Hi! Nate here, maker of Negative Lab Pro. This video is so great... couldn't stop laughing. Well done. A couple of hints on Negative Lab Pro that may be helpful for viewers. 1) For Tiff scans, I recommend NOT using Lightroom's white balance tool prior to conversion. Without getting into all the technical details, the white balance tools works differently on RAW files vs Tiff/Jpeg files. White balancing on a TIF/JPG prior to conversion is likely to result in strong turquoise casts (which some people love, and others hate - so I guess to each his own?). So here, you could either just convert without white balancing prior to conversion, or you could use the included "Tif Scan Prep" utility, which will more correctly balance out the film prior to conversion. It isn't usually necessary, but you'll get slightly more accurate results if you do that step. You could also create a RAW DNG with either Silverfast or Vuescan, which could then make use of Negative Lab Pro's raw camera profiles. I usually think this produces better results. 2) The default "standard" profile in Negative Lab Pro is on the punchier side, and is based on Lab Scanners default contrast profiles. You can make the "linear + deep" or "linear + flat" profiles the default if you want something flatter, or adjust the whiteclip and blackclip points to taste. Everything you do in Negative Lab Pro in non-destructive (unlike EpsonScan and Silverfast) so it's easy to adjust and re-adjust always working against the original. 3) For backlit scenes, a quick trick you can do is to crop in to just the foreground, and then run the conversion (you can re-crop after). NLP will optimize based on whats in the crop at the time of conversion. 4) Future versions of NLP will have more options for gamut control - which will be especially useful for controlling the bright cherry reds and intense turquoise colors. Hope that helps, and thanks again for the awesome videos you make!
Seriously though, it pains me to get my shots I worked hard on get 5 likes when some random girl can put a filter on her face and get 127. Instagram really isn't the way imho.
@@fandyus4125 true that. plus it really isn't the best way to appreciate photography (it crops images, quality is poor and you can't really zoom in to see the details)
Ok you had your fun Jason now can I please have my scanner back, I’m sending my wife’s boyfriend to pick it up since you broke my nose and clogged the toilet
Love the commentary. Recently purchased the Plustek Opticfilm 8200 ai scanner with 8.8 silverfast to scan decades of my parents slide photos. Still learning the correct settings especially for any underexposed slides...... Hundreds of Kodak Carousels in my closets now to be scanned. I am sure eventually I shall master the settings... Keep up the fantastic commentary and enjoy a beer discussing the wisdom of life and the value of an analog life....
4:42 I would totally take the EPSON Scan over the other two. It's just way more natural IMO and a better starting point to work with the image if you wanted to tweak it in post a little. It's not a RAW file most likely a TIFF, so having good highlight exposure it looks great and If you wanted you could putt a bit of the shadows up but I think it looks the best and most properly exposed. The colors also look to be the most accurate. I've never had any issues with my Epson software.
If you actually take 15 seconds to make some very basic adjustments in Epson scan, it delivers. I'm sure that's true of all 3 apps though. So honestly this is not a very illuminating comparison cuz nobody's just going to take the stock auto exposure and use that, are they? If you're going to all the trouble to shoot and develop film, surely you're not going to just set your scanner on instamatic. I've watched a ton of reviews on NLP and ViewScan and not really seeing any convincing reason to switch from Epson. The colors such as oversaturated reds and turning all the blues turqoise in NLP are just bizarre IMO.
I turn “CCR” (color cast removal) off in Silverfast. I find it often screws up the colors. I watched so many of these comparisons and reviews last year, I’m confident that Silverfast is overall the best scanning software. For reference I use a Plustek 8200i.
Here we are four years after you did this video and you had me laughing! Became an instant subscriber. Great job! Just started scanning film and never heard of Silverfast or the LR plug-in ($99?! Sheesh!).
This was the video that we all badly needed. I had been wanting a comparison like this for a while. I wish that you developed your own film so that you could compare B/W developers
I use Epson scan just because it came with the scanner and one of the most impressive things about the software is how it removes the magenta shift from expired slide film and gives a pretty usable image. Would be interested in how the other software alternatives would handle expired slide film.
