I still believe (and hope) that he's one of the blue wizards. My agruemtns: - it fits timewise, because the blue wizards arrive in the second age - the stranger is going to the East, just like the blue wizards did and unlike Gandalf who said 'To the East, I not go.' - One of the mystics said just before they die "He's not Sauron. He is the other." as if they already met one of the blue wizards.
"One of the mystics said just before they die "He's not Sauron. He is the other." as if they already met one of the blue wizards." Wonderful catch, thanks for the comment.
One of them will surely become corrupted, otherwise the story would be boring. I wonder which it will be? I think in tolkiens writings he suggested the blue wizards may have practiced dark magics. So prepare for some wild visual effects.
I wouldn't want The Stranger to be Gandalf. I prefer to watch two Istars clash and quarrel in the east, one that has fallen into darkness and the other that has not fallen, over two different versions of the Blue Wizards. I think that processing in this way will add more depth to the script and will be interesting.
That should be the plot since the stranger is alatar the first maiar/istar sent to fight sauron. He will journey to the east to find his brother who has been corrupted
The problem with the constellation is that the starfields wouldn't change on a Flat Arda and only change in the South (especially south of the equator) on a round Arda. I'm hoping that the Stranger is one of the Blue Wizards as none of the other Istari are supposed to appear in Middle-earth in the Second Age.
In the dialogue the stranger doesn't actually say he is an Istar. The witches have called him this, he translates the term for Nori, but he doesn't claim to be one himself. NORI: They called you something else. "Istar." Is that your kind? STRANGER "Istar?" In your tongue, that means "wise one." Or... "Wizard." I reckon he is Olorin but before he goes to wizard school
There were only 2 wizards that appeared in the 2nd age, the blue wizards morinehtar(darkness slayer) and Rómestámo(east helper)....gandalf, sarumon, and radagast did not appear untill much later, 1000 years into the 3rd age, after isilildor failed to destroy the one ring.....I believe the stranger to be morinehtar. Not much is known about what they did during that time, which gives the writers creative licenses, without contradicting the lore...as long as they keep to the fact that were sent to apose sauron and prevent the forces of the from outnumbering those of the free peoples in the West.
I literally laughed out loud when you said “…it would be the most lore accurate..”. They are good at breaking the lore and creating their own. They’re so bad at the mystery box stuff that they believe that we think that he’s not Gandalf that we know that he’s going to be The Grey Pilgrim. Whomever he is we won’t know for sure for another couple of years or more so we can speculate all we want.
Well, just like Jackson then because straight lore adaptation wont work on screen, particularly in a meaningful telling of the 2nd age, which does indeed need creation too, the sort of creation that Tolkien invited.
Many fans were left disappointed about season 1 because the writers were intentionally trying to create new lore by squeezing 1000 years into one season. Secondly, the team also stated that this series is firmly a Second Age Tale, and they don’t want to pull too much Third Age material because they want to, more or less, bring the Silmarillion to life. The Stranger being one of the Blue Wizards makes the most sense because the studio and actor would have near complete creative freedom over the character’s development, personality, etc. The studio will probably have better luck being accurate to lore than trying to twist existing legendarium material to their will. They can make their own lasting impact in the canon by filling in the things we don’t know.
If the series stays true to Tolkien's lore then it definitely is. Alatar was the first istar sent he is a blue wizard along with his brother pallando. I would tell u more but I'd just be spoiling
Gandalf would be the obvious choice of writers who have zero sense of creativity or lore where ROP is concerned. So, let’s completely ignore the fact that Gandalf never even entered Middle Earth until the 3rd age and never traveled to Rhun.
@@SectionHikingTheAT well i disagree with you completely. Rings of Power is incredibly creative and whilst i would be disappointed if it were Gandalf i think you could at least wait till you are proved right or wrong before drawing conclusions about the lore in this respect. Indeed i have seen quoted comments from the showrunners stating that they wouldnt be using Ian Mc however much they'd love to because they are bound by the books.
nice video. although your theory doesn't exclude any of the istari - as in: you make a case for all 5 (there are just 5). mighta helped more to go by exclusion.
