Was Poland-Lithuanian Commonwealth a Real Republic?
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 22 พ.ค. 2024
- Kings and Generals animated historical documentary series on the Middle and Early Modern Ages continues with a video in which we talk about the Poland-Lithuanian Commonwealth also known as Rzeczpospolita, as we ask if the confederation was a real republic.
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Can you make the Kyrgyz Empire Too? It was big enough
RES TI TUTA! Not "Res Publica". Rzeczpospolita , Res Ti Tuta, is term coined by Wincenty Kadlubek in his book "History of Poland", which was written in _Latin_. There was no mention about any Res Publica until year 1918. You do not know Latin? That Poland uses in foreign translation word "Polish Republic" does not mean "Rzeczpospolita" is originating from Res Publica. In Polish language there is different word for "Res Publica", which is polish word "republika".
Short answer. It is complicated. Whole democracy thing was only invented. In many Republics before that, also only citizens have any rights. Universal citizenship was not a thing even in US, until Civil War.
Is there a date when you'll put The Punic Wars for all subscribers who can watch it?
@@Scorpion51123314512 nope
The PLC is one of the most valuable cases to learn from in history. It really shows how political intrigue can severely weaken and ruin a nation, especially with democracies. It's a shame very few people know about the collapse of the PLC because all modern democracies are suffering the same problems and have the same weaknesses such as factionalism and self sabotage
That is a fair point
USA is ridden with decadent nobility
The thing is, such a trend is increasing. Where I am from, there are already 5 dictatorships nearby due to a lack of faith in democracy, as many people just want to see a firm ruler to guide them through the insurgency fallout
The falling away of the people being virtuous through the decline of Christianity is also a common thread.
Also, you got to remember that Poland and Lithuania were devastated by Swedes, I don't remember the percentage, but by percentage they killed more than nazis or soviets.
The commonwealth feared monarchy so much that they forgot the threat of oligarchy.
Which leads me to ponder if the fall of the Commonwealth will be more similar to the inevitable fall of the US than the Roman collapse
@wyattcole5452 Fall of US? Lmao stop doomscrolling.
@@corneliaaurelli1603 ??? You think the US won’t fall or something?
@wyattcole5452 Of course not. What are you smoking for you to have such delusions?
@wyattcole5452 All governments are doomed to fall, but I doubt the U.S.A. will collapse anytime soon.
Jan Ostrorog: 'this kind of government is a great shame if the Republic can be brought to ruin through the stupidity or stubbornness of a single individual.'
Man really was ahead of his time.
Well, the Roman Republic and Athens already showed them all it takes is one bad apple to spoil a batch
Sorry but in Rome and Athens, (and Sparta and Carthage and Thebes for that matter), there were more than a few bad apples in each (I hate to say it but history being may be repeating itself).
Yep !! Stick with monarchy, fools - you can't afford to take that first step...!
I can see merit in the need for unanimous votes... all you have to do is quote Nancy Pelosi..."We have to pass the bill in order to find out what's inside it." Factionalism? Yep, got that too... Ignoring areas that are struggling while shoving detrimental legislation through? Absolutely, check that box. Of course, few people even realize that the "United States" is not a constitutional republic any longer, and NEVER was a democracy. We lost our country right after the Civil War, in 1871 when Grant revised the constitution turning our country into a Corporation after the crown of England (merely a formality since all power resides with the City of London and the Lord Mayor after the Rothschilds took hold of the money) put us into so much debt we were hopelessly enslaved once again. Lincoln wanted to change the money to the infamous Greenbacks. Which is why he was assassinated. Jesuits, Masons, Zionists, The Vatican, ect. are all in bed with each other. E Pluribus Unum. Ordo Ab Chao.
On the other hand it's good to remember that the"liberum veto" rule was in force at least since 1514, and yet it was used for the first time only in 1652 when one member did not agree to extend the parliament session beyond the statutory period (and he was widely shamed for it for the rest of his life, his body was on display in his family town as a cautionary tale up to the 19th century). However, it really became abused only during the 18th century. So for more than a century (during the heyday of the Commonwealth) all of the parliament's decisions were always unanimous - try doing that nowadays in any country!
What is also intresting is the fact that while PLC's neighbours reffered to themselves as heirs to Roman Empire (Gernans, Russians and Ottomans) PLC's nobility prefere themselves to compare to Roman Republic
This is not true.
@pyrographyarts204 Which part isn't true?
@@braxtonfriday8713 The part where PLC nobles did claim they have Roman origin. Google Palemonids.
@@pyrographyarts204 It is true:
"The Polish-Lithuanian concept of ëCommonwealthí (Respublica;
Rzeczpospolita) was based on the ancient Greek and Roman republic
model. Political authors in the sixteenth and seventeenth century often
quoted or paraphrased the definitions of respublica in Aristotleís Politica
and Ciceroís De Re Publica. "
src-h.slav.hokudai.ac.jp/coe21/publish/no15_ses/08_koyama.pdf
@@pyrographyarts204 It is true. At least the Lithuanian side deeply believed to have roots in Rome.
You forget to mention that PLC was religius free state - all people running from polish neighbours, heretics or prosecuted could seek asylium here. You could have any religion you wanted - we had catolics poles, orthodox lithuanians, calvinists prussians, muslim tatars, protestants and all other religions. It was unique feature that no other state had.
care to comment on the widespread persecution of orthodox Christians after Union of Brest (1595-96)??? there goes your (unique feature)
@@user-tn9sr7xy1o You dont understand what religion freedm is - of course there were some movments that fought with other religions/heresy. But it wasnt controled by state, nor the king or parliment - there wasnt any laws that forbid orthodox from living in Poland. Until 1660s when after the deluge king Jan Casimir III banished arians (or so called polish brothers, branch of calvinists). From that point it was end for freedom of faith coz someone was banished. So no, some "persecutions" done by locals and ordinary people doesnt count, it was happening from time to time.
