@@wraithcadmus For me, trying to run (originally) on a P120, the frame rate (even in software mode) actually wasn't ever really bad... it just took forever once a battle was triggered to actually transition into the battle. Having a Voodoo3 did make it look really nice though.
Yep. Still, honestly, it should say "It still works on XP... mostly/with some quirks". Maybe the "for more details (visit webpage)" part addressed that?
The fact that I was able to tell both the true SC-88 and SC-55 mapping is both worrying, concerning and impressive. I have spent too much time with MIDI and GMIDI. Thank you for perserving this gem from the past.
I used to use Roland VCS for all of my composing back in the Win XP days and it was so much clearer than the standard Windows MIDI. Had a lot of great extra sounds too. I was sad I couldn't install it in later versions of Windows, and never found a good soundfont equivalent.
funnily enough, I found the opposite to be true in more recent times. FL Studio (and perhaps other modern MIDI sequencers) has a method for directly using the default GM.DLS soundbank, and applies 'proper' resampling so it's less noisy. The VST version of VCS (which uses the same engine as VSC3 driver) has a worse resampler. The actual raw soundbank quality is very similar. The real difference is the resampling and the effects (reverb/chorus/echo used to make the difference). No clue if it had extra sounds though, didn't seem to be significant.
The VSC's "Secure Memory" feature is probably what would be causing the bugchecks you were getting with playback before. Having it set to "Always allocate" usually keeps it more stable (If I remember correctly), as constantly trying to write memory from the kernel is... a bad idea in general. I've got to say, I was not expecting VSC to be archived in a proper way. I've been exposed to this software before but only on software collections on some CDs or long-dead FTP directories. Thanks for being cool with the archiving.
Ah, this brings back memories! A Power Mac 8500, MacOS 9.0.4, Logic Platinum 4.8, and Roland VSC. It all integrated beautifully and I had that setup for quite a few years.
I had Virtual Sound Canvas back in the day! I became an avid internet user back in the 90s when MIDIs were a big thing, and they helped cultivate my interest in electronic music production. So when I found out about Roland releasing this software product that would let your computer play back MIDIs in a way that sounded like some of their dedicated music hardware, I was thrilled.
Edirol was Roland’s desktop media arm, I think they tried to sell music and video hardware to schools. That first demo sounds like Eric Persing (Spectrasonics) who did a lot of demo stuff for Roland back in the 90s.
Seems like this was a precursor to Roland Sound Canvas VA, a software synthesizer and VSTi plugin Roland made several years ago. I use it with my DOSBox all the time and it's so good with old DOS games, it completely eliminates the need to buy the real Sound Canvas module, since it emulates it near perfectly.
I pirated the Virtual Sound Canvas in the early 2000s because I liked the sounds when composing and arranging sheet music. I was in high school, but it's so cool to see this again. I removed it from my PC when I stopped pirating years ago, but I have great memories of it!
Amazing find! I've been using SoundBlaster Live hardware on my retro machines that don't have ISA slots. After searching around for the perfect "SC-55 like" soundfont, which does not exist, you found what may be the holy grail of SC-55 emulation. Thank you so much for this video, and for archiving this!
This is brilliant! I've been looking for a version of the Roland Virtual Sound Canvas that didn't require a cloud subscription to maintain for ages. Ironically, I ended up buying a Dreamblaster X2GS wavetable daughterboard which uses genuine licensed SC-55 samples to scratch the Roland itch. I completely concur with Descent being one of my go-to MIDI game as well. I also like to test with Warcraft II for GM. Growing up, I had a Yamaha SW60XG card to play these games and I'm so glad I kept that card. Thank you for archiving this and doing a deep dive into the virtual sound canvas. This helps complete the set getting proper Roland SC-55 support virtually. Cheers!
@@Nukle0n Yes. The Redbook audio on the CDs is a recording of the compositions from the composer's Roland SC-55 Mk. II (or so the story goes...) It's a rare case where you can snag the MIDI files from the game and directly compare with a synth of your choice and the music as the composer intended from the CD.
@@DankRedditMemes That's been the fun part... finding a version of Sound Canvas VA that didn't need an active Roland Cloud subscription. Admittedly, I never finished doing an "exhaustive search" once I found a different hardware solution.
I've done the comparison with a real SC-55 Mk. II and I think the CD audio just has some minor adjustments or post-processing. It's really close and I was super giddy when I first got it playing through the device. Also cool to see what the soundtrack was like on a Yamaha MU-80.
16:30 I have a MIDI for the opening theme of Sensible Golf. On every computer I’ve played it on, it plays fine. Except for one, my Toshiba Satellite Pro 4600, and **only** on Windows 2000. It immediately blue screens when playing it through its Yamaha AC-XG chipset. On XP and 98SE though, it’s fine!
This is so awesome. I used to have a Roland Sound Canvas SC-55 back in the day. The default piano sound was really good (which prompted me to get it) back when it was introduced. Not bad for a lower priced sound module. The synth, bass and drum sounds were very good for putting ideas together. There was a game I had that featured mecha robot warriors from Japan and it was compatible with GM so it played the soundtrack like a dream. Good times.
I remember having the SoundBlaster AWE32, which actually had memory slots (RAM). You could load "Soundfonts" into this memory, in order for the Soundcard to use Wavetable Synthesis (modifying a recorded sound sample) for Midi instead of relying on FM-Synthesis (trying to generate a sound out of nothing). The larger SoundFont Files you had (and loaded), the better the output sound was. I think at the end I had 2x8 MB Modules installes in my Soundcard and loaded the corresponding Soundfonts. The Midi Sounds, were just beyond any other Soundcard at that time. It might be worth looking into that extraordinary card :)
Ohh BTW, later Soundblasters with PCI supported to use the system memory to even load larger sound fonts, it's kind of interesting to hear the sound quality difference between the SoundFont files.
