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Sera and Sona are great when you pair them up in the bot lane. I’m not sure if it’s actually good as much as the enemy inevitably becoming tilted after having to listen to 2 song themed champions for the first half of the game, like even if they fail to kill their lane opponents in game they’ll still kill their mental from sheer cringe.
As one of the rare sona mains on the planet hearing the sad but true statement of Seraphine existing means Sona will probably never get a rework struck me in the heart :( Fuck it tho we ball on till we Etwahl out
Its a really annoying thing with the whole seraphine vs sona argument cause i think riot made them so similar but different enough in tiny ways to justify saying oh its a whole new character! when its what sona probably should have been. I still love sona very much I just think everything about her lore wise is just way cooler to me than anything seraphine ever was. Im always gonna love sona just because of what she can do and the fact she can win games and help the team like crazy just in really small ways, like what other champ has a 30% reduce enemy champion dmg in their base kit? Theres always a different passive chord to use in a situation, you see a lilia time to slow, rengar w exhaust and its things like that i love about the champ.
I dont think Sona should've been worked into seraphines kit beat for beat per say but they absolutely could've used some of the ability concepts to bring Sona up to modern standards like having her ult travel further and making it a charm or adding seraphines passive to Sona so she is always able to give her teammates some extra damage without only having to use her q to do it. Sonas design is awesome and I'd hate to see her lose her identity as a champion but I would be nice to see her in a more modern light.
One reason i prefer Sona over Seraph is the aura effect.. I think the best thing to keep her relevant without changing her identity would be to simply increase the radius of the auras
I definitely feel like there could've been a good middle ground for a sona update if they just sliced up her abilities to be more viable in modern league. She has decent effects as is but so many champions now have passives on passives and it feels like some of sonas abilities could be combined to introduce more mechanics to her kit.
Nah you're totally right, WR cuts down on some of the bloat while giving her a nice little stun with her power chord, idk how I feel about the change to the ult though
the issue is that wildrift sona is in wildrift. a different game. there are alot of discussions on the sona main reddit and i wont burry this shit out again but the issue is. ITS A DIFFERENT GAME, and porting sonas WR kit to PC brings quite a lot of risks with it, that arent nesseary @@T_squared112
the sona sera take is an take you only have when you have 0 idea about Sona and her game philosophy. Seraphine, while haveing some similaritys is only compared so much to sona because of the them of the champion: Music. if it would not be for music all those non sona players would never came to that silly conclusion that "seraphine is just a sona rework". its not, and its silly to agure since a lot of enchanters carry similarity like sona and sera do in there kit. Sona and Seraphine are simply 2 different takes on the enchanter idea, and the issue just springs from the fact that both use music. sona could always be updated since seraphine is not sona 2.0. Seraphine has a far bigger focus on been a mage than most enchanters has, while sona takes the enchanter idea and give it an unique twist with being an aura specialist, what makes her unique but also very fitting design for the game since lol has a lot of items and runes that are specificly made more usefull by the fact that sona can spread there effects so effectivly. what in that case made sona always a scaleing teamfight champion, since she profit alot from enchanter items, more than other enchanters, while been able to bring thos item effects and enhanced shileds to all teammates consistently. also the "sona needs an update" take is also weak. the video never explains why she would need an update and i myself cant come to an conclusion my self. is it because sona is not the most populare champion with playrate? or because her abilities are simple by design? i dont think that are reasons to rework an champion. there will be always in an ever evolving game like lol champions with simpler abilities and less playrate. its fine that some champions have an more simple design, and sonas pickrate is also not bad, while as i mentioned before her aura based identity is unique in lol and has an good place with the current item design, and since thos item existed for as long as i can remeber (sometimes more sometimes less many and effectiv) i dont think that will change anytime soon. sorry if my comment is with out strukture. also some actuall constructive feedback. your videos would be much better with timestamps. the explain of her kit wars long and i can imagine that some people (like me) allready know what the kit of some champion is. you put effort in this video but i think it only shows an uninformed outside view to the topic that i really dont cant agree with. when i read the comments here i have a sour taste in my mouth since they all agree with an extremly outside and not understanding view of the champion what might actually result in changes no one asked for. i dont know you or your sources but i would also recommend to get an deeper understanding of champions that you talk about next time. i dont want to end only negative since i think you can make great videos about topics like that but this video really wasnt it. Liz out xoxo
I appreciate the feedback and I like seeing different takes on these topics. I try to keep these videos relatively short form so I can actually get them out without a headache so yes there's a fair bit of information that gets left out or some points may not get elaborated on. I understand the sentiment of feeling like Sona doesn't need to be changed and based on numbers and play rates it's understandable why she wouldn't get changed. More so looking at the turmoil around seraphines release it just seemed like there could've been a good opportunity to add more to sonas kit to bring her up to a more modern play style that might feel more intuitive. They've put in a lot of work to work on older champions with outdated kits and while I think Sona has some great tools some of them could be combined with other abilities or have more unique effects to make her a more potent pick as a support. I don't think a full-scale rework would be needed but I would definitely argue that seraphines existence has put Sona in a very unfortunate position where if they were to update her it would go far beyond what her current identity is and if there comes a time and meta where she isn't as effective the only viable way to buff her is with straight numbers which is an arguably bad way to bring champions into meta. Very good feedback overall and I like being able to banter in the comments about these things so I appreciate the comment!