@@user-tn9sr7xy1o that ortodox that worked aginst Poland how strange is that huh?
Orthodox Ukrainians know to what extent Orthodoxy was allowed
@@user-fe9zm8gd7m it was allowed until you sold your motherland great PLC to russia for some money. It is strange how people treat you after you broke oaths and put a knief in thier back.
As a Polish person, I really appriciate the video on the history of my country, and Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth in this case - the Rzeczpospolita. 👑🇵🇱 Thank You! ❤
Abiejų Tautų Respublika 👍
Річ Посполита обох народів) Колись вона майже стала Річчю Посполитою трьох народів 🇺🇦🇵🇱🇱🇹🇧🇾
@@TheAl2kas republika obojga narodów was first version of Polish-Lithuanian integration
very big respect from Turkey, Poland-Lithuania was a great state, i still dont understand, how it easily partitate by Germans and Russia, Sobieski defend Europe later they partitate Poland-Lithuania, Great Britain, France no one protest partition ?
About 6 years ago I asked if K&G are planning to make videos about the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth, and they responded to my comment and said "Yes"! I guess they took all that time to master the pronunciation of Polish names, which they totally nailed. Looking forward to see more videos about the PLC, its battles and the wider history of Eastern Europe!
video at a really high level, but let's start using historical coats of arms and typically Polish costumes
Fuck yes I’m in love with early modern history. Would love to see a 1654 Russo-Polish war or 1608 Muscovite-Polish war vid!
Dude the War started in 1609, before that it was simply bands of Polish nobles not approved by the state.
Dokładnie szczególnie 1610-1612 Moskwa i cała Rosja pod panowaniem Polskim.
@@Wokerr i co z tego później wyszło? dzisiaj Polski nie ma....
@@fernandor8186 dalej jest o trzyma się dobrze kolego. Polska jest jak Feniks
@@Wokerrда потому что Московский бояре решили что русским царём будет принц Владислав Ваза будущий король Польши Владислав IV Ваза (Швец по национальности) и все в России готовились к тому что Владислав станет царём но была одна но Владислав должен был принять православие и находиться в Москве ну его отец Сигизмунд решил что сперва он подберёт себя Смоленск.Это привело это привело восстание против семибоярщины поднятие второго ополчения а поляки просто ушли из Москвы и ещё тогда в Москве находился более 1.500 польских дворян которых после свадьбы Лжедмитрия i
About Liberum veto - originally the total unanimity was intended only for the formal matters like prolonging the sessions or electing the parliament's marshal (speaker). When it was first effectively used in 1652, a deputy from Upita, Siciński, vetoed not the meritum of the session, but the session's prolonging in order to conclude it formally, and then left. The marshall ordered guards to bring the obstructionist back, but he escaped.
The principle in theory and origins made some sense. It wasn't meant to break the sessions, just to -force- encourage compromises - "noone goes home until you agree" mechanism - something familiar to Americans on jury duty, I bet). Siciński wasn't the first obstructionist, but the first one to escape instead of being coerced to withdraw the veto. It changed the whole deal.
Important thing here: Deputies formally were not 'members of parliament' but 'envoys' from their constituency, obliged to vote according to instructions of their land's assembly. Possessing such written instructions was the proof of their mandate. To proceed without a deputy was like excluding his entire Land of the Commonwealth. Non possumus, as they'd say.
In this situation it could have been still just handwaived and unanimity applied to those still present but A - the marshal was extreme formalist, and B - this particular session going down the drain was actually convenient to many factions, so noone really insisted. The Session was not prolonged, could not be formally closed in time, and became void as if it never happened. This created the precendence and liberum veto started to be applied commonly.
Another important point is it had existed for some 200 years before first used and it was not a problem. The parliament had always been able to make decisions supported by entirety of deputees before that.
As a Lithuanian i'm glad you made video about part of our history, knowing how important PLC was to European history, it's unfortunate there are not many good english language documentaries about it.
The Radziwiłł were major players in the commonwealth
@@DutifulCommentsIt's his history for sure
@@DutifulComments That's not true tho. Within the Commonwealth the ethnically Polish noble houses were relatively minor, most of magnateria - the few most powerfull noble houses - were actually of Lithuanian or Ruthenian origins. The Radziwiłł family was of Lithuanian origin, the Ostrogski family was an old Ruthenian knyaz dynasty from Volhynia and the Wiśniowiecki family was both, as they descended from Giediminas and Lithuanian rulers but were also Ruthenian knyaz and some of their members were Orthodox. They got culturally Polonized but were not Polish. Many of them were describing themselves as "genthe Rutheni, natione Poloni" - of Ruthenian ethnicity, of Polish nationality. The only ethnically Polish noble house of the magnateria was the Zamoyski family.
@@DutifulComments Lithuanians Rutenized themselves and then Polonized on their own free will. That's the first thing.
Second, the eastern Slavs had a huge influence on the PLC. Radziwiłł, Ostrogski, Wiśniowiecki, Sanguszko and other families had huge influence on the country and they had ruthenian/lithuanian roots. And they brought the state into many conflicts and began to undermine its system.
@@DutifulComments What the f** are you talking about? Forming part of something is what makes "our history". The same way Spanish history, for certain timeline is also the same as Roman history, because Hispania was part of Roman Rep. / Empire. If you can't agree with this, then you are just denying all countries/nations history, because all of them, at any time, formed part of something bigger.
It's great to see you covering this topic. I think you did pretty well. Especially since the state of serious scholarship of this subject available in English seems to be a bit lacking. It's been almost a decade since the 1st volume of the Oxford history of Poland-Lithuania by Robert I. Frost (ending at the Union of Lublin in 1569) was published. I'm starting to doubt if the vol. 2 will ever see the light of day.
