I love/hate conspiracy theories like this, because it's always about two minutes between "An alternate history, with free energy and giants? That sounds wonderfully creative!" And "It's just more racism, isn't it?" ...but damn, those two minutes are magical and full of promise.
Yeah, it's crazy. "Hey there used to be this crazy advanced culture of giants. They had energy weapons and free energy and stuff. Then they where wiped out and conquered. Also they are the progenitors of the 'white race' and 'The Jews' invented Christianity to enslave white people" ??? Wut!
You know what really bothers me? The fact that there *is* in fact a cabal of powerful people trying to misinfrom and control the world, they're called oligarchs and while many of them work together some are in competition with one another but most are powerful enough to just carve out their little spot without intruding on others and to keep stability don't bother eachother, but it's not the Jews or anything some may be Jewish (like dennis praguer for instance) they just take what they do (use money and media to control and instill fear in people) and just blame it on Jews and leftists
I enjoy stuff like this or ancient-aliens or flat-earth as fiction, it can be fun, but people tend to ruin things one way or another, especially the ones who _insist_ it's true. It's especially infuriating when they not only insist it's true, they ignore evidence and arguments to the contrary. (Though, it can be amusing, if painful, to try to think like them and see if you can come up with logical, reasonable, sane explanations to waive off evidence. 🤔)
...all when simple BUILDING CODES and a magnetron refute every bit of drivel from these mouth breathers. Conspiracy loons are tiresome and loathsome, including the videos sane people make about them.
I have seen the Tartaria theory described as "they've now applied the logic of Ancient Aliens to white people of 100-150 years ago," which is kind of amusing, but someone always has to go and blame the Jews or insist that the lost super-civilization is why white people are special or whatever.
I stg if I hear one more person say "They drove horses and buggies" I dare them go build a wagon and travel the oregon trail. Do it. You won't make it because it actually takes an insane amount of skill to upkeep moving wooden parts.
My grandpa actually restores antique farming equipment as well as sleds and carriages, he lives in upstate New York around the amish communites. He's a skilled mechanic and carpenter and alot of the equipment he works with is 100+ years old and literally is still being used to bring in the hay today. its asinine that people believe that people are incapable of creating complex machines and buildings just cause they happened to live a couple centuries ago. I swear people have become so seperated from how things are made that Magic is an easier answer.
Yeah, people who ride in horses and buggies are still building things today. Where I live, many Amish work in the construction industry, and the buildings they build are at least as good as those built by other contractors.
When I was renting a late 19th century cemetery caretaker's house for a year, the Amish came to dismantle the similarly old house across the street (future home of a Dunkin Donuts). They were like ants. The first day they chalk marked the boards for reassembly purposes and stripped it down to the frame. Day 2, they stripped the frame, uprooted all the basement wall bricks, and carted it back home. On the third day other contractors showed up with an excavator and a dump truck, and they filled in the hole. Then a road project to change the intersection... Eventually the Dunkin. The Amish were the most efficient part of the whole process. I'd have loved to have had a camcorder or today's modern cellphone back then (2006) to take a time lapse video of them picking the house clean.
Yup. We CAN build cathedrals. It's just that the ruling class has decided they don't want to spend their stolen money on beautiful buildings that are visible to the masses anymore.
@@johannageisel5390 not necessarily. Architectural and aesthetic preferences change over time. As do things such as availability of materials and broad availability of housing. Keep in mind, at the time when most cathedrals and such were built, 95% of the population lived in wooden and mud homes, sharing their living spaces with multiple generations of their family and their livestock. And of the remaining 5% maybe 1% had access to anything resembling indoor heating and or plumbing. The access to these sort of conveniences and the ability to put up a building in a year instead of 100 to 200 years is why the aesthetics have in a sense simplified. The Sagrada Familia is a quite a unique project, it's been under construction for about 140 years now, and will take another 10 years to finish. It is exceptional, but wildly inefficient.
@@MikeBenko The thing is: With today's technology we could easily build comfortable housing for the masses AND really nice public buildings. But capitalism ruins everything. Of course the problem of inequality predates capitalism. Only in ye olden times the ruling class still had other interests apart from amassing ever more money - for example appeasing some invisible sky daddy or leaving a legacy. That's why they put a part of their stolen money into representative public buildings. Today they have stopped doing even that.
I have always felt like we should value beautiful sturdy architecture not because of some moral reason, but simply because having great architecture around puts you in such a great mood and also when things are built to be functional and last it saves everyone money in the long run. You don't have to worry as much about shelling out thousands of dollars on random repairs every year.
This is very interesting to me because, as a Russian without a particular interest in conspiracy theories, I always thought of "Great Tartaria" as a particularly fringe version of the "primordial Russian global empire" theory and had no idea it got so much traction outside Russia. Just a slight quibble around 43:24 : this isn't really the same generic sense of the term "Ta(r)taria" as used by the old Western European cartographers. In Soviet usage "Tataria" very specifically referred to the administrative entity whose full name was the Tatar Autonomous Soviet Socialist Republic, which corresponds to the modern Republic of Tatarstan. Some Russian speakers still use "Tataria" as the short form place name, but this usage is generally frowned upon in the region itself with most Tatar people using "Tatarstan" in all languages. Since calling Tatar people "Tartars" in English only really started getting pushback in recent decades, it's not surprising that a CIA document from 1957 would have used the spelling "Tartaria" for what was "Tataria" in the original. But yeah, this is very obviously referring to attempts by the Soviet Union at the time to whitewash the history of relations between the Russian state and the Turkic-speaking Muslim Tatars in order to strengthen "inter-ethnic cohesion" and minimize the threat of the Tatars' opposition to the USSR as the continuation of the Russian state. Since the original Soviet document is supposed to be from 1944, this threat would have been seen as more than just hypothetical at the time, as Nazi Germany was exploiting the nationalist feelings of Tatars and other ethnic groups of the larger Volga area to recruit fighters for its Idel-Ural Legion.
You are correct. as I understand it. But I do think the story goes much deeper. some of the architecture in Saint Petersburg has images of astrology. Clearly not built by communist, but they have claimed it in 1944 as communist design. No chance 😂
There is one reason for buried buildings that you forgot to mention: The ground is growing in many places. Erosion by wind and water will slowly transport material from higher regions into lower regions where it gets deposited. I saw that in the German city of Trier, which was founded around the year 0 by the Romans. Our tour guide told us that the ground in that region grows by roughly 10cm per century. 2000 years, aka 20 centuries, will then result in 2m of rise. And what do you know - the entrance level of the Roman buildings was about 2m under today's ground, while the medieval entrance level was about 1m under today's ground level. (There is a watch tower in a park where they have dug away the dirt around the original entrance so that you can see the difference.) And all without a mudflood!
Every time you play that clip of someone saying they used horse and buggies just makes me think of a video I watched of like 50 something Amish dudes straight up lifting a barn or something - I get that it’s not the same as a cathedral but like, people make due ya know
I love how people forget that these ornate buildings often took multiple generations of people to make, some who saw the beginning of the project, but not the end, and vice versa.
I also love how these advanced civilisations used... stone. They've mastered free energy, but clearly couldn't afford the energy to industrially smelt steel and surpass the glaring limitations imposed by the square-cube law when it comes to building with stone. Just compare the pyramids to one of those super-slim towers next to Central Park.
And you have proof of this or just taking the word of people who told you who also had no proof and just took the word of people who told them and so on? Yeah, didn't think so.
As a British person watching your videos for the first time, I got to 8:58 and spat out my tea, my monocle fell out and I almost dropped my crumpet. Top show old bean, subscribed.
Mia is a bit of an Anglophobe. I remember when she tweeted complaints about British "people". I was in her chat and saw quite a lot of her British fans being really saddened. Someone even asked how her British fans who were trans would feel. She deleted the tweet but yeah, I wasn't sure what we did but she threw us under the bus. One last trans role model to look up to. It seems she thinks post imperialist Britons are still imperialist. Maybe she thinks all Germans are still Nazis. You'd have thought a historian would know better. To be fair, her Anglophobia proper broke my heart 😢
You see, there once a species of humans that had blood infused with Tartar sauce, the natural food of the gods, allowing them to reach heights unattainable by ketchup infused humans (which is what blood actually is).
As a person who lost his (2nd story, already raised) home in February to flooding in the worst climate event our region has ever seen, I can absolutely confirm that water-go-up events exist and are undesirable.
This reminds me of a guy who wrote an essay about how the Theatro Amazonas had to be an ancient structure built by aliens, less than 10 years after its actual construction.
In response to the TikTok that went "you expect me to believe that they built this with a hammer and chisel? 🤨": The Inca would build a lot of their most important buildings without mortar. They would file the bricks down in ways that would allow them to slot almost perfectly together like legos and as a result they were virtually earthquake-proof. So uhhhhhh yeah if Machu Picchu can be built without mortar I'm pretty sure we probably could build something like that building with a hammer and chisel
Blame the History channel, that ancient aliens show has really caused many people to think ancient humans were basically incompetent in every way. Ive had to explain that it’s classified as entertainment for a reason, many times with little to no result.
Small note - I'm pretty sure you're talking about Puma Punku at Tiwanaku, which was pre-Inca, not Machu Picchu. Machu Picchu was Inca, and yet Puma Punku used far more advanced techniques. There are a lot of conspiracy theories surrounding it because nobody's quite sure what kind of tools were being used to construct it - stone tools (in particular the hammerstones used to construct most Inca architecture) were incapable of the fine interior right angles that some of the stones displayed, so some people (notably, the History Channel) jumped from "wow, these people were more clever than we give them credit for" to "wow, there's no way these uneducated savages could have possibly done this on their own, obviously it was aliens," because some people are chronically incapable of seeing how interesting the real world is and have to make shit up to compensate
@@littlesnowflakepunk855 Oh, but of course aliens did it! You expect me to believe people that maybe didn't even rode around in horse and buggies made all those wonderful constructions?
"are we expected to believe people did this with a hammer and a chistle?" What do you call this specific kind of disbelief in human ingenuity bred by modern technology? 🤔
Free energy exists no this dude is a paid propagandist you need to look past the algorithm even TIKTOK is good for truth stuff look at both sides than make a decision never listen to anything TH-cam suggests always hit uploaded recently
@@DAVEMCKEEGANSWORSTNIGHTMAREyes free energy exists(taken from skies ,just like a signal tower) These people will never going to make us use that They captured and destroyed knowledge of pyramids,paganic temples and temples to use them as a free energy source
Like... They know that the time frame they're talking about for the fall of Tartaria is just barely outside living memory, right? Forget the history books, at the short end of that 100-300 year window you could just ask your grandparents if they remembered it or if *their* grandparents told them about it.
Like here in Chattanooga, our city is built on a river and one time it flooded, so they built the entire downtown up one level. My grandparents told me about it all the time. The library is full of old diaries you can just read for free.
It occurs to me, how much of this stuff is coming from America? As a Scottish person the idea that the apocalypse happened 300 years ago sounds absurdly recent. We still have some pretty serious social problems stemming from grudges that started 500 years ago. America however is such a new country that 300 years ago being pre history might make more sense.
As an American, I found it absurd for my own local reasons. Colonialism was dramatically shaping our modern population 300 years ago -- if some other empire was actually in charge at that time, then why are all these white people over here? Why do I speak English? Did colonialism happen?
I blame our education system's disinterest in exploring pre-Founding Father's mythos America. Very little other than the May Flower, Pilgrims, all that crap. No King Phillip's War. Very little 7 Years War. Our public schools generally start the meat and potatos of our own history at the Revolution, teach world history as a more remote and separate animal, and leave science to pick up the slack with humanity's origins.
I’m in America and the European part of my family got here in 1620, I am not alone, I know the whys and how’s of peoples lives and deaths going back further the 300 years. Russia and China are flooding our minds with trash
Americans tend to think that 100 years ago was an ancient time, and therefore MUST have been radically different from today, and where much of the truth MUST have been lost over those vast ages. Especially young people who can't remember anything from even 20 years ago. I think a lot of "Tartarians" forget that there are still people alive today who remember the 1920s, 30s, 40s, and whose parents remembered the 19th century well. As for why this seems to be a more American phenomenon, I agree with the other commenters that it may have something to do with the relative youth of our country, paired with the fact that we largely ignore indigenous history. It's almost like our concept of world history begins in 1492 or even 1776 rather than ~3000 BC.
