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Why Boeing Bought 17 Airbus A340s From Singapore Airlines
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 31 ส.ค. 2020
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Remember that time that Boeing bought 17 Airbus A340 jets? Yes - it actually happened! Taking place over 20 years ago, this interesting piece of aviation history may not be common knowledge to everyone. Let’s rediscover the story and how it all happened…
Article link: simpleflying.c...
Video source links:
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A350-900 Vietnam SkyteamLivery • 【4K】『SKYTEAM 特別塗装機』ベトナ...
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A340 Virgin Atlantic • Virgin Atlantic Airway...
Photos:
David Calhoun photo - Boeing
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Highest rated VPN, where did you get that from, PureVPN maybe?. On google play its rated 3.7☆. most VPNs have a rating over 4.5☆
If only you’d mentioned it at some point in the videp
@Osel Somar you do realise that channels also have to make money, right?
Airbus could’ve used this to their advantage by saying “ A340 is soo good even our competitors want it”
Or steal the a340's systems
I was going to like but there’s already 69 likes
And boeing would probably respond with “We like it for it’s scrap value.”
And anyone with good logic and reasoning skills would just laugh at that statement
@@waynelee8327 logic and reasoning is a hard thing to come by now
So basically...
Boeing: Go twinjets!
Airbus: Go quadjets!
McDonnell Douglas: What about trijets?
Edit:
Antonov: Have you tried six?
Trijet can go fly a kite. LOL. Jkjk.
Planes like the 777, 737, A320 and A350 are all trijets. Haters gonna try and prove me wrong
@@davesmith5949 lol, apu?
Levi Zevaka don’t get me wrong but wasn’t the a340 also partially made when etops rules were restricting twin engined aircraft?
Niccolo Machiavelli Since the plane came after the A300, I think this was after they changed the rules
The A340 is simply a beautiful aircraft.
Agreed - just not beautiful to the CFO's of airlines...
Yes but it is a nighmare for ATCs here at JFK
Indeed, especially the A346! Too bad we don't see many of them anymore. Mostly we see the A343, which is also a nice plane, but by far not as elegant and beautiful as the -600!
@@bibinb.8688 why is that ?
@@morry19965 The very bad rates of climb were on the first versions. As anyone will tell you a twin climbs better than a quad.(engine out performance,. , etc..)
Problem was that controllers were getting used to twins on long range and expected the same performance or better for the 340, it was not and by far .
But still far better than a DC8 or a 707
The A340 is a gorgeous aircraft. It’s a shame they weren’t more popular...
A350 capacity and A380 fuel efficiency
Incredible kerosene guzzlers they were.
THAI ended up losing money on every single non-stop flight to New York because of it before sanity prevailed and the route was ended.
The only reason the A340 has any climb rate is because the earth is curved.
They were hopeless. Four engines to propel and two engine plane.
Sitting in economy near the rear it was way too narrow.
Pretty aircraft. Poor economics.
With Boeing ( the great American know how) because of their arrogance related problems, Air Bus just might become more popular. And right now for some strange reason, l think l trust Air Bus more than what l do Boeing. And before coming up with insane ideas for new planes, they should be forced to rectify problems they already have, and right now because of a pendemic, it's the perfect time, that's if the FAA has any guts, unless of course they're being paid off.
Wow that's incredible! But it was actually quite successful as SQ placed further orders of B777 including -300ER
2 engines 2 make money 😂😂🤣🤣
Especially the A350
4 engines 4 sell
Double decker 4 deep discount....
This is no different to a GM dealer buying your Ford so you can buy a GM from them.
There is a difference when there is a duopoly like in the commercial aircraft industry
Or Gamestop buying your Xbox so you can buy a Playstation.
not ry not really. Is that what your name stands for? Besides, they could always buy an Ilyushin. 😂
@@Ayrshore indeed they could've :)
@@CactusBravo42 No It's Sony buying your XBox if you buy a Playstation.
This is like the time 767 landed in a Airbus manufacture plant
lmao im dead
When was this. Or when a Saudia 330 landed in Israel and a Delta 767 landed in Tehran.
@@indranilchakrabarty4196 A Northwest Airlines DC 10 once landed in Iran in 2005.
