Wemby deserves to win ROTY IMO because the award is mostly about individual performance, rather than team wins. Wemby has been leading in most rookie stats, including points, assists, rebounds, blocks, and steals. Although Chet has also been impressive, and he does helped OKC from being a good team to a great team, but he also has the advantage of playing alongside an MVP type player like SGA and have decent enough pieces around him, making it easier for him to impact his team's wins. On the other hand, Wemby is the best player on his team and had to work harder, especially in the beginning of the season when his teammates didn't know how to pass him the ball. Wemby had Jeremy Sochan and Malaki Branham as PG most of the beginning of the season which is foul for Pop to ever put him in that position dealing with them as his PG in the first place. Wemby to me is the overall better all around player. Yes Chet is the better shooter, but Wemby is better than him in everything else. Shit Wemby is even leading blocks overall in the NBA right now as an rookie.
If the ROTY is an individual award and not a team award i think Victor is leading the charge (more points, assists, rebounds, blocks, steals) while carrying his team as a number one offense and defensive option. If it's like the MVP which heavily leans on stats paired with team record then it's obviously Chet.
@@kayplainsdrifter136 Does it really for ROTY? Because Jalen Williams had the best efficiency last year and he didn't win ROTY, plus it not like Wemby is that far behind Chet in efficiency.
@@dougiedoug8994 i read the efficiency take and my first thought was almost identical. Paulo won it over Keegan Murray even tho Keegan’s team made a big playoff jump and the efficiency was way better. The stats arent as close as Chet and Wemby but efficiency and wins are rarely ROTY pillars
@@justinbires6283 Facts and they keep talking about efficiency, but they don't talk about how Wemby is leading Chet in points, blocks (lead the NBA overall), rebounds, assists, and steals. The only thing Chet got over Wemby is shooting and efficiency.
@dougiedoug8994 JDub was 2nd in ROTY voting despite having a huge deficit in name recognition and narrative. It does matter, but of course these awards are based on a variety of factors that can trend differently from year to year.
Fact: Victor has better stats and Chet has better advanced stats. I would expect that when one is the focus and the other is playing with an MVP candidate. Speculation: If you swapped Victor and Chet, OKC would have a better record and SA would be worse. For those reasons I think Vic should be the ROTY
One guy is contributing on a contending team with an MVP candidate. The other is the focal point of an experiment and is as-advertised, producing. Pound for pound it’s not close who the Victor is.
Enjoyed the show! Wemby is having an incredible rookie year, his DARKO DPM projections are insane. DPM in top 20 as a rookie, Chet is in the 40's. Context matters and Chet is playing with superior teammates in a superior system. He is obviously having a great vear and contributing to winning. I think wh Wembanyama is doing individually with subpar talent and currently not a good system is amazing and some of the most advanced numbers show it particularly when playing with an actually PG in The Jones. His defensive impact is incredible. I think he would have just as efficient numbers as Chet if he replaced him at okc and I based on his DARKO projects he would contribute even more to winning. I compared his current trajectory in DARKO to current nba great and he is outpacing everyone I've researched, even rivaling Tim Duncan's rookie year. I believe if he stays relatively healthy he will be a top 10 player all time. For me rookie of the year is about what rookie was the most outstanding not necessarily who contributed most to winning. Chet is fortunate to be on a winning team after missing rookie season; a team that has an mvp candidate and great role players. Wemby is sort of doing everything himself and is still incredible. I don't see ROY about winning, most great players come into losing situations/ chet didn't and he has done well, good for him. Also, looking back in the years to come I think it will seem obvious that wemby should have had the ROY if Chet wins because of basic efficiency stats. Wemby is the superior player already when given even a modicum of competency at PG.
to be clear, I'd rather have Vic than Chet long-term. Not all that tough of a choice in my mind. I also think people are overestimating a bit where Vic is as a shooter right now and his ability to actually get position and absorb contact through his lower half. Don't think he'd be as efficient as Chet is right now in OKC if you put him in OKC. Chet is a level ahead of him as a shooter right now, and he takes contact a bit better around the rim when crowded. Think Chet's offense remains a good distance ahead
@@GameTheoryPodcastwSamVecenie I agree he doesn’t gain/hold position well, his shooting has been very spotty on the perimeter (often rushing shots). Since the minutes restriction he has become a bit more efficient, but not significantly. Chet is the better shooter and so far the more efficient offensive player. I think in OKC Wemby’s passing numbers would improve as well as his tov %; he would have more space to operate and be delivered the ball in adv positions. Both are fantastic rookies; I look forward to the 2nd half of the season and your coverage! Thank you for the reply!
