ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 5 มี.ค. 2024
- What is ugly and what is pretty is quite subjective, or is it? I have found a set of guidelines for how to design a cafe racer, and it really helps to follow the guide to get a pretty looking build. I call it for the "Cafe Race Design Principles" in this video.
Here is a link to the article "How to build a cafe racer" i am referring to in the video:
www.bikeexif.com/build-cafe-r...
#honda #caferacer #build
Music from #Uppbeat (free for Creators!):
uppbeat.io/t/d0d/getaway
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Well well thought out and informative video mate 👏
Thanks 🙏 Happy to hear you liked it 😊
Am I correct in believing the original cafe racers were not designed, it was euro punks pulling parts off their bikes for weight reduction?
You are absolutely correct! It all originated in the UK in the 60s by youths stripping down their fathers old motorcycle to make it go faster 😎 Today it's mostly about style, secondly you want it to sound good and lastly you want it to go decently fast and have good riding abilities 😊 If you want to go racing you really want a completely other type of bike than a cafe racer today 😏
As someone with my own cafe project waiting in the garage, I will estimate the reason most cafes of today are ugly is due to lack of skill or confidence to start the metalworking. 😅
Hehe, it's a learning curve for sure 😊
As someone who was riding in the UK in the 1960s I don’t recognise most of the objects people seek to pass off as ‘cafe racers’ these days. The ‘proper’ cafe racers were styled to look like (and sometimes go like) bikes that were used in short-circuit track racing. So engines were often tuned, footrests were rear-set, handlebars were clip-ons, gear-change often reversed by turning the gear-pedal ‘back-to-front’ to match the footrests. The tank would often be a larger than standard (usually alloy) number that the rider could lay down on when ‘doing the ton’. Generally people wouldn’t play with wheel or tyre sizes, and that big ugly fat front wheel and tyre on modern efforts just looks WRONG, as it also does on so-called ‘scramblers’. My brother-in-law built and raced scramblers and they had BSA frames for strength, Triumph 500cc engines for lightweight power, and usually Norton Roadholder forks for control. And an 18”-21” wheel combination because that worked. The modern (and to my eyes) ugly offerings are just exercises in styling which probably handle like camels and are almost unridable and certainly poor efforts on a race track or a scrambles (motocross) course. So who cares where the lines go or meet up if the bike is not useable? Might as well be a ‘chopper’ (another useless styling exercise).
Times has definitely changed 😌I don't think many people look at cafe racers as racing motorcycles any more, today you would select a completely different kind of bike if you want to go fast. At least for me a cafe racer is mostly about design and nostalgia 😊
Underrated video. It's always nice to see someone applying mathematical symmetry (which exists in everything we consider beautiful in nature) into their design. Having good form has always contributed the most in making something look amazing imo
Thanks 🙏 I agree, and when exact symmetry is not possible or feasible the solution is often to balance the elements to give an impression of symmetry 😊
your shop is so organized and clean it makes what I am used to shame
Hehe, I like to keep my workspace tidy - probably a tiny bit above average 🤔
As a mechanic i nearly always refuse to work on these home builds.too many things going wrong with them.nice vid
I would guess the quality is not always top notch? 🫤
@@kihestad well,ppl don't know what they are doing.using many cheap parts,trying to be different in ways that are not logical,but the biggest mistake I've seen,is that many care how the bike looks,but not how I feels or rides.and many technical aspects,like wrong petcocks,don't calculate their reserve,and things like that
Glad to see your back on it my friend,cat what to hear what that exhaust sounds like 👍
Hehe, I am curious about that myself as well 😊 I have to get my Cagiva fixed first, but that's not that big of a project 🤞
Again an excellent & enjoyable video on multiple levels (pun intended). Satisfying seeing it come together.
Also fun to realise how I seem to have used principles that I 'grabbed from the air' which were actually written down by kind Mr Trelogan :D
Happy to hear you enjoyed the video 😊 By just copying or being inspired from others build, you will probably implement most of the guidelines. Nice to have a systematic summary of them though, and it makes you even more aware of them and why they are there 😊
For me the flat line horizontal is the most important to make the bike look right, that's why a lot of modern bikes with trellis frames are not suitable as the frame slopes upwards around the fuel tank and therefore it's impossible to make the tank sit flat. Considering the shape of your tank with the back sloping downwards it actually looks really good. Really nice job, I wish I had your welding skills. excellent video.
Thanks 👍 You are absolutely right. For newer bikes it's better to build something completely different, for example streetfighter style or modernizing the look.
