The controller was granted permission to approach the pilot once he managed to get down. He walked up to the pilot, placed his hands on his shoulders before driving his knee into the guy’s groin. The controller then merrily skipped back to work with a song in his heart and a smile on his face.
@@nexus9876 Yes, FAA regulation 18-2290-A clearly states, "When a controller is forced to handhold a complete moron safely back to the ground, there are granted full authority to punt the pilot in the nuts." I don't make this crap up...much.
Yeah that was actually pretty good. You can tell he's capable of speaking cle't'lan with Southwest and Endeavor, which is fine as long as they understand and read back correctly, but he slows down and enunciates with FBL and doesn't sound annoyed that he has to do so.
I agree with many comments: the first pilot on the radio barely reaches ICAO's English Language Proficiency Level 4 (minimum operational level), based on this conversation anyway. But hats off to the controller who realises the communication problem, speaks slower, enunciates really well and repeats instructions with absolutely no sign of irritation in his voice. A job really well done!
People argue about the whole country needing to speak English. Why not just go full speed ahead with air traffic communications and then we’ll have nuanced conversations elsewhere.
Easy said than done! Everybody making fun of the guy, but can't imagine how stress with the language, plus troubleshooting the landing gear, plus following unnecessary instructions... You can tell he is a new pilot, but looks like there are more expert pilots here in this comments.
A pilot like this should not be flying a high speed Phenom 300 into a busy airspace - perhaps even better, not fly at all. He may be not a native English speaker, but he has no business being in a very busy airspace not communicating well.
I honestly don’t know how this pilot got his certificate. Can’t fly a published STAR can’t fly an ILS. If that was a 15L ILS and he just blew through it, then he would be going thru the 15R final. Not sure how Boston works there traffic but if they do simultaneous parallel approaches then that could be disastrous.
Those controllers wouldn't have had any problems with the pilots if they'd used standard phraseology as they're trained to do. Controllers deviated from their training, and it caused problems for them. Fortunately, they realized their mistake and toed the line to get that plane on the ground safely.
@FitManFatty I think approach was upset because he verified descending on the correct track twice with Center and once with approach and then descended on the wrong one. Thus resulting in lateral and vertical deviations in a busy airspace. But some people have more access to the full story then what is presented here. Also, the timeline seems skewed as the transmissions were not that rapid in the full tape since they are missing some time stamps. You can't fly into core 30 airports in the US and not have a very solid grasp of English. It adds risk for all users of the system and is dangerous.
@FitManFatty it would have also helped if the pilots onboard FBL had a shred of competence. They blew an altitude on the STAR and then blew through the LOC on a low threat VMC day. Since they could barely control the aircraft with no malfunctions, day VMC, where do you think the situation ends with the low level of airmanship displayed by the pilots when they’re single engine IMC? Most likely it ends in a smoking hole regardless if the controllers got frustrated with them or not.
As a retired air traffic controller, I have always felt the "I have a phone number for you to call" BS to be apalling. It is usually following an already stressful situation, and sometimes (like this one) before landing. Now we throw in confusion with someone to whom English is clearly a second language. IMHO, it is nothing more than a "you're in trouble, and I'm going to tell Mom" moment. It might have been important in 1980, but we have ways of reaching each other these days that don't involved adding at least 60 seconds of additional stress over the radio. Not the controller's fault (the speech, but the stress is), but instead a policy of the FAA. Gotta show them who's boss.
I agree. Last thing this guy needed was another distraction. The controller should have realized the pilot was losing Situational Awareness and just waited until after close to parking
When a pilot, whatever the reason may be, is already struggling to follow basic ATC instructions half way down the STAR, I don't think it's helpful to add the "possibly deviations, here's a number" type message, it just adds to a situation that's clearly overwhelming enough. Pass on a message, say like the guy ignored the number to call, and get it followed up that way. The priority here was getting him down, and the other aircrafts, without a mid air. The second terminal approach controller played it really well, I get something was amiss here with his skills or his English or something else like lack of oxygen, that's easy more hanging fruit, you gotta think in more directions
@@CameTo The whole incident happened because the controllers didn't use standard phraseology when communicating with the pilot, and they were speaking too quickly and clipping their words. If I was that pilot, I'd have been happy to copy and call that number. After I was on the ground. I sincerely hope that one or more of those controllers got a deal over that.
In an instance such as this, I find it’s best to just get him on the ground, and then get the tower to give him the phone number. The pilot sounds way behind the airplane as it is. Last thing you need to have is a laborious back and forth exchange on frequency giving the idiot a phone number….
This was my reaction too. The pilot was obviously new to IFR or type and the first controller decided to hit him with a stick when he realized it. That's unprofessional and just as stupid as the pilot was acting. Fortunately someone at ATC with a cooler head prevailed and did what was necessary to get this flight down safely. This is a good real life example of how to recover from the chain of errors, on the ATC side, and I applaud whoever caught it in time and stopped the bleeding.
This was utterly terrifying, those controllers earned their wages that day. That second pilot also saved that aircraft (and possibly the others around them too). Scary, just damn scary.
It is scary bc they didn’t sound confident whatsoever with any of the read backs yet they were flying a freaking Phenon 300.. 1st pilot seemed older (more experience?) yet sounded least confident & copilot seemed younger (less experience?) yet sounded more confident! Who knows. I sound like a little biatchhh on the radio too 😂
I'd fire the first ATC. He started immediately shouting at the aircraft, telling them off, and refused to use standard language as he clearly wanted them to make more errors due to his anger. When he was angry his accent was very strong also, speaking as a non-American. The Second ATC that yeeted the first saved the situation. The First ATC essentially incapacitated the first pilot.
You are correct, when the other pilot took over the communication became much clearer and responsive. The first pilot was not understanding his instructions nor was he responding properly. There was something going on with that crew - apparently related to a disagreement about the landing gear. First guy sounded like he was half asleep.
As a Brazilian, I’ve often been shocked at how poor Brazilian pilots are on radio - this includes within Brazil in Portuguese. I’ve flown with quite a few guys on the right seat and more often than not it really stood out to me.
Só passamos vergonha, é impressionante! Já vi muito Cmte "macaco velho" que se recusa a falar um inglês minimamente decente!
3 ปีที่แล้ว +4
Sim, mas como foi dito num comentário anterior, se a fraseologia dos controladores fosse a padrão, teria ajudado muito. Só quando veio o outro controlador é que melhorou
@@anonymousaardvarkinnigeria8721 Atc communication is very standardized so your brain always knows what to expect. You only have to decode a word or two and a number each transmission.
the pilot working the radio initially was barely ICAO English proficient. He can readback headings, altitudes and approach clearances....but not much else. ATC in the US often includes a lot of extra verbage, he was absolutely lost. Controllers often take a while to realize this, or don't realize it at all, including more and more detail/verbage in instructions. It doesn't yield the outcome they would like. They blew through the localizer and failed to hear a significant number of radio calls after a vertical deviation during the arrival. They're lucky the airspace wasn't more saturated or it could've been significantly worse. I have to concur with other comments, the guy who did most of the talking (until the other took over) was more or less a menace to aviation, at least with regards to US airspace.
Exactly! Extra verbage isn't ICAO RT phraseology either. I still don't get how the controllers there don't recognise this as an issue but more like a swag. The pilot is definitely going to face an issue or lose his license. But the controllers there just can't keep things standard
A competent pilot with a broken radio sounds safer than a pilot who appears to ignore you or misunderstand you half of the time. If he has a broken radio, just move all other traffic out of his way until he's on the ground (assuming that's how it works at least). If it's not the radio but the pilot himself who has communication issues, basically you don't know what to expect. It's basically layers upon layers of uncertainty. Is he having a medical emergency? Radio issue? Uncertainty? Impaired? Is his airplane compromised? Do I need to get other traffic away from him? Communication is so vitally important, if it doesn't work properly that's a very big issue.
