Be careful , when you talk about "service mode" . You are very correct in saying you will not have piston to valve contact. BUT you can absolutely have intake and exhaust valve contact. Set your exhaust cam first, then the intake cam. IAG heat a great tech tip on this. Thanks for the video!
Hello, I am from Chile and I have removed the belt about 5 times thinking that the point is wrong, today I left it as you have it and I will start it without gasoline to see what happens, I broke my head thinking that it is wrong but then After watching some videos and yours I convinced myself that it is fine. Thank you very much!!!
Thank you for the video. As a fellow perfectionist and mechanic, I really couldn't get my head around how I was always missing. I must have taken the belt off and on three or four times before I saw your video, confirming what I suspected was going on. Coming from working on Volvo and VAG, the timing marks always line up perfect, so this was new to me. But the engine started and ran just fine. Thank you.
Thanks for the video. I encountered the same situation with a new timing belt (2009 Forester XT Limited). The original belt and marks were also slightly off. I assumed at first the original belt had stretched but the new belt was no different. Up to this point, I had only seen videos of perfectly lined up marks which stressed that importance so I assumed something must be off. However, the teeth count between all the gears was correct and it was clear that if anything was moved even one tooth, it would be worse. After checking and rechecking repeated, I decide it had to be right and applied your “Don't worry, be happy” attitude. Sure enough the car started right up and runs great. When I was a young man working on cars, everything that was “Made in Japan" was considered junk and to be avoided. I had thought this had changed but after dealing with this timing belt and changing the spark plugs, the old memories are coming back.
Worked at a dealer for 7 years and went to do a DOHC today to help my boss. We had all the marks physically lined up and when we went to turn the crank had piston to valve. Set it off a tooth crank side and it wouldn't run. I wasn't there for take off. So either a valve got hit or I'll try this tomorrow. Great video.
Back again.. Any updates? I've bent a valve since my last comment because I rotated the cams he says you can rotate in safe mode lol. Use a cam lock tool!
I'm over here doing this job 4 times In a row because they won't line up on a fresh rebuilt EJ255 beating my head against the wall not able to figure this out. Thought it had to be perfect and I got OCD, this video helped a ton!
I literally did mine 4 times. I am a mechanic and I haven’t done one since 2015 when I was an apprentice. I tried my best to get it perfect but same issue as here. I did a sohc one literally a week before doing a dohc. I honestly thought i was doing it wrong but I realised it can’t be. Those lines on the belt really help. Great to know I’m not the only one who thought this!
thanks for sharing! The SOHC doesn't have this issue. but the DOHC I've run into this countless times. So decided to share. I hope this helps others not waste time too!
The definitive way to check is there should be 28 teeth between each of marks on the cams. 54.5 teeth between the crank and passenger side intake cam, 51 teeth between the crank and the drivers side intake cam mark.
If you line up the driver side cams pointing at each other. And point the passenger side lower cam straight up, the top cam should almost be pointing straight down but to the right a little. What happens when the engine starts its spins clockwise pulling that little bit of half a tooth off into place first. Then it lines up with the others. Then they all spin together. If you have passenger side dead on. You can turn the crank clockwise and watch the top passenger cam move first as its first to be tugged by the belt which is why there's a half tooth of play and it also will stretch over time to the correct position.
I rotated those right side cam gears while it was in "Safe Position". It bent an intake valve and I heard the valve adjuster shim fall out into the valve cover. Pulled it off and the valve wouldn't even return. Had to get a new engine because I didnt use a cam locker on that side. It is not an invincible "Safe Mode", because the intake and exhaust valves can still contact each other regardless of piston position.
Are you saying you needed cam lockers on both sides? Doing mine now and have a cam locker on order for EJ255. How far did you rotate the cams and was on the belt install?
I had to pay a garage to do my timing belt and water pump on 1998 Legacy 2.5. It's running rough at idle since the new timing belt. The mechanic says it's because of my driveshaft U-joints, but that doesn't make sense if the car's not moving. I'm thinking about paying a different garage to check he timing.