EPM, BPM, and RAPM say it's not close, Darko thinks it's not close in the other direction (Wemby better), and LEBRON think it's close. Personally I'm a RAPM guy so I'd go with Chet but I think people are probably not paying attention to the dramatic shift that occurred once he switched to center. A flaw with pretty much all all-in-one-stats is that they do not directly account for and separately track changes in player role, but usually it doesn't matter much because very few players persistently play two different roles when they are much better at one than the other (like Wemby with C vs PF).
Per 36 mins (possible All-Star) Paolo Banchero 23.6ppg 7.3reb 5ast 1.2stl .6blk 1.6threes 3.4TO 45.8/38.1/70.3 splits 54.7% true shooting 29.4% usage +1.1 emp (93rd). Anthony Edwards per 36 mins 27.2ppg 5.5reb 5ast 1.4stl .6blk 2.6threes 3.6TO 46/38.8/84.5 splits 58.1% TS 32.8% usage +4 epm (19th). Jalen Williams per 36 stats 20.7ppg 4.7reb 5ast 1.2stl .6blk 1.5threes 2.1TO 54.7/44.6/83.1 splits 63.5% TS 22.1% usage +3.5 epm (30th) and does not care about how many shots he gets just wins. My hot take is that JDubs ceiling is higher than both of them and he’s the most slept on player in the league by far most recent 2k ratings update couple days ago he’s an 82, Paolo 87 and Ant 90 and Ringer ranks Ant 17th, Paolo 44th and JDub 57th
OKC fans man...we get it your players are good.... comparing Paolo to JDub is insane. Paolos responsibilities are two fold, and he's not surrounded by any elite shooter other than Suggs (who is a career below avg shooter). JDub is on one of the best rosters in the NBA... stop with the glazing
@@MK3504 What roster you are on doesn’t determine a players upside necessarily that’s just flawed logic. They are at least on the same level right now ppl just don’t recognize it because of biases. Im not just an Okc fan I’ve watched like 1/3rd of Magic games too and went to one live and think Paolo should legit make the All-Star team if Magic keep good record and he keeps playing well but that doesn’t mean I have to think he’s way better than JDub and way higher upside which is what 99% of NBA fans (non Thunder) and even media people believe and I just don’t think it’s true… like at all
@@MK3504 Also last 11 games JDub in only 31.1mpg averaging 21ppg 4.5reb 5.5ast 1.2stl .9blk 2.2TO 2threes 65.5/61.1/73 splits +118 👀 23.2% usage. Paolo nor Ant are capable of making some of the advanced passes, or having the consistency of shooting touch he has displayed over this stretch and I question if JDub is the best athlete of the 3 i’m leaning towards yes
@@bkelly625 haha, but you were the one posting stats, including EPM. Are you saying that your team does not influence your stats? For being a first round pick, we haven't had one national game yet, instead we get to watch Wemby layup bricks. For being the number one pick, he's pretty slept on, I know a lot of analyst's and fans who know about JDub. Again why post stats if you think they have no bearing on someone's potential? And roster fit determines way more than you seem to imply.
@@bkelly625 you haven't watched many magic games if you don't realize one of Paolos biggest strengths, his play making. It's clear that you are a fanboy, and no problem. JDub is awesome, but to say that Paolo doesn't have the capability to make the same passes you clearly don't watch Magic basketball. I don't blame you but God damn admit your biased at least
Vecine is such a Wemby hater. It's disgusting. Chet gets rewarded for getting drafted to a team with an MVP. Congrats to Chet being the 3rd option and shooting wide open shots and having guys create for him. Sucks that's Wemby has to do everything on his own, and now he has to even play point center.
Did ROTY ever be about team wins though? Chet is impressive, but let be forreal, yes Chet help a good team to become great, but Chet also benefited to have someone like SGA on his team as well and being the 3rd option on that team meanwhile Wemby is the Spurs best player and the 1st option as a rookie with nobody on the same level as SGA on his team. Chet is in a way better situation now than Wemby is with the Spurs, but Wemby still leads Chet in points, blocks, steals, assists and rebounds.