He must be a Blue Wizard. If they make him Gandalf I'm tapping out. I stuck with the show, despite the criticism. Gandalf in the Second Age is a bridge too far. It would also be spectacularly stupid to not take up the opportunity of him being a Blue Wizard, given the fascination amongst Tolkien fans.
If Gandalf is the stranger, it would prove they got the wrong people to do the show. They got the timeline off. Gandalf came many years later after the second age. The only wizards it could be would be one of the blue wizards.
I don't see the 'follow your nose' line being a hint. Gandalf is known for stealing other peoples' lines - there's nothing to say Gandalf didn't know the Blue Wizards before they left for Middle Earth (in fact, he did know them) or that he would not have met them at some point in Middle Earth
He will be a blue wizard. In personality he will be Gandalf. We are going east and he will find the other blue wizard and ta-da he will be Rhadaghast in personality. This is the second rate writing we have seen thru season one and the entire production.
If he turns out to be Gandalf, that's it for me, I'm done with this show. Gandalf was definitely not there in the second age. He must be a blue wizard, they were they and they went to Rhun.
I don't see it that way. It was possible that Gandalf visited during 2nd age. Many Maiar and Valar did visit Middle Earth now and then. Why not Olórin too?
@@J1mmyMack fair point. I'm quite sure Tolkien would have known and mentioned if Olórin had spent some time as a Wizard in Middle-Earth during 2nd age. But then again, we can't know for sure ;)
@@J1mmyMack I hear ya, but correct if I am wrong, the Stranger hasn't called himself a wizard either. I mean, the entire first season he didnt know words let alone that he was a wizard.
I hope he is Saruman to be honest, and we get to see a good side of Saruman. Saruman is good up until the very end of his life, so I would like to see some of those deeds. "Saruman used to walk in these forests" was a quote from treebeard, and Saruman lived thousands of years before he got frustrated and started looking for shortcuts to complete his mission, which ultimately led to his demise. I want to see that part of Saruman, because it was nice seeing a younger more hopeful Elrond.
If you had read the books and other parts of Tolkien's mythos you'd know Saruman was never 'good', he was truly neutral and only ever acted on what he believed would be best for Middle Earth as that was his mission. He's certainly not Radaghast If they are faithful to Tolkien's writing he will be one of Allatar or Pallando as the two blue wizards were sent first during the second age and the other three all arrived on ships at the beginning of the third age.
Saruman Gandalf arrived in the 3rd age. The first istar arrived to fight sauron was alatar who was a blue wizard along with his brother pallando. If they follow tolkiens lore we wont be seeing gandalf and saruman
The show literally confirmed that he is Gandalf with the "follow your nose", until then we had only speculated and again the greatest likelihood was that he is the grey wizard. The acting, the facial expressions, the tone of voice... Everything pointed to Gandalf, or at least to Peter Jackson's edition. The moths, the relation to harfoots-hobbits...just further clues. The producers of ROP want the series to be part of the cinematic universe created by PJ, so that the viewer can see the series and the other films in some continuity. That's the reason we see similar cinematographic techniques in ROP and the LOTR trilogy in world building, etc. So it's a bit of a paradox when an Istar quotes Gandalf or acts like Gandalf and is not him. The journey to Rhun is merely an integration of Blue Wizard lore into Gandalf's story and that's it in my opinion. And honestly, who needs to see blue wizards other than hardcore book fans? Istari living in Middle-earth in the Second Age is quite a break with lore... why do that with characters who were not even that interesting to Tolkien. He never had a proper story written about them. Gandalf is a very popular character, a future ring-bearer, guardian of Middle Earth. The main antagonist of Sauron in the Third Age. It makes sense to have him there with Elrond and Galadriel rather than any other Istar who did not play much of a role in the war against darkness.