@@michaelwills1926 You're on the internet right? Why do people ask others for 3vidence when you have a world of knowledge at your fingertips, go look it up or something
This whole "theory" boils down to "This doesn't LOOK like it would have been made by people I regard as stupid uncultured savages, so it MUST have been made by some anceint advanced civilization sometime in the past" In other words, it is Atlantis, just bigger. Or how we created gods, just smaller.
@@MCArt25 I wrote for this theory extensively about a decade ago and one of the old pillars was that racism was created by the Europeans in their attempt to dominate the post mud flood world.
@@MCArt25 - Not quite as racist. With _this_ theory, they're underestimating the skills and ingenuity of Europeans, too. It's a little refreshing, actually.
Nice straw man. Meanwhile, no drawings, no plans, no records of all these construction projects. Explain how all this could be done with the technology as told by the history tellers and then we can get to the bottom of it. Oh but wait: they were destroyed in ~fires~
MiniMinuteman has some good stuff on this, that most conspiracies like this basically consist of people going "Doesn't this thing look kinda like this other, completely unrelated thing? Really makes you think, huh" with basically no understanding of the actual process that creates either thing
Loved the section of your video dedicated to settlements needing to bury considerable sections of previous architectural solutions. As an archaeologist, i have to say that humans tend to do that a lot! In fact, my master's thesis took advantage of that to date a roman site. Amazing vid, as usual!
This reminds me of the "Helen Keller was a fraud" BS. I'm a disabled, wheelchair-using disability advocate and educator...so I guess I would go there. But I think the similarities are still there. It always comes down to, "I don't know much about this thing, and I generally have a low opinion of groups I'm not familiar with, so that translates to my being unable to imagine people I consider lesser doing something I also cannot imagine myself doing." I.e. "I couldn't make a bulding like that, no WAY people did 200yrs ago," (even though humans 10,000yrs ago had the same brains that we now do trigonometry and particle physics and paint photorealism with). Or with Helen Keller, "I know very little about the disability community and since it doesn't benefit me directly I have no desire to learn, so I am going to assume HK was the only deafblind person who ever learned to speak and write even though there are deadass *deafblind TikTokkers.*" Hubris is a cruel mistress, my dude. Have a little real curiosity about your fellow humans and don't approach everything with an air of superiority just because you're afraid to do the work to be genuinely informed. At the very least, stop and consider: if it was found out for absolute certain, undeniable proof, it is 100% that the narrative you are about to post turns out to be completely wrong, are you going to look like a ghoul? Embarrassingly gullible? Fabulous take, per usual, Mia.
Soup Emporium made a fascinating video on the subject that also explores HK's leftist activism and how her political beliefs were revised out of her legacy. A lot of what he goes into might be old news for you but his channel in general is worth a visit :)
@@therealjuliuscaesar6584 I watched that! I was very surprised and I imagined just how frustrated and exasperated she must have felt going through that again and again. She never got a break but she never caved to them and stood up for her values and ideals. I was impressed and now I have even more respect for her than I previously did.
I'm an urban planner and I have a gf who loves old architecture despite not being in that field at all, and it's always kinda hard to explain her that we don't build XIXth century Wilhelmian Era style buildings because of economics, of improved pay for construction workers, of resource shortages and of shifts in societal makeups. It's pretty easy to build yourself a hostel in Paris France when you know you can pour a lot of budget in it since it'll be inhabited by three generations and two branches of the family, when the sculptor has a ton of barely paid apprentices, when we've barely scrapped the surface of quarries because most houses are (well) made of mud, wood, clay bricks and hay
There's also practical limitations, the reason why skyscrapers are rarely very ornate is because they're so high that the wind could be strong enough to rip a lot of ornamentation off, which would present a danger to everyone below. That was actually a problem in New York and led to legislation against it. At the same time there's also just the desire to make the interior as comfortable as possible by letting in as much light as possible, which leads to us making large glass facades. Older buildings might look nice on the outside but they're rarely actually very comfortable to work or live in because of things like this. These days we tend to generally focus more on making a building comfortable for the people actually using them rather than making them into grand propagandistic monuments to our personal glory.
@@hedgehog3180 Having seen some grand monuments to personal glory and excess of opulence, I'd say they moved the flash and glitter *inside* instead of external, and that turned out to be a lot more successful and comfortable (and above all, easier to _maintain_ comparatively- who'd want a beautifully ornate house that's hell to touch up and restore when the wear of time inevitably hits?)
This person hasn't gone deep enough. I'm pretty level-headed but when you go deep there are many glaring holes. This person uses conspiracy theory as an easy way to make people questioning the narrative look stupid. You should always question things and people have forgotten about that very important lesson. Start digging into old books and maps. That's where the good stuff is. It's starts to become apparent that something isn't right. It's just that these people that claim to know all of the answers make that act of digging for more look like dum-dums
There are 2 reasons why we don't build like that anymore: 1) There are not highly qualified workers, masonry is not a form of art anymore (Well kinda, there are still some highly qualified masons but not enough to satisfy a possible demand) 2) Buildings are made cheap (Because of the form over function line of thought in architecture) and they are planned to not be durable enough, they are made to be recyclable and destroyed. The wage argument doesn't make sense when you take into account that people back then (Even till 1950) were paid with gold backed certificates and they were valued way more. Back then one man could sustain a family by his own (He even could buy a house without incurring on debt), and everything back then was more durable than nowadays.
I'm watching this immediately after rewatching the New Chronology video, so when you mentioned Anatoly Fomenko, I shouted "GODDAMMIT! YOU CAN'T ESCAPE THIS MATH NERD!"
Educational system failure. This is what happens when people stop reading books. What young people don’t realize is that there are usually hundreds of books written about any random Wikipedia page subject. There is vast information out there. Today people only read the “Cliffs Notes”
I’m an apprentice high school social studies teacher😅 It’s just as frustrating for us teachers as it is for students. I’m in my student teaching rn and the catch up I have to play with my kids because of Covid is insane. I started a lesson on imperialism that included Guns, Germs and Steel but on the fly I had to change the lesson to giving them an overview of Mesopotamia and the Fertile Crescent.
Mia everytime you upload a new video it feels like the portics of heaven have openned up to the earth to greet us mortals with weirdass conspiracy theories and aesthetic lofi music
Hello! Would you like to watch a video where the prettiest girl you've ever seen thoughtfully deconstructs some wack conspiracy you'd never even heard of? Subscribe to Mia Mulder today!
@@CChissel "real" would be those who actually provide evidence for theories and rational, logical arguments rather than straw man arguments. This is a good channel for those who just want confirmation bias and those who scoff at anything which goes against their mainstream bubbles. Just laugh at anything that doesn't comport to your programming and stay safe in the historical narrative provided for you thru a lifetime of programming. This channel serves to keep you in the "safe" box of accepted authoritarian views and allows you to feel superior to anyone who would challenge your precious beliefs. You can easily find thousands of channels which serve to prop up the false paradigm and if you never question what you have been taught and don't ever think outside the box then these channels are perfect for you. If you actually see beyond your own bias and world view and are actually sincere in seeking truth then you will find many, many good sites which can help you. If I have to point you to these sites then you have no ability to think for yourself and find your own answers. All you will find here is confirmation of what you already think.
@17:33 I love how the fact Tartary has a flag on this panel is used as evidence of its existence as a state or empire even though the same panel has a pirate flag on it. And not just anywhere, the 'Pirates' flag is just to the lower left. Also, that flag is literally the flag of Qazan, a Turkic city conquered by Russia and renamed Kazan because Russians don't do q.
i watch a lot of debunking videos about history conspiracies, and the flag is the only part of the tartaria theory that they never seem to address. it was mentioned in this video but not explained. and it is actually interesting because that image with the yellow flag and dragon is actually from before Kazan started having a coat of arms with a dragon. the yellow flag with a dragon was originally from a book by a Dutchman named Allard (published in 1694 apparently) along with a second flag that was yellow with an owl, and he said that these two flags were used by "Caesar of Tataria" one of them was supposedly the naval flag. it seems no one knows exactly where these flags were from but most likely they were either from the old Kazan Khanate or the Crimean Khanate (who actually had a navy). They were also shown on many other flag charts until the 19th century.
I find the "why are these photos so empty" people particularly infuriating because a lot of it is just how cameras worked at the time. Before we'd invented super light sensitive mediums to take pictures with, photos took AGES to expose, so you'd only be able to see stuff that had stayed still and everything else either wouldn't show up or would be a total blur and you get these beautiful, haunting photos of historical streets where you can just *barely* see the shadows of one or two people in a place that would've actually been full of life. The first photo we actually have of a human being was when a guy pointed his camera out a window and someone on the street below just HAPPENED to be getting his shoes shined, and as a result was standing around for long enough that it showed up in the photo.
architect here, along with mia's great explanation of the economic aspect i would also like to encourage people who are interested in architecture to understand the different types of stress (compression, tensile, shear, bending, etc.) present in structures and its relation to their form and materials, and how our understanding of those evolved over time. i know it may sound boring but if you can understand that you would definitely not see modern concrete and steel buildings as lesser in complexity and technology compared to older ones, and you will get why certain structural typologies repeat across different cultures throughout history.
Basically, Tartar was a generic catch-all term to refer to a variety of places, peoples and powers ...and these people read it as if Tartar was instead a unified, national power which makes otherwise harmless, menial assertions look like major untold events
search up “Cultural Development under Communism”. A REAL CIA APPROVED DOCUMENT where they say the Russians purposely FALSIFIED the history of the tartars and multiple other groups mainly Muslim groups in the region. Nothing is done for no reason.
I love your work! This is very interesting, although my soul leaves my body everytime I hear "We're expected to believe people build this with a hammer and chisel." Like yes, yes people did build that with a hammer and chisel
As someone once put it, 'everything is miraculous/inexplicable to one who is ignorant' - these people have never learned the basic whys and hows of the world, so anything beyond their immediate experience looks like a mystery. I consider it ultimately a failure of education, not because they don't know the exact facts but because they don't know how to interrogate the world they live in.
my fav building to talk about is the florence cathedral which can be quite daunting to think it was actually built by humans with hammer and chisels. until you find out it took 140 years to complete it. 50 of those years construction slowed down due to first architect dying and a pandemic called the black death
@@joeyj6808 Well, there was such a thing like Socialist Classicism and it looked really nice. And just look at the Moscov metro stations! Stalin was an asshole, but during his time they really tried building "palaces for the people". Sadly, the costs were high and the SU couldn't keep that up. WWII and the cold war was a real burden. But they showed that it is possible to build nice stuff for the masses. You have to have the political will to do so, though.
There are actual historical pictures of the cologne cathedral being built with nails and hammers by ordinary humans. It's totally possible to build things like that, it just takes time.
Can't wait for people in 300 years talking about the empire state building and the Burj Kalifa like "what? Are we expected to believe they built this when they didn't even have energy-tachyon power and matter reconstruction technology? Get real"
For thousands of years, all was well in the Tartarian Empire with their whimsical Beaux-Arts towers, wacky Neo-Gothic turretes and Art-Nouveau ornaments. But then, the Le Corbusier nation attacked.
the preoccupation with world fairs is particularly mindboggling. every reference i can ever remember about them--as far back as memory allows, anyway--has almost always been immediately followed up with "but they were basically plaster and wire sculptures and most of them would have fallen over in a year. their fragility has always been a core component of their mythos. also those fairs weren't a egalitarian celebration of knowledge and ingenuity, it was industrial-age international propoganda. simple as.
I went to the World's Fair in New Orleans when I was a kid and about the only thing I remember was being so stoked about the gondolas (telecabins) and being disappointed that they were not built for permanency (my family went there every year on vacation so I thought it was something I'd get to do again and again). I'm not even sure they were they were working the weekend we went. I remember going on an on about wanting to ride one and when are we going to get to ride them, but I don't think we ever did. I don't remember any buildings being erected for it, like in a lot of cities in the old days, but as a jaded old person who's seen how things work, I just assume that most World Fair constructions would be a lot like Olympic Villages, expensive quick-builds that do not stand any test of time. I'm legit impressed that Chicago still has two standing.
As a Seattleite, I am very glad you brought up underground Seattle--it was definitely my first thought! Also, as an archaeologist who specializes in the 19th century US, the tiktoks from this theory were physically painful for me to watch :') Loved your reading of the appeal of this theory to people, though. Aesthetic moralism is something I have definitely seen, but didn't have a word for, before
I'm the kid of an architect who specializes in stuff relating to old buildings, and even with the knowledge I got from being around his work, hearing him talk about it, and helping him out sometimes by for example checking his texts for typos those tiktoks are incredibly painful to watch, it would be funny if it wasn't this sad.