I couldn't agree more with you. The only reason Sona hasn't been meta in a while is because long range champions haven't been meta in a while. And the few times they were, it was poke, wich does barely profit from Sona as well. After all Sona stands in her backline and wants to buff them continuously. A Kai'sa and any other diver just don't work very well with her. BUT the biggest difference between Seraphine and Sona is RANGE. Im surprised how this wasn't mentioned at all. Seraphines is only good, because she can poke and cc you from Narnia and her AOE heal has the size of the sun. Her spells are pretty mid outside of that. All they would have to do for Sona is: Reduce Sona ult cooldown and have her stacks increase the range of her Auras and her Ult. That way she would be less hit or miss and she could buff her team more reliably without needing to hug them.
@@FuhonTusjo making her abilities scale is such a good idea. Late game it really just comes down to spamming and the scaling is still pretty mediocre so scaling and evolving gameplay would be super cool.
@@FuhonTusjo nonono i think honestly giving sona more scaleing is a dangerous tool, special the range. Sona is never "meta" if we just use meta as an word that discribes what is picked a lot. sona wars the last 9 years always good or solid. Sona only falls into "meta" when she is op, and that is not healthy to set as an goal. the range thing is very very unhealthy to increase since it is sonas "only" skillexpression. haveing the best positioning and movement is the skill sona mains mastered and a key of her gameplay. giving her more range removes that, what makes her not just easyer in general but it also removes her masterclass what results imo in an boring state of design. sona ult cd is allready insanly low and i would rather not lower it more. because of its speed and aoe area sona ult is allready an insanely strong aoe impact cc tool that dont need to be bigger or more often available. think like that. how do you want to balance sona? do you want to increase the range of her non R abilities? good job, riot will need to nerv all the numbers by a lot and take power from the ultimate to balance it out do you want to buff power of the ulitmate? good job, now riot needs to gut her non r abilities more. i think a champion balanced via numbers is a blessing for riot. and sona shows that with an year long record of been a strong champion that can be easylie picked up and excells via masterclass. Sona has all tools she could ask for allready, just from my expirence as an sona main the community doese not value the consistent value sona brings much over high impact ones other champs brings. Auras cant be gamechanging neither they cant have an to big range. it would be an instant issue. how would you feel to play against an sona that is never reachable but can put all her buffs on allies? i know how you would feel. tilted. just like the oppionon against yuumi is/wars. its just not healthy. i think the range of sona is good. it enables her to be so strong but requireres an often overlooked skill. positioning. sona can buff every team mate, she excells to play on the edge of getting hit. she excells of playing to the limit of what is possible. giving her more range would firstly water down the skill expression behind sona and would creat a very problematic champion for riot. now you could say we could just let her range scale so little it dose not counter my arguments. and i think riot did allready in the mini rework something with the scaleing cooldown and the stack mechanic. and i say yes that could work out and improve something. but lets qoute "Vars" fiora video for an moment "Riot tried to fix, what wasnt broken". yea for sure riot could do that. but for me there is no reason why. is sona weak? no. is sona not played? no. is sona problematic right now? no. yea theoriecrafting sometimes is nice but i think in the case of sona we should acceapt that she is a more niche champion, that is with a roaster of over 160 champions a position to be in that is actually quite nice.
@@Im_TheNoodle i dont think sonas scaleing is mediocre. as i said before sona is the enchanter that scales with items. giving her abilites themself more scaling just creats an issue of having to much scaling what could result in an treatment that makes her useless in the early game, what dose not fit the development riot games tried to force on lol for the last years. faster and more snowball. i dont think sona needs a better late and infact riot knows that. the last mini rework allready took away a bit of sonas hyper late game scaling to let her reach her full potential earlyer.