I just bought an Epson scanner this morning, and you conforted me in my choice. Great video as always, finally one that kills my boring ass quarantine day routine
Thanks! I went all in and bought the Epson V850Pro some weeks ago, mainly for braggin' rights, but it comes with Silverfast SE 8 included for free (cause the scanner is hella expensive), and I've just been using that so far. I have, though, realised how much difference a few adjustments can do to to the output of the scan. Also, the iSDR (iRDS? iSRD?) for colour negatives is AMAZING at removing all that dust that otherwise would make my life a living hell.
Thanks for the comparison. I myself have been manually adjusting negatives with curves in Photoshop before, but recently, I have started processing my negative scans with my own python code using grey world algorithm improved with salient detection. It works surprisingly well and costs nothing.
The TIFF prep is like a gamma correction, definitely helps with contrast and color. Only problem I have with it is the fact that you end up with 3 gigantic files for every one finished photo
Hey Corey, I also use a V750 and Negative Lab Pro and after extensive testing specifically with this scanner, TIF prep rarely improves or worsens the result. Tiff prep is more needed for low gamma value scanners like Nikons. The Epson V700 and V700 series are Gamma 2.2 scanners and will generally only benefit from Tiff Prep in edge cases.
@@GregoryVeizades Interesting, I knew it corrected to Gamma 2.2 - but did not know that the 700 & 750 were Gamma 2.2 default. Very interesting, thank you Gregory!
Jose Juarez That was the point of the video, comparing their default results without editing them. It is to show people what the program does itself, not with the user.
Colour scanning rely a lot on the quality of the light source and RAW converter, you will be amazed what you can get out of Capture One compared with the mentioned software.
I really love the results I get with my epson, they scans are flat but it retains details in the shadows and highlights but it takes some work in Lightroom to correct the contrast and mid tones. I’m impressed with what Ive seen from silverfast and I’m curious about negative lab pro.
The nice thing about the V700 is you can use the wet mount scan process to get better results from your film scans. If you have Silverfast there is a option to crossgrade your license at a discount. These flatbeds are great for medium / large format film not so great for 35mm. Silverfast does some interesting scanning at different setting to give you a better dynamic range. I don't scan much at home anymore because it just takes too long and I never been able to match results from pro labs with skilled film scanner operators (except for Black and White, I can get just as good or better black and white scans at home).
I like the results from Silverfast but it’s the program I love to hate. Most unfriendly interface, but useable if you buy the third party manual. I’m currently trying NLP as the interface is very nice and it fits into my LR workflow without the export, import hack to fix backwards controls in LR when photographing negatives. It’s just so good to see new products in this space and your review was a giggle. Thank you.
Super informative, Jason. I've been using Vuescan for a while but I'm looking to change things up. I definitely appreciate the humor that you bring to your reviews as well. Well done.
Jimmyferminphotography Yes. In my opinion, a true FINE ART photographer would want to get the image in camera, even if it takes coming back to that spot 8 months later using an ephemeris to position the moon in the correct spot, or waiting until the perfect sunset to take that cityscape shot even if it takes months to happen and you have to go every time there is a sunset. It is cutting corners, and you will never see an image with a moon added using photoshop or a sky replacement landscape photograph in the MOMA or any comparable fine art museum that has been around for more than 50 years. I realize “hobbyist” photographers or “professional” photographers don’t care and would rather do it in post because of laziness but that is why they are not revered fine art photographers that are being represented by distinguished galleries
You're the first stand up comedian who also makes great videos about film photography. It's pretty clear: you won't find the good stuff swimming on the top of the ocean, you must dive deeper. However, I wish you all the best and as much subscribe as the well known TH-cam photographer Influencer advertising non professional dude.
Quick thing to make your scans even better, head on over to eBay, type in "SCAN TECH ANTI NEWTON RING ANR OPTICAL GLASS" and marvel at the difference an actually flat negative can make when you use the ANR glass vs the regular jacked up Epson holders.
An easier way us you get the Epson V700 35mm holders with the Build in ANR layer. Much much better vs the stock V700 ones and way easier to use. Still not ideal, but neither are flatbeds in general for 35mm.
not sure if this applies to the v700 but Silverfast is actually given free if you register your scanner to the epson website. Reason being that the iSRD isnt functional in the Epson Scan software 2. Used it on my v600
IMO the best software for scanning negatives is RawTherapee. It is completely free, and its film negative module is really outstanding. There is definitely more to adjust than on other softwares, but overall, I found the results to be more consistent somehow.
you can achieve NLP-conversions without the turquoise blue tones, if you digitize as a RAW DNG, either with Silverfast (a version which allows it) or with Vuescan which can also use infrared dust removal. but for your route via Tiff I highly recommend using the Tiff-Preparation tool which comes with NLP. It will change the tiffs gamma to a value (2.2) from which NLP will work much better.
