I clicked on this expecting to let it play for maybe a handful of minutes but here I am over two hours later having just listened to the entirety of the episode. I regret nothing.
so glad you guys brought up Bret's selling. Every time I watch a Bret match that's the first thing I notice. He's a master seller and it makes you root for him.
@@mussman717wordI have seen him. I bumped into him at an airport once. After I realized oh shit it’s Big Stevie Cool, I apologized immediately and he angrily shouted at me…I will never forget his words… “I’LL SHOW YOU! YOU’LL SEE!!”
Stevie, you were a WONDERFUL example for meeting your heroes. I first met you at an Extreme Rising show in PA (where New Jack breaks his leg and Matt Hardy gets a massive concussion) in '12 (I asked about unbooked Catering and said you needed to do a shoot interview) then again in NOLA for whatever show you worked during WM34 weekend (I asked more about unbooked catering, you also had a Vince McMahon Madden aside that was humorous). Both in an out of the business I've always appreciated the way you carry yourself. Keep up the good work sir!
I think we need more than 10 categories honestly. Some maybe separate out of where you have them lumped. 1. Look 2. Selling 3. Drawing ability, Marketability, and “Brand ambassador” factor 4. Realism & legitimacy 5. Charisma 6. In-ring work 7. Finisher(s) and signature move(s) 8. Ability to work with everybody, and as babyface or heel 9. Comedy 10. Promos 11. Locker room respect factor 12. Protect their opponents 13. Ability to evolve & adapt over time and on the fly, can they “call an audible” and are they creative 14. Longevity & durability 15. Easy to work with (from an office/booker/agent perspective)
Don't see charisma and promo being separate, but Bret wins this 10-5. Shawn has promos, comedy etc, Bret takes darned near everything else that involves skill
Thank you Stevie for your sharing your personal story with with Shawn. Not only did it prove you were unbiased in your ranking but it's something so many of your audience (if not everyone) can empathize with. Your authenticity is refreshing.
I absolutely loved your analysis channel Stevie but this is so much better. Hearing your different stories from your career & your views & opinions about wrestling & wrestlers is FN’ awesome man. Always been a huge fan. Another great show too.
Just tooting some horn here. Want to say thank you for this not-podcast. It's almost like class in a sense, where I'm very interested and eager to learn and listen. I like it, and I hope you fellas don't get discouraged in continuing it. Thank you fellas very much. Even the behind the scenes work, and look forward to your shows.
Just wanna say, I love Stevie's original show and have been a fan of his since his ecw days but this show with James is gold. I think they have great chemistry together and they both have a passion for the business that just oozes out into the show. Love them both, keep up the great work guys, I'm a fan of both of you for life. Much respect to the both of you.
I’m not good with number ratings so I’ll just name who I think is best in each of the categories. Technical Wrestling: Bret Striking: Bret Putting matches together: Both Baby face: Bret Heel: Shawn Presentation: Shawn Promos: Shawn Charisma: Shawn Creating memorable moments: Shawn Out of the ring attitude: Bret Scores: Bret: 5 Shawn: 6 I prefer Shawn more than Bret slightly because in wrestling I enjoy the larger than life personality and entertainers more than in ring talent and pure wrestlers, and I think Shawn was more entertaining overall and had the complete package. Bret was a better wrestler and more believable as an in ring talent. In conclusion, I don’t think one is completely better than the other, it’s apples and oranges. It depends on what you like from wrestling the most.
That genuinely was really rough to listen to. Like you tell someone they’re your hero and they let you down like that? It’s devastating. You can tell how deeply it affected him, it affected me listening to it. And you just know Bret would never do something like that.
@@rsb8380 Can confirm. We brought Bret to one of our local indies and somehow I was lucky enough to be invited to sit at Bret’s table and I got to tell him how he inspired me to get trained and become a wrestler, to which he smiled, shook my hand and said I’d done a great job that night. Bret truly is the best there is, was and ever will be.
I'm a 43 year old from philly who grew up going to the original ecw on a regular basis. So I been a stevie since his baron von stevie days, the bwo, and even his brief WCW stint to right to censor. Needless to say I love this podcast. Offers insight no other wrestling podcast does .
My two cents on the "too short" is very simple. Being a short wrestler doesn't mean you're bad or unpopular. And being a tall wrestler doesn't mean you're good or popular. i think historically more bad wrestlers have been given an opportunity for being tall, and more good wrestlers have been stripped of opportunities for being short.
Tall guys can be good grapplers, short guys can be good grapplers, but weight classes still exist for a reason. Cruiserweights shouldnt co mingle with heavyweights if theyre not atleast 190 legit lbs, not pro wrestling lbs
@@UnprofitServant at some point with your two brain cells did you even consider for a second that this is in fact fictional? And the last thing a theatrical program about undead cryptkeepers and custody battles need is some buffoonsih oaf to jump out of the audience and yell "THAT'S NAHT TRUE, HE DIDN'T REALLY HIT HM. THIS IS FAAAAAAKE. A LITTLE GUY CANT BEAT A BIG GUY"
@@UnprofitServant The most skilled fighter will win 9 times out of 10 regardless of size, we've learned this from years of MMA and other combat sports. The best MMA fighter we've ever seen is arguably Demetrious Johnson and almost everybody is taller than him. Dudes fought out of his natural weight class his entire career and still barely has any losses. If size mattered as much as people say it does, Stephan Struve would be the GOAT as he's a legit 7 footer. At best he's a gatekeeper Full Disclaimer: do not bring up roid monkeys Jones and Lesnar. Fraudsters like that get an asterisk when it comes to skill.
Keep up the great work, love the podcasts, been watching wrestling since i was little. Born in 74,stevie richards was the pop when ecw rocked the world and by the way your superkick was better . Keep up the great work. ❤
It's all just a matter of opinion, I suppose, but I can't agree with Stevie on the babyface category. I always thought Bret was one of the greatest babyface champions ever, giving the glasses to kids etc, while I found Shawn much more convincing as a heel than a face. Stevie seems to be focusing on the promos and charisma, but they have separate categories of their own.
Love this show! Good episode but what stood out to me the most was when Stevie was talking about his interactions with HBK. I grew up a huge HBK fan. As a little kid I rewatched the 1995 Royal Rumble a million times. HBK was my hero. After hearing what you said about how he treated you, made me a little disappointed and upset. Makes me look at Shawn in a different light. I will never take away from his wrestling and performance ability, but as a person, I’ve lost some respect for him. Stevie Richard’s seems like a real genuine dude and I love listening to him talk about wrestling. I can watch this show all day everyday
Another great show guys. James is complaining about the length of the episodes. How about taping 3-5 10 minute segments on the day of taping then release a new segment every day for fresh content. You can reduce the time of the weekly podcast by doing that. Just a suggestion. Keep up the great work! 🚀
I used to build rings for indy shows with this guy who was really methodical about it. He owned 2-3 rings and each was put together and broken down in the exact same way every time, including the placement of the boards. It was time-consuming but the people who used his rings frequently knew exactly what they were getting every time.