@@Alasadg im not sure what youre trying to say...? they still play very differently lmao, sona can support her team a lot more than seraphine can, seraphine isn't a pure enchanter like sona, you left out the most important thing in Sona's kit which is her passive and her Aura's which setaphine cant replicate with her W
This is the same stupid argument people used back when seraphine was released years ago. Seraphine is NOT Sona and if you think she is, then you have never played either of them or you don’t know how to play them correctly. Yes Sona needs a rework but sera has nothing to do with that
My problem with the seraphine release at large is that it didn't necessarily have to be a full blown rework for Sona but there are definitely aspects of her kit that could've been solved to Sona as a minor update to give her a more modern and intuitive feel without losing her identity and play style as a whole. I think as far as game feel and play style go they both definitely function differently but looking at the state of the game and meta I can see why a lot of players would prefer to have a seraphine. Just giving Sona some of seraphines unique aspects like her ult distance growing with each target or her bonus auto damage being on her normal passive and not attached to her q would make Sona more of a force to be reckoned with. But now that those aspects have been applied to an entirely unique champion it means they're probably going to make even more drastic changes to Sona if or when they update her meaning there's a good chance she will evolve into an entirely different play style which I'm sure a lot of players don't want.
Sera and Sona are great when you pair them up in the bot lane. I’m not sure if it’s actually good as much as the enemy inevitably becoming tilted after having to listen to 2 song themed champions for the first half of the game, like even if they fail to kill their lane opponents in game they’ll still kill their mental from sheer cringe.
As one of the rare sona mains on the planet hearing the sad but true statement of Seraphine existing means Sona will probably never get a rework struck me in the heart :( Fuck it tho we ball on till we Etwahl out
Stay ballin my friend.
Its a really annoying thing with the whole seraphine vs sona argument cause i think riot made them so similar but different enough in tiny ways to justify saying oh its a whole new character! when its what sona probably should have been. I still love sona very much I just think everything about her lore wise is just way cooler to me than anything seraphine ever was. Im always gonna love sona just because of what she can do and the fact she can win games and help the team like crazy just in really small ways, like what other champ has a 30% reduce enemy champion dmg in their base kit? Theres always a different passive chord to use in a situation, you see a lilia time to slow, rengar w exhaust and its things like that i love about the champ.
I dont think Sona should've been worked into seraphines kit beat for beat per say but they absolutely could've used some of the ability concepts to bring Sona up to modern standards like having her ult travel further and making it a charm or adding seraphines passive to Sona so she is always able to give her teammates some extra damage without only having to use her q to do it. Sonas design is awesome and I'd hate to see her lose her identity as a champion but I would be nice to see her in a more modern light.
One reason i prefer Sona over Seraph is the aura effect.. I think the best thing to keep her relevant without changing her identity would be to simply increase the radius of the auras
I definitely feel like there could've been a good middle ground for a sona update if they just sliced up her abilities to be more viable in modern league. She has decent effects as is but so many champions now have passives on passives and it feels like some of sonas abilities could be combined to introduce more mechanics to her kit.
@@Im_TheNoodle I agree.. off the dome I’m thinking armor/MR added to her W, or resistance shred on her ult
@@Pav-the-trump-guy wouldn't mind her ult getting the seraphine treatment either I mean c'mon...
Sona had something neat going for her
Then sera incident happened
Love it. Subbed.
As a Sona main, I am so attached to her and actually would be so sad if they announced she is getting reworked xd
Well if they ever do let's hope they don't go overboard.
genuine question, how do the stupid harp noises not drive you insane?
it takes them like 5 years to rework a champ dont worry 😂
@@AndroidZero-Nine plink plonk
Coming here to boost the algorithm cuz that things a ****
waiting for u on mine xd
zoo wee mama that was a good video!
Thanks homie you're a real one.
Eww you pay lmao
@@yorhaunit21o32 I support real ones and this man is as real as it gets
@@yorhaunit21o32 if you're broke just say so
*farts cutely*
Oh dang I’ve got a cool badge, you guys should get one too
Only $1.99 a month 😏
nice video
WR sona better is than PC sona (might get hate from this).