Good video, informative. Do yourself a favor put the factory air box with the factory air filter back on your car. Washable/ reusable air filters aren't as efficient.
thanks for the correspondence, This is not my car. I would never run a garbage cobb intake. I prefer oem type air box, but keep in mind, oem are old and broken tabs and warped by now. i will alternatively use k&n or AEM intake. They have very good quality filters now. I dont like the drop in panels as they dont seal very well compared to the clamp type cone filter. Again, not all aftermarket intakes are good, the cobb ones are junk, they are bigger tubing, causing lean condition, and the filter media is garbage, it only filters birds and small babies, doesnt filter dirt dust or sand. it passes right through and ruins the rings and cylinders. causing blowby and burning oil and eventually kills the engine.
Could engine temperature have anything to do with it? Your engine is cold now, but when you drive and the engine heats up it will expand slightly and stretch the belt.
Thank you for the video dude! I’ve had issues for months with my timing making my car run like absolute crap. I reset my timing belt last night and the half a tooth out was worrying me. Now, watching your video, the 2nd cylinder inlet cam is half a tooth out PAST the mark on the cover. Will this be alright or does it need to be before the mark?
Thanks for the video, my engine is EJ25, forester 2010 just snapped the timing belt on the way to work any chances of nothing bad happened to the engine? My mechanic was able to turn the crankshaft and camshaft with the socket and told to order the kit.
7:04 this part kinda throws your thoery of "stretch belt will line up perfectly" right out the window. Im less than 1/4 tooth off with tensioner tightened. I think im ok
I don’t recall my car running hot until I changed the timing belt and water pump, so I changed the water pump to an OEM one again, but the car still runs higher that normal, yesterday I took it for a ride and got it up to 90 with AC on car got to 218, I’m wandering if the timing is off, would it even run if it was off
Just did my belt all the marks are lined up , but one is off by maybe a tooth is that bad? Ot started up completely fine but sounds like a little ticking noise but isnt throwing codes or knocking.
I'm totally stuck on an EJ20E timing belt kit replacement. .... I can't for the life of me get the new belt on my SOHC. The new Gates tensioner seems to have a higher hydraulic pin even with the hand grenade pin inserted correctly. I've done what Gates said in priming/bleeding the tensioner but I think the 1 or 2 mm that push pin is sitting up is making it impossible to install the new belt. Any advice on how to get around this issue?
Hi, I've got same issue on EJ20K engine, 1996 v3 sti type ra, early type tensioner etc. Lined up everything but the double lines on the LH EX and IN don't line up exactly as the RH EX and IN, when removing and replacing the timing belt do I just line them up or line up as they are now? Thanks in advance
Hows it going dude, i just did my timing belt on my 07 wrx, ej255. I had the same issue with my timing marks being little on the piss on the right hand cam sprockets, like half a tooth. Anyway, watched this video and it was literally exactly what was going on with me so i decided to run with it. Runs well, maybe better then before. Unfortunately 20 mins in to my test drive it threw a cel. Have you had an experience with this happening?
no because the avcs variable angle would affect the cam position angle, itself,,, not the outer sprocket or cam gear timing mark alignment on the outer side of the avcs sprocket.
@@subtledriver yeah I did this job on my 2002 wrx with the 205 and no avcs and it was less than half a tooth off, I was scared to start it but everything went fine
BS. The reason it doesn't line up is nothing to do with stretch but because you've just pulled the pin on the tensioner and haven't turned it over to even out the tension across the belt. You could turn it a revolution forward and then turn it back it will line up but I don't like turning engines backwards if I can avoid it. Just line the marks up on the belt and you'll be good. As for the 'service mode' comment, also BS. Sure, withe the crank in that position the valves can't hit the pistons but they sure as hell can hit each other if you go spinning the cam pullies around the wrong way like an incompetent.
