Mars suffers a lot from arrogance in their technology, and lack of experienced officers. Yao was captain of the baddest ship in the solar system and still lost. Hell, the ship was almost captured.
Earth ship: oh no, my 80yo central computer just glitched :( we gotta get back to base Donnager: _*gets nuked_ = gives a fuck + diverts energy to railguns
I’m actually fairly certain that some of the fans of the Expanse books helped write some of the lore for use in the TV show. I know Spacedock here on TH-cam did a whole thing on it
I think the name torpedo is just for "naval" tradition. The Russian Skval ,if I'm correct does not use a prop, it uses a chemical rocket but it's not a missile.
There are many things I like about The Expanse's naval doctrine. One being the weapons multi-task (This helps reduce issues with logistics). There is one detail about when the Donnager is on screen that I really hate. Every time She shows up, she is killed. Sure she dies spectacularly, by showing off why she is feared, BUT she still dies.
@@caelestigladii The Japanese battleships had AA rounds for their main guns, the San Shiki rounds, en.wikipedia.org/wiki/San_Shiki_(anti-aircraft_shell)
Yeah sadly the donnagers suffer from the worf effect, theyre always beat up by someone else to show how strong the bad guys are. I can think of a single time in the last book where a donnager finally gets to do damage and not be instantly exploded to hype up something else, and by that point its so hopelessly obsolete it still cant really do much
The Donnager class suffers from the same fatal flaw as any model modern battleship…. Our ability to destroy a ship far outweighs our ability to defend a ship. World War II was the last hurrah for battleships because that was the last time in human history where navies had to point analogue computers with optical targeting at one another to aim at targets on the distant horizon…. 10 years after the end of the war, missiles made battleships obsolete. The Donnager is big, the Donnager is powerful, it carries massive railguns… that are absurd levels of overkill and don’t really serve any useful purpose, other than to be absurd levels of overkill. Take them off and add more missiles to the magazine, and your ship is actually more useful in a combat situation. The donut your class get its ass, beat every time it appears on screen, because the entire idea of a battleship is obsolete. The only situation under which the Donnager excelled was anti-piracy …. Primarily because it was the big stick, and Pirates didn’t have the ability to overwhelm something with that many point defense guns on it in an actual naval engagement, though the MCR and wasted their entire military budget on making eight really large really juicy targets that the UNN is going to dispatch 100 vessels to destroy.
There are naval torpedoes that are rocket powered, the defining quality of a torpedo is its ability to be pushed out of a tube by an external force. Some torpedo launchers have used black powder, oxygen, or even a "plug" of water.
In practical terms, torpedoes and missiles are pretty much the same. The primary difference is that torpedoes operate in the ocean while missiles are aerial weapons. I've seen people try to argue that guidance makes the difference, with torpedoes being more command guided while missiles are self guided. In reality, both torpedoes and missiles can make use of similar guidance systems.
So, going to chip in here. The term Torpedo simply means a tube-shaped explosive device to be used in naval warfare and long pre-dates the self-propelled torpedo that we are familiar with. These could refer to anything from a weapon far more akin to a sea-mine which is actually where we get the famous quote "Damn the Torpedoes, full speed ahead" or the so called Bangalore Torpedoes that were used by landing forces to clear beach obstacles during WW2 that was basically a long tube filled with explosives carried by infantry. The Expanse pulls nearly all it military terminology from Maritime navies, thus, a long range anti-ship weapon that carries a self-contained explosive warhead is a Torpedo, simply out of Naval tradition
I hate when people say 'sci-fi terminology is wrong'. Yes sometimes words may be technically not correct to their modern day usage, but terms and meaning drift over time due to culture or ease-of-use consideration, it's set in the future! How many rows or oars does a guided missile cruiser have? Orient the combat trireme to the enemy space station and fire all particle beams, prepare the Spartans for boarding!
I do agree, although I just like missile more, since missiles tend to be the primary ship to ship weapon in modern navies, and so it stands to reason that if navies ever ditch the oceans for the void of space, they'd still keep calling the big explody hurty stick that flies a missile. Although to be entirely fair, referring to moving through the vacuum of space as flight really is no more accurate than saying space battleships swim through the void.
@dfas I hate the argument that a Star Destroyer can't be a Star Destroyer on the basis that it's ''not the size of a destroyer'' when in fact, there is no determined size for destroyer, they started off as just torpedo boats with extra guns, and progressively they've gotten a lot bigger, the size and role of a destroyer has completely changed. Same goes for cruiser, originally a cruiser was any ship that's role was basically to go somewhere far away and do stuff, in ship of the line terms this can mean just about anything, because you have no fuel limitation. It took a long time for there to be any kind of consensus on what actually is a ''real'' cruiser, and of course, as if it wasn't all convoluted enough these things also varied, and still vary from navy to navy.
In the later books the Laconia special ships that push like 20G acceleration, forcing the crew to be put in a liquid bed so they don’t turn to mush. The hard science of The Expanse can not be found in pretty much any sci-fi.
Terra invicta/ Children of a dead earth/ Kerbal space program players staring at you from behind. I don't see ships in the expanse have radiators so their going to melt themselves when they even try to turn on the engine.
@@許進曾 yeah Children of a Dead Earth is the most hard sci-fi game I've ever played. I guess big radiators wouldn't work aesthetically with the Expanse's ships but I do love how they look
I was an engineer on the USS Kitty Hawk CV-63. We were like 1069 feet long 300ish meters and the heaviest I ever weighed her at was 86,292 tons. Our power to weight ratio was um... nice 280,000 shaft horsepower.
@@Vilakazi You know I'd think somebody would know what they worked as. Stop getting so caught up on symantics things like technician & Engineer basically mean the same thing & it depends more on the employer.
It's not mentioned on the show but it is in the books: in The Expanse, under high-g and combat maneuvers, most of the crew is on the juice and sedated in their racks/crash couches with only a bare minimum conscious and operational.
Also, the ports at the back of the PDCs aren't separate thrusters, they're exhaust for propellant gases to counteract recoil. Also, Roci ends up using her aftermarket railgun as a thruster, doing the space version of grenade-jumping.
In military sci-fi the difference in missiles and torps are the role they play. missiles are weapons that are used for multiple applications, i.e.: anti-fighter, ground attack, and ECM. Torps are strictly used in the anti-ship role. they are orders of magnitude larger than missiles and are almost exclusively nuclear in nature, either contact nukes or some form of laser head. For those that don't know a laser head is a bomb pumped x-ray laser with multiple lasing rods orientated in all directions. See the Honor Harington books by David Weber. Interesting note: The bomb pumped laser concept was originally thought up in the 1970's, and in the mid 1980's Ronald Reagen's SDI program came up with the laser head concept from that. It is something we could really build today.
I was under the impression the Donnager could carry six Corvette class frigates. Each berthing space could be taken up by two Morrigan class patrol destroyers. Capt. Yao used this option to increase the range of her net during Oper. Silent Wall. If I'm mistaken, my apologies.
