Inside the Chieftain's Hatch: Super Kurassier, Part 1
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 18 ส.ค. 2023
- The SK-105 is an Austrian vehicle using the French-style oscillating turret. The design supposedly came with a number of drawbacks, such as stabilisation problems (Stabilising a multi-ton turret instead of just a gun) and NBC problems. However, Austrian engineers had a crack at these problems, creating this prototype vehicle.
Filmed at www.hgm.at/en Heeresgeschichtliches Museum
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If there is one thing that I have learned from these videos over the years, is that performance of the gun, efficiency of the optics, or strength of the armor, means nothing in a battle if an improperly tensioned track does not get you there.
No thats just inconvinient.
Consider this situation: boom you get the next enemy vehicle killed. You hear ICOMMING over radio from the artillery radar operator
Your driver cranks in reverse and hits the accelerator. Ckrckrck is the message from the track - most likely the last sound you will hear in your short remaining lifespan.
Interestingly, I found out in you tube from a manufacturer's official cha nnel that an excavator's tracks need to be off the ground before being tensioned while an armored trac can be tensions while sitting on the ground
@@shaider1982That may be required for some vehicles, but certainly not all.
Looking quickly at Caterpillar guides, most of their vehicles are "roll to a stop, check track sag, adjust the amount of grease in a hydraulic tensioning system until appropriate tension is achieved".
Much like how many different armoured vehicles have different systems, so do civilian vehicles. Now systems that need more time, equipment, or consumable resources make more sense in civilian practices than in a military vehicle so there is likely a broader array used in civilian equipment.
Ever had chain driven bike or motorcycle? Forgetting to keep an eye on its tension will end badly or even tragically. It's critical part of maintenance.
@@karoltakisobie6638how right you are....the most deadly weapon on today's battlefield is that jumped chain ripping through the air off of the 10 speed bicycles which special ops use...need to take out a tank?! Slap rip boom! The ever deadly 10 speed bicycles chain strikes...hell from what I can gather you're not safe even at distances as great as 2ft away from the rear sprocket...
You really cannot even fathom how dangerous a loose bicycle tire can be if it comes loose.....whooaaa dawgy you cannot put run them either
Front mounted convoy marker lights: A quick google brought up a slew of other examples of front mounted convoy lights, It appears to be relatively common. Apparently they serve both as a marker for oncoming traffic to know something is there, and as a confirmation for any leading vehicles to check that they are still being followed. No mention of why they aren't just another simpler light. Logic suggests it's probably easier logistically, to buy a batch of the lights and just use them everywhere than have to have 2 different designs of light to keep track of.
Im guessing it is usefull if you are being followed by a tank to be able to look behind and radio them if the tank driver is distracted and they are too far or about to run you over
Probably from WW2 : Soldiers on amphetamine would either doze off or not react to course changes.
Indeed, the only real problem with convoy lights on the front is in combat, where the lights can be used by the enemy to see one coming if one is too foolish to remember to turn off the front lights. Appears the US Army is one to say that they'd consider the combat risks more important to address than the peace-time risks; Slightly higher chance of pile-ups in a peace-time convoy is more acceptable than a chance of an unit being wiped out because one driver forgot to switch off his convoy lights.
@@tarjei99 What!?! ✋️😭
if you've ever tried to guide anyone who is a slower/less aggressive driver than you its an exercise in frustration. I'd imagine if you're doing a road march and you have say, an AMX-10 in front of one of these, it would be even harder to not leave them in the dust.
I love oscillating turrets, and always thought the Kurassier was a neat tank, so this video definitely has my interest.
🥖 🤡
@@samholdsworth420 wsup karen !
@@davidlefranc6240 I identify as a Sharon
4:14 February 1985 several crews of M1s had to camp in their tanks for some days in the snowy valleys of Hohenfels until their vehicle could be towed by M88 which, in contrast to the M1s, could overcome the snowy inclines.
I saw a M88 tobogan down a road in South Korea. What it did to the farmer's house at the bottom wasn't pretty.
P.S Hohenfels means high cliffs. I'm guessing the area lives up to it's name.
Bet they were glad of the BV ;-)
Vienna is what I feel like Heaven would be if there was one. Did so much stuff there, but had no idea that this museum existed😅 I miss Vienna so much.