You dont follow the spurs because if you did you would know that Josh Richardson and Jakob Poeltl were hard carrying last year. We traded all our veterans away this season.
Wemby deserves to win ROTY IMO because the award is mostly about individual performance, rather than team wins. Wemby has been leading in most rookie stats, including points, assists, rebounds, blocks, and steals. Although Chet has also been impressive, and he does helped OKC from being a good team to a great team, but he also has the advantage of playing alongside an MVP type player like SGA and have decent enough pieces around him, making it easier for him to impact his team's wins. On the other hand, Wemby is the best player on his team and had to work harder, especially in the beginning of the season when his teammates didn't know how to pass him the ball. Wemby had Jeremy Sochan and Malaki Branham as PG most of the beginning of the season which is foul for Pop to ever put him in that position dealing with them as his PG in the first place. Wemby to me is the overall better all around player. Yes Chet is the better shooter, but Wemby is better than him in everything else. Shit Wemby is even leading blocks overall in the NBA right now as an rookie.
If the ROTY is an individual award and not a team award i think Victor is leading the charge (more points, assists, rebounds, blocks, steals) while carrying his team as a number one offense and defensive option. If it's like the MVP which heavily leans on stats paired with team record then it's obviously Chet.
Efficiency matters.
@@kayplainsdrifter136 Does it really for ROTY? Because Jalen Williams had the best efficiency last year and he didn't win ROTY, plus it not like Wemby is that far behind Chet in efficiency.
@@dougiedoug8994 i read the efficiency take and my first thought was almost identical. Paulo won it over Keegan Murray even tho Keegan’s team made a big playoff jump and the efficiency was way better. The stats arent as close as Chet and Wemby but efficiency and wins are rarely ROTY pillars
@@justinbires6283 Facts and they keep talking about efficiency, but they don't talk about how Wemby is leading Chet in points, blocks (lead the NBA overall), rebounds, assists, and steals. The only thing Chet got over Wemby is shooting and efficiency.
@dougiedoug8994 JDub was 2nd in ROTY voting despite having a huge deficit in name recognition and narrative. It does matter, but of course these awards are based on a variety of factors that can trend differently from year to year.
Fact: Victor has better stats and Chet has better advanced stats. I would expect that when one is the focus and the other is playing with an MVP candidate.
Speculation: If you swapped Victor and Chet, OKC would have a better record and SA would be worse.
For those reasons I think Vic should be the ROTY
One guy is contributing on a contending team with an MVP candidate.
The other is the focal point of an experiment and is as-advertised, producing.
Pound for pound it’s not close who the Victor is.
Enjoyed the show! Wemby is having an incredible rookie year, his DARKO DPM projections are insane. DPM in top 20 as a rookie, Chet is in the 40's. Context matters and Chet is playing with superior teammates in a superior system. He is obviously having a great vear and contributing to winning. I think wh Wembanyama is doing individually with subpar talent and currently not a good system is amazing and some of the most advanced numbers show it particularly when playing with an actually PG in The Jones. His defensive impact is incredible. I think he would have just as efficient numbers as Chet if he replaced him at okc and I based on his DARKO projects he would contribute even more to winning. I compared his current trajectory in DARKO to current nba great and he is outpacing everyone I've researched, even rivaling Tim Duncan's rookie year. I believe if he stays relatively healthy he will be a top 10 player all time. For me rookie of the year is about what rookie was the most outstanding not necessarily who contributed most to winning. Chet is fortunate to be on a winning team after missing rookie season; a team that has an mvp candidate and great role players. Wemby is sort of doing everything himself and is still incredible. I don't see ROY about winning, most great players come into losing situations/ chet didn't and he has done well, good for him. Also, looking back in the years to come I think it will seem obvious that wemby should have had the ROY if Chet wins because of basic efficiency stats. Wemby is the superior player already when given even a modicum of competency at PG.
to be clear, I'd rather have Vic than Chet long-term. Not all that tough of a choice in my mind.