You're correct, it has six bays which can carry either one Corvette-class each or two Morrigan-class destroyers. I believe the Donnager carried a 50/50 mix, 3 Corvettes and 6 Morrigans.
Accurate to what age of science? The exapnce is a futuristic show, while sticking (mostly) to science we understand TODAY. Who's to say in four hundred years we wont be able to manipulate gravity? See the oxymoron here? Showing future tech, but doing it while sticking to what we currently understand of the sciences.
Could you do the Truman class dreadnought as your next expanse vid? It’s my favourite Un ship and the donnager’s counterpart. Maybe the Timberwolf for your next battletech vid.
The next expanse vid is going to be a new style of content for the cahnnel. It's a battle breakdown of the donnager verses the stealth ships from season one episode 3. But some UN ships and more mechs are absolutely coming.
@@scienceinsanity6927 I would love to see that breakdown! I think that battle was fascinating because it showed that the most advanced military technology in the MCRN was ultimately vulnerable to what amounted to civilian level technology on earth
@@scienceinsanity6927 Nice, been waiting for a battle breakdown for taht cuz I watched the show but still had trouble understanding waht was happening.
@@scienceinsanity6927 Great video, but I would highly suggest you don't have any background music. I strongly believe it is distracting, annoying, and unnecessary (especially for videos with lots of talking). I also believe that people want to hear you speak/get information and not hear generic background music that doesn't really add anything useful and that people have to mentally filter out. Plus it will be less work for you.
Ballistic defense weapons against incoming missiles are the last line of defense, modern ships use missiles to intercept enemy missiles/mortars or artillery, the guidance systems allow a much better hit probability & tracking with a higher payload than rounds could carry thus a much higher intercept probability (because incoming ordnance is actually destroyed by shrapnel that is generated by rounds/interceptor missiles exploding near them) In modern combat there are at least 5 layers of defense for something like a carrier, first one being long range radar, second being friendly aircraft like fighters, third being long range interceptor missiles, forth being countermeasures (electronic that block guidance systems in missiles + active ones like flares to confuse heat seaking) and the last line of defense are radar guided automated turrets (the PDCs from the expanse). I think they really slept on a lot of already existing tec in the show, a military combat ship in the future would have exponentially more combat capabilities then it is depicted.
It’s largely baked into the plot. The Rosinante has a skeleton crew responsible for everything …. Thus almost everything on the ship is automated. If we assume that the level of automation involved in something like that carries through to the combat systems, ECM and counter, ECM would also be automated. It’s probably simply not talked about because the PDC’s look cooler on screen. Realistically, defensive missiles, would just leave flak in the path of oncoming offensive missiles…. Allowing them to shred themselves before impact. It’s a moot point anyway. In a university where acceleration vastly outpaces human endurance, virtually all combat would be done by drones anyway. The benefit of a platform, the size of a Donnager, aside from its long range railguns, would be its carrying capacity, its ability to play freight train and haul a fleet of drones into combat.
I think the battle scenes are one of the best things in The Expanse. But off topic about the Donager, the Aliens: Colonial Marines Technical Manual did talk about how space combat, much like The Expanse. The missile is the primary weapon and is best used for long distance, while the railguns are close combat weapons. Lasers are used for point defense. The armor, also is only good for against energy weapons and not kinetic weapons.I think the only difference is emission control, meaning knowing when to use your sensors to attack. It's almost like submarine warfare.
Well it was always planned as a six season run covering everything up to the massive time jump between books six and seven so I wouldn't exactly say it was canceled. More like it had finally reached a good spot to take a break. They needed to recast every character or wait for the cast to age up a bit for the next section of the story.
i like to think that there is a tech-priest in the engine room applying sacred oils and chantting prayers to the machine spirits of these MARTIAN MADE BEASTS based on this old game from earths distant past called WARHAMMER 40K.
I seem to remember that the first nuke that hit Galactica caused substantial damage, and the nuke that went up in the civilian fleet completely destroyed at least one ship.
Agreed it was explicitly mentioned that the Jupiter class battle stars were specifically armored to survive several hits by nukes on top of being able to withstand hefty amounts of damage from the conventional cannons and missiles employed by both sides of the Cylon war.
That depends on how you define superior. Earth navy was vastly larger than Mars, but Mars had newer ships because earth was spending all of its money on welfare for its ludicrously large population.
They do, but Earths fleet is old and in constant maintenance. The UNN flagship, Agatha King was really old, as show in it's introduction with all the crew effecting repairs on the bridge and the glib line of it falling apart.
Corvette class frigate sounds like a great way to just absolutely confuse your enemies. "They have 4 corvettes!" Claims the scout, so you move in and boom, there's 4 line ship that are more than ready to destroy you for thinking they were some rinky dinky corvettes.
At best the enemy makes a mistake and completely underestimates the power of your fleet, at worst it annoys the hell out of them. In short it's just a F. U. to the enemy and I love it.
In order to avoid a projectile, you need to detect the projectile. That is difficult, even with radar. With multiple sources of projectiles, that is more difficult still.
@@weir-t7y I am well aware. And each projectile takes resources, which are finite. Finite power and finite cooling for the radar system that must dissipate that power. Time is one of the most abundant resources in a phased array radar because so much is spent cooling and so little spent radiating.
Interesting Sci FI bit on nukes. The Imperium of Man on Warhammer 40k views nukes as illegal weapons only to be used to kill planets under authorization form the highest of commanders. This in a universe were bio weapons, Poison gas human waves etc. are common.
The thing with nukes and conventional warheads is, it's not the fireball that does the damage, it's the shockwave and with no atmosphere there is no shockwave. So unless the enemy ship did not vacate it's atmosphere (which would allow for the boom to ripple through the ship) the damage would just be some molted plating (heat still transferes into it). So no nukes should not end ships, they are just more heat and cosmic radiation to ship (basically bigger plasma missiles).
WHY!!! The Ramen Ah??? I am never going to be able to pronounce the words amun-ra the same again!😂😂 I just started being able to do it with Channing Tatum. I love your videos guy, my friends and I joke and talk to each other the same way. And we love aggravating each other to the point where the other one says "it's fine whatever it's fine'" too cracking jokes and teasing each other like this is seriously fundamental to our friendships, so I love the nerd friend banter you guys have on this video. My friends and I are a little bit older now so we don't get to do much of that anymore, so hearing you guys do it brings a nice warm fuzzy to a special place in my heart I love it, this is how smart creative nerdy people Express profound feelings of love for one another don't ever change it! And if I haven't said it thank you for putting these together not only do I like the source material I've enjoyed your brand of delivery very much. I'm a disabled veteran so I spend a lot of time at home scouring TH-cam nerdy fun science stuff and when I find one, like yours I will watch THE SHIT out of it! Totally going to love exploring this Channel and seeing what other excellent stuff you have to offer any personal favorites or recommendations?