Thanks for this excellent discussion on the Tartaria theories circulating online. The 'lost empire' seemed to be very strange to me from the outset, and your reasoned presentation, as a person with a solid background in history, offers the viewers a foundation of sorts - free of rabbit holes and quagmires.
@@MiaMuldertaking select sound bites, using them out of context, to create a selective argument proves nothing. Some logical fallacies used in your argument: strawman, false cause, begging the question, appeal to authority, composition/division, the fallacy fallacy, cherry picking. It just shows you don't understand how to research or even understand the actual theory, just small parts of it. Hope you find help for your body dysmorphia though.
We actually ARE still building elaborate structures of the kinds familiar to us from past ages. Barcelona's famous Sagrada Familia basilica is still unfinished- it's been under construction since 1882, with work scheduled to finish in 2026. Most ancient buildings need regular restoration to keep them in good shape, and many have been substantially restored following disasters- e.g. they're currently rebuilding the roof of Notre-Dame de Paris following the fire in 2019. In Berlin they recently completed a building called the Humboldt Forum, which is used to house a museum, but is a ground-up reconstruction of the 300-year-old Berlin Royal Palace, which was completely destroyed in WWII. Other than the stone being cleaner, it looks almost indistinguishable from the surrounding baroque buildings.
And there are still plenty of buildings being made which aren't solely functional, but the aesthetic of what is considered "fancy" has also changed. See things like the Sydney Opera House, or the Gherkin, or Frank Lloyd Wright's work for some more recent famous examples. Heck, aesthetics also changed over the centuries in question, just someone without knowledge on the subject would group all of those aesthetics together as "old building styles" without really being able to tell them apart.
There's also plenty of lavish buildings with the old flourishes built recently, conspiratoids just don't know about them because they're dictators' palaces or mosques.
The whole Old Town of Warsaw was reconstructed based on XVIIc. oil paintings, old city planes and so on after Nazi burned the city to the ground. And it took less than 40 years at such a scale.
I'm glad you mentioned Seattle. Having grown up there, I'd been educated from an early age about the regrading that happened in the city's history. Anyone who walks in certain parts of downtown and sees the glass cubes embedded in the sidewalk will have questions about that which tour guides are happy to explain. Incidentally, if you visit Seattle, there have a version of the Underground Tour after dark called the "Underworld Tour". It's the same as the normal tour, except it's 21+, they talk about the old Seattle vice industries, and it comes with an included cocktail at the end of the tour. I recommend it. It's one of the few "tourist traps" in town that I think of as worth the time and money to do.
We are doomed as a species when relatively recent history like this is obscured and forgotten. Like there is one thing for the misunderstanding of how the pyramids are built, that happened a long time ago. but a lot of things and buildings here either have written modern English on why, how and for whom they where built, or photos.
lol you say we are doomed as a species because of the way a small group of people view the past without seeing the type of people being made today by left! Lmao how ironic and ignorant your statement really is. Say that to yourself one more time “Doomed as a species”
.*a few centuries from now* “Are we expected to believe that people who rode around in vehicles with primitive explosion engines that ran on dead dinosaur goo built these giant skyscrapers? Please.”
"I can't believe they thought electric cars were better. They still used fossil fuels to charge their cars. They just added a step. I can't believe they fell for that propaganda" loll
Every time I watch a Mia Mulder video, I try desperately to find a Mulder and Scully joke, but I never find one. I know there's one out there, I want to believe
The thing that gets me about the people going on about how they "just had horses and buggies" is like, okay and....were they supposed to be magically using cars instead? There isn't much improvement to be made to a buggy, and you can't technologically upgrade a horse.
I see a lot of Tartarian "historians" but not many Tartarian scientists working on that etheral free energy technology. What a shame they are wasting their time on Tik Tok. Thanks for this economic analysis, tried it on european Tartarians but that does not seem to convince them (had to remind them of wars and financial crisis as well but... nope). Good point for them : lots of beautiful pictures out of the archives.
What I've learned from watching Miniminuteman videos is that tiktok conspiracy theorists absolutely LOVE to say "doesn't this LOOK like X?" and never even attempt to find any further evidence than that
Imagine meatriding Miniminuteman the incel femboy and gulping his spoorm and then taking it as the ultimate fact , and science worshippers think the ''conspiracists'' have no brain LMAO
I like the idea of alternate history and entertain it lightly now and again as a mental plaything, but WOW OOOF ouch it's rough to hear people say things like: "I acknowledge this old building is cool, but I don't think THESE people made it, yannow? They clearly needed help to do it." It has the same exact energy as Chariots of the Gods/Ancient Aliens, where I'm kinda vibing to the rap about Mayans in space capsules, but I lose the thread when they claim: "well, obviously THEY couldn't manage, that, because, yannow (racism)? So did it for reasons." Like nah, you turned some cool mental image I had going of sleek sci-fi space ports in jungles and made it into some boring rag about invading aliens helping "those" humans as if they wouldn't have known rocks from kernels of corn without intervention. Like, scientology did it, it's corporate-tier boring to say aliens did it, and that deus ex-machina only exists because this kind of conspiracy theorist is too racist or otherwise too stuck in some other bias to have a full range of imagination that maybe people did do more on their own without . The way it dismisses the actual effort and intelligence of the actual historical people at the time is as chilling as their imagination is lacking. It's bad alt history fanfic, too, so it's especially a deep letdown when this half-baked tripe is taken as fact.
I never got the racism angle. I just don’t see that being the case. They say that ancient megalithic structures couldn’t have been built by ancient people, on their own, because of their more primitive technology. It just happens that all these megalithic structures only exist where POC live. The only real exception being Stonehenge, which these folks also attribute to aliens and shit.
@@PatheticApathetic It originates from racist thought. Most of those theories came about in the early 20th century due to racism, if you read some of the earliest mentions of these structures you’ll see that they usually do not entertain that the ancestors of the local population could have built such things because of their prejudice.
@@PatheticApathetic I just wish for variation. Aliens helping for reasons is just not a very interesting story now that it's been told nearly every other time aliens are part of the story. It's the sci-fi equivalent of caulking at this point, when there isn't a better explanation. Anyway, if they're so primitive how come various ancient stone works astonish us to this day? You must give the brilliant ancients credit for managing this, even if we don't get how they did it. The "oh someone came and helped them" fanfics just sorta sucks the air out of any premise of maybe having the people do anything at all, which will always be a worse story than maybe like, considering the primacy of a culture reaching new heights, and exploring a limitless ceiling for their influence. It kicks the explanatory can down the road and also puts the credit in the hands of Xanadu or whomever and it's just so much less fun and also I know that these works stand because of the effort of the actual people, so it's like, bad and uninspiring to the extent that over time I can't help but see the intellectual, cultural, and creative poverty of this "sci-fi" pattern of worldbuilding.
Mia on 21.06: "And today Tartaria believers are basically not at all aligned with Russia or Russian interests or believing that Russia is supposedly this ancient empire." Me: "Bet they've kept the 'blaming the Jews' part though!" Fascinating video as always! Thank you! P.S. "svarogiches" on 18.55 should be spelled Svarozhitses or Svarozhiches, I believe. As in sons of Svarog - or maybe Levashov meant the Svarozhich symbols - hard to know without digging deeper into his nonsense.
Having read too much late 19th and early 20th century speculations about Atlantis, there's just way too many similarities (especially the pyramid building white giants). I'm sure it's a result of direct influence but it'd also be interesting to see a comparison of conditions surrounding advocates of both ideas. Also, can't wait for a fantasy author to deconstruct this mythos the way Robert E Howard tore down Atlantis.
> Having read too much late 19th and early 20th century speculations about Atlantis Oh, so you’ve pretty much read all of it, then? Seeing as the Atlantis Myth was invented by a Civil War-Era Politician from a metaphor told by Plato.
@@MrMessiah2013 You're forgetting Theosophical authors making up way more than Ignatius Donnelly came up with, biologists making up the continent of Lemuria because nobody had figured out plate techtonics yet, James Churchward making up Mu (which Theosophists could never decide was also Lemuria or not), and white supremacists trying to throw Hyperborea into the mix.
@@MrMessiah2013 Then it seems like there could be two myths of Atlantis, one made in Europe and one in the USA (I have heard about that one in the past, but I do not recall those details). I little bit doubt that US myth would make it to sort of Germany encyclopedia from late 19th century. And there is some reprint of map that seems like from late 18th century or early 19th century, in style it is very different from other maps made in late 19th century.
I find the idea that building scyscrapers out of little but glass, steel, and concrete is somehow not insanely impressive, kinda fascinating. Brain dead, but fascinating
For as far as i know, "tartarus" was also used to refer to someone who came from the worlds edges in anchient rome and greece, cause tartarus is placed there in greek mitology. As well as "barbarus" was used to refer to someone who speaks an unknown language, so they sound like "bar bar" when they talk
I know there’s plenty of people who are actually very cautious about critical thinking and healthy skepticism and genuine research love themselves some conspiracy theories. I used to as well when I was younger, but seeing where this conspiracy stuff leads people who don’t know how to do real research or fact check for the past 6 years has sucked all the fun out of all such content for me that isn’t dedicated to debunking it. The way narratives and lore are fed to people under the guise of “history” is so stressful.
wait Fomenko started all this stuff? That's so crazy. I knew of him because he wrote a well loved math textbook. It's always weird when faces come back for vastly different reasons
There's academic math papers that cite the Unabomber by actual name, because intense specialisation is a thing done by many people who have a predisposition to going squirrelly.
@@sakurakiyori i clicked on the comment to mention ted kaczynski too lmao. if i had a nickel for every time a notable mathematician came up with a WILD theory/ideology, i'd have 2 nickels etc
@@gunsugoncu You'd have a lot more than that, too. Any name you remember from high school maths, look them up to find some wild shit. Newton's rainbow music, Pythagoras and beans, anything related to Descartes, and I'm sure there's more.
@@sakurakiyori I mean in general scientists often end up saying really stupid shit whenever they go outside of their field, but mathematicians seem especially predispositioned to doing this. I guess it might be because math doesn't involve the same kind of background knowledge that you need to build up in science so mathematicians are less likely to realize that they might have a knowledge blind spot that'll lead to them misunderstanding things. Historians and Archeologists are the opposite since those are fields were you need an absolute ton of knowledge to even make basic assertions about a specific things so they know that even within their own field they're probably not qualified to say much about something they themselves don't study.
I used to follow conspiracies a lot when an ex-friend fell deep into them. But this is one I had never heard of so thanks for the deep dive into it! Awesome video as always.
I’m less than five minutes in and am FLABBERGASTED by what I’m hearing! I’m literally doing homework for my ancient history class and if this civilization existed, we would see it LONG, LONG BEFORE it was supposed to have fallen. Plus, a large amount of the ~pretty architecture~ and ~ruins under cities~ from “200” years ago is MUCH. MUCH MUCH MUCH OLDER. How would a mud flood even work. Where did this society originate. How did they not have squabbles with the other ancient powerhouses of their time. How didn’t other cultures make notes of them. How come we have ancient ruins from Greece and Rome and Sumer and Babylon- even cities that were BURNED TO THE GROUND, but this MYSTERY EMPIRE is either STILL STANDING IN MAJOR CITIES, or is completely SWALLOWED BY DIRT THAT APPARENTLY FLOODED THE WORLD CENTURIES AFTER ROME FELL. Edit: I’m a bit farther in and a few of my questions have been answered so I’m glad that these conspiracy theorists actually looked for answers to these questions… even if they’re wrong- but it turns out my history class is actually literally learning about the Mongols right this minute and I just started a video and it calls them Tartars for the first time this unit. I wish I started it when I started this video I would’ve lost my mind.
I love that you put a picture of Lewis Hamilton there. As a lifelong F1 fan in the United States who feels like nobody here watches this sport, I felt very seen.
Conspiracy theories that boil down to "I am too stupid to do that, so all those I see as more primitive than myself could not do that either" are always... Fun.
Jon Levi and others have so much evidence at this point there is really no debate. But just like the coof psyop some people will attach to the mainstream lies no matter how much cognitive dissonance mental gymnastics it takes. Go learn the basics of just setting foundations for construction and if you have an IQ over 80 you will realize there is no way people could build these, let alone even set a foundation, with no electricity.