The chieftain casually teases at a story about an m1 falling off a mountain and gets my hope up for hearing a good story then proceeds on. Hopefully we’ll hear that story one day
Skiing in the Austrian Alps, perhaps? ;-)
My main question is *which M1*
Pretty sure he has mentioned this before. Maybe third time will be the charm?
@@brianj.841 deja vu blasting in the distance
@@Ineptus_Mechanicus M1 Garand? ;)
HeeresGeschichtsMuseum is what I understood as native German. So no butchering and well done.
So not accurate since it is Vienna and the Austrians have their weird accent? ;D
Pretty close. It's Heeresgeschichtliches Museum actually. Must be a horror for non-native speakers to pronounce.
I think you just volunteered to be the calibrated german speaker. May the Omnisiah have mercy on your soul!
@@residentgeardo hmm, not that hard tbh, not when compared to a polish surname at least
@@ravenouself4181 yeah you're right polish is something different entirely. There's always a language more complicated to be found. 😀
I was literally there today! Panzerhalle and the entire museum was quite interesting, even though the WW2 exhibit was closed for renovation.
Convory markers on the front is so you can pass on coming traffic. As a old hemmit jocky, passing and tank blacked out on a dusty tank trail at night with no NVGs was about a pucker factor 5. I alway hoped they had better vision than I did.
Lived in Vienna for almost 20 years, never been there. What a pity.
Nice video, as always! Thx!
I had no idea the American approach to track tensioning was so unique!
Ah, Americans... They are "Speshul", bless.😁
Ah, a Classic Chieftain Inside the Hatch Video! It’s been awhile! Thanks!
Yeah it's been what, 9 days since the last one? That's forever and a day ago....
@@MaverickBlue42 Notifications are hit and miss on here.
Not a classic one untill that loop music plays.
Old Cav Scout here. I remember using something similar to those convoy lights on my gun truck while using NODs and it helped us see some, so maybe it was used for that? It doesn't look quite like the one they put on our Humvees so I might be wrong
If you plan to visit the museum check the opening times of the tank hall. When I was in Vienna it was only open on the weekend.
There are still a few tanks outside and in an exhibition about Austrian army during the Balkan Wars in the 90s.
They also have a big exhibition about WW1 and lots of stuff of the centuries before.
Topic Convoy Marker
If i remember correctly from my time at the Bundeswehr. Those Markers where used during night, instead of the headlights.
In war those would make you and the vehicle in front of you a big target.
Most drivers didn't had any kind of night vision Equipment. But you cant drive at night if you cant see.
Those markers give up just a little bit light, enough to spot the reflective X back on the vehicle in front of you.
Ur time in the "Bundeswehr" jucks nobody, come back when u have some knowledge bout the austrian "Bundesheer".
thanks
Do apply the laws of Physics different in Austria? Or are People of Austria able to see in the Dark? I don't think so. @@kasauerkrautimgulasch
If they both use front convoy lights, what difference does it make? If you had an answer I'd say your comment is worthwhile, but seeing as you have nothing to contribute, I'm not sure why you said anything.
"I am back in Vienna, in the capable hands of France"
**Starts sweating profoundly in Imperial Germany**
Oh ok the museum guides name is France or does he mean Franz?
@@mitchanthony1548
I'm sure it's Franz, I'm just making a joke
@@mitchanthony1548 Took me halt of the video to realize it. 😬
Why? Vienna was not part of Imperial Germany. It was the capital of the Austrian-Hungarian Empire.
@@tubarlog
Because it would imply that France was in control of Austria, and imperial Germany would not be particularly happy to see a France-controlled state on its southern flank
Worked with a gent who did his national service in Austria as a tanker. He said they preferred the Kurassier over the Leo, as whilst both had no armour the Kurrassier was faster, so speed = life.
Make sense !
Off the top of my head, besides the AMX-13/Kürassier, the AMX-30 and Leclerc guns also have ventilation holes in the bottom of the thermal sleeve. It seems it's a unique design feature of French tank guns.
Drain holes, perhaps?
@@birlyballop4704 Maybe you´re right and they're intended to drain off water/condensantion. The bottom location would make sense for this.