100% one that's not talking to you. The general rule of aviation is aviate, navigate, communicate. So if the radio suddenly goes quiet it's usually because the pilot is so task loaded just keeping the plane in the air they can't talk. Which is concerning at a minimum. You have to wonder how many of these poor ATC dudes have either seen themselves or been present when someone goes silent and suddenly their blip disappears from the radar.
Not surprised by how the controller reacted, the Boston approach controllers are really good, I haven’t had a bad experience with these guys so yea praise the controller
The pilots have stopped responding to the system. - Press ESC to cancel and return to directing other traffic. - Press ENTER to get the other one on the radio. - Press CTRL + ALT + DEL to restart your pilots. You may lose any unsaved readbacks.
One thing to remember, avoid asking pilot for information and giving instructions in one transmission. Especially when dealing with a possible pilot deviation
It sounded like his kid stepped up and took over the radio. Did a better job at communication and actually asked ahead what was the next stage after the current stated by the controller.
Could you imagine finding out you were on that plane! Amazing how everyone ELSE stays professional, clear headed and speaking clearly. My hats off to all involved in the daily workings of airport.
Not sure if the language barrier is what overloaded that first pilot but it seemed like he was overloaded big time and could not process any information. Glad this worked out.
Holy Heck! I've never even heard a student pilot have this level of confusion! Well done to the controllers.... love to hear that there was some level of re-training involved unless there was another underlying problem. I don't really buy the "landing gear" issue that the one pilot threw out there.... Left to his own devices I think he would landed in Heathrow thinking that he was in landing in Jackson Hole 😄😄
This is one of those videos where you instinctively shut your eyes really tight halfway through it because you can't bear to see what happens next. Then you remember it's audio and that doesn't work.
I think the controller was extremely patient with him. I know Boston Approach really well, I expected them to vector him out of their airspace. No excuse for such incompetence at a major airport.
My take is it was the first officer flying, but after he screwed up multiple times the pilot took over. Thus the change in voices halfway thru the video. Sounds like he might remain a first officer for a while.
@@kurttappe Clearly the second guy was the FO, much younger voice. It happens a lot in Brazil. Very "experienced" captains (not necessarily qualified or competent) eventually call for a younger and unexperienced F/O that speaks a bit more english. The result? You just saw.
I think he was just absolutely clueless about things especially about not expressing disgust when asked for the phone number. I know its not the KBOS concessions stand.
@@martintheiss4038 I don't see how you could be that clueless and at the same time hold the necessary ratings to captain that aircraft. What is that...multi-engine, jet, instrument, commercial?
@@ljfinger in South America sometimes… there is no certificate. Literally they don’t get a certificate they just go fly. Or they just get really basic training in a simulator and one or two flights and that’s it. Some company will ‘pay’ them (with who knows what’s onboard) give them a sim to practice with and off they go. This is most likely an example of that. What do you think the odds are… that the pilot actually called the ATC phone number?
CRM in that cockpit was excellent. Unlike so many other flights I've heard where the Captain is incompetent and the FC just sits there chewing his nails, clearly the FC in this one took control. That Captain would never have gotten that plane on the ground in one piece!
Not sure what video you watched, but that was not the case here at all. The incompetent guy talking on the radio should have been eliminated from the operation altogether if there was another pilot in the cockpit. Their inability to climb and maintain 10,000 after being instructed multiple times shows there wasn’t any competent pilot in that cockpit and it’s a miracle they didn’t end up a smoking hole in the ground.
@@prorobo At first I thought maybe the pilot was hypoxic and was glad they got him down to 10000'. Then maybe drugs or medical (stroke? hypoglycemic?). Then when the other pilot came on I pictured: "Bob! Bob! *What* are you *doing*?! I asked you to sit here and do nothing for a minute while I took a dump! What the *hell*, Bob?!"
So much for English proficient. I flew the ROBUC3 a couple of months ago, several speed restrictions on it, with the approach controller asking our speed on three separate occasions. The third time I just said "published".
Is that VATSIM? Geez... Sounds like everyday business over here at VATSIM :D EDIT: At 4:20 it sounds like another controller takes over (or the freq. change has been cut out). That controller was probably like "hey, can somebody else try to work with that guy here? I need a smoke... (no pun intended :D)
@@dovahseod Well I wouldn't trust that logic with that particular "pilot". He had a tendency to report things the controller didn't want to hear and leave out the things he needed to have read back.
Sorry to say these guys are brazilians…ICAO 4 on their license, but in reality, maybe 1 or 2….not ready to fly on busy airspace in the US. My apologies to Boston APP controllers.
@@dashford06 In Brazil, they speak Portuguese on the frequency, which is no problem for them. No one doubts their ability to fly an airplane, but their capacity to operate in English-speaking airspace and comply with ATC instructions.
"Landing Gear Issue" How much you wanna bet the the gear issue was the operator in charge of the landing gear...aka "pilot". He sounded like he was in a daze and confused state. I think another pilot took over, after some tense negotiating in the cockpit took place.
Oh my god! I mean I'm sure it's a language barrier / unexpected problem / unfamiliarity with Boston thing... but this is how accidents could happen. Kudos to these controllers for getting this guy down, and out of other people's way.
The controller probably should've waited to spring the "Possible Pilot Deviation" news on that pilot until after he was on the ground. That crew had no CRM at all and that pilot certainly didn't need another distraction - especially one that could lead to him losing his license.
@YOYO MA Don't spend your time worrying about blame, worry about how to make the situation better. The ATC could have handled this better. It's 100% the pilots fault, but some confusion could have been avoided had the ATC handled this slightly differently.
Excellent job by the controllers & very professional of them to show the levels of patience that they did. Being said, could the first controller have perhaps passed on the possible pilot deviation message further down the chain & not bring it up while there was clearly a bit of a language barrier + workload management situation going on? I just wonder if it would have helped the pilots.
True. However he gave it during a segment when the plane was stabilized and on a heading at 10,000’ and then descending to 7,000’. It shouldn’t have been a high workload segment. Additionally, the controller was probably just done with him and wanted to get the Brasher warning done in the hopes that this guy wouldn’t get away with being a menace to aviation. Then it just got worse from there anyway.
Anytime a controller asks me "how do I hear", I respond with "my ears, how do you hear" ?? I have to make a lot of phone calls for some reason.... LOL :)
I also thought something running on that cockpit, like a possible hijack (the one on the command not being a commercial pilot, but a hijacker). Sometimes people should go beyond the words.
If you have a pilot that you are barely able to control, the last thing you do is throw something stupid at him like Possible pilot deviation. You wait until he is on the ground and tell the tower to give him the information on the ground frequency just before he gets to the ramp. I hate it when a pilot is experiencing difficulty no matter what the reason and instead of getting them on the ground they are busy playing traffic cop. While he is busy trying to pass on the phone number the guy ties up the frequency and the controller can't break into the frequency to give him a turn to final or a vector to avoid traffic. But he was able to get him the phone number
After reading most of the comments here I am really surprised no one mentioned hypoxia or pressurizations issues. Clearly speculating but it appears this was not a language issue but purely lacking total awareness. Keep it mind everyone reacts different towards this but it might be possible that the co-pilot finally came to his senses and took over the aircraft. Here's a few notes from my experience: Oxygen levels do not change the higher you go, its the pressure that becomes lower thus affecting your lungs to absorb. It can slowly creep up on you without noticing, its not always rapid. Most pilots train for this and go to pressure chambers to test their reaction skills. The controller should have noticed this and attempted to help not scrutinize. Happy replies !
Below 10,000 you shouldn't be hypoxic and planes cabin always maintain positive/zero pressure even if pilot mess up. It is communication + not familiar with airplane issue. They missed capture on first go and I think overshoot on second attempt too.