Hey, it was pretty good and had most of the banter in pragmatic science pretty spot on, particularly about acceleration forces. For some reason people think the 9G rating of some fighter aircraft relates to a sustainable biological figure but truth is that's not even sustainable for those aircraft. Now I only point this out because I love this stuff as much as you do, but the functionality of nukes in space is a bit off. In fact BSG got it right and the Expanse less so. There are plenty of science channels that have discussed the real physics of nukes in space but the short version is microwave cooker, no pressure wave. The reason we think they're so devastating is because of their effect in atmosphere, which tremendously magnifies its destructive power. In space they're not even an effective weapon unless detonated at very close range and all the damage is radiation type, mainly gamma rays and energetic radiation the kind spacecraft are ideally well shielded against as mundane protection from cosmic and stellar rays. Yes they're very intense but a good analogy would be a very powerful microwave oven cooking a portion of the ship next to the detonation point. It is not as materially destructive as a very good chemical warhead in space, which can still produce a significant pressure wave in the form of a reactive chemical expansion. Or perhaps some combination of a significant chemical warhead detonated by a nuclear trigger. If you were going to have nukes in space as a tactical ship weapon that would be the best form, nuclear trigger for a stupidly insane chemical reaction warhead. But pure nukes. Think BSG.
Re Nukes and Battletech. In BT lore, they indicate that the initial navy battles were nuke fests that result in mutual destruction. This was also often the case with ground combat too. Battlemechs partially mitigated this issue as they could walk around a nuclear battlefield with out issue unless hit (near) directly. Also one of the reasons that the First Succession War was so brutal and most warships didn't make it past the second war and none made it to the third. All of them, and the facilities to make them, were destroyed.
I worked on the show. They built most of the Rossi such that you could film all around, through, and inside it in a single take. Rumour has it that the cast is pushing to do another BSG reboot.
I love shit like this. Will be looking forward to further ship breakdown videos, especially from The Expanse universe. The prolog breaking down the rules of the universe was very well done.
I'm going to be a pendant and say the term "torpedo" was used as a carry over from wet navy nomenclature, and as you mentioned, to differentiate between offensive and defensive armaments. It's entirely plausible that in the future the definition of Torpedo has "expanded" (lol) to include space-borne anti ship fireworks.
Torpedoes are actually floating mines, MOTOR torpedoes a what you are describing. Pedantic sure, however, I bring this up in defense of the setting. Language changes over time to adapt to the need for communication. Missiles mean shoulder fired stuff, small scale intercept work etc and torpedoes are anti ship weapons, its not just for the audience It's for everyone involved to rapidly ID what you are talking about.
The "juice" was described in the books as a cocktail of mostly painkillers and sedatives, with some anti-coagulants, vasodilatiors, and muscle relaxers sprinkled in. Most passengers and non-essential crew would be sedated for any maneuvers that would require the juice. Essential crew, in civilian vessels, this was usually just the pilot, would have amphetamines mixed with their formulations to keep them awake in case anything went wrong. In book 4, when there was rush to settle the new worlds, the demand for "the juice" was so high that the crew of Roci could only get their hands on some of the lowest quality formulations, which was described as mostly just morphine.
I came here from your RagingCanadian channel and loved this video! I'm done with Wow and wargaming myself and very happy that you have a second channel that creates good content, because I like your "style". I'll be looking out for more take care!
The best part of the Expanse's ships is that they put the command and control systems and flight crew in the core of the ship behind the thickest armor. Because when you're flying a warship through space that's exactly where you'd wanna be.
Nukes' effects in-atmosphere are very different than in a vacuum. No atmosphere means no shockwave. Shockwave is a *huge* part of why terrestrial nukes are as devastating as they are.
How wrong can a statement be? There is a shockwave in space, not an atmospheric shock wave but a massive amount of particles. Also, 200-300 million degrees Celsius (The sun is only 15 million Celsius at its core) has been measured during the Cold War as the US and USSR set medium size nuclear weapons. Do some research, take a physics class. You must have been sleeping in science class.
@@marcusanton95 It's a relative matter. Compared to *in-atmosphere*, where the explosion is able to compress and displace a wall of said atmosphere, there is a significant shockwave effect. Absent that compressible, pushable atmosphere, the only thing the nuke has is a couple pounds of nuclear fuel-remnants to push. Its primary effects are radiation.
@@ferricoxide Project Orion Study showed the blast wave was capable of propelling a vehicle at speeds of 10,000 Kilometers a second using just a few medium size Nuclear bombs detonated at a safe distance. This is done by the incredible shockwave. NASA's plan to used stand-off nuclear weapons to deflect asteroids. This uses the shockwave created. NASA also has direct detonation on the surface, this vaporizes much of the surface area, turning the escaping gas as jets to move the object along with the shockwave. Which of them you choose has to do with speed, size, when it's detected (how much time we have) and composition of the object. It would seem that MIT and NASA disagree with your assessment of the effects of such weapons in space. This is where my understanding of the subject comes from, studies, science journals and the like. If they're wrong then I'm wrong.
If I remember correctly, the Donnagers actually have the power to mount all 4 Foehammers. The only reason they don't mount the other 2 is because the ship literally cannot handle the stress of firing 4 guns. Also, plasma torps are for stripping armour off of a target to leave bigger ships open to being gutted by PDC fire. You mention Galactica as unarmoured, she wasn't. She was under-crewed and under-armed.
Good thing about this "unclimactic" combat in Expanse- it showcases how brutal warfare is. Shootout never lasts hours, sometimes it doesn't even lasts minutes- it can last a second if your oponent knows what to hit and when. A quick yeet of a well placed rocket disables your ship's defenses and another breaks the ship in half, done- explosive reality check followed by very unpleasant physics of vaccum gets introduced to your crew. And if your enemy decides to keep the scrap and not make it adrift- say hello to getting sterilized with either high levels of radiation or temperature. The plaz missile is a death sentence if you get someone unprepared in setting of Expanse- crew is gone, keep the scraps (you just need to vent the corpses out and maybe replace some circuitry). I bet scummy criminals would use that to yoink vessels without needing to do that much outside repairs
Funny comparison. Babylon 5 had a thing about 'gun ports open' in the show - the earth-minbari war started basically because of 'gun ports open' but the ship models didn't HAVE gunports. the only hint of which was that b5's defense turrets happened to be hidden away the same way, but none of the SHIPS hid/protected their guns like that. The Donnie, and pretty much every MCRN ship, has these. The PDCS are all tucked away when not in combat. So even though B5 was basically a mix of 'hard' and 'soft' scifi in the space combat arena - the starfury's basically operating the same way as Expanse meanwhile all the alien ships excluding the narn have artificial gravity and stuff. REALLY wish that 'uh you've got your guns out What the hell dude?' issue from B5 was properly done in Expanse at some point.