Strangely, my interest in this tank goes back to 1983-84, when there were riots in Tunisia, called "Bread Riots". My father worked there and he was stuck in a hotel when he had to return to France. The Tunisian army had deployed its "Kurassiers" near the hotel. At the time, I was a kid, I did not know these tanks and they looked quite strange to me.
As an ex-tanker and now MSc in Mech Eng, I really enjoy these tours from technical detail point of view.
Timestamps:
0:00 - Intro
2:25 - Vehicle Front
7:51 - Running Gear
12:20 - Left Upper Hull
13:26 - Vehicle Rear
14:13 - Engine Compartment
16:01 - Turret Bustle Rear
17:29 - Infantry Telephone
17:50 - Vehicle Right
20:56 - Turret Roof
One thing to note is that the Side mirrors look IDENTICAL to those on Pz 68/88
😔Back when austria at least built our own hulls for armoured tracked vehicles. Sadly that knowhow was given up and now only the Pandur is still made here.
(But the "company" making them was sold to a foreign arms manufacturer long ago.)
It's a shame that our politics weren't able to grasp the knowhow they let go. (Same for the Pinzgauer, it's in service since the middle of the 70's and there's no replacement for them even on the market. Nothing that can compete in offroading with the payload and even less being narrow enough to manage the trails it needs to.)
Volvo c303/202....
@@01Bouwhuis According to wikipedia their manufacture was stopped in 1981. (So even earlier than the Pinzgauer.)
Absolutely one of my favorite museums! I visit every time when I am in Vienna
As usual very interesting and very informative video. Thank you very much for your hard work 😁👍
I would thing the addition of the rear-view driver's mirror would indicate that the front marker was so a lead vehicle could tell if they were out pacing their group.
Finally! Great Video as usual!
Thanks Nick
Always a good day when the Cheiftian uploads a video
Very neat tanks, looking forward to the next part.
Well with turreted vehicles, and ones with rotating cupolas where the crew seat might face them sideways towards the breece, with vision blocks and such, especially ones where the barrel of the gun extends further to the front than the rear, if you rotate the turret, or turn your head 90 degrees to the rear, you'd see those front marker lights and be able to tell the driver of your own vehicle to slow down or speed up, as needed.
It's an interesting weird feeling, when a TH-camr you follow, from another continent, suddenly appears in your city and makes a video. 😅 Hope you enjoy Vienna.
I had a pub session as well, it was announced on my FB page. I'll post on YT Community as well
The convoy markers on the front is probably as simple as the TC in the tank ahead being able to look behind and check the distance of the following tank, likely when moving as a convoy in night time conditions when headlights need to be turned off
?
@@DrLoverLover ?
It's not unknown for drivers to fall asleep while traveling long distance, the lights may just be there to let the soon to be rammed vehicle in front to get the hell out the way if possible and allow those in the vehicle to get out if they can't move out the way. Would imagine a Jeep or 2-1/2 ton truck wouldn't win during a collision with that.
Just a sec-Did he just say that many Central European tanks are street legal? Sheeet…I know what I want for my next daily driver!
One of the reasons for the design of the Kürassier was for it not need a Military Police escort in peace time on public roads. Most training in central Europe (Germany) was done on public roads.
Sure. Example m.th-cam.com/video/bowtCs5j6lQ/w-d-xo.html
Most tanks are street legal in the US depending on local road weight regulations and whether tracks at an issue. They are just registered as agricultural vehicles and are mostly exempt. In most of Europe they have stricter regulations about what can be driven on the road, you are required to have certain lights, etc, whatever you are driving, whoever you are. So even the military had to install marker lights, etc, to legally drive on the roads, or yes, the police could pull them over and fine them. So he means the tanks are street legal in Central Europe, not that Central European tanks are the only ones you can drive on the road. Unless you live in Central Europe. And have a lot of money for fuel and insurance, especially once you have inevitably totalled a few cars because you can't even see where you are going in a 40 ton armored vehicle on the way to work every day, getting a half mile per gallon or worse in fuel mileage.
Until somebody brings evidence that's conclusive in one way or another, my suggestion regarding the linked idler is to default to Occam's razor.
The simplest explanation might be that no other military has had enough problems with tracks popping off due to the suspension travel to warrant bolting more complex gubbins to the hulls of their AFVs.