As somewhat of a pianist, I can totally see how the Music Tutor could be helpful. Once you *do* know how to play piano, and just need a little boost, a little help, along the continual learning process, especially for certain pieces - this seems to fit that niche nicely - like a precursor to Synthesia and similar.
Thanks for this. Stumbled on a retro pc on fb and immediately aearched TH-cam when I noticed roland support in audio outputs and spent the evening enjoying dos game music much in the same way.
Duuuuuude! This is one awesome find! One things for sure, you've just changed how I game on my retro PCs! I used to use the MT32 emulator but it was a little cumbersome. Weird how VisualMT works. I'd have assumed the same thing...
Thank you so much for the video. I love experimenting with different software synths on different systems. For Windows 10, I use CoolSoft VirtualMIDISynth for MIDI. On a virtual Windows 3.11 system, I use WinGroove and for a virtual Windows 98 system; Yamaha XG Soft Synth. I was stuck with the default (and rather lame) Windows Roland GS Soft synth for Windows XP until I stumbled across your video. Now MIDI sounds so much better on that system with the Roland Virtual Sound Canvas, which can add reverb and chorus to midi tracks.
Killer video Shelby. Would have liked to se more hands-on exploration of different sounds, but I respect your perspective as more of a gamer more than a musician. Or am I assuming wrongly?
My cat also likes to sit next to my keyboard, sometimes on top of my mouse, and demand fuss-tax. Makes playing a particular mouse dexterity marble exploring game extremely difficult. My cat loves when I use retro computers on the table at the window more than when I use my modern laptop. He hasn't worked out that CRTs are warm yet.
It's a damn shame that MIDI is virtually forgotten now for video games. Sure, "real" music sounds better, but you just can't beat that distinctive MIDI sound for some things. Hell, Microsoft have removed almost all the MIDI features from Windows these days beyond basic playback, but thankfully we still have software like VirtualMIDISyth to give us control back... Plus selectable soundfounts!
@@fordesponja for video games MIDI is still widely used with instruments as it's _the_ standard for communication between an instrument and either another instrument or a computer
Oh my. I'd love something like this for Windows 10 (and up)! Fantastic! This brings back such fond memories of playing Descent and Duke 3D, but with a Yamaha TG-300 instead of a Roland Sound Canvas. Good times!
Man, GS MIDI is such a vibe. Hey, I am currently using those same Creative speakers in a funky bi amped setup! I use them for the highs/ high mids, and some big RCA bookshelf speakers for the mids and lows. The piano lessons didnt seem too complicated, 6/8 was the 3rd time signature I learned as a kid iirc. Edirol Orchestral was neat. It was sorta like Sound Canvas but focused specifically on more realistic, natural sounding orchestral sounds. I actually still have a copy of Edirol Orchestral on my PC.
Worth noting that nowadays there's an option of Sound Canvas VA, which if you don't mind price tag and a few more steps when setting it up, should be a lot closer to real thing, at least for newer PCs or if you have a spare pc for usage as MIDI device. A bit of a shame you didn't mention it in the video.
The hardware Soundcavas was one of my main midi playback modules for composing in the 1990s. I then also used Virtual Sound Canvas for playback in the 2000s. Not great for acoustic instruments (except percussion), but really great for electronic sounds.
Well that solves a mystery I've been hanging onto for a while. I have seen those serial MIDI inputs since the 90s, and never once ran across anything that plugged into them, or even any software that I was aware of that supported them.
I've been itching to get the Roland sound on my modern PC in software and I can't afford the modern VST plug-in you can get that emulates the SC55 so I think I'm going to get virtual sound canvas a try.
The crashing could be down to your hardware raid controller using a shared irq or resources with other components, try disabling serial port and parallel ports.
On my first computer I had a soundcard integrated (unusable for midi) I later bought a used SoundBlaster Awe32, and it was an incredible improvement (Then SoundBlaster Live, Audigy etc). I tried Midi with many programs on windows 95 and newer. I had a Yamaha XG 100 synthesizer sound emulator on windows XP. Thanks for the interesting video. It reminded me of the days of the midi era. Then I tried music in MOD, XM, S3M etc. But that was a different category and before PC it was music in those formats on the Amiga computer.
The Sound Canvas software is still available and being sold today but, unfortunately, only as part of the Roland Cloud subscription (ouch). Up to a few years ago, you could still purchase it directly from their web. Compared to this early version, it has a revamped interface and a new audio engine, and I'm pretty sure it no longer creates a virtual MIDI device and it will just work like any other VST plugin instead (however, you have plenty of options if you want to connect a VST to any MIDI input). It has been always marketed to professional musicians who want to add some retro sounding instruments to their productions, so it should have pretty low latency and great quality.
Two words: Yamaha XG. The peak of computer MIDI standards, nothing can touch it. There were software version of their flagship sound cards with XG midi, S-YXG50 and 100, the latter almost on par with SW1000XG hardware. No, I didn't watch the video yet but I do know Roland MT and I stand by my comment :D
With the sound canvas enabled, then you won't hear when you press the keys but you can get the visual feed back as you press the keys along with the accompaniment.
This software is awesome! Just added it to my windows xp machine and even though it does have a good soundcard it's fun to play around with. Thank you very much :)
I cannot get any midi sound from the VSC in games with Windows 98se. What am i doing wrong??, i have it selected as the midi output device. Specs are PIII 700 and Soundblaster 16 CT2910 etc.
