Some extra notes and thoughts that I could not fit into the description of the video as space there is limited to 5k characters - TH-cam is so mean! * OpenStack History: - Started by RackSpace + NASA! - Where are they now? Oh, yes, they're now partners to the hyperscalers! - What happened? - It kind of picked up momentum around 2015/16 - I remember going to OpenStack Summit in Barcelona - I was with SUSE - Quite a few of the Open Source vendors jumped on board (Red Hat, SUSE, Canonical, HP (Helion), VMware vCloud (then sold to OVH Cloud) - Small Cloud Service Providers (based their clouds on OpenStack) - Even T-Systems has one - it's still running and it's called Open Telekom Cloud (OTC) - it's actually probably the most automated OpenStack-based cloud out there! * Enter Kubernetes! - It was all going well until Kubernetes and Containers hit the mainstream - 2017/18 - Around that period, I jumped ship from SUSE (2016 - had OpenStack distro only because Red Hat had one), to Mirantis (2018 - big on OpenStack) and then Heptio (2018 - big on Kubernetes) * Kubernetes really killed it - We moved from this VM concept to Containers - OpenStack Foundation changed its name to Open Infra Foundation * So now you had to run OpenStack, then Kubernetes, then your Pods and Containers? - Does not make sense to run two layers of infrastructure, cloud, hypervisor, virtualisation, before you can do anything useful...! * OpenStack is: - An entire cloud ecosystem - it's not a runtime or a cluster or even only a hypervisor! - It's effectively a "Cloud Operating System) like Mesos and others have tried to be in the past - Lots of OpenStack modules: Neutron, Nova, Ironic, Barbican, Cinder/Swift, Heat, Trove, Glance, Horizon, Keystone - Funny named ones: Freezer, Cyborg, Blazer - Managed by different project teams! governance.openstack.org/tc/reference/projects/ * I had a conversation with Copilot about the virtues of OpenStack vs Kubernetes and it tried its best to remain neutral: - OpenStack and Kubernetes "solve similar issues" - Copilot - Neutron: Networking is complex and difficult part to scale - Cloud Therapist: Why use OpenStack with Kubernetes for bare metal or public cloud or Kubernetes distros? Copilot: "Good question!" * One of the worst and self-indulgent things about OpenStack was that they started naming each of their releases - giving each one a different name! - What is the point of this? - This move for me was the epitome of boredom, overconfidence and arrogance! - Unfortunately, Kubernetes has started doing the same thing, as well - Let's see how long THAT lasts now! LOL * Present Day: - Vendors have mostly moved away from OpenStack - It has retreated into telco space - OpenStack was strong in telco due to Network Function Virtualisation (NFV) - virtualisation of telco hardcore equipment - But even that is threatened - AWS announced in 2023 Telco Network Builder + Managed Telco Networks aws.amazon.com/blogs/aws/new-aws-telco-network-builder-deploy-and-manage-telco-networks/ * Rackspace attempts to dis-spell some OpenStack myths and rumours: www.rackspace.com/blog/dispelling-myths-openstack-clouds * Nobody I know is now contemplating using OpenStack - Not in their data centre or any form of cloud or anywhere else! - If any cloud vendor is running OpenStack it's because of history, not by a recent decision! - You might as well run Kubernetes on VMware vSphere - and even that is a bad idea now, thanks to the Broadcom acquisition! * OpenStack is notoriously hard to Manage, Patch and Upgrade - Even if that was after lots of Chef/Puppet automations in those days! - Much like OpenShift customers - they dreaded upgrades - just attend an OpenShift Summit and ask a customer! - You needed an army of folks that knew OpenStack - Lived and breathed it with years of practical experience - a high priestly order of fanatics! * State Of OpenStack distros: - SUSE acquired HP Helion to integrate with its OpenStack solution - SUSE failed to integrate the two and they pulled out of the whole OpenStack endeavour a few years ago! - VMware vCloud sold to OVH Cloud - Red Hat continues to support it - Red Hat "Red Hat OpenStack Services on OpenShift" - announced in 2023 www.redhat.com/en/blog/red-hat-openstack-services-openshift-next-generation-red-hat-openstack-platform - "this blending of technologies requires careful planning" - Yes!!! - "Red Hat OpenStack Platform 17.1 is the last version of the product to use the classic form-factor of the control plane" - Both Canonical and Mirantis (with MOSK) have followed the same path as Red Hat * Conclusions - So was OpenStack a romantic notion? - A wishful, whimsical thought of running one's own cloud? * OpenStack is really superseded by Containers (Docker) and Orchestration (Kubernetes) - Trying to fit these into OpenStack or it into them, is just retro-fits either way! * OpenStack remains complex - upgrades are like a heart operation! * Only a handful of vendors supporting it * The whole concept of how we want to do cloud has moved on - Not even Hybrid or Private Clouds are that popular nor do they use OpenStack to build up on * We spent $805B on Public Cloud in fiscal 2024! - Does that say we want to build our own clouds? - And what is the best way to do GenAI today? Certainly not on OpenStack! * I declare that OpenStack is definitely DEAD!!
Hello from the other half of the Cloud Therapist that never been! 😀Thank you Richard for having me, it was pleasure to do this one together, and I somehow sense this may not be the end of us doing collabs going forward! Cheers, Leo.
Some extra notes and thoughts that I could not fit into the description of the video as space there is limited to 5k characters - TH-cam is so mean!
* OpenStack History:
- Started by RackSpace + NASA!