He's back!
The ammo might be comfy, but the driver might have other thoughts ...
I love the idea of indicator lights on a tank. If I were in a vehicle behind a tank, I'd hold back and wait to see which way it moves. I wouldn't need a subtle hint to see which road it chews up. I'd be grateful for a wave from the TC out of his hatch to show he noticed me!
The "Arsenal" the Building Complex the museum is in was built in the mid 19th century, not in the 18th century, as a reaction to the unsuccessful Revolution of 1848, but since the channel is not about architecture...
I sit corrected...
To add: the barracks in which the museum is located were built in the moorish style. Fantastic complex, as such alone worth a visit. And among the exhibits is the car, in which the Austro-Hungarian heir to the throne was shot in Sarajevo starting WW I.
Thanks for covering vehicles from my glorious county of origin: Österreich!
They shine two beams on the leading vehicle. The distance between the beams on the rear of the leading vehicle gives an indication of the following distance.
They aren't bright enough to project light. They are designed to be just visible to an observer.
@@TheChieftainsHatch I’m flattered you took the time to respond to my post, even if it was to debunk it. Keep up the good content.
That's the entire point of the convoy light on the back of the vehicle ahead of you, so why would you need that? And why would you just make something up and post it as an answer if you didn't know?
@@justforever96 I appreciate the response but the last sentence was unnecessary.
Holy shit. I was just there yesterday. Awesome place awesome video!
@Chieftain: Nice to see you were in my home country. I hope you enjoyed the stay.
Finally!! another Episode
I always found it amazing that a grease gun could tension a track.
It's actually simple hydraulics. Uses a lot of grease though
Some Remarks:
When the Amis left Austria in 1955 they took almost no equipment with them. We put everything in service for the austrian army, so no wonder you find tracks etc.
The convoi markers on both ends of the vehicle where still in use in the early 80. In bad or very bad terrain one man had to look out for the following vehicle and tell the commander if the connction got lost. So you can keep your convoy together without the use of radio. A slow but reliable syytem
I am in the museum at least once a year and the kürassiers are my favorites... dont understand why WG has not put one of them as a fast autoloading td without armor into the game...
I'm very much into hearing that story.
I was a Leopard 1 driver (PRTL Dutch Gepard gunner driver in 1981)
I guess that the live track of a Leopard as a simple cost even eleviates the need of ato track tension.
After changing a track we needed to have no more than a few millimeters of slack on the track measured along some two three meters of top track. Done with a piece of string with two weights.
I'd have to look up the exact measurments. 15:50
Nice to see you back in Vienna :)
So this is a tank destroyer / light tank. Name sort of implies heavy cavalry (ie some form of scouting vehicle) So hopefully we'll get a brief explanation as how it's deployed etc in the next part.
What?
This came from that period in the late 60's where people were scatching their heads and trying to come up with a way to stop early heavy ATGM's and 115mm guns with RHA alone without busting every bridge or pontoon in the army. The Leo 1, AMX-13 the Panzer 61 and the Kurassier where all based on the idea that this was not possible.
Thus they are MBT's which are only proof of autocannon rounds.
@@benlewis4241That is simply not true. The Kurassier was not a main battle tank, the Austrians had M47s and (later) M60s serving alongside the Kurassier.
Just like the French had M47s before developing the AMX-30 as main battle tanks alongside their AMX-13 light tanks.
The Leopard 1 (which originated in the same joint development program that would result in the AMX-30 after the Germans and French went their own ways) would also have substantially more armour than the AMX-13 or Kurassier.
Maybe the convoy lights are on the front to mark the tank at nighttime not when it's moving but when its standing still. Imagine you are conducting a night time road march to staging points for a maneuver. You need to conduct some uick maintenance/resupply and fall out. You park your vehicles on the side of the road, facing the road, so you can rapidly pack up and get back to the march. The marker lights on the front indicate your position to your allies. I was going to suggest that they were most likely chosen because they were created as a unit so it would be easier logistically to have them the same front and back but to me the rear lights looked to be a different design. but that could have been the poor angle.
I would assume the convoy lights at the front of the vehicle are there so that if the vehicle is transported on a flatbed truck facing backwards, you can switch the convoy lights on the tank on and still maintain proper distances when driving among other military vehicles. At least that is the first logical conclusion that jumped into my mind.