This is coming out amazing! Love the new subframe. The CB definitely needed a straight anchor point from the subframe instead of the original curved one. I saw many people keeping that, and it really killed the vibe of the bike. Will the electrical box under the seat extend all the way to the end? Mine is very similar (a 1984 450), but the box is smaller and deeper, protruding a little too much from the side view. Currently, my bike is totally disassembled to fix a valve that broke off and dropped inside the engine 🤦♂. Hope to get it back on the road soon. Good luck with the rest of your build, and keep the videos flowing!
I absolutely agree, keeping the original frame and try to work around it (like I tried on my version 1.0) does not really work 😌 I plan to make the tray under the seat just go a tiny bit lower than the bottom of the seat hoop, but having 45 degree angels on the side walls so you cannot see it from "above". I plan to make my own lithium battery based on 18650 batteries, it will be very slim and should fit in a slim seat tray. The seat tray will go from the tank and to the upswing at the rear of the seat hoop.
Oooh, a broken valve does not sound good 🫤Thanks for watching and commenting, and good luck with your build as well! 👍👍
Thank you. I am wanting to get a Bott frame for my Buell. And extend rear fender on the swing arm so it don't spray water as much.
Buell is a vey interesting company, their motorcycles as well. Take care of the one you have, good luck improving it 👍
i think that's a really good tank bracket. keep up the good work!
That was good news! I hoped someone would approve it, so I did not have to redo it 😊
Keen to see the engine and frame cleaned up
Agree, but there are some other tasks that come first. The next job is to fit the rear fender, then make the seat tray and the seat. I want to do all the wiring and mount all kinds of small stuff to make sure I can remove unnecessary brackets and add new ones where needed. Then comes the fun getting it cleaned up 🤩
A funny thing is that for me a bike can never be captured on camera as you see it in real life, even the ugly ones look better 🤔
I have to agree, not sure why though 😏
Great solution for the tank mount, I'm doing something similar. I want to get the line of the tank before it dips down to be level with the seat subframe
Sounds like a good plan!
Hei! Digger videoene dine! Liker spesielt hvordan du programmerte en keyless system og diverse😄. Jeg anbefaler YSS schock, god kvalitet og Perfect oppgradering fra de originale med stort utvalg. Jeg har et spørsmål, er du med i norwegian cafe racer gruppen på fb? Vis ikke så ta en titt innom du vil😄 gleder meg til flere videoer!
Hey, skal sjekk ut YSS shocks - takk for tipset!👍er med i en del FB grupper, men ikke den norske tror jeg - skal sjekke.... 😊
This is a very cool design study! I am a bit of a sucker for reverse Comstars, excellent bike. Completely agree, a bit of extra shock height is needed in the rear. Cheers, from the American Northeast.
The reverse Comstars (I think Honda called them Comcast) is very cool. They are a bit wider than the older Comstars, and I like that they have sharper "edges" compared to the comstarts 😊
What lift table/storage is that. That thing is awesome
I am quite satisfied with it, I wanted originally a scissor lift but they are too expensive for my budget. This one was very affordable, at least when I bought it (on sale). I made a video about it here: th-cam.com/video/H4oMGfEGHKc/w-d-xo.htmlsi=MDHvpav4Lb3CHR5V
Love it!
Glad to hear that 😊
Looking good!
👍
I agree with all the guidelines, The only thing would like to see added would be the style of wheels. Spokes prefered or something that looks period correct
That's true, the first rule : "the foundation" says the wheels should be fairly similar in size. No guidelines beside that. The wheels are quite important and a big part of the visual appearance, it could absolutely be a separate guideline!
Looks great. Taller shocks in the back would look great
Thanks 😊 yes, agree about the shocks. Has not found any yet, but still searching
Tanks from the early 80's onward are often made to connect to the side panels. This makes them look weird without those pannels in place. Making a truly good looking build is not easy.
That's exactly how it was for this bike, the side panels continued where the weird bend is now. Without the side panel the bend is quite useless 😵💫
I was going to suggest that. Merging the new covers into the existing end of the tank. I like it so far, Is that a CM400T?
It's a CB400N from 1984
What bugs me more is how terrible the performance usually get with these cafe racers. Fitting these CV carburettors with pod filters usually leads to a bad mixture and sloppy power curve negating any performance gained with the weightloss.
And after they're ridden in ground they end up for sale online with "just needs a carb clean" in the description
Haha, yes it's absolutely a challenge with these small podfilters. Jetting them to provide more fuel is possible, but for carbs made for laminar flow It's hard to get good performance using podfilters directly on the carb intake as it leads to turbulent flow (I think 🤔).