I watched the Screw Job match for the first time a few months ago and it is a bummer that what happened overshadowed the match that Bret and Shawn had. I also respect both of them for keeping their professionalism during their matches, they both could've easily decided to hurt each other because of their real life feud.
An astoundingly in-depth analysis that expounded upon every conceivable aspect regarding two of the greatest icons within sports entertainment’s unique realm. When considering each performer’s merits as either a heel or face, it’s important to remember that during his early career, as one half of The Rockers, Michaels was cast exclusively as a “clean cut” golden boy, and his villainous persona never emerged until he “catastrophically” broke up with Marty Jannetty during their infamous Barbershop encounter. Bret, by contrast, forming part of The Hart Foundation, was involved with numerous angles and feuds both as a heel and face alongside Jim Neidhart, the late 80s and early 90s, perhaps most notably against the British Bulldogs and Demolition, before becoming an established solo force a year or so earlier than Shawn, though on balance, in terms of their respective “physical” characterisation of either role I’d say both were equally effective and believable . In the category of “ring psychology” I find their individual assets make it impossible to pick a winner. Shawn, perhaps as the superior “pure athlete” and one with extraordinary stamina could pace a match to perfection, used spectacular “single moves” to level the playing field whilst Bret, being from a traditional wrestling background had the larger overall repertoire of manoeuvres, applied them with greater precision and a sharper technique, “grafted” his way back from the brink of defeat, and conveyed a greater sense of drama though his body language depending on the match’s momentum. As to memorable mic spots or back stage promos, I agree that barely anyone can replicate, let alone surpass Shawn’s ability to work a crowd, or more seamlessly transition between their loveable and detestable personality to suit whatever twists and developments the narrative incorporated. Bret, as an almost fanatical Patriot, always appeared more concerned that certain storylines would alienate his native fans, to whom both he had his family were and remain veritable royalty, which perhaps suggests there was a bigger distinction between “The Hitman” and Bret’s personal character than was the case for Shawn and “HBK”. Could this mean that Bret was the better “actor”?! Charisma - couldn’t choose Presentation - dead level Professional Conduct - I’ll leave that to the pro… Uh…What were the other categories? Guess I’ll go back and listen again!
This is an eternal debate because it's not comparing apples to oranges it's comparing steak to lobster. It's The Godfather versus Raiders of the Lost Arc, 12 Angry Men vs Star Wars. If you prefer drama, psychology, realism, you prefer Bret. If you prefer excitement, charisma, entertainment, you prefer Shawn. Neither school of thought is better, both are valid, but, which match do you prefer? The HBK vs Razor WM X ladder match? or Hitman vs Stone Cold "I Quit" from WM 13? Both are groundbreaking, legendary matches that changed wrestling forever FOR THE BETTER< and each underlines what I am saying. Shawn's match vs Razor was thrilling and exhilarating and a demonstration of rousing athletic performance. Bret's match vs Austin was slow, intense, methodical, and you bought in to its sincerity. Shawn vs Bret is a debate that will never die, because it's an impossible question to answer. They're both the best at what they did, but what they did were two different things in the same sport.
I always thought Bret never got enough credit for his promos. During the heyday of 80’s and New Gen he did a standard big wrestler promo, but his promos in the late 90s and especially 97 were on another level.
Been loving this pod..show series! Fucking hated you in RTC when i was a kid 😂 but absolutely love your wisdom as an adult! Talking about ring dynamics, im curious how the "Lesnar vs Big Show superplex ring collapse" spot worked from a technical standpoint, would love your insight on it some time!
Love the show. Love the Bret Shawn conversation but I gotta hard disagree about Shawn’s selling. He would COMMIT to selling. I remember watching him as a kid he made selling cool. In his Ironman match with Bret, Shawn hits him with the super kick but he’s so wiped out he can’t get up for the cover. He just lays on the mat, totally exhausted. In fact, Bret almost gets to his feet before Shawn until he sees Shawn’s still selling. Then Bret stalls a little. His match with Taker at Badd Blood. Another great example of his selling. Bro had to drag himself over to taker for the cover at the end. Shawn’s match with Razor SummerSlam 95 is a masterclass on long term selling over the course of a match. The way he struggles to climb the ladder, the way he’ll just lay on the mat after a big spot, there’s even a point where Razor tries to Irish whip Shawn and Shawn just collapses cause he can’t make it to the ropes. I highly recommend rewatching that match. Love the show! Great episode.
So glad you mentioned Shawn's *masterful* selling at the end of Badd Blood '97. It is THE finest piece of exhaustion selling in have EVER seen in Professional Wrestling. He sold it so well it made him look like the luckiest guy on the planet to have beaten The Undertaker. My favourite match of all time, by the way.
I disagree. Shawn oversold. He would do a back somersault with his legs straight up in the air. He flopped around like a fish, but then would go from zero to 10. It can be entertaining, but it ruins the immersion at least for me.
I thought it that the Bret Hart and Shawn Michaels comparison was very insightful especially from Stevie Richard's perspective. I also think that the striking comparison between the two men is totally off. HBK is a legend and one of the best wrestlers to ever do it. That said, his striking aside from his punch was "lucha light" meaning luchadores have tendency to strike light/land light because it is a more high flying style than the punch/kick style that was prevalent in the 80's when both guys were coming up in many of the territories through the United States/Canada. Maybe that was because Shawn was trained by a luchador in Jose Lothario versus Stu Hart/Stampede Wrestling in Canada. Bret Hart was also very crisp in everything from his punches, kicks, back breakers, suplexes, Russian leg sweeps, etc. Bret's striking and moves had a snap to them similar to Chris Benoit when they struck or executed a move that other wrestlers did not have with regards to striking.
One of my favorite Bret Hart promos came from WCW. When he was the US Champ he had a backstage promo with Mean Gene and he said that he was going to be a fighting champion, then he named El Dandy as his next opponent. We all know what he said next.
Never meet your heroes? I met Stevie Richards at a TNA fan interaction the day before Bound for Glory 2009. He couldn’t have been any nicer. He even signed my ECW dvd as Big Stevie Cool despite his gimmick at the time being Dr. Stevie. Abyss and Kurt Angle were also unbelievably nice. Rhino was a dick, and the same can be said 10-Fold for Blubber Ray Dudley. BTW Stevie did wrestle in the TNA 4-sided ring. He probably doesn’t remember because that’s the same ring he almost got killed in while taking a Styles Clash
The thing with being very small is that it's not the case you're too small, it's the case that you carry yourself like you're just here to have fun, when at the end of the day you should treat this like kayfabe and make like this is totally real for you. People will buy into your intreast if you sell them that intreast, you just got to believe in that by showing it through your body, work and uniqueness. Reason why Marko Stunt is loved despite looking like a poster child for "too small to take seriously" is because he at least knows his role and allows himself to be utilized to the full degree through it.
