I got into this hobby about six years ago. Since I got started, I have had six machines given to me with "locked up" engines. One had a starter gear jammed in the flywheel. One had been locked up by a flywheel failure. Two needed valve adjustments, and one push mower had so much grass buildup under the deck that it was preventing the blade from turning. Thus far, I have only encountered one machine with a bad engine, and I already had an identical good engine to replace it with. Engines do not go out as much as people think they do.
I've got one where the engine 'seemed' to be seized. I have since turned the engine the same way you did, minus the drill. I will attempt the drill to see if I can free it, so to speak. I have another mower that looks like it needs the bearings on the ball control plate replaced. Opened it up and the bearings were not being held, essentially flew out of the race.
It almost looked like the piston was locking on the valves at first. I grew up in my grandfather's lawn mower shop but I think he would have starved in our modern throw-away culture.
That’s what I was thinking as well but probably failed to mention it when I put it to TDC and eyeballed valve clearance. It really is unfortunate how much good stuff gets thrown out, but I kinda understand with the cost of small engine shop labor. I think in my area it’s 60 just to walk in the door not including parts if it’s anything other than a tuneup.
@@BackyardRepairs My grandfather would have charged $5 to look at it. My mom was horrified that he never raised his prices. It made for a good video. Thanks!
The clutch handle means it has the hydrostatic transmission- I finally topped mine off and air-bled it since Honda's factory was capable of doing it properly, after two years of use and ownership and it rips now! So fast!
That's what I was thinking I guess the f 9:43 igurev got nothing to lose it thrown away already I would this s aved for Parts How many Mowers does some one need
Nice score. I bought one new for $850 around 7 seasons ago. Well worth the money. There are some on Amazon right now for $1400, and they're "refurbished". (Doesn't mean anyone's going to pay that...). Those hydro transmissions are now selling for over $400, up from $240 or so prepandemic. I found a basketcase 217HYA a few years back -- owner hit a stump, and ruined the block somehow trying to fix the bent crank. $25. I already had a good-running GCV160, so I put it on last week, going through the same steps you just did. Not identical! Slightly different engine mount bolt pattern. Throttle linkage looks different -- might need some alterations. Fun spring project for a retiree like me.
Thanks! I still am somewhat amazed at the situation with this mower, I'll never know what the PO was thinking when they tore it down though. Sounds like you got quite the score there especially with the spare engine to swap in. Thanks for sharing!
Congratulations on that find, and you did an amazing job winging it together. I know just how hard it can be when you don't take it apart yourself. I have a similar find. I saw a post for a mower with the head off and a string trimmer for $150. I kept seeing the post, and he kept going down in price. I offered for $50 as I knew, the trimmer was more than worth it. I sold the trimmer for $115. When I looked at the mower, it was so simple. He bought a all in one kit. 10 air filters and a spark plug witch he included. The kit was for a Honda, and this was a Briggs & Stratton quantum. So it was the longer spark plug hitting the piston. $7 head gasket and a perfect push bagger a d I had already doubled my money.
Thanks! and that's a great flip. It might just be my area, but I'd be hard pressed to get over 100 for a used trimmer unless it's a higher end brand. It's probably pretty obvious when start laughing in these videos that I'm always so surprised how the simplest of things get people to throw in the towel.
@BackyardRepairs yes, it is just crazy how quick people are to just throw out perfectly good stuff. I go to our town's transfer station most days. There is a free area called Tiffany's. I just got a Ryobi string trimmer with great compression and so much more. The one I sold was an Echo string trimmer. I also had the back story on it. As it was 7 years old and was only used for the first 2 years. Then he moved into an apartment with lawn maintenance included. I didn't even have to do carb work.
Thanks! I've mowed with this since the video and found that I really like the blade clutch system despite telling myself in the past that I don't need that feature on a mower. Really convenient when stopping to open and move through fence gates
@@jackhuddleston6830 That is true. I guess I'm just used to weed wacking a good 12" away from the fence line to keep the mower handle out of it and keep me sane lol.