@@my2cents366 Recovery from hypoxia isn't instantaneous the second you reach better altitude. Everyone reacts differently. Commercial planes usually have pressure valves that open/close to regulate packs in case of over pressure but that does not prevent mishaps from mx or aircrew. And it has nothing to do with maintaining zero pressure. The problem is not having enough pressure. From my own experience in test chambers others would be just fine while some of us may have appeared normal but could not even pronounce our names correctly.
Looks like it has a private owner, perhaps two corporate pilots flying. My wild guess is that it was a lower hours FO handling comms, they had some issues that they were busy sorting out, plus the language barrier not making things easier for them. But after seeing his FO ignoring or misunderstanding the canceled clearance, CA who’s now free from having fixed their issue, took over comms and had a generally uneventful approach. The second guy was still missing some read backs but sounded much calmer and much more professional and seemed to have things under control.
@@WilburLin Clearly the second guy was the FO, much younger voice. It happens a lot in Brazil. Very "experienced" captains (not necessarily qualified or competent) eventually call for a younger and unexperienced F/O that speaks a bit more english. The result? You just saw.
So there were two ATC on the mic, and two pilots. The first pilot was obviously asleep, confused, on drugs, or something. But the ATC got aggravated (that moment was not time for "I have a number for you") and did not handle it well. Not soon after a second ATC came on, the pilot in charge also changed and things were handled. Glad things got sorted.
I could only imagine, how Kennedy Steve would've handled him. That would've been an awesome show xD Edit: Of course after he brought him down professionally
I imagine it would have sounded something like this, "Delta tug foxtrot bravo lima..." in his typical muffled way. He might have thrown in some sort of 1% comment as well.
This was a dangerous situation. The pilot flying was clearly struggling with an instrument approach, language barrier, and perhaps wasn't familiar with the aircraft ay a level you would expect. Putting these together and Boston is not the right place to "practice" (which I hope was the case and there were no passengers on board). I also agree with Charles Cornett's comments about pilot deviation and phone numbers - the pilot was was already beyond his capacity, adding stress and shifting is focus could have been deadly; it would have been easier to alert ground to pass on that information if he safely landed. Also, the second pilot (assuming the PIC) wasn't much better and I challenge if there was a gear situation or they were simply focused on the missed approach and didn't respond. Both pilots need significant training and ATC could benefit from learning not to overburden a pilot in trouble.
Boston controllers had a great amount of patience with these pilots. However, whenever they went off script and said non standard phraseology it through the foreign pilots for a loop. As soon as they realize these guys are dangerous they should be trained to just give bare minimum, standard phraseology clearances and get them on the ground.
Bare minimum standard phraseology is written into the FARs for a reason. Deviation from that is when problems occur. This video is evidence of that. Complacency kills. Fortunately, these pilots were able to dodge the bullet.
@@briansmyla8696 Teneriffe air disaster is an example of what happens when phraseology is not consistent. I believe one of the recommendations from the accident investigation was the worldwide use of standard phraseology.
@@vk2ig IIRC, the Tenerife incident was heavily weighted towards CRM problems. The FO could have and should have shut everything down just after the PF pushed the throttles up. He voiced his concerns, but didn't have the balls to actually do it because he knew that the company wouldn't back him up if he happened to be wrong. The FO knew they shouldn't be rolling, despite the fact that standard phraseology wasn't used.
@@briansmyla8696 Like many accidents (air transport and others), there were multiple factors at work in the Tenerife disaster: CRM, phraseology, diversions, time of year, weather, etc.
I love all the controller blame that goes around on this channel. The wheels on this wagon did not start to fall off because of non standard phraseology. It went to shit when the pilot could not competently fly the STAR into Boston. It was not the controllers that were the undoing of this situation it was the complete incompetence of PSFBL pilots that placed everyone in the air and underneath them in the Boston in danger. When you have a type rating the controllers are assuming a standard of competency in operating the aircraft you are operating which was not demonstrated by the two idiots on the flight deck of that aircraft. The controllers job is to separate you from traffic during all phases of flight and to render assistance to emergency aircraft. They are not there to spoon feed you on how to operate your aircraft in any given situation nor are the controllers expected to give dual when, for example FBL’s PIC, decides to fly the aircraft into a situation the PIC is not equipped to handle. In this case an IFR flight with a STAR(failed to execute correctly,) to an ILS(which they also failed to execute correctly,) so when this level of incompetence in basic IFR operation is demonstrated by the PIC and crew of FBL the brain trust around here goes “obviously the controllers fault.” Common folks and get a clue.
"PS" prefix aircraft are registered in Brazil so it is safe to assume English is his second language. I have flown with Germans, Danes, Norwegians, Saudis, Persians (Iranians), a North Yemen, Peruvians, Bolivians, Vietnamese and a few more that I do not recall. I learn just enough of foreign languages to be polite as "English" is the official ICAO (Google it) Language. The problem being, when you are flying in a foreign country, the controller maybe speaking in two languages and I would have no idea what the other aircraft were doing. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_aircraft_registration_prefixes
Was he task-saturated? A low-time pilot? Maybe a communication barrier? Sluggish speech too; may indicate a number of things. I get that he had a landing gear issue, but I’m a little worried about this pilot. I think he was just super-focused on that issue, but could have been at his - and other pilots in the area - peril.
@@artlaudenslager3102 the incident with the Las Vegas controller having a stroke also resulted in this kind of conversation. I wouldn't necessarily assume a sluggish speech is a language barrier issue.
What happened onboard PSFBL anyway , was the cpt not well? 2nd pilot had it together and indeed did a good job saving the flight and pax ( if there were any there) ...and MUCHO RESPECT to the ATC. 👍👍👍👍👍👍Be proud of a job very well done.
@@Boss_Tanaka One of the oldest jokes in the engineering fraternity about using too much jargon. Think it started with the turbo-encabulator and then morphed into the retro-encabulator. "The original machine had a base plate of prefabulated amulite, surmounted by a malleable logarithmic casing in such a way that the two main spurving bearings were in a direct line with the panametric fan. The latter consisted simply of six hydrocoptic marzlevanes, so fitted to the ambifacient lunar waneshaft that side fumbling was effectively prevented. The main winding was of the normal lotus-o-deltoid type placed in panendermic semi-boloid slots in the stator, every seventh conductor being connected by a nonreversible tremmie pipe to the differential girdlespring on the "up" end of the grammeters" (from Wikipedia).
Is it just me or was the controller somewhat early in asking for number to copy when the pilot was clearly struggling to follow instructions? Won't waiting till after landing be much safer?
@@12345fowler That makes a lot of sense-thanks! I guess he couldn't pass the possible pilot deviation to ground? It just seemed like this pilot was overwhelmed for SOME reason, possibly a poor one, and safety would have trumped the deviation phone call? But I'm completely ignorant of the rules, so my apologies in advance.
I was thinking... the pilot is Brazillian he aint going to give a shit about sanctions in USA. His company will just make sure he doesn't fly there again.
I'm not a pilot but have many hours in the air wonder if any of this happened to any of the civilian planes I was on. In the Airforce I always plug in and listen
![[REAL ATC] Qantas suffers depressurization | Pilot becomes incapacitated](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/uCQE77K8GUw/mqdefault.jpg)
![BOWKYLION - วิงวอน (ex-change) [Official MV]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/cLdnZWDaO-w/mqdefault.jpg)
When the controller sternly said SAY SPEED, I was waiting for the pilot to reply with.....speed
Or with "yeah I'm on speed"...
"Speed"
You know the old joke -
Approach - "Cessna Nxxyy say speed"
Pliot "Speed"
Approach "Cessna Nxxyy say cancel IFR"
Pilot "er, speed is 130"
They need to pratice more english.