Flatbeds have their own lights
But if you are Infront of a tank in a convoy you can check if he is still there
@@ara8692 Hmm, well dedicated military trucks might have, but in wartime you sometimes have to take civilian trucks too, so then those wouldn't have military-standard convoy lights?
@@baryonyxwalkeri3957 Maybe that's part of it but I doubt there's going to be a lot of civilian truck-trailers that can handle a modern tank, those melon farmers are heavy. And besides the weight, you'd have to have a trailer of the correct width (pretty sure your average skinny European commercial trailer isn't wide enough) and getting the tank on to and off of the trailer is also a concern. I mean, I'm no expert, maybe it's easier than I imagine, but I mean, I do believe most armies have dedicated specialized tank-trailers, for some of the reasons I mentioned.
@@Kinzarr4ever I just checked this and a Kürassier is just a few cm wider than a regular ISO container, otherwise it fits in that space completely. And the weight, a Kürassier weighs 18 tons, and a regular truck trailer can carry up to 36 tons from what I googled.
The trailer has its own convoy lights.
maybe the convoy markers are on the front so the commander of the vehicle in front can see how far behind the tank behind him is?
Or the engineer that put them there didn't serve with tanks and just thought you need those on both sides
Was literally there last week.
i would assume that the dual slits in the lights would allow you to see ahead of you and you could more or less position the vehicle ahead between the beams of light as a way to mark follow distance, and still allow the commander out front to be able to see the vehicle behind
Can't wait
Nice thanks for the video been watching old stuff. Hope your doing well
The M24 Chaffee likewise had the rearmost set of road wheels flipped backwards for the same reasons: to free up space along the floor of the vehicle so they could fit the engine without having to raise the engine deck.
The more you know. 😊
M-24 tracks.... at first I thought this was a modified Chaffee hull/chassis. Certainly very similar looking.
The chassis is actually a modified APC, SPz A1 / Saurer 4K4FA / Leonidas
@@stefanm886 Was this a cheap vehicle? The assumption is yes just because of the AMX 13 heritage, but a lot of engineering effort is on display to use every inch of space as much as possible... And that means complicated to manufacture, which means expensive... But this up-armored variant is probably 20 tons or 22 at best, so it's a nearly unarmored light tank, and who wants to buy expensive light tanks? Like, artillery fragments are going to be an issue without add on armor.
But there's a ton of them all over South America where the AMX 13 reigns just because nobody has good artillery, so clearly they were cheap enough.
@@cheyannei5983 I don't know the exact price, but given it used an existing chassis already in use, and the Austrian Bundesheer had always been on a pretty tight budget, it probably wasn't particularly expensive.
Its export success in South America and the middle east (Tunesia, Morocco) also points to the fact that countries considered it to be decent bang for the buck compared to the base AMX 13.
Armor was worse than that of an actual tank, but it wasn't a tank but a TD and scout vehicle, and compared to other vehicles of this category its armor was actually above average having thiker side armor than the PT-76 had frontal armor, in addition it had the advantage of an extremly small silhouette when hull down (0,44m² 3 times smaller than the Leo 1 or T-55 4 times smaller than an S-Tank or Jagdpanzer Kanone)
@@stefanm886 The AMX 13 armor is *really* bad. A step above an armored car, but only from the front. I actually think this thing probably had slightly better protection, probably a big deal when autocannons are the primary threat.
The drum brakes are actually a really neat side advantage; spare parts. There isn't a machine shop in the Americas that can't make replacement drums or anything else, and hydraulic drives are very common and easily understood here, too. In effect, you don't need original spare parts, which would save a lot of money and ease logistics.
@@cheyannei5983 Slightly better, 20-25 instead of 15-20 mm hull front the rest pretty similar in thikness, I have a book that claims the turret front received some add on armor, but can't find its thikness
Thanks Nick. Interesting and Informative.
Having to deal with uneven ground ... one more thing about auto loaders a human would have no problem with ... or at least - no problem that didn't just require some more effort.
.
The convoy marker lights at the front:
Not for driving in reverse but being transported on a truck.
Or: When the Commander (or whoefer) looks back he might see marker lights in the reflection or something so he can tenn the driver to go slower when they loose the next vehicle.