They say we build on old structures, now... what about all the fires? Every major city had a major fire. The buildings always say FOUNDED. ..checkout Mind Unveiled or My Lunch Break
Cavity magnetrons don't generate power, the turn power you must provide into microwaves. And they're made of metal not stone, stone cavity magnetrons wouldn't work, and the circle patterns are just an idealised crossection, real magnetrons have stuff both sides of the circles to work, so those stone windows wouldn't remotely work as a magnetron. Some very bizarre theories out there. Anyway, thank you for the good video, I enjoyed it a lot. Always happy to see you post!
Forgot that you were a fellow Swede for a while until 36:38 and your subtle passive aggressive tone basically gave me whiplash, and I promptly remembered.
I believe the "Tartars" referenced in that CIA document actually refer specifically to the modern Tatar ethnic minority in Russia. That's why Muslim religious identity is also mentioned. They're Muslims, and the Soviet Union was pretty darn anti-islam. It wasn't merely a general term but used in reference to a specific ethnic minority. Incidentally the Tartaria conspiracy theorists are through their sheer ignorance completely erasing the actual histories of various Asian ethnic groups.
Not really. I've been in the comments section of yt uploads made by and about modern Tatars, showcasing their culture. There are a few ''Great Tartaria'' nutcases in the comment sections but they circle jerk and don't dare ask anything from the real Tatars posting. I asked a couple of Tatars if they'd heard of this theory, they were bemused and just said ''stupid Americans''. Their culture is going strong, just because a few stupid Westerners who think TikTok is a source of knowledge are ignorant of it is immaterial.
I absolutely love your debunkings of these weird conspiracy theories, Mia! This one in particular actually sounds like a great premise for a novel or something. almost feels like Attack on Titan? but maybe it's just the giants leading me to make that conclusion. it's honestly kind of sad to hear people believing that humans aren't capable of creating beautiful things with basic tools like chisels and hammers, though. humans are a lot more capable on our own than we give ourselves credit for.
The one little thing missing in this video would be a short tangent about the modern, real, ethnic group called Tatars. Not because they are relevant to this conspiracy theory but just because whoever starts googling to know more about Tartaria will end up finding info about Tatarstan, Tatars of Criema.. and get confused. And more confusion is bad !
A note about the 60s and 70s. Post World Wars, art and thought was extremely anti-tradition. My ex's mom went to art school and was often chastized for drawing and liking realistic paintings. She purposefully protested in some classes and dropped out of others when the teacher got snobby about "REAL art". I like a lot of modern art, but I can see why there was a huge anti-modern backlash because of how nasty modern art crtics were about older art! Maintainable decor is prohibitively expensive! I live in places with TONS of gorgeous Victorian (and older) homes. In the mid century, a LOT of people stripped the gingerbread and flourishes off their house because the labor to repair, paint and maintain them is SO costly. My house is one of these, possibly older than 1900, but very little decor left. Someone remodeled and decided to remove all the fancy stuff because it was too much of a pain to maintain.
Always enjoy Mia's timely interventions. When I first came across this 'theory' I found something rather charming about it, these tiktokers giddily asserting all sorts of wondrous things. There's something about lost subterranean worlds particularly that brings out the inner child. Some of us who end up becoming archaeologists can trace our interest back to those long summer days mucking about in sandpits, doing grand excavations, building castle turrets, digging traps under drawbridges made of lolly sticks. Sadly, like many conspiracy theories, this one is tainted by darker origins. Great work as always Mia.
If you want an actual underground marvel (if you haven't heard of it by now): the underground city of Derrinkuyu, Turkiye. Shit's _amazing_ these doods saw easy to carve rock and they made like.... a whole Fallout Vault-level city. It's amazing and it was in use still very recently! Derinkuyu is now basically my model for when I've gotta design underground cities in my fics and stories.
Another fun thing about cartography- They lied. On purpose, and a lot. Before any sort of real IP laws, it became a really efficient way to prove someone was cheating and copying your maps. If they published an atlas with your fake city or mountain range, they sucked and obviously everyone should be buying your maps instead.
Not sure if that rings true 🤔 why would a professional map maker with a reputation risk tarnishing it with work that would make them look bad at their job just preemptive strike on possible copy cats?
@@gregmasseyify because it was common trade practice - they would put it in places that they thought were irrelevant to the interests of their patrons so as long as everything else was reasonably accurate it was considered fine
If there actually were a Tartaria, the 'modern empires' wouldn't be hiding it, they would be fighting over who would actually be the proper heir to that Empire. See: the various iterations of the Holy Roman Empire.
Is it just me, or is this a redux of Atlantis/antediluvian age mythology? Because it feels like a lot of the tropes from that in regards to hidden histories/ancient advanced races (human or otherwise) that you see in those conspiracies seems to be repeated here.
the way those people talk about the "disappearance of Tartaria" being the "fault" of "them"/"parasites" along with how they go on about how "advanced and free it was" gives me very heavy Andrew Ryan and Rapture vibes, and Comstock and Columbia vibes (especially adding in the all the racism and "white giant ancestors" stuff), from all three current Bioshock games.
Tartaria is a new one to me but I did stumble across Lemuria TikTok a year or two ago and that community threw me for a loop. Like I dig the aesthetics of crystals and such but the further down the rabbit hole I went the more it was just, like... Scientology with New Age aesthetics.
Exonyms are not much a symptom of "European laziness" but of "human laziness" (though I do understand you probably meant that the name "Tartaria" was tied to European laziness, and on that specific case you'd be correct). Humans in general tend to simply so that they have an easier time understanding complicated situations. This tendency to give everyone the same name despite their different origins, languages and cultures and all the nuances of the case is something all human groups tend to do. Just like people call "Europeans" all white people or "Africans" all black people, and so on, as if we were all a single, homogenous monolith. Look at the Muslim Empire (made of multiple different people) whose people called all the people coming from Europe as "Franks", no matter where they actually came from. There are countless examples of this. Exonyms are extremely common. For example, the name "Comanche" is an exonym of the Ute tribe that used that word to point out enemies/strangers. The actual Comanche autonym is "nʉmʉnʉʉ". There are so many other cases in the Native American world, and of course it's not an isolated phenomenon to them.
I cant believe in 37:30 Mia uses the word "dike" and leak together and she did not even consider to make any lesbiana joke. It feels like such a missed opportunity 😢😢. On the whole great video as always 😊
just a little note from a local: seattle’s underground was undergrounded not because of flooding, but because the whole city caught on fire in the 1880s. and then like within a year or two we rebuilt on top. so, yeah, not flooding, mud or otherwise
At the pics near 36:00~38:00 it would also have been great if you showed pictures of ancient ruins inside modern cities. In my city of Thessaloniki, Greece, we have ancient Roman ruins that are in the middle of a city. The palace of emperor Galerius, for instance, is in the middle of a very popular square here (Navarino Square). And also our metro has been delayed like 20 years because they keep finding ancient Macedonian artifacts, buildings, etc when they dig. They have "promised" that it will finally be delivered in the end of 2023, and you will be able to see all the ancient things in the metro, apparently. You might want to check that out next year!
It's really rather common for that to happen in Europe actually just because many of the cities have existed for so long that if you do literally any kind of digging you'll stumble into a ruin.
I love/hate conspiracy theories like this, because it's always about two minutes between "An alternate history, with free energy and giants? That sounds wonderfully creative!" And "It's just more racism, isn't it?" ...but damn, those two minutes are magical and full of promise.
Yeah, it's crazy.
"Hey there used to be this crazy advanced culture of giants. They had energy weapons and free energy and stuff.
Then they where wiped out and conquered. Also they are the progenitors of the 'white race' and 'The Jews' invented Christianity to enslave white people"
???
Wut!
You know what really bothers me? The fact that there *is* in fact a cabal of powerful people trying to misinfrom and control the world, they're called oligarchs and while many of them work together some are in competition with one another but most are powerful enough to just carve out their little spot without intruding on others and to keep stability don't bother eachother, but it's not the Jews or anything some may be Jewish (like dennis praguer for instance) they just take what they do (use money and media to control and instill fear in people) and just blame it on Jews and leftists
I enjoy stuff like this or ancient-aliens or flat-earth as fiction, it can be fun, but people tend to ruin things one way or another, especially the ones who _insist_ it's true. It's especially infuriating when they not only insist it's true, they ignore evidence and arguments to the contrary. (Though, it can be amusing, if painful, to try to think like them and see if you can come up with logical, reasonable, sane explanations to waive off evidence. 🤔)
...all when simple BUILDING CODES and a magnetron refute every bit of drivel from these mouth breathers. Conspiracy loons are tiresome and loathsome, including the videos sane people make about them.
I have seen the Tartaria theory described as "they've now applied the logic of Ancient Aliens to white people of 100-150 years ago," which is kind of amusing, but someone always has to go and blame the Jews or insist that the lost super-civilization is why white people are special or whatever.
I stg if I hear one more person say "They drove horses and buggies" I dare them go build a wagon and travel the oregon trail. Do it. You won't make it because it actually takes an insane amount of skill to upkeep moving wooden parts.
I wonder why they seem so attached to the phrase "horses and buggies." Copying each other?
@@fruitygarlic3601 It just sounds really funny and they actually encouraged me to use it.
My grandpa actually restores antique farming equipment as well as sleds and carriages, he lives in upstate New York around the amish communites. He's a skilled mechanic and carpenter and alot of the equipment he works with is 100+ years old and literally is still being used to bring in the hay today. its asinine that people believe that people are incapable of creating complex machines and buildings just cause they happened to live a couple centuries ago. I swear people have become so seperated from how things are made that Magic is an easier answer.
Yeah, people who ride in horses and buggies are still building things today. Where I live, many Amish work in the construction industry, and the buildings they build are at least as good as those built by other contractors.
When I was renting a late 19th century cemetery caretaker's house for a year, the Amish came to dismantle the similarly old house across the street (future home of a Dunkin Donuts).
They were like ants.
The first day they chalk marked the boards for reassembly purposes and stripped it down to the frame.
Day 2, they stripped the frame, uprooted all the basement wall bricks, and carted it back home.
On the third day other contractors showed up with an excavator and a dump truck, and they filled in the hole.
Then a road project to change the intersection... Eventually the Dunkin.
The Amish were the most efficient part of the whole process.
I'd have loved to have had a camcorder or today's modern cellphone back then (2006) to take a time lapse video of them picking the house clean.
"We can't build cathedrals anymore." Meanwhile in Barcelona....Sagrada Familia, they are literally still building it right now!
Yup.
We CAN build cathedrals. It's just that the ruling class has decided they don't want to spend their stolen money on beautiful buildings that are visible to the masses anymore.
@@johannageisel5390 not necessarily. Architectural and aesthetic preferences change over time.
As do things such as availability of materials and broad availability of housing.
Keep in mind, at the time when most cathedrals and such were built, 95% of the population lived in wooden and mud homes, sharing their living spaces with multiple generations of their family and their livestock.
And of the remaining 5% maybe 1% had access to anything resembling indoor heating and or plumbing.
The access to these sort of conveniences and the ability to put up a building in a year instead of 100 to 200 years is why the aesthetics have in a sense simplified.
The Sagrada Familia is a quite a unique project, it's been under construction for about 140 years now, and will take another 10 years to finish.
It is exceptional, but wildly inefficient.
@@MikeBenko The thing is: With today's technology we could easily build comfortable housing for the masses AND really nice public buildings.
But capitalism ruins everything.
Of course the problem of inequality predates capitalism. Only in ye olden times the ruling class still had other interests apart from amassing ever more money - for example appeasing some invisible sky daddy or leaving a legacy. That's why they put a part of their stolen money into representative public buildings.
Today they have stopped doing even that.
I went there a year ago and trying to look at the half finished spire hurt my neck lol
Gaudi was a madman, that‘s an outlier
I have always felt like we should value beautiful sturdy architecture not because of some moral reason, but simply because having great architecture around puts you in such a great mood and also when things are built to be functional and last it saves everyone money in the long run. You don't have to worry as much about shelling out thousands of dollars on random repairs every year.
What I find interesting is the left embraces such ugly arts in music and fine arts.
Society is totally dumb down
This is very interesting to me because, as a Russian without a particular interest in conspiracy theories, I always thought of "Great Tartaria" as a particularly fringe version of the "primordial Russian global empire" theory and had no idea it got so much traction outside Russia.