Just did the timing belt on my 2006 STI, I have low idle, and occasional low idle misfire, with P0011. But, it runs great under load. Could this be the issue? I have new plugs, new Cam pos Sensor, new avcs solenoid, fresh oil, no banjo filter screens. New PCV valve. Great video by the way.
@@moezori2265 turns out I had lots of metal debris built up in my cam gears from a previous engine rebuild. The shop did not clean out all of the oil channels properly. So I kept throwing the code because the metal debris was interfering with the variable movement cam gears.
@2:45 He cranks over the engine. For me after the timing belt it wont go. I didnt force it, at all once resistance was felt I stopped. how do i fix this
I have a SOHC and the last pulley would not line up. I tried putting the belt on every way possible and could only get two of the lines to work. The only way it would have worked is if the right hand pulley was a tooth toward the passenger side. Well, I thought that couldn't be right and put it on the other way. Now it idles rough. Time to take it apart.
When I did it it was damn near perfect then I rotate it and somehow the belt shifted to the right a couple notches all around not sure where I fucked up
This comment is fairly old but if you hadnt figured it out by now once you set the belt and marks appropriately, and then rotate the engine, the timing marks will line back up after the appropriate rotations but not the belt. The belt takes an absurd amount of rotations to be back aligned with the marks. The marks on the belt are only good for the initial alignment.
But i opens up my timingbelt suspecting belt jumped a tooth... And i tried counting belt tooth method... End up i screwed up my timing marks even worse... Now im unsure to continue counting the belt tooth or revert back to my previous timing position.... Anyway im getting p0340 at redline shift..hence im checking my timing marks in the first place
I just now checked my 2009 wrx timing as we speak. 60k on a gates racing belt and everything is spot on all 4 cams. Check the tooth count on the belts your using some are 351, 352 etc...
@@roberthiggins1419 I bought my belt from subaru and told them the correct engine and im still having the problem, are you sure its the wrong belt because everywhere else I looks says they are all the same unless you have a sohc
@@roberthiggins1419 Yes exactly, it will be off until the belt stretches, you are about due for a timing job, therefore your belt is stretched and marks line up better.
Be careful , when you talk about "service mode" . You are very correct in saying you will not have piston to valve contact. BUT you can absolutely have intake and exhaust valve contact. Set your exhaust cam first, then the intake cam. IAG heat a great tech tip on this. Thanks for the video!
Hello, I am from Chile and I have removed the belt about 5 times thinking that the point is wrong, today I left it as you have it and I will start it without gasoline to see what happens, I broke my head thinking that it is wrong but then After watching some videos and yours I convinced myself that it is fine. Thank you very much!!!
Thank you for the video. As a fellow perfectionist and mechanic, I really couldn't get my head around how I was always missing. I must have taken the belt off and on three or four times before I saw your video, confirming what I suspected was going on. Coming from working on Volvo and VAG, the timing marks always line up perfect, so this was new to me.
But the engine started and ran just fine.
Thank you.
Thanks for the video. I encountered the same situation with a new timing belt (2009 Forester XT Limited). The original belt and marks were also slightly off. I assumed at first the original belt had stretched but the new belt was no different. Up to this point, I had only seen videos of perfectly lined up marks which stressed that importance so I assumed something must be off. However, the teeth count between all the gears was correct and it was clear that if anything was moved even one tooth, it would be worse. After checking and rechecking repeated, I decide it had to be right and applied your “Don't worry, be happy” attitude. Sure enough the car started right up and runs great.
When I was a young man working on cars, everything that was “Made in Japan" was considered junk and to be avoided. I had thought this had changed but after dealing with this timing belt and changing the spark plugs, the old memories are coming back.
Worked at a dealer for 7 years and went to do a DOHC today to help my boss. We had all the marks physically lined up and when we went to turn the crank had piston to valve. Set it off a tooth crank side and it wouldn't run. I wasn't there for take off. So either a valve got hit or I'll try this tomorrow. Great video.