1. VSC doesn't support 32 channels, it only has 16. 2. The integrated MIDI player on VSC crashes a LOT on Windows XP, almost every single time. I can play any 16-channel MIDI file with Windows Media Player, XGPlayer and Falconsoft SoundFont Midi Player just fine, but not the integrated VSC MIDI player. 3. VSC doesn't support EFX.
I have a problem of understanding here. If I can use a normal simple soundcard (SoundBlaster for example) plus the VSC software to get MIDI sound, why should I buy a hardware MIDI controller?
The blue screen points to a RAM problem. It's possible that VSC was using a part of the RAM that was defective. Another explanation could be that VSC is accessing memory it shouldn't - keep in mind that W9x wasn't as sophisticated as XP is when it comes to terms of memory protection.
From Windows XP and on, Windows came with a cut-down licensed by Roland Virtual Sound Canvas Built-In with a custom patch reduced sound sample patch set of like 2MB at the light setting like 22kHz. There was a hack going around that you could get the full Sound Canvas 3.0 8MB sound sample set that you could just copy the 8MB dll file over top of the 2MB one to get like a full upgrade to the high quality 44kHz over the built in cut down GS set at 22kHz. *edit, actually, it may have come on Windows Me or Windows 98SE as well...I can't remember.
I think it came in ME and it was the 3.5 MB GM/GS set. You are absolutely right that the DLS file could be easily replaced, but the 22 kHz mix rate had nothing to do with the sample set itself. Actually, the bigger DLS files did only contain more samples, not necessarily higher quality (although some really were of higher quality). The mixrate however could be set to 44.1 if you used an application that used MIDI via DirectMusic instead of WinMM.dll (such as Winamp). This way, you could get essentially the same sound out of a stock Windows Me or XP PC without installing Roland VSC.
I still have the Virtual Sound Canvas in my Virtual Machines to this day. I haven't been making videos from it from burn out after years of history on my Channel.
Have you seen Roland's Vima Tunes Player program? It's basically Virtual Sound Canvas, but in a form of a karaoke machine. Although VTP has some flaws and missing features that VSC previously had, it's an OK MIDI player so I kinda recommend to check it out since the program works on modern Windows OS(s). Along with Vima Tunes Player, there's also a SMF/MIDI to WAV converter program made by Roland which also uses VSC sounds.
I just tried out the VIma Tunes Player and it's seems to work well! But I've noticed it's got crackling of all things, is there a fix for this? Also do you know what the SMF/MIDI converter program is called?
*e1M1 Starts playing on the keyboard* Oh hey cool! *Camera zooms out, it's a 500 pound dual keyboard synth organ behemoth* OH. OH, I WANT A VIDEO ON THIS YESTERDAY.
I just used an AWE32, and an AWE32 and an AWE32 and an AWE64 Gold. There was nothing like directX yet, one card could play 1 wav and 1 midi at the same time.
With this Winamp will actually interface with it. I have on my Laptop a PCem VM with Windows 98SE and it installed and Winamp v2.95, you have to adjust the Winamp Midi plugin to work with the Virtual Sound Canvas.
While this is factually correct, it's important to note that the instruments provided by Roland to Microsoft (or to Apple for that matter, since Roland also provided their instruments to Macs at some point in time) were drastically inferior in quality to the real deal Sound Canvas instruments and sounded completely different.
@@kosmosyche The in-box stuff provided by Roland for Windows sounds *very* similar to the Sound Canvas VA 55 and, of course, the SC55. There are some comparison videos here on YT. Different, but not drastically so if you're not comparing it to a later SC or using effects. Makes sense as the in-box GS Synth was derived from the VSC 55 which was derived from the SC 55. If you compare to an SC-88, you'll hear real differences. But if you compare to the older SC55, you'll find very little difference. The SC55 was already several years old by the time that the in-box GS synth was released, and Roland continued to refine their General MIDI devices.
@@Psychlist1972 Dude, I have a comparison video on my channel, and I compared most well-known soundfonts as well as most old soundcards maniacally between each other on hundreds of MIDI compositions. It's kinda what I like doing for fun. The difference is night and day. Default Windows MIDI is one of the worst sounding MIDI soundfonts I've ever heard. I can't even think of anything that sounds worse. It's a muffled cut down mess. Even Gravis Ultrasound with default patches, the sound of which I personally hate, sound a bit better in my opinion. So don't tell me they sound almost the same, it's not true. lol
@@kosmosyche Maybe I'm just not hearing it. In your Quest for Glory 4 (MIDI) video, can you point me to two timestamps where the GS synth differs significantly from the SCVA 55?
@@Psychlist1972 Ok, let's take my favorite part of this song - the guitar solo. It starts at 1:07 for default Windows MIDI and at 15:33 for Sound Canvas VA (it's not the real SC-55, but it's close enough to the real deal). On SC-55 it sounds like a real guitar, the sound is fairly nuanced, lots of dynamics between notes, you can hear how well all the small fret changes are emulated. On default Windows MIDI it doesn't even sound like an electric guitar, it's almost like a small annoying pipe or something, the sound is completely butchered. But tbh you can take most instruments and see the same difference. There is also a huge difference is sound engine itself - not only the instruments themselves, but how the notes are mixed together into whole. It's much more simple on default MIDI, it completely flattens the music.
Not sure if you've made a dedicated video for your Windows XP setup, but I had the same Antec case back in the day complete with the LAN party carrying strap and that drawer of screws!
I bought a igel pc just to run this and the yamaha S-YXG50 software when I found this out. I found both on a old OG Athlon Asus Motherboard driver CD from my brothers old stash of CDs. I use it as a kind of midi emulation box to lift the burden from the actual dos/win98 pc.