Maybe:
Measureing distance in general. Since it is made to cross obstacles backwars (11:00) maybe when going into position as a commander you wany to see how fare away from the other tank you are atm. Even if he is facing you.
They are for traveling in convoy. If for some reason a tank was being transported on a trailer in a convoy, the trailer would have it's own convoy lights, you wouldn't need ones on the tank. Do the lights on your car serve as taillights when it's on a flatbed truck? And again, they are convoy lights, you aren't going to be crossing obstacles in convoy, especially not in reverse. If you are crossing obstacles you are in combat, and no one needs to keep proper spacing on you. In fact, you are trying to be invisible, so you aren't going to be running exterior lights on your vehicle to give the enemy a nice target to shoot at.
Asking Detroit why we do things isn't gonna help. Remember, they thought it was a good idea to put a gas cap behind a swing down tail light because they forgot to design it in to begin with. 😂
I see a Chaffee inspired hull I hit thumbs up. Also if you get a chance can you do a video on the NM-116 Super Chaffee?
Hi Chieftain, For the track tensioning system controlled by the first suspension arm, the MAJOR problems are as follows: if the first suspension arm is damaged, it is impossible to change it for another and get the tank back on the road by changing the suspension arm for another or by shortening the track because it is no longer possible to tighten it (example: for an M1 Abrams to only run with 6 suspension arms instead of 7 on one side). Because the part is not available the model of the first arm is unique compared to the following ones so if we do not have this arm specifically, it is available the tank must be abandoned or towed and it does not stop there, the first arm of suspension is unique and requires a different manufacturing model from the 5/6 others, which increases manufacturing costs and higher logistics costs because the availability of more limited parts for this part especially. I am sorry iam french i don't speak well english i use google traduction .
I'm not sure I entirely agree with the premise. Yes, it does require an additional part to be repaired to like-new, but the tank will not be immobilized. It is possible to short-track an M1 if the first road wheel www.reddit.com/media?url=https%3A%2F%2Fi.redd.it%2Fmgpy5kpozfg61.jpg or even first and second both are destroyed. www.reddit.com/media?url=https%3A%2F%2Fpreview.redd.it%2F9iwmuqrozfg61.jpg%3Fwidth%3D750%26format%3Dpjpg%26auto%3Dwebp%26s%3D0dc6e484025562a40ff30defcf6a103d843d5372
I partially agree with you the difference is that if the system as shown to you is put in place there is a loss of ability to move and mobility which requires driving at a very low speed and makes impossible to cross a wall or any obstacle the slightly high with the arm inverted moreover by accelerating the caterpillar pulls the suspension arm in the opposite direction which is all the more limiting whereas a more classic system by screw or at least dissociated from the coupling with this suspension arm will encounter almost no problem apart from an unequal distribution of the masses of the vehicles and will be able to drive faster and cross higher obstacles because in this case the system always works and is not affected by the absence of this special suspension arm. Then another argument why this system has not been adopted is quite simply because the engineers of other countries have judged that even if it could be interesting they could do without it and not use it as the return rollers for the CV90 and preferred to develop active tensioning systems for future tanks or just the hydraulic system of the Challengers with a simple button to reduce the workload even if it does not bring any other advantages for mobility.
I have another question had you information on the Belleville suspension system of the Swiss panzer 68 that you had presented a long time ago, I did not find any and I do not know how their suspension is arranged because it differs from the E-50 series that Germany tried to develop at the end of the war. This is precisely the main attraction of these tank panzer 68 and I do not remember that you mentioned it. Thank you for having answered me and for all other information on the Belleville suspension of the panzer 68 I am interested.@@TheChieftainsHatch
Perhaps the convoy markers on the front were so the tank commander can see how close the tank behind him is?
The convoy lights on the front would make sense if you had planned to move the vehicles on civilian lowboy trailers pulling the bulbs from the light fixtures for blackout.
Depressing how many of you seem convinced that makes any sense.
You ocean liner battle skills have been challenged!
The convoy lights are on the front, so the driver in the tank ahead can see them in the Wing Mirrors. At least that is my interpretation of the layout of the tank given.