At least the late period and the fall of the Commonwealth are covered pretty well by Richard Butterwick. Edit: I forgot about the book _History of the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth: State - Society - Culture_ by Urszula Augustyniak.
I'm looking forward to your coverage of the _Rzeczpospolita_ in greater detail in the future. You seriously could make multiple whole series about different aspects of it.
But did you notice that there was no depiction of typical Polish nobles with Sarmatian garment? we are presented as a typical European country. There was no research into our uniqueness when it comes to culture.
@@ihin2005 yes, the images could reflect the local culture more rather than just portray generic European middle ages, the fashion in PLC was quite unique with Italian style being mixed with Oriental influences
@@olseneudezet1 No Kontusz, no Żupan, no moustaches? No.
Dokładnie po za tym że Szwecja była sojusznikiem Polski. Potop szwedzki był najbardziej niszczycielski w całej historii Polski gorszy nawet od drugiej wojny światowej. Rzeczpospolita już nigdy się nie podniosła po potopie zginęła 1/3 ludności kraj był w ruinie wszystkie dobra były zawłaszczane przez Szwedów nie zostawili nic poza spustoszeniem. Jedyny plus to to że na końcu przegonili i pokonali Szwedów po pięciu latach klęsk tylko Rzeczpospolita została zrujnowana.
@ihin2005 Yeah, I guess. Fashion in the video was a bit of a jumble, with not much of the unique "sarmatian" style elements, and it kinda looked like mixing clothes from different periods in one scene. But fashion and material culture, in general, clearly wasn't the focus of this video, so I chose to focus on the positives.
BTW, speaking of the positives, I could also note that the pronunciation was good.
GREETINGS FROM LITHUANIA!
As a Pole i must say this was a very professional, condens, and all around good essey (i hope this is the right word). The movie was not to long, historicaly accurate and had matching animations. I watched it with pleasure. I can only praise yet another good work of your team :)
Which movie?
@@arturgabriel4857 the author meant this video :)
wszystko git ale boli mnie ten współczesny orzeł i stroje zbyt zachodnie jak na Polskę
A good example on the pseudo-democratic mindset that dominated the Polish nobility at the time of the signing of the Union of Lublin in 1569 can be found in the work '' De Optimo Senatore" by Laurentius Grimaldus Goslicius.
It was written in the latter half of the 16th century in Venice by a Polish szlachtic noblemen, philosopher and future Bishop of Poznan, Wawrzyniec Goślicki. It's main arguments focus on explaining that in a just, moral and virtous society no one man can be above the law, and that even kings, nobles, bishops and any other figure within the state have to subordinated to the justice system. It also justifies the right of people to overthrone their ruler in cases of tyranny, corruption or negligence of his duties to the people; it also includes defences on religious toleration and the power of assembly and the vote of the multitude in deciding final decisions in legislature.
The work was popular in the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth but also in England where passages from its chapters would be distributed to the soliders and supporters of the parliamentarians during the English Civil War, in the form of pamphlets. Thomas Jefferson was also known to have kept a copy of it in his famous library and the treatise would remain well known as an early xample of democratic thought untill the early 19th century.
Excellent presentation by the way. Keep the up the good work!
ha, nothing changed, rich foreign companies and important politicians, bureaucrats are above polish law while polish commoner under one of these contemporary magnates has to think day and night how to break the law enough so that he won't starve to death and yet not to much so the police wouldn't throw him into the dungeons
now however, nobody seems to oppose the tyranny, while some commoners do protests, they are highly inefective while the magnates interestingly enough don't seem to oppose any president whoever he might be
Thank you for finally making a video from the Commonwealths persepctive. I hope there is more in the future! Please, let there be more. It is very important for all East-Central Europeans, not only Poles!
Yep
For Lithuania too I bet.
And also for Ukraine and Belarus. It does not mean these nations interpret the history the same, but that the Commonwealth is very important in understanding all of their pasts
@quiquemarquez3211 And for Belarusians and Ukrainians. To a lesser extent for Latvians. I'd say that it's also very important for Jewish history.
Having viewed some Belarusian content on this platform and in other corners of the net, I can say that many Belarusians today (particularly among the anti-Lukashenko, pro-western types) seem to be more into the Commonwealth than most Polish people.
@@Artur_M. niestety nasz naród staje się troche przygłupawy, ludzi nie interesuje nasza historia a jedyne co wiedzą o niej to 2 wś
No other big channels are making content like this. I’m usually watching tiny channels which is fine but having a higher production standard really sets your videos apart.
Thanks 🙏 ❤
Thanks!
One mistake. Polish kings were not elected by parliament as you stated. They were elected by special assemblies of all nobility. This of course had it downsides (votes were bought by magnates from extremely poor nobles known as "golota") but on the other hand was more democratic than the decision of parliament, which mostly consisted of richer nobles.
The main problem with such a system is that you get Kings that are weak and do not challange the power of the nobility. And that is a problem when you got a country where the nobility is already too powerful and harmful to development. The nobility will of course only elect someone to become a King if he can give promises to respect the rights of the nobles and give them gifts, favorable treatment and more power. And that makes the power of the nobles grow even more, so the next time you elect a King they will dare to demand even more stuff from a young guy before they accept him to become a King.
Denmark had the same system as Poland in this regard. In Sweden on the other hand did the eldest son automatically inherit the throne so it was therefore much more difficult for the nobles to bully a King into submission. So Sweden could raise taxes, conscript soldiers, and sometimes also apply some meritocracy for some positions in society.
But in Denmark was those things difficult. And in the end would Denmark lose the battle against Sweden about the dominance over the Baltic sea, despite being a larger country with more resources. Sweden was simply better organized. While Denmark was backwards.