Any updates as to what happened?
Back again.. Any updates? I've bent a valve since my last comment because I rotated the cams he says you can rotate in safe mode lol. Use a cam lock tool!
1 less anxiety attack, thanks man.
Thanks for the help! Doing this now and took it off and back on about 5 times thinking I was off.
you are welcome! do be careful if you re-compressed the tensioner many times. they dont like it sometimes. again thanks for the feedback!
Vert helpful, I have a 1994 jdm and this was super informational.
I'm over here doing this job 4 times In a row because they won't line up on a fresh rebuilt EJ255 beating my head against the wall not able to figure this out. Thought it had to be perfect and I got OCD, this video helped a ton!
I literally did mine 4 times. I am a mechanic and I haven’t done one since 2015 when I was an apprentice. I tried my best to get it perfect but same issue as here. I did a sohc one literally a week before doing a dohc. I honestly thought i was doing it wrong but I realised it can’t be. Those lines on the belt really help. Great to know I’m not the only one who thought this!
thanks for sharing! The SOHC doesn't have this issue. but the DOHC I've run into this countless times. So decided to share. I hope this helps others not waste time too!
I haven't done a DOHC yet but I appreciate that you took the time to make this video for when I do. Thanks
The definitive way to check is there should be 28 teeth between each of marks on the cams. 54.5 teeth between the crank and passenger side intake cam, 51 teeth between the crank and the drivers side intake cam mark.
If i find so much as one teeth on my shaft I’m up and audis
What side is the driver?
@mmark8394 for USDM the left hand side from the driver's perspective
If you line up the driver side cams pointing at each other. And point the passenger side lower cam straight up, the top cam should almost be pointing straight down but to the right a little. What happens when the engine starts its spins clockwise pulling that little bit of half a tooth off into place first. Then it lines up with the others. Then they all spin together. If you have passenger side dead on. You can turn the crank clockwise and watch the top passenger cam move first as its first to be tugged by the belt which is why there's a half tooth of play and it also will stretch over time to the correct position.
This was driving me nuts, thanks you
you are welcome!
Helping the future 2024. Thanks
I rotated those right side cam gears while it was in "Safe Position". It bent an intake valve and I heard the valve adjuster shim fall out into the valve cover. Pulled it off and the valve wouldn't even return. Had to get a new engine because I didnt use a cam locker on that side. It is not an invincible "Safe Mode", because the intake and exhaust valves can still contact each other regardless of piston position.
Are you saying you needed cam lockers on both sides? Doing mine now and have a cam locker on order for EJ255. How far did you rotate the cams and was on the belt install?
Thank you so greatly this video gives some stress relief
Good job thanks all so the gravy feed balancer trick was good thanks agen.
the bottom idler , i always use the double bearing idler not the single one as you have installed as they are less likely to fail
It all depends on how much they shave when they have done a headgasket job. And if you are not using the stock of thicker headgasket.
So if my head gasket has been changed will this impact how the double marks line up on cams? How do i know which is correct alignment
I had to pay a garage to do my timing belt and water pump on 1998 Legacy 2.5. It's running rough at idle since the new timing belt. The mechanic says it's because of my driveshaft U-joints, but that doesn't make sense if the car's not moving. I'm thinking about paying a different garage to check he timing.
Thanks for this. Helped tremendously
You're welcome. I hope it worked out great! Please share and follow my Instagram @subtledriver! Have a great day!
Good video, informative. Do yourself a favor put the factory air box with the factory air filter back on your car. Washable/ reusable air filters aren't as efficient.
thanks for the correspondence, This is not my car. I would never run a garbage cobb intake. I prefer oem type air box, but keep in mind, oem are old and broken tabs and warped by now. i will alternatively use k&n or AEM intake. They have very good quality filters now. I dont like the drop in panels as they dont seal very well compared to the clamp type cone filter. Again, not all aftermarket intakes are good, the cobb ones are junk, they are bigger tubing, causing lean condition, and the filter media is garbage, it only filters birds and small babies, doesnt filter dirt dust or sand. it passes right through and ruins the rings and cylinders. causing blowby and burning oil and eventually kills the engine.
