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All the 1/4/9 points endings makes it feel like they're solely there to artificially incentivize people to have to include combinations of them otherwise you're losing out on a few points if you combine any of them with the 0/5 point ending squads.
That's not artificially insentivise tho, that's just insentivise. Like a proper game design should
@comlitbeta7532 Not when you have something like 2000 points to pull from. Because then you could just spam up to the last 100 points and only optimize from there.
Personally I think it's mostly so they can pretend they've put more thought into it than they actually have.
@comlitbeta7532 No, it's artificial because it's an arbitrary constraint made to _FEEL_ suboptimal that doesn't actually reflect anything measurable, rather than naturally making particular combinations more worthwhile from a game mechanics perspective.
The whole point Tom & Ben are making is that if you've got something that's 2000 points vs. something that's 1998 points, there's _no possible way that it's balanced THAT meticulously,_ so these are just made to prey on people's bias that lower number = weaker no matter what, and you have to max out with nice clean round numbers first & foremost.
Thus it's not anything in the game's mechanics or design itself that's actually getting people to create interesting combinations of those units naturally, but rather a dependency on making it artificially harder to pair up whatever you want together into a nice round number by pretending that there's a difference between something being a 99 point unit and a 100 point unit when there really isn't.
The only thing arbitrary here is your definition of game design. They are balanced that meticulously, because we can break down every unit and weapon down to the attacks they produce and their chance of success. There are hundreds of statlines that need to be cross referenced for consistency and compared to each other in order to avoid there being a single best choice. On top of that. A lot of those statlines and points costs are multiplicative. Meaning a random 2 point difference for 1 model, is potentially 20 for a 10 man squad or 50 for a 25 man mob. And that's only one of several possible upgrades that are also added and multiplied.
@@lweaver2988
In a game where you abstract all things to have 8mm marines bash their heads in, it looks to extremely silly.
It makes very little sense to me that Legions, a game with MORE stuff on the table, has more granularity, and warhammer 40k 10th, a game that has LESS stuff on the table, has less granularity.
That's absolutely backwards. Whether your dudes have combi-bolters or combi-weapons means more when you only have 10 of them, not 100, so tracking the granularity at a smaller scale makes more sense.
I'm convinced that the GW game design team has like, a portion that takes care of the granularity and decision making on list building things, and they have them divided between games, but accidentally all of the dudes got simultaneously unassigned from 40k and reassigned solely to Legions
It makes no sense but it feels like that.
@@Nobody-zl3kk the 40k design team and the specialist games design teams are seperate.
40k has been simpified into a beginner friendly game for selling KPI boxes, specialist games have not.
@@T0mm3n That feels like a moot point.
The game is still very complicated, I don't think list building having variability in loadouts makes the *game* more or less beginner friendly. A complex game is a complex game, even stripped. All they're doing by stripping complexity is making a complex game boring for players that like complex games and still too complex for people who don't like complex games.
That's like saying a banana split sundae has a lotta sugar so just eat ice cream with chocolate syrup instead for less sugar. They both have a fuck ton of sugar. XD
Legions died for me when I realised 3k was the standard and the whole starter set is like 900pts
Vanguard have a full 3m ruleset in development, easily adaptable to 40k or Horus Heresy. Those Gobbo tanks are mine :D
They look at points and complain.
Maybe complain about the fraudulent pricing.
Tell it to me straight, boys. Did I choose the worst time ever to try and make a Tanith 1st inspired Guard army?
It's certainly not the cheapest they've ever been.
I'm pretty sure you'd save money buying a whole damn 3D printer & resin.
Yes
i mean, you can get most of the way there with cadians and greenstuff cloaks
@queencyrys6309 I found a 3d print file for the cloaks but I mostly meant that it looks like they're going full blown Krieg with both the new pack, the codex, and the new guard combat patrol
All the time is a bad time. Just make the army you like, and play them with your friends using the riles that best fit.
At least there’s no decimals, for now
Loadouts cost nothing in 40k, but they plan to make them actually add to the points value in their epic scale game?
Yeah, alright. Just checking.
Thats because 40k has been infinitely streamlined into a beginner-friendly game, and specialist games quite rightly have not
Ill be real though, i love the granularity of Legions
I forgive you for this opinion 😇
@@anonymousguy720I do not
I love the idea of some nerd who has equipped his armies with bunch of small variations that add like 2 or 3 points, and then starts arguing about it when the others don't count those weapons. As he's losing an encounter by a lot, he insists on counting up all those extra points, and it turns out he's still way off from winning anyway, so it didn't matter to begin with.
Where's the dog? I can't tell how big any of these are without the dog!
Legions is absolutely the best system GW make at the moment
I personally hate the trend of upgrades not costing points.
When you add up 20 5 point rhinos with 20 multimeltas it adds up quite a lot
full spectrum dominance is a really cool 6mm game
Legions is a far funner game than 40k. Alternating activations, usable rules for Titans and Flyers.
To be fair, if the points were always multiples of 5, then you might as well divide everything by 5 and use that.
The point difference may be down to the Death Guard not liking to have heavy weapons in their tactical squads and thus having less shootyness? Probably not, but it's a thought.
The Legions Imperialis stuff at the beginning aged badly now that a years past and we know the points breakdown for every option.
Annnd this is why i play Adeptus Titanicus 😂
GW stopped supporting it for this system get pranked. No more official tournaments for Titanicus. No more FAQs or rules
Are you guys seriously "rolling your eyes" at different loadouts having different point costs?
For an epic scale game? Yes.
@@plastefuchs666 But Legion Imperialis, the book they are looking at, is not that.
What else is it then?@@Pedro-zu3uq
@@Pedro-zu3uq previous epic games had round numbers of 10s. But I'm about the same age as Ben so I would know that.
When you make up things to get mad about.