I watch videos like this at 1.5 times the normal speed playback. You can still understand what's going on, but it goes quicker and you don't lose much. Try it and see.
I have the same mower and was struggling with a non-start condition since the end of last season. I thought it might be the auto-choke because I ran into that a few years back and the symptoms were the same. Ordered replacement parts for the choke, and finally got around to trying to install them today. Still wouldn't start - I tried everything I could think of but I was exhausted from trying to pull start it over and over. Finally caved and pulled the recoil starter off and used a drill to crank it. I finally got it started but it was smoking like crazy. I shut it off because an amazon driver pulled in and I didn't want to smoke him out. Started again and it ran better - no more smoke. Put recoil back on, got it started, thinking I was going to mow, but as soon as I engage the blade, it bogs down and stalls. Even backfired on a few tries. I'm stumped on this one. I figure the hard starting is fuel related, but not sure why it would stall when the blade is engaged.
Hey, based on your description there are three things I’d check next if you know you have good fuel, no carb issues (including correct gasket orientations), and spark.. 1- compression check 2- correct valve lash adjustment and 3- that the flywheel key isn’t sheared. The excessive smoking when you did get it running lead me to question the piston ring or cylinder health which could lead to low compression and the engine not being able to take the load from the blade clutch and stalling out. A bad valve adjustment and/or sheared flywheel key can both contribute to any combination of hard starting, loss of compression, and backfiring. Hopefully that helps!
@@BackyardRepairs Thanks. I need to get a compression gauge to check that. The weird thing is that the smoking only happened after I initially “drill-started” it (this was bluish smoke which was concerning since it was likely burning oil). Once I shut it off and restarted it ran reasonably well - no smoke until I tried to engage the blade (then smoke was black and I got the backfires).
Circling back to this…I ended up taking the carb apart and cleaning it as best I could. That got it running again. Still not running great, but it works. (It tends to surge when not under load but runs better when loaded.)
That's great! It does sound like it needs another cleaning with special attention on the idle circuit passage or a gasket integrity check. Sometimes that surge will clear itself out after several uses with fresh gas though too. There are a lot of videos out there on it, but I did do a video specifically on the Honda GCV160 carb that shows what to remove and where to spray to clear the idle circuit (if you're feeling like another cleaning is in order).
@@BackyardRepairs When I got it taken apart, I realized that my can of carb cleaner was nearly empty so that prevented me from doing as good a job as I wanted! I will get a new can one of these days and tackle it again.
Cool find and video. I would've at least cleaned that carb knowing people use ethanol and was probably the culprit of it not starting. It doesn't explain why they thought it was seized up. But good video.
Good video, I have that model too. Looks like maybe the whole clutch may come off together if you loosened rose bolts on the bracket holding it to the block and slide the whole thing off the shaft together?
Sorry being late on this one, but great job on your initial educated guess fits! Where do you find the torque call-outs? TH-camr's are always saying "I can get the torque settings later" or "F it" lol. Problem is I can only find blade torques in the manual and nothing in the engine manual. Some tuber's are even saying there's a torque call-out for every bolt and nut. What's your take? BTW, I just got this model (w/ electric start) from my local mower shop in their so called "bone yard" area for $25! Everything's there and it turns over (no oil though). Can't wait to dissect it as soon as I get done rebuilding a hrm215 I got for $4! 😃😃 I'm wondering if they were going to attempt to part it out but later figured, screw it...?