Dude, Bret as a face is much better than Shawn as face. Dude took his roles seriously. Hell, dudes like Cornette have said he’d take himself and the business as a whole a bit too seriously. Besides, he carried that company as face for a few years. What, 93-96, 95? Oh well. This is all subjective anyway way. A fun show, and a great segment! Continue the great work, gentlemen
Shawn as a babyface in 1995 was like a rock star, getting babyface reactions that I think surpassed Bret at his most over. Don't get me wrong, Bret was mega over, but if we judge it on which one of them had arenas full of people marking out, chanting his name etc I think that's clearly Shawn. Even moreso if we take his second run into account, where he was basically a babyface for 8 straight years and was super over the whole time.
I agree with you, but an argument could be made that he didn’t draw very well when he was on top. I’m not saying we should saddle the whole business slump on him by any means, I love Bret. But I can understand a 7-8 score.
I would give Bret a 10 and Shawn a 9 for baby-face. Bret in the 90's was amazing. His look and everything was really cool as a kid to look up to. It was really easy to get into the matches and story-lines he was in. He was a hero to a lot of kids not just in Canada but United States for sure until his heel turn. He was also on the Simpsons. My friends and I would look forward to seeing him whenever we got the chance because his matches were so cool. His moves were cool. I think Shawn was also a great baby face but not as much as Bret in my opinion because Bret was more believable and to me came across as more respectful and a harder worker which were ideals that we were supposed to look up to.
Really enjoyed the show, have to say I strongly disagree on the grading of strikes, Bret had one of the best working punches in wrestling, Shawn’s super kick finish was great, but his punches don’t compare to brets. Hitman is clear in that category for me.
Lol, Shawn was a better babyface than Bret? What, with all his dancing and prancing? Cmon dude … Bret would wait hours to sign stuff for his fans, gave kids glasses, told them to stand up for themselves, fought the big baddies that wanted to destroy good, showcased how much of a good brother he was by refusing to fight Owen, gave up single wrestling to team with Owen cause Owen wanted it and bigger brother had to look out for him (remember that storyline?!), spoke about family values and sticking up for eachother, always got the stuffings kicked out of him but kept going until he pulled out a victory from out of nowhere… Bret was a babyface done right! With Shawn it always looked like an act, despite the charisma. Dude was a legit heel and he had his best moments as a heel. As a kid I preferred Shawn, for all the flashy stuff and general goofiness. As a man, I see how many leagues ahead Bret was in storytelling, selling, pacing and overall personality.
It's a matter of opinion and they presented some passable arguments for it. Plus, they are coming from the perspective of someone who knew and worked at least half of the main subjects of the video. Sooo, I'm sure that's counts for more than you can account for but wtf do I know
@@FlechFisher If they're talking about their individual perspectives on whom they found better to wrestle, that's something I couldn't argue against. Here, they mention primarily their own understanding of the characters and the roles they played, and the stories they put up, and as a damn fan, and consumer, I can very well state my opinion and be rigth about it. I've been watching the game for the 30 years. I'm not some newbie who doesn't provide a solid arguement. Within this context, the fact that they "worked at least half of the main subjects" has nothing to do with it. By that measure, let fans never comment, just the wrestlers and ex-wrestlers.
@@kdr3619 oh fans can comment. They should just know their perspective is just that. Of a fan. It's far more subjective than objective whicj is undeniable. Most of them just make memes and crack jokes. Others try to play it up as if they were there. All they should have is self awareness and humility which we both know they very seldomly have. Same goes for most of sports too.
@@FlechFisher you're playing at bollocks mate. You're preaching. "they should know their perspective is just that. of a fan". I reckon many do. I certainly do. Don't exactly need you to remind me. There was nothing in my original comment that signified some grandiose position. Neither did I make a meme nor crack a joke. I called it as I saw it, so I don't know just what in the artificial world you're going on about. But hey, here's giving ya the benefit of the doubt.
@@kdr3619 I hit a nerve stating the obvious. There is indeed proof of arrogance in the very first sentence of the first paragraph. As far as preaching goes you're not a very good example as you don't practice it. The perspective of a fan is just that, mere subjectivity. Just reminding you of that is all. Sure a fan can say a boxer is better than the other for example. But how is a pro meant to take that seriously? Simple as that. Remind yourself of your position before spouting.
I can't complain that Shawn won on points on Stevie's rating system, even though Bret's my personal favourite. You could also do this for Hogan and Flair.
Great video. Never realised until that Timelapse that the rings were basically scaffold board with a small mat over it. Stevie, growing up in south Philadelphia and being of Italian descent, did you ever encounter any mafiosi?
Stevie, I really respect you! I saw you wrestle back in June of 96 at the Quakertown Flea market for the WWWA you went over woth the stevie kick. More importantly I respect the fact that you go out of your way to elevate your friend but also your brothers and sisters in Christ. That Shawn Michaels story made my stumach turn as a christian man myself. I understand that no one is perfect but my goodness can you be anymore of a DB. You and your musician friend deserve all the blessings in the world. We are too let the world know we are Christians by our love not our " Match Quality". Very disappointed in that story
Also, I'd like to see Rey go out against Dom in a "Hair vs. Mask" Match. He's already been unmasked, but its enough at stake that when he loses and takes off the mask and retires. Get Dom heat for cheating to retire his dad, and also lets Rey do the honors for his son.
I’d shake Steve’s hand if I ever ran into him. Quite frankly, him and Maven are probably the only pro wrestlers I would approach in public. I see the Undertaker on a regular basis (I do business around where he lives) and I don’t even bother trying to interact with him at all. He definitely comes off as unapproachable, I even have subbed to his 6ft under podcast since sub 10k members; and there is no way that I would think it’s a good idea to tell him he’s been a hero of mine that I’ve admired since childhood. Steve, you and Maven are far more important to the business than you would think. I appreciate you.