Bringing gandalf in the 2nd age would be irrelevant as he was sent in the 3rd age and he said to never go to the east(rhun)while the stranger is travelling there. The first maiar/istar sent to fight against sauron was alatar. All istar are direct enemies of sauron not just gandalf. Even though gandalf is famous introducing him in the second age completely messes up the plot. The series is based off the books. They have changed a bit for the fans but they cant make major changes like these they still have to follow Tolkien lore
He's a blue wizard and it's not even a debate. The show did stuff for fan service, that's it. Quit with trying to convince people he's one of the other 3. Ay carumba people.
@@geir8849 might be part of the story. He's clearly forgotten who he was for some reason and we will find out why. Remember him burbling stuff about Manya Ure? Or fire. Maybe something went wrong with plans to stop Mount Doom exploding, something to do with the 2nd blue wizard not being where he shpuld have been? Who knows. All speculation, but surely there is fun in finding out.
![KRK - ชนิสรา Ft.WanMai , N/A [Official MV] Prod. By Sakarin](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/C-WMwwYobcU/mqdefault.jpg)
hoping he is a blue wizard & that they SERIOUSLY step up their writing game in the remaining seasons ASAP
I don't see how he could be anyone other than a blue wizard given the time this is happening.
I hope he turns out to be one of the Blue Wizards
So do I. It was so much fun putting together the Rhun segment.
He will be
I still believe (and hope) that he's one of the blue wizards. My agruemtns:
- it fits timewise, because the blue wizards arrive in the second age
- the stranger is going to the East, just like the blue wizards did and unlike Gandalf who said 'To the East, I not go.'
- One of the mystics said just before they die "He's not Sauron. He is the other." as if they already met one of the blue wizards.
"One of the mystics said just before they die "He's not Sauron. He is the other." as if they already met one of the blue wizards." Wonderful catch, thanks for the comment.
One of them will surely become corrupted, otherwise the story would be boring. I wonder which it will be? I think in tolkiens writings he suggested the blue wizards may have practiced dark magics. So prepare for some wild visual effects.
Did you just call little Sebastian a porcupine?? He’s a hedgehog! Poor little boy 🦔
I wouldn't want The Stranger to be Gandalf. I prefer to watch two Istars clash and quarrel in the east, one that has fallen into darkness and the other that has not fallen, over two different versions of the Blue Wizards. I think that processing in this way will add more depth to the script and will be interesting.
I love that! It would be really cool. I am so thrilled to see how they show Rhun.
That should be the plot since the stranger is alatar the first maiar/istar sent to fight sauron. He will journey to the east to find his brother who has been corrupted
One correction - Radaghast healed a hedgehog, not a 'porcupine'
The problem with the constellation is that the starfields wouldn't change on a Flat Arda and only change in the South (especially south of the equator) on a round Arda. I'm hoping that the Stranger is one of the Blue Wizards as none of the other Istari are supposed to appear in Middle-earth in the Second Age.
He's a blue wizard.... he's going east and is going to find the other one on the way
In the dialogue the stranger doesn't actually say he is an Istar. The witches have called him this, he translates the term for Nori, but he doesn't claim to be one himself.
NORI: They called you something else. "Istar." Is that your kind?
STRANGER "Istar?" In your tongue, that means "wise one." Or... "Wizard."
I reckon he is Olorin but before he goes to wizard school
Nice video as ever Harry. Let’s face it, it’s Gandalf, which is massively disappointing and frankly lazy on the part of the SRs. 😢
Excuse me, in what world does Daniel Wayman look like Ian McKellen??
My guess: It is Gandalf or Saruman with the mission of the Blue Wizards :)
There were only 2 wizards that appeared in the 2nd age, the blue wizards morinehtar(darkness slayer) and Rómestámo(east helper)....gandalf, sarumon, and radagast did not appear untill much later, 1000 years into the 3rd age, after isilildor failed to destroy the one ring.....I believe the stranger to be morinehtar. Not much is known about what they did during that time, which gives the writers creative licenses, without contradicting the lore...as long as they keep to the fact that were sent to apose sauron and prevent the forces of the from outnumbering those of the free peoples in the West.
I literally laughed out loud when you said “…it would be the most lore accurate..”. They are good at breaking the lore and creating their own. They’re so bad at the mystery box stuff that they believe that we think that he’s not Gandalf that we know that he’s going to be The Grey Pilgrim.
