Plane Flies Too Close To Another Plane
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 20 พ.ย. 2021
- Enjoy this episode of 3 Minutes of Aviation!
✈ SOURCES / FURTHER INFORMATION
South African Airways Airbus A340-600 formation flight
• Heavy Formation Low-Pass
UPS MD-11 Engine fire after landing
• Incident: UPS MD11 at ...
Passenger plane passing through sandstorm on approach
• Rafha sandstorm from p...
Boeing 777X steep turn during Dubai Air Show 2021
• B777x in Dubai aerosho...
Pilot filming rainbow contrails of Airbus A380
• *Rare* Rainbow Contrai...
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The Airbus A340 in close formation was well planned, practiced, fully authorised, and part of a display flight at a major national event. Both pilots are not only highly experienced training captains, but also accomplished aerobatics pilots at airshows. The one in the cockpit view was also in a world first at an airshow/military expo in Cape Town some years ago, to be one of the first pilots to do a formation display flight in two B737’s, belonging to SAA Cargo at the time. If ever there were pilots in the world to do this, it would be these guys!
Thank you for explaining that.
I was wondering the the heel was going on.
Most SAA pilots are ex military and train very hard for these displays
Hmm
ThNks… context is everything
Ex fighter pilots, the best in the world.
Hardly "too close". Looks very stable and probably very well planned and briefed by some talented pilots.
yes your right its very stable and planned by talented pilots but it doesnt change the fact that those planes are extremely close.
No good reason for it v the risk
@@Surv1ve_Thrive yeah did you see the 777x few degrees of tilt more and it would have gone down like the one at Fairchild, it's all fun and games pilots capabilities and planes performance till it goes down crashes into a fireball.
@@Addy-745 I live near Shoreham, Sussex (UK) where a jet hit a busy, major road. Avoidable disaster. So I have no support for 'high jinks'/photo opps etc in these cases. Outcome versus risk is the question all pilots need to ask themselves honestly and I feel this channel should reinforce that.
There's guaranteed more than "talent" involved...
At 1:00 - sandblasting the engines is going to be costly.
I remember how bad volcanic ash is for engines and was wondering if a sandstorm would also damage them.
@@Anurania Sand does damage engine blades, all the way back to the turbine blades. However, it's not as bad as you might think. It's best to be avoided, but there is dust on any runway, so a sand storm is just a lot of it in a short time, rather than little of it over a lot of time.
Either way, the engines need to be checked. There will be a few inpacts and some pitting on the inside of the fan blades, some more on the compressor blades and quite some sand accumulation in the cowling.
Volcanic ash is different as the consitency is diffferent, thicker and harder. If reacts differently on impact and causes more damage.
Probably already factored-into the ticket price, if not a hidden fee (eg. "sandstorm surcharge"), or collectible upon disembarking.
@@TheUtuber999 good answer. The fine print says "no refunds of fees on a clear day."
@johnnytheprick I've been complimented by a prick... not sure quite what to make of that.
Watching this plane flying into that sandstorm was beyond terrifying
Terrifying for the airlines pocket book but shouldn’t be for passengers.
Yes, it was
When I was in a Navy C-40 squadron, we flew through volcanic ash and incurred excessive blade erosion. Grounded for a week in Sicily! What luck!
Birds are dangerous but sand storms are ok lol
The sand just goes through the Engine, and a Bird makes the engines to failures
Formation flight so pre planned hardly flying too close together
@@rblxmac Sand carries rocks.
@@tomatosoupwoo tiny rocks
Sand carries rock at that altitude 🤔🤣🤣🤣🤣
2:36. RVSM (Reduced Vertical Separation Minimum) airspace allows high altitude aircraft to be separated by 1000 feet vertically rather then 2000 feet. This was a game changer for Air Traffic Control and users of the National Airspace System (NAS).
Gotta love RVSM... When I was jump seating from Miami to Newark I can't say the amount of aircraft that were passing by heading our way at a thousand feet. Always an incredible view
✈😃
Even better in the NAT MNPS areas where same direction traffic can be only 1000ft apart.