Convoy Light on the Front: my guess is that a vehicle commander can look over the back of the deck to see how far back the tank behind has fallen behind or is too close. “Driver, slow it up. Bravo Barney is too far back again.”
How do so many TH-camrs I‘m subscribed to visit my hometown without me never running into one of them?
Dear Mr. Chieftain,
I have a rather serious question concerning tank crews.
Hopefully, you haven‘t been asked this question before (I‘m relatively new to your channel).
When you play videogames like War Thunder or World of tanks, the game will often simulate the death or incapacitation of a single crew member or a part of the crew from an enemy player‘s hit. As a consequence, the tank‘s fighting capabilities will decrease, but not disappear completely, because e.g. the loader will take the gunner‘s place or the commander will take the driver‘s place etc.
My question is whether or not this idea has any basis in realtiy. I‘d imagine that it‘s quite a lot to ask of any tanker, no matter how elite or well-trained they are, to drag their comrades dead body out of their place and take it, and keep going like nothing happened. I can only speak for myself, but if I saw anything like this going on in my hypothetical tank, I‘d most likely call it a day and bail immediately. I‘d imagine this issue is part of a tanker‘s training in some way shape or form, or it gets adressed in some way for example in tank design.
With greetings from germany.
No, that doesn't happen. If your tank is penetrated you only fight long enough to withdraw. Your armor is compromised, you probably have significant damage and wounded or dead crew. That's just a video game thing. Although if a crew member is incapacitated by spalling or concussion or hit outside the vehicle, you might fight with a reduced crew if you can't find a volunteer to replace him, but only until you can find one .
Marching order is to secure that the vehicle AFTER you are not slipping backwards, if You see that the light goes from 2 to one, You have to slow down or stop, if everybody in the convoy does that, the convoy will stay as a unit. If You just follow the vehicle in front, You may soon be the last vehicle in the convoy instead of being in the middle, or even if You are the leading vehicle You may be very lone very soon. Remember radio silence?
All I can think of is if the whole convoy suddenly had to back up they could keep the correct distance still. Lol
To add to the marker light discussion... Several other folks have pointed out that a lot of vehicles have them (including side facing) but since this is an older vehicle that may not have been the standard. However, this vehicle in particular was intended for mountainous terrain, and one of the things that happens in off-road conditions is you may attempt a path, determine you can't make it, and have to back out.
If you're the lead vehicle in a group, it would in that situation be very useful to be able to determine where the vehicle behind you is before you start backing up, especially since on a slope backing up into the following vehicle may mean you back up *over* them, and I believe the technical term for that is "bad shit". I suspect reasoning could be found for this in some testing or design report, if anyone cares to dig into the archives (and assuming the development program/testing notes are unclassified).
Insert French running away joke for the marker lights
The Israelis were offering the Austrian SK-105's to the Philippines light tank requirements' just a few years back (winner was ASCOD II but still with the Israelis).
French solved oscillating turret problems with char future 4, didn't they? Turret crew has its own pods left and right of the oscillating part, which is only the gun and the bustle with the autoloader. No need to seal anything oscilating related as it's totally separated part. I don't know if Sweden's Emil series does the same.
Char future 4 never left the drawing board so I am not sure it counts.
The actual french oscilating turret that was built and thus 100% counts that solved the problem was the FL-20 turret (which unfortunalty never received sales), fully stabilised and nbc protected.
Welcome to Austria, Chieftain, sorry we had to give our Army History Museum such a hard to pronounce name 😆
The Kürassier is an ugly beast but it served us quite well. Good thing we never got into any wars since 1945...
Knowing the kinds of budgets our army has to work with, this is fuckin ingenious.
The issue with the loading ramps would appear to be a lesser issue than you make out boss. If you're parked at an inconvenient angle, simply load the one you can load, then turn the turret until you can load the other.
Note that there are 2 convoy marker lights, left and right. If aligned with a convergence, say 7metres, both lights appear together on the back of the vehicle in front of you, and separated to show if you are closer or farther away. Keeping the lights convergence in the center of the vehicle is obviously also part of this.
For an accurate depiction of this method, see the movie "The Damnbusters" where the bombers used 2 lights to fly at a consistant 35 feet in altitude over the water.
