Still, I think the content is all covered by fair use terms. So if TH-cam took the video down then they are redefining the notion of fair use for satire and review. Any clip used in reviews, including satire is fair use and therefore free from accusations of copyright infringement.
Possibly - I’m not an expert in the area. But consider an entire movie trailer, if someone simply changed some of the shots and cut bits of another video into it and kept the length and audio exactly the same? I’m not so sure they would could as fair use. I have a video “Apple Silicon M1 Intel Original Parody” or a similar title, from a few years back. To took Apple’s original launch promo for the switch from Power PC to Intel, and remade it for the switch _from_ Intel. AI tools didn’t exist to I used a phase inversion technique to remove the original voiceover from the audio, and recorded a new voice over in a similar style, but changed the words to mention Intel chips burning your leg and draining your battery and so on. I then keyframe composited the end of the video to show an Apple Silicon chip being put inside a modern MacBook, the original showed an Intel chip inside a 2006 MacBook. Anyway… different audio track, still using their original music though. But I’d not be surprised if I got a take down at some point. I do think TE should’ve left it up.
@ it Definitely gets complicated. There’s the letter of the law and the spirit of the law. My question is where did TE get their medieval samples from? Did they just look for copyright-free, public domain samples of medieval sounds? Did they plunder early music recordings. Is every sample cleared for use?
@@nickdryad While I'm not connected with TE, I follow much of the music tech industry and have for many years. Sold and taught gear for a 10 years. Anyway I'm confident TE has cleared everything and I can tell you why. On their site at now/2022 url they had a series of articles with photos about the recording process for the drums on the OP-1 Field. "having recording experience dating back to the 80s, tobias has seen the sampling process go from complex floppy disk storage to OP-1 field. recently, while he was living in uganda, we saw the opportunity for him to record percussion instruments with local artists. here we welcomed muwanguzi james and serugo joseph, who created the sounds that would become the lubowa drum kit." and so on. There's a lot there. And that''s one of the few products of theres I do own. Awhile back I contacted their support about another matter and I told them about the awesome sound packs made by an artist called Rephazer, here on TH-cam. So much nuance and care in these samples. Anyway they reached out to him and I don't know what arrangement they had, but OP-XY shipped with a large number of factory sounds by Rephazer (different to the ones I know) and he had OP-XY videos showing music made on the XY ready to go on launch day, so they at least gave an early unit. I have no interest in the OP-XY myself, but they're not a sham company or a startup. They'd be nuts not to clear samples. They also sell medieval sounds on LP / Vinyl (because of course they do, urgh, not a fan of selling modern vinyl) to use with the unit or any other sampler. I doubt they'd be risking selling relatively cheap sample records if the samples weren't cleared, even more than I think they'd do that with a market-compeditive $299 sampler (the EP-1320 at the heart of this saga)
@@nickdryad Actually a more suscinct answer than what I just left would be to watch Nick Batt's (sonicstate) video on the EP-1320 sampler. He doesn't really like it but you can hear the qualty and uniqueness of the sounds. Also if you want my recent 1 minute video there is a side by side comparison of TE's Medieval launch video, and Florian's version of it - and if you go to TE's chanel you can watch the 1 minute video with audio and hear the sounds - if you look at the production quality on that video, that's a massive budget although it's unusual. They would've have just searched the 'net for some samples. No way.
no it's not deemed as *fair use* because both parties countries do NOT support fair use under CR. Just because the US has a fair use policy, does not mean every other country supports it too.
The original video from TE is playing upper left. The original video Florian posted (an edit of it) is playing upper right. They are both the same length, both sync'd together. This is the point of my video. As to audio, I didn't want this to automatically get taken down. Audio it identical in both videos, Florian did not change the audio. So if you watch the video on TE's own channel, that is the audio :)
He clarified what happened with a comment on Scott's video. I still don't think TE should've had the video taken down, but understand why they did. Swedish copyright law is different too. So it's nuanced.
@@sonickitchen We don't know specifics. All we have to go on is that screenshot shown in the video, which shows "Content was removed by Teenage Engineering"
@@darwiniandude As is their right to do so IF they felt their content was being ripped off. This can of course be appealed by the persson 'borrowing' said content or worked out between both parties behind the scenes. Some might say that creating an attention seeking Cr4pstorm and especially without knowing specifics, is is not helping matters at best, bordering on negligent at worst.