Yea and you can just sense the stress in his voice
Hats off to the Controller. Took his time and slowed down, did a great job.
The controller was granted permission to approach the pilot once he managed to get down. He walked up to the pilot, placed his hands on his shoulders before driving his knee into the guy’s groin. The controller then merrily skipped back to work with a song in his heart and a smile on his face.
@@waldoinaz bruh?
@@nexus9876
Yes, FAA regulation 18-2290-A clearly states, "When a controller is forced to handhold a complete moron safely back to the ground, there are granted full authority to punt the pilot in the nuts."
I don't make this crap up...much.
@@waldoinaz Oh yeahhh, you right you right. I must have forgot about that regulation
Yeah that was actually pretty good. You can tell he's capable of speaking cle't'lan with Southwest and Endeavor, which is fine as long as they understand and read back correctly, but he slows down and enunciates with FBL and doesn't sound annoyed that he has to do so.
I agree with many comments: the first pilot on the radio barely reaches ICAO's English Language Proficiency Level 4 (minimum operational level), based on this conversation anyway. But hats off to the controller who realises the communication problem, speaks slower, enunciates really well and repeats instructions with absolutely no sign of irritation in his voice. A job really well done!
The pilot is impaired. That’s what this is!
private registration out of brazil, color me shocked
That there is a proper professional controller.
People argue about the whole country needing to speak English. Why not just go full speed ahead with air traffic communications and then we’ll have nuanced conversations elsewhere.
atc: "possible pilot deviation"
PSFBL: "maintain heading 040"
did he just try and jedi mind trick the controller
*waves hand
You don't need to see my pilot certificate
Maybe a Jedi mind trick
@@salkabalani1482 It didn't work
@@jeffn82 💯 Because the controller doesn't have a weak enough mind.
Also l don t believe in his landing gear issue.
I would rather walk from Brazil to Boston than fly with this crew
😂
Literally
And many other crew.
That definitely was an “accident waiting to happen “
scary stuff
You wouldn’t make it out of Brazil lol
Controller: "Turn 5 degrees right"
PS-FBL: "What heading?"
Controller: "What's your current heading?"
PS-FBL: "035"
Controller: "Turn right heading 040"
*facepalm*
laughed my ass of when he said that lmao!
Hahahahahahaa
Lol
Easy said than done! Everybody making fun of the guy, but can't imagine how stress with the language, plus troubleshooting the landing gear, plus following unnecessary instructions... You can tell he is a new pilot, but looks like there are more expert pilots here in this comments.
@@tchecholino he's not his
ATC: "Possible pilot deviation"
FBL: "I reject your reality and substitute my own"
Thanks Adam savage. Haha
Nice to hear the ROBUC3 being used, this flight path into Boston was named after my Cousin when he retired after many years as ATC at Boston centre
Very cool. I’ve wondered how these routes got named. It’s a nice touch to the evolution of the roads in the skies, like how roads in towns get named.
The name caught my ear too, because my last name is a variant of the same (went Rohbock -> Rhebock -> Rebuck over a few hundred years)
@@mhp0810 whatever, believe or not
Wicked awesome pissa!
That wouldn’t happen to be “Your cousin from Boston” by any chance? 😜
A pilot like this should not be flying a high speed Phenom 300 into a busy airspace - perhaps even better, not fly at all. He may be not a native English speaker, but he has no business being in a very busy airspace not communicating well.
Agree 100%!
I would not trust this guy flying a C172 in Microsoft Flight simulator
reminds me of the Air China at JFK with heavy language barrier.
@@lovejetfuel4071 Loool
I honestly don’t know how this pilot got his certificate. Can’t fly a published STAR can’t fly an ILS. If that was a 15L ILS and he just blew through it, then he would be going thru the 15R final. Not sure how Boston works there traffic but if they do simultaneous parallel approaches then that could be disastrous.
That pilot is an accident waiting to happen!
So so true , spot on
The pilot sounded so lackadaisical. Did he not understand the instructions???
Hypoxia, overworked, long time no sleep...?
@@sapede I was wondering if he just learned English. He also sounds out of it, so maybe overworked.
@@blackwidow8412 Yep. I kept thinking "ESL problem."
ATC: "Climb and maintain one zero ten-thousand"
Pilot: "Roger climbing and maintaining 100,000 feet"
Going space shuttle status
Roger, contacting Nasa Houston on departure, g'day
Neil Armstrong, Buzz Aldrin, Elon Musk, Jeff Bezos, PSFBL.
Possible astronaut deviation, I have NASA's number for you to call whenever you're ready. Cancel ILS clearance, do you want ISS clearance instead?
Lol you guys are funny 😂🤣🤣
The controller has the patience of a saint.
They don’t have much of a choice. Sketchiest week to be flying.
Those controllers wouldn't have had any problems with the pilots if they'd used standard phraseology as they're trained to do. Controllers deviated from their training, and it caused problems for them. Fortunately, they realized their mistake and toed the line to get that plane on the ground safely.
@@1450JackCade Absolutely. Emotion-driven decision making rather than an informed/logical one is all-too-common lately.
@FitManFatty I think approach was upset because he verified descending on the correct track twice with Center and once with approach and then descended on the wrong one. Thus resulting in lateral and vertical deviations in a busy airspace. But some people have more access to the full story then what is presented here. Also, the timeline seems skewed as the transmissions were not that rapid in the full tape since they are missing some time stamps. You can't fly into core 30 airports in the US and not have a very solid grasp of English. It adds risk for all users of the system and is dangerous.
@FitManFatty it would have also helped if the pilots onboard FBL had a shred of competence. They blew an altitude on the STAR and then blew through the LOC on a low threat VMC day. Since they could barely control the aircraft with no malfunctions, day VMC, where do you think the situation ends with the low level of airmanship displayed by the pilots when they’re single engine IMC? Most likely it ends in a smoking hole regardless if the controllers got frustrated with them or not.
As a retired air traffic controller, I have always felt the "I have a phone number for you to call" BS to be apalling. It is usually following an already stressful situation, and sometimes (like this one) before landing. Now we throw in confusion with someone to whom English is clearly a second language. IMHO, it is nothing more than a "you're in trouble, and I'm going to tell Mom" moment. It might have been important in 1980, but we have ways of reaching each other these days that don't involved adding at least 60 seconds of additional stress over the radio. Not the controller's fault (the speech, but the stress is), but instead a policy of the FAA. Gotta show them who's boss.
Human being has finally shown here. Congrats!
I agree. Last thing this guy needed was another distraction. The controller should have realized the pilot was losing Situational Awareness and just waited until after close to parking
Totally agree sir!
Yep. Get him on the ground safely. Then keep him there, pending results of cognitive, language, and drug testing.
If you're flying into foreign airspace, surely there should be a requirement for you to be entirely fluent in the local language?
Dang the video was only 3 minutes in when they said possible pilot deviation there was still 8 1/2min left to go!
lol by the time the video was over, I had completely forgotten they had a number to call
Im sure they did too
When a pilot, whatever the reason may be, is already struggling to follow basic ATC instructions half way down the STAR, I don't think it's helpful to add the "possibly deviations, here's a number" type message, it just adds to a situation that's clearly overwhelming enough.
Pass on a message, say like the guy ignored the number to call, and get it followed up that way. The priority here was getting him down, and the other aircrafts, without a mid air. The second terminal approach controller played it really well, I get something was amiss here with his skills or his English or something else like lack of oxygen, that's easy more hanging fruit, you gotta think in more directions
@@CameTo The whole incident happened because the controllers didn't use standard phraseology when communicating with the pilot, and they were speaking too quickly and clipping their words. If I was that pilot, I'd have been happy to copy and call that number. After I was on the ground. I sincerely hope that one or more of those controllers got a deal over that.
@@cojawfee By the time the video was over, they had 6 numbers to call...