JS in the cockpit is amazing. Only tried it twice but I’ll never forget the experience. It’s like first losing the nonrev lottery and then ending up with the feeling that you won after all. Only downsides are space and no alcohol but that’s a small sacrifice.
I flew on a private plane from LA to San Diego.
It was like a "freeway in the sky" with the Northbound GA planes (30 year old memory) flying 1000' higher and just to our East, very visible & every minute or two.
I-5 up HIGH !
unlike what the video says, the required vertical separation in RVSM airspace (FL290 and up, approx. 29,000 ft and higher) is actually just 1000ft for approved aircraft like the ones shown.
A 380 rainbow contrails are the best on this video! Beautiful!
RVSM, if certified, is used from Flight Level 290 up to Flight Level 410. Within those Flight Levels, the vertical separation is reduced to 1000ft (300m) between aircraft meeting RVSM capability requirements. Above Flight Level 410 we are back in Non-RVSM Airspace and 2000ft (600m) vertical separation needs to be applied between traffic.
the video implied that
And 5000 feet AOB FL600. Usually there's such little traffic there that they can have any altitude they want, but separation between aircraft that high must be 5000 feet unless they've declared MARSA or they're in formation flight (if that would ever happen so high).
@@Winglets68 No it did not!
Looking at that 777X, I can hear the computer yelling "bank angle, bank angle" 😂😮
… and I can hear Aerosucre pilots yelling “We did that first!”
I have never flown into a sand storm but if I am the guy who pays for the paint job on my plane I think I would go elsewhere instead of sandblasting my plane.
Yep! But when the time comes to have to repaint just go through a sand storm and bam, free sand blasting lol
Al Baker would have his Qatar A350's fly through them for sure... And then blame Airbus for shoddy paintwork. Lol
Those poor engines
I wouldn't do that, as well as you wouldn't fly into volcanic ash.
or to get that new steel finish, just fly through volcanic ash clouds. I hear it's quite pretty.
Absolutely love these 3mins of aviation vidoes. Thank you!!
Those rainbow contrails are incredibly cool!
*Chemtrails
@@evs251 oof
Nyan Jet
@@evs251 Indeed, the plane above was DEFINTELY spraying "CHEMtrails" while the commercial jet below was probably just a contrail, however the chemicals from the cloud above might have been causing the tint in the contrail.
@@evs251 🤦♂️🤷♂️
"Boeing 777X perfprms an incredible steep turn"
Tex Johnson: Hold my beer.
Hahaha no doubt about it.
Bud Holland: Watch me do the same thing in a B-52.
Tex got "reamed" by Boeing's president, for doing those barrel rolls.
But, Tex balanced the forces on the 707, so it was perfectly safe.
Just what I needed! A little break from work is always nice and refreshing :)
Especially on a Sunday.. :D
@@Mrcl5902 Hahaha bud, good joke :) But depends on the time zones too though.
I love these videos 👍✈
unbelievably irresponsible intentionally flying into a sandstorm
great catch of the 2 aircraft above.
Okbok. Will ask the management to fire the crew, since you are upset
I Wonder why pitot tubes not get stuck bc of sand... or do they have a "cleaning" mechanism?
And also why not avoid sand storm - as we know flying through volcanic ash cloud caused KLM 867.
No cleaning mechanism but only heat. That guys were pretty much on YOLO
Agreed. You'll lose accurate airspeed indication when the pitot tube gets clogged but I'd be more worried about the engine blades...
Just imagine the sandblasting the internals of those engines (and fan blades) received!
@johnnytheprick He means 'tubes', just like Melanie said. Not the engines.
@johnnytheprick The PITOT tubes !!
Not sure how flying through a sandstorm is not dangerous for the engines
Its Saudi, I reckon its like being in Canada and not driving in the snow.
and the paint
I'm really surprised at how much impact it had on the aircraft, that sounded pretty nuts.
It's absolutely dangerous and extremely expensive!
Sand particles will destroy the fan blades and compressors blades.
All engines will be replaced after landing because all blades will be damaged.
Also, the sand melting temperature is about 1700°С, but the gas temperature in the turbine can reach 1927°C, so sand particles will melt and stick to engine parts in colder sections.