L take
Nah you're totally right, WR cuts down on some of the bloat while giving her a nice little stun with her power chord, idk how I feel about the change to the ult though
the issue is that wildrift sona is in wildrift. a different game. there are alot of discussions on the sona main reddit and i wont burry this shit out again but the issue is. ITS A DIFFERENT GAME, and porting sonas WR kit to PC brings quite a lot of risks with it, that arent nesseary @@T_squared112
Sona main 3.3 mil points 🎉❤
YIPPEE!!!
the sona sera take is an take you only have when you have 0 idea about Sona and her game philosophy. Seraphine, while haveing some similaritys is only compared so much to sona because of the them of the champion: Music. if it would not be for music all those non sona players would never came to that silly conclusion that "seraphine is just a sona rework". its not, and its silly to agure since a lot of enchanters carry similarity like sona and sera do in there kit. Sona and Seraphine are simply 2 different takes on the enchanter idea, and the issue just springs from the fact that both use music. sona could always be updated since seraphine is not sona 2.0. Seraphine has a far bigger focus on been a mage than most enchanters has, while sona takes the enchanter idea and give it an unique twist with being an aura specialist, what makes her unique but also very fitting design for the game since lol has a lot of items and runes that are specificly made more usefull by the fact that sona can spread there effects so effectivly. what in that case made sona always a scaleing teamfight champion, since she profit alot from enchanter items, more than other enchanters, while been able to bring thos item effects and enhanced shileds to all teammates consistently.
also the "sona needs an update" take is also weak. the video never explains why she would need an update and i myself cant come to an conclusion my self. is it because sona is not the most populare champion with playrate? or because her abilities are simple by design? i dont think that are reasons to rework an champion. there will be always in an ever evolving game like lol champions with simpler abilities and less playrate. its fine that some champions have an more simple design, and sonas pickrate is also not bad, while as i mentioned before her aura based identity is unique in lol and has an good place with the current item design, and since thos item existed for as long as i can remeber (sometimes more sometimes less many and effectiv) i dont think that will change anytime soon.
sorry if my comment is with out strukture. also some actuall constructive feedback. your videos would be much better with timestamps. the explain of her kit wars long and i can imagine that some people (like me) allready know what the kit of some champion is.
you put effort in this video but i think it only shows an uninformed outside view to the topic that i really dont cant agree with. when i read the comments here i have a sour taste in my mouth since they all agree with an extremly outside and not understanding view of the champion what might actually result in changes no one asked for.
i dont know you or your sources but i would also recommend to get an deeper understanding of champions that you talk about next time. i dont want to end only negative since i think you can make great videos about topics like that but this video really wasnt it.
Liz out
xoxo
I appreciate the feedback and I like seeing different takes on these topics. I try to keep these videos relatively short form so I can actually get them out without a headache so yes there's a fair bit of information that gets left out or some points may not get elaborated on. I understand the sentiment of feeling like Sona doesn't need to be changed and based on numbers and play rates it's understandable why she wouldn't get changed. More so looking at the turmoil around seraphines release it just seemed like there could've been a good opportunity to add more to sonas kit to bring her up to a more modern play style that might feel more intuitive. They've put in a lot of work to work on older champions with outdated kits and while I think Sona has some great tools some of them could be combined with other abilities or have more unique effects to make her a more potent pick as a support. I don't think a full-scale rework would be needed but I would definitely argue that seraphines existence has put Sona in a very unfortunate position where if they were to update her it would go far beyond what her current identity is and if there comes a time and meta where she isn't as effective the only viable way to buff her is with straight numbers which is an arguably bad way to bring champions into meta. Very good feedback overall and I like being able to banter in the comments about these things so I appreciate the comment!
I couldn't agree more with you. The only reason Sona hasn't been meta in a while is because long range champions haven't been meta in a while. And the few times they were, it was poke, wich does barely profit from Sona as well. After all Sona stands in her backline and wants to buff them continuously. A Kai'sa and any other diver just don't work very well with her.
BUT the biggest difference between Seraphine and Sona is RANGE. Im surprised how this wasn't mentioned at all. Seraphines is only good, because she can poke and cc you from Narnia and her AOE heal has the size of the sun. Her spells are pretty mid outside of that.
All they would have to do for Sona is:
Reduce Sona ult cooldown and have her stacks increase the range of her Auras and her Ult. That way she would be less hit or miss and she could buff her team more reliably without needing to hug them.
@@FuhonTusjo making her abilities scale is such a good idea. Late game it really just comes down to spamming and the scaling is still pretty mediocre so scaling and evolving gameplay would be super cool.