I used to have these both at one point. I'm not sure why they had it, but a radio station was getting rid of all of thier old stuff, and these were part of the mix of things. I don't have any idea where they evee went.
Well. I finally found a use for my ASUS eee 1000HE. Permanent virtual sound canvas. I have no other use for it, it's nice and compact. And since I can't afford a real sound canvas or MT device and I have this sitting around... I know for certain I could get a cable to go into USB on it from a 15 pin, or make one. What I would Really like to do though Is figure out how to connect it to another computer directly and act simply as an extra powerful external sound card. This could be a fun project!
I have an MT-32 and 2 PMA-5 synths (MT-32 attached to Linux, 1 PMA-5 attached to Win7... the other in a box tucked away), and would really like to get a roland _midi_ (not usb) keyboard to use with them :(
Closest thing I have is the RealTech onboard sound on my Ryzen 3 1300x All in One retro gaming pc. It has a Roland SC Midi WaveTable synth built into it.
Yes I actually design and manufacture analogue synthesisers for a living, but one of my favourite digital synthesisers is the Sound Canvas. I have five of them!: RA-30, SC-33, SC-88VL, SK-88 Pro, and the _nicest_ Sound Canvas ever made, the SC-880. So glad to see a fellow SK-88 Pro owner! btw if you ever want to come to Knobcon (the world's only synthesiser convention) let me know and I'll give you a media pass. for better or worse, it's the same weekend and metropolitan area as the Midwest Vintage Computer Fair.
Please check out the "Electronica" festival held in the fall in Baltimore MD. I think info from last year is only FB, but if interested I'll get you info.
in the four examples i reacted instantly that the VSC sounded very strange and wrong as it sounded very compressed, not sure if that was due to how it was recorded.
I used this back in September 2009 before I finally bought a real Roland SC-88 Pro in March 2010. Microsoft GS Wavetable Synth is basically a more cut down version of Virtual Sound Canvas. For midi file rendering I still think even the hardware SC-55 is better than VSC or MS Wavetable Synth. But of course Sound Canvas VA does actually as good as a real SC-8820/SK-500/SC-D70.
Great video...Very cool to see! I love messing around with MIDI whenever I can. Such an amazing technology for music development and composition. I did mess around with playing MIDI tracks on the Nintendo 64 Console which was pretty wild. Loads of Fun!! ^_^ Once again, Great video. :) Cheers! -Gerry
hace algun tiempo usé el virtual sound canvas, como mera curiosidad. ahora tengo un CS88 pro en fisico y persona. definitivamente, su sonido es muy bueno...
19:15 How can the puss keep sleeping like a log with the Doom theme banging thru the speakers right next to it? This human slight sleeper is so envious!
It’s cute how you call 6/8 time or a fast run up and down the scale complicated! Certainly not novice, but I’d say solidly intermediate for weekly kids lessons. Also staff notation is much faster for read-ahead, once you’ve got it down. That just requires practicing scales for a while (it’s much easier than learning the written word or maths). Which is indeed what I expect the tutor would have the student doing for up to maybe the first month before starting them on this program. And the demo files are definitely for the teacher, not the student, so think of them more like notation demoscene stuff (earlier software was far too limited compared to handwritten music), hence all the time signatures and varying-length slides and so on. Showing the teacher they can input whatever material they’re teaching into the program accurately and easily.
Final Fantasy VII came with a Yamaha Software Synth and we owned a Soundblaster AWE 32 at the time. The difference was mind blowing.
I remember how much it tanked my already low framerate.
My very first PC came with this, it sounded amazing but it really took a hit on the P166mmx CPU.
Final Fantasy VII on PC? Woof.
@@wraithcadmus For me, trying to run (originally) on a P120, the frame rate (even in software mode) actually wasn't ever really bad... it just took forever once a battle was triggered to actually transition into the battle.
Having a Voodoo3 did make it look really nice though.
Yes! The yamaha XG Midi thing I believe, It sounded awesome for FF7
I like how they had to update the box twice with stickers for the additional OS versions.
Yep. Still, honestly, it should say "It still works on XP... mostly/with some quirks". Maybe the "for more details (visit webpage)" part addressed that?
The fact that I was able to tell both the true SC-88 and SC-55 mapping is both worrying, concerning and impressive.
I have spent too much time with MIDI and GMIDI.
Thank you for perserving this gem from the past.
I used to use Roland VCS for all of my composing back in the Win XP days and it was so much clearer than the standard Windows MIDI. Had a lot of great extra sounds too. I was sad I couldn't install it in later versions of Windows, and never found a good soundfont equivalent.
funnily enough, I found the opposite to be true in more recent times. FL Studio (and perhaps other modern MIDI sequencers) has a method for directly using the default GM.DLS soundbank, and applies 'proper' resampling so it's less noisy. The VST version of VCS (which uses the same engine as VSC3 driver) has a worse resampler. The actual raw soundbank quality is very similar. The real difference is the resampling and the effects (reverb/chorus/echo used to make the difference). No clue if it had extra sounds though, didn't seem to be significant.
The VSC's "Secure Memory" feature is probably what would be causing the bugchecks you were getting with playback before. Having it set to "Always allocate" usually keeps it more stable (If I remember correctly), as constantly trying to write memory from the kernel is... a bad idea in general.
I've got to say, I was not expecting VSC to be archived in a proper way. I've been exposed to this software before but only on software collections on some CDs or long-dead FTP directories.
Thanks for being cool with the archiving.
new 8081 program to be installed just dropped
Ah, this brings back memories! A Power Mac 8500, MacOS 9.0.4, Logic Platinum 4.8, and Roland VSC. It all integrated beautifully and I had that setup for quite a few years.