@god
_"Water boils at 100 Celsius."_
- Do even know what that means?🤦♂️ *No* as I see.
"The normal boiling point (also called the atmospheric boiling point or the atmospheric pressure boiling point) of a liquid is the special case in which the vapor pressure of the liquid equals the defined atmospheric pressure at sea level, one atmosphere."
For Water, this is 100°C at sea level.
*Not at your home at an unknown altitude under falsified conditions!*
Serious Q for any informed pilots or Jet Mechanics:
Isn't this flying thru sandstorm terribly damaging to the engines ?
Or are they made to tolerate some amount of airborne particulates lije sand or volcanic ash ?
Thanks in advance !
I was thinking the same thing.
Some small turboprop and turboshaft aircraft incorporate an "inertial deflector" in the intake system which redirects the air while heavier particulates continue on straight and out of the nacelle. Large turbofan engines cannot utilize this technology so are vulnerable to damage from sand, hail, ash, etc. Any abrasive substance can and will do substantial damage to the internals of a gas-turbine engine. If nothing else, a visual inspection would be a must after flying through a storm such as in the video.
Yes. Bad idea. Very risky. It could cause a double engine flameout at worst and cause lots of damage, pitted cockpit windows, etc, and a major repair bill at best..
I can’t see the sand causing a flame out as the sand has nowhere to collect but I could see it being abrasive for wear
@@robertgary3561 An engine stall with a flame out is possible, but not super likely.
The sand/dust in the air does change pressure and oxygen concentration inside the turbine.
With modern high bypass torbo fan engines though, most of that sand/dust passes through the secondary air stream and thereby only hit the fan blades and the inside of the cowling, where it can accumulate. But then you just open up the cowling and let the sand fall out.
A bit of that sand/dust can amd will make it into the compressor stages, through the combustion chamber and into the turbine. That will cause a bit of pitting and shouldn't be done all too often, if avoidable.
Modern engines are tested for the conditions they are likely to encounter. And with a ton of planes flying through/over/into deserts, flying through sand storms is tested thoroughly. Just like huge water intake events, hail, snow and bird strikes.
Those poor engines in sand storm!
"Oh, what a day... what a lovely day!"
That couldn't have been good for the paint job or windshield, either. 😬
Actually beneficial to the engines as long as its not overdone. We used walnut hulls to blast jet engines back in the 60’s
@@sailguru4412 yeah. Notably in a controlled environment, and because walnut shells are less abrasive than sand.
Last one was gorgeous.
gotta love the a340.. so majestic. I'm so lucky to have been on one and in the cockpit.. so sad it's decomissioned
Pilots are different type of human being 👏🏼
B52 corkscrewed in doing a very similar steep turn and very low altitude. British Airways had a very dangerous flameout of all engines flying through volcanic ash - seems crazy to fly into a duststorm.
Well planned and executed formation (SAA).
That was spectacular.
Was there an incident report for the plane that flew through the sandstorm?
Love the rainbow contrails!
I bet that 777 was screaming "bank angle"
I think a Terrain warning was probably also in there, and pulling out of the turn was likely going to hear an Underspeed warning.
MD-11 were nice planes to be on! Flew a lot on Varig's DC 10 - 30 and MD 11's ❤❤❤
Sand storm looks scary more so than near pass.. 👍
Umm why didn’t they go around the sand storm?
He wanted to destroy the engines
Love watching these videos informative. Wish you would make some longer videos say around 10 minutes of aviation please.
A340 is a magnificent airliner.one of my favorite plane.
2:20 I don't like 'em putting chemicals in the air that the turn the friggin' birds gay! Do you understand that? [slams fist on table repeatedly]
I was looking for this comment! "They're turning the frickin frogs gay!" 🤣
2k ft is a big difference yeti seemed much closer. Cool video. 👍👊
i love the rare intermediate callout on the first video
The DC-10 and MD-11 have sadly always been cursed.
That last plane had Nyan Cat as his alter ego. :D
Another fantastic vid.
Your content is compelling enough to watch. No need for fake titles.