- Where are they now? Oh, yes, they're now partners to the hyperscalers!
- What happened?
- It kind of picked up momentum around 2015/16
- I remember going to OpenStack Summit in Barcelona - I was with SUSE
- Quite a few of the Open Source vendors jumped on board (Red Hat, SUSE, Canonical, HP (Helion), VMware vCloud (then sold to OVH Cloud)
- Small Cloud Service Providers (based their clouds on OpenStack)
- Even T-Systems has one - it's still running and it's called Open Telekom Cloud (OTC) - it's actually probably the most automated OpenStack-based cloud out there!
* Enter Kubernetes!
- It was all going well until Kubernetes and Containers hit the mainstream - 2017/18
- Around that period, I jumped ship from SUSE (2016 - had OpenStack distro only because Red Hat had one), to Mirantis (2018 - big on OpenStack) and then Heptio (2018 - big on Kubernetes)
* Kubernetes really killed it
- We moved from this VM concept to Containers
- OpenStack Foundation changed its name to Open Infra Foundation
* So now you had to run OpenStack, then Kubernetes, then your Pods and Containers?
- Does not make sense to run two layers of infrastructure, cloud, hypervisor, virtualisation, before you can do anything useful...!
* OpenStack is:
- An entire cloud ecosystem - it's not a runtime or a cluster or even only a hypervisor!
- It's effectively a "Cloud Operating System) like Mesos and others have tried to be in the past
- Lots of OpenStack modules: Neutron, Nova, Ironic, Barbican, Cinder/Swift, Heat, Trove, Glance, Horizon, Keystone
- Funny named ones: Freezer, Cyborg, Blazer
- Managed by different project teams!
governance.openstack.org/tc/reference/projects/
* I had a conversation with Copilot about the virtues of OpenStack vs Kubernetes and it tried its best to remain neutral:
- OpenStack and Kubernetes "solve similar issues" - Copilot
- Neutron: Networking is complex and difficult part to scale
- Cloud Therapist: Why use OpenStack with Kubernetes for bare metal or public cloud or Kubernetes distros?
Copilot: "Good question!"
* One of the worst and self-indulgent things about OpenStack was that they started naming each of their releases - giving each one a different name!
- What is the point of this?
- This move for me was the epitome of boredom, overconfidence and arrogance!
- Unfortunately, Kubernetes has started doing the same thing, as well
- Let's see how long THAT lasts now! LOL
* Present Day:
- Vendors have mostly moved away from OpenStack
- It has retreated into telco space
- OpenStack was strong in telco due to Network Function Virtualisation (NFV) - virtualisation of telco hardcore equipment
- But even that is threatened - AWS announced in 2023 Telco Network Builder + Managed Telco Networks
aws.amazon.com/blogs/aws/new-aws-telco-network-builder-deploy-and-manage-telco-networks/
* Rackspace attempts to dis-spell some OpenStack myths and rumours:
www.rackspace.com/blog/dispelling-myths-openstack-clouds
* Nobody I know is now contemplating using OpenStack
- Not in their data centre or any form of cloud or anywhere else!
- If any cloud vendor is running OpenStack it's because of history, not by a recent decision!
- You might as well run Kubernetes on VMware vSphere - and even that is a bad idea now, thanks to the Broadcom acquisition!
* OpenStack is notoriously hard to Manage, Patch and Upgrade
- Even if that was after lots of Chef/Puppet automations in those days!
- Much like OpenShift customers - they dreaded upgrades - just attend an OpenShift Summit and ask a customer!
- You needed an army of folks that knew OpenStack
- Lived and breathed it with years of practical experience - a high priestly order of fanatics!
* State Of OpenStack distros:
- SUSE acquired HP Helion to integrate with its OpenStack solution
- SUSE failed to integrate the two and they pulled out of the whole OpenStack endeavour a few years ago!
- VMware vCloud sold to OVH Cloud
- Red Hat continues to support it
- Red Hat "Red Hat OpenStack Services on OpenShift" - announced in 2023
www.redhat.com/en/blog/red-hat-openstack-services-openshift-next-generation-red-hat-openstack-platform
- "this blending of technologies requires careful planning" - Yes!!!
- "Red Hat OpenStack Platform 17.1 is the last version of the product to use the classic form-factor of the
control plane"
- Both Canonical and Mirantis (with MOSK) have followed the same path as Red Hat
* Conclusions
- So was OpenStack a romantic notion?
- A wishful, whimsical thought of running one's own cloud?
* OpenStack is really superseded by Containers (Docker) and Orchestration (Kubernetes)
- Trying to fit these into OpenStack or it into them, is just retro-fits either way!
* OpenStack remains complex - upgrades are like a heart operation!
* Only a handful of vendors supporting it
* The whole concept of how we want to do cloud has moved on
- Not even Hybrid or Private Clouds are that popular nor do they use OpenStack to build up on
* We spent $805B on Public Cloud in fiscal 2024!
- Does that say we want to build our own clouds?
- And what is the best way to do GenAI today? Certainly not on OpenStack!
* I declare that OpenStack is definitely DEAD!!
Hello from the other half of the Cloud Therapist that never been! 😀Thank you Richard for having me, it was pleasure to do this one together, and I somehow sense this may not be the end of us doing collabs going forward! Cheers, Leo.
Pleasure was all mine. How did you know this is not the last one - you must be a mind reader! ;-)
Haha I am! Then I thought I would ask Copilot what ‘it’ thinks of our collab 😀@@CloudTherapist