Sweden did also conquer Poland two times, in 1658 and 1706. Which shows how pathethically weak Poland was because of its systematic mismanagement by its ruling class. A country with a 15 times larger population, richer population, better climate, better diplomatic power and so on should easily have crushed Sweden. And it easily did so at Kircholm in 1605 when both Sweden and Poland was at a primitive level of managment of their military and economy. But Sweden did learn from its mistakes and reformed its economy and military and would come back and conquer Poland. Poland on the other hand was unable to modernize because of its nobles, and hostile foreign powers that were bribing their members of parliament so Poland could never do what was best for its own self-interest but instead remained weak and paralyzed by the influence from enemy powers.
Its sad. Because this empire did have a lot of potential. But we are now unable to see what it was capable of.
That's right.
In some 18th century elections 10s of thousands of nobles turned up to vote.
It was worse than the Roman Assembly system where the voters were at least organised into tribes.
The Poles should probably have imitated that system.
Polish king Stefan Batory (mentioned at 4:00 ) is famously quoted for saying to a student at Zamość academy: "Disce puer latine, ego faciam te mościpanie" which translates as "Study Latin [young lad] and I shall make thou a Lord". I have little to no doubt that if he were to make a similar statement today it would be in the lines "Watch Kings and Generals and you shall become a statesman [mąż stanu]". Splendid video 👏
Can we take a moment to appreciate how H&G pronounce polish names? That's high quality standard for an YT video documentaries!
It's too bad the politics of the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth never rubbed off in its neighbors. Definitely one of the most fascinating countries of the Early Modern period.
too bad? I mean, the PLC paralyzed itself which lead to its painful partition, so why should the other countries learn from its model and become failed states themselves?
@@oldrabbit8290 You mean that it should've been like the other countries that just attacked countries for their own selfish gains, became empires and fell as well?
@@oldrabbit8290 Too bad because Poland's neighbours were aggresive regimes that exploited the situation and partitioned PLC. If they would be more like PLC then maybe life would be more peacefull in Europe as PLC's nobility was never keen on starting wars. King could have their backing pretty much only when it was a defensive war, because nobody wanted the risks of war, die in battle or pay extra taxes. PLC was a lot like ancient Sparta in this context. A formidable land power that rarelly wanted to go outside it's territory.
@@bobbyhenderson8655 1. the PLC was quite belligerent nation itself, fighting pretty much all of its neighbors in the late 16th century.. Then these neighbors learned that they could always pay some nobles to veto any action against these foreign interests..
2. The comparison with Sparta is on point, as Sparta is also quite famously lethargic when it comes to reform, even to avoid certain doom. After suffering population decline after decades of Peloponnesian War, they didn't try to reform the requirement to become citizen, or reform its army to include more non-citizen (perioikoi); instead, they were like "so be it" and let Sparta decline into irrelevant, become a freak show for Roman tourists..
@@oldrabbit8290 I disagree with you about PLC being often an agressor. This is not what I remember from history books. From what I know since it's conception in 1569 every king had a big problem with raising taxes for war and it was really hard for PLC to start anything. In PLC a king couldn't do much without the nobility (ca. 10% of the nation at the time) and their chosen delegates for the Sejm. While the will of the Tzar in Muscovy or Sultan's word in the Ottoman Empire was pretty much the law. I mean compared to Russian or Ottoman Empires and their territorial expansion at the time PLC was a saint 🙃
It should also be noted that Protestant historians, (who wrote with a pro Protestant bias mostly British and American), overlook the PLC and the Venetian Republic. (In order to argue that Protestantism goes with constitutionality, and Catholicism with Absolutism, they also overlook Prussia and Sweden on the other side).
In fact, Protestant Prussia (Vassal of the Kingdom of Poland), the first Protestant country in history, is a country created by Catholic Poland and Lithuania.
@@times4937 really I thought Sweden and Denmark converted around the same time?
Papist spotted.
Fantastic as usual are you guys ever going to do a video on the partitions by any chance?
Thanks! Yep, on the way
If you do not want to wait, there is a series on the Deluge on the Eastory channel.
Fun fact, that the word 'rokos' comes from 'rákos', a Hungarian word. We held our parliament on the great field of Rákos. This is a creek in Pest. In that time we had many big biz with our Polish brothers.
The Ottoman Regency of Algiers also had a sort of republic, a military republic (also called stratocracy) where janissaries and corsairs formed the body of government and elected the ruler (Dey), the janissaries had a council of government called divan where they elected its president "the Agha" (He was Also the minister of the army in the Dey's cabinet). The divan often undermined the suzerainty of the Ottoman porte, and engaged in billateral relations with European countries. It was called "collective despotisme" by some authors like montesquieu or "Wild democracy" by Edward gibbon but Jean jaques rousseau was impressed by it.
junta.
Yeah and they were evil the ottomans stole lands by conquest
Thank you very much for making PLC history more popular.
Very good material, altough I need to ad something which is often forgotten even in Poland and Lithuania. Vasa dynasty for example was infact Swedish family, but Sigismund the III knew Polish language, after all his mother was Jagiellon. Stefan Batory did not speak Polish, at least when he started to rule, but Hungarian culture was the most similar to the Polish back then, they were in big contrast to the western Europe and their traditions, they said that Batory dressed himself "po polsku" - as a Polish person, which was very respected. Also some of the kings who are considered as Polish, were eg. Rus people, like Michał Korybut Wiśniowiecki, to be clear most of people who lived in the Great Duchy of Litchuania were ethnicaly Slavic - Rus people, not Baltic - Lithuanians as a lot of people think today. My point is that ethnic identity of aristocrats was very fluent, especially before 19th century. The most important cultural characteristics of a king in Rzeczpospolita, was that he was catholic because most of the szlachta was (but they were also: protestant, orthodox and even Muslim nobles in the Commonwealth), that he knew latin and that he looked like a Polish person in contrast to flamboyant European style of Nobility, which was considered as feminine and ridiculous in Rzeczpospolita. Thats why some of the kings for example Vasas, depicted themselves in traditional Polish (infact Persian/Turkish) clothes and facial hair, which was probably kind of propaganda for szlachta. My point is that it is often anachronistic to imply our modern categories for identity when we talk about the past, szlachta of commonwealth was very multiethnic group of people, they identified with themselves because of their position and responsibility, not because of language or ethnicity, maybe thats why they created the myth of "Sarmatian heritage" of the Szlachta, to unite themselves.