I had Virtual Sound Canvas back in the day! I became an avid internet user back in the 90s when MIDIs were a big thing, and they helped cultivate my interest in electronic music production. So when I found out about Roland releasing this software product that would let your computer play back MIDIs in a way that sounded like some of their dedicated music hardware, I was thrilled.
Ahh, all that MIDI wonders that were absolutely out of my reach back then. Love to see more of this! Thanks for preserving!
Edirol was Roland’s desktop media arm, I think they tried to sell music and video hardware to schools. That first demo sounds like Eric Persing (Spectrasonics) who did a lot of demo stuff for Roland back in the 90s.
man, I miss old sound cards/devices...I remember getting my AWE32 and being amazed at how nice midi sounded.
I miss it too!
Thanks for archiving the VSC, perfect for anyone with a Windows 98 or XP machine.
It is good to know that the virtual SC can be a viable alternative for people like me who do not own the actual hardware.
For DB50XG emulation there's the S-YXG50 software, which can be also run in the background, like VSC.
there's also s-yxg100 for win95/98 if you want an upgrade
Seems like this was a precursor to Roland Sound Canvas VA, a software synthesizer and VSTi plugin Roland made several years ago. I use it with my DOSBox all the time and it's so good with old DOS games, it completely eliminates the need to buy the real Sound Canvas module, since it emulates it near perfectly.
I pirated the Virtual Sound Canvas in the early 2000s because I liked the sounds when composing and arranging sheet music. I was in high school, but it's so cool to see this again. I removed it from my PC when I stopped pirating years ago, but I have great memories of it!
Amazing find! I've been using SoundBlaster Live hardware on my retro machines that don't have ISA slots. After searching around for the perfect "SC-55 like" soundfont, which does not exist, you found what may be the holy grail of SC-55 emulation. Thank you so much for this video, and for archiving this!
I miss how cool all of this was back then! Thanks for sharing 😊🙏
The sample "Cool Sweet" at 13:58 - Sounds soo Transport Tycoon ish!
I love how they recreated the page turning
This is brilliant! I've been looking for a version of the Roland Virtual Sound Canvas that didn't require a cloud subscription to maintain for ages.
Ironically, I ended up buying a Dreamblaster X2GS wavetable daughterboard which uses genuine licensed SC-55 samples to scratch the Roland itch.
I completely concur with Descent being one of my go-to MIDI game as well. I also like to test with Warcraft II for GM. Growing up, I had a Yamaha SW60XG card to play these games and I'm so glad I kept that card.
Thank you for archiving this and doing a deep dive into the virtual sound canvas. This helps complete the set getting proper Roland SC-55 support virtually. Cheers!
For something more modern, you cough, ahem, 'acquire' SoundCanvas VA
Warcraft II has MIDI music? I thought it was Redbook audio.
@@Nukle0n Yes. The Redbook audio on the CDs is a recording of the compositions from the composer's Roland SC-55 Mk. II (or so the story goes...)
It's a rare case where you can snag the MIDI files from the game and directly compare with a synth of your choice and the music as the composer intended from the CD.
@@DankRedditMemes That's been the fun part... finding a version of Sound Canvas VA that didn't need an active Roland Cloud subscription.
Admittedly, I never finished doing an "exhaustive search" once I found a different hardware solution.
I've done the comparison with a real SC-55 Mk. II and I think the CD audio just has some minor adjustments or post-processing. It's really close and I was super giddy when I first got it playing through the device. Also cool to see what the soundtrack was like on a Yamaha MU-80.
Similar VSC is included with Cakewalk Music Creator 2003 which in turn was included with the Edirol Hyper Canvas.
Yes! Omg I forgot all about Cakewalk
Great video. Thank you for sharing! I'm amazed at the chill of your cat sleeping in front of the speakers as Duke music to blaring away!
16:30 I have a MIDI for the opening theme of Sensible Golf. On every computer I’ve played it on, it plays fine. Except for one, my Toshiba Satellite Pro 4600, and **only** on Windows 2000. It immediately blue screens when playing it through its Yamaha AC-XG chipset. On XP and 98SE though, it’s fine!
So glad we got to see your sweet kitty cat again. I missed your cat.
This is so awesome. I used to have a Roland Sound Canvas SC-55 back in the day. The default piano sound was really good (which prompted me to get it) back when it was introduced. Not bad for a lower priced sound module. The synth, bass and drum sounds were very good for putting ideas together. There was a game I had that featured mecha robot warriors from Japan and it was compatible with GM so it played the soundtrack like a dream. Good times.
I am downloading this right now to installing in my Windows 98 Retro PCs, thank you for archiving it.
I remember having the SoundBlaster AWE32, which actually had memory slots (RAM). You could load "Soundfonts" into this memory, in order for the Soundcard to use Wavetable Synthesis (modifying a recorded sound sample) for Midi instead of relying on FM-Synthesis (trying to generate a sound out of nothing). The larger SoundFont Files you had (and loaded), the better the output sound was. I think at the end I had 2x8 MB Modules installes in my Soundcard and loaded the corresponding Soundfonts.
The Midi Sounds, were just beyond any other Soundcard at that time.
It might be worth looking into that extraordinary card :)
Ohh BTW, later Soundblasters with PCI supported to use the system memory to even load larger sound fonts, it's kind of interesting to hear the sound quality difference between the SoundFont files.
As somewhat of a pianist, I can totally see how the Music Tutor could be helpful.
Once you *do* know how to play piano, and just need a little boost, a little help, along the continual learning process, especially for certain pieces - this seems to fit that niche nicely - like a precursor to Synthesia and similar.
I love the "stack of components" design that was so common in media programs back then.