@@FuhonTusjo nonono i think honestly giving sona more scaleing is a dangerous tool, special the range. Sona is never "meta" if we just use meta as an word that discribes what is picked a lot. sona wars the last 9 years always good or solid. Sona only falls into "meta" when she is op, and that is not healthy to set as an goal. the range thing is very very unhealthy to increase since it is sonas "only" skillexpression. haveing the best positioning and movement is the skill sona mains mastered and a key of her gameplay. giving her more range removes that, what makes her not just easyer in general but it also removes her masterclass what results imo in an boring state of design.
sona ult cd is allready insanly low and i would rather not lower it more. because of its speed and aoe area sona ult is allready an insanely strong aoe impact cc tool that dont need to be bigger or more often available.
think like that. how do you want to balance sona?
do you want to increase the range of her non R abilities? good job, riot will need to nerv all the numbers by a lot and take power from the ultimate to balance it out
do you want to buff power of the ulitmate? good job, now riot needs to gut her non r abilities more.
i think a champion balanced via numbers is a blessing for riot. and sona shows that with an year long record of been a strong champion that can be easylie picked up and excells via masterclass. Sona has all tools she could ask for allready, just from my expirence as an sona main the community doese not value the consistent value sona brings much over high impact ones other champs brings. Auras cant be gamechanging neither they cant have an to big range. it would be an instant issue. how would you feel to play against an sona that is never reachable but can put all her buffs on allies? i know how you would feel. tilted. just like the oppionon against yuumi is/wars. its just not healthy.
i think the range of sona is good. it enables her to be so strong but requireres an often overlooked skill. positioning. sona can buff every team mate, she excells to play on the edge of getting hit. she excells of playing to the limit of what is possible. giving her more range would firstly water down the skill expression behind sona and would creat a very problematic champion for riot.
now you could say we could just let her range scale so little it dose not counter my arguments. and i think riot did allready in the mini rework something with the scaleing cooldown and the stack mechanic. and i say yes that could work out and improve something. but lets qoute "Vars" fiora video for an moment "Riot tried to fix, what wasnt broken". yea for sure riot could do that. but for me there is no reason why. is sona weak? no. is sona not played? no. is sona problematic right now? no. yea theoriecrafting sometimes is nice but i think in the case of sona we should acceapt that she is a more niche champion, that is with a roaster of over 160 champions a position to be in that is actually quite nice.
@@Im_TheNoodle i dont think sonas scaleing is mediocre. as i said before sona is the enchanter that scales with items. giving her abilites themself more scaling just creats an issue of having to much scaling what could result in an treatment that makes her useless in the early game, what dose not fit the development riot games tried to force on lol for the last years. faster and more snowball. i dont think sona needs a better late and infact riot knows that. the last mini rework allready took away a bit of sonas hyper late game scaling to let her reach her full potential earlyer.
Seraphine and Sona play nothing alike tho. If you want to make a comparison, Seraphine is just a better Lux.
SONA SERAPHINE
q-poke q-better poke
w-heal w-heal and movement speed
e-MS buff e-enemy MS nerf
R-CC R-better CC
@@Alasadg im not sure what youre trying to say...? they still play very differently lmao, sona can support her team a lot more than seraphine can, seraphine isn't a pure enchanter like sona, you left out the most important thing in Sona's kit which is her passive and her Aura's which setaphine cant replicate with her W
@@Alasadg
can do that with nami to. you smart person :)
5:20 Seraphine is fine in Runeterra, but the LoL version is awful
Legends of runeterra?
Yea, she has much better design there and fits with her cards into Piltover nicely@@Im_TheNoodle
This is the same stupid argument people used back when seraphine was released years ago. Seraphine is NOT Sona and if you think she is, then you have never played either of them or you don’t know how to play them correctly. Yes Sona needs a rework but sera has nothing to do with that
My problem with the seraphine release at large is that it didn't necessarily have to be a full blown rework for Sona but there are definitely aspects of her kit that could've been solved to Sona as a minor update to give her a more modern and intuitive feel without losing her identity and play style as a whole. I think as far as game feel and play style go they both definitely function differently but looking at the state of the game and meta I can see why a lot of players would prefer to have a seraphine. Just giving Sona some of seraphines unique aspects like her ult distance growing with each target or her bonus auto damage being on her normal passive and not attached to her q would make Sona more of a force to be reckoned with. But now that those aspects have been applied to an entirely unique champion it means they're probably going to make even more drastic changes to Sona if or when they update her meaning there's a good chance she will evolve into an entirely different play style which I'm sure a lot of players don't want.
haven't watched the video yet, my hypothesis is that the problem with sona is that her voicelines are really fking annoying