@@sonickitchen It can't be appealed, this is what ToS is from TE. *You are not allowed to use our images, text, videos, or other materials for commercial purposes without obtaining written authorization from teenage engineering* Both Austria and Sweden do not support the fair use doctrine. There is a lot of misinformation going on and unfortunately for Florian, he got a smack on the bottom and had to go to CR school.
He has since done a reply video, saying he's done wth synth videos, "I QUIT!" for now at least. Apparently had a lot of toxic harassment and death threats even, people found his unlisted mobile number and were hassling him. NOT COOL synth community, not cool. :(
@@darwiniandude none of what happened is cool, and Scott is an example of what happens when other people spread misinformation with the intent and purpose to harm individuals or company. I witnessed it 1st hand where the individual who started the rumor, was hell bent on making sure TE was taken down by public opinion. He had 200+ likes but that thread has now been deleted. The issue here at hand is how this whole thing could have been avoided had people just behaved in a civil manner, but now we have seen the true cost of it.
Thanks so much for taking the time to correct misinformation. I knew as soon as I saw the copyright strike which video it was for, and could guess why. Scott obviously doesn't watch Florian's channel enough and just assumed it was a review video that got taken down. TE are still bad though.
Scott got it wrong on so many levels because even though he pinned Florian's reply, not many are reading it and are fueling the negative narrative which is actually harming said company. I don't care for TE, but when I see a gang mentality of cancel culture which is convinced an injustice was done, I will speak out. 1 certain poster on Florian's channel started the hype train where he was convinced it was for using samples, not the original content TE made. He inflamed the situation and had 200+ likes, never once citing any facts. I called him out and he kept saying that I was pr for TE, trying to besmirch my character, all because he could not prove what he was saying was true. Florian only replied to him once saying he was shocked about the takedown, but never did Florian explain to him directly, so this train wreck can really be pointed towards him as the 1st point of misinformation. That thread has now been deleted, many people hopped on that train and stated they would boycott TE. All due to the fact the thread creator lied about why the CR strike exists. Cancel culture is real and it's sad that it exists today without people actually fact checking. I remember when Trump said "they're eating the cats and dogs". Welcome to 2025 folks.
Their samples and presets are licensed and royalty free to use in your own productions, obviously, just as with synths from Roland, Yamaha, Elektron and so on. Scott’s Synths is sharing a lot of misinformation. Remember - at the start of the video he says they took down a Bad Gear review episode - no they didn’t, and he never saw it, and despite pinning Florian’s correction he’s issued no edit or correction comment either. His views are off the charts for this video vs his other synth videos - best performing one previously was 109K after 4 years I think. Anyway, here’s TE’s page about sample usage: support.teenage.engineering/hc/en-us/articles/360017576159-using-factory-samples-in-music-making-what-are-the-legal-copyright-licensing-terms
@@darwiniandude Scott has perpetuated a lot of misinformation by not editing his video, if anything, TE could sue him for the continual damage TE is taking as a company.
Yeah maybe it will make them reconsider this sort of thing in the future? Misguided or not there is a lot of ill-will floating around towards TE now, about more than just some of their prices. They were certainly within their rights to do this though.
@@darwiniandude there is 1 specific person that started all this, now they're lying low, under the radar, I have good mind to contact TE because of all the drama they have caused. They're the ground zero, and they should be held accountable.
It's not a gag strike, you cannot use TE's original material without written consent has posted on their website. *You are not allowed to use our images, text, videos, or other materials for commercial purposes without obtaining written authorization from teenage engineering* TE are well within their means to protect their brand, which means their content too.
Which is why people say its jerk move. As in, they have legal rights to do what they did, but their behaviour is big "screw you" spit into face of community. Ideally, they should have contacted Florian and getting him to remove his Month Python mashup behind the scenes. Instead of sending strike like they did.
@@kurisuchiinathecrocodile333 It is not at all certain that the claim TE made is legally justified. Chances are that Florian‘s video is subject to the European parody exemption and fair use in the US.