Thank you!! i had the same results and I thought i was doing something wrong!! super helpful! thanks bro! CHICKEN GREASE!!! 🤟
always line up the mark before you take the old belt off, use that as a reference. If the old belt is off the same, you're good. otherwise, not good.
Could engine temperature have anything to do with it? Your engine is cold now, but when you drive and the engine heats up it will expand slightly and stretch the belt.
I appreciate the video. Thanks!
your welcome!
Do you follow the timing mark cover or the belt marks itself?
In bed now I wanna go see if it’s off half a tooth or actually a full tooth
Thank you for the video dude! I’ve had issues for months with my timing making my car run like absolute crap. I reset my timing belt last night and the half a tooth out was worrying me. Now, watching your video, the 2nd cylinder inlet cam is half a tooth out PAST the mark on the cover. Will this be alright or does it need to be before the mark?
When the car comes back for another timing belt 😹
For the recommended maintainace interval? Hilarious.
Thanks for the video, my engine is EJ25, forester 2010 just snapped the timing belt on the way to work any chances of nothing bad happened to the engine? My mechanic was able to turn the crankshaft and camshaft with the socket and told to order the kit.
7:04 this part kinda throws your thoery of "stretch belt will line up perfectly" right out the window. Im less than 1/4 tooth off with tensioner tightened. I think im ok
I don’t recall my car running hot until I changed the timing belt and water pump, so I changed the water pump to an OEM one again, but the car still runs higher that normal, yesterday I took it for a ride and got it up to 90 with AC on car got to 218, I’m wandering if the timing is off, would it even run if it was off
Thank you mate great vid
After replacement, I have a compression of only about 5-6 Bar, the engine is running.??? Valve bad?
Just did my belt all the marks are lined up , but one is off by maybe a tooth is that bad? Ot started up completely fine but sounds like a little ticking noise but isnt throwing codes or knocking.
I'm totally stuck on an EJ20E timing belt kit replacement. .... I can't for the life of me get the new belt on my SOHC. The new Gates tensioner seems to have a higher hydraulic pin even with the hand grenade pin inserted correctly. I've done what Gates said in priming/bleeding the tensioner but I think the 1 or 2 mm that push pin is sitting up is making it impossible to install the new belt. Any advice on how to get around this issue?
I have 1/2 a tooth more but to the right side could be the problem for no power under load like going in 2 cylinder?
Question? Does it matter if it’s a tooth back or a tooth forward?
What if it’s slightly to the right half of tooth?
Hi, I've got same issue on EJ20K engine, 1996 v3 sti type ra, early type tensioner etc. Lined up everything but the double lines on the LH EX and IN don't line up exactly as the RH EX and IN, when removing and replacing the timing belt do I just line them up or line up as they are now? Thanks in advance
Hows it going dude, i just did my timing belt on my 07 wrx, ej255. I had the same issue with my timing marks being little on the piss on the right hand cam sprockets, like half a tooth. Anyway, watched this video and it was literally exactly what was going on with me so i decided to run with it. Runs well, maybe better then before. Unfortunately 20 mins in to my test drive it threw a cel. Have you had an experience with this happening?
what was the code?
I thought this was due to the variable timing system?
that is a possibility, but I also had this issue with the non avcs ej20.
no because the avcs variable angle would affect the cam position angle, itself,,, not the outer sprocket or cam gear timing mark alignment on the outer side of the avcs sprocket.