In an instance such as this, I find it’s best to just get him on the ground, and then get the tower to give him the phone number. The pilot sounds way behind the airplane as it is. Last thing you need to have is a laborious back and forth exchange on frequency giving the idiot a phone number….
@@RueCardinal hes an idiot for not understanding then going to BOSTON
I'm with you, giving him the number to call is not ideal. Poor fella was struggling as it is.
@@warboyrb He should not be flying into a busy airport without understanding the language. Great to hear Cape Air!!!
Couldn't agree more
This was my reaction too. The pilot was obviously new to IFR or type and the first controller decided to hit him with a stick when he realized it. That's unprofessional and just as stupid as the pilot was acting. Fortunately someone at ATC with a cooler head prevailed and did what was necessary to get this flight down safely. This is a good real life example of how to recover from the chain of errors, on the ATC side, and I applaud whoever caught it in time and stopped the bleeding.
"Landing gear disagreement" = we forgot to lower the landing gear.
This guy boosts my confidence through the roof lol.
Get him on the ground; take the keys away.
Take the engion out, and take the tires off ASAP
Noooo don't do anything to the plane its not its fault take the license from this fool🤣
@@foxiedogitchypaws7141 I'll have the headset pls. And the aviators if he has a pair :D
There were 2 pilots. The 2nd had to take over
I couldn't handle listening to the whole transmission. It was painful.
I am not a GA but it sounds like you have no idea what was going on and since he never yelled at the ATCs i am sure he had no idea what he was doing.
@@martintheiss4038 I understand aviation enough to know what was going on and this was painful. That guy is dangerous.
@Paul Thankfully the Boston controllers did.
exactly
Amazing how one bad pilot affects the other in its vicinity. This guy gives everyone involved a bad day.
And a headache.
that’s why I don’t think it’s funny
Imagine if the people down below knew
What if both pilots were not brand new and just experienced hypoxia or should we always scrutinize first even though they might of needed help.
@@johnwild757 I mean they were at 13000 and descending, and his english didn't get any better after he got down to 6
9:00... am I the only one thinking the "disagreement" actually ended up with the first flying pilot laying unconscious on the floor?
lol that's a funny image
You re not al1
I was about to say, it sounded like a different person after the radio break, and suddenly no issues following directions or communicating.... Lmao
Landing gear issue. Solved now we stuffed that first guy down into the wheel well.
you are the only one because you didn't hear him talk @11:25
This helps alleviate any doubt I had about my ability to earn my IFR. If this guy can do so, surely I can.
ATC: turn right 5 degrees
Pilot: I don't do math
This was utterly terrifying, those controllers earned their wages that day. That second pilot also saved that aircraft (and possibly the others around them too). Scary, just damn scary.
It is scary bc they didn’t sound confident whatsoever with any of the read backs yet they were flying a freaking Phenon 300.. 1st pilot seemed older (more experience?) yet sounded least confident & copilot seemed younger (less experience?) yet sounded more confident! Who knows. I sound like a little biatchhh on the radio too 😂
The controller wasn't using standard phraseology.
I'd fire the first ATC. He started immediately shouting at the aircraft, telling them off, and refused to use standard language as he clearly wanted them to make more errors due to his anger. When he was angry his accent was very strong also, speaking as a non-American. The Second ATC that yeeted the first saved the situation. The First ATC essentially incapacitated the first pilot.
You are correct, when the other pilot took over the communication became much clearer and responsive. The first pilot was not understanding his instructions nor was he responding properly. There was something going on with that crew - apparently related to a disagreement about the landing gear. First guy sounded like he was half asleep.
@Carbon 12 wow, you definitely watched a different video than I did. Where is the "telling them off" portion?
As a Brazilian, I’ve often been shocked at how poor Brazilian pilots are on radio - this includes within Brazil in Portuguese. I’ve flown with quite a few guys on the right seat and more often than not it really stood out to me.
Me 2!!!!!! Jetinho brasileiro. Kkkkkk
Só passamos vergonha, é impressionante! Já vi muito Cmte "macaco velho" que se recusa a falar um inglês minimamente decente!
Sim, mas como foi dito num comentário anterior, se a fraseologia dos controladores fosse a padrão, teria ajudado muito. Só quando veio o outro controlador é que melhorou
@@Fabiano_Oliveira if you are intended to fly in the USA we presume you are able to communicate in english. :)
Eu passei aperto lá tbm em 96. Geralmente grandes aeroportos são f....
I wanna fly on Southwest 224 he knows what time it is.
It's probably ex military guys flying. I think there's a lot of them at southwest.
this makes me so deeply appreciate the efficiency and articulateness of pilots and ATC on basically all the other videos on this channel
you can say that again!
@@anonymousaardvarkinnigeria8721 Atc communication is very standardized so your brain always knows what to expect. You only have to decode a word or two and a number each transmission.
Sounds like father and son. After Jr took over things went much smoother.
Anakin and Luke ... trying to Jedi mind-trick the controller in not giving out the Phone Number.
the pilot working the radio initially was barely ICAO English proficient. He can readback headings, altitudes and approach clearances....but not much else. ATC in the US often includes a lot of extra verbage, he was absolutely lost. Controllers often take a while to realize this, or don't realize it at all, including more and more detail/verbage in instructions. It doesn't yield the outcome they would like. They blew through the localizer and failed to hear a significant number of radio calls after a vertical deviation during the arrival. They're lucky the airspace wasn't more saturated or it could've been significantly worse. I have to concur with other comments, the guy who did most of the talking (until the other took over) was more or less a menace to aviation, at least with regards to US airspace.
Reminds me of talking to tech support in India. "What?...say again.....Do you have anybody there who speaks English?"
If that guy fulfills the international aviation requirements for "proficient" English in communications, then "proficient" definitely needs an update.
Spot on.
Exactly! Extra verbage isn't ICAO RT phraseology either. I still don't get how the controllers there don't recognise this as an issue but more like a swag. The pilot is definitely going to face an issue or lose his license. But the controllers there just can't keep things standard
@@varunkumar1724 Indeed, if the standard phraseology is kept all the time, it helps a lot to avoid a misunderstandings.
If I were an air traffic controller I don't know what would worry me more, a pilot not hearing me or a pilot ignoring me
A competent pilot with a broken radio sounds safer than a pilot who appears to ignore you or misunderstand you half of the time. If he has a broken radio, just move all other traffic out of his way until he's on the ground (assuming that's how it works at least). If it's not the radio but the pilot himself who has communication issues, basically you don't know what to expect. It's basically layers upon layers of uncertainty. Is he having a medical emergency? Radio issue? Uncertainty? Impaired? Is his airplane compromised? Do I need to get other traffic away from him?
Communication is so vitally important, if it doesn't work properly that's a very big issue.
Both are bad lol
@@alex2143 Hence the "ARE YOU ALRIGHT" I thought the first pilot sounded sleepy/drugged and/or hypoxic.
100% one that's not talking to you. The general rule of aviation is aviate, navigate, communicate. So if the radio suddenly goes quiet it's usually because the pilot is so task loaded just keeping the plane in the air they can't talk. Which is concerning at a minimum. You have to wonder how many of these poor ATC dudes have either seen themselves or been present when someone goes silent and suddenly their blip disappears from the radar.
@@aaronsuever2414 I'm sure that first ATC drives over, screams at them, and tells their firey corpses to copy down a number.
I feel for him, I felt the same way when flying VATSIM for the first time hahaha
true dat, can't believe this is happening IRL.
LOL SAME
Jajajaja todos hemos pasado por eso. En mi caso en IVAO en un Barajas lleno y un controlador con más paciencia q nadie. Que tiempos aquellos
exactly!
True 😂
Not surprised by how the controller reacted, the Boston approach controllers are really good, I haven’t had a bad experience with these guys so yea praise the controller
The pilots have stopped responding to the system.