For the Black Watch, a nuke is merely an inconvenience because they are too angry to die. The Black Watch likes whisky, bag pipes, and murder. - Thank you Mr. Tex of the BPL for those inspiring words.
In most Sci-Fi, missiles are not large enough to single hit kill a target vessel. Torpedoes tend to be at least large enough on their own to at least threaten a reshaping of the fight. And some can one hit kill the target vessel.
Like the vid very good, but hammer lock is for railgun range. So the longest range weapons they use in the expanse is torpedoes/missiles Then railguns and last but not the least the closest are the PDC's. Just wanted to add to your points they do use armour on the ships but as you said physics, the armour is usually matched to weapons of similar size. Also the reason they use pdc instead of flare counter measures is because the tracking command and control is superior to current day so its basically ineffective so pointless
Nukes used in a vacuum have a much pretty much no blast and little thermal effect. But the radioactive effects are much greater then used in atmosphere. So BSG nukes where more accurate to the damage done to ship structure. Other wise a really fun video to watch!
Ship naming conventions and the designations of weapons change over time. Torpedos didnt used to have propellers, they used to be sea mines. If you look at quotes and battle descriptions from the US civil war they called static sea mines topedos, so its not so far fetched to make a disticnt definition between space torpedos and space missiles based on the future context of the setting
Much of the destructive power of a nuclear weapon comes from how it interacts with an atmosphere. With regard to BSG, a lot would depend on where the device detonated.
Let's get this straight, torpedoes are only designed to mainly take out ships and do massive amounts of damage to them, so it makes sense to call it that in a space warfare setting. However, for a missile is more of a multi-purpose weapon, not only for ships but also fighters, gunships, satellites, etc missiles and torpedoes in a warfare sci fi setting can have pros and cons or similar to each other but are designed to do different things
At 3:00 you mention that ships in the expanse have a hard up limit how fast they can go. I think you meant accelerate because there is no upper limit how fast they can go theoretically. Just a little nit pick that's been bothering me.
To be fair, the nuke missile is in effect the counterpart to modern heavy torpedos. Complaining that it being an insta-kill weapon (on a hit) is unrealistic is naive. Just look at the SinkX exercises of the US navy. The ships take an immense beating from everything flying and floating shooting it with guns, missiles, cruise missiles, JDAMS, etc…. And when they *actually* want to sink the thing, boom goes the mk48 heavy torpedo and the ship is gone 30 seconds later because it breaks it in half
"Every single time we've seen a nuke hit a ship, there isnt a ship left over afterwards" Just wait, the Laconians might have something to say about the effectiveness of nukes.
One thing about the theory that confuses me that i was under the impression that into the pit was post fnaf 6 due to trash and the gang being dumped at the mill
The thing about Nukes in space...You'd basically get a big flash and some highly-energised particles. Lethal to say; an unarmoured target. Against armour? Not so much, unless they've created a nuke that utilises a 'munroe-effect.'
That's depend on whether or not the nuke was in contacts with the hull of the ship or if it's detonated next to it without touching . A properly armoured ship can survive the latter, nothing can withstand a nuke at literally touching range.
The expanse doesn't go much into detail about the g force juice, but classic military sci-fi novel "the forever war" sure does. The forever war is a little different, however, because in it crash couches are additionally inside a tank that fills up with extreme high pressure fluid. The g force juice dramatically increases your body's internal pressure, which equals out with the external pressure from the tank, and the result is... Well... Its like being a whale, essentially. Whales on land die horribly from the crushing weight of their own bodies, but suspended in the high pressure fluid environment of... Being in the water... They're fine. Its a similar principal.
Looking forward to the video about the Morrigan class. One nit picking thing I do not like about The Expanse. The way they classify their ship types. On Earth pre space. scout/patrol boat, corvette, frigate, destroyer, cruiser, and battleship. Mars does it like: patrol torpedo boats, patrol destroyer, frigate and the other larger ships.
![PLANETARY DEFENSE | How to protect your world from invasion [FIXED]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/m8rkp7NPgvs/mqdefault.jpg)
The Donnager doesn't even have a fusion reactor, it simply flies powered by pure Martian middle finger energy.
A great ship. But the captain was as impresses as this commentator, and that got it killed??
Mars suffers a lot from arrogance in their technology, and lack of experienced officers. Yao was captain of the baddest ship in the solar system and still lost. Hell, the ship was almost captured.
Earth ship: oh no, my 80yo central computer just glitched :( we gotta get back to base
Donnager: _*gets nuked_ = gives a fuck + diverts energy to railguns
You can't talk too much crap. The first fight we see the Donnager class in, it gets disabled, boarded, and almost captured.
@@Kazanko28 sounds like earther propaganda
I’m actually fairly certain that some of the fans of the Expanse books helped write some of the lore for use in the TV show. I know Spacedock here on TH-cam did a whole thing on it
0 27:53 😊ko90o90pv😮
It would make me happy that the producers let those with skill make their prioduct better.
Naomi's tattoo she gets are the spacedock logo
Didn't the authors of the Expanse also work in the TV show?
I think the name torpedo is just for "naval" tradition. The Russian Skval ,if I'm correct does not use a prop, it uses a chemical rocket but it's not a missile.
There are many things I like about The Expanse's naval doctrine. One being the weapons multi-task (This helps reduce issues with logistics).
There is one detail about when the Donnager is on screen that I really hate. Every time She shows up, she is killed. Sure she dies spectacularly, by showing off why she is feared, BUT she still dies.
Many WW2 naval weapons can multitask. Only the primary guns of battleships don’t as they’re too heavy(literally) for anti-aircraft role.
I wish we saw the Donny unload it’s hanger with Morrigan and Corvette class ships for a fight.
@@caelestigladii The Japanese battleships had AA rounds for their main guns, the San Shiki rounds, en.wikipedia.org/wiki/San_Shiki_(anti-aircraft_shell)
Yeah sadly the donnagers suffer from the worf effect, theyre always beat up by someone else to show how strong the bad guys are. I can think of a single time in the last book where a donnager finally gets to do damage and not be instantly exploded to hype up something else, and by that point its so hopelessly obsolete it still cant really do much
The Donnager class suffers from the same fatal flaw as any model modern battleship…. Our ability to destroy a ship far outweighs our ability to defend a ship.
World War II was the last hurrah for battleships because that was the last time in human history where navies had to point analogue computers with optical targeting at one another to aim at targets on the distant horizon…. 10 years after the end of the war, missiles made battleships obsolete.
The Donnager is big, the Donnager is powerful, it carries massive railguns… that are absurd levels of overkill and don’t really serve any useful purpose, other than to be absurd levels of overkill. Take them off and add more missiles to the magazine, and your ship is actually more useful in a combat situation.
The donut your class get its ass, beat every time it appears on screen, because the entire idea of a battleship is obsolete.