When Raven talked to Shawn about how he ran the ropes later in the matches, Shawn replied to Raven that he did it intentionally to show the boys in the back that he wasn’t blown up… Shawn knew better… he just didn’t really care. I think he was better about selling being tired later on in his career when his ego wasn’t as inflated…
Watch Shawn’s match in 95 against Razor at SummerSlam. Absolute masterclass in long term selling and proves Shawn was one of the best at it. Same thing with his match with Taker Badd Blood 97. Shawn was one of the best of all time with tired selling. He’d literally pull himself up using the ropes like he was so beat up he couldn’t stand on his own 2 feet anymore. You don’t see a lot of guys do that
Once you tell a narcissist that you look up to them or hold them in any high regard they'll begin to treat you like garbage and resent the heck out of you. They have a inner bad object and so they always will think of themselves as a totally worthless piece of crap. That's why they created the awesome false self that they're experiencing life through. When you tell them something like that, the narcissist hears that you think a piece of crap is totally awesome. It makes you even lower than they are in their mind. It's a license for them to display their greatness by submarining you to extract Supply.
Bret: 91/100. 9 for wrestler HBK: 85/100. 8.5 for wrestler Technical Bret 10 / Shawn 7 Striking Bret - 10(His looked very real and kicks) / Shawn 7 (his kicks were good his punches where meeeh) Putting matches together Bret 10 / Shawn 10 BabyFace Bret 9. was loved everywhere. the biggest draw outside usa in his era. women literally loved Bret too. Shawn - 7 was not that over outside of usa. not as popular in the usa as Bret. shawn is no where near him, not eve debatable. HEEL Bret - 7 (1997 was amazing for Bret being a heel solid 9 over all to 7, he was better as babyface) Shawn - 10 (He can draw heat) Presentation Bret - 10. amazing music, shades, the jacket he had the look Shawn - 10 same as Bret. PROMOS Bret - 7 his heel work was amazing. 1996 started really getting good. Bret did make it feel real. Shawn - 10 Charisma Bret - 8. Bret carried himself very well. He had the looks, the hair, the body and the attitude. Bret on mic always had the real sound Shawn - 7 he shtick got old quickly look when they out him as baby face ppl rebelled the dancing and stripping (Im gay yet) and it just felt too annoying. Creating Memorable Moment's Bret - 10 He had way better matches with same wrestler shawn faced. Bret owen / Bret Austin/ Bret Diesel / Bret Yoko / Bret Lawler / Bret Mr. Perfect / Bret Taker Shawn - 7 sorry but he had handful of memorable matches in the era they both wrestled in. shawn razer / Shawn Undertaker had one good match (Theyre not close how Stevie is looking at this is beyond me) Out Of The Ring Attitude Bret - 10 was respected. Was real champion. was on more tv shows mad tv, simpsons, lonesome dove etc.. Shawn - 7 The click and vince is about all ppl could handle. playgirl will give him that one. quickly ends there Total: Bret: 91/100. 9 for wrestler HBK: 85/100. 8.5 for wrestler
What Shawn said to Stevie about being a good Christian is one of the shittiest things I think I could have ever imagined a person or even a “Christian” could say.
I actually had a thought on mania 8 and why Hogan flair didn't happen. Hogan making it his final match essentially meant he almost had to go out on a win, if he beats flair and becomes champion the title is then vacated, or else you have to have a heel win in the main title match which wasn't the style at the time. So my thinking is they pivoted to avoid a vacated title situation for the main championship
In terms of in-ring, Bret and Shawn are my favorites of all time. I think if you put a gun to my head I'd pick Bret over Shawn, but I love them equally.
Aight Dr. Stevie. Let's see whatcha got for us today. Ahhhh Ricky Morton... Legend. Ricky could connect with a crowd in such a profound way. You would believe he was just in absolute agony then he'd make that hot tag and the crowd would pop like crazy.
Exclusive content available on Patreon: www.patreon.com/c/stevierichards
Friday is the best day of the week: Dutch in the mornings, and Stevie in the afternoon. Plus, Stevie is my new favorite podcaster! 😍
Undertaker at night 😅
And Maven's video.
Best comment!!!
Gave me a new routine thanks
Dutch is lame. Zero charisma or personality
I was disappointed Stevie’s show was ending but this is a fabulous format to showcase his personality and opinions.
Stevie has such a refreshing take on the business. This show has quickly became one of my favorite podcasts 👏👏👏
He speaks so much sense
I clicked on this expecting to let it play for maybe a handful of minutes but here I am over two hours later having just listened to the entirety of the episode. I regret nothing.
Why would you only listen to 5 minutes of a 2 hour podcast? Wouldnt even get past the ad read.
so glad you guys brought up Bret's selling. Every time I watch a Bret match that's the first thing I notice. He's a master seller and it makes you root for him.
While the other guy sold like a cartoon.
@@ZBR_ProXPjust during that match with Hogan. Which was deserved cuz hogan was and is a POS
@@Hugo_Tate no, he went above and beyond for that one but he always oversold. He even says himself that he always sold like that.
Stevie Richards is a real human being
Quickly turning into one of my favorite wrestling podcasts, glad you two got it going!
I believe in Steve Richards
..and Joe Hendry!!
I mean, he exists, I can see him and watch him actually DO and SAY things.
@@planexshifter ALLEGEDLY. Have you ever seen him except on a screen?
@@mussman717wordI have seen him. I bumped into him at an airport once. After I realized oh shit it’s Big Stevie Cool, I apologized immediately and he angrily shouted at me…I will never forget his words…
“I’LL SHOW YOU! YOU’LL SEE!!”
Here I am sitting on a plane listening to the episode and my theme comes on! Guess I need to appear 👏 👏
Stevie, you were a WONDERFUL example for meeting your heroes. I first met you at an Extreme Rising show in PA (where New Jack breaks his leg and Matt Hardy gets a massive concussion) in '12 (I asked about unbooked Catering and said you needed to do a shoot interview) then again in NOLA for whatever show you worked during WM34 weekend (I asked more about unbooked catering, you also had a Vince McMahon Madden aside that was humorous). Both in an out of the business I've always appreciated the way you carry yourself. Keep up the good work sir!
Stevie, I mean this honestly, you are meant for this format. This is incredible work and one of the best wrestling podcasts out there. Awesome work
I think we need more than 10 categories honestly. Some maybe separate out of where you have them lumped.
1. Look
2. Selling
3. Drawing ability, Marketability, and “Brand ambassador” factor
4. Realism & legitimacy
5. Charisma
6. In-ring work
7. Finisher(s) and signature move(s)
8. Ability to work with everybody, and as babyface or heel
9. Comedy
10. Promos
11. Locker room respect factor
12. Protect their opponents
13. Ability to evolve & adapt over time and on the fly, can they “call an audible” and are they creative
14. Longevity & durability
15. Easy to work with (from an office/booker/agent perspective)
Very true
I got 8:7 in favor of Shawn.
Don't see charisma and promo being separate, but Bret wins this 10-5. Shawn has promos, comedy etc, Bret takes darned near everything else that involves skill
Thank you Stevie for your sharing your personal story with with Shawn. Not only did it prove you were unbiased in your ranking but it's something so many of your audience (if not everyone) can empathize with. Your authenticity is refreshing.