There goes the new paint job!
Amazing video!😸
Can someone tell me what the music is at the end of these greats videos? It’s rather catchy. Thanks.
Try this: [A Trip to Infinity - Mandelbrot Fractal Zoom (Depth 1.2e1077) (4k 60fps)].
Concerning the two SAA A340s, how far away (or close) does a plane have to be before it is affected by a front plane's wake turbulence?
@johnnytheprick He hasn't mentioned anything about the effect on engines.
0:47 Talk about an FOD nightmare...
Great footage👍! Thx.
Nanoparticles produce lovely rainbows 🌈
Ever watered your garden on a sunny day?
"too close" huh
I didn’t know that a jet could fly through a sandstorm. Wouldn’t all that dirt cause the engines to stall?
Yes
Yeah, I don't know what those pilots were thinking.
yes they can the blades in the engine are coated with a layer to resist sand abrazing them when flyin over sandy areas mainly the operators of these airlines, they do it at the TBF (turbine blade facility in derby uk) clever way of doing it really.
@@PS-zw4yc My dad and I have a same color circle like you do!
@@williamburke8242 ?
Do they just turn TCAS off for formations?
RVSM (Reduced Vertical Separation Minimums) airspace allows for 1000 foot separation for aircraft equipped for it.
well it’s 2000 same direction. The planes coming the other direction are offset by 1000 so yeah you are right and the video is right
@@ethanbrandt1827 Negative. In oceanic air space 1000 ft same direction on tracks or even on random routes. (Captain of A-340)
That was a better upload 👍🏼
Rainbow chemtrails... scary
Does anyone know how pilots combat wake turbulence when formation flying like that? Perhaps the vortices are less dangerous when you're REALLY close behind?
The rainbow in the contrail is beautiful. Presumably ice crystals forming to cause that? Or can the rainbow form in the vapour itself?
Loved seeing the steep turn, so fun to see what these big jets are capable of. Usually they have to fly so sedately so as to keep the passengers comfortable.
Rainbows can be seen in regular vapor. If you have lawn sprinklers, you can see rainbows the next time they're on
Thank you for sharing.
how does the wake turbulence not mess them up?
The sand storm looks scary
The engines were changed and pilots cut in little peaces after the sand storm? Or how they do it in Saudi?
Yikes that boeing 777x was right on the edge with that steep turn...
What a gorgeous plane in flight 🥰
This weirdly reminds me of driving a combine and auger cart at the same time when farming. You have to match everything perfectly so that that the combine can keep moving without stopping. The combine gets full, the auger cart has to be like 1 foot or straddling wheels between combine and auger cart. Super dangerous and scary, but part of the job. And if you mess it up, it’s million+ dollar mistake. It takes precision. Kudos to these pilots.
How can they fly so close behind engens? Separation on take off is 2 or 3 miles.
Very nice rainbow chemtrails!
Respect To South African Airlines For Flying A340 600s 👍 ,Great Quad Jet Cool Looking , I Believe 4 Engine Planes are Safe And Powerfull
RVSM - Reduced Verticle Separation Minimum is 1000 feet. Prior to RVSM it was 2000'.
1000ft for opposing directions, 2000ft for the same direction. The statement in the video is correct.
...And for ~97% of people on Earth: 1000 feet is just 305m! That's really close.
Specifically for flight above FL290 (29,000 ft) and below FL410 (41,000ft) Below that vertical separation has been 1000ft, possibly ever since formalised air traffic control began. RVSM above FL290 started round about 1996. Vertical separation above FL410 remains 2000ft.
Pretty sure that's how Mario created the Rainbow Road level.
What does all that sand do for the engine?
Polishes the internals.
^makes it smoother on the inside so it runs more efficiently👍
Pitting on the inside of the fan blades, lots of extra weight due to sand accumulation insidw the cowling, a bit of pitting on compressor and turbine blades as well. Possibly a few clogged injectors and some additional wear on bearing, if the sand gets sucked into the wrong hoses. Most of it will come out the other end without causing any damage.
Also power reduction due to less oxygen inside the engine.
Nothing good.
