They will overheat just sitting there loose, despite the 300g of thermal paste you added.
Hi and thanks for the hint! I have to check if I screwed them in in the meantime :)
I just bought a servo and a controller for it. Was way nicer to use, maybe not as cheap though.
Sounds good. Can you share which motor and which controller you used?
👍👍👍
👏
Hab für diese 7Segment Displays mal ne DinA4 große dunkelrote und doch durchsichtige 2mm dicke Acrylscheibe gekauft. Unter 10€. Anritzen und über ne Kante brechen. Kaschiert auch die jetzt zu großen, dann aber passende Taster Löcher
Hi und danke für den Kommentar! Ja, hab auch schon überlegt, noch eine rote Folie oder etwas ähnliches zwischen Display und Folientastatur zu legen, damit man die Zahlen vllt etwas besser lesen kann. Durch das transparente Fenster kommen die Zahlen nicht ganz so gut raus.
جيد ❤
a talkie one!
At least I tried ;)
@@WeCanDoThatBetter And you have done it very well 👍 Thank you for your effort (from the perspective of a non native english speaker)
Well done, though that cabinet is worth more than the lathe itself.
Haha :D Thank you very much. Yes, with the costs of the replacement motor this is probably almost true... :)
I seriously doubt you want the "whole machine" to lose power due to the activation of an emergency switch (which is NOT an "I'm being electrocuted" or "the control box is on fire" button). All it's supposed to do is STOP ALL MOTION, preferably as quickly as possible. It does no more than that even on industrial Panasonic pick and place machines, with heads jerking around at accelerations that will easily rip up your floor if it isn't bedrock-steady. On the other hand, there's a small Italian machine on which the e-stop DOES indeed simply cut all power, and anyone who ever tripped it is guaranteed to wish they didn't, because this also cuts power to the PC controlling the thing, which is ridiculously prone to not even booting at all after a stunt like that, until you repair the MBR. I just hope you know your way around Grub...
Thanks for your comment! I think you are right. The most important thing is, that the machine stands still as quick as possible in case of emergency and this is given with this emergency cutoff.
here in germany we differentiate between an e-stop and an emergency stop.
the e-stop (electronical stop), tells the controller of the thing to stop the thing, the emergency stop is required to cut all power from the machine.
⭐🙂👍
I am not sure we did this one better haha
At least, it is better than before for me :)
There are a good number of these mini lathe projects around on TH-cam, some of, can I say questionable quality. This is not one of those, of the videos I have watched this is up there with the best of them. However they all raise the same question for me, isn't it better to save the money for a while and just buy a better lathe?
I'm humbled! Thank you very much for your kind words. I really do appreciate that. Happy to hear you like my work. And you are totally right, if you need the machine for quick and accurate work, you better buy another one. But if you want to fill a youtube channel, go for it :D
swappenheimer
Haha :DD had to laugh ;)!
Аккуратная ,красивая работа. Себе поставлю аснхронный двигатель.
Thanks!
I wanted to buy a couple of the membrane panels from your ebay shop, but the cost of shipping works out to be two and a half times the cost of the item. I appreciate that this is not really under your control, but it makes it not viable for a lot of people.
Hi and thanks for your feedback. I really do appreciate that! I'm sorry for the high shipping costs. I assume you are in a non EU country? For EU it is 11,99 and for non EU it's 19,99. That is expensive, yes. But I can't do anything about it as I have to ship the items as a parcel even if they are very small. These are the guidelines for commercial shipment unfortunately. If you know a dispatcher which is less expensive, please let me know.
@@WeCanDoThatBetter - post it as a letter. You know, those flat things containing paper that people used to write on.
@@johncoops6897he just explained, that he is not allowed to do that lol
@@miko007 - no, he CHOOSES not to do that. Probably because as a German, he must 'Follow Das Rules".
@@johncoops6897 yeah, because if you do not follow the rules, you get fined. whats part of this simple concept don't you understand?
Way to many ads here, i won't be back here again.
Do you mean the youtube ads during the video?
The emergency stop to the fuse? You may want to have an electrician double check everything. Spacings looks a bit suspect and not sure how you grounded the enclosure. Strain relief looks suspect, bare wires in the motor connector, taking the servo out of it's enclosure also a problem, are all the safety, spacing, cooling, enclosure size, heat all taken into account. It''s just not a good idea to make these modifications unless you are trained and experienced.
let me tell you about our lords and saviors: diodes.
Слишком усложнил простое.
;)