The truth will be drowned out by all the noise. People already have a bias against Teenage Engineering so they're latching onto the misinformation for confirmation of said bias. The Medieval is the only TE product that I own and I only bought it for the medieval sounds to use in commercial production. The way this story was being presented, as if I can't use the thing without risk being sued, got me so pissed that I was just about to put the thing on Reverb until this video popped up in my feed. Turns out I can still use it in original productions. I thought that's what AudioPilz did in his video because he usually just remakes his channel's intro song with whatever gear he's reviewing so that wouldn't have been struck down. But he played their whole video with the audio track they made, totally unaltered? He deserved to get that strike. But TE probably should've left this alone because now the fake news machine has gotten ahold of it and their standing in the community is going to take another hit.
Spot on! I don’t own the medieval EP-1320, or the original - I do have little PO-33 I got for the kids; battery, mic, speaker, sampling and filter and sequencing in your pocket. It’s pretty cool. I’d like something larger and more robust perhaps, better speaker - but I’d absolutely want the Medieval sounds. Do you like them? I have always liked Roland’s JV/XV series romplers and had JV and later SRX cards in them, Ochestral, World and so on. I now have those same ‘cards’ virtually installed in the Jupiter Xm which is very portable. But some of the Medieval sounds in the demos are quite unique and enticing, I just wish you could get them in the normal one. I much prefer the look of the standard non-medieval version.
@@darwiniandude I have every major collection of VSTs for medieval sounds ever produced and the Medieval stacks up with them and holds its own. Certain sounds like the hurdy gurdy drones and the jaw harp are among the cleanest you'll find out there, but in the end they are just samples and not individually fleshed out instruments like the VST's so while they are perfectly fine for creating grooves, I find them too limiting for deep composition. So I use the Medieval as a sketch pad for grooves before moving them over to the DAW for turning them into songs. And from everything I've seen from TE's stuff, that's pretty par for the course. They're good for getting something started quick but their limitations become very apparent shortly thereafter and you're left wondering where are the rest of the features you paid for. I will say that I like the aesthetic of the Medieval more so than their other stuff, which has that typical Swedish lifelessness to it. TE is the IKEA of music gear, so the Medieval's aesthetic is a nice departure from that. But I'm also a history nerd who's into all that medieval shit so having the Latin names for all the buttons is cute to me, even if it's a pain to work with. It has its own charm, which will only be endearing to some, but that's also true of its sounds too. The Medieval was made for dungeon synth nerds. It's a niche instrument for a niche genre within a niche genre. 😂
Florian replaced about half of the shots in the TE-commercial by scenes from Monty Python, thus parodying TE‘s rompler. He did not repost the TE-video unaltered.
@@generalgrafx Correct. Although the audio track was unaltered. And mostly I think he shortened TE's shots to fit the Monty Python bits in, rather than replacing them. But anyway that's being pedantic. I do think TE should've left it alone.
Not a big TE fan myself but do at least know that the product in question costs less than $300 and their pocket operators about a third of that. So no, it doesn't cost 'a lot.' Bit old fashioned but maybe take some time to do your own research?
@@sonickitchen Lol k. I owned op1, tx-6, and the opx y....all I can say is I was not impressed for what the cost is. 300+ is a ton of money for some people. I found their products just trash, and I'm not alone but the synth fan boys of TE are rawr rawr rawr and I don't care.
Teenage engineering created some bad publicity for themselves. No company wants negative press. They tripped on their pee pee this time, and will loos support, I won’t buy their gear anymore
I think most of the bad publicity though was because some were claiming TE did a copyright strike against a review video they didn’t like, and were able to remove it because the review contained a song with sound samples from the instrument. Which is just false in every level, not what happened at all.
Still, I think the content is all covered by fair use terms. So if TH-cam took the video down then they are redefining the notion of fair use for satire and review. Any clip used in reviews, including satire is fair use and therefore free from accusations of copyright infringement.