Just a slight quibble around 43:24 : this isn't really the same generic sense of the term "Ta(r)taria" as used by the old Western European cartographers. In Soviet usage "Tataria" very specifically referred to the administrative entity whose full name was the Tatar Autonomous Soviet Socialist Republic, which corresponds to the modern Republic of Tatarstan. Some Russian speakers still use "Tataria" as the short form place name, but this usage is generally frowned upon in the region itself with most Tatar people using "Tatarstan" in all languages. Since calling Tatar people "Tartars" in English only really started getting pushback in recent decades, it's not surprising that a CIA document from 1957 would have used the spelling "Tartaria" for what was "Tataria" in the original.
But yeah, this is very obviously referring to attempts by the Soviet Union at the time to whitewash the history of relations between the Russian state and the Turkic-speaking Muslim Tatars in order to strengthen "inter-ethnic cohesion" and minimize the threat of the Tatars' opposition to the USSR as the continuation of the Russian state. Since the original Soviet document is supposed to be from 1944, this threat would have been seen as more than just hypothetical at the time, as Nazi Germany was exploiting the nationalist feelings of Tatars and other ethnic groups of the larger Volga area to recruit fighters for its Idel-Ural Legion.
You are correct. as I understand it. But I do think the story goes much deeper. some of the architecture in Saint Petersburg has images of astrology. Clearly not built by communist, but they have claimed it in 1944 as communist design. No chance 😂
There is one reason for buried buildings that you forgot to mention: The ground is growing in many places.
Erosion by wind and water will slowly transport material from higher regions into lower regions where it gets deposited.
I saw that in the German city of Trier, which was founded around the year 0 by the Romans. Our tour guide told us that the ground in that region grows by roughly 10cm per century. 2000 years, aka 20 centuries, will then result in 2m of rise.
And what do you know - the entrance level of the Roman buildings was about 2m under today's ground, while the medieval entrance level was about 1m under today's ground level. (There is a watch tower in a park where they have dug away the dirt around the original entrance so that you can see the difference.)
And all without a mudflood!
Ah, her geology was, er, pretty F'n bad.
That "growth" happen usually by flooding events.
@@danciagar What about wind? What about rain washing dust out of the atmosphere?
@@johannageisel5390 In places like Trier, with a river notorious by flooding events, their impact would be minimal compared with flooding events.
Something unsettling about the phrase "The ground is growing"
Mia: ‘Welcome, 100,000 people, to me talking about concrete economics’
100,000 people: ‘FINALLY’
See also Well There's Your Problem, the leftist podcast about engineering disasters (which is, in itself, a disaster)
If I had a nickle for every creator who delved into concrete economics, I would have 2 nickles, which isn't a lot, but it is weird it happened twice.
With the things with cities built upwards it's just reminding me of discworld.
"Most of Ankh Morpork was, in fact, built on Ankh Morpork"
talking of mud floods…
Necromunda as well!
Every time you play that clip of someone saying they used horse and buggies just makes me think of a video I watched of like 50 something Amish dudes straight up lifting a barn or something - I get that it’s not the same as a cathedral but like, people make due ya know
It was often said that Anch-Morpork was built on loam. What Anch-Morpork was really built on, was Anch-Morpork.
I love how people forget that these ornate buildings often took multiple generations of people to make, some who saw the beginning of the project, but not the end, and vice versa.
Some of the cathedrals took literally CENTURIES to complete.
I also love how these advanced civilisations used... stone. They've mastered free energy, but clearly couldn't afford the energy to industrially smelt steel and surpass the glaring limitations imposed by the square-cube law when it comes to building with stone. Just compare the pyramids to one of those super-slim towers next to Central Park.
"Wow, this cathedral must have taken, like, months to build."
"135 years, actually."
And you have proof of this or just taking the word of people who told you who also had no proof and just took the word of people who told them and so on? Yeah, didn't think so.
@@McCucumber Look, if you want you can go to Europe and look up the financial records of a cathedral's construction yourself.
As a British person watching your videos for the first time, I got to 8:58 and spat out my tea, my monocle fell out and I almost dropped my crumpet. Top show old bean, subscribed.
Cheerio
@@MiaMulder chip chip.. or uhhh pip pip? chip chop? what do the brits say
Mia is a bit of an Anglophobe. I remember when she tweeted complaints about British "people". I was in her chat and saw quite a lot of her British fans being really saddened. Someone even asked how her British fans who were trans would feel. She deleted the tweet but yeah, I wasn't sure what we did but she threw us under the bus. One last trans role model to look up to. It seems she thinks post imperialist Britons are still imperialist. Maybe she thinks all Germans are still Nazis. You'd have thought a historian would know better. To be fair, her Anglophobia proper broke my heart 😢
@@StephMcAlea please tell me thats like a copypasta im not aware of
@@gunsugoncu how do you mean?
You see, there once a species of humans that had blood infused with Tartar sauce, the natural food of the gods, allowing them to reach heights unattainable by ketchup infused humans (which is what blood actually is).
Today I learned Ambrosia was just ancient Tartar sauce. Time to stockpile some of that divine sauce in hopes of purifying my ketchup infused body.
Lies, the the natural food of the gods is dijon mustard
@@merrittanimation7721Mustard powder is the debased form of ambrosia
As a person who lost his (2nd story, already raised) home in February to flooding in the worst climate event our region has ever seen, I can absolutely confirm that water-go-up events exist and are undesirable.
And nobody's digging out the basement to play with whatever's still in there.
This reminds me of a guy who wrote an essay about how the Theatro Amazonas had to be an ancient structure built by aliens, less than 10 years after its actual construction.
In response to the TikTok that went "you expect me to believe that they built this with a hammer and chisel? 🤨": The Inca would build a lot of their most important buildings without mortar. They would file the bricks down in ways that would allow them to slot almost perfectly together like legos and as a result they were virtually earthquake-proof. So uhhhhhh yeah if Machu Picchu can be built without mortar I'm pretty sure we probably could build something like that building with a hammer and chisel
I'm pretty sure they also must think Machu Picchu was built by aliens...
Blame the History channel, that ancient aliens show has really caused many people to think ancient humans were basically incompetent in every way. Ive had to explain that it’s classified as entertainment for a reason, many times with little to no result.
Small note - I'm pretty sure you're talking about Puma Punku at Tiwanaku, which was pre-Inca, not Machu Picchu. Machu Picchu was Inca, and yet Puma Punku used far more advanced techniques. There are a lot of conspiracy theories surrounding it because nobody's quite sure what kind of tools were being used to construct it - stone tools (in particular the hammerstones used to construct most Inca architecture) were incapable of the fine interior right angles that some of the stones displayed, so some people (notably, the History Channel) jumped from "wow, these people were more clever than we give them credit for" to "wow, there's no way these uneducated savages could have possibly done this on their own, obviously it was aliens," because some people are chronically incapable of seeing how interesting the real world is and have to make shit up to compensate
@@littlesnowflakepunk855 Oh, but of course aliens did it! You expect me to believe people that maybe didn't even rode around in horse and buggies made all those wonderful constructions?
@@minaverry Yes.
"are we expected to believe people did this with a hammer and a chistle?" What do you call this specific kind of disbelief in human ingenuity bred by modern technology? 🤔
An argument from incredulity
Orthogenesis, almost? Like, the idea that we are fundamentally better than our ancestors at *everything*, because that's Progress.
@@lyndonwesthaven6623 we are better off then our ancestors generally because we are building off our ancestors
@@jacobnoelle8428 the only reason people can talk shit about how dumb their ancestors are is because their ancestor were probably much smarter
I think you can just call it ignorance
"The boats ran on free energy"
yeah, it was called wind
Im not support of this
But in many parts of the world ,if aeroplane types of toys in mayans
Book in India can be found than this is also possible
you won the critics choice runner-up "best commentary " award..congrats!
Free energy exists no this dude is a paid propagandist you need to look past the algorithm even TIKTOK is good for truth stuff look at both sides than make a decision never listen to anything TH-cam suggests always hit uploaded recently
@@DAVEMCKEEGANSWORSTNIGHTMAREyes free energy exists(taken from skies ,just like a signal tower)
These people will never going to make us use that
They captured and destroyed knowledge of pyramids,paganic temples and temples to use them as a free energy source
@@DAVEMCKEEGANSWORSTNIGHTMARE I have a physics degree sweetheart
Like... They know that the time frame they're talking about for the fall of Tartaria is just barely outside living memory, right? Forget the history books, at the short end of that 100-300 year window you could just ask your grandparents if they remembered it or if *their* grandparents told them about it.
Like here in Chattanooga, our city is built on a river and one time it flooded, so they built the entire downtown up one level. My grandparents told me about it all the time. The library is full of old diaries you can just read for free.
People don't want to believe that people that lived so simple are smarter then they will ever be
It occurs to me, how much of this stuff is coming from America? As a Scottish person the idea that the apocalypse happened 300 years ago sounds absurdly recent. We still have some pretty serious social problems stemming from grudges that started 500 years ago. America however is such a new country that 300 years ago being pre history might make more sense.
As an American, I found it absurd for my own local reasons. Colonialism was dramatically shaping our modern population 300 years ago -- if some other empire was actually in charge at that time, then why are all these white people over here? Why do I speak English? Did colonialism happen?
I blame our education system's disinterest in exploring pre-Founding Father's mythos America. Very little other than the May Flower, Pilgrims, all that crap. No King Phillip's War. Very little 7 Years War.
Our public schools generally start the meat and potatos of our own history at the Revolution, teach world history as a more remote and separate animal, and leave science to pick up the slack with humanity's origins.
I’m in America and the European part of my family got here in 1620, I am not alone, I know the whys and how’s of peoples lives and deaths going back further the 300 years. Russia and China are flooding our minds with trash
@@fuzzydunlop7928 - as a refugee from the public schools of the 1970s to early 80s, I can confirm that. That's exactly what I remember.
Americans tend to think that 100 years ago was an ancient time, and therefore MUST have been radically different from today, and where much of the truth MUST have been lost over those vast ages. Especially young people who can't remember anything from even 20 years ago. I think a lot of "Tartarians" forget that there are still people alive today who remember the 1920s, 30s, 40s, and whose parents remembered the 19th century well. As for why this seems to be a more American phenomenon, I agree with the other commenters that it may have something to do with the relative youth of our country, paired with the fact that we largely ignore indigenous history. It's almost like our concept of world history begins in 1492 or even 1776 rather than ~3000 BC.
The "horse and buggy" thing is funny. Like what, "these people didn't have internal combustion engines! how could they have built big cathedrals?"
That’s dumb
@@aeksinsang932
They built buildings, using horses. And trailers. They had flat bed trailers. For real. The horses pulled it.
@@aeksinsang932
Good job you tube.
😊
@@Designer_TopGI would love to see that being done. Let’s get down to it, because either this can be demonstrated or it is a lie.
@@michaelwills1926 You're on the internet right? Why do people ask others for 3vidence when you have a world of knowledge at your fingertips, go look it up or something
This whole "theory" boils down to "This doesn't LOOK like it would have been made by people I regard as stupid uncultured savages, so it MUST have been made by some anceint advanced civilization sometime in the past"
In other words, it is Atlantis, just bigger. Or how we created gods, just smaller.
and just as racist
@@MCArt25 I wrote for this theory extensively about a decade ago and one of the old pillars was that racism was created by the Europeans in their attempt to dominate the post mud flood world.
@@MCArt25 - Not quite as racist. With _this_ theory, they're underestimating the skills and ingenuity of Europeans, too. It's a little refreshing, actually.
Nice straw man. Meanwhile, no drawings, no plans, no records of all these construction projects. Explain how all this could be done with the technology as told by the history tellers and then we can get to the bottom of it. Oh but wait: they were destroyed in ~fires~
@@michaelwills1926 Sure! which building or city do you want me to explain?
MiniMinuteman has some good stuff on this, that most conspiracies like this basically consist of people going "Doesn't this thing look kinda like this other, completely unrelated thing? Really makes you think, huh" with basically no understanding of the actual process that creates either thing
Loved the section of your video dedicated to settlements needing to bury considerable sections of previous architectural solutions. As an archaeologist, i have to say that humans tend to do that a lot! In fact, my master's thesis took advantage of that to date a roman site.
Amazing vid, as usual!
This reminds me of the "Helen Keller was a fraud" BS. I'm a disabled, wheelchair-using disability advocate and educator...so I guess I would go there. But I think the similarities are still there.