Can you believe we're on episode 5 already? Always so hyped to see this podcast on my feed.
I absolutely loved your analysis channel Stevie but this is so much better. Hearing your different stories from your career & your views & opinions about wrestling & wrestlers is FN’ awesome man. Always been a huge fan. Another great show too.
This podcast makes my fridays at work not so awful , thank you
These episodes are really informative. Love it, awesome job!!
Just tooting some horn here. Want to say thank you for this not-podcast. It's almost like class in a sense, where I'm very interested and eager to learn and listen. I like it, and I hope you fellas don't get discouraged in continuing it. Thank you fellas very much. Even the behind the scenes work, and look forward to your shows.
This is a great template for great wrestling rivalries. More please!!!
Man, this show is awesome. I hope you guys do this forever.
Just wanna say, I love Stevie's original show and have been a fan of his since his ecw days but this show with James is gold. I think they have great chemistry together and they both have a passion for the business that just oozes out into the show. Love them both, keep up the great work guys, I'm a fan of both of you for life. Much respect to the both of you.
Stevie is so likable. This is such an enjoyable show to listen to. Great work from the two of you and thanks for the honesty
Stevie seems like such a genuine, great person. Enjoying the content fellas - great episode.
I’m not good with number ratings so I’ll just name who I think is best in each of the categories.
Technical Wrestling: Bret
Striking: Bret
Putting matches together: Both
Baby face: Bret
Heel: Shawn
Presentation: Shawn
Promos: Shawn
Charisma: Shawn
Creating memorable moments: Shawn
Out of the ring attitude: Bret
Scores:
Bret: 5
Shawn: 6
I prefer Shawn more than Bret slightly because in wrestling I enjoy the larger than life personality and entertainers more than in ring talent and pure wrestlers, and I think Shawn was more entertaining overall and had the complete package. Bret was a better wrestler and more believable as an in ring talent. In conclusion, I don’t think one is completely better than the other, it’s apples and oranges. It depends on what you like from wrestling the most.
I think Brett and Sean is Yin and yang.
I think Bret was an excellent heel.
That Shawn story is like the saddest thing I’ve ever heard. DARKSIDE OF THE RING season 12: Tears of Stevie Richards
That genuinely was really rough to listen to. Like you tell someone they’re your hero and they let you down like that? It’s devastating. You can tell how deeply it affected him, it affected me listening to it. And you just know Bret would never do something like that.
@@rsb8380
Can confirm. We brought Bret to one of our local indies and somehow I was lucky enough to be invited to sit at Bret’s table and I got to tell him how he inspired me to get trained and become a wrestler, to which he smiled, shook my hand and said I’d done a great job that night.
Bret truly is the best there is, was and ever will be.
stevie is a real man for still respecting that POS I loved shawn as a worker but lost respect for him with this story
I suppose but your daddy should have told ya there are no heroes, just people.
your daddy should have told you there are good people and pieces of sht
What a great mind for the business, after hearing Stevie I wanna go back and watch his career with different eyes
I'm a 43 year old from philly who grew up going to the original ecw on a regular basis. So I been a stevie since his baron von stevie days, the bwo, and even his brief WCW stint to right to censor. Needless to say I love this podcast. Offers insight no other wrestling podcast does .
Loved watching you as a kid man I’m glad you’re doing well.
Thank you for sharing your story about Shawn. I could feel the emotion when you delivered it.
I feel like you can do that whiteboard segment for a few more wrestlers without it getting old
Rock vs Austin
Orton vs. Cena
Hogan vs. Flair
@@puertoriconnect4611
sting v taker
Usos vs Harlem heat
@@puertoriconnect4611and Khali vs Heidenreich
Sting vs Warrior
Midnight express vs road warriors
Trump vs McMahon 😂
My two cents on the "too short" is very simple. Being a short wrestler doesn't mean you're bad or unpopular. And being a tall wrestler doesn't mean you're good or popular. i think historically more bad wrestlers have been given an opportunity for being tall, and more good wrestlers have been stripped of opportunities for being short.
At the end of the day, your personality matters the most
Tall guys can be good grapplers, short guys can be good grapplers, but weight classes still exist for a reason.
Cruiserweights shouldnt co mingle with heavyweights if theyre not atleast 190 legit lbs, not pro wrestling lbs
@@UnprofitServant at some point with your two brain cells did you even consider for a second that this is in fact fictional? And the last thing a theatrical program about undead cryptkeepers and custody battles need is some buffoonsih oaf to jump out of the audience and yell "THAT'S NAHT TRUE, HE DIDN'T REALLY HIT HM. THIS IS FAAAAAAKE. A LITTLE GUY CANT BEAT A BIG GUY"
@@UnprofitServant Agree it's obvious and Guerrero wasn't that big a deal when he wont to the rest of the world.
@@UnprofitServant The most skilled fighter will win 9 times out of 10 regardless of size, we've learned this from years of MMA and other combat sports. The best MMA fighter we've ever seen is arguably Demetrious Johnson and almost everybody is taller than him. Dudes fought out of his natural weight class his entire career and still barely has any losses. If size mattered as much as people say it does, Stephan Struve would be the GOAT as he's a legit 7 footer. At best he's a gatekeeper
Full Disclaimer: do not bring up roid monkeys Jones and Lesnar. Fraudsters like that get an asterisk when it comes to skill.
You’re OG Stevie, the show is awesome as always
Keep up the great work, love the podcasts, been watching wrestling since i was little. Born in 74,stevie richards was the pop when ecw rocked the world and by the way your superkick was better . Keep up the great work. ❤
This was really great and you guys rock ‘n’ roll thank you for the post
I love this comparison! Shawn and Bret are my absolute favorites.
It's all just a matter of opinion, I suppose, but I can't agree with Stevie on the babyface category. I always thought Bret was one of the greatest babyface champions ever, giving the glasses to kids etc, while I found Shawn much more convincing as a heel than a face. Stevie seems to be focusing on the promos and charisma, but they have separate categories of their own.
Love the podcast Stevie! Awesome to hear your stories! Loved watching you in the ring back in the day.