You didn’t mention the lack of ICE for Negative Lab Pro which adds to the processing length. Have you done manual inversions in Photoshop? It’s not too hard and would have been a great 4th comparison. Maybe a follow-up video?
Have you heard about the film negative converter in rawtherapee? Its free and I'm too cheap to buy some software thats worth more than the old scanner I have
I beg of you to use more Ektar 100 during the Fall weather. The red cast film with the leaves changing colors really feels like being an old lady walking through the fall decoration section of a Hobby Lobby. In a good way.
Hi! Nate here, maker of Negative Lab Pro. This video is so great... couldn't stop laughing. Well done. A couple of hints on Negative Lab Pro that may be helpful for viewers. 1) For Tiff scans, I recommend NOT using Lightroom's white balance tool prior to conversion. Without getting into all the technical details, the white balance tools works differently on RAW files vs Tiff/Jpeg files. White balancing on a TIF/JPG prior to conversion is likely to result in strong turquoise casts (which some people love, and others hate - so I guess to each his own?). So here, you could either just convert without white balancing prior to conversion, or you could use the included "Tif Scan Prep" utility, which will more correctly balance out the film prior to conversion. It isn't usually necessary, but you'll get slightly more accurate results if you do that step. You could also create a RAW DNG with either Silverfast or Vuescan, which could then make use of Negative Lab Pro's raw camera profiles. I usually think this produces better results. 2) The default "standard" profile in Negative Lab Pro is on the punchier side, and is based on Lab Scanners default contrast profiles. You can make the "linear + deep" or "linear + flat" profiles the default if you want something flatter, or adjust the whiteclip and blackclip points to taste. Everything you do in Negative Lab Pro in non-destructive (unlike EpsonScan and Silverfast) so it's easy to adjust and re-adjust always working against the original. 3) For backlit scenes, a quick trick you can do is to crop in to just the foreground, and then run the conversion (you can re-crop after). NLP will optimize based on whats in the crop at the time of conversion. 4) Future versions of NLP will have more options for gamut control - which will be especially useful for controlling the bright cherry reds and intense turquoise colors. Hope that helps, and thanks again for the awesome videos you make!
You're a scholar and a gentleman, Nate!
Your milkshake brings all the film photographers to the yard.
Great tips Nate!
u are a god Nate!
dropping knowledge! I'll have to try this out and see how the results change! thank you Nate!
I'm going to translate this to some Chinese user of negative lab,thank you so much.
“So you can get liked by all 6 of your parents alt accounts” haha so true
Seriously though, it pains me to get my shots I worked hard on get 5 likes when some random girl can put a filter on her face and get 127. Instagram really isn't the way imho.
@@fandyus4125 I've been seriously asking myself what's the way to go though... Like, how tf can I make someone at least interact with my photos!?
@@fandyus4125 true that. plus it really isn't the best way to appreciate photography (it crops images, quality is poor and you can't really zoom in to see the details)
@@riccardonecci8083 You can't, the market is too oversaturated.
@@fandyus4125 that is a sad truth my friend.
Ok you had your fun Jason now can I please have my scanner back, I’m sending my wife’s boyfriend to pick it up since you broke my nose and clogged the toilet
lol
There's a story that needs exploring there.
literally died laughing at the youtube film photographers avengers thing
Rest in Peace
Judson Graham
???? - 2020
Nick Carver - Dr. Strange
Matt Day - Captain America
I think he forgot Analog Insights
I'm kinda new to the film photographers youtube space. Would somebody be kind enough to tell me who each of the "film photographer avengers" are?
Analog insights = vision ?
Love the commentary. Recently purchased the Plustek Opticfilm 8200 ai scanner with 8.8 silverfast to scan decades of my parents slide photos. Still learning the correct settings especially for any underexposed slides...... Hundreds of Kodak Carousels in my closets now to be scanned. I am sure eventually I shall master the settings... Keep up the fantastic commentary and enjoy a beer discussing the wisdom of life and the value of an analog life....
asked a question about this on the livestream, got ignored but got a video out of it. Life is good.