Possibly - I’m not an expert in the area. But consider an entire movie trailer, if someone simply changed some of the shots and cut bits of another video into it and kept the length and audio exactly the same? I’m not so sure they would could as fair use. I have a video “Apple Silicon M1 Intel Original Parody” or a similar title, from a few years back. To took Apple’s original launch promo for the switch from Power PC to Intel, and remade it for the switch _from_ Intel. AI tools didn’t exist to I used a phase inversion technique to remove the original voiceover from the audio, and recorded a new voice over in a similar style, but changed the words to mention Intel chips burning your leg and draining your battery and so on. I then keyframe composited the end of the video to show an Apple Silicon chip being put inside a modern MacBook, the original showed an Intel chip inside a 2006 MacBook. Anyway… different audio track, still using their original music though. But I’d not be surprised if I got a take down at some point. I do think TE should’ve left it up.
@ it Definitely gets complicated. There’s the letter of the law and the spirit of the law. My question is where did TE get their medieval samples from? Did they just look for copyright-free, public domain samples of medieval sounds? Did they plunder early music recordings. Is every sample cleared for use?
@@nickdryad While I'm not connected with TE, I follow much of the music tech industry and have for many years. Sold and taught gear for a 10 years. Anyway I'm confident TE has cleared everything and I can tell you why. On their site at now/2022 url they had a series of articles with photos about the recording process for the drums on the OP-1 Field. "having recording experience dating back to the 80s, tobias has seen the sampling process go from complex floppy disk storage to OP-1 field. recently, while he was living in uganda, we saw the opportunity for him to record percussion instruments with local artists. here we welcomed muwanguzi james and serugo joseph, who created the sounds that would become the lubowa drum kit." and so on. There's a lot there. And that''s one of the few products of theres I do own. Awhile back I contacted their support about another matter and I told them about the awesome sound packs made by an artist called Rephazer, here on TH-cam. So much nuance and care in these samples. Anyway they reached out to him and I don't know what arrangement they had, but OP-XY shipped with a large number of factory sounds by Rephazer (different to the ones I know) and he had OP-XY videos showing music made on the XY ready to go on launch day, so they at least gave an early unit. I have no interest in the OP-XY myself, but they're not a sham company or a startup. They'd be nuts not to clear samples. They also sell medieval sounds on LP / Vinyl (because of course they do, urgh, not a fan of selling modern vinyl) to use with the unit or any other sampler. I doubt they'd be risking selling relatively cheap sample records if the samples weren't cleared, even more than I think they'd do that with a market-compeditive $299 sampler (the EP-1320 at the heart of this saga)
@@nickdryad Actually a more suscinct answer than what I just left would be to watch Nick Batt's (sonicstate) video on the EP-1320 sampler. He doesn't really like it but you can hear the qualty and uniqueness of the sounds. Also if you want my recent 1 minute video there is a side by side comparison of TE's Medieval launch video, and Florian's version of it - and if you go to TE's chanel you can watch the 1 minute video with audio and hear the sounds - if you look at the production quality on that video, that's a massive budget although it's unusual. They would've have just searched the 'net for some samples. No way.
no it's not deemed as *fair use* because both parties countries do NOT support fair use under CR.
Just because the US has a fair use policy, does not mean every other country supports it too.
I would love to see a link to the original video.
The original video from TE is playing upper left. The original video Florian posted (an edit of it) is playing upper right. They are both the same length, both sync'd together. This is the point of my video. As to audio, I didn't want this to automatically get taken down. Audio it identical in both videos, Florian did not change the audio. So if you watch the video on TE's own channel, that is the audio :)
@@darwiniandude I was aware of that, but thanks for your reply. 🙂
Great. So this means Florian apologized, admitted he was wrong or will never do this again?
He clarified what happened with a comment on Scott's video. I still don't think TE should've had the video taken down, but understand why they did. Swedish copyright law is different too. So it's nuanced.
@@darwiniandude How do you know it was actually TE that took it down?
@@sonickitchen We don't know specifics. All we have to go on is that screenshot shown in the video, which shows "Content was removed by Teenage Engineering"
@@darwiniandude As is their right to do so IF they felt their content was being ripped off. This can of course be appealed by the persson 'borrowing' said content or worked out between both parties behind the scenes. Some might say that creating an attention seeking Cr4pstorm and especially without knowing specifics, is is not helping matters at best, bordering on negligent at worst.
@@sonickitchen It can't be appealed, this is what ToS is from TE.
*You are not allowed to use our images, text, videos, or other materials for commercial purposes without obtaining written authorization from teenage engineering*
Both Austria and Sweden do not support the fair use doctrine.