That's not how those lights work, though. They glow just enough to be visible, they don't project lights. The four small slits split two and two will appear as one light, two lights or four lights depending on how close you are. Correct distance is two lights. If you see all four slits individually you are too close, if you can't see any separation at all, you are too far
May I suggest the front marker lights might had been used in conjution with the side rear view mirror on the tank driving in front of it. This to make sure that the convoy is travelling in line without exposing the tank commander and if the rear tank goes outside the path the driver can notify commander to adjust the rear vehicle to come back in line. The driving in line might be for various reason on which I am still extrapolating.
We need to go deeper... How about tank providing elevation, stabilizing the whole tank and having the turret only rotate?
Deeper, flatten the earth!
My best guess about the column light in the front would be so you look in the rearview mirror and see if the guy behind you is too far away? Not sure why you'd need that but that's the only idea I could come up with. Maybe if you're the leader in front you want to keep in check if the other guys are following you at the correct distance?
Easier for you to slow down than for someone behind to catch up?
The TC could also use rear -facing periscope (or stick head out) to check and then ask his driver "Why are we suddenly all alone? You got somewhere to be?"
@@lukedogwalker Maybe you don't wanna slow down but want your subordinates to keep pace? ..and sure you can stick your head out and see them but with the addition of the column light you can immediatly see if they are at the correct distance. Maybe it's also a driving school thing?
Surly the front convoy lights are for night use during possible two way traffic and/or so the vehicle in front is able to tell roughly how far away the vehicle behind is during a convoy? The old WW2 vehicles, Jeeps, cargo trucks etc have them at the front so maybe that is the answer?
Actualy the Superkürassier is a Kryptonian Design, it just pretends beeing from a small Tank Factory in rural Austria.
A lot of older vehicles were very minimalist. One marker light on front and back one headlight etc. Newer vehicles not as much. It also may be that the marker lights on all corners were a legal requirement like how British vehicles have liscense plates.
No... I think we do need to go into the M1 that fell down a mountain.
The convoy marker lights in the front. I'd suppose is so a vehicle crewman can look back and see if the trail vehicle behind them is still there.
My theory for the front marker lights is redundancy.
You're supposed to be looking at the guy in front of you and keeping up. BUT if you fail to do this, the tank commander in front of you can poke his head out, look at the markers behind him, hop on the radio and say "Hey guys, you're trailing way too far. Form up!."
That redundancy could be especially useful in training recruits that are getting used to the spacing and might let their eyes wander from the tank in front of them.
The marker lights on the front actually illuminate a small patch of ground in front of the vehicle slightly. It does help especially if you are the lead vehicle and don't have a proper IR sight. I've actually used them on exercises, not great but it works.
Why didnt you use the the front lights? The small ones above the bigger. They are the same that leopards have
Front lights give away your position too much, the marker lights less so although they still show up huge if viewed through infrared. @@taistelusammakko5088
No
That would be your night drive light
Fully stabilized and oscillating battlesta... Kurassier, I meant to say Kurassier.
On the convoy lights on the front: would they have transported the tank loaded on a trailer facing rearward? If so, I could see the light on the tank being used as it would be much closer to the height of the cab of the following truck than the tail of the transport trailer.
CHEIFTAIN CAN YOU PLEASE TALK ABOUT THE CHEIFTAIN FINALLY. I swear you’re the only person to name yourself after your favourite tank and then not do a single video or discussion about it. You could do a “inside the chieftains hatch” for it, it’s truly one of britains greatest tanks ever. For the time it was almost as advanced as the centurion was for its time
There is this snapshot... th-cam.com/video/4IHSqn_SJ3Q/w-d-xo.html
From the front it looks like a Dalek from Dr. Who. Cheers from the Pacific West Coast of Canada.
Here from Detroit
4:12 "You will see there are holes in the sides of the tracks and the purpose of those is to stick ice-creams..." I think I need my sweet fix!
I don't get it, he said "Ice grips" which doesn't even sound anything like "ice creams". If he had said "ice cleats" it would make sense.
I have no experience driving tanks and I have even less experience driving tanks in convoy at night (still none), however I wonder if the front marker lights could be for the driver of the front vehicle to be able to make sure that the tank that is meant to be following him is still there? Or perhaps for oncoming traffic
For the travel lights… do these vehicles have reflectors on the back in a triangle set up or so?