In Poland we think of the old Commonwealth in many different ways. We take pride in our Hussars, great victories and relatively huge tolerance for that time but also remember how the great nation can fall within just a few decades because of selfishness and corruption. Nevertheless it's a great pride for us, Poles, and having ancestor of Winged Hussars is even greater honor.
We had more than hussars
Lots of people forget about units like Pancerni, Hajducy or Lisowczycy
You're huge tolerance lead to your downfall too...
@@theggman111 I would not brag about Lisowczycy aka Riders of the Apocalypse. They could not tell a friend from foe.
@@robertbloch1063
Overall they were one of the PLC armed forces. We need to remember about others. Not just the hussars
@@theggman111 Well, Lisowczycy were part of polish forces initially at least. Albeit effective in battle, they were impossible to control. It got to the point that in PLC existed a law against them, allowing killing them on spot. Polish king got rid of them quickly, sending as "support" to Habsburgs. They then became mercenaries. They eventually got disbanded and most ended up as bandits.
In terms of brutality and terror Lisowczycy could only be compared to Mongols. Difference was, Lisowczycy committed their atrocities on foes and friends alike. Made no difference to them.
Should we remember them? Sure. As a warning. Nothing to be proud of.
Lisowczycy were scum. Never ever mention them in same line with Hussars.
The fact that the Polish Lithuanian Commonwealth is not included in our education system is Ridiculous! it is the prime example of how a democracy should work.
*how a democracy should not work
@@Alengar Should work with minor adjustment*
*how democracy should not work when your neighbours are shit
Great choice with direction for next videos. This one was already amazing, can't wait for the next one!
A very welcome surprise to see a video about PLC in English. I'm excited for more about partitions too!
Yessss, been waiting for this content!
More about Poland!
And about Lithuania...
Video on polish uprisings after the last partition would be great
Thanks!
matko boska, ile to piwa....
@@viz12345 Na oko 15 puszek🍺
this channel keep updating!
im gratefull!
Interesting that there’s a video about the Poland-Lithuanian Commonwealth as I remember watching a TH-cam Narrrative Let’s Play on Empire Total War called “Crownless Eagle” by Mahu which tells a story about a Polish commonwealth that never fell or at least that’s what I remember it’s been a while since I saw the series.
A very objective and factual look at the subject of the history of the Rzeczpospolita, well done!
Great video keep it up you're doing amazing things 😁👍
It has been a while since i binged watched this channel videos and hearing that intro music/sound was really refreshing ngl, feels like a safe space. amazing content
Awesome video. Thanks for it.
Fascinating to say the least. This is what roman republican principles are applied in modern context, trying to blend medieval standards like kings and religion with classical ones like republic and philosophy. Usually we think of Italy as the place of political experiments (passing from petty duchies like Modena to republics like San Marino to absolute theocracy like the papal state), but this is really unique. Other videos on PLC please!
Great video. However I would like to point out that the clothing shown on most of the artwork, from my point of view is, at the very least strange. In the time of its existence, the fashion in the PLC was heavily influenced by Turkish and Persian style due to the popular back then, idea of Sarmatism. Therefore, most of the Polish nobility and even the lower social classes would be usually seen wearing a dress consisting of: the żupan (a type of long garment. Wealthier nobles would usually have them coloured crimson and made out of silk, while the lesser nobility and the lover social classes would make it grey or white, either out of wool or linen.),
either the kontusz (a long, decorative, outer garment) or the Delia ( a coat furnished with fur), the kontusz belt, also called a kontusz sash ( a long often intricatelly decorated scarf worn wrapped around the hips), szarawary ( a type of wide horseriding pants), and most importantly, as a headdress: the kołpam (a type of fur hat). All of this would make a Polish or Lithuanian look more akin to a Persian or a Turk than a Western European of the time. Some examples of how the clothing would look all together you can find in Wikipedia commons on paintings such as: Jan Kazimierz by Daniel Schultz, Jan Zamoyski, Portret Kazimierza A. Ossolińskiego and many others. You can also find photos of modern day recreations of such clothing on the photos of the Krakow Kur Fraternity.
In comparison the videos artwork mostly shows mostly western european clothing from the 17th and 18th century as well as the type of clothes worn in the Poland and Bohemia around the 15th and early 16th centuries. The weirdest of all are the hats which look like they were worn in Western Europe from the late 14th to 16th century, and were never that popular in the region of the PLC, yet still somehow, very commonly appear throughot the video instead of the far more historically accurate kołpak. Although you would, from time to time see these types of clothing among the nobility and more rarely the merchants, it was far from common, while in the artwork most of the characters are dressed that way. I would like to say again, great video, but I hope you pay attention to such details next time as they truly enhance the experience.
Thanks for the video
Recently putin spoke with tucker calrson, he mentioned Poland a million times... This video will help you understand the obsession, fear, borderline harted of russian elite towards Poland
They simply cannot allow their own people to see and try anything else thanwhat they have
Explaining philisophy, culture, political system and touch of religion in all of that.. all nicley packed in one video, great material
great video. i love how you always show your sources, as you should. its awesome to be able to watch a unbiased and mature video about how a political entity worked.
if you are interested in it, i would love to watch videos about how common folk lived and stories of everyday life, anywhere in any period of time.
