Agree about Oceania being the new normal, to me Oceania is the Texas hold ‘em of Wingspan, the Cadillac of games. The only tweak I’d make is that like that 3rd spot in the wetlands or the 4 spot in the grasslands just don’t offer much advantage to the player for building out
I think welcome sparrow should have been geared like a late game chiff chaff/ chaffinch….like stonemaier already showed they were perfectly fine with a 4 point, 1 food cost bird that could lead do tons of tucks- so a 2 food one point, best case scenario 5 tuck bird is just a bad balance
I completely agree about Oceania. For me it is easily the most essential expansion and I have zero interest in ever playing anything without Oceania board and therefore also Nectar. It fixes all the problems and is simply so much more fun and diverse experience.
Neat video format, podcast-like style but in a shorter video format. Maybe a bit of a wall of text, but to quickly go over the different topics & points. I only play the physical verison, and not online. But I do hope that atleast the Asia expension is going to the Wingspan app version sooner then later, its a bit of a pity that you kinda have this gap now between the people who only play online & people who play the physical version. I don't remember where, but I think during one of Jamey Stonemeiers livestreams he mentioned that when they release a game / expansions, they want atleast 1 year or so before putting it also online (though can be wrong about that) I really like the Hornbill, with eggs harder to come by in Oceania its a fun bird to try to maximize. Trying to fill up a nest with eggs but also having eggs elsewhere around to pay for the Hornbill whilst making sure you don't need the eggs to pay for other prehaps more important birds. Real fun. The welcome sparrow, not so much. As you say, its 2 food for 4 points, only if a bonus card really needs it. Though Oceanina has some other birds that are also late-game point bombs that score rather few points, like the Spotless Crake or Pacific Black Duck. Not sure what the design idea is behind these, they are all birds that benefit from having a filled row, but still score little in the most ideal situation. Endangered species protecter is such a fun bonus card, it makes playing a bonus card bird and drawing bonus cards you won't score for alot less painful. I find it to work really well with the European bonus card birds since those also let you lay an egg, get food or draw cards. With the base board vs Oceania boards. Maybe they went a bit to far with redesigning the boards & nectar, but I really enjoy it the way it is. My only complaint is that the nectar is also on the fruit side of the die, so fruit gets very rarley choosen (wish they added the nectar on the single wheat & worm sides rather then then single wheat & fruit side). Nectar removes alot of frustration for me when the birdfeeder just does not give me the food I need.
Pretty cool format for a video! I won't write a novel here and hopefully respond to your points quickly. I personally don't have a problem with cosmetic purchases in games but I suspect that Stonemaier has some ability to tell Monster Couch that they don't want to be associated with "microtransactions" of that nature. The artwork in Wingspan is one of those transcendent elements of the game, it's part of its identity almost as much as the actual gameplay, and there might be some perception that the OG art "isn't good enough" or some perceived disrespect to the OG artists. I also don't think that Jamey wants to be associated with microtransactions of any kind. He likes to focus on completed products and actively tries to avoid FOMO. But maybe I'm wrong here since they did produce the Fan Art pack. In a post Wyrmspan world, we can see that Jamey is actively looking for more ways to monetize the Wingspan IP so maybe there are more of these options open than I think. I agree about the Hornbill. I call it the Bonellie's of OE. I also agree with Welcome Swallow. This is one of those designs that really makes me question playtesting. They really seemed afraid of that power. Also agree on Endangered Species Protector. This is probably the best card of any type currently in Wingspan. Imagine the combo of ESP and Great Indian Bustard. Good luck house ruling that one digitally. There may be hope for people who like house rules because BGA has gotten permission from Stonemaier to add Wood Duck to the "banned" list despite this not being an officially supported variant or option. This opens the door to Monster Couch doing the same thing for any cards. I also agree that it's hard to go back to core after OE. I also think that OE went too far in one direction. The redesigned board is one thing, but combining it with Nectar probably makes OE Forest better than Core Grasslands. Just like you said, they nerfed Grasslands too much in OE. I think this redesign is the legacy of all the complaining about egg spam from the early days of the game. Those people got what they wanted, playing more bird cards in a game about playing bird cards.
I'll also add that I'm not sure how much pull the Tournament Discord Mods have with Monster Couch, but it seems like they have their ear enough to at least have some conversation. Especially now that Flan is also a mod on the MC Wingspan Discord. I can foresee a scenario where the Mod Team takes their data from their bird power surveys and petitions Stonemaier and Monster Couch for some ability to house rule problematic cards. I pretty sure Jamey would listen to their argument at the very least.
Went to a friend's house and played on a base game board...forgot how SLOW out of the gate those games can be. YES this can still happen with Oceania board & nectar head start, but the frequency of dud starts is like 10% compared to 30% on a base game with a bad starting hand.
Yeah endangered species protecter is crazy. The more bonus cards birds you play the more chance you hsve of picking this up and when you do... bam! can easily be 40+ points from bonus cards, with 15 from the endangered species protector. Asia has lots of interesting bonus card birds too I had a game though with endangered species protecter in my opening hand, and could not find a single bonus card point bird the whole gsme. 0 points
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Wingspan content lurker here; love this video and the vids lately. Well-spoken!