Lubricates the bearings 😁
That rainbow contrails plane looked completely different from the plane just above it. So which one is the chemtrails plane?
The one with the camera. It was obvious misdirection!
@@skydiverclassc2031 oh yea, I didn't even think about the one with the camera...dam. right under my nose
Quelqu'un peut me dire pourquoi et comment se fait ce bel arc-en-ciel avec la condensation derrière l'avion ???
Incredible
Wouldnt the sand storm damage the plane esp the engines?
2:00 Bank angle, bank angle. 😂
I’d have pissed myself looking out that window and seeing that wall of sand approaching.
it is pretty common here in saudi arabia
Who knows about the Sandstorm? Why doesn't it damage the engines? You'd think it melts to glass and causes problems in the engine just like volcanic ash...I know the US military had big problems with the Sand in Iraq with their aircraft and even with their Tanks which have turbines, too
amazing
Too close? Not for pilots experienced in formation flying. I'm sure they briefed all of the maneuvers they flew, including breakaway procedures. In USAF pilot training we have 36 inches of lateral separation, with longitudinal stagger. During in-flight refueling we are in physical contact with the tanker- doesn't get any closer than that! Airline pilots with formation experience in fighter and transport jets get to fly for commercial ad shoots- no pax on board. The only troubling part of this great video was the voluntary sand blasting.
Tell me, what branch of the military ever did A340 close formation flying? The army?... Exactly, no part of the army uses A340's for close formation flights. Clearly not 'too close' as they didn't collide but a lot closer than anyone else would fly them.
@@someguy4915 I was in the USAF for over 7 years before moving on to the airlines. I flew formation in a C-141B including in-flight refueling. The C-141 is (actually was) a four engine heavy jet. Cheers
@@gerardmoran9560 So you did not fly an A340 in formation?
@@someguy4915 What on Earth is your problem? Mom turned off the heating in the basement, trying to make you go outside into the real world?
If the SAA pilots flying the two A340s are ex-military, then they're skilled at formation flying and they can fly anything in formation. It's not a skill which is reserved *only* for military aircraft. Go talk to a military pilot and ask them if their formation-flying training suddenly disappears when they get into a non-military aircraft, LOL.
@@vk2ig Are you a little bit mad you weren't allowed to fly a real aircraft? It's okay, you tried your best.
Looks like the Blue Angels and the Thunderbirds have some competition
AMAZING
747 powered by skittles. Interesting
It was an A380 powered by skittles
if skittles were made from aluminum and barium, then yes
@@goodtoBfit skittles are made of mysterious ingredients. Non of which are good for you
I've been out of it for a while, but RVSM was 1000' if equipped and certified to use that airspace. Maybe no longer so?
You are correct.
1000ft between RVSM-approved aircraft.
2000ft between non-RVSM approved aircraft and any other aircraft operating within RVSM airspace.
The commentary in these videos tend to contain mistakes, e.g. "plane flies too close to another plane" ... unfortunately.
Is it safe to fly through a sandstorm? Does it not scratch the turbines, and and the windows? What if the engines flamed out? I am not a pilot, but seems like they should have avoided it, the engines were spooling up very high too as soon as it went in.
It's safe
Beautiful ✈✈✈😍😍
1:57 When a backbencher becomes a pilot
Nice... that tripple 7 turns like an F-16
because it was flying super light. probably less than 10% of its fuel load, no PAX, only 2 command crew. no cargo.
That puts it in its maximum performance handling area of its flight dynamics.
every demo like this is flown that way, so they can execute 75+ Degree takeoffs, hard turns, and throw the plane around semi-like a fighter. without compromising structural risks or threats to the aircraft because its operating well within its loading factors.
Plot twist:
Nobody:
Chuck Norris hold my beer.
I was a cabin crew in Ryanair and once I landed on a sandstorm in Morocco... and my God... 😱😱 my underwear was nearly incapacitate. 😂🤣😂
Years back while flying to Chicago on United I looked out my starboard side window and saw another jetliner heading seemingly straight for us from 90 degrees before it passed right overtop of our plane. I’m sure there was minimum legal separation kept but it sure looked to close to me. Everyone else in our plane was sitting clueless reading etc. and I thought of how quickly their lives could have just ended and they wouldn’t have known a thing.