The only situation under which the Donnager excelled was anti-piracy …. Primarily because it was the big stick, and Pirates didn’t have the ability to overwhelm something with that many point defense guns on it in an actual naval engagement, though the MCR and wasted their entire military budget on making eight really large really juicy targets that the UNN is going to dispatch 100 vessels to destroy.
There are naval torpedoes that are rocket powered, the defining quality of a torpedo is its ability to be pushed out of a tube by an external force. Some torpedo launchers have used black powder, oxygen, or even a "plug" of water.
Some torpedoes are swim out tho
peroxide
Actually the difference between torpedoes and missiles is that torpedoes are fish and missiles are birds.
In practical terms, torpedoes and missiles are pretty much the same. The primary difference is that torpedoes operate in the ocean while missiles are aerial weapons. I've seen people try to argue that guidance makes the difference, with torpedoes being more command guided while missiles are self guided. In reality, both torpedoes and missiles can make use of similar guidance systems.
So, going to chip in here. The term Torpedo simply means a tube-shaped explosive device to be used in naval warfare and long pre-dates the self-propelled torpedo that we are familiar with. These could refer to anything from a weapon far more akin to a sea-mine which is actually where we get the famous quote "Damn the Torpedoes, full speed ahead" or the so called Bangalore Torpedoes that were used by landing forces to clear beach obstacles during WW2 that was basically a long tube filled with explosives carried by infantry.
The Expanse pulls nearly all it military terminology from Maritime navies, thus, a long range anti-ship weapon that carries a self-contained explosive warhead is a Torpedo, simply out of Naval tradition
I hate when people say 'sci-fi terminology is wrong'. Yes sometimes words may be technically not correct to their modern day usage, but terms and meaning drift over time due to culture or ease-of-use consideration, it's set in the future! How many rows or oars does a guided missile cruiser have? Orient the combat trireme to the enemy space station and fire all particle beams, prepare the Spartans for boarding!
I do agree, although I just like missile more, since missiles tend to be the primary ship to ship weapon in modern navies, and so it stands to reason that if navies ever ditch the oceans for the void of space, they'd still keep calling the big explody hurty stick that flies a missile. Although to be entirely fair, referring to moving through the vacuum of space as flight really is no more accurate than saying space battleships swim through the void.
@dfas I hate the argument that a Star Destroyer can't be a Star Destroyer on the basis that it's ''not the size of a destroyer'' when in fact, there is no determined size for destroyer, they started off as just torpedo boats with extra guns, and progressively they've gotten a lot bigger, the size and role of a destroyer has completely changed. Same goes for cruiser, originally a cruiser was any ship that's role was basically to go somewhere far away and do stuff, in ship of the line terms this can mean just about anything, because you have no fuel limitation. It took a long time for there to be any kind of consensus on what actually is a ''real'' cruiser, and of course, as if it wasn't all convoluted enough these things also varied, and still vary from navy to navy.
My favorite part of the lore is that Spacedock youtube channel got to create lore for ships and companies.
In the later books the Laconia special ships that push like 20G acceleration, forcing the crew to be put in a liquid bed so they don’t turn to mush. The hard science of The Expanse can not be found in pretty much any sci-fi.
What I'd give to see a Magnetar-class onscreen.
They took that from Forever War, I think.
Terra invicta/ Children of a dead earth/ Kerbal space program players staring at you from behind.
I don't see ships in the expanse have radiators so their going to melt themselves when they even try to turn on the engine.
Should read the three body problem also very good hard sci-fi
@@許進曾 yeah Children of a Dead Earth is the most hard sci-fi game I've ever played. I guess big radiators wouldn't work aesthetically with the Expanse's ships but I do love how they look
I was an engineer on the USS Kitty Hawk CV-63. We were like 1069 feet long 300ish meters and the heaviest I ever weighed her at was 86,292 tons. Our power to weight ratio was um... nice 280,000 shaft horsepower.
*technician. You're not an actual engineer.
@@Vilakazi What makes you say that?
@@Vilakazi are you?
They are an actual engineer
@@Vilakazi You know I'd think somebody would know what they worked as. Stop getting so caught up on symantics things like technician & Engineer basically mean the same thing & it depends more on the employer.
It's not mentioned on the show but it is in the books: in The Expanse, under high-g and combat maneuvers, most of the crew is on the juice and sedated in their racks/crash couches with only a bare minimum conscious and operational.
Also, the ports at the back of the PDCs aren't separate thrusters, they're exhaust for propellant gases to counteract recoil.
Also, Roci ends up using her aftermarket railgun as a thruster, doing the space version of grenade-jumping.
In military sci-fi the difference in missiles and torps are the role they play. missiles are weapons that are used for multiple applications, i.e.: anti-fighter, ground attack, and ECM. Torps are strictly used in the anti-ship role. they are orders of magnitude larger than missiles and are almost exclusively nuclear in nature, either contact nukes or some form of laser head.
For those that don't know a laser head is a bomb pumped x-ray laser with multiple lasing rods orientated in all directions. See the Honor Harington books by David Weber.
Interesting note: The bomb pumped laser concept was originally thought up in the 1970's, and in the mid 1980's Ronald Reagen's SDI program came up with the laser head concept from that. It is something we could really build today.
I was under the impression the Donnager could carry six Corvette class frigates. Each berthing space could be taken up by two Morrigan class patrol destroyers. Capt. Yao used this option to increase the range of her net during Oper. Silent Wall. If I'm mistaken, my apologies.
You're correct, it has six bays which can carry either one Corvette-class each or two Morrigan-class destroyers. I believe the Donnager carried a 50/50 mix, 3 Corvettes and 6 Morrigans.
some Submarines do carry rocket powered torpedo's - the expanse was AWESOME
You forgot to feed Steve and now he's dead. Another banger of a vid RC.
I fell in love with the Donnager from the book and show, it's such an incredibly aggressive monster.
I... LOVE... THE... EXPANSE! One of the most accurately represented sci-fi space shows I've seen.
Accurate to what age of science? The exapnce is a futuristic show, while sticking (mostly) to science we understand TODAY. Who's to say in four hundred years we wont be able to manipulate gravity? See the oxymoron here? Showing future tech, but doing it while sticking to what we currently understand of the sciences.
@@nihilityjoey according to today's understanding of physics but you are correct
Could you do the Truman class dreadnought as your next expanse vid? It’s my favourite Un ship and the donnager’s counterpart.
Maybe the Timberwolf for your next battletech vid.
The next expanse vid is going to be a new style of content for the cahnnel. It's a battle breakdown of the donnager verses the stealth ships from season one episode 3. But some UN ships and more mechs are absolutely coming.
@@scienceinsanity6927 I would love to see that breakdown! I think that battle was fascinating because it showed that the most advanced military technology in the MCRN was ultimately vulnerable to what amounted to civilian level technology on earth
@@scienceinsanity6927 Nice, been waiting for a battle breakdown for taht cuz I watched the show but still had trouble understanding waht was happening.