There is a lot of misinformation going on and unfortunately for Florian, he got a smack on the bottom and had to go to CR school.
Has @scottsSynthStuff pulled the video now?
yes he removed it or put it on pvt.
He has since done a reply video, saying he's done wth synth videos, "I QUIT!" for now at least. Apparently had a lot of toxic harassment and death threats even, people found his unlisted mobile number and were hassling him. NOT COOL synth community, not cool. :(
@@darwiniandude none of what happened is cool, and Scott is an example of what happens when other people spread misinformation with the intent and purpose to harm individuals or company.
I witnessed it 1st hand where the individual who started the rumor, was hell bent on making sure TE was taken down by public opinion.
He had 200+ likes but that thread has now been deleted.
The issue here at hand is how this whole thing could have been avoided had people just behaved in a civil manner, but now we have seen the true cost of it.
Thanks so much for taking the time to correct misinformation. I knew as soon as I saw the copyright strike which video it was for, and could guess why. Scott obviously doesn't watch Florian's channel enough and just assumed it was a review video that got taken down. TE are still bad though.
Plenty you can criticise them (and other companies) for - just should be legitimate criticisms about real issues, I agree.
Scott got it wrong on so many levels because even though he pinned Florian's reply, not many are reading it and are fueling the negative narrative which is actually harming said company.
I don't care for TE, but when I see a gang mentality of cancel culture which is convinced an injustice was done, I will speak out.
1 certain poster on Florian's channel started the hype train where he was convinced it was for using samples, not the original content TE made.
He inflamed the situation and had 200+ likes, never once citing any facts.
I called him out and he kept saying that I was pr for TE, trying to besmirch my character, all because he could not prove what he was saying was true.
Florian only replied to him once saying he was shocked about the takedown, but never did Florian explain to him directly, so this train wreck can really be pointed towards him as the 1st point of misinformation.
That thread has now been deleted, many people hopped on that train and stated they would boycott TE.
All due to the fact the thread creator lied about why the CR strike exists.
Cancel culture is real and it's sad that it exists today without people actually fact checking.
I remember when Trump said "they're eating the cats and dogs".
Welcome to 2025 folks.
Ok, but do you think about the terms, according to which you can't just show people the samples?!
Their samples and presets are licensed and royalty free to use in your own productions, obviously, just as with synths from Roland, Yamaha, Elektron and so on. Scott’s Synths is sharing a lot of misinformation. Remember - at the start of the video he says they took down a Bad Gear review episode - no they didn’t, and he never saw it, and despite pinning Florian’s correction he’s issued no edit or correction comment either. His views are off the charts for this video vs his other synth videos - best performing one previously was 109K after 4 years I think. Anyway, here’s TE’s page about sample usage: support.teenage.engineering/hc/en-us/articles/360017576159-using-factory-samples-in-music-making-what-are-the-legal-copyright-licensing-terms
@@darwiniandude Scott has perpetuated a lot of misinformation by not editing his video, if anything, TE could sue him for the continual damage TE is taking as a company.
Yeah maybe it will make them reconsider this sort of thing in the future? Misguided or not there is a lot of ill-will floating around towards TE now, about more than just some of their prices. They were certainly within their rights to do this though.
@@darwiniandude there is 1 specific person that started all this, now they're lying low, under the radar, I have good mind to contact TE because of all the drama they have caused.
They're the ground zero, and they should be held accountable.
@@DankePlace Happy New Year
It might be legal. It's still a massive dick move and it is definitely a gag strike
Agreed - maybe if the audio track wasn't completely identical it may have slipped under the radar.
It's not a gag strike, you cannot use TE's original material without written consent has posted on their website.
*You are not allowed to use our images, text, videos, or other materials for commercial purposes without obtaining written authorization from teenage engineering*
TE are well within their means to protect their brand, which means their content too.
Which is why people say its jerk move. As in, they have legal rights to do what they did, but their behaviour is big "screw you" spit into face of community. Ideally, they should have contacted Florian and getting him to remove his Month Python mashup behind the scenes. Instead of sending strike like they did.
@@DankePlace Some manufacturers think they can make their own laws and everyone has to abide to them.