It was said without focus, but it's one of most important PLC features. All nobles were equal. There were no dukes, princes, barons, lords, etc.
Thank you so much! Been itching for videos about my home!
Really helpful thank you! Always wondered!
Please make a detailed series on the three kingdoms period . A great fan of your work . This channel is the reason for my love of history. Please make a series on this period of human history
Really enjoyed this look at the history of the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth. Very interesting society for the time, a fierce sense of national identity, and a most insightful video! Well done!
Yes, but the nation was defined not in ethnic or reliogious sense, but as a community of noblemen. You could be Pole, Lithuanian, Ruthenian, German, Armenian - as a noblemen you were part of that nation...
Great episode!
Thank you for this video! It is great to have now also some more knowledge about this fascinating union.
Polish history is honestly very interesting and I’m glad it will be covered more
Amazed me how vast they were bak in the 17th c, felt like I couldn't believe my eyes.
Not surprising considering Lithuania alone stretched all the way to the Black Sea prior to the merge. Poland was no slouch in territory either.nothing unseen up to that point, but the combination does make for an impressive map
Google Jagiellon dynasty. If we were more lucky with dynastic affairs (like king having/not having a heir) the things could have become wild.
Nice video. I learn with every new video form this channel unknown facts. Great
Great video!
I'm happy you made a video about our history; it's a shame there aren't more high-quality movies about PLC in English, given its significance to European history.
The Rzeczpospolita was a fascinating political system and its downfall is a sad story.
Just like always , very informative and interesting material
Very good content.👍 Thank you.
Love this side of history!
A tool against factionalism becoming a major weapon for factionalists?
Congratulations, everybody! You just played yourselves!
Thank you for the video :)
Great job!
Greetings from Belarus! Thank you for making a video about our ancestry. PLC's history and legacy doesn't belong exclusively to Polish or Lithuanians, but to Belarusians as well. This is our common history, Belarusian people took part in it no less than other participants. Unfortunately, most of the time people tend to omitt this fact and try to hog the cover. Really looking forward to see something about Belarusians, their language within the GDL and PLC, and how did ancient western Rus states decide to unite with the GDL. Great video👍
Kościuszko is my number 1 hero from our history, thank you for birthing him Belarus
I once read a book wrote by Bielorusian. He wrote in Polish: Oh, Lithuania, my Father land!
Some certainly became vassals willingly for one reason or another as Lithuanian princes were often heading off to act as frontier protectors for republican Slavic states like Novgorod, Pskov and others, but there was certainly a lot of warfare involved in the creation of the largest state in Europe at the time. It's not like these Slavic states all just agreed to be ruled by Lithuanians, this was achieved through a combination of clever diplomacy, tolerant domestic policy, marriage alliances and most importantly conquest. This doesn't mean Belarus can't look to this shared history and take pride, but the key is to not take ownership of it as some Belorussians are trying to do by rewriting the reality of medieval Lithuania with such claims as every ruler being of Slavic heritage.
@@pl-hq5hr Exactly! That's the thing people need to know about PLC. It was multiethnic state with people who were not really trying to distinguish themselves ethnically, for them it was one common country. But why it wasn't a problem back then? Because nationalism wasn't a thing yet, it was in embryonic stage at best. Unfortunately that creates tonnes of problems today. Polish, Lithuanians and Belarusians argue over the historical and cultural heritage, tearing poor Mickievič in three parts, claiming that he belongs only to them. The dude literally loved his home - Belarus, spoke Polish and called Lithuania his Fatherland. For him all three were inseparable.
@@cogitorium1089 the man was a true patriot
Oh my 👀 Another fantastic day, when K&G drops a new video! On the complex polotics, of Eastern Europe
Amazing video thanks I knew nothing about this block. Perhaps a follow up video on its relations with Rus?
As usual, amazing and iformative video. Thanks for this Eastern Europe videos! For me, as Ukrainian, it's so amazing to see how this topic become more popular and well know among the Western audience.
Have you noticed they put the name of russia to what was actually moscove tsardom? it was Kingdom or Rus governed by Danylo of Galych, king of Rus. The moscovite stolen the name Rus only in 1721
If it isn't Little European Texas, these fellas had some of the wildest history out there
I actually have never heard Poland-Lithuania be called that. Huh
@@KingsandGeneralsSome people call Poland that not necessarily the Commonwealth
It's compared to American south regulary. Freedom but not for everyone
How old is Texas again? 200 year? Maybe 300?
@@trevdestroyer8209 That's rather rude. We had far greater history then Texas.
One note: after the Jagiellonian dynasty ended in 1572 the kings were not elected anymore just by the parliament, but instead in so called 'free elections', where every nobleman (about 10% of population) had an equal right to vote. These elections usually took place in some village near Warsaw, where the nobles from around the country would travel to and cast their vote in person.
Super interesting video
Very informative ❤😊
It's also worth noting the PLC, as a land of freedom, managed to avoid the European wars of religions, being a shelter to any refugees fleeing the western Europe. That also included many Jews running away from oppression.
Actually it was a reason why in Poland there were more Jewish people than anywhere else!
The biggest problem was probably the inability to collect taxes. The peasants were serfs so they couldn't pay taxes. The nobility got privileged so they didn't pay taxes. Most cities were "Magdeburg law cities" that were governed as if they were HRE cities and not a small townships in the Pripyat swamps. There were even private manor cities that didn't pay taxes to the crown that much
Awesome! Venice next!
Good video!
When you make that series on the events that led up to the partitions you should start from the death of Augustus III (who was about to be couped) and the little known civil war in the aftermath.
This is one of the most favorite periods of mine. From domination of russia to the client state of them. Just the joke of history. we always appreciate your hard work and dedication towards these videos. Love and big fan of you from Sri Lanka. ❤
After so many centuries we, Poles, understand RU is NOW an artificial, multi-national, multi-cultural and multi-religion totalitarian state, that should be partitioned for the greater good.