@@kihestadexactly, I've seen alot of solutions on these honda twins. blocking the wide end of the podfilter with some tape seems to work. placing the podfilters further away from the carbs seems to work better but doesn't look as good.
Personally I leave the stock airbox on my cb400t in combination of having a balance in the exhaust system. But yeah, that leaves me to deal with the awkward frame these bikes have.
Those wheel and green tank are spectacular
Thanks for the tips! 👍
Bone line did improve a lot! And the back needs to go up a bit and/or the front lower in my opinion. But he.. its your design so do what you like! I will put my own caferacer against the principals, never even knew they excisted.
Yep, it's a bit tall at the front and/or low at the rear to be a 100% cafe racer type. But I am not really aiming for that, this one is supposed to be a tiny bit scrambler-ish 😊 I think it will be a bit better with taller rear shocks / raised lower mounts.
I totally agree with your comments regarding the design concept, a majority of cafe racers look so wrong and not in proportion. Yes it`s a personal thing, but there are so many ugly cafe racers out there.
Yea, I am afraid I have to agree 😞
I really like the wheels where to get
The wheels are the standard on this bike, called Comcast 🤩
@@kihestad thanks mate
Everything else is quite nice, but I couldn't live with that tank bottom line. It should be straight as possible. It's angled in too many directions. I would personally try to modify tank, which would be a pain or consider some different tank. Something in veins of Bonneville, though don't know if dimensions are even close to fitting on that. But anyway, more "classic" older style fuel tank.
To me problem exactly is that those shapes scream "this is shaped for fairing to continue" and it just doesn't cut it for me.
Yea, this tank will never be perfect if the aim is to get a true old school cafe racer style 😌 I have however decided to keep it as is, trying to make it a feature instead of a flaw 😬 By having parallel lines with the upswing on the seat hoop and "reverse curves" on the tank decals I hope it will look OK. At least it's some kind of unique design, and some kind of tribute to the original bike.
@@kihestad Sure it's option. And good one in regard of breaking the "rules". Imo too many stick to guideline X and make their builds fairly generic looking and losing a lot of personality going that route. Like virtually 95% of modern cars. Made with aerodynamics and trends in mind and they usually end up looking really boring and similar. I personally like surprising ideas some have come up. Recently saw for sale 90's Kawasaki ZZR made to modern scrambler and military paint camo style with hand made leather bags and stuff. It looked really bizarre and unexpected in a very good way. Never ever thought that frame and bike like that would be suitable for such conversion.
Yes, that's a very good point! We don't want all bikes to look the same. It's nice to see experiments, some builds really surprise with unexpected and very good looking design 😊
cambiar el tanque.
The tank is not the classic cafe racer type, I have decided not to swap it though. Trying to keep some of the bike's original look to see if it can work out 🤞
In so many cases... wheels...
wheels what? 🫤
look. respect to your craft and all, but f'ck me, let a person build it however they like lol.
almost all of the time, its not because the person doesn't have the vision, its because they don't have the skill or maybe they don't know how to tackle specific tasks due to a lack of specific experience or equipment.
then some gatekeeping design expert asshole tells them its ugly and doesn't follow rules and that only goes to knock motivation out of young people who initially have a lot of enthusiasm.
one thing I've learnt over the years is to let a person do whatever they want. More often than not, they'll end up with similar opinions as you anyway through trial and error so calling their work ugly if it doesn't follow rules doesn't really help their process.
I am glad you are defending those who ended up with a less successful result. I think however nobody wants their build to end up looking ugly, and hopefully knowing about these guidelines will help those who might not really know how to do it in the first place... 🤔
@@kihestad yeah, no doubt. Even though it may have looked like it, its not a jab at you per se, more of the motorcycle community as a whole who enjoy to belittle others because their bike's styling may not conform to what's 'proper' or 'correct'.
Everyone does it, even I'm guilty of it if my mood is off, lol.
Why are so many ugly hair cuts around?
Beats me 🤔
@@kihestad 😀😀😀
Get abetter tank this one is ugly
It's a budget build, a new tank is too expensive for me 😏
This was such an incredible video. So much details and yet you manage to put in a good story around the rules of what a cafe racers is all about. I'm really impressed how well you change between the angles, the camera work, audio everything is on par. Well done mr. Hestad. 🤌🏻🎥
Thanks bro, glad to get your approval - tried my best to combine two topics this time: a bit design theory and real life usage of it - glad to hear you thought it worked out 🤩🙏