I think DJI’s Avinox system is going to blow most things out of the water! I’ve got a performance CX on my Pole Voima and never had a problem with it, interested to try the Bosch/TRP drivetrain although they’ll probably only make it compatible with the next gen motor🤦🏼♂️🙄 really dumb move if they do! Wouldn’t buy a bike with a Shimano motor on it, a mates experience of having 3 motors in less than 12 months plus all the comments I’ve read! Good video, nice to see a proper real world side by side test!👍🏻 I did look at the Nicolai but it weighs a lot, 27kg!
My brother has a Yeti e-bike and it weighs that much. It feels like a tank. He swears “you don’t feel the weight” but when I rode it downhill it was full Chonk. It was so heavy to move around. The Amflow at 20kgs is really going to disrupt the market.
DJI has incredible torque. Pinion should just team up with a existing manufacturer for a better motor and battery technology. The gearbox with a belt is s superior system.
The Pinion seems a bit disappointing, especially in terms of noise. I had a bike with a Pinion gearbox and thought it was OK but I still prefer a derailleur.
Thanks for the review and sharing your thoughts. As a viewer though, this is a "Apples to Oranges" comparison at best. As there are several unknown or unstated points making a direct comparison tenable.
As an owner of a 2017 Levo, which I have fitted with a Rohloff, I'm convinced internal gearboxes are the future. So the Pinion MGU had instant appeal to me. I'm not sure if your tests really tell us any more than these bikes are different. I do agree with you that version 2 of the Pinion MGU will be the real deal breaker for whether this technology will supersede traditional external cogs and derailleurs.
Some dude in Australia put rohloff on a Levo…. would love such a bike…. I’ve a Merida eOne-Sixty 700 and when it’s time to upgrade (hopefully a year or two away) I will seriously look at Rohloff or Pinion MGU…. these bikes re crazy expensive in Australia
The Nicolai Eboxx MR14 is the bike you should try with Bosch motor Rohloff hub (manual change) belt drive with tucked in front mounted tensioner. Very very good setup. Its a good motor / hub gearbox (totally proven) quiet and no heavier than the MGU.(Goodbye derailleurs.) SERIOUSLY the weight of a Emtb actually gives you stability in the air ,traction and makes the bike feel more planted and comfortable. Depends if you want stability or flickability. Manual change( over electronic) Rohloff hub is far better for Emtb ..I can't notice the tiny bit of extra unsprung hub weight and you wouldn't either. E=mtb²
I like natural feeling of EP8, which is the only motor I’m experienced with… but like idea of Rohloff and belt…. I don’t really do jumps or super sketchy stuff…. Love the downhill bullock trails in my backyard, the Adelaide Hills… also like tech uphill stuff… so range and suspension most important for me, brakes as wel obviously l… as long as not tooo heavy 25-ish kilo is fine…. not fussed with moderate / low levels of noise or rattle…. only other bike I’ve ridden is a turbo levo alloy comp I hired for a week 2 years ago before making a decision to buy a much cheaper Merida eOne-Sixty 700 (still 7½ K Australian) and am more than happy with weight, motor feel, noise etc… just wish I had more range… Rohloff looks very appealing indeed…
@timscarman4599 Have a look at Paul Moirs Rohloff Australia pages. Video Mountain biking with Rohloff . I also have a Rohloff on a 2018 Merida 13500 km now.They get better with age. E=mtb²
I’m not overly fussed with rattle or sound….. as long as it’s low-ish…. I’m a 54yr old trail explorer in Adelaide Hills, so minimal sketchy shit…. Btw my first even MTB, I’ve always had flat bar road bikes and a recumbent (Bachetta)
I'm curious about range? I've read that the pinion gearbox adds drag. I'm wondering if that drag has a real world measurable impact on battery drain. Otherwise, there is a lot to like with the maintenance wins on the gearbox system.
Yes the coffee grinder sound of the MGU would kill the joy of Emtb for me. I've updated my 2018 super silent, smooth and powerful 1.3 Brose Levo with a Rohloff manual change hub,170 mm Fox 38's 150mm cranks, 9piont8 steering head slacker kit + more. The silence is golden and goodbye derailleurs for me. A brand new spare sealed, updated motor and two 500wh batteries are the go for me.Going backwards with updates gives me what I want until they can come up with something as silent and smooth and reliable. E=mtb².
I Dont think The Pinion Has Much Drag,The Losses Will Come From Running a Belt Drive to to the Massive Tension on it To Make it Work,That is Where the Increased Power Loss Comes From. Chain Drive Has More Losses The More it Gets Worn and Dirt in it All,But A Gearbox Will Have Some internal Resistance Due to The Gears Running in All and interacting All the Time With Each other. Apart From Batteries Getting More Power From Smaller Sizes I Dont See How You Can Reduce the Weight of an Alloy E Bike With a MGU Much More than the 26 KG As the Bike Has to Be made to Take The Loads on it,And Jumping etc.
I think DJI’s Avinox system is going to blow most things out of the water! I’ve got a performance CX on my Pole Voima and never had a problem with it, interested to try the Bosch/TRP drivetrain although they’ll probably only make it compatible with the next gen motor🤦🏼♂️🙄 really dumb move if they do! Wouldn’t buy a bike with a Shimano motor on it, a mates experience of having 3 motors in less than 12 months plus all the comments I’ve read! Good video, nice to see a proper real world side by side test!👍🏻 I did look at the Nicolai but it weighs a lot, 27kg!