Go, Stevie, go!!! ⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️
shouts from the u.k, love this show and format
Great stuff, stevie. Looking forward to episode 6
Love this show! Good episode but what stood out to me the most was when Stevie was talking about his interactions with HBK. I grew up a huge HBK fan. As a little kid I rewatched the 1995 Royal Rumble a million times. HBK was my hero. After hearing what you said about how he treated you, made me a little disappointed and upset. Makes me look at Shawn in a different light. I will never take away from his wrestling and performance ability, but as a person, I’ve lost some respect for him. Stevie Richard’s seems like a real genuine dude and I love listening to him talk about wrestling. I can watch this show all day everyday
Another great show guys. James is complaining about the length of the episodes. How about taping 3-5 10 minute segments on the day of taping then release a new segment every day for fresh content. You can reduce the time of the weekly podcast by doing that. Just a suggestion. Keep up the great work! 🚀
I used to build rings for indy shows with this guy who was really methodical about it. He owned 2-3 rings and each was put together and broken down in the exact same way every time, including the placement of the boards. It was time-consuming but the people who used his rings frequently knew exactly what they were getting every time.
Great episode! thanks so much
I watched the Screw Job match for the first time a few months ago and it is a bummer that what happened overshadowed the match that Bret and Shawn had. I also respect both of them for keeping their professionalism during their matches, they both could've easily decided to hurt each other because of their real life feud.
Shawn couldn't hurt an 8 year old...Bret was a real tuff guy
shawn wouldnt be able to hurt Bret
Totally agree about the CWC. I'd love to see that every year
Fun fact Shawn’s first retirement was actually because he knew he couldn’t compete with the STEVIE KICK
An astoundingly in-depth analysis that expounded upon every conceivable aspect regarding two of the greatest icons within sports entertainment’s unique realm.
When considering each performer’s merits as either a heel or face, it’s important to remember that during his early career, as one half of The Rockers, Michaels was cast exclusively as a “clean cut” golden boy, and his villainous persona never emerged until he “catastrophically” broke up with Marty Jannetty during their infamous Barbershop encounter.
Bret, by contrast, forming part of The Hart Foundation, was involved with numerous angles and feuds both as a heel and face alongside Jim Neidhart, the late 80s and early 90s, perhaps most notably against the British Bulldogs and Demolition, before becoming an established solo force a year or so earlier than Shawn, though on balance, in terms of their respective “physical” characterisation of either role I’d say both were equally effective and believable .
In the category of “ring psychology” I find their individual assets make it impossible to pick a winner. Shawn, perhaps as the superior “pure athlete” and one with extraordinary stamina could pace a match to perfection, used spectacular “single moves” to level the playing field whilst Bret, being from a traditional wrestling background had the larger overall repertoire of manoeuvres, applied them with greater precision and a sharper technique, “grafted” his way back from the brink of defeat, and conveyed a greater sense of drama though his body language depending on the match’s momentum.
As to memorable mic spots or back stage promos, I agree that barely anyone can replicate, let alone surpass Shawn’s ability to work a crowd, or more seamlessly transition between their loveable and detestable personality to suit whatever twists and developments the narrative incorporated.
Bret, as an almost fanatical Patriot, always appeared more concerned that certain storylines would alienate his native fans, to whom both he had his family were and remain veritable royalty, which perhaps suggests there was a bigger distinction between “The Hitman” and Bret’s personal character than was the case for Shawn and “HBK”. Could this mean that Bret was the better “actor”?!
Charisma - couldn’t choose
Presentation - dead level
Professional Conduct - I’ll leave that to the pro…
Uh…What were the other categories? Guess I’ll go back and listen again!
This is an eternal debate because it's not comparing apples to oranges it's comparing steak to lobster. It's The Godfather versus Raiders of the Lost Arc, 12 Angry Men vs Star Wars. If you prefer drama, psychology, realism, you prefer Bret. If you prefer excitement, charisma, entertainment, you prefer Shawn. Neither school of thought is better, both are valid, but, which match do you prefer? The HBK vs Razor WM X ladder match? or Hitman vs Stone Cold "I Quit" from WM 13? Both are groundbreaking, legendary matches that changed wrestling forever FOR THE BETTER< and each underlines what I am saying. Shawn's match vs Razor was thrilling and exhilarating and a demonstration of rousing athletic performance. Bret's match vs Austin was slow, intense, methodical, and you bought in to its sincerity. Shawn vs Bret is a debate that will never die, because it's an impossible question to answer. They're both the best at what they did, but what they did were two different things in the same sport.
I always thought Bret never got enough credit for his promos. During the heyday of 80’s and New Gen he did a standard big wrestler promo, but his promos in the late 90s and especially 97 were on another level.
Been loving this pod..show series! Fucking hated you in RTC when i was a kid 😂 but absolutely love your wisdom as an adult!
Talking about ring dynamics, im curious how the "Lesnar vs Big Show superplex ring collapse" spot worked from a technical standpoint, would love your insight on it some time!
Stevie why don’t you interview Bret ?
Love the show. Love the Bret Shawn conversation but I gotta hard disagree about Shawn’s selling.
He would COMMIT to selling. I remember watching him as a kid he made selling cool.
In his Ironman match with Bret, Shawn hits him with the super kick but he’s so wiped out he can’t get up for the cover. He just lays on the mat, totally exhausted.
In fact, Bret almost gets to his feet before Shawn until he sees Shawn’s still selling. Then Bret stalls a little.
His match with Taker at Badd Blood. Another great example of his selling. Bro had to drag himself over to taker for the cover at the end.
Shawn’s match with Razor SummerSlam 95 is a masterclass on long term selling over the course of a match.
The way he struggles to climb the ladder, the way he’ll just lay on the mat after a big spot, there’s even a point where Razor tries to Irish whip Shawn and Shawn just collapses cause he can’t make it to the ropes.
I highly recommend rewatching that match.
Love the show! Great episode.
So glad you mentioned Shawn's *masterful* selling at the end of Badd Blood '97. It is THE finest piece of exhaustion selling in have EVER seen in Professional Wrestling. He sold it so well it made him look like the luckiest guy on the planet to have beaten The Undertaker. My favourite match of all time, by the way.
@@liquidgeorge
Yoo that’s literally my favorite match of all time too.
We best friends now, dude.
@@puertoriconnect4611 You have impeccable taste in Pro Wrestling.
I disagree. Shawn oversold. He would do a back somersault with his legs straight up in the air. He flopped around like a fish, but then would go from zero to 10. It can be entertaining, but it ruins the immersion at least for me.
I thought it that the Bret Hart and Shawn Michaels comparison was very insightful especially from Stevie Richard's perspective. I also think that the striking comparison between the two men is totally off. HBK is a legend and one of the best wrestlers to ever do it. That said, his striking aside from his punch was "lucha light" meaning luchadores have tendency to strike light/land light because it is a more high flying style than the punch/kick style that was prevalent in the 80's when both guys were coming up in many of the territories through the United States/Canada. Maybe that was because Shawn was trained by a luchador in Jose Lothario versus Stu Hart/Stampede Wrestling in Canada. Bret Hart was also very crisp in everything from his punches, kicks, back breakers, suplexes, Russian leg sweeps, etc. Bret's striking and moves had a snap to them similar to Chris Benoit when they struck or executed a move that other wrestlers did not have with regards to striking.