- Press ESC to cancel and return to directing other traffic.
- Press ENTER to get the other one on the radio.
- Press CTRL + ALT + DEL to restart your pilots. You may lose any unsaved readbacks.
You're awesome dude.
Alt+F4...? 🤪
Way to show your age
One thing to remember, avoid asking pilot for information and giving instructions in one transmission. Especially when dealing with a possible pilot deviation
Sounds like they switched pilots on the radio calls. The 2nd half was pretty coherent.
That or it's a case of hypoxia that cleared once this guy descended...
It sounded like his kid stepped up and took over the radio. Did a better job at communication and actually asked ahead what was the next stage after the current stated by the controller.
"We had a landing gear disagreement. You see, this guy next to me thought that lever up meant gear down. But now it's all okay."
Could you imagine finding out you were on that plane! Amazing how everyone ELSE stays professional, clear headed and speaking clearly. My hats off to all involved in the daily workings of airport.
Doesn't seem to be a commercial flight. He's probably flying a small private plane.
If I hear this transmission out of blue I would believe that this is VATSIM or IVAO and he is a newbie pilot.
Exactly
Not sure if the language barrier is what overloaded that first pilot but it seemed like he was overloaded big time and could not process any information. Glad this worked out.
ATC: Say speed
PSFBL: Okay, speed.
As a controller I can honestly say I’ve been waiting for the day this happens to me. I don’t know how I’d react, but I know it’d be funny
@@twoleftnuts - Where are you based?, fellow Atcer.
@@rubenvillanueva8635 NE of the US, you?
@@twoleftnuts Retired now and reside in Spain. Worked in the middle East, and Far East. Have an FAA friend now working Bahrain.
@@twoleftnuts you’d react by giving him a number to call once he lands I’m sure?
I was getting worried....like expecting to hear that the is off the screen. Very professional ATC. VERY professional. 👍
wow... sounds like re-training is needed.
AT LEAST would not even say his own plane designation same way twice in a row.
Give the man XP11, the Aerobask Phenom 300 and let him do the I-Ratings on Pilotedge and he will do much better :-).
Probably just language training
It is called “remediation training” or get grounded!
This is not a training issue. Clearly he hasn’t had any training or isn’t actually a certificated pilot. Not uncommon in South America
"Duuuude, where's my localizer?"
"And then ???"
Where's your localizer, dude?
" see ya"...
"And THEN !!??? .... "
“Capturing the Glideslope, maintain 3000’… of course…..
The language it is a barrier but no excuses.
Maybe it s a 0 degree glideslope
@@Boss_Tanaka or the airport is at 3000' elevation
Can't speak to controllers in English, don't fly in English-controlled airspace, it's just putting everyone at risk.
@@TiagoSeiler English is the international language of aviation.
"what do you mean I have to intercept a localizer? And what is a glideslope anyway? Roger?" LOL
sounds like you have a death wish being near a major regional airport.
Sounds like my neighbor after few cocktails trying to make it across street to her driveway and ended up deviating in the ditch...🤦♀️
😂 😆 😂
This was SOO painful to watch. Well done by the KBOS Approach controllers.
Same here, funny at first...even ATC was holding back laughs....then the reality of the situation hits and the nail biting begins.
If you think this is painful try to have them as your colleagues
Sounds like me the first time I flew with Vatsim on MSFS
Same lol
Lol
That controller was so patient and did an excellent job. I think he might have had a sigh of relief when he handed the pilot off to approach.
Holy Heck! I've never even heard a student pilot have this level of confusion! Well done to the controllers.... love to hear that there was some level of re-training involved unless there was another underlying problem. I don't really buy the "landing gear" issue that the one pilot threw out there.... Left to his own devices I think he would landed in Heathrow thinking that he was in landing in Jackson Hole 😄😄
sounded to me like the 1st pilot wasnt competant.. second pilot.. probably captain lost his shit when they got a number and took over
Thank you to all ATC controllers who guided him. Wow…this guy must be serious when flying an airplane.
This is one of those videos where you instinctively shut your eyes really tight halfway through it because you can't bear to see what happens next. Then you remember it's audio and that doesn't work.
I think the controller was extremely patient with him. I know Boston Approach really well, I expected them to vector him out of their airspace. No excuse for such incompetence at a major airport.
When I was a new pilot I flew from mn to the Boston area. Boston approach was nothing short of awesome helping me navigate the area VFR.
for those who were wondering the type of aircraft, it´s an Embraer Phenom 300
Thanks!:)
*300 not 500
@@MSRTA_Productions corrected, thanks!
I'd be worried if they were in a Cessna 150, with that model the worry factor takes a quantum leap.
Gee this is a jet. I expected this to be a new pilot in a cessna or something.
I really want to know the reason for this mess... Cant be his first flight
My take is it was the first officer flying, but after he screwed up multiple times the pilot took over. Thus the change in voices halfway thru the video. Sounds like he might remain a first officer for a while.
@@kurttappe Clearly the second guy was the FO, much younger voice.
It happens a lot in Brazil. Very "experienced" captains (not necessarily qualified or competent) eventually call for a younger and unexperienced F/O that speaks a bit more english.
The result? You just saw.
Exactly. What makes you think it's the FO?
@@tonythreepies9272 how do you know it wasn't the FO flying? FO makes landings a good portion of the time
@@tonythreepies9272 Yea you are right. I guess I felt attacked :D
I love flying and trust the pilots I fly with, but not with this guy
Task saturation? Technical combined with language maybe?
I think he was just absolutely clueless about things especially about not expressing disgust when asked for the phone number. I know its not the KBOS concessions stand.
@@martintheiss4038 I don't see how you could be that clueless and at the same time hold the necessary ratings to captain that aircraft. What is that...multi-engine, jet, instrument, commercial?
@@ljfinger I don't think he should have a US entry license after this. Not yelling back at the ATC after being asked for the number is telling.
@@ljfinger in South America sometimes… there is no certificate. Literally they don’t get a certificate they just go fly. Or they just get really basic training in a simulator and one or two flights and that’s it. Some company will ‘pay’ them (with who knows what’s onboard) give them a sim to practice with and off they go.
This is most likely an example of that.
What do you think the odds are… that the pilot actually called the ATC phone number?
Just Brazilian. Most pilots over 40 years old have awful English.
CRM in that cockpit was excellent. Unlike so many other flights I've heard where the Captain is incompetent and the FC just sits there chewing his nails, clearly the FC in this one took control. That Captain would never have gotten that plane on the ground in one piece!
Not sure what video you watched, but that was not the case here at all. The incompetent guy talking on the radio should have been eliminated from the operation altogether if there was another pilot in the cockpit. Their inability to climb and maintain 10,000 after being instructed multiple times shows there wasn’t any competent pilot in that cockpit and it’s a miracle they didn’t end up a smoking hole in the ground.
@@prorobo At first I thought maybe the pilot was hypoxic and was glad they got him down to 10000'. Then maybe drugs or medical (stroke? hypoglycemic?). Then when the other pilot came on I pictured: "Bob! Bob! *What* are you *doing*?! I asked you to sit here and do nothing for a minute while I took a dump! What the *hell*, Bob?!"
So much for English proficient. I flew the ROBUC3 a couple of months ago, several speed restrictions on it, with the approach controller asking our speed on three separate occasions. The third time I just said "published".
As a vatsim controller of 7 years, this guy is doing a spot on impression of a newbie vatsim pilot 😂
As an IVAO CTR controller for 5 years, I can agree this is over 30% of the population in existence flying right now :)
sometimes i get noobed and i dont know im doing, even tho i been flying on vatsim for 7 years
As an infinite flight controller I have no idea what you are talking about xb
Lol, Sounds like someone just installed MSFS and decided to try vatsim.