@@pawezdziech7120 Cope lmfao. Ur just mad russia outgrew your country and you cant bully them anymore.
nice video
The sad thing is they knew over a hundred years before the partitions that their system would lead to them, their nobles and thinkers wrote about it
Really good depiction of Polish-Lithuanian history. It was really interesting to watch
Courland tried its hand at colonialism, setting up a small colony in West Africa and colonies on the islands of Trinidad and Tobago in the Caribbean. Courlander Bay in Tobago is named after them, where they landed on the island.
It's curious that this Polish vassal state was so sea - oriented when the Polish nobles definitely weren't.
When a video about the tocharian people?
It would be a great opportunity to talk about their origins, the oasis-states, etc.
More videos of this are necessary indeed.
Unique political system in that period. Maybe closest to the English constitutional monarchy from 1688 revolution, except that it required unanimity to pass laws in the Polish Lithuanian parliament, which allowed enemies to paralyse decision-making with spies and bribes, kompromat etc. Also a rare example of religious tolerance, though this declined in 1650 onwards under pressure from the wars with Sweden and Moscovy. Another big difference to England was the widespread serfdom, but also a larger electorate maybe 10% of men were nobles. Also the elective monarchy.
I see the Polish system close to the Swedish system 1721-1788 during the age of liberty. The power of the country laid with the parliament and not with the King. Most men in parliament were nobles, altough representatives from the nobility, clergy, burghers and commoners was supposed to be represented. In practice it was the nobles ruled the country.
And those rich and priviligied men abused their power to enrich themselves at the expense of the country. They taxed the peasants and plowed the tax money into state funded companies, like the Swedish East India company, where the money later ended up in the pockets of the rich ruling elite.
They voted for tax cuts for themselves though. And since most of the money and wealth in the country ended up in their pockets was there only one solution that the government could do to get money - and that was to tax the rich. But since the rich sat in government and ruled the country, did they put self-interest before what was best for the country.
So the military budget was cut in half as soon the nobles got into power in 1721. The rich rather had tax cuts than a military that could defend the country. And the wars against Russia 1741-43 and Prussia 1758-1762 became disasterous failures for Sweden as a result.
Many of Swedens enemies made up secret plans to carve up Sweden like they did to Poland in 1772 and 1792.
Denmark would take southern Sweden, Prussia would take Pomerania, and Russia would take Finland. Foreign powers also bribed Swedish politicians to promote their national interests instead of what was in Swedens best interest. The entiry system was corrupt and dysfunctional and led to Swedens ruin as a great power, much like how Polands dysfunctional noble fake democracy had destroyed an enormous state with huge potential.
In the end would Swedens rotten nobility drive Sweden towards its ruin. They had become too powerful. And once did the Swedish King Gustav III try to reign in some of their powers. And that angered them so much that the military officers (who were nobles) commited mutiny and rather betrayed their country and raised arms against their King that fighting the russians.
The King had those traitors arrested and ordered the death penelty, but later on he showed mercy on them and removed the death sentences and let them go free. But this did not change the minds of the nobility, which shortly afterwards murdered the Swedish King. And a few decades later would the nobility once again commit treason in the middle of a war, and Swedens 400 year old royal dynasty was ended as they removed Swedens King and treatened with a bloody civil war unless he abdicated willingly.
Religious tolerance ????? really ??? care to comment on the repression of the orthodox Christians after the Union of Brest in 1595-1596? Get your facts right!!!!!
Having a leader be essentially hired by the commonwealth is kindve ingenious. The foreign leaders don’t feel as comfortable in the court and in their role because they aren’t leading their people. I think some kings would get caught up in the idea that he’s leading his people and that his people will do whatever he says and accept however he rules. Also the foreigners won’t have grown up in the court meaning they won’t have as many connections making the foreign leader more uncomfortable in his position. Maybe even feeling like he could be “fired” from the role. All of this culminating in a better ruler for the people
It also gave Poland free ally, since that King would still lead his old nation. As a matter of fact Poles often elected new King based on that, for example if they wanted to ally Sweden they would elect Swedish King.
It was sometimes a bit comical - mentioned here Henry Valois literally run from Poland to take France throne after his brother, this was even funnier that Polish court try to catch him in a horse race screaming why is he leaving. (I'm not making it up, it's actually well documented)
Elective monarchy, the king's great idea cannot be cared about by his followers in such a system, because it is not his subjects, you can also give a damn about the fate of the state, because it is not his state and he will not pass it on to anyone, and if he even tries to treat this sick man, his servants will immediately start a fight and every good and initiative will be met with bribes in the form of privileges and the Nobility will be bought by foreign Monarchs.
@@WodospadPelagia "Vai ar yu runin?"
This procedure actually created Polish-Lithuanian branch for the Swedish Vasa dynasty, who had three subsequent kings in the PLC, since they were dethroned in Stockholm. Same would've probably happened with Henri de Valois and his descendants, were he not to succede the French throne.
as a Pole invested in history - that's a great, great video with deep understanding of the 'noble democracy' system.
can't wait for more videos, as this seems as a fantastic intro to the weird political system of Poland.
Excellent Vídeo.
kings and generals are my go to channel for history allways
Thanks!
Thank you very much for shedding more light on the PL Commonwealth. It is a nation very much overlooked in history.
CHEERS!!!
Very interesting ❤❤❤👏👏👏🔥🔥🔥
As a Pol I appreciate the vids on Polish history. Underrated in history imo.
Could one argue that partition of Poland the greatest diplomatic mistake of Federick? In retrospect he ceded almost all of PLC to Russia (after the Napoleonic wars), which was to become a headache for Germany to this day.
Britain got India and America. Austria, Prussia and Russia got Poland. But France got nothing after the seven years war and faced economic ruin. And later on she got a revolution.