Thanks! I can say via career experience that there is a max torque based on fastener capability, and then an assembly torque based on fastener application for pretty much any product out there. I've found that type of information is not available to people like us and is typically only available in the factory manufacturing/assembly process. So in most cases I can't find the mower-body assembly torques and will usually assemble it tightened "well" by hand, then try to find a torque for things I think are safety-critical after the fact. The engine-specific torques are typically in the engine shop manual that authorized dealers have and use, which has way more information than the basic use/care engine owner's manual they send with the mower. I think those who say they have the torque either invested in getting the right manufacturer documentation and looked it up, or are looking up the max torque via a general torque-tension chart using the fastener's size/type/grade. The risky part about the max torque route is those values do not take into account the application (i.e. steel bolt into plastic or aluminum threads requires lower torque than steel bolt into steel nut, etc) Great score on the $4 HRM215! What a random sale number lol
@@BackyardRepairs yeah, I just realized “the shop manual” ($40). I see why these mechanics forgo it 😆. Thank you on your follow up! The hrm is running. Just needed emulsifier/pilot jet cleaned (bowl was pristine surprisingly) and oil added. Now learning linkage for proper RPM setting. Just got a tachometer also
I've actually got a video coming up next week where this exact situation happens. But I usually draw the line (on engines specifically) for three situations.. if there's an internal catastrophic failure that would cost more in parts than what the machine would be worth, the failure took out the block/cylinder wall that's physically not fixable, or the parts are not available to fix it. Most small engines are rebuildable depending on the damage and parts availability, but it depends on how much time you want to invest in it based on the machine.
Backyard Repairs, you did a great job putting this beast back together, for someone with some but not Honda-dealer-mechanic experience. As an HRX217 (that STILL will not start) mower owner, this was hard to watch, because I've been through every temporary misstep you made here. Get one gasket, spring, bolt, etc. in the wrong order or place, and it will NOT start. One area you only touched on: the auto-choke on these engines is a HUGE general issue for Honda mower owners. Just check out other TH-cam videos and owner comments; it wasn't your issue, but believe me, it's many others' issue. I suspect that what derailed the previous owner of your Honda mower is the #1 problem of non-starting lawnmowers generally (see Chickanic's TH-cam videos): over-wintered, waterlogged, ethanol unleaded gasoline. In addition to my Honda, I also have a circa-2000 TroyBilt, basic Briggs & Stratton engine push mower that is lighter (=doesn't need self-propelled), more reliable, and way less complicated to maintain or service , compared to my Honda HRX217. Bleep you Consumer Reports for going all-in on the Honda. Give me the simpler circa-2000 Troy-Bilt.
Thanks! And I’m inclined to agree after using this one most of the spring. Very good build quality and overall mower, but it does leave grass clumping when mulching tall stuff that cheaper mowers I’ve had in the past didn’t. A lot of hype on these guys
If you’re referring to that massive engine recall, this one it’s not affected. This is the previous engine model design before that and I think this mower was built before 2019 if my memory serves. I think the recall is limited to the newer GCV170 and GCV200 engines, and this one is a GCV190
Click...Torque done, lol. I've never even owned a torque wrench. I don't even know how to use one. You have to be careful not to trigger the torque wrench warriors. I built a riding mower from the ground up out of spare parts without a torque wrench, and it works just fine. They aren't really necessary if you use common sense.
I got into this hobby about six years ago. Since I got started, I have had six machines given to me with "locked up" engines. One had a starter gear jammed in the flywheel. One had been locked up by a flywheel failure. Two needed valve adjustments, and one push mower had so much grass buildup under the deck that it was preventing the blade from turning. Thus far, I have only encountered one machine with a bad engine, and I already had an identical good engine to replace it with. Engines do not go out as much as people think they do.
Omg what a find . Best mowers ever. I just bought 2 like that one for 999 . They are going away forever .
Restored one of these but the push version wit the same engine. It was outside 15 years, rotted through, restored all to like new condition. Was fun.
I've got one where the engine 'seemed' to be seized. I have since turned the engine the same way you did, minus the drill. I will attempt the drill to see if I can free it, so to speak. I have another mower that looks like it needs the bearings on the ball control plate replaced. Opened it up and the bearings were not being held, essentially flew out of the race.
Like the way you make it all look so easy... Not your average beginner for sure. Thanks for the well done video and hrx217 restore info
glad you liked it!
It almost looked like the piston was locking on the valves at first. I grew up in my grandfather's lawn mower shop but I think he would have starved in our modern throw-away culture.
That’s what I was thinking as well but probably failed to mention it when I put it to TDC and eyeballed valve clearance.
It really is unfortunate how much good stuff gets thrown out, but I kinda understand with the cost of small engine shop labor. I think in my area it’s 60 just to walk in the door not including parts if it’s anything other than a tuneup.