Space Quest III and IV have my favourite game sound tracks when paired with a Roland MT-32
Thanks for this. Stumbled on a retro pc on fb and immediately aearched TH-cam when I noticed roland support in audio outputs and spent the evening enjoying dos game music much in the same way.
Duuuuuude! This is one awesome find! One things for sure, you've just changed how I game on my retro PCs! I used to use the MT32 emulator but it was a little cumbersome.
Weird how VisualMT works. I'd have assumed the same thing...
Thank you so much for archiving this software and doing a video on it! Much appreciated
Thank you so much for the video. I love experimenting with different software synths on different systems. For Windows 10, I use CoolSoft VirtualMIDISynth for MIDI.
On a virtual Windows 3.11 system, I use WinGroove and for a virtual Windows 98 system; Yamaha XG Soft Synth.
I was stuck with the default (and rather lame) Windows Roland GS Soft synth for Windows XP until I stumbled across your video.
Now MIDI sounds so much better on that system with the Roland Virtual Sound Canvas, which can add reverb and chorus to midi tracks.
I use the SC VST for all my midi needs now, works a treat.
Killer video Shelby. Would have liked to se more hands-on exploration of different sounds, but I respect your perspective as more of a gamer more than a musician. Or am I assuming wrongly?
I had so much fun with Midi as a teenager/twen in the eighties/nineties, Roland, Voyetra soft and hardware....
Thanks for your review and the archive.
My cat also likes to sit next to my keyboard, sometimes on top of my mouse, and demand fuss-tax. Makes playing a particular mouse dexterity marble exploring game extremely difficult. My cat loves when I use retro computers on the table at the window more than when I use my modern laptop. He hasn't worked out that CRTs are warm yet.
UHHH THE VIRTUAL SOUND CANVAS IS SO PRETTY AND SOUNDSSS SOOOO GOOOOOD, amazing!,
It's a damn shame that MIDI is virtually forgotten now for video games. Sure, "real" music sounds better, but you just can't beat that distinctive MIDI sound for some things. Hell, Microsoft have removed almost all the MIDI features from Windows these days beyond basic playback, but thankfully we still have software like VirtualMIDISyth to give us control back... Plus selectable soundfounts!
Is not really forgotten, recently the MIDI 2.0 specification was finalized.
@@fordesponja for video games
MIDI is still widely used with instruments as it's _the_ standard for communication between an instrument and either another instrument or a computer
Nice find! I'll have to check out the archive, thanks!
That Roland organ is a beauty
That demo song "cool" brought back so many Transport Tycoon memories.
Oh my. I'd love something like this for Windows 10 (and up)! Fantastic! This brings back such fond memories of playing Descent and Duke 3D, but with a Yamaha TG-300 instead of a Roland Sound Canvas. Good times!
Man, GS MIDI is such a vibe.
Hey, I am currently using those same Creative speakers in a funky bi amped setup! I use them for the highs/ high mids, and some big RCA bookshelf speakers for the mids and lows.
The piano lessons didnt seem too complicated, 6/8 was the 3rd time signature I learned as a kid iirc.
Edirol Orchestral was neat. It was sorta like Sound Canvas but focused specifically on more realistic, natural sounding orchestral sounds. I actually still have a copy of Edirol Orchestral on my PC.
Worth noting that nowadays there's an option of Sound Canvas VA, which if you don't mind price tag and a few more steps when setting it up, should be a lot closer to real thing, at least for newer PCs or if you have a spare pc for usage as MIDI device. A bit of a shame you didn't mention it in the video.
The hardware Soundcavas was one of my main midi playback modules for composing in the 1990s. I then also used Virtual Sound Canvas for playback in the 2000s. Not great for acoustic instruments (except percussion), but really great for electronic sounds.
Well that solves a mystery I've been hanging onto for a while. I have seen those serial MIDI inputs since the 90s, and never once ran across anything that plugged into them, or even any software that I was aware of that supported them.
I've been itching to get the Roland sound on my modern PC in software and I can't afford the modern VST plug-in you can get that emulates the SC55 so I think I'm going to get virtual sound canvas a try.
And I sadly couldn't get it to work
Bluescreen running XP?
You definitively need Me on that machine :D
The crashing could be down to your hardware raid controller using a shared irq or resources with other components, try disabling serial port and parallel ports.
On my first computer I had a soundcard integrated (unusable for midi) I later bought a used SoundBlaster Awe32, and it was an incredible improvement (Then SoundBlaster Live, Audigy etc). I tried Midi with many programs on windows 95 and newer. I had a Yamaha XG 100 synthesizer sound emulator on windows XP. Thanks for the interesting video. It reminded me of the days of the midi era. Then I tried music in MOD, XM, S3M etc. But that was a different category and before PC it was music in those formats on the Amiga computer.
The Sound Canvas software is still available and being sold today but, unfortunately, only as part of the Roland Cloud subscription (ouch). Up to a few years ago, you could still purchase it directly from their web. Compared to this early version, it has a revamped interface and a new audio engine, and I'm pretty sure it no longer creates a virtual MIDI device and it will just work like any other VST plugin instead (however, you have plenty of options if you want to connect a VST to any MIDI input). It has been always marketed to professional musicians who want to add some retro sounding instruments to their productions, so it should have pretty low latency and great quality.
You can still buy it on its own. For 69 Dollar I think. I bought it one year ago for 75 Euro.
Two words: Yamaha XG. The peak of computer MIDI standards, nothing can touch it. There were software version of their flagship sound cards with XG midi, S-YXG50 and 100, the latter almost on par with SW1000XG hardware.