Lol, Sounds like someone just installed MSFS and decided to try vatsim.
This was sooo exciting! I didn't know if they would make it until the final few seconds!
Damn, that's morbid! 😂
Is that VATSIM? Geez...
Sounds like everyday business over here at VATSIM :D
EDIT: At 4:20 it sounds like another controller takes over (or the freq. change has been cut out). That controller was probably like "hey, can somebody else try to work with that guy here? I need a smoke... (no pun intended :D)
freq change seems to be cut out since FBL reported their altitude and heading to the controller.
I signed up but thats why im afraid to join lol
@@dovahseod Well I wouldn't trust that logic with that particular "pilot".
He had a tendency to report things the controller didn't want to hear and leave out the things he needed to have read back.
Sorry to say these guys are brazilians…ICAO 4 on their license, but in reality, maybe 1 or 2….not ready to fly on busy airspace in the US. My apologies to Boston APP controllers.
On Flight Aware you can see this airplane flying all over Brazil to some pretty busy, large airports. Hopefully with a new crew...
@@dashford06 In Brazil, they speak Portuguese on the frequency, which is no problem for them. No one doubts their ability to fly an airplane, but their capacity to operate in English-speaking airspace and comply with ATC instructions.
"Landing Gear Issue" How much you wanna bet the the gear issue was the operator in charge of the landing gear...aka "pilot". He sounded like he was in a daze and confused state. I think another pilot took over, after some tense negotiating in the cockpit took place.
I could definitely see that having transpired.
Panic attack…
No he had gear disagree.
@@imaPangolin I hate it when I get gear disagree.
@@cshader2488 I'm not surprised with the ATC shouting at him like that. Forced errors at that point.
If I did not know English I would think "wow, this pilot sounds very relaxed, you can tell he knows what he is doing"
Oh my god! I mean I'm sure it's a language barrier / unexpected problem / unfamiliarity with Boston thing... but this is how accidents could happen. Kudos to these controllers for getting this guy down, and out of other people's way.
Thanks / congratulations / issuing words of respect to / praising / a pat on the back / a respectful nod of the head to.... that kinda thing.
Whose way was he in?, All three flights sequenced in, no delays, no problems.
The controller probably should've waited to spring the "Possible Pilot Deviation" news on that pilot until after he was on the ground. That crew had no CRM at all and that pilot certainly didn't need another distraction - especially one that could lead to him losing his license.
Atc guy is racist, simple.
I 100% agree. No reason to stress out foreign pilot while he’s flying through busy airspace.
@YOYO MA Don't spend your time worrying about blame, worry about how to make the situation better. The ATC could have handled this better. It's 100% the pilots fault, but some confusion could have been avoided had the ATC handled this slightly differently.
Excellent job by the controllers & very professional of them to show the levels of patience that they did. Being said, could the first controller have perhaps passed on the possible pilot deviation message further down the chain & not bring it up while there was clearly a bit of a language barrier + workload management situation going on? I just wonder if it would have helped the pilots.
True. However he gave it during a segment when the plane was stabilized and on a heading at 10,000’ and then descending to 7,000’. It shouldn’t have been a high workload segment. Additionally, the controller was probably just done with him and wanted to get the Brasher warning done in the hopes that this guy wouldn’t get away with being a menace to aviation. Then it just got worse from there anyway.
Anytime a controller asks me "how do I hear", I respond with "my ears, how do you hear" ?? I have to make a lot of phone calls for some reason.... LOL :)
Hypoxia was my first thought given the slow response but it continued through to the landing. Perhaps stroke, intoxicated or excessively tired?
Slow responses are also a sign of poor language skills, which is more likely.
They are simply not good at english.
All four...
I also thought something running on that cockpit, like a possible hijack (the one on the command not being a commercial pilot, but a hijacker).
Sometimes people should go beyond the words.
If you have a pilot that you are barely able to control, the last thing you do is throw something stupid at him like Possible pilot deviation. You wait until he is on the ground and tell the tower to give him the information on the ground frequency just before he gets to the ramp. I hate it when a pilot is experiencing difficulty no matter what the reason and instead of getting them on the ground they are busy playing traffic cop. While he is busy trying to pass on the phone number the guy ties up the frequency and the controller can't break into the frequency to give him a turn to final or a vector to avoid traffic. But he was able to get him the phone number
I’m curious how the taxiing went.
They gave him vectors on the ground
Got off on taxiway golf, went left onto charlie and just followed it straight into to Boston Harbor... Probably
We'll let you know, he's still taxiing.
After reading most of the comments here I am really surprised no one mentioned hypoxia or pressurizations issues. Clearly speculating but it appears this was not a language issue but purely lacking total awareness. Keep it mind everyone reacts different towards this but it might be possible that the co-pilot finally came to his senses and took over the aircraft.
Here's a few notes from my experience:
Oxygen levels do not change the higher you go, its the pressure that becomes lower thus affecting your lungs to absorb. It can slowly creep up on you without noticing, its not always rapid.
Most pilots train for this and go to pressure chambers to test their reaction skills.
The controller should have noticed this and attempted to help not scrutinize.
Happy replies !
Below 10,000 you shouldn't be hypoxic and planes cabin always maintain positive/zero pressure even if pilot mess up.
It is communication + not familiar with airplane issue. They missed capture on first go and I think overshoot on second attempt too.
@@my2cents366 Recovery from hypoxia isn't instantaneous the second you reach better altitude. Everyone reacts differently. Commercial planes usually have pressure valves that open/close to regulate packs in case of over pressure but that does not prevent mishaps from mx or aircrew. And it has nothing to do with maintaining zero pressure. The problem is not having enough pressure. From my own experience in test chambers others would be just fine while some of us may have appeared normal but could not even pronounce our names correctly.
For next time Cape Air (KAP)’s callsign is “CAIR”
Not to be that guy, it's actually "Cair".
This occurred on June 2, 2021. Aircraft is registered PS-FBL. Listed as Private Owner out of Brazil. Embraer EMB 505 Phenom 300.
Thank you @Dad Jokes
When you hear the pilot’s voice, you may wonder if he didn’t have a cabin decompression… 😂 !
Fr
i was thinking the same. he seems way too confused for the type of airplane he is flying
Pilots voice changed, must be 1st officer that's taken over, sounds much brighter and happier, seems to follow better
It was sketchy enough and then a whole other person started working the radio and it got slightly better. They need to take a break from flying.
Looks like it has a private owner, perhaps two corporate pilots flying. My wild guess is that it was a lower hours FO handling comms, they had some issues that they were busy sorting out, plus the language barrier not making things easier for them. But after seeing his FO ignoring or misunderstanding the canceled clearance, CA who’s now free from having fixed their issue, took over comms and had a generally uneventful approach. The second guy was still missing some read backs but sounded much calmer and much more professional and seemed to have things under control.
@@WilburLin you pretty much summed it all up. Idk if I would want my private jet piloted by these pilots
@@WilburLin Clearly the second guy was the FO, much younger voice.
It happens a lot in Brazil. Very "experienced" captains (not necessarily qualified or competent) eventually call for a younger and unexperienced F/O that speaks a bit more english.
The result? You just saw.
@@WilburLin Single pilot aircraft.
@@nates.4552 Why do you think there was more than one pilot in the cockpit?
glad atc spoke slowly and all turned out well
Brazilian registered aircraft.
hope it's not what i think you're trying to do, but yes it is Brazilian
Had no doubts … clueless ! 🤦🏻♂️
Listening to that gave me anxiety! BZ to the controller with not loosing it when pilot deviated and then STILL had more issues!
The pilot sounded like he was nodding off on approach. Then appears first officer had to do coms to get that plane down.
But whoever gave him that type rating says he is a really good pilot!😂
GIV-X., MAYBE HIS BROTHER IN LAW!!!!!!!!!