Stevie is so earnest and unashamedly human it's impossible not to root for him.
Bret > Shawn
Yes, please! A whole episode on rebooking AEW would be really interesting. I know I'd watch. Feel free to take as much time as you need.
One of my favorite Bret Hart promos came from WCW. When he was the US Champ he had a backstage promo with Mean Gene and he said that he was going to be a fighting champion, then he named El Dandy as his next opponent. We all know what he said next.
Love Stevie's presentation. Couldn't agree more on his assessment.
Shawn and Randy would likely have given us some EPIC matches!
love the opening joke! I have a spinal fusion and I can't turn my head lol. you made me laugh good
12:06 you could do an entire episode on the invasion storyline
Never meet your heroes? I met Stevie Richards at a TNA fan interaction the day before Bound for Glory 2009. He couldn’t have been any nicer. He even signed my ECW dvd as Big Stevie Cool despite his gimmick at the time being Dr. Stevie. Abyss and Kurt Angle were also unbelievably nice. Rhino was a dick, and the same can be said 10-Fold for Blubber Ray Dudley.
BTW Stevie did wrestle in the TNA 4-sided ring. He probably doesn’t remember because that’s the same ring he almost got killed in while taking a Styles Clash
The thing with being very small is that it's not the case you're too small, it's the case that you carry yourself like you're just here to have fun, when at the end of the day you should treat this like kayfabe and make like this is totally real for you. People will buy into your intreast if you sell them that intreast, you just got to believe in that by showing it through your body, work and uniqueness.
Reason why Marko Stunt is loved despite looking like a poster child for "too small to take seriously" is because he at least knows his role and allows himself to be utilized to the full degree through it.
Dude, Bret as a face is much better than Shawn as face. Dude took his roles seriously. Hell, dudes like Cornette have said he’d take himself and the business as a whole a bit too seriously. Besides, he carried that company as face for a few years. What, 93-96, 95? Oh well. This is all subjective anyway way. A fun show, and a great segment! Continue the great work, gentlemen
Shawn as a babyface in 1995 was like a rock star, getting babyface reactions that I think surpassed Bret at his most over. Don't get me wrong, Bret was mega over, but if we judge it on which one of them had arenas full of people marking out, chanting his name etc I think that's clearly Shawn. Even moreso if we take his second run into account, where he was basically a babyface for 8 straight years and was super over the whole time.
Bret: baby face 7?? He was the Face of the WWF in the mid 90s!
8.5 easy
I agree with you, but an argument could be made that he didn’t draw very well when he was on top. I’m not saying we should saddle the whole business slump on him by any means, I love Bret. But I can understand a 7-8 score.
bret 9 hbk 7
I would give Bret a 10 and Shawn a 9 for baby-face. Bret in the 90's was amazing. His look and everything was really cool as a kid to look up to. It was really easy to get into the matches and story-lines he was in. He was a hero to a lot of kids not just in Canada but United States for sure until his heel turn. He was also on the Simpsons. My friends and I would look forward to seeing him whenever we got the chance because his matches were so cool. His moves were cool. I think Shawn was also a great baby face but not as much as Bret in my opinion because Bret was more believable and to me came across as more respectful and a harder worker which were ideals that we were supposed to look up to.
Thats what i could believe... absolutely not even close between HBK and Bret in babyfaces
Really enjoyed the show, have to say I strongly disagree on the grading of strikes, Bret had one of the best working punches in wrestling, Shawn’s super kick finish was great, but his punches don’t compare to brets. Hitman is clear in that category for me.
I just went and watched that match between kota and cedric that stevie mentioned. And yah! Its a hell of a match!
good shoutout for Steve Mufuggin Bios. Salute, BSCool and James- Jam Up Guys. Big respect.
you sir are also a Jam up guy!
@@BrighamMike JAM SESH! LMFAO MOST EXCELLENT!
Dope podcast. Thanks much.
Lol, Shawn was a better babyface than Bret? What, with all his dancing and prancing? Cmon dude … Bret would wait hours to sign stuff for his fans, gave kids glasses, told them to stand up for themselves, fought the big baddies that wanted to destroy good, showcased how much of a good brother he was by refusing to fight Owen, gave up single wrestling to team with Owen cause Owen wanted it and bigger brother had to look out for him (remember that storyline?!), spoke about family values and sticking up for eachother, always got the stuffings kicked out of him but kept going until he pulled out a victory from out of nowhere… Bret was a babyface done right!
With Shawn it always looked like an act, despite the charisma. Dude was a legit heel and he had his best moments as a heel.
As a kid I preferred Shawn, for all the flashy stuff and general goofiness. As a man, I see how many leagues ahead Bret was in storytelling, selling, pacing and overall personality.
It's a matter of opinion and they presented some passable arguments for it. Plus, they are coming from the perspective of someone who knew and worked at least half of the main subjects of the video. Sooo, I'm sure that's counts for more than you can account for but wtf do I know
@@FlechFisher If they're talking about their individual perspectives on whom they found better to wrestle, that's something I couldn't argue against. Here, they mention primarily their own understanding of the characters and the roles they played, and the stories they put up, and as a damn fan, and consumer, I can very well state my opinion and be rigth about it. I've been watching the game for the 30 years. I'm not some newbie who doesn't provide a solid arguement. Within this context, the fact that they "worked at least half of the main subjects" has nothing to do with it.
By that measure, let fans never comment, just the wrestlers and ex-wrestlers.
@@kdr3619 oh fans can comment. They should just know their perspective is just that. Of a fan. It's far more subjective than objective whicj is undeniable. Most of them just make memes and crack jokes. Others try to play it up as if they were there. All they should have is self awareness and humility which we both know they very seldomly have. Same goes for most of sports too.
@@FlechFisher you're playing at bollocks mate. You're preaching. "they should know their perspective is just that. of a fan". I reckon many do. I certainly do. Don't exactly need you to remind me. There was nothing in my original comment that signified some grandiose position. Neither did I make a meme nor crack a joke. I called it as I saw it, so I don't know just what in the artificial world you're going on about. But hey, here's giving ya the benefit of the doubt.
@@kdr3619 I hit a nerve stating the obvious. There is indeed proof of arrogance in the very first sentence of the first paragraph. As far as preaching goes you're not a very good example as you don't practice it. The perspective of a fan is just that, mere subjectivity. Just reminding you of that is all. Sure a fan can say a boxer is better than the other for example. But how is a pro meant to take that seriously? Simple as that. Remind yourself of your position before spouting.