No, I didn't watch the video yet but I do know Roland MT and I stand by my comment :D
Your adorable cat clearly doesn't mind MIDI music right next to its head.
Just found your channel now? Never too late I guess.
With the sound canvas enabled, then you won't hear when you press the keys but you can get the visual feed back as you press the keys along with the accompaniment.
My preference on the samples were 4, 1, 3, 2 and that unsurprisingly checks out now that I know what they were.
Great video of some lesser known (to me) software. Also that initial Duke Nukem test sounds like it needed a little less cowbell
This software is awesome! Just added it to my windows xp machine and even though it does have a good soundcard it's fun to play around with. Thank you very much :)
I cannot get any midi sound from the VSC in games with Windows 98se. What am i doing wrong??, i have it selected as the midi output device. Specs are PIII 700 and Soundblaster 16 CT2910 etc.
I'm having the same issue. Anyone?
1. VSC doesn't support 32 channels, it only has 16.
2. The integrated MIDI player on VSC crashes a LOT on Windows XP, almost every single time. I can play any 16-channel MIDI file with Windows Media Player, XGPlayer and Falconsoft SoundFont Midi Player just fine, but not the integrated VSC MIDI player.
3. VSC doesn't support EFX.
I have a problem of understanding here. If I can use a normal simple soundcard (SoundBlaster for example) plus the VSC software to get MIDI sound, why should I buy a hardware MIDI controller?
The blue screen points to a RAM problem. It's possible that VSC was using a part of the RAM that was defective.
Another explanation could be that VSC is accessing memory it shouldn't - keep in mind that W9x wasn't as sophisticated as XP is when it comes to terms of memory protection.
From Windows XP and on, Windows came with a cut-down licensed by Roland Virtual Sound Canvas Built-In with a custom patch reduced sound sample patch set of like 2MB at the light setting like 22kHz. There was a hack going around that you could get the full Sound Canvas 3.0 8MB sound sample set that you could just copy the 8MB dll file over top of the 2MB one to get like a full upgrade to the high quality 44kHz over the built in cut down GS set at 22kHz. *edit, actually, it may have come on Windows Me or Windows 98SE as well...I can't remember.
I think it came in ME and it was the 3.5 MB GM/GS set. You are absolutely right that the DLS file could be easily replaced, but the 22 kHz mix rate had nothing to do with the sample set itself. Actually, the bigger DLS files did only contain more samples, not necessarily higher quality (although some really were of higher quality). The mixrate however could be set to 44.1 if you used an application that used MIDI via DirectMusic instead of WinMM.dll (such as Winamp). This way, you could get essentially the same sound out of a stock Windows Me or XP PC without installing Roland VSC.
I still have the Virtual Sound Canvas in my Virtual Machines to this day. I haven't been making videos from it from burn out after years of history on my Channel.
Have you seen Roland's Vima Tunes Player program? It's basically Virtual Sound Canvas, but in a form of a karaoke machine.
Although VTP has some flaws and missing features that VSC previously had, it's an OK MIDI player so I kinda recommend to check it out since the program works on modern Windows OS(s).
Along with Vima Tunes Player, there's also a SMF/MIDI to WAV converter program made by Roland which also uses VSC sounds.
I just tried out the VIma Tunes Player and it's seems to work well! But I've noticed it's got crackling of all things, is there a fix for this?
Also do you know what the SMF/MIDI converter program is called?
4:25 "But, can it play Doom?"
I have a windows 9x era version of VSC that came with a band in box software package
did you post that copy online?
@@Nico93 No, but probably should after I've gotten around to archiving all my software...
@@JohnSmith-xq1pz that should be done certainly, not a lot of vsc survive today.
@@Nico93 I'll make a mental note tolook into that
*e1M1 Starts playing on the keyboard*
Oh hey cool!
*Camera zooms out, it's a 500 pound dual keyboard synth organ behemoth*
OH. OH, I WANT A VIDEO ON THIS YESTERDAY.
Even if you knew how to play the piano, there is no way you could play most of those samples with the short keyboard. Pretty cool, all in all!
Paused at 12:30 I don't know which one it is but I like #3 and #4 the best.
I just used an AWE32, and an AWE32 and an AWE32 and an AWE64 Gold. There was nothing like directX yet, one card could play 1 wav and 1 midi at the same time.
loved the kitty cameo!
With this Winamp will actually interface with it. I have on my Laptop a PCem VM with Windows 98SE and it installed and Winamp v2.95, you have to adjust the Winamp Midi plugin to work with the Virtual Sound Canvas.
Woopp...wooop....early to a Tech Tangents video :)
Trivia: The GS Wavetable synth (the in-box General MIDI Synth on Windows) was actually provided by Roland.
While this is factually correct, it's important to note that the instruments provided by Roland to Microsoft (or to Apple for that matter, since Roland also provided their instruments to Macs at some point in time) were drastically inferior in quality to the real deal Sound Canvas instruments and sounded completely different.
@@kosmosyche The in-box stuff provided by Roland for Windows sounds *very* similar to the Sound Canvas VA 55 and, of course, the SC55. There are some comparison videos here on YT. Different, but not drastically so if you're not comparing it to a later SC or using effects. Makes sense as the in-box GS Synth was derived from the VSC 55 which was derived from the SC 55.
If you compare to an SC-88, you'll hear real differences. But if you compare to the older SC55, you'll find very little difference. The SC55 was already several years old by the time that the in-box GS synth was released, and Roland continued to refine their General MIDI devices.