@@BackyardRepairs My grandfather would have charged $5 to look at it. My mom was horrified that he never raised his prices. It made for a good video. Thanks!
Very impressive on your savy to piece that thing back together, BRAVO ! 👏🏻
thank you!
The clutch handle means it has the hydrostatic transmission- I finally topped mine off and air-bled it since Honda's factory was capable of doing it properly, after two years of use and ownership and it rips now! So fast!
Good video! Oh, and you know the previous owner cut the belt to get the engine out.
Thanks! And 100% think you’re right especially with how haphazardly it was taken apart
This is the kind of stuff i would do if i won the powerball and was all vacationed out and had too much time on my hands...
Illadmit though, this was impressive.
50;LBs of Compression
Are sure you want to put everything on
That's what I was thinking I guess the f 9:43 igurev got nothing to lose it thrown away already
I would this s aved for Parts
How many Mowers does some one need
Nice score. I bought one new for $850 around 7 seasons ago. Well worth the money. There are some on Amazon right now for $1400, and they're "refurbished". (Doesn't mean anyone's going to pay that...). Those hydro transmissions are now selling for over $400, up from $240 or so prepandemic. I found a basketcase 217HYA a few years back -- owner hit a stump, and ruined the block somehow trying to fix the bent crank. $25. I already had a good-running GCV160, so I put it on last week, going through the same steps you just did. Not identical! Slightly different engine mount bolt pattern. Throttle linkage looks different -- might need some alterations. Fun spring project for a retiree like me.
Thanks! I still am somewhat amazed at the situation with this mower, I'll never know what the PO was thinking when they tore it down though. Sounds like you got quite the score there especially with the spare engine to swap in. Thanks for sharing!
Congratulations on that find, and you did an amazing job winging it together. I know just how hard it can be when you don't take it apart yourself. I have a similar find. I saw a post for a mower with the head off and a string trimmer for $150. I kept seeing the post, and he kept going down in price. I offered for $50 as I knew, the trimmer was more than worth it. I sold the trimmer for $115. When I looked at the mower, it was so simple. He bought a all in one kit. 10 air filters and a spark plug witch he included. The kit was for a Honda, and this was a Briggs & Stratton quantum. So it was the longer spark plug hitting the piston. $7 head gasket and a perfect push bagger a d I had already doubled my money.
Thanks! and that's a great flip. It might just be my area, but I'd be hard pressed to get over 100 for a used trimmer unless it's a higher end brand. It's probably pretty obvious when start laughing in these videos that I'm always so surprised how the simplest of things get people to throw in the towel.
@BackyardRepairs yes, it is just crazy how quick people are to just throw out perfectly good stuff. I go to our town's transfer station most days. There is a free area called Tiffany's. I just got a Ryobi string trimmer with great compression and so much more. The one I sold was an Echo string trimmer. I also had the back story on it. As it was 7 years old and was only used for the first 2 years. Then he moved into an apartment with lawn maintenance included. I didn't even have to do carb work.
She’s a beast. Great job. I’ve had an Hrx217 since 2012. I upgraded to the blade brake, like this one last summer.
Thanks! I've mowed with this since the video and found that I really like the blade clutch system despite telling myself in the past that I don't need that feature on a mower. Really convenient when stopping to open and move through fence gates
@@BackyardRepairs I like that too but I think that style of handle is just a little bit longer. Kind of hard to manage in a fenced in yard.
@@jackhuddleston6830 That is true. I guess I'm just used to weed wacking a good 12" away from the fence line to keep the mower handle out of it and keep me sane lol.
I watch videos like this at 1.5 times the normal speed playback. You can still understand what's going on, but it goes quicker and you don't lose much. Try it and see.
Excellent video. Well done!
That was a nice catch and just at the right time. Also a clear easy to follow along video... shes a keeper that's for sure.
Thanks!
Man, that carb stack looks like a nightmare. Maybe you're supposed to lay it on the exhaust side to put it on.
Get a cast aluminum valve cover and gasket if you intend to keep this mower. They are about $30.00.