It always comes down to, "I don't know much about this thing, and I generally have a low opinion of groups I'm not familiar with, so that translates to my being unable to imagine people I consider lesser doing something I also cannot imagine myself doing." I.e. "I couldn't make a bulding like that, no WAY people did 200yrs ago," (even though humans 10,000yrs ago had the same brains that we now do trigonometry and particle physics and paint photorealism with).
Or with Helen Keller, "I know very little about the disability community and since it doesn't benefit me directly I have no desire to learn, so I am going to assume HK was the only deafblind person who ever learned to speak and write even though there are deadass *deafblind TikTokkers.*"
Hubris is a cruel mistress, my dude. Have a little real curiosity about your fellow humans and don't approach everything with an air of superiority just because you're afraid to do the work to be genuinely informed. At the very least, stop and consider: if it was found out for absolute certain, undeniable proof, it is 100% that the narrative you are about to post turns out to be completely wrong, are you going to look like a ghoul? Embarrassingly gullible?
Fabulous take, per usual, Mia.
Soup Emporium made a fascinating video on the subject that also explores HK's leftist activism and how her political beliefs were revised out of her legacy. A lot of what he goes into might be old news for you but his channel in general is worth a visit :)
@@therealjuliuscaesar6584 I watched that! I was very surprised and I imagined just how frustrated and exasperated she must have felt going through that again and again. She never got a break but she never caved to them and stood up for her values and ideals. I was impressed and now I have even more respect for her than I previously did.
Well to be fair, if I don't know about it, it must be some bullshit amiright???
Never heard that one. But OF COURSE there's people that believe that. Sigh ....
HK is just another religion. Why don't you take a walk, get some fresh air and grow up. PHF
engagement engagement engagement i'm getting married to the algorithm
Feed the eldrich Algorithm god
The algorithm will probably eventually read comments like this as being irrelevant and might stop counting them towards engagement.
Oh man, anyone know where I can put all this extra engagement?
As am I
Congratulations!
I'm an urban planner and I have a gf who loves old architecture despite not being in that field at all, and it's always kinda hard to explain her that we don't build XIXth century Wilhelmian Era style buildings because of economics, of improved pay for construction workers, of resource shortages and of shifts in societal makeups. It's pretty easy to build yourself a hostel in Paris France when you know you can pour a lot of budget in it since it'll be inhabited by three generations and two branches of the family, when the sculptor has a ton of barely paid apprentices, when we've barely scrapped the surface of quarries because most houses are (well) made of mud, wood, clay bricks and hay
There's also practical limitations, the reason why skyscrapers are rarely very ornate is because they're so high that the wind could be strong enough to rip a lot of ornamentation off, which would present a danger to everyone below. That was actually a problem in New York and led to legislation against it. At the same time there's also just the desire to make the interior as comfortable as possible by letting in as much light as possible, which leads to us making large glass facades. Older buildings might look nice on the outside but they're rarely actually very comfortable to work or live in because of things like this. These days we tend to generally focus more on making a building comfortable for the people actually using them rather than making them into grand propagandistic monuments to our personal glory.
After the 1934 earthquake in LA, they flat outlawed most applied ornament because it fell down.
@@hedgehog3180 Having seen some grand monuments to personal glory and excess of opulence, I'd say they moved the flash and glitter *inside* instead of external, and that turned out to be a lot more successful and comfortable (and above all, easier to _maintain_ comparatively- who'd want a beautifully ornate house that's hell to touch up and restore when the wear of time inevitably hits?)
This person hasn't gone deep enough. I'm pretty level-headed but when you go deep there are many glaring holes. This person uses conspiracy theory as an easy way to make people questioning the narrative look stupid. You should always question things and people have forgotten about that very important lesson. Start digging into old books and maps. That's where the good stuff is. It's starts to become apparent that something isn't right. It's just that these people that claim to know all of the answers make that act of digging for more look like dum-dums
There are 2 reasons why we don't build like that anymore:
1) There are not highly qualified workers, masonry is not a form of art anymore (Well kinda, there are still some highly qualified masons but not enough to satisfy a possible demand)
2) Buildings are made cheap (Because of the form over function line of thought in architecture) and they are planned to not be durable enough, they are made to be recyclable and destroyed.
The wage argument doesn't make sense when you take into account that people back then (Even till 1950) were paid with gold backed certificates and they were valued way more. Back then one man could sustain a family by his own (He even could buy a house without incurring on debt), and everything back then was more durable than nowadays.
I'm watching this immediately after rewatching the New Chronology video, so when you mentioned Anatoly Fomenko, I shouted "GODDAMMIT! YOU CAN'T ESCAPE THIS MATH NERD!"
Educational system failure. This is what happens when people stop reading books. What young people don’t realize is that there are usually hundreds of books written about any random Wikipedia page subject. There is vast information out there. Today people only read the “Cliffs Notes”
I’ve unironically just learned more about European history than I ever did in American high school. Thanks, Mia.
True though
To be fair, statistically it's unlikely you were interested in the subject and paying attention the whole time.
probably the same reason for this bullshit to surface there and not in europe.
Sounds about right.
I’m an apprentice high school social studies teacher😅 It’s just as frustrating for us teachers as it is for students. I’m in my student teaching rn and the catch up I have to play with my kids because of Covid is insane. I started a lesson on imperialism that included Guns, Germs and Steel but on the fly I had to change the lesson to giving them an overview of Mesopotamia and the Fertile Crescent.
Mia everytime you upload a new video it feels like the portics of heaven have openned up to the earth to greet us mortals with weirdass conspiracy theories and aesthetic lofi music
Hello! Would you like to watch a video where the prettiest girl you've ever seen thoughtfully deconstructs some wack conspiracy you'd never even heard of? Subscribe to Mia Mulder today!
And background plants.
Seriously? This person knows nothing about this subject. There are "real" sources on line.
@@gregpursley1 What are these “real” sources?
@@CChissel "real" would be those who actually provide evidence for theories and rational, logical arguments rather than straw man arguments. This is a good channel for those who just want confirmation bias and those who scoff at anything which goes against their mainstream bubbles. Just laugh at anything that doesn't comport to your programming and stay safe in the historical narrative provided for you thru a lifetime of programming. This channel serves to keep you in the "safe" box of accepted authoritarian views and allows you to feel superior to anyone who would challenge your precious beliefs.
You can easily find thousands of channels which serve to prop up the false paradigm and if you never question what you have been taught and don't ever think outside the box then these channels are perfect for you. If you actually see beyond your own bias and world view and are actually sincere in seeking truth then you will find many, many good sites which can help you.
If I have to point you to these sites then you have no ability to think for yourself and find your own answers. All you will find here is confirmation of what you already think.
@17:33 I love how the fact Tartary has a flag on this panel is used as evidence of its existence as a state or empire even though the same panel has a pirate flag on it. And not just anywhere, the 'Pirates' flag is just to the lower left. Also, that flag is literally the flag of Qazan, a Turkic city conquered by Russia and renamed Kazan because Russians don't do q.
i watch a lot of debunking videos about history conspiracies, and the flag is the only part of the tartaria theory that they never seem to address. it was mentioned in this video but not explained. and it is actually interesting because that image with the yellow flag and dragon is actually from before Kazan started having a coat of arms with a dragon. the yellow flag with a dragon was originally from a book by a Dutchman named Allard (published in 1694 apparently) along with a second flag that was yellow with an owl, and he said that these two flags were used by "Caesar of Tataria" one of them was supposedly the naval flag. it seems no one knows exactly where these flags were from but most likely they were either from the old Kazan Khanate or the Crimean Khanate (who actually had a navy). They were also shown on many other flag charts until the 19th century.
I find the "why are these photos so empty" people particularly infuriating because a lot of it is just how cameras worked at the time. Before we'd invented super light sensitive mediums to take pictures with, photos took AGES to expose, so you'd only be able to see stuff that had stayed still and everything else either wouldn't show up or would be a total blur and you get these beautiful, haunting photos of historical streets where you can just *barely* see the shadows of one or two people in a place that would've actually been full of life.
The first photo we actually have of a human being was when a guy pointed his camera out a window and someone on the street below just HAPPENED to be getting his shoes shined, and as a result was standing around for long enough that it showed up in the photo.
architect here,
along with mia's great explanation of the economic aspect i would also like to encourage people who are interested in architecture to understand the different types of stress (compression, tensile, shear, bending, etc.) present in structures and its relation to their form and materials, and how our understanding of those evolved over time.
i know it may sound boring but if you can understand that you would definitely not see modern concrete and steel buildings as lesser in complexity and technology compared to older ones, and you will get why certain structural typologies repeat across different cultures throughout history.
Basically, Tartar was a generic catch-all term to refer to a variety of places, peoples and powers
...and these people read it as if Tartar was instead a unified, national power
which makes otherwise harmless, menial assertions look like major untold events
search up “Cultural Development under Communism”. A REAL CIA APPROVED DOCUMENT where they say the Russians purposely FALSIFIED the history of the tartars and multiple other groups mainly Muslim groups in the region. Nothing is done for no reason.
I love your work! This is very interesting, although my soul leaves my body everytime I hear "We're expected to believe people build this with a hammer and chisel." Like yes, yes people did build that with a hammer and chisel
As someone once put it, 'everything is miraculous/inexplicable to one who is ignorant' - these people have never learned the basic whys and hows of the world, so anything beyond their immediate experience looks like a mystery. I consider it ultimately a failure of education, not because they don't know the exact facts but because they don't know how to interrogate the world they live in.
Humans: * perfecting masonry during the last 12,000 years *
Other humans: "Unbelievable!"
We'd have done better with a hammer and sickle, amiright?
my fav building to talk about is the florence cathedral which can be quite daunting to think it was actually built by humans with hammer and chisels. until you find out it took 140 years to complete it. 50 of those years construction slowed down due to first architect dying and a pandemic called the black death
@@joeyj6808 Well, there was such a thing like Socialist Classicism and it looked really nice.
And just look at the Moscov metro stations!
Stalin was an asshole, but during his time they really tried building "palaces for the people". Sadly, the costs were high and the SU couldn't keep that up. WWII and the cold war was a real burden.
But they showed that it is possible to build nice stuff for the masses. You have to have the political will to do so, though.
Always thoroughly enjoyed Mia's essays but lately I feel she's getting better and better in terms of pacing, editing, exposition... Keep up!
Wow, thank you!
*he
@@murrijuana2842 *she
@@murrijuana2842 ok thank you. I had to look at the comments to make sure. I can always tell because I stopped playing make-believe when I was a kid.
@@murrijuana2842 Actually *hon. See, learning contemporary languages is fun! Hej då!
There are actual historical pictures of the cologne cathedral being built with nails and hammers by ordinary humans. It's totally possible to build things like that, it just takes time.
Can't wait for people in 300 years talking about the empire state building and the Burj Kalifa like
"what? Are we expected to believe they built this when they didn't even have energy-tachyon power and matter reconstruction technology? Get real"
For thousands of years, all was well in the Tartarian Empire with their whimsical Beaux-Arts towers, wacky Neo-Gothic turretes and Art-Nouveau ornaments.
But then, the Le Corbusier nation attacked.
you won the critics choice "best commentary " award..congrats!
Underrated post
The old Le Corbusier nation and Frank-Lloyd-Wright Empire alliance.
What that motherfucker did to architecture can be considered a war crime. At least when the Nazis bombed cities they didn't ruin them like he did
❤
the preoccupation with world fairs is particularly mindboggling. every reference i can ever remember about them--as far back as memory allows, anyway--has almost always been immediately followed up with "but they were basically plaster and wire sculptures and most of them would have fallen over in a year. their fragility has always been a core component of their mythos. also those fairs weren't a egalitarian celebration of knowledge and ingenuity, it was industrial-age international propoganda. simple as.
I went to the World's Fair in New Orleans when I was a kid and about the only thing I remember was being so stoked about the gondolas (telecabins) and being disappointed that they were not built for permanency (my family went there every year on vacation so I thought it was something I'd get to do again and again). I'm not even sure they were they were working the weekend we went. I remember going on an on about wanting to ride one and when are we going to get to ride them, but I don't think we ever did. I don't remember any buildings being erected for it, like in a lot of cities in the old days, but as a jaded old person who's seen how things work, I just assume that most World Fair constructions would be a lot like Olympic Villages, expensive quick-builds that do not stand any test of time. I'm legit impressed that Chicago still has two standing.