@@Psychlist1972 Dude, I have a comparison video on my channel, and I compared most well-known soundfonts as well as most old soundcards maniacally between each other on hundreds of MIDI compositions. It's kinda what I like doing for fun. The difference is night and day. Default Windows MIDI is one of the worst sounding MIDI soundfonts I've ever heard. I can't even think of anything that sounds worse. It's a muffled cut down mess. Even Gravis Ultrasound with default patches, the sound of which I personally hate, sound a bit better in my opinion. So don't tell me they sound almost the same, it's not true. lol
@@kosmosyche Maybe I'm just not hearing it. In your Quest for Glory 4 (MIDI) video, can you point me to two timestamps where the GS synth differs significantly from the SCVA 55?
@@Psychlist1972 Ok, let's take my favorite part of this song - the guitar solo. It starts at 1:07 for default Windows MIDI and at 15:33 for Sound Canvas VA (it's not the real SC-55, but it's close enough to the real deal). On SC-55 it sounds like a real guitar, the sound is fairly nuanced, lots of dynamics between notes, you can hear how well all the small fret changes are emulated. On default Windows MIDI it doesn't even sound like an electric guitar, it's almost like a small annoying pipe or something, the sound is completely butchered. But tbh you can take most instruments and see the same difference. There is also a huge difference is sound engine itself - not only the instruments themselves, but how the notes are mixed together into whole. It's much more simple on default MIDI, it completely flattens the music.
12:35 I take Edirol for my ADD
Not sure if you've made a dedicated video for your Windows XP setup, but I had the same Antec case back in the day complete with the LAN party carrying strap and that drawer of screws!
I bought a igel pc just to run this and the yamaha S-YXG50 software when I found this out. I found both on a old OG Athlon Asus Motherboard driver CD from my brothers old stash of CDs.
I use it as a kind of midi emulation box to lift the burden from the actual dos/win98 pc.
I used to have these both at one point. I'm not sure why they had it, but a radio station was getting rid of all of thier old stuff, and these were part of the mix of things. I don't have any idea where they evee went.
Thank you for show this solution, you save me to buy the original sc-88 :)
Tech Tangents like a MUGG!!!!
Well. I finally found a use for my ASUS eee 1000HE. Permanent virtual sound canvas. I have no other use for it, it's nice and compact. And since I can't afford a real sound canvas or MT device and I have this sitting around... I know for certain I could get a cable to go into USB on it from a 15 pin, or make one. What I would Really like to do though Is figure out how to connect it to another computer directly and act simply as an extra powerful external sound card. This could be a fun project!
Even to this day I'm impressed by the midi sounds wingroove produced.
I have an MT-32 and 2 PMA-5 synths (MT-32 attached to Linux, 1 PMA-5 attached to Win7... the other in a box tucked away), and would really like to get a roland _midi_ (not usb) keyboard to use with them :(
Closest thing I have is the RealTech onboard sound on my Ryzen 3 1300x All in One retro gaming pc. It has a Roland SC Midi WaveTable synth built into it.
Yes I actually design and manufacture analogue synthesisers for a living, but one of my favourite digital synthesisers is the Sound Canvas. I have five of them!: RA-30, SC-33, SC-88VL, SK-88 Pro, and the _nicest_ Sound Canvas ever made, the SC-880. So glad to see a fellow SK-88 Pro owner!
btw if you ever want to come to Knobcon (the world's only synthesiser convention) let me know and I'll give you a media pass. for better or worse, it's the same weekend and metropolitan area as the Midwest Vintage Computer Fair.
Please check out the "Electronica" festival held in the fall in Baltimore MD. I think info from last year is only FB, but if interested I'll get you info.
@@VAXHeadroom cool name, "Vax headroom" ... what is this festival?
in the four examples i reacted instantly that the VSC sounded very strange and wrong as it sounded very compressed, not sure if that was due to how it was recorded.
hey man, this a perfect video, i like this videos from music softwares old!! excellent!!😃😃
I used this back in September 2009 before I finally bought a real Roland SC-88 Pro in March 2010.
Microsoft GS Wavetable Synth is basically a more cut down version of Virtual Sound Canvas.
For midi file rendering I still think even the hardware SC-55 is better than VSC or MS Wavetable Synth.
But of course Sound Canvas VA does actually as good as a real SC-8820/SK-500/SC-D70.
Great video...Very cool to see!
I love messing around with MIDI whenever I can. Such an amazing technology for music development and composition.
I did mess around with playing MIDI tracks on the Nintendo 64 Console which was pretty wild.
Loads of Fun!! ^_^
Once again, Great video. :)
Cheers!
-Gerry
I'm still waiting for that part 2 video about that :D
nice seeing you here Gerry :D
hace algun tiempo usé el virtual sound canvas, como mera curiosidad. ahora tengo un CS88 pro en fisico y persona. definitivamente, su sonido es muy bueno...
has VSC-MP1 its the last one made virtual soundcanvas before Soundcanvas VA
7:36 What is that song?
19:15 How can the puss keep sleeping like a log with the Doom theme banging thru the speakers right next to it? This human slight sleeper is so envious!
I wonder if you could install that to a linux box running wine before running a dos/win game?
Sounds like Jerry from Rick and Morty XD
It’s cute how you call 6/8 time or a fast run up and down the scale complicated! Certainly not novice, but I’d say solidly intermediate for weekly kids lessons.
Also staff notation is much faster for read-ahead, once you’ve got it down. That just requires practicing scales for a while (it’s much easier than learning the written word or maths). Which is indeed what I expect the tutor would have the student doing for up to maybe the first month before starting them on this program.
And the demo files are definitely for the teacher, not the student, so think of them more like notation demoscene stuff (earlier software was far too limited compared to handwritten music), hence all the time signatures and varying-length slides and so on. Showing the teacher they can input whatever material they’re teaching into the program accurately and easily.
this is cool af