Nice work, doing the same thing now will be posting it very soon
I have the same mower and was struggling with a non-start condition since the end of last season. I thought it might be the auto-choke because I ran into that a few years back and the symptoms were the same. Ordered replacement parts for the choke, and finally got around to trying to install them today. Still wouldn't start - I tried everything I could think of but I was exhausted from trying to pull start it over and over. Finally caved and pulled the recoil starter off and used a drill to crank it. I finally got it started but it was smoking like crazy. I shut it off because an amazon driver pulled in and I didn't want to smoke him out. Started again and it ran better - no more smoke. Put recoil back on, got it started, thinking I was going to mow, but as soon as I engage the blade, it bogs down and stalls. Even backfired on a few tries. I'm stumped on this one. I figure the hard starting is fuel related, but not sure why it would stall when the blade is engaged.
Hey, based on your description there are three things I’d check next if you know you have good fuel, no carb issues (including correct gasket orientations), and spark.. 1- compression check 2- correct valve lash adjustment and 3- that the flywheel key isn’t sheared.
The excessive smoking when you did get it running lead me to question the piston ring or cylinder health which could lead to low compression and the engine not being able to take the load from the blade clutch and stalling out. A bad valve adjustment and/or sheared flywheel key can both contribute to any combination of hard starting, loss of compression, and backfiring. Hopefully that helps!
@@BackyardRepairs Thanks. I need to get a compression gauge to check that. The weird thing is that the smoking only happened after I initially “drill-started” it (this was bluish smoke which was concerning since it was likely burning oil). Once I shut it off and restarted it ran reasonably well - no smoke until I tried to engage the blade (then smoke was black and I got the backfires).
Circling back to this…I ended up taking the carb apart and cleaning it as best I could. That got it running again. Still not running great, but it works. (It tends to surge when not under load but runs better when loaded.)
That's great! It does sound like it needs another cleaning with special attention on the idle circuit passage or a gasket integrity check. Sometimes that surge will clear itself out after several uses with fresh gas though too. There are a lot of videos out there on it, but I did do a video specifically on the Honda GCV160 carb that shows what to remove and where to spray to clear the idle circuit (if you're feeling like another cleaning is in order).
@@BackyardRepairs When I got it taken apart, I realized that my can of carb cleaner was nearly empty so that prevented me from doing as good a job as I wanted! I will get a new can one of these days and tackle it again.
my curb fined needed a replacement carburetor, that was all
This is pretty good for your first Honda.
Cool find and video. I would've at least cleaned that carb knowing people use ethanol and was probably the culprit of it not starting. It doesn't explain why they thought it was seized up. But good video.
Awesome video! Thanks for sharing, and great job on putting the pieces back together!
thanks!
Good video, I have that model too. Looks like maybe the whole clutch may come off together if you loosened rose bolts on the bracket holding it to the block and slide the whole thing off the shaft together?
Im sure there is a better way to remove it than the way I did lol
How to install clutch cable at hand control, plz review sir
Sorry being late on this one, but great job on your initial educated guess fits!
Where do you find the torque call-outs? TH-camr's are always saying "I can get the torque settings later" or "F it" lol. Problem is I can only find blade torques in the manual and nothing in the engine manual. Some tuber's are even saying there's a torque call-out for every bolt and nut. What's your take?
BTW, I just got this model (w/ electric start) from my local mower shop in their so called "bone yard" area for $25! Everything's there and it turns over (no oil though). Can't wait to dissect it as soon as I get done rebuilding a hrm215 I got for $4! 😃😃
I'm wondering if they were going to attempt to part it out but later figured, screw it...?
Thanks!