@@Canleaf08 Yes, of course. NW DC10 not Delta 767. Not sure. Or when a jal dc8 landed at an airstrip in.mumbai in the 60s and a pan am 707 in a small.town in India
@@Canleaf08 k we get yalls point here
I remembered this was telecast on our local news. At that time, SQ was trying to connect to wider routes thus a340 was heavily used. A340 was a test for SQ for its credibility and soon after SQ purchased its a340-500. During that time, it was phenomenal to be able to travel that long. Airbus was never salty about the SQ decision. In fact, SQ was their first customer for the A380 and A350ULR programme.
Skip to 0:59 cause there's a long ass intro about VPN
Hubalahu ye
Thanks these intros take about 1/3 of the video
Why not support them instead 🤷♂️
sponsor block addon available for firefox if anyone is interested
@@birdburb8766 I already pay for TH-cam Premium. I can't be bothered to listen to ads.
One thing is missing: Singapore Airlines originally ordered MD-11s. But when the first MD-11s had such bad performance problems (Swissair couldnt even fly them from Hong Kong to Zürich fully loaded!) SQ canceled that whole order and ordered the A340 instead.
When the A340s came online and were delivered to SQ they found out that also the A340s were not meeting their performance targets/promises. This is why SQ was looking at the 777 then, the aircraft SQ would be very happy with, but it was a long way!
Some of these ex Singapore Airlines A340s were sitting here in Hamburg for years, until they were then delivered to Emirates at some point.
Yeah, there is often some more meat to a story like this.
Thanks for completing the story, I was wonder what Boeing did with the 340's
@@MannySilva five of them went to Emirates, three to Cathay Pacific, three to Gulf Air, three to Khalifa Airways, one to China Airlines and two went to private owners. So all of them found a new home. Some of them are stored, some are already scrapped but also some of them are still operating.
if only MD got the MD-11 right in the first place, it could still be flying passengers today.
@@PlymouthNeon maybe a few years longer but not by much, the 777 was just so much better and MDD not existant anymore. But if MDD continued to exist I am sure that today there would still be passenger MD11s.
Airbus: 4 engines safer than 2
Also Airbus: we made a330s at the same time
Very odd decision
Oldaan If I remember correctly a Simple Flying video, said Airbus originally did not have ETOPS rating for the A330 due to the A330 being able to handle flights such as, Miami to New York then, New York to LA. Airlines then asked “Why no ETOPS rating for the A330?” So the Airbus A330 has a ETOPS rating.
4 engines are safer.
And Airbus pioneered wide body twin engine travel with the A300.....
@@mikepetitti That’s why it’s odd Airbus did A340 as 4 engines on a single decked plane makes no sense with how powerful engines are. It made sense with the 747 (the *first ever widebody* ) because of its size and the earlier narrowbody jets because of the lack of engine thrust but also safety unlike now
Interesting, I would love to know what Boeing did to the A340s, did it resell them or scrap them?
Incidentally, the 777 is the twinjet that sold me personally on the use of twinjets for transcontinental flights.
@Zayd M Aviation I would guess that it was probably for parts rather than just the raw scrap value of the aluminum, steel and other materials
Zayd M Aviation No doubt it would have been better if the A340s had had a second life with another airline. However, it probably would have been a real pain in the posterior for Boeing to offload 17 A340s, especially to multiple buyer. Was likely just simpler and easier to sell them to a parts dealer and be done with it. That would be my hypothesis
Brock and Effie - that’s incorrect. Boeing has an aircraft holding and leasing division and leased/sold them to airlines. They went on to fly with loads of airlines including Cathay pacific, emirates, aerolineas argentinas, etc. SF did a follow up article to this, so there might be a follow up video :)
Brock and Effie they could’ve sold them?
A quick search on planespotters.net shows that SQ originally had 17 A340-300Es. Three were sold/ leased (?) to CX, and one to GF. Thirteen were then sold to Boeing. Of the 13, eight ended up with EK. The others were leased to other carriers.
Spotted the A340 at the airport and thanks to this channel I was able to identify it from quite some distance. Such a marvel of an aircraft as we drove past in the shuttle bus
I certainly didn't know about it until this video.