You gotta do one of these for Rock vs Austin, Undertaker vs Kane, John Cena vs Randy Orton and John Cena vs CM Punk
Only grade I have difficulty agreeing with is the 5 for Bret's charisma.
Very enjoyable episode!
Your run on Stevie Night Heat was the best 👍
Love Stevie and admire James - thanks to you both for an amazing show.
I can't complain that Shawn won on points on Stevie's rating system, even though Bret's my personal favourite. You could also do this for Hogan and Flair.
Great video. Never realised until that Timelapse that the rings were basically scaffold board with a small mat over it. Stevie, growing up in south Philadelphia and being of Italian descent, did you ever encounter any mafiosi?
Stevie,
I really respect you! I saw you wrestle back in June of 96 at the Quakertown Flea market for the WWWA you went over woth the stevie kick. More importantly I respect the fact that you go out of your way to elevate your friend but also your brothers and sisters in Christ. That Shawn Michaels story made my stumach turn as a christian man myself. I understand that no one is perfect but my goodness can you be anymore of a DB. You and your musician friend deserve all the blessings in the world. We are too let the world know we are Christians by our love not our " Match Quality". Very disappointed in that story
Also, I'd like to see Rey go out against Dom in a "Hair vs. Mask" Match. He's already been unmasked, but its enough at stake that when he loses and takes off the mask and retires. Get Dom heat for cheating to retire his dad, and also lets Rey do the honors for his son.
Stevie is very smart and knowledgeable. Loving the podcast.
We should make the show getting longer every week part of the bit/gimmick 😂
I enjoy this. Stevie’s insight is interesting and captivating
you should do steve austin vs the rock or sting vs ric flair next ... love the idea of this ep
I’d shake Steve’s hand if I ever ran into him. Quite frankly, him and Maven are probably the only pro wrestlers I would approach in public. I see the Undertaker on a regular basis (I do business around where he lives) and I don’t even bother trying to interact with him at all. He definitely comes off as unapproachable, I even have subbed to his 6ft under podcast since sub 10k members; and there is no way that I would think it’s a good idea to tell him he’s been a hero of mine that I’ve admired since childhood.
Steve, you and Maven are far more important to the business than you would think. I appreciate you.
When Raven talked to Shawn about how he ran the ropes later in the matches, Shawn replied to Raven that he did it intentionally to show the boys in the back that he wasn’t blown up…
Shawn knew better… he just didn’t really care. I think he was better about selling being tired later on in his career when his ego wasn’t as inflated…
Watch Shawn’s match in 95 against Razor at SummerSlam. Absolute masterclass in long term selling and proves Shawn was one of the best at it.
Same thing with his match with Taker Badd Blood 97. Shawn was one of the best of all time with tired selling. He’d literally pull himself up using the ropes like he was so beat up he couldn’t stand on his own 2 feet anymore.
You don’t see a lot of guys do that
Once you tell a narcissist that you look up to them or hold them in any high regard they'll begin to treat you like garbage and resent the heck out of you. They have a inner bad object and so they always will think of themselves as a totally worthless piece of crap. That's why they created the awesome false self that they're experiencing life through. When you tell them something like that, the narcissist hears that you think a piece of crap is totally awesome. It makes you even lower than they are in their mind. It's a license for them to display their greatness by submarining you to extract Supply.
Stevie, I think your brave man, and your back gets better soon God bless.
Shawn is better. More dynamic, much much better promo.
Bret: 91/100. 9 for wrestler
HBK: 85/100. 8.5 for wrestler
Technical
Bret 10 / Shawn 7
Striking
Bret - 10(His looked very real and kicks) / Shawn 7 (his kicks were good his punches where meeeh)
Putting matches together
Bret 10 / Shawn 10
BabyFace
Bret 9. was loved everywhere. the biggest draw outside usa in his era. women literally loved Bret too.
Shawn - 7 was not that over outside of usa. not as popular in the usa as Bret. shawn is no where near him, not eve debatable.
HEEL
Bret - 7 (1997 was amazing for Bret being a heel solid 9 over all to 7, he was better as babyface)
Shawn - 10 (He can draw heat)
Presentation
Bret - 10. amazing music, shades, the jacket he had the look
Shawn - 10 same as Bret.
PROMOS
Bret - 7 his heel work was amazing. 1996 started really getting good. Bret did make it feel real.
Shawn - 10
Charisma
Bret - 8. Bret carried himself very well. He had the looks, the hair, the body and the attitude. Bret on mic always had the real sound
Shawn - 7 he shtick got old quickly look when they out him as baby face ppl rebelled the dancing and stripping (Im gay yet) and it just felt too annoying.
Creating Memorable Moment's
Bret - 10 He had way better matches with same wrestler shawn faced.
Bret owen / Bret Austin/ Bret Diesel / Bret Yoko / Bret Lawler / Bret Mr. Perfect / Bret Taker
Shawn - 7 sorry but he had handful of memorable matches in the era they both wrestled in.
shawn razer / Shawn Undertaker had one good match
(Theyre not close how Stevie is looking at this is beyond me)
Out Of The Ring Attitude
Bret - 10 was respected. Was real champion. was on more tv shows mad tv, simpsons, lonesome dove etc..
Shawn - 7 The click and vince is about all ppl could handle. playgirl will give him that one. quickly ends there
Total:
Bret: 91/100. 9 for wrestler
HBK: 85/100. 8.5 for wrestler
Bah gawd it's so damn easy to listen/watch these guys. They're like the Arnold Palmer of wrestling youtube, just smooth sippin'
What Shawn said to Stevie about being a good Christian is one of the shittiest things I think I could have ever imagined a person or even a “Christian” could say.
I actually had a thought on mania 8 and why Hogan flair didn't happen. Hogan making it his final match essentially meant he almost had to go out on a win, if he beats flair and becomes champion the title is then vacated, or else you have to have a heel win in the main title match which wasn't the style at the time. So my thinking is they pivoted to avoid a vacated title situation for the main championship
In terms of in-ring, Bret and Shawn are my favorites of all time. I think if you put a gun to my head I'd pick Bret over Shawn, but I love them equally.
I checked out your books, as you requested, James. I might even buy them. You said you would be more than appreciative. What does that entail?
I see Bret Hart - I click - I like
this is a great show two smart guys talking wrestling
Aight Dr. Stevie. Let's see whatcha got for us today.
Ahhhh Ricky Morton... Legend. Ricky could connect with a crowd in such a profound way. You would believe he was just in absolute agony then he'd make that hot tag and the crowd would pop like crazy.
to everyone complaining about the co host, just be thankful he's not Conrad Thompson
I think Conrad is fine, Brian Last and Sean Oliver are pretty insufferable to me. This James fella is pretty good in my book.
Michaels was and will always remain a jerk, ‘Christian’ or not