@@kurisuchiinathecrocodile333 It is not at all certain that the claim TE made is legally justified. Chances are that Florian‘s video is subject to the European parody exemption and fair use in the US.
The truth will be drowned out by all the noise. People already have a bias against Teenage Engineering so they're latching onto the misinformation for confirmation of said bias. The Medieval is the only TE product that I own and I only bought it for the medieval sounds to use in commercial production. The way this story was being presented, as if I can't use the thing without risk being sued, got me so pissed that I was just about to put the thing on Reverb until this video popped up in my feed. Turns out I can still use it in original productions. I thought that's what AudioPilz did in his video because he usually just remakes his channel's intro song with whatever gear he's reviewing so that wouldn't have been struck down. But he played their whole video with the audio track they made, totally unaltered? He deserved to get that strike. But TE probably should've left this alone because now the fake news machine has gotten ahold of it and their standing in the community is going to take another hit.
Spot on! I don’t own the medieval EP-1320, or the original - I do have little PO-33 I got for the kids; battery, mic, speaker, sampling and filter and sequencing in your pocket. It’s pretty cool. I’d like something larger and more robust perhaps, better speaker - but I’d absolutely want the Medieval sounds. Do you like them? I have always liked Roland’s JV/XV series romplers and had JV and later SRX cards in them, Ochestral, World and so on. I now have those same ‘cards’ virtually installed in the Jupiter Xm which is very portable. But some of the Medieval sounds in the demos are quite unique and enticing, I just wish you could get them in the normal one. I much prefer the look of the standard non-medieval version.
@@darwiniandude I have every major collection of VSTs for medieval sounds ever produced and the Medieval stacks up with them and holds its own. Certain sounds like the hurdy gurdy drones and the jaw harp are among the cleanest you'll find out there, but in the end they are just samples and not individually fleshed out instruments like the VST's so while they are perfectly fine for creating grooves, I find them too limiting for deep composition. So I use the Medieval as a sketch pad for grooves before moving them over to the DAW for turning them into songs. And from everything I've seen from TE's stuff, that's pretty par for the course. They're good for getting something started quick but their limitations become very apparent shortly thereafter and you're left wondering where are the rest of the features you paid for. I will say that I like the aesthetic of the Medieval more so than their other stuff, which has that typical Swedish lifelessness to it. TE is the IKEA of music gear, so the Medieval's aesthetic is a nice departure from that. But I'm also a history nerd who's into all that medieval shit so having the Latin names for all the buttons is cute to me, even if it's a pain to work with. It has its own charm, which will only be endearing to some, but that's also true of its sounds too. The Medieval was made for dungeon synth nerds. It's a niche instrument for a niche genre within a niche genre. 😂
Florian replaced about half of the shots in the TE-commercial by scenes from Monty Python, thus parodying TE‘s rompler. He did not repost the TE-video unaltered.
@@generalgrafx Correct. Although the audio track was unaltered. And mostly I think he shortened TE's shots to fit the Monty Python bits in, rather than replacing them. But anyway that's being pedantic. I do think TE should've left it alone.
Teenage engineering - plastic bullshit that costs a lot.
Not a big TE fan myself but do at least know that the product in question costs less than $300 and their pocket operators about a third of that. So no, it doesn't cost 'a lot.'
Bit old fashioned but maybe take some time to do your own research?
@@sonickitchen Lol k. I owned op1, tx-6, and the opx y....all I can say is I was not impressed for what the cost is. 300+ is a ton of money for some people. I found their products just trash, and I'm not alone but the synth fan boys of TE are rawr rawr rawr and I don't care.
@@thenext9537 you found their products trash but bought 3 of them?
@@sonickitchen pocket operators production cost is probably $2 and that shitty sampler could cost $100 to the public, easily
@@DankePlace Yes, yes I did. You think, it's this, no it's that, ok wait what. Yes, stupid, I know. I shall say to others, don't.
Teenage engineering created some bad publicity for themselves. No company wants negative press. They tripped on their pee pee this time, and will loos support, I won’t buy their gear anymore
I think most of the bad publicity though was because some were claiming TE did a copyright strike against a review video they didn’t like, and were able to remove it because the review contained a song with sound samples from the instrument. Which is just false in every level, not what happened at all.