@@subtledriver yeah I did this job on my 2002 wrx with the 205 and no avcs and it was less than half a tooth off, I was scared to start it but everything went fine
BS. The reason it doesn't line up is nothing to do with stretch but because you've just pulled the pin on the tensioner and haven't turned it over to even out the tension across the belt. You could turn it a revolution forward and then turn it back it will line up but I don't like turning engines backwards if I can avoid it. Just line the marks up on the belt and you'll be good.
As for the 'service mode' comment, also BS. Sure, withe the crank in that position the valves can't hit the pistons but they sure as hell can hit each other if you go spinning the cam pullies around the wrong way like an incompetent.
i have a 2000 outback legacy and mines off 3 teeth any help?
Just did the timing belt on my 2006 STI, I have low idle, and occasional low idle misfire, with P0011. But, it runs great under load. Could this be the issue? I have new plugs, new Cam pos Sensor, new avcs solenoid, fresh oil, no banjo filter screens. New PCV valve.
Great video by the way.
Did you ever figure out your issue??
Same issue any solutions?
@@moezori2265 turns out I had lots of metal debris built up in my cam gears from a previous engine rebuild. The shop did not clean out all of the oil channels properly. So I kept throwing the code because the metal debris was interfering with the variable movement cam gears.
i had this,but i thought it was because i had my heads planed
😆 this had me scratching my head.
The half-tooth off thing really got me ???
@2:45
He cranks over the engine. For me after the timing belt it wont go. I didnt force it, at all once resistance was felt I stopped. how do i fix this
Make sure marks line up. Why are you doing the belt?
What if it doesn't start
I’ve got a sohc that idles not smooth like before the belt was done. Could it just be a tooth off?
i would pop the cover and check. the sohc doesnt have same half tooth issue however... SOHC is much easier to time.
I have a SOHC and the last pulley would not line up. I tried putting the belt on every way possible and could only get two of the lines to work. The only way it would have worked is if the right hand pulley was a tooth toward the passenger side. Well, I thought that couldn't be right and put it on the other way. Now it idles rough. Time to take it apart.
@@alexp336 What did you figure out? Doing mine and the same pulley line is a tooth towards the passenger
I’m getting a p0018.. I haven’t pulled my timing cover off yet..
Hey did you ever get this fixed
When I did it it was damn near perfect then I rotate it and somehow the belt shifted to the right a couple notches all around not sure where I fucked up
This comment is fairly old but if you hadnt figured it out by now once you set the belt and marks appropriately, and then rotate the engine, the timing marks will line back up after the appropriate rotations but not the belt. The belt takes an absurd amount of rotations to be back aligned with the marks. The marks on the belt are only good for the initial alignment.
@@McGamesta 😂 I swear nobody told me this yeah I just ran with it
let me know if you can fix my 09 corolla timing
Timing chain?
But i opens up my timingbelt suspecting belt jumped a tooth... And i tried counting belt tooth method... End up i screwed up my timing marks even worse...
Now im unsure to continue counting the belt tooth or revert back to my previous timing position....
Anyway im getting p0340 at redline shift..hence im checking my timing marks in the first place
Would a tooth off cause a misfire under load?
that should be corrected regardless, but it is possible. most likely an ignition or low fuel volume issue.
Yeap
Cuenta los dientes de la. Vieja. Cadena. Cuenta los dientes distancia de. Cada. Linia a otra linia
You got the wrong timing belt. No it's not normal
I just now checked my 2009 wrx timing as we speak. 60k on a gates racing belt and everything is spot on all 4 cams.
Check the tooth count on the belts your using some are 351, 352 etc...
@@roberthiggins1419 I bought my belt from subaru and told them the correct engine and im still having the problem, are you sure its the wrong belt because everywhere else I looks says they are all the same unless you have a sohc
@@roberthiggins1419 Yes exactly, it will be off until the belt stretches, you are about due for a timing job, therefore your belt is stretched and marks line up better.
All ej205 255 and 257s all use the same belt and timing marks
Does sohc apply to this as well?