Whomever he is we won’t know for sure for another couple of years or more so we can speculate all we want.
Well, just like Jackson then because straight lore adaptation wont work on screen, particularly in a meaningful telling of the 2nd age, which does indeed need creation too, the sort of creation that Tolkien invited.
The stranger also arrives on an eagle in the teaser of Season 2 like Gandalf flew eagles in LOTR. I do hope it's him... love that character.
Many fans were left disappointed about season 1 because the writers were intentionally trying to create new lore by squeezing 1000 years into one season. Secondly, the team also stated that this series is firmly a Second Age Tale, and they don’t want to pull too much Third Age material because they want to, more or less, bring the Silmarillion to life.
The Stranger being one of the Blue Wizards makes the most sense because the studio and actor would have near complete creative freedom over the character’s development, personality, etc. The studio will probably have better luck being accurate to lore than trying to twist existing legendarium material to their will. They can make their own lasting impact in the canon by filling in the things we don’t know.
After hearing the " follow your nose"line he delivered for me that was what made me think he's Gandalf and that he's so close with the hobbits
I really do believe that he is one of the Blue Wizards.
If the series stays true to Tolkien's lore then it definitely is. Alatar was the first istar sent he is a blue wizard along with his brother pallando. I would tell u more but I'd just be spoiling
The two did arrive together and went to East so that already ruins the canon for the Blue Wizards
ofc it is Gandalf. the writers proved their creativity, it cannot be anybody else.
It most definitely can be someone else.
Gandalf would be the obvious choice of writers who have zero sense of creativity or lore where ROP is concerned. So, let’s completely ignore the fact that Gandalf never even entered Middle Earth until the 3rd age and never traveled to Rhun.
@@SectionHikingTheAT well i disagree with you completely. Rings of Power is incredibly creative and whilst i would be disappointed if it were Gandalf i think you could at least wait till you are proved right or wrong before drawing conclusions about the lore in this respect. Indeed i have seen quoted comments from the showrunners stating that they wouldnt be using Ian Mc however much they'd love to because they are bound by the books.
He turned everything behind him dark like the lord of the rings part one
nice video. although your theory doesn't exclude any of the istari - as in: you make a case for all 5 (there are just 5). mighta helped more to go by exclusion.
He must be a Blue Wizard. If they make him Gandalf I'm tapping out. I stuck with the show, despite the criticism. Gandalf in the Second Age is a bridge too far. It would also be spectacularly stupid to not take up the opportunity of him being a Blue Wizard, given the fascination amongst Tolkien fans.
If Gandalf is the stranger, it would prove they got the wrong people to do the show. They got the timeline off. Gandalf came many years later after the second age. The only wizards it could be would be one of the blue wizards.
I don't see the 'follow your nose' line being a hint. Gandalf is known for stealing other peoples' lines - there's nothing to say Gandalf didn't know the Blue Wizards before they left for Middle Earth (in fact, he did know them) or that he would not have met them at some point in Middle Earth
I assume Radagast or Saruman. Being Gandalf is going to be too anticlimactic
He will be a blue wizard. In personality he will be Gandalf. We are going east and he will find the other blue wizard and ta-da he will be Rhadaghast in personality. This is the second rate writing we have seen thru season one and the entire production.
Alatar or Pallando
Gandalf never went to Rhun 😊
If he turns out to be Gandalf, that's it for me, I'm done with this show. Gandalf was definitely not there in the second age. He must be a blue wizard, they were they and they went to Rhun.
I don't see it that way. It was possible that Gandalf visited during 2nd age. Many Maiar and Valar did visit Middle Earth now and then. Why not Olórin too?
@@esjope Not as wizards.
@@J1mmyMack fair point. I'm quite sure Tolkien would have known and mentioned if Olórin had spent some time as a Wizard in Middle-Earth during 2nd age. But then again, we can't know for sure ;)
@@J1mmyMack I hear ya, but correct if I am wrong, the Stranger hasn't called himself a wizard either. I mean, the entire first season he didnt know words let alone that he was a wizard.