The picture of the mountains during sunrise is stunning. Clap
4:42 I would totally take the EPSON Scan over the other two. It's just way more natural IMO and a better starting point to work with the image if you wanted to tweak it in post a little. It's not a RAW file most likely a TIFF, so having good highlight exposure it looks great and If you wanted you could putt a bit of the shadows up but I think it looks the best and most properly exposed. The colors also look to be the most accurate. I've never had any issues with my Epson software.
Yeah. Epson scan looks the best here.
I agree I was confused every time he said it was ass and the worst
😊
😊😊 3:11
If you actually take 15 seconds to make some very basic adjustments in Epson scan, it delivers. I'm sure that's true of all 3 apps though. So honestly this is not a very illuminating comparison cuz nobody's just going to take the stock auto exposure and use that, are they? If you're going to all the trouble to shoot and develop film, surely you're not going to just set your scanner on instamatic. I've watched a ton of reviews on NLP and ViewScan and not really seeing any convincing reason to switch from Epson. The colors such as oversaturated reds and turning all the blues turqoise in NLP are just bizarre IMO.
I didn't know it before but now it's clear. Your sarcasm is one of the many things that keep me afloat in these trying times.
You and Nick Caver are the best two film photography channels I've found, really enjoyable to watch.
I came here for the comedy and was not disappointed!
I turn “CCR” (color cast removal) off in Silverfast. I find it often screws up the colors.
I watched so many of these comparisons and reviews last year, I’m confident that Silverfast is overall the best scanning software. For reference I use a Plustek 8200i.
Here we are four years after you did this video and you had me laughing! Became an instant subscriber. Great job! Just started scanning film and never heard of Silverfast or the LR plug-in ($99?! Sheesh!).
One of the funniest guys on TH-cam. Videos are informative and fun. Self depricating but always on the money.
Casually throws a sick parallax on the last shot. Well done sir.
this officially becomes my new favorite ASMR channel
This is exactly what I’ve been trying to compare for months. Thank you for this.
What a beautifully edited video. You made the comparison "shots" really, really well.
not only hilarious, not only educational, but also simply well made video
This was the video that we all badly needed. I had been wanting a comparison like this for a while.
I wish that you developed your own film so that you could compare B/W developers
I AM SO GLAD YOU UPLOADED TODAY!!
I use Epson scan just because it came with the scanner and one of the most impressive things about the software is how it removes the magenta shift from expired slide film and gives a pretty usable image. Would be interested in how the other software alternatives would handle expired slide film.
Silverfast gets weird. Ive had issues with it.
Getting a V600 to scan paper photos and slides. Thanks so much for this amazing video, it gives me a good idea - I tend to prefer the SilverFast scan.
I just bought an Epson scanner this morning, and you conforted me in my choice.
Great video as always, finally one that kills my boring ass quarantine day routine
Love the videos editing and special effects made the comparison experience an absolute blast! 🙏🏻
The dialogue in this video is my spirit animal. Thank you for giving me something I didn't know I needed. Scanning part is informative I guess.
Negative lab was my favorite version! Thanks for testing them out for us!
the last time i was this early we weren't living through a historical pandemic
the last time it was mentioned it wasn't original already
Thanks!
I went all in and bought the Epson V850Pro some weeks ago, mainly for braggin' rights, but it comes with Silverfast SE 8 included for free (cause the scanner is hella expensive), and I've just been using that so far. I have, though, realised how much difference a few adjustments can do to to the output of the scan. Also, the iSDR (iRDS? iSRD?) for colour negatives is AMAZING at removing all that dust that otherwise would make my life a living hell.
Also, the thanks was for a break in the monotony of lockdown and the sound of my scanner whirring away at my backlog of negatives.
Thanks for bringing back a memory 1:20 I can recall the funeral pyres just a little farther down the river.
Thanks for the comparison. I myself have been manually adjusting negatives with curves in Photoshop before, but recently, I have started processing my negative scans with my own python code using grey world algorithm improved with salient detection. It works surprisingly well and costs nothing.
Keep the salty humor going, it's gold!