My brother has a Yeti e-bike and it weighs that much. It feels like a tank. He swears “you don’t feel the weight” but when I rode it downhill it was full Chonk. It was so heavy to move around.
The Amflow at 20kgs is really going to disrupt the market.
DJI has incredible torque. Pinion should just team up with a existing manufacturer for a better motor and battery technology. The gearbox with a belt is s superior system.
Pinion every day!
The Pinion seems a bit disappointing, especially in terms of noise. I had a bike with a Pinion gearbox and thought it was OK but I still prefer a derailleur.
Thanks for the review and sharing your thoughts. As a viewer though, this is a "Apples to Oranges" comparison at best. As there are several unknown or unstated points making a direct comparison tenable.
Good point! Thanks for your feedback 👍
As an owner of a 2017 Levo, which I have fitted with a Rohloff, I'm convinced internal gearboxes are the future. So the Pinion MGU had instant appeal to me. I'm not sure if your tests really tell us any more than these bikes are different. I do agree with you that version 2 of the Pinion MGU will be the real deal breaker for whether this technology will supersede traditional external cogs and derailleurs.
Some dude in Australia put rohloff on a Levo…. would love such a bike…. I’ve a Merida eOne-Sixty 700 and when it’s time to upgrade (hopefully a year or two away) I will seriously look at Rohloff or Pinion MGU…. these bikes re crazy expensive in Australia
The Nicolai Eboxx MR14 is the bike you should try with Bosch motor Rohloff hub (manual change) belt drive with tucked in front mounted tensioner. Very very good setup. Its a good motor / hub gearbox (totally proven) quiet and no heavier than the MGU.(Goodbye derailleurs.) SERIOUSLY the weight of a Emtb actually gives you stability in the air ,traction and makes the bike feel more planted and comfortable. Depends if you want stability or flickability. Manual change( over electronic) Rohloff hub is far better for Emtb ..I can't notice the tiny bit of extra unsprung hub weight and you wouldn't either. E=mtb²
I like natural feeling of EP8, which is the only motor I’m experienced with… but like idea of Rohloff and belt…. I don’t really do jumps or super sketchy stuff…. Love the downhill bullock trails in my backyard, the Adelaide Hills… also like tech uphill stuff… so range and suspension most important for me, brakes as wel obviously l… as long as not tooo heavy 25-ish kilo is fine…. not fussed with moderate / low levels of noise or rattle…. only other bike I’ve ridden is a turbo levo alloy comp I hired for a week 2 years ago before making a decision to buy a much cheaper Merida eOne-Sixty 700 (still 7½ K Australian) and am more than happy with weight, motor feel, noise etc… just wish I had more range… Rohloff looks very appealing indeed…
@timscarman4599 Have a look at Paul Moirs Rohloff Australia pages. Video Mountain biking with Rohloff .
I also have a Rohloff on a 2018 Merida 13500 km now.They get better with age. E=mtb²
I’m not overly fussed with rattle or sound….. as long as it’s low-ish…. I’m a 54yr old trail explorer in Adelaide Hills, so minimal sketchy shit…. Btw my first even MTB, I’ve always had flat bar road bikes and a recumbent (Bachetta)
I'm curious about range? I've read that the pinion gearbox adds drag. I'm wondering if that drag has a real world measurable impact on battery drain. Otherwise, there is a lot to like with the maintenance wins on the gearbox system.
Sadly we didn’t have enough time to test the range but I think reduced range due to motor drag would make sense
Yes the coffee grinder sound of the MGU would kill the joy of Emtb for me. I've updated my 2018 super silent, smooth and powerful 1.3 Brose Levo with a Rohloff manual change hub,170 mm Fox 38's 150mm cranks, 9piont8 steering head slacker kit + more.
The silence is golden and goodbye derailleurs for me. A brand new spare sealed, updated motor and two 500wh batteries are the go for me.Going backwards with updates gives me what I want until they can come up with something as silent and smooth and reliable. E=mtb².
A spare sealed motor, wow, you are on another level ;)
Rohloff is just as noisy lol
Auto shifting is much better on the cvts like the enviolo
I Dont think The Pinion Has Much Drag,The Losses Will Come From Running a Belt Drive to to the Massive Tension on it To Make it Work,That is Where the Increased Power Loss Comes From.
Chain Drive Has More Losses The More it Gets Worn and Dirt in it All,But A Gearbox Will Have Some internal Resistance Due to The Gears Running in All and interacting All the Time With Each other.
Apart From Batteries Getting More Power From Smaller Sizes I Dont See How You Can Reduce the Weight of an Alloy E Bike With a MGU Much More than the 26 KG As the Bike Has to Be made to Take The Loads on it,And Jumping etc.
Fantastic video Ben
Glad you enjoyed it 👊
Offcourse pinion far away pinion
Pinion owned by Porsche, Who told you that ??
It is not. It was started by 2 ex-porsche engineers and was bought out by BRP 2 years ago.
@@sautez8 My mistake. Thanks for clarifying
@@benro87 Fazua is ex Porsche ingeneers not Pinion
Pinion SUCKS! MGU callibration failure on day one.
Sorry to hear that!