As a Seattleite, I am very glad you brought up underground Seattle--it was definitely my first thought!
Also, as an archaeologist who specializes in the 19th century US, the tiktoks from this theory were physically painful for me to watch :') Loved your reading of the appeal of this theory to people, though. Aesthetic moralism is something I have definitely seen, but didn't have a word for, before
I'm the kid of an architect who specializes in stuff relating to old buildings, and even with the knowledge I got from being around his work, hearing him talk about it, and helping him out sometimes by for example checking his texts for typos those tiktoks are incredibly painful to watch, it would be funny if it wasn't this sad.
I took a tour of the underground and the company sold me a book called Sons of the Profits. Interesting stuff!
fellow seattleite here, have you done the tour yet?
My main takeaway from the underground tour was that Seattle was built on two things: poor planning and prostitution.
@@sirearlgrey2036 that's most cities though.
I don't really care what your videos are about I just find it really pleasent to listen to the sound of your voice.
Thanks for this excellent discussion on the Tartaria theories circulating online. The 'lost empire' seemed to be very strange to me from the outset, and your reasoned presentation, as a person with a solid background in history, offers the viewers a foundation of sorts - free of rabbit holes and quagmires.
Glad you enjoyed it!
@@MiaMuldertaking select sound bites, using them out of context, to create a selective argument proves nothing. Some logical fallacies used in your argument: strawman, false cause, begging the question, appeal to authority, composition/division, the fallacy fallacy, cherry picking. It just shows you don't understand how to research or even understand the actual theory, just small parts of it. Hope you find help for your body dysmorphia though.
@@kybalion848 you committed the grave logical fallacy of being reddit
We actually ARE still building elaborate structures of the kinds familiar to us from past ages. Barcelona's famous Sagrada Familia basilica is still unfinished- it's been under construction since 1882, with work scheduled to finish in 2026. Most ancient buildings need regular restoration to keep them in good shape, and many have been substantially restored following disasters- e.g. they're currently rebuilding the roof of Notre-Dame de Paris following the fire in 2019. In Berlin they recently completed a building called the Humboldt Forum, which is used to house a museum, but is a ground-up reconstruction of the 300-year-old Berlin Royal Palace, which was completely destroyed in WWII. Other than the stone being cleaner, it looks almost indistinguishable from the surrounding baroque buildings.
And there are still plenty of buildings being made which aren't solely functional, but the aesthetic of what is considered "fancy" has also changed. See things like the Sydney Opera House, or the Gherkin, or Frank Lloyd Wright's work for some more recent famous examples.
Heck, aesthetics also changed over the centuries in question, just someone without knowledge on the subject would group all of those aesthetics together as "old building styles" without really being able to tell them apart.
Girl that a lie it was already there
@@pablopope5145 Girl that a lie your mind been deleted and replaced with a faulty chatbot without knowledge of punctuation -'""',.;:?!
There's also plenty of lavish buildings with the old flourishes built recently, conspiratoids just don't know about them because they're dictators' palaces or mosques.
The whole Old Town of Warsaw was reconstructed based on XVIIc. oil paintings, old city planes and so on after Nazi burned the city to the ground. And it took less than 40 years at such a scale.
I'm glad you mentioned Seattle. Having grown up there, I'd been educated from an early age about the regrading that happened in the city's history. Anyone who walks in certain parts of downtown and sees the glass cubes embedded in the sidewalk will have questions about that which tour guides are happy to explain.
Incidentally, if you visit Seattle, there have a version of the Underground Tour after dark called the "Underworld Tour". It's the same as the normal tour, except it's 21+, they talk about the old Seattle vice industries, and it comes with an included cocktail at the end of the tour. I recommend it. It's one of the few "tourist traps" in town that I think of as worth the time and money to do.
I also grew up in Seattle and did the underground tour for my 11th birthday. I'll have to check out the adult version next time I'm back!
We are doomed as a species when relatively recent history like this is obscured and forgotten. Like there is one thing for the misunderstanding of how the pyramids are built, that happened a long time ago. but a lot of things and buildings here either have written modern English on why, how and for whom they where built, or photos.
lol you say we are doomed as a species because of the way a small group of people view the past without seeing the type of people being made today by left! Lmao how ironic and ignorant your statement really is. Say that to yourself one more time “Doomed as a species”
your uploads have so much effort they're all like an hour + long
amazing quality keep up the good work
You’re hilarious! You obviously had a great studying this. Thank you my dear!❤
.*a few centuries from now*
“Are we expected to believe that people who rode around in vehicles with primitive explosion engines that ran on dead dinosaur goo built these giant skyscrapers? Please.”
"I can't believe they thought electric cars were better. They still used fossil fuels to charge their cars. They just added a step. I can't believe they fell for that propaganda" loll
Just popping in to say that “Tartaria and the Mud Flood” sounds like the name of a one-hit-wonder band from the 80’s
*1970s.
Radio host: That was the latest song from Tartaria and the Mud Flood. From their debut album, Lost Empire.
Every time I watch a Mia Mulder video, I try desperately to find a Mulder and Scully joke, but I never find one.
I know there's one out there,
I want to believe
The thing that gets me about the people going on about how they "just had horses and buggies" is like, okay and....were they supposed to be magically using cars instead? There isn't much improvement to be made to a buggy, and you can't technologically upgrade a horse.
Horse breeder: challenge accepted
I see a lot of Tartarian "historians" but not many Tartarian scientists working on that etheral free energy technology. What a shame they are wasting their time on Tik Tok. Thanks for this economic analysis, tried it on european Tartarians but that does not seem to convince them (had to remind them of wars and financial crisis as well but... nope). Good point for them : lots of beautiful pictures out of the archives.
What I've learned from watching Miniminuteman videos is that tiktok conspiracy theorists absolutely LOVE to say "doesn't this LOOK like X?" and never even attempt to find any further evidence than that
Footprints!
Imagine meatriding Miniminuteman the incel femboy and gulping his spoorm and then taking it as the ultimate fact , and science worshippers think the ''conspiracists'' have no brain LMAO
@@khanusmagnus577 you ok there, buddy?
TikTok is never a credible source of anything, that being said there are some TH-cam videos that show a lot more evidence
I like the idea of alternate history and entertain it lightly now and again as a mental plaything, but WOW OOOF ouch it's rough to hear people say things like: "I acknowledge this old building is cool, but I don't think THESE people made it, yannow? They clearly needed help to do it."
It has the same exact energy as Chariots of the Gods/Ancient Aliens, where I'm kinda vibing to the rap about Mayans in space capsules, but I lose the thread when they claim: "well, obviously THEY couldn't manage, that, because, yannow (racism)? So did it for reasons."
Like nah, you turned some cool mental image I had going of sleek sci-fi space ports in jungles and made it into some boring rag about invading aliens helping "those" humans as if they wouldn't have known rocks from kernels of corn without intervention. Like, scientology did it, it's corporate-tier boring to say aliens did it, and that deus ex-machina only exists because this kind of conspiracy theorist is too racist or otherwise too stuck in some other bias to have a full range of imagination that maybe people did do more on their own without .
The way it dismisses the actual effort and intelligence of the actual historical people at the time is as chilling as their imagination is lacking. It's bad alt history fanfic, too, so it's especially a deep letdown when this half-baked tripe is taken as fact.
I never got the racism angle. I just don’t see that being the case. They say that ancient megalithic structures couldn’t have been built by ancient people, on their own, because of their more primitive technology. It just happens that all these megalithic structures only exist where POC live. The only real exception being Stonehenge, which these folks also attribute to aliens and shit.
@@PatheticApathetic It originates from racist thought. Most of those theories came about in the early 20th century due to racism, if you read some of the earliest mentions of these structures you’ll see that they usually do not entertain that the ancestors of the local population could have built such things because of their prejudice.
@@PatheticApathetic I just wish for variation. Aliens helping for reasons is just not a very interesting story now that it's been told nearly every other time aliens are part of the story. It's the sci-fi equivalent of caulking at this point, when there isn't a better explanation.
Anyway, if they're so primitive how come various ancient stone works astonish us to this day? You must give the brilliant ancients credit for managing this, even if we don't get how they did it.
The "oh someone came and helped them" fanfics just sorta sucks the air out of any premise of maybe having the people do anything at all, which will always be a worse story than maybe like, considering the primacy of a culture reaching new heights, and exploring a limitless ceiling for their influence. It kicks the explanatory can down the road and also puts the credit in the hands of Xanadu or whomever and it's just so much less fun and also I know that these works stand because of the effort of the actual people, so it's like, bad and uninspiring to the extent that over time I can't help but see the intellectual, cultural, and creative poverty of this "sci-fi" pattern of worldbuilding.
@@PatheticApathetic In this example I think _eurocentrism_ is probably the more fitting term to use for the underlying bias feeding the delusion.
@@siukong Though eurocentrism is itself also an aspect of racism.
Mia: let's talk about European cartography
Me: *buckles up*
I'm more interested in the concrete economics.
@@vigilantcosmicpenguin8721 European Cartography and Concrete Economics sounds like the name of a Community episode.
*Aggressively shakes a container of Rolled map*
MAPS!!
I just ran across one of these people, and you guessed it, they aren't allowed at their family Thanksgiving.
I feel like almost every “popular” conspiracy theory is antisemitic to a degree 😅 Loved the video 🤘🏻
Yeah, I wonder what the takeaway there is.
Oh dear, really? Do you even know what antisemitic means?
@@drubber007 🤡
Mia on 21.06: "And today Tartaria believers are basically not at all aligned with Russia or Russian interests or believing that Russia is supposedly this ancient empire."
Me: "Bet they've kept the 'blaming the Jews' part though!"
Fascinating video as always! Thank you!
P.S. "svarogiches" on 18.55 should be spelled Svarozhitses or Svarozhiches, I believe. As in sons of Svarog - or maybe Levashov meant the Svarozhich symbols - hard to know without digging deeper into his nonsense.
Mia Mulder out here being the dope sequel to Fox Mulder. Covering conspiracies and opening minds
Maybe she's his secret daughter with Scully?
@@johannageisel5390 mias channel dares to ask the question "what if fox mulder was a trans woman"
@@ajpoopfucker He would be Denise Bryson from Twin Peaks.
"You have no idea how out there the truth is."
But doing literally the opposite lol, he believed all and every crackpot theory there was.
Having read too much late 19th and early 20th century speculations about Atlantis, there's just way too many similarities (especially the pyramid building white giants). I'm sure it's a result of direct influence but it'd also be interesting to see a comparison of conditions surrounding advocates of both ideas.
Also, can't wait for a fantasy author to deconstruct this mythos the way Robert E Howard tore down Atlantis.
> Having read too much late 19th and early 20th century speculations about Atlantis
Oh, so you’ve pretty much read all of it, then? Seeing as the Atlantis Myth was invented by a Civil War-Era Politician from a metaphor told by Plato.
@@MrMessiah2013 You're forgetting Theosophical authors making up way more than Ignatius Donnelly came up with, biologists making up the continent of Lemuria because nobody had figured out plate techtonics yet, James Churchward making up Mu (which Theosophists could never decide was also Lemuria or not), and white supremacists trying to throw Hyperborea into the mix.
@@MrMessiah2013 what politician?
@@MrMessiah2013 Then it seems like there could be two myths of Atlantis, one made in Europe and one in the USA (I have heard about that one in the past, but I do not recall those details). I little bit doubt that US myth would make it to sort of Germany encyclopedia from late 19th century. And there is some reprint of map that seems like from late 18th century or early 19th century, in style it is very different from other maps made in late 19th century.
@@MrMessiah2013 Plato talks about Atlantis...
I find the idea that building scyscrapers out of little but glass, steel, and concrete is somehow not insanely impressive, kinda fascinating. Brain dead, but fascinating
For as far as i know, "tartarus" was also used to refer to someone who came from the worlds edges in anchient rome and greece, cause tartarus is placed there in greek mitology. As well as "barbarus" was used to refer to someone who speaks an unknown language, so they sound like "bar bar" when they talk
I know there’s plenty of people who are actually very cautious about critical thinking and healthy skepticism and genuine research love themselves some conspiracy theories. I used to as well when I was younger, but seeing where this conspiracy stuff leads people who don’t know how to do real research or fact check for the past 6 years has sucked all the fun out of all such content for me that isn’t dedicated to debunking it. The way narratives and lore are fed to people under the guise of “history” is so stressful.
wait Fomenko started all this stuff? That's so crazy. I knew of him because he wrote a well loved math textbook. It's always weird when faces come back for vastly different reasons
There's academic math papers that cite the Unabomber by actual name, because intense specialisation is a thing done by many people who have a predisposition to going squirrelly.