I can say via career experience that there is a max torque based on fastener capability, and then an assembly torque based on fastener application for pretty much any product out there. I've found that type of information is not available to people like us and is typically only available in the factory manufacturing/assembly process. So in most cases I can't find the mower-body assembly torques and will usually assemble it tightened "well" by hand, then try to find a torque for things I think are safety-critical after the fact. The engine-specific torques are typically in the engine shop manual that authorized dealers have and use, which has way more information than the basic use/care engine owner's manual they send with the mower. I think those who say they have the torque either invested in getting the right manufacturer documentation and looked it up, or are looking up the max torque via a general torque-tension chart using the fastener's size/type/grade. The risky part about the max torque route is those values do not take into account the application (i.e. steel bolt into plastic or aluminum threads requires lower torque than steel bolt into steel nut, etc)
Great score on the $4 HRM215! What a random sale number lol
@@BackyardRepairs yeah, I just realized “the shop manual” ($40). I see why these mechanics forgo it 😆. Thank you on your follow up! The hrm is running. Just needed emulsifier/pilot jet cleaned (bowl was pristine surprisingly) and oil added. Now learning linkage for proper RPM setting. Just got a tachometer also
thats awesome.. i wish i could do this .. great job
Thanks!
I'm sure you already know this, but if you look closely on a used throttle cable, it will have witness marks that show you were it was attached at.
Thank you for making this video. I will never buy a honda lawnmower.
Mighty fine job
thanks!
Egads, that thing is even more complicated than my HRX216. 🙄
when would you NOT choose to repair an engine? what kind of damage would prevent you from bothering to?
I've actually got a video coming up next week where this exact situation happens. But I usually draw the line (on engines specifically) for three situations.. if there's an internal catastrophic failure that would cost more in parts than what the machine would be worth, the failure took out the block/cylinder wall that's physically not fixable, or the parts are not available to fix it. Most small engines are rebuildable depending on the damage and parts availability, but it depends on how much time you want to invest in it based on the machine.
@@BackyardRepairs thanks. waiting to hear from the service center now.
Nice! Hope you put oil in it lol!
Great video!!
Backyard Repairs, you did a great job putting this beast back together, for someone with some but not Honda-dealer-mechanic experience.
As an HRX217 (that STILL will not start) mower owner, this was hard to watch, because I've been through every temporary misstep you made here. Get one gasket, spring, bolt, etc. in the wrong order or place, and it will NOT start. One area you only touched on: the auto-choke on these engines is a HUGE general issue for Honda mower owners. Just check out other TH-cam videos and owner comments; it wasn't your issue, but believe me, it's many others' issue.
I suspect that what derailed the previous owner of your Honda mower is the #1 problem of non-starting lawnmowers generally (see Chickanic's TH-cam videos): over-wintered, waterlogged, ethanol unleaded gasoline.
In addition to my Honda, I also have a circa-2000 TroyBilt, basic Briggs & Stratton engine push mower that is lighter (=doesn't need self-propelled), more reliable, and way less complicated to maintain or service , compared to my Honda HRX217. Bleep you Consumer Reports for going all-in on the Honda. Give me the simpler circa-2000 Troy-Bilt.
Thanks! And I’m inclined to agree after using this one most of the spring. Very good build quality and overall mower, but it does leave grass clumping when mulching tall stuff that cheaper mowers I’ve had in the past didn’t. A lot of hype on these guys
Was this one of those that had the recall?
If you’re referring to that massive engine recall, this one it’s not affected. This is the previous engine model design before that and I think this mower was built before 2019 if my memory serves. I think the recall is limited to the newer GCV170 and GCV200 engines, and this one is a GCV190
Did you use RTV on the valve cover?
Yes I ended up resealing it after running it a few times to make sure I didn’t need to get in there again to adjust valves
Click...Torque done, lol. I've never even owned a torque wrench. I don't even know how to use one. You have to be careful not to trigger the torque wrench warriors. I built a riding mower from the ground up out of spare parts without a torque wrench, and it works just fine. They aren't really necessary if you use common sense.
Wow
My guess he had an issue took it apart and got frustrated and gave up on it.
This is a strange one.
I'll never know why they took it that far apart
TAKE AN OLD SOCK AND PUT IT ON THE MICROPHONE TO STOP NOICE OF AIR ON YOUR SHOPE COMING ONTO THE TAPE.
thanks for the feedback! I'm still trying to figure out good audio for my application
I hate Hondas. Everything is unnecessarily difficult on them. I can't stand working on them.