Terrifying
The Saudi pilots wanted the polished chrome look on the engines then. Flashy.
That approach into a sandstorm seems reckless in the extreme. Probably two new engines and a repaint at best. You can hear the sand hitting the aircraft!
And the engines are revving hard ...
Well that sand storm sand can't be good for a jet engine to ingest!
Like a lot of other comments said, all the sand in the engines can't be good.
Even if the engine keeps running, how could the sand not ruin the turbine blades?
Most of the sand passes through without causing any or much damage. There is always a vit of sand and other dust in the air.
There will be some pitting on the blades' inside, but not enough to be serious damage. It will be checked, evaluated and the next overhaul of the engine will be a few flight hours earlier than scheduled.
Those sand particles are light and the fan blades are quite hard. A lot of sand grains hitting the same spot will cause a bit of pitting, but from the outside, you wouldn't even notice it.
I just performed a fan blade inspection a couple of weeks ago. That engine must have flown through a sand storm at some point as well, maybe not so severe, but the back side of the fan blade looked a bit like orange peel. But still, most pits were less than 1mm deep. They would have very little effect on the performance and durability of the blades
@@CerberusTenshi It sounds like you can answer this unrelated question.
There's a video of a damaged turbofan engine that looks like it's going to shake the plane apart, someone commented why don't they shut it down, someone else said they probably did, and it's windmilling. I was trying to think of a way to stop the engine from windmilling. So here's the question.
Since the engines are used to generate electricity and turn a hydraulic pump, is there a way to use those systems to slow down the windmilling?
Thanks
@@bigredc222 No, because the alternator and hydraulic pump are not driven from the low speed spool (shaft) which includes the ducted fan (the big fan at the front of the engine). On a 3-spool engine like those on ducted fan engines, those systems are driven from the high speed shaft via a power take-off gearbox. So loading the hydraulic pump and alternator on the windmilling turbofan engine will slow down the high speed shaft, but not the intermediate speed and low speed shafts. Also, the alternator is driven through a Constant Speed Drive (CSD) which converts the variable speeds from the power take-off gearbox to a constant speed necessary to deliver 400 Hz 3-phase AC power from the alternator. The load protection relays will not allow load to be connected to the alternator unless the AC voltage falls within a specified voltage range and frequency range - a windmilling engine may not provide enough drive power to the alternator to allow the load to be connected.
@@bigredc222 As vk2ig wrote. Or in short and easy, the generator and hydrolic pump are not connected to the fan blades in the front, but rather the high pressure compressor and the high pressure turbine. The fan blades are in most turbofan engines on the low pressure compressor, which has a different speed and the bearings between the two shafts has very very little friction. So windmilling is, unfortunately in that case, unavoidable.
Windmilling is also a wanted thing, as in case of an engine failure, the turning blades produce a little less drag than a stationary ones. Either way, it's going to be a bumpy ride that the pilots hopefully quickly manage to end safely.
It was extremely stupid for that flight crew to fly into that avoidable sand storm. You can see a sand storm for at least 20 miles out, especially one of that size. I'm sure some damage was done to that aircraft. Very risky.
If on final approach it is an acceptable risk and within design specs
@@davalleyguy5020 , well, that acceptable risk really messed up their airplane.
@@bobby1970 what damage was incurred?
@@davalleyguy5020 It almost certainly received some abrasion on the windshield and some wear on the engine turbines. It could have easily caused a flameout, which is very dangerous at low altitude.
"Too close" means it hit something or caused some damage otherwise.
When will you stop using that in titles?
"If Mason said you were too close, then you were too close!"
Alternative title suggestion: Plane flies "too close" to a sand storm
2:32 he got the collectors edition
Nice video
How can the compressor withstand so much of sand intake ?
although it looks a lot of sand, it's actually low, because the engine has the abilty to push things out of the center through centrifugal motion, although not really invulnerable. if done often, its still gonna break
@@agps4418 thanks