Thank you for telling
I didn't know this
“4 engines are safer”
Boeing: “so we have this not so insignificant plane for sale called a 747-400”
You should have made more of the personnel links between GE and Boeing. They move CEOs between each other like a game of chess. And of course GE would make negative remarks about Airbus as it no longer directly supplied engines to the manufacturer. And why? Because GE did a deal with Boeing to fund the 'Production Engineering' of the 777X in return for sole engine supply and use of GE Leasing for sales. So Airbus gave sole supply to RR for the A330neo and A350. RR already had 60% of A380 sales.
i know it costs more but quads do feel safer ......
Why? Twin engine jets are more than capable of flying on one engine and if a situation happens that shuts down both engines odds are it would shut down the quad jet aswell
@@kevcom000 just more redundancy
Well, such a wasted opportunity to tell whole story.... like why Boeing did it? Thats more interesting than other stuff u stuffed 4 minutes of this video...
I think it is a long term benefits to Boeing.
First, when buy Airbus from Singapore mean Boeing cut off some of the major business line between Singapore and Airbus.
Second, Singapore give up Airbus for Boeing, a kind of advertising.
Third, Boeing buying Airbus have to come out $ but sell Boeing to Singapore just balance up.
The following support, spare parts etc is a long going businesses to Boeing.
What did Boeing do with the A340s?
Not sure from rumors I heard Boeing put it in their leasing company they own. Not sure what happened afterwards if that rumor is true.
Probably peed all over them and burned them
It DESTROYED them
Exactly what I wondered too
simpleflying.com/boeing-singapore-airlines-airbus-a340-fate/ - TB
A lot earlier Boeing once bought three brandnew A310 from Kuwait Airways - who made a part payment for new 767-200ERs with these airplanes - which were then sold to Pan Am in 1985 by Boeing, these would be the last aircraft Boeing would ever sell to Pan Am. They became N805/806/807PA.
4 engines are indeed not a smart move - Airbus invented the twin engine airplane and then lost focus with the 340.
And the A380
@Fred Fernackerpan these 2 are my favorite planes too
The 17xA340s SIA order was a blow to Boeing . Boeing never admit it . With their money power , they could have done whatever they wanted to do to promote their 777s
They maybe trying to study the technology behind that sophisticated aircraft
Think one would do.
Airbus: "4 engines are better."
Boeing: "2 engines are better."
Me: "Bring back trijets!"
MD-11 and DC-10 be like
How bout...no.
Lockheed L1011. Way, way ahead of its time.
Why Boeing bought the Airbus planes: To have safe planes for the group to get around.
Boeing bought 17 A340s because they needed 68 hair dryers. Duh.
I flew in both B777 and A340 of Singapore Airlines on routes PER-SIN, SIN-CGK, CGK-SIN, SIN-PER lots of times back in 2003-2007 .... Still prefer A340 over B777. Somehow I found A340 quieter and more comfortable than B777
2 engines needs to be near to the fuselage due to stability of the plane. since the 777 had the biggest engines available. i heard many times it was very loud inside.
I have read about this deal before sumewhere so it was not new for me. But this was a nice recap.
Thanks for the feedback! - TB
I also remember the latest one the bombardier vs boeing
This Boeing-Singapore Airlines deal was mentioned briefly on Long Haul by Simple Flying's video about the rise and fall of the A340. So yes, I've technically heard about this before hahaha
They even posted a long article about it on their app
And also told what happened to those a340s next
I never knew that. Thanks for bring it to light.
Yes I lived this story. Thanks God they kept purchasing the A340-500s .
The Boeing sales team outmaneuvered the Airbus sales team. Airbus tactic backfired.
How to sell your product ? Buy your competitors' ones !
😂😂😂
Singapore was smart. The A340 was out of date when the 777 was introduced.
Four hair dryers never cut it... Even Lufthansa put away their A340-600s and slowly start to do the same with the -300...
I went on a Lufthansa A340 and its so long that the bathroom needs stairs that go down to its own room
Abhishal Kochhal lol airbus
@@perfectman3077 but a340 looks cool with 4 engines
I remember this. At the time -even though from a business standpoint understandable- it was unheard of!
I always thought the “4 engines 4 long haul” was a result of the Virgin / BA feud
@Simple Flying... did Boeing part these 17 A340's aircraft out?