Excellent blend of science, color and humor. Prost!!!
Ahhh a grainydays upload means a good day
ahh Jason... the antithesis of the photography avengers... and a breath of fresh air!
Negative Lab Pro requires you to do the DNG or Tiff prep before you convert, that may explain the screwy color shift.
= more effort
Vikman Photography No like it’s a one button click in Lightroom. (Okay two, technically)
The TIFF prep is like a gamma correction, definitely helps with contrast and color. Only problem I have with it is the fact that you end up with 3 gigantic files for every one finished photo
Hey Corey, I also use a V750 and Negative Lab Pro and after extensive testing specifically with this scanner, TIF prep rarely improves or worsens the result. Tiff prep is more needed for low gamma value scanners like Nikons. The Epson V700 and V700 series are Gamma 2.2 scanners and will generally only benefit from Tiff Prep in edge cases.
@@GregoryVeizades Interesting, I knew it corrected to Gamma 2.2 - but did not know that the 700 & 750 were Gamma 2.2 default. Very interesting, thank you Gregory!
3:26 there's something so satisfying about that cut
We would love to have that here in Zambia.❤❤ It's really good have loved them all.
That motel picture with Cinestill was dope!!
Really enjoyed this video. Definitely informative, and you're mood is just nailing how we all feel right now...just trapped with our own thoughts.
I see grainydays on my push notifs, I click
Subscribed because your personality is hilarious!! Thanks for the comparison!
The Silverfast defaults looked so good!
Agree. Though I get a feeling he was just using defaults and not doing anything really custom.
Jose Juarez That was the point of the video, comparing their default results without editing them. It is to show people what the program does itself, not with the user.
It could just be me, but my silverfast doesnt have a cinestill default... does anyone know if there is one?
@@Being_Joe you should get that feeling because he explicitly said it’s few times.
Jason looking fresh AF!
Colour scanning rely a lot on the quality of the light source and RAW converter, you will be amazed what you can get out of Capture One compared with the mentioned software.
I really love the results I get with my epson, they scans are flat but it retains details in the shadows and highlights but it takes some work in Lightroom to correct the contrast and mid tones.
I’m impressed with what Ive seen from silverfast and I’m curious about negative lab pro.
The nice thing about the V700 is you can use the wet mount scan process to get better results from your film scans. If you have Silverfast there is a option to crossgrade your license at a discount. These flatbeds are great for medium / large format film not so great for 35mm. Silverfast does some interesting scanning at different setting to give you a better dynamic range. I don't scan much at home anymore because it just takes too long and I never been able to match results from pro labs with skilled film scanner operators (except for Black and White, I can get just as good or better black and white scans at home).
Man you are so damn funny 😂 i enjoy how bored/sarcastic you are all the time .. and great content as always
Your commentary is god-like, keep it up, I love it
I like the results from Silverfast but it’s the program I love to hate. Most unfriendly interface, but useable if you buy the third party manual. I’m currently trying NLP as the interface is very nice and it fits into my LR workflow without the export, import hack to fix backwards controls in LR when photographing negatives. It’s just so good to see new products in this space and your review was a giggle. Thank you.
I’m in love with your channel, is like watching standup comedy with photography
Super informative, Jason. I've been using Vuescan for a while but I'm looking to change things up. I definitely appreciate the humor that you bring to your reviews as well. Well done.
Thank you for throwing a jab at composite DIGITAL ARTISTS who call themselves “photographers”. Just gained many more respect points 👌🏽☺️
firsthandaccount are you referring too someone who adds something extra to a photo (that they took)? Cause I see nothing wrong with that
Jimmyferminphotography Yes. In my opinion, a true FINE ART photographer would want to get the image in camera, even if it takes coming back to that spot 8 months later using an ephemeris to position the moon in the correct spot, or waiting until the perfect sunset to take that cityscape shot even if it takes months to happen and you have to go every time there is a sunset. It is cutting corners, and you will never see an image with a moon added using photoshop or a sky replacement landscape photograph in the MOMA or any comparable fine art museum that has been around for more than 50 years. I realize “hobbyist” photographers or “professional” photographers don’t care and would rather do it in post because of laziness but that is why they are not revered fine art photographers that are being represented by distinguished galleries
I really want to know who the "film photographer avengers" are
relieved this is upper decker positive lifestyle channel
how do you correct blue sky in neglabpro ?!