@@sakurakiyori i clicked on the comment to mention ted kaczynski too lmao. if i had a nickel for every time a notable mathematician came up with a WILD theory/ideology, i'd have 2 nickels etc
@@gunsugoncu You'd have a lot more than that, too. Any name you remember from high school maths, look them up to find some wild shit. Newton's rainbow music, Pythagoras and beans, anything related to Descartes, and I'm sure there's more.
@@fruitygarlic3601 oh yeah lmaoo i sometimes forget about pythagoras's math cult 👁️👁️ and then I Remember
@@sakurakiyori I mean in general scientists often end up saying really stupid shit whenever they go outside of their field, but mathematicians seem especially predispositioned to doing this. I guess it might be because math doesn't involve the same kind of background knowledge that you need to build up in science so mathematicians are less likely to realize that they might have a knowledge blind spot that'll lead to them misunderstanding things. Historians and Archeologists are the opposite since those are fields were you need an absolute ton of knowledge to even make basic assertions about a specific things so they know that even within their own field they're probably not qualified to say much about something they themselves don't study.
I used to follow conspiracies a lot when an ex-friend fell deep into them. But this is one I had never heard of so thanks for the deep dive into it! Awesome video as always.
I’m less than five minutes in and am FLABBERGASTED by what I’m hearing! I’m literally doing homework for my ancient history class and if this civilization existed, we would see it LONG, LONG BEFORE it was supposed to have fallen. Plus, a large amount of the ~pretty architecture~ and ~ruins under cities~ from “200” years ago is MUCH. MUCH MUCH MUCH OLDER.
How would a mud flood even work. Where did this society originate. How did they not have squabbles with the other ancient powerhouses of their time. How didn’t other cultures make notes of them. How come we have ancient ruins from Greece and Rome and Sumer and Babylon- even cities that were BURNED TO THE GROUND, but this MYSTERY EMPIRE is either STILL STANDING IN MAJOR CITIES, or is completely SWALLOWED BY DIRT THAT APPARENTLY FLOODED THE WORLD CENTURIES AFTER ROME FELL.
Edit: I’m a bit farther in and a few of my questions have been answered so I’m glad that these conspiracy theorists actually looked for answers to these questions… even if they’re wrong- but it turns out my history class is actually literally learning about the Mongols right this minute and I just started a video and it calls them Tartars for the first time this unit. I wish I started it when I started this video I would’ve lost my mind.
I love that you put a picture of Lewis Hamilton there. As a lifelong F1 fan in the United States who feels like nobody here watches this sport, I felt very seen.
Read the title as "Terraria" gamer brain Rot reaching critical mass
same
Well, Mia refers 3D Terraria in the video, so you weren't that far.
Literally me
Conspiracy theories that boil down to "I am too stupid to do that, so all those I see as more primitive than myself could not do that either" are always... Fun.
"I spent three hours watching videos on TikTok, and now I know more about history than all archeologists and historians."
Jon Levi and others have so much evidence at this point there is really no debate. But just like the coof psyop some people will attach to the mainstream lies no matter how much cognitive dissonance mental gymnastics it takes. Go learn the basics of just setting foundations for construction and if you have an IQ over 80 you will realize there is no way people could build these, let alone even set a foundation, with no electricity.
They say we build on old structures, now... what about all the fires? Every major city had a major fire. The buildings always say FOUNDED. ..checkout Mind Unveiled or My Lunch Break
Wow I wasn't expecting Mia Mulder to start making One Piece lore videos
Cavity magnetrons don't generate power, the turn power you must provide into microwaves. And they're made of metal not stone, stone cavity magnetrons wouldn't work, and the circle patterns are just an idealised crossection, real magnetrons have stuff both sides of the circles to work, so those stone windows wouldn't remotely work as a magnetron. Some very bizarre theories out there.
Anyway, thank you for the good video, I enjoyed it a lot. Always happy to see you post!
Can we take a moment to appreciate how many more plants your videos have these days? I remember when it was but the one little visitor.
I just heard instead of "Tartarian Empire", "Targaryan Empire" and it all makes sense now
Tardigrade empire
@@pixie-fae pitch that to the people making the Quantum Realm in the MCU
@@ninreck5121 upcoming ant man movie has that
@@pixie-fae Terabithian Empire
Forgot that you were a fellow Swede for a while until 36:38 and your subtle passive aggressive tone basically gave me whiplash, and I promptly remembered.
I believe the "Tartars" referenced in that CIA document actually refer specifically to the modern Tatar ethnic minority in Russia. That's why Muslim religious identity is also mentioned. They're Muslims, and the Soviet Union was pretty darn anti-islam. It wasn't merely a general term but used in reference to a specific ethnic minority.
Incidentally the Tartaria conspiracy theorists are through their sheer ignorance completely erasing the actual histories of various Asian ethnic groups.
Not really. I've been in the comments section of yt uploads made by and about modern Tatars, showcasing their culture. There are a few ''Great Tartaria'' nutcases in the comment sections but they circle jerk and don't dare ask anything from the real Tatars posting. I asked a couple of Tatars if they'd heard of this theory, they were bemused and just said ''stupid Americans''. Their culture is going strong, just because a few stupid Westerners who think TikTok is a source of knowledge are ignorant of it is immaterial.
soviet union was pretty darn anti religion FIFY
I absolutely love your debunkings of these weird conspiracy theories, Mia! This one in particular actually sounds like a great premise for a novel or something. almost feels like Attack on Titan? but maybe it's just the giants leading me to make that conclusion. it's honestly kind of sad to hear people believing that humans aren't capable of creating beautiful things with basic tools like chisels and hammers, though. humans are a lot more capable on our own than we give ourselves credit for.
The "What's the deal with the Mongolian Empire" joke made me laugh so loud I woke up my roomate xD
The one little thing missing in this video would be a short tangent about the modern, real, ethnic group called Tatars. Not because they are relevant to this conspiracy theory but just because whoever starts googling to know more about Tartaria will end up finding info about Tatarstan, Tatars of Criema.. and get confused. And more confusion is bad !
A note about the 60s and 70s. Post World Wars, art and thought was extremely anti-tradition. My ex's mom went to art school and was often chastized for drawing and liking realistic paintings. She purposefully protested in some classes and dropped out of others when the teacher got snobby about "REAL art". I like a lot of modern art, but I can see why there was a huge anti-modern backlash because of how nasty modern art crtics were about older art!
Maintainable decor is prohibitively expensive! I live in places with TONS of gorgeous Victorian (and older) homes.
In the mid century, a LOT of people stripped the gingerbread and flourishes off their house because the labor to repair, paint and maintain them is SO costly.
My house is one of these, possibly older than 1900, but very little decor left. Someone remodeled and decided to remove all the fancy stuff because it was too much of a pain to maintain.
Thousands of tunnels all across the world that go on for miles.
Always enjoy Mia's timely interventions. When I first came across this 'theory' I found something rather charming about it, these tiktokers giddily asserting all sorts of wondrous things. There's something about lost subterranean worlds particularly that brings out the inner child. Some of us who end up becoming archaeologists can trace our interest back to those long summer days mucking about in sandpits, doing grand excavations, building castle turrets, digging traps under drawbridges made of lolly sticks. Sadly, like many conspiracy theories, this one is tainted by darker origins. Great work as always Mia.
If you want an actual underground marvel (if you haven't heard of it by now): the underground city of Derrinkuyu, Turkiye. Shit's _amazing_ these doods saw easy to carve rock and they made like.... a whole Fallout Vault-level city. It's amazing and it was in use still very recently!
Derinkuyu is now basically my model for when I've gotta design underground cities in my fics and stories.
Another fun thing about cartography- They lied. On purpose, and a lot. Before any sort of real IP laws, it became a really efficient way to prove someone was cheating and copying your maps. If they published an atlas with your fake city or mountain range, they sucked and obviously everyone should be buying your maps instead.
Not sure if that rings true 🤔 why would a professional map maker with a reputation risk tarnishing it with work that would make them look bad at their job just preemptive strike on possible copy cats?
@@gregmasseyify because it was common trade practice - they would put it in places that they thought were irrelevant to the interests of their patrons so as long as everything else was reasonably accurate it was considered fine
@@patriciapandacoon7162 thanks, that makes sense
You’re telling me that people who invented cellphones rode around in combustion based cars? Unlikely.
If there actually were a Tartaria, the 'modern empires' wouldn't be hiding it, they would be fighting over who would actually be the proper heir to that Empire.
See: the various iterations of the Holy Roman Empire.
They aren’t. Putin made the old world maps Tartaria public CIA declassified documents on it. This video is damage control propaganda
Is it just me, or is this a redux of Atlantis/antediluvian age mythology? Because it feels like a lot of the tropes from that in regards to hidden histories/ancient advanced races (human or otherwise) that you see in those conspiracies seems to be repeated here.
They share a lot of roots for sure.
Pretty much.
Mudflooders confuse me so much, like how do you seemingly have a curiosity and a passion for the past while doing literally zero research on history?
They do research...on TikTok. I am pretty sure most have never read a book.
the way those people talk about the "disappearance of Tartaria" being the "fault" of "them"/"parasites" along with how they go on about how "advanced and free it was" gives me very heavy Andrew Ryan and Rapture vibes, and Comstock and Columbia vibes (especially adding in the all the racism and "white giant ancestors" stuff), from all three current Bioshock games.
A number were black
Tartaria is a new one to me but I did stumble across Lemuria TikTok a year or two ago and that community threw me for a loop. Like I dig the aesthetics of crystals and such but the further down the rabbit hole I went the more it was just, like... Scientology with New Age aesthetics.
It's funny to me how Lemuria went from "Hey how did lemurs get all around the Indian Ocean" to "Magic ancient people"
Oh, so this is why the old farmhouse my family lives in has a weird hill covering the basement windows.
Exonyms are not much a symptom of "European laziness" but of "human laziness" (though I do understand you probably meant that the name "Tartaria" was tied to European laziness, and on that specific case you'd be correct). Humans in general tend to simply so that they have an easier time understanding complicated situations. This tendency to give everyone the same name despite their different origins, languages and cultures and all the nuances of the case is something all human groups tend to do. Just like people call "Europeans" all white people or "Africans" all black people, and so on, as if we were all a single, homogenous monolith. Look at the Muslim Empire (made of multiple different people) whose people called all the people coming from Europe as "Franks", no matter where they actually came from. There are countless examples of this. Exonyms are extremely common. For example, the name "Comanche" is an exonym of the Ute tribe that used that word to point out enemies/strangers. The actual Comanche autonym is "nʉmʉnʉʉ". There are so many other cases in the Native American world, and of course it's not an isolated phenomenon to them.
I cant believe in 37:30 Mia uses the word "dike" and leak together and she did not even consider to make any lesbiana joke. It feels like such a missed opportunity 😢😢.
On the whole great video as always 😊
just a little note from a local: seattle’s underground was undergrounded not because of flooding, but because the whole city caught on fire in the 1880s. and then like within a year or two we rebuilt on top. so, yeah, not flooding, mud or otherwise
@@jellyfishi_ There is always a fire.
Like all of the world's fair buildings too? 😅
Found the agent
At the pics near 36:00~38:00 it would also have been great if you showed pictures of ancient ruins inside modern cities. In my city of Thessaloniki, Greece, we have ancient Roman ruins that are in the middle of a city. The palace of emperor Galerius, for instance, is in the middle of a very popular square here (Navarino Square).
And also our metro has been delayed like 20 years because they keep finding ancient Macedonian artifacts, buildings, etc when they dig. They have "promised" that it will finally be delivered in the end of 2023, and you will be able to see all the ancient things in the metro, apparently. You might want to check that out next year!
It's really rather common for that to happen in Europe actually just because many of the cities have existed for so long that if you do literally any kind of digging you'll stumble into a ruin.
This is the first time the algorithm has popped you into my feed, really intereting video, gonna go check out some more, thanks!
Welcome aboard!
Absolutely fantastic 👏 thank you ! You ve taught me so much in such a fabulous way !!! Thanks again Mia !!
This is my favorite conspiracy theory next to Mountains are Giant Trees. There is actually a point where these two meet.