@@scienceinsanity6927 Great video, but I would highly suggest you don't have any background music. I strongly believe it is distracting, annoying, and unnecessary (especially for videos with lots of talking). I also believe that people want to hear you speak/get information and not hear generic background music that doesn't really add anything useful and that people have to mentally filter out. Plus it will be less work for you.
Ballistic defense weapons against incoming missiles are the last line of defense, modern ships use missiles to intercept enemy missiles/mortars or artillery, the guidance systems allow a much better hit probability & tracking with a higher payload than rounds could carry thus a much higher intercept probability (because incoming ordnance is actually destroyed by shrapnel that is generated by rounds/interceptor missiles exploding near them)
In modern combat there are at least 5 layers of defense for something like a carrier, first one being long range radar, second being friendly aircraft like fighters, third being long range interceptor missiles, forth being countermeasures (electronic that block guidance systems in missiles + active ones like flares to confuse heat seaking) and the last line of defense are radar guided automated turrets (the PDCs from the expanse).
I think they really slept on a lot of already existing tec in the show, a military combat ship in the future would have exponentially more combat capabilities then it is depicted.
It’s largely baked into the plot. The Rosinante has a skeleton crew responsible for everything …. Thus almost everything on the ship is automated.
If we assume that the level of automation involved in something like that carries through to the combat systems, ECM and counter, ECM would also be automated. It’s probably simply not talked about because the PDC’s look cooler on screen.
Realistically, defensive missiles, would just leave flak in the path of oncoming offensive missiles…. Allowing them to shred themselves before impact.
It’s a moot point anyway.
In a university where acceleration vastly outpaces human endurance, virtually all combat would be done by drones anyway.
The benefit of a platform, the size of a Donnager, aside from its long range railguns, would be its carrying capacity, its ability to play freight train and haul a fleet of drones into combat.
Donnagers actual PDC count is closer to 36-42 than 59 based on what is shown onscreen. Spacedock came up with the 59 number.
Yes, to battle breakdowns
Yes, to more Expanse
Yes, to feeding Stephen...He hates it when I spell it that way....
Hehehehe......
I think the battle scenes are one of the best things in The Expanse.
But off topic about the Donager, the Aliens: Colonial Marines Technical Manual did talk about how space combat, much like The Expanse. The missile is the primary weapon and is best used for long distance, while the railguns are close combat weapons. Lasers are used for point defense. The armor, also is only good for against energy weapons and not kinetic weapons.I think the only difference is emission control, meaning knowing when to use your sensors to attack. It's almost like submarine warfare.
I know this was a year ago, but it was an exceptional dive into the ship. Thank you.
I do love the Donnie class.
I can’t believe they canceled this show, it was literally the best thing on TV/streaming; God I hate Hollywood.
Read the books. They’re great.
@@bobskywalker2707 definitely will, I just hope they resurrect this show again because it was fantastic.
Well it was always planned as a six season run covering everything up to the massive time jump between books six and seven so I wouldn't exactly say it was canceled. More like it had finally reached a good spot to take a break. They needed to recast every character or wait for the cast to age up a bit for the next section of the story.
@@jamesjellis there was so much potential.
@@Beavereaver there still is.
i like to think that there is a tech-priest in the engine room applying sacred oils and chantting prayers to the machine spirits of these MARTIAN MADE BEASTS based on this old game from earths distant past called WARHAMMER 40K.
Let me correct you - not "distant past" but DISTANT FUTURE.
Because it is 300-400.M2 in Expanse.
I seem to remember that the first nuke that hit Galactica caused substantial damage, and the nuke that went up in the civilian fleet completely destroyed at least one ship.
Agreed it was explicitly mentioned that the Jupiter class battle stars were specifically armored to survive several hits by nukes on top of being able to withstand hefty amounts of damage from the conventional cannons and missiles employed by both sides of the Cylon war.
Flying Death Prism pog. All I gotta say.
I thought the Martians had the Superior Navy albeit smaller Navy and the Earthers had the bigger one?!
That depends on how you define superior. Earth navy was vastly larger than Mars, but Mars had newer ships because earth was spending all of its money on welfare for its ludicrously large population.
They do, but Earths fleet is old and in constant maintenance. The UNN flagship, Agatha King was really old, as show in it's introduction with all the crew effecting repairs on the bridge and the glib line of it falling apart.
Corvette class frigate sounds like a great way to just absolutely confuse your enemies. "They have 4 corvettes!" Claims the scout, so you move in and boom, there's 4 line ship that are more than ready to destroy you for thinking they were some rinky dinky corvettes.
At best the enemy makes a mistake and completely underestimates the power of your fleet, at worst it annoys the hell out of them. In short it's just a F. U. to the enemy and I love it.
Space dock has described the Doni as having “Sheer middle finge energy” in context to the anst barrage when Marco took the ring and I think it fits.
In order to avoid a projectile, you need to detect the projectile. That is difficult, even with radar. With multiple sources of projectiles, that is more difficult still.
Modern air defense systems, particularly naval, track hundreds of projectiles
@@weir-t7y I am well aware. And each projectile takes resources, which are finite. Finite power and finite cooling for the radar system that must dissipate that power. Time is one of the most abundant resources in a phased array radar because so much is spent cooling and so little spent radiating.
Interesting Sci FI bit on nukes. The Imperium of Man on Warhammer 40k views nukes as illegal weapons only to be used to kill planets under authorization form the highest of commanders. This in a universe were bio weapons, Poison gas human waves etc. are common.
"But Amaris had himself a problem...the goddamned Black Watch"
Yay reference
So, wouldn't our solar system be surrounded by an ever-increasing cloud of hellishly fast PDC rounds... It'd be the greatest navigational hazard ever.
I freaking love The Expanse! Hope to see more of this content! Great vid man!
The thing with nukes and conventional warheads is, it's not the fireball that does the damage, it's the shockwave and with no atmosphere there is no shockwave. So unless the enemy ship did not vacate it's atmosphere (which would allow for the boom to ripple through the ship) the damage would just be some molted plating (heat still transferes into it). So no nukes should not end ships, they are just more heat and cosmic radiation to ship (basically bigger plasma missiles).
I loved The Expanse, it was one of the best Sci Fi series ever in my opinion it was filmed in Canada.
WHY!!! The Ramen Ah??? I am never going to be able to pronounce the words amun-ra the same again!😂😂 I just started being able to do it with Channing Tatum.
I love your videos guy, my friends and I joke and talk to each other the same way. And we love aggravating each other to the point where the other one says "it's fine whatever it's fine'" too cracking jokes and teasing each other like this is seriously fundamental to our friendships, so I love the nerd friend banter you guys have on this video. My friends and I are a little bit older now so we don't get to do much of that anymore, so hearing you guys do it brings a nice warm fuzzy to a special place in my heart I love it, this is how smart creative nerdy people Express profound feelings of love for one another don't ever change it!