Poland was already a weak state. Russia sent its invasion armies into Prussia without asking Poland for permission or consent to pass their territory. And realisticly speaking was Poland too weak to dare to resist any Russian demands at that point.
Poland was a weak failed state and was going to be eaten up by its neighbours sooner or later.
Nope(but in the long run it was a negative).. He took a smaller but more strategic portion of poland. He successors got greedy and took more than they should or could govern
Frederick was a child in many regards, impulsive, self serving, arrogant, and emotional. I don’t think he really knew what he was doing with the PLC.
@@guavaguy4397 He also hated Poles, apparently compared the country to native americans.
not really, actually it were the Russians that sort of regreted taking all these lands since Alexander I feared all the possible rebelions and how right he was! i don't have any statistics towards how economically profitable was the kingdom of Poland under Russian rule apart from polish narration that it was the meh one economically and not too bad in terms of treating polish people, yet, they hated Russians with every inch of their heart and constantly revolted, hence, all the later repressions and we can only assume how much did it cost to crush all these rebellions over and over again
Looking at that map, it’s crazy how Prussia had that patch of good coastline right in the middle Poland.
Prussia was a subject of PLC at the time. Nobody really cared about it until they did.
A "conservative revolution" like Poland in 1569 often produces a government that combines monarchy with parliamentary, republican features, like the Netherlands at the same time, or England after 1688, or France's "July Monarchy" of 1830, or Japan after 1945.
What if they'd settled for requiring a 2/3 or a 3/4 majority, instead of unanimity?
A: "Was the PLC a republic?"
B: "Not really. It was dominated by the richest people in society, who chose all the leaders among themselves and who had much closer affinity and loyalty to foreign kings than to the commoners. They had tremendous rights compared with the masses and were legally untouchable. The only way it was in any way representative was that the few people at the top had to agree on policies, which they frequently didnt. Even a small minority of political leaders could paralyze the entire government, and were often bribed in order to do just that, including by hostile foreign powers."
A: "So it was a modern democracy."
I do also think that an equal society with transparancy and equality under the law can help to keep corruption more under control. And with democracy and direct democracy would it be possible to clean out political parties that are hold hostage by foreign governments secret money.
Direct democracy, where citizens have a direct say in decision-making through mechanisms such as referendums and initiatives, can indeed empower people to directly address issues of corruption and hold politicians accountable.
While no system is immune to corruption, fostering a culture of transparency, accountability, and civic participation can help safeguard against it and strengthen democratic governance.
Voting out the pro-russian politicians in the coming years election could be one step towards cleaning out corruption and harmful elements in western democracies. Getting rid of the russian influence through the Republican party, AfD, Le Pen, Orban etc.
Personally I do not think that a representative democracy without elements of direct-democracy deserves to be called a true democracy, as the people are not in charge - not in practice, and not even theoretically.
Every republic in the world has to answer the question who is in, who is out?
In Ancient Rome you had to be a citizen, In Athens you had to be a citizen.
If you ask a peasant from PLC if he is Polish he will answer you - Huh? - they didn't consider themselves Poles at all. Peasants who consider themselves Polish, that's much later - XVIII century.
Peasants in PLC (X - XVII century) were like small companies. They were paying rent for renting land from the landlord by working in it couple of days a year. This was all their duty. Noble had an obligation to sustain them in case of famine or bad crops. Peasants as private entrepreneurs were uninterested in political struggles, wars etc. If you investigate Polish literature you will find a lot of examples where peasants just don't care who is in power.
@@nattygsbord Interestingly Germany doesn't have referendums.
@@slawomirkulinski And if Germany does not have referendums, then can the will of the people not express itself. You only need to bribe, threaten or take control over the politicians in parliament and you will control the country, and the will of the German people no longer matters.
Hence is why I think that it is important with direct-democracy. I do not think that bailout of criminal wall street bankers would have happened if people could have done like in Switzerland and collected name signatures and forced the politicians to hold a vote on the matter.
And then would the people say no the idea of giving money to criminal wall street banks.
It would also be fun to see the people tear up things like the silly copyright laws in the EU, throw war criminals like Dick Cheney and Tony Blair in jail for the unprovoced war against Irak, and end government mass surveillance of its own people that are not suspected of having commited any serious crimes.
Most of the EU legislation could be torn into pieces by referendums. So I think the idea is excellent. I like democracy and hate arrogant politicians who think they are everyone elses betters.
Declining PLC was like Ukraine today. Big, but quite weak AND Internally DIVIDED. DESPITE DEMOCRATIC FORM was ruled by oligarchs, corruption and in permanent stagnation . Citizen had right too protests trough Rokosz (Maidan today). Had brave and skilled soldiers, but it was not enough in the end. Thankfully for Ukraine, not all of its neighbours wants it dismembered currently.
Poland-Lithuania was so much ahead of its time. Yet, that virtuous liberum veto was the biggest flaw. When foreign powers wanted to meddle in PLCW, they just bought ONE DUDE, who vetoed everything. Then it went spiral, veto after veto, making every "sejm" pointless. Then magnates had it done and started to think only for themselves, when whole country was paralyzed by a SINGLE DUDE. Sigh.
The PLC seems much more the inheritor of Rome than anyone who actually claimed it
To be fair in order to gain legitimacy, the Lithuanian segment of aristocracy in the PLC claimed descent from Polemon II of Pontus, who is a relative of Emperor Nero. In their origin story, they say that fleeing the fall of Rome, 500 Roman noble families sailed into the Black Sea, and up rivers, eventually settling in Lithuania and creating the first cities.
I didn't realise how Ciceronian their political thought was.
I know I've asked this before and its probably on your list but ill ask once more just to clear my mind..
Could you please do a video on the government of the vernesan republic
Thank you very much.