Unfortunately Negative Lab Pro is only for Lightroom. So Capture One users are left with DIY DSLR or Epson scanning.
Thank you, I really get a kick out of your videos.
How did you change the turquoise color cast from the NLP?
You're the first stand up comedian who also makes great videos about film photography. It's pretty clear: you won't find the good stuff swimming on the top of the ocean, you must dive deeper. However, I wish you all the best and as much subscribe as the well known TH-cam photographer Influencer advertising non professional dude.
Great video, love the comparisons!
So this proves you don’t need either plug in. Just adjust the tones a bit in Lightroom and save some money.
Quick thing to make your scans even better, head on over to eBay, type in "SCAN TECH ANTI NEWTON RING ANR OPTICAL GLASS" and marvel at the difference an actually flat negative can make when you use the ANR glass vs the regular jacked up Epson holders.
An easier way us you get the Epson V700 35mm holders with the Build in ANR layer. Much much better vs the stock V700 ones and way easier to use.
Still not ideal, but neither are flatbeds in general for 35mm.
Nice social network reference
Earned a subscriber purely in your wit, great video.
i love your dark humour
Best comedian in the film photography community
Have you tried VueScan? Using the Nikon Coolscan 9000 and SilverFast, I would get red lines all over the image.
I really enjoyed this video and your humor 😆😭😂
It seems all of them needed a little correction, but only one is free. Love your videos, man.
I am so pumped to watch this! Just switched from Epson Scan to Siverfast. HELP!
What did you use to scan the positives for negative lab pro? Epson or silverfast? I get different results when scanning from either.
not sure if this applies to the v700 but Silverfast is actually given free if you register your scanner to the epson website. Reason being that the iSRD isnt functional in the Epson Scan software 2. Used it on my v600
IMO the best software for scanning negatives is RawTherapee. It is completely free, and its film negative module is really outstanding. There is definitely more to adjust than on other softwares, but overall, I found the results to be more consistent somehow.
Just glad Baxter made an appearance
Been waiting for another upload
Thanks for your assessment. Much appreciated. For me the Epson solution hit the mark.
Where was the picture at 4:31 taken? It looks beautiful
Great video ! i've been fighting with my scans forever.
you can achieve NLP-conversions without the turquoise blue tones, if you digitize as a RAW DNG, either with Silverfast (a version which allows it) or with Vuescan which can also use infrared dust removal. but for your route via Tiff I highly recommend using the Tiff-Preparation tool which comes with NLP. It will change the tiffs gamma to a value (2.2) from which NLP will work much better.
You didn’t mention the lack of ICE for Negative Lab Pro which adds to the processing length. Have you done manual inversions in Photoshop? It’s not too hard and would have been a great 4th comparison. Maybe a follow-up video?
Instant subscribe after listening to 10 seconds of you chatting
Have you heard about the film negative converter in rawtherapee? Its free and I'm too cheap to buy some software thats worth more than the old scanner I have
Very funny video and very detailed! Thanks for the info!
I beg of you to use more Ektar 100 during the Fall weather. The red cast film with the leaves changing colors really feels like being an old lady walking through the fall decoration section of a Hobby Lobby. In a good way.
when you scan you should only include the image and not the black border of the negative because it will bias the scan.
So many people make this mistake.
you are just soooo engaging. And smart..
Best film dude on the web
"Negative Lab Pro definitely has a greenish cast, like it got a Mountain Dew pre-wash in development" 😂
Amish would love that
Great video! I'm now subscribed!
I am 1 minute in, you haven’t started reviewing anything, and I’ve subscribed. I want more of this humor!
Which Negafix settings did you use for CineStill 800?
FFS I just realised Jason is the Ant-Man of film photography :D
god i love your deadpan voice..
Why is Ektar dead to you? It's been my favorite for landscapes but I'm always trying to learn and try new films.
nice job on the comparison and the edit on this video
Just curious, did you use Epson Scan or Silverfast to scan the negatives you used in Negative Lab Pro?
Would love to know which software you use to scan your negatives as positives before importing to LR?
Seems like Epson really nails the B&W's, but Silverfast is a nice middle ground scan for colors, in my opinion.
The script writer is super talented lol