Agree about Oceania being the new normal, to me Oceania is the Texas hold ‘em of Wingspan, the Cadillac of games. The only tweak I’d make is that like that 3rd spot in the wetlands or the 4 spot in the grasslands just don’t offer much advantage to the player for building out
I think welcome sparrow should have been geared like a late game chiff chaff/ chaffinch….like stonemaier already showed they were perfectly fine with a 4 point, 1 food cost bird that could lead do tons of tucks- so a 2 food one point, best case scenario 5 tuck bird is just a bad balance
I completely agree about Oceania. For me it is easily the most essential expansion and I have zero interest in ever playing anything without Oceania board and therefore also Nectar. It fixes all the problems and is simply so much more fun and diverse experience.
Neat video format, podcast-like style but in a shorter video format.
Maybe a bit of a wall of text, but to quickly go over the different topics & points.
I only play the physical verison, and not online. But I do hope that atleast the Asia expension is going to the Wingspan app version sooner then later, its a bit of a pity that you kinda have this gap now between the people who only play online & people who play the physical version. I don't remember where, but I think during one of Jamey Stonemeiers livestreams he mentioned that when they release a game / expansions, they want atleast 1 year or so before putting it also online (though can be wrong about that)
I really like the Hornbill, with eggs harder to come by in Oceania its a fun bird to try to maximize. Trying to fill up a nest with eggs but also having eggs elsewhere around to pay for the Hornbill whilst making sure you don't need the eggs to pay for other prehaps more important birds. Real fun.
The welcome sparrow, not so much. As you say, its 2 food for 4 points, only if a bonus card really needs it. Though Oceanina has some other birds that are also late-game point bombs that score rather few points, like the Spotless Crake or Pacific Black Duck. Not sure what the design idea is behind these, they are all birds that benefit from having a filled row, but still score little in the most ideal situation.
Endangered species protecter is such a fun bonus card, it makes playing a bonus card bird and drawing bonus cards you won't score for alot less painful. I find it to work really well with the European bonus card birds since those also let you lay an egg, get food or draw cards.
With the base board vs Oceania boards. Maybe they went a bit to far with redesigning the boards & nectar, but I really enjoy it the way it is. My only complaint is that the nectar is also on the fruit side of the die, so fruit gets very rarley choosen (wish they added the nectar on the single wheat & worm sides rather then then single wheat & fruit side). Nectar removes alot of frustration for me when the birdfeeder just does not give me the food I need.
Pretty cool format for a video! I won't write a novel here and hopefully respond to your points quickly.
I personally don't have a problem with cosmetic purchases in games but I suspect that Stonemaier has some ability to tell Monster Couch that they don't want to be associated with "microtransactions" of that nature. The artwork in Wingspan is one of those transcendent elements of the game, it's part of its identity almost as much as the actual gameplay, and there might be some perception that the OG art "isn't good enough" or some perceived disrespect to the OG artists. I also don't think that Jamey wants to be associated with microtransactions of any kind. He likes to focus on completed products and actively tries to avoid FOMO. But maybe I'm wrong here since they did produce the Fan Art pack. In a post Wyrmspan world, we can see that Jamey is actively looking for more ways to monetize the Wingspan IP so maybe there are more of these options open than I think.
I agree about the Hornbill. I call it the Bonellie's of OE. I also agree with Welcome Swallow. This is one of those designs that really makes me question playtesting. They really seemed afraid of that power. Also agree on Endangered Species Protector. This is probably the best card of any type currently in Wingspan. Imagine the combo of ESP and Great Indian Bustard. Good luck house ruling that one digitally. There may be hope for people who like house rules because BGA has gotten permission from Stonemaier to add Wood Duck to the "banned" list despite this not being an officially supported variant or option. This opens the door to Monster Couch doing the same thing for any cards.
I also agree that it's hard to go back to core after OE. I also think that OE went too far in one direction. The redesigned board is one thing, but combining it with Nectar probably makes OE Forest better than Core Grasslands. Just like you said, they nerfed Grasslands too much in OE. I think this redesign is the legacy of all the complaining about egg spam from the early days of the game. Those people got what they wanted, playing more bird cards in a game about playing bird cards.
I'll also add that I'm not sure how much pull the Tournament Discord Mods have with Monster Couch, but it seems like they have their ear enough to at least have some conversation. Especially now that Flan is also a mod on the MC Wingspan Discord. I can foresee a scenario where the Mod Team takes their data from their bird power surveys and petitions Stonemaier and Monster Couch for some ability to house rule problematic cards. I pretty sure Jamey would listen to their argument at the very least.
Went to a friend's house and played on a base game board...forgot how SLOW out of the gate those games can be. YES this can still happen with Oceania board & nectar head start, but the frequency of dud starts is like 10% compared to 30% on a base game with a bad starting hand.
Yeah endangered species protecter is crazy.
The more bonus cards birds you play the more chance you hsve of picking this up and when you do... bam! can easily be 40+ points from bonus cards, with 15 from the endangered species protector.
Asia has lots of interesting bonus card birds too
I had a game though with endangered species protecter in my opening hand, and could not find a single bonus card point bird the whole gsme. 0 points
reddit really thinks "endangered species" bonus card is 'not overpowered'. it's absurd at best. should be 2x for sure