Yeah I'm very curious about that.
What happened to those a340s
I knew about this deal but what happened with those 17 a340's? Did Boeing sold these aircraft to another operator? Military operator?
Keep an eye on our channel for part 2 ;) - TB
What happen to the A340's that Boeing bought?
Good question! Boeing couldn't have just thrown them out. Maybe they were sold to another customer? Or Boeing used them to reverse engineer XD
simpleflying.com/boeing-singapore-airlines-airbus-a340-fate/ - TB
@@hueyrosayaga Reverse engineer to know how to use 20 miles to take off 🤣🤣🤣
Thanks for the information on the date of these aircraft. I was under the impression that most of them went to emirates to fill Emirates need for rapid expansion while waiting for the 777-300ER deliveries...
The follow-up video came out today :) th-cam.com/video/WoOZyZ1XteI/w-d-xo.html
Finally! Thanks! I was already aware about this but I coudnt know why!
Isn't this sorta like when Airbus was trying to get into the American market and basically gave away planes to US carriers?
Airbus: 20 years later, ashame how boeing jets keep crashing
I didn’t now this and I’m a pilot and aviation buff! Good informational video
Thanks for the feedback! - JS
The way you say John Leahy’s surname (my surname) fills me with happiness
I think that airbus saying that 4 engines is safer than 2 is extremely hypocritical considering airbus was formed to make a large plane that had 2 engines for the sake of efficiency. You'll never see this type of hypocrisy with soviet aircraft marketing!
So what became of the 17 airbus aircraft? And why didn’t Airbus put out an advert simply with a message to Boeing saying; if you like our planes so much we can sell them directly to you.
Didn't airbus did the same by buying the super guppy? (Which was a modified version of the stratocruiser)
@@Cartoonman154 oh yeah, I forgot about that
Yes, but they bought them because at the time they were the only large transport on the market. Boeing jumped right on it by campaigning that “every airbus is delivered on the wings of a boeing”
@@makomadns4 lol
Never heard of it before. So what happen to the A340s in the deal?
th-cam.com/video/WoOZyZ1XteI/w-d-xo.html
@@chrislohphotography I just watched it.
Fascinating, I never knew Boeing owned so many Airbus? Airbusses?
Airbusi? Airbusen?
@Simple Flying
Correct me if I am wrong. I have also downloaded your app and I think you guys posted an Article a out this purchase too right?
I read it over there. I know they purchased it so Singapore Airlines have to buy 777s.
I am commenting without even having the video watched.
That's correct. - TB
Long story short: when allowed for trans ocean flights 2 engines won the battle from 4 engines
When I first entered the aviation field, I didn't even know the A340 exists like back in 2015. It's a real shame, a beautiful aircraft like the A340 wasn't popular. Never seen an A340 in India in real life man.
Didn't know that!!
What a great story!
Calhoun is pronounced Cal-Hoon btw, amazing vid either way
Thanks for the feedback! - TB
Vehemently is pronounced vehemently.
I’m not sure how helpful your comment is lol
Singapore Airlines later purchased 5 A340-500s for SIN-LAX/EWR.
I came across this same news either on a different TH-cam channel or on a TV documentary. Can't remember exactly. Now, this video. Why such old news ???
It is more of a historical piece than a news piece. - TB
Boeing probably bought them so they could see how the upstarts from Europe could possibly design and build such a stunning looking aircraft that being the 340-600 surely one of the most fantastic looking passenger aircraft of all time
i didnt knew this deal until now
as soon one engine of a twinjet plane fails there is a red alert, uncertainty phase, captain: "SOS, SOS, Mayday, Mayday, we immediately need an emergency landing at the next airport". When one engine from a plane with four engines fails you never hear of this incident.
Thanks for putting this from print to video . Appreciate it .
The Boeing triple seven ruined all quadjets party
Boeing now : Hi, Airbus ? We have some 737 max on sale, I will give you best price, sounds fair enough?
_Grabs Popcorn_
Airbus have always been more technologically advanced than Boeing. If its Boeing I ain't going
As a retired pilot, i can affirm that aircraft are not purchased by pilots but by accountants; the 777 is much more economical than the a340. That said, i still prefer the 777 to the A340.