Brazilian aircraft, but no record of that flight. Very interesting.
Ok, so it's not just me
@@Zizzily of course. A florida connection hahaha
@@aross924 In that case, we know the reason for all this. He had to deal with customs at FLL and had a stroke.
Well, yes. Because the first thing you should think is that it is a conspiracy instead of going further back in the logs.
I got to the phone number and thought we'd be done... Can't believe it's only halfway through the video!
Wow scary this guy is flying a phenom
@@marceloluizfigueira7208 You surely have a hard-on, for low budget pilots!, were you turned down as a pilot, by this owner?
@@rubenvillanueva8635 Just a very common mindset on the third world.
So there were two ATC on the mic, and two pilots. The first pilot was obviously asleep, confused, on drugs, or something. But the ATC got aggravated (that moment was not time for "I have a number for you") and did not handle it well. Not soon after a second ATC came on, the pilot in charge also changed and things were handled. Glad things got sorted.
I could only imagine, how Kennedy Steve would've handled him. That would've been an awesome show xD
Edit: Of course after he brought him down professionally
I imagine it would have sounded something like this, "Delta tug foxtrot bravo lima..." in his typical muffled way. He might have thrown in some sort of 1% comment as well.
This was a dangerous situation. The pilot flying was clearly struggling with an instrument approach, language barrier, and perhaps wasn't familiar with the aircraft ay a level you would expect. Putting these together and Boston is not the right place to "practice" (which I hope was the case and there were no passengers on board). I also agree with Charles Cornett's comments about pilot deviation and phone numbers - the pilot was was already beyond his capacity, adding stress and shifting is focus could have been deadly; it would have been easier to alert ground to pass on that information if he safely landed. Also, the second pilot (assuming the PIC) wasn't much better and I challenge if there was a gear situation or they were simply focused on the missed approach and didn't respond. Both pilots need significant training and ATC could benefit from learning not to overburden a pilot in trouble.
Boston controllers had a great amount of patience with these pilots. However, whenever they went off script and said non standard phraseology it through the foreign pilots for a loop. As soon as they realize these guys are dangerous they should be trained to just give bare minimum, standard phraseology clearances and get them on the ground.
Bare minimum standard phraseology is written into the FARs for a reason. Deviation from that is when problems occur. This video is evidence of that.
Complacency kills. Fortunately, these pilots were able to dodge the bullet.
@@briansmyla8696 Teneriffe air disaster is an example of what happens when phraseology is not consistent. I believe one of the recommendations from the accident investigation was the worldwide use of standard phraseology.
@@vk2ig IIRC, the Tenerife incident was heavily weighted towards CRM problems. The FO could have and should have shut everything down just after the PF pushed the throttles up. He voiced his concerns, but didn't have the balls to actually do it because he knew that the company wouldn't back him up if he happened to be wrong. The FO knew they shouldn't be rolling, despite the fact that standard phraseology wasn't used.
@@briansmyla8696 Like many accidents (air transport and others), there were multiple factors at work in the Tenerife disaster: CRM, phraseology, diversions, time of year, weather, etc.
I love all the controller blame that goes around on this channel. The wheels on this wagon did not start to fall off because of non standard phraseology. It went to shit when the pilot could not competently fly the STAR into Boston. It was not the controllers that were the undoing of this situation it was the complete incompetence of PSFBL pilots that placed everyone in the air and underneath them in the Boston in danger. When you have a type rating the controllers are assuming a standard of competency in operating the aircraft you are operating which was not demonstrated by the two idiots on the flight deck of that aircraft.
The controllers job is to separate you from traffic during all phases of flight and to render assistance to emergency aircraft. They are not there to spoon feed you on how to operate your aircraft in any given situation nor are the controllers expected to give dual when, for example FBL’s PIC, decides to fly the aircraft into a situation the PIC is not equipped to handle. In this case an IFR flight with a STAR(failed to execute correctly,) to an ILS(which they also failed to execute correctly,) so when this level of incompetence in basic IFR operation is demonstrated by the PIC and crew of FBL the brain trust around here goes “obviously the controllers fault.” Common folks and get a clue.
"PS" prefix aircraft are registered in Brazil so it is safe to assume English is his second language. I have flown with Germans, Danes, Norwegians, Saudis, Persians (Iranians), a North Yemen, Peruvians, Bolivians, Vietnamese and a few more that I do not recall. I learn just enough of foreign languages to be polite as "English" is the official ICAO (Google it) Language.
The problem being, when you are flying in a foreign country, the controller maybe speaking in two languages and I would have no idea what the other aircraft were doing.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_aircraft_registration_prefixes
Was he task-saturated? A low-time pilot? Maybe a communication barrier? Sluggish speech too; may indicate a number of things. I get that he had a landing gear issue, but I’m a little worried about this pilot.
I think he was just super-focused on that issue, but could have been at his - and other pilots in the area - peril.
Sluggish speech = not a native or fluent English speaker and has to think through the translation from/to Portuguese while speaking or listening.
@@artlaudenslager3102 the incident with the Las Vegas controller having a stroke also resulted in this kind of conversation. I wouldn't necessarily assume a sluggish speech is a language barrier issue.
No inglise....Me No pick inglise!!!
@@GBOAC • That’s true; only a suggestion as to a myriad of possibilities.
The important thing is it doesn't MATTER. The ATC should have treated it as such, instead of shouting and berating.
So much for the ICAO English proficiency test in Brazil.
Honestly this was like watching a brand new pilot on VATSIM....... The embarrassing thing is that person is really flying irl
What happened onboard PSFBL anyway , was the cpt not well? 2nd pilot had it together and indeed did a good job saving the flight and pax ( if there were any there) ...and MUCHO RESPECT to the ATC. 👍👍👍👍👍👍Be proud of a job very well done.
Let’s take a minute to discuss the Turbo Encabulator.
🤣🤣🤣 Your comment has made my day! 👍
Please explain
@@Boss_Tanaka One of the oldest jokes in the engineering fraternity about using too much jargon. Think it started with the turbo-encabulator and then morphed into the retro-encabulator.
"The original machine had a base plate of prefabulated amulite, surmounted by a malleable logarithmic casing in such a way that the two main spurving bearings were in a direct line with the panametric fan. The latter consisted simply of six hydrocoptic marzlevanes, so fitted to the ambifacient lunar waneshaft that side fumbling was effectively prevented. The main winding was of the normal lotus-o-deltoid type placed in panendermic semi-boloid slots in the stator, every seventh conductor being connected by a nonreversible tremmie pipe to the differential girdlespring on the "up" end of the grammeters" (from Wikipedia).
@@DustyCircuits336 yes it s funnier when you get the reference.
Thanks Dusty Circuits
The girdle spring sprung.
These guys in Tracon are real pros. Kuddos.
Wow those controllers are sometimes really stretched. All in all, well done everyone, no one hurt.
Gotta love this pilot. Combining sightseeing with burning off extra fuel as to not overbear the landing gear.
Is it just me or was the controller somewhat early in asking for number to copy when the pilot was clearly struggling to follow instructions? Won't waiting till after landing be much safer?
My thoughts exactly!!
Yeah this pilot was already having issues. Get him on the ground and get him the number to call.
Well the controller has to mention it to him before he passes him to the next sector.
@@12345fowler That makes a lot of sense-thanks!
I guess he couldn't pass the possible pilot deviation to ground? It just seemed like this pilot was overwhelmed for SOME reason, possibly a poor one, and safety would have trumped the deviation phone call? But I'm completely ignorant of the rules, so my apologies in advance.
I was thinking... the pilot is Brazillian he aint going to give a shit about sanctions in USA. His company will just make sure he doesn't fly there again.
I'm not a pilot but have many hours in the air wonder if any of this happened to any of the civilian planes I was on.
In the Airforce I always plug in and listen