@@ArtbyKurtisEdwards He has, watch episode 8.
Hey man change the mic
You might as well ask if the space hobo is Abraham Lincoln, that timeline's no worse than claiming him to be any of the LoTR wizards
I hope he is Saruman to be honest, and we get to see a good side of Saruman. Saruman is good up until the very end of his life, so I would like to see some of those deeds. "Saruman used to walk in these forests" was a quote from treebeard, and Saruman lived thousands of years before he got frustrated and started looking for shortcuts to complete his mission, which ultimately led to his demise. I want to see that part of Saruman, because it was nice seeing a younger more hopeful Elrond.
If you had read the books and other parts of Tolkien's mythos you'd know Saruman was never 'good', he was truly neutral and only ever acted on what he believed would be best for Middle Earth as that was his mission.
He's certainly not Radaghast
If they are faithful to Tolkien's writing he will be one of Allatar or Pallando as the two blue wizards were sent first during the second age and the other three all arrived on ships at the beginning of the third age.
Saruman Gandalf arrived in the 3rd age. The first istar arrived to fight sauron was alatar who was a blue wizard along with his brother pallando. If they follow tolkiens lore we wont be seeing gandalf and saruman
The show literally confirmed that he is Gandalf with the "follow your nose", until then we had only speculated and again the greatest likelihood was that he is the grey wizard. The acting, the facial expressions, the tone of voice...
Everything pointed to Gandalf, or at least to Peter Jackson's edition.
The moths, the relation to harfoots-hobbits...just further clues.
The producers of ROP want the series to be part of the cinematic universe created by PJ, so that the viewer can see the series and the other films in some continuity.
That's the reason we see similar cinematographic techniques in ROP and the LOTR trilogy in world building, etc.
So it's a bit of a paradox when an Istar quotes Gandalf or acts like Gandalf and is not him.
The journey to Rhun is merely an integration of Blue Wizard lore into Gandalf's story and that's it in my opinion.
And honestly, who needs to see blue wizards other than hardcore book fans?
Istari living in Middle-earth in the Second Age is quite a break with lore... why do that with characters who were not even that interesting to Tolkien. He never had a proper story written about them. Gandalf is a very popular character, a future ring-bearer, guardian of Middle Earth. The main antagonist of Sauron in the Third Age. It makes sense to have him there with Elrond and Galadriel rather than any other Istar who did not play much of a role in the war against darkness.
Bringing gandalf in the 2nd age would be irrelevant as he was sent in the 3rd age and he said to never go to the east(rhun)while the stranger is travelling there. The first maiar/istar sent to fight against sauron was alatar. All istar are direct enemies of sauron not just gandalf. Even though gandalf is famous introducing him in the second age completely messes up the plot. The series is based off the books. They have changed a bit for the fans but they cant make major changes like these they still have to follow Tolkien lore
He's a blue wizard and it's not even a debate. The show did stuff for fan service, that's it. Quit with trying to convince people he's one of the other 3. Ay carumba people.
Thanks for the comment. Its a full narrative that is also entertaining and shows the full span of what the fanbase is thinking.
Yes, a full narrative of the Second Age where the other 3 aren't even sent to Middle Earth yet. If they were real fans then they would know this.
Why did they have to drag this mystery further. I am done with meteor man.
Because its interesting finding stuff out?
@@markwareham6031 Yes, interesting to discover Rhun yes! But why can't they use his name. Guess I just have to follow my nose.
@@geir8849 might be part of the story. He's clearly forgotten who he was for some reason and we will find out why. Remember him burbling stuff about Manya Ure? Or fire. Maybe something went wrong with plans to stop Mount Doom exploding, something to do with the 2nd blue wizard not being where he shpuld have been? Who knows. All speculation, but surely there is fun in finding out.
@@markwareham6031 I will give it a chance, sure!
None of them, because every istari arrived to middle earth….by boat hahahahaha not in a fucking meteorite
If its not a blue wizard then they have failed us all