And if I haven't said it thank you for putting these together not only do I like the source material I've enjoyed your brand of delivery very much. I'm a disabled veteran so I spend a lot of time at home scouring TH-cam nerdy fun science stuff and when I find one, like yours I will watch THE SHIT out of it! Totally going to love exploring this Channel and seeing what other excellent stuff you have to offer any personal favorites or recommendations?
Hey, it was pretty good and had most of the banter in pragmatic science pretty spot on, particularly about acceleration forces. For some reason people think the 9G rating of some fighter aircraft relates to a sustainable biological figure but truth is that's not even sustainable for those aircraft.
Now I only point this out because I love this stuff as much as you do, but the functionality of nukes in space is a bit off. In fact BSG got it right and the Expanse less so. There are plenty of science channels that have discussed the real physics of nukes in space but the short version is microwave cooker, no pressure wave. The reason we think they're so devastating is because of their effect in atmosphere, which tremendously magnifies its destructive power. In space they're not even an effective weapon unless detonated at very close range and all the damage is radiation type, mainly gamma rays and energetic radiation the kind spacecraft are ideally well shielded against as mundane protection from cosmic and stellar rays. Yes they're very intense but a good analogy would be a very powerful microwave oven cooking a portion of the ship next to the detonation point. It is not as materially destructive as a very good chemical warhead in space, which can still produce a significant pressure wave in the form of a reactive chemical expansion. Or perhaps some combination of a significant chemical warhead detonated by a nuclear trigger. If you were going to have nukes in space as a tactical ship weapon that would be the best form, nuclear trigger for a stupidly insane chemical reaction warhead.
But pure nukes. Think BSG.
Re Nukes and Battletech. In BT lore, they indicate that the initial navy battles were nuke fests that result in mutual destruction. This was also often the case with ground combat too.
Battlemechs partially mitigated this issue as they could walk around a nuclear battlefield with out issue unless hit (near) directly. Also one of the reasons that the First Succession War was so brutal and most warships didn't make it past the second war and none made it to the third. All of them, and the facilities to make them, were destroyed.
I worked on the show. They built most of the Rossi such that you could film all around, through, and inside it in a single take.
Rumour has it that the cast is pushing to do another BSG reboot.
Terran Fleet: The British Navy pre First Sea Lord Admrial Jackie Fisher
Marshin Fleet: The British Navy with the fleet Jackie Built.
I love shit like this. Will be looking forward to further ship breakdown videos, especially from The Expanse universe. The prolog breaking down the rules of the universe was very well done.
I'm going to be a pendant and say the term "torpedo" was used as a carry over from wet navy nomenclature, and as you mentioned, to differentiate between offensive and defensive armaments.
It's entirely plausible that in the future the definition of Torpedo has "expanded" (lol) to include space-borne anti ship fireworks.
Torpedoes are actually floating mines, MOTOR torpedoes a what you are describing. Pedantic sure, however, I bring this up in defense of the setting. Language changes over time to adapt to the need for communication. Missiles mean shoulder fired stuff, small scale intercept work etc and torpedoes are anti ship weapons, its not just for the audience It's for everyone involved to rapidly ID what you are talking about.
The "juice" was described in the books as a cocktail of mostly painkillers and sedatives, with some anti-coagulants, vasodilatiors, and muscle relaxers sprinkled in. Most passengers and non-essential crew would be sedated for any maneuvers that would require the juice. Essential crew, in civilian vessels, this was usually just the pilot, would have amphetamines mixed with their formulations to keep them awake in case anything went wrong. In book 4, when there was rush to settle the new worlds, the demand for "the juice" was so high that the crew of Roci could only get their hands on some of the lowest quality formulations, which was described as mostly just morphine.
Oh yeah, it's a realisitic series.
SHRAPNEL
becuase of FRACTION OF LIGHTSPEED SLUG.
Actually I believe you’re wrong about the carry capacity, as I recall it can carry 1 frigate or two destroyers in each of it’s six hanger spaces
I'm a simple man: I see Donnie, I put my like
I came here from your RagingCanadian channel and loved this video! I'm done with Wow and wargaming myself and very happy that you have a second channel that creates good content, because I like your "style". I'll be looking out for more take care!
The best part of the Expanse's ships is that they put the command and control systems and flight crew in the core of the ship behind the thickest armor. Because when you're flying a warship through space that's exactly where you'd wanna be.
The Notebooks of Lazarus Long tell us: "Stupidity is the Universe's only capital crime and the sentence is meted out immediately and without mercy."
If you equipped a space missile with an Alcubierre Warp Drive I would call it a torpedo.
Nukes' effects in-atmosphere are very different than in a vacuum. No atmosphere means no shockwave. Shockwave is a *huge* part of why terrestrial nukes are as devastating as they are.
How wrong can a statement be? There is a shockwave in space, not an atmospheric shock wave but a massive amount of particles. Also, 200-300 million degrees Celsius (The sun is only 15 million Celsius at its core) has been measured during the Cold War as the US and USSR set medium size nuclear weapons. Do some research, take a physics class. You must have been sleeping in science class.
@@marcusanton95 It's a relative matter. Compared to *in-atmosphere*, where the explosion is able to compress and displace a wall of said atmosphere, there is a significant shockwave effect. Absent that compressible, pushable atmosphere, the only thing the nuke has is a couple pounds of nuclear fuel-remnants to push. Its primary effects are radiation.
@@ferricoxide Project Orion Study showed the blast wave was capable of propelling a vehicle at speeds of 10,000 Kilometers a second using just a few medium size Nuclear bombs detonated at a safe distance. This is done by the incredible shockwave.
NASA's plan to used stand-off nuclear weapons to deflect asteroids. This uses the shockwave created. NASA also has direct detonation on the surface, this vaporizes much of the surface area, turning the escaping gas as jets to move the object along with the shockwave. Which of them you choose has to do with speed, size, when it's detected (how much time we have) and composition of the object.
It would seem that MIT and NASA disagree with your assessment of the effects of such weapons in space. This is where my understanding of the subject comes from, studies, science journals and the like. If they're wrong then I'm wrong.
If I remember correctly, the Donnagers actually have the power to mount all 4 Foehammers. The only reason they don't mount the other 2 is because the ship literally cannot handle the stress of firing 4 guns. Also, plasma torps are for stripping armour off of a target to leave bigger ships open to being gutted by PDC fire.
You mention Galactica as unarmoured, she wasn't. She was under-crewed and under-armed.
Wing Commander series used "Torpedoes" for anti-ship missiles as well
Love the Blackwatch mention
Good thing about this "unclimactic" combat in Expanse- it showcases how brutal warfare is.