So did Boeing pawn them off to someone else or write them off? I think it unlikely Boeing would want another customer to start using a competitors product. Although personally, while flying over an ocean, I would feel a lot safer with four engines, no matter HOW "reliable" the 777 is supposed to be.
The time when Boeng could think outside the square.
I WAS JUST LOOKING FOR A GOOD VPN. Thanks for the recommendation
I was amazed and I don't know this deal before this video.Cheers team.Liked it much
I have met a guy who was an Airbus instructor working for Boeing, because of this deal....
Propellers rule!
the obvious question - what did Boeing then do with 17 A340s ?
would seem an expensive option to scrap them. Were they onsold to another airline or leasing company?
Keep an eye on our channel for part 2 ;) - TB
but what did Boeing do with the A340s? Did they scrap them or flick them off?
Interesting information. Thank you
Great vid, btw...keep up the good work
Thanks for the feedback. - TB
Airbus should have seen the writing on the wall that big twin jets were the economical future for airlines. They went ahead with the A380 anyway and look where that program ended up.
Is this VPN available in Pakistan?
The question remaining is what happened to those A340s? Did Boeing strip down one to bare chassis and study their build quality? Possible...
And In your app you also told what happened to those A340s @Simple Flying
I love ur app
Thanks for the feedback! - TB
@@SimpleFlyingNews many times u guys said "-TB"
What does that mean??
@@zulfiqaralikhurrum6911 yeah, I really wonder about that, it maybe their members?
Yes, heard about it back in the day
In its hey day, SQ was the EK of SE Asia. Aircraft manufacturers were tripping over themselves trying to get business from SQ. There was a time when SQ could not decide between the 757 and A310, and decided to purchase BOTH to try them out. The latter won eventually as 757 never numbered beyond 4 with the airline. Ah the good old days.
Well this Story is now several years ago but many things have changed since then, Sir Richard Branson of Virgin was a great believer in a Quad Engined Airliner for long haul services but has now changed to the ' Big Twin Purchasing both The Airbus A-350 1000 & The Boeing 787 to save on fuel costs, and I expect Purchasing cost 4 Engines against Two. The Modern Big Fan Bypass Jet Engine is now so reliable that Engine Failure in flight is almost unknown. Airbus Pioneered the Big Twin with its A.300, The very
First Big Twin, soon to be copied by Boeing
with its 757 & 767 and then the Big 777 Airliners.
Airbus has missed the market for wide bodies for a long time.
The 350 finally gives them a marketable design.
I'd like to say that this happens all the time in other industries. Microsoft obviously has a bunch of macs a an example. It's not a violation of fair trade.
Quadjets are safer in an event of engine failure however twinjets has to be certificated ETOPS ( Extended range Twin Engine Operation ) or EDTO ( Extended Diversion Time Operation ) to perform long haul flights. Twinjets are more efficient when it comes to fuel consumption than quadjets.
twins are just as safe as quads
just skip to 0:59 to save your time
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Airbus' marketing about "Four engines were safer" just scratches the surface as to why Airbus went to four engines on the 340.
At least Boeing had 17 reliable planes for once...
The 777 is reliable despite what you think
I'll still choose a quad jet over a twin any given day,just as the Australia 🇦🇺 to argentina 🇦🇷 Southern transpolar route that flies close to the south pole they uses an a340 or 747 commonly over the a330,a350 or triple 777s weekly
bro all the 747s flying are freighters at this point
I haven't watched the video, but I guess Boeing did it to reverse engineer and find out "how the heck did Airbus make a twin (a330) take a normal length of runway to take off, but takes forever for this quad to do the same thing?"
To find out how to build a safe aircraft?
This is exactly the same as the principle behind trading-in your car. Sounds fair to me. Airbus made all that noise because Boeing beat them in that round. Hey Airbus, win some, lose some.
More information about what Boeing actually did with the A340s would have been good. Were they scrapped? Did they part them out, or on-sell them?
Hey, could you create a timeline of what planes was 'in' for (short-, medium and log houl) and which planes was able to cross the atlantic?
So we have a feel for what planes fought at what times and what was the 'new tech' at time x
Is it possible for a one engine aircraft?
So the unanswered question what happened to these 17 A 340's . What did Boeing do with them?