Shootout never lasts hours, sometimes it doesn't even lasts minutes- it can last a second if your oponent knows what to hit and when. A quick yeet of a well placed rocket disables your ship's defenses and another breaks the ship in half, done- explosive reality check followed by very unpleasant physics of vaccum gets introduced to your crew. And if your enemy decides to keep the scrap and not make it adrift- say hello to getting sterilized with either high levels of radiation or temperature.
The plaz missile is a death sentence if you get someone unprepared in setting of Expanse- crew is gone, keep the scraps (you just need to vent the corpses out and maybe replace some circuitry). I bet scummy criminals would use that to yoink vessels without needing to do that much outside repairs
Funny comparison. Babylon 5 had a thing about 'gun ports open' in the show - the earth-minbari war started basically because of 'gun ports open' but the ship models didn't HAVE gunports. the only hint of which was that b5's defense turrets happened to be hidden away the same way, but none of the SHIPS hid/protected their guns like that.
The Donnie, and pretty much every MCRN ship, has these. The PDCS are all tucked away when not in combat. So even though B5 was basically a mix of 'hard' and 'soft' scifi in the space combat arena - the starfury's basically operating the same way as Expanse meanwhile all the alien ships excluding the narn have artificial gravity and stuff.
REALLY wish that 'uh you've got your guns out What the hell dude?' issue from B5 was properly done in Expanse at some point.
Please do a video on the space combat sim called Children of A Dead Earth, for even harder sci-fi
Wow, why did I just stumble now on this channel?
21:05 From this point on I had the Jetpack Joyride song in my head until the end of the video...
Beautiful work. Thank you.
For the Black Watch, a nuke is merely an inconvenience because they are too angry to die. The Black Watch likes whisky, bag pipes, and murder.
- Thank you Mr. Tex of the BPL for those inspiring words.
@17:32 Aw, it's just a little frigate. We can deal with that, no problem.
Rocinante: [angry porcupine noises]
In most Sci-Fi, missiles are not large enough to single hit kill a target vessel.
Torpedoes tend to be at least large enough on their own to at least threaten a reshaping of the fight. And some can one hit kill the target vessel.
I felt personally attacked about the Battletech comment.
Man you are soooo right!!! All of it are missiles...
Always a bit surprised that the series didn't have official model kits, like Star Trek or Star Wars. The series was popular enough.
"Mach Jesus" "Just Chacha Slide out of the way" :D
Like the vid very good, but hammer lock is for railgun range.
So the longest range weapons they use in the expanse is torpedoes/missiles
Then railguns and last but not the least the closest are the PDC's.
Just wanted to add to your points they do use armour on the ships but as you said physics, the armour is usually matched to weapons of similar size.
Also the reason they use pdc instead of flare counter measures is because the tracking command and control is superior to current day so its basically ineffective so pointless
i agree with you about the "torpedo's"
love the enthusiasm!
17:10 Aircraft-carrying cruiser Admiral Kuznetchov says hi.
In lore they use the word Torpedo because it's common naval terminology.
The Donny was an awesome looking ship.
EXTRA hard points can also mean more missile/torpedoes & launchers.
Nukes used in a vacuum have a much pretty much no blast and little thermal effect. But the radioactive effects are much greater then used in atmosphere. So BSG nukes where more accurate to the damage done to ship structure. Other wise a really fun video to watch!
Geez i am getting all needy watching her
My favorite ship in the Expanse.
Ship naming conventions and the designations of weapons change over time. Torpedos didnt used to have propellers, they used to be sea mines. If you look at quotes and battle descriptions from the US civil war they called static sea mines topedos, so its not so far fetched to make a disticnt definition between space torpedos and space missiles based on the future context of the setting
Knowing what 11b crunchy is got my sub :D
Much of the destructive power of a nuclear weapon comes from how it interacts with an atmosphere. With regard to BSG, a lot would depend on where the device detonated.
Let's get this straight, torpedoes are only designed to mainly take out ships and do massive amounts of damage to them, so it makes sense to call it that in a space warfare setting. However, for a missile is more of a multi-purpose weapon, not only for ships but also fighters, gunships, satellites, etc missiles and torpedoes in a warfare sci fi setting can have pros and cons or similar to each other but are designed to do different things
Have you guys done a video on something from the Frontlines series of books by Marko Kloos?
At 3:00 you mention that ships in the expanse have a hard up limit how fast they can go. I think you meant accelerate because there is no upper limit how fast they can go theoretically. Just a little nit pick that's been bothering me.
Just as a point of comparison, the Donnager is about the size of a Dreadnought-class heavy cruiser, or the length of 3 CR90s.
Love the Expanse! ❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️
To be fair, the nuke missile is in effect the counterpart to modern heavy torpedos. Complaining that it being an insta-kill weapon (on a hit) is unrealistic is naive.
Just look at the SinkX exercises of the US navy.
The ships take an immense beating from everything flying and floating shooting it with guns, missiles, cruise missiles, JDAMS, etc…. And when they *actually* want to sink the thing, boom goes the mk48 heavy torpedo and the ship is gone 30 seconds later because it breaks it in half
"Every single time we've seen a nuke hit a ship, there isnt a ship left over afterwards"
Just wait, the Laconians might have something to say about the effectiveness of nukes.
Hopefully we get to see it. I've read all 9 books multiple times. The books and the show are my favorite of all time. Instant classics.
One thing about the theory that confuses me that i was under the impression that into the pit was post fnaf 6 due to trash and the gang being dumped at the mill
The thing about Nukes in space...You'd basically get a big flash and some highly-energised particles. Lethal to say; an unarmoured target. Against armour? Not so much, unless they've created a nuke that utilises a 'munroe-effect.'
That's depend on whether or not the nuke was in contacts with the hull of the ship or if it's detonated next to it without touching . A properly armoured ship can survive the latter, nothing can withstand a nuke at literally touching range.
The Rocinante used a rail gun as a thruster in the 3rd book iirc.
30:47
Does this battle-armor make my thighs look fat?
No, your thighs make the battle-armor look fat.
When my ships RCS system is damaged or disabled they DO use their guns as their RCS.
The expanse doesn't go much into detail about the g force juice, but classic military sci-fi novel "the forever war" sure does. The forever war is a little different, however, because in it crash couches are additionally inside a tank that fills up with extreme high pressure fluid. The g force juice dramatically increases your body's internal pressure, which equals out with the external pressure from the tank, and the result is... Well... Its like being a whale, essentially. Whales on land die horribly from the crushing weight of their own bodies, but suspended in the high pressure fluid environment of... Being in the water... They're fine. Its a similar principal.
Expanse has a similar gel past the tome skip
Looking forward to the video about the Morrigan class. One nit picking thing I do not like about The Expanse. The way they classify their ship types. On Earth pre space. scout/patrol boat, corvette, frigate, destroyer, cruiser, and battleship. Mars does it like: patrol torpedo boats, patrol destroyer, frigate and the other larger ships.
can yall do some farscape lore?
Nice Scotty Quote.