I also think people are overestimating a bit where Vic is as a shooter right now and his ability to actually get position and absorb contact through his lower half. Don't think he'd be as efficient as Chet is right now in OKC if you put him in OKC. Chet is a level ahead of him as a shooter right now, and he takes contact a bit better around the rim when crowded. Think Chet's offense remains a good distance ahead
@@GameTheoryPodcastwSamVecenie I agree he doesn’t gain/hold position well, his shooting has been very spotty on the perimeter (often rushing shots). Since the minutes restriction he has become a bit more efficient, but not significantly. Chet is the better shooter and so far the more efficient offensive player. I think in OKC Wemby’s passing numbers would improve as well as his tov %; he would have more space to operate and be delivered the ball in adv positions. Both are fantastic rookies; I look forward to the 2nd half of the season and your coverage! Thank you for the reply!
Thoughts on Nick Smith Jr next pod? Hes getting more minutes
CAM!
I'm fine with saying chet is better than wemby, but saying its not close ? cmon...
EPM, BPM, and RAPM say it's not close, Darko thinks it's not close in the other direction (Wemby better), and LEBRON think it's close. Personally I'm a RAPM guy so I'd go with Chet but I think people are probably not paying attention to the dramatic shift that occurred once he switched to center. A flaw with pretty much all all-in-one-stats is that they do not directly account for and separately track changes in player role, but usually it doesn't matter much because very few players persistently play two different roles when they are much better at one than the other (like Wemby with C vs PF).
He said "landslide", meaning in favour of Holmgren. Wow.
Per 36 mins (possible All-Star) Paolo Banchero 23.6ppg 7.3reb 5ast 1.2stl .6blk 1.6threes 3.4TO 45.8/38.1/70.3 splits 54.7% true shooting 29.4% usage +1.1 emp (93rd). Anthony Edwards per 36 mins 27.2ppg 5.5reb 5ast 1.4stl .6blk 2.6threes 3.6TO 46/38.8/84.5 splits 58.1% TS 32.8% usage +4 epm (19th). Jalen Williams per 36 stats 20.7ppg 4.7reb 5ast 1.2stl .6blk 1.5threes 2.1TO 54.7/44.6/83.1 splits 63.5% TS 22.1% usage +3.5 epm (30th) and does not care about how many shots he gets just wins. My hot take is that JDubs ceiling is higher than both of them and he’s the most slept on player in the league by far most recent 2k ratings update couple days ago he’s an 82, Paolo 87 and Ant 90 and Ringer ranks Ant 17th, Paolo 44th and JDub 57th
OKC fans man...we get it your players are good.... comparing Paolo to JDub is insane. Paolos responsibilities are two fold, and he's not surrounded by any elite shooter other than Suggs (who is a career below avg shooter). JDub is on one of the best rosters in the NBA... stop with the glazing
@@MK3504 What roster you are on doesn’t determine a players upside necessarily that’s just flawed logic. They are at least on the same level right now ppl just don’t recognize it because of biases. Im not just an Okc fan I’ve watched like 1/3rd of Magic games too and went to one live and think Paolo should legit make the All-Star team if Magic keep good record and he keeps playing well but that doesn’t mean I have to think he’s way better than JDub and way higher upside which is what 99% of NBA fans (non Thunder) and even media people believe and I just don’t think it’s true… like at all
@@MK3504 Also last 11 games JDub in only 31.1mpg averaging 21ppg 4.5reb 5.5ast 1.2stl .9blk 2.2TO 2threes 65.5/61.1/73 splits +118 👀 23.2% usage. Paolo nor Ant are capable of making some of the advanced passes, or having the consistency of shooting touch he has displayed over this stretch and I question if JDub is the best athlete of the 3 i’m leaning towards yes
@@bkelly625 haha, but you were the one posting stats, including EPM. Are you saying that your team does not influence your stats? For being a first round pick, we haven't had one national game yet, instead we get to watch Wemby layup bricks. For being the number one pick, he's pretty slept on, I know a lot of analyst's and fans who know about JDub. Again why post stats if you think they have no bearing on someone's potential? And roster fit determines way more than you seem to imply.
@@bkelly625 you haven't watched many magic games if you don't realize one of Paolos biggest strengths, his play making. It's clear that you are a fanboy, and no problem. JDub is awesome, but to say that Paolo doesn't have the capability to make the same passes you clearly don't watch Magic basketball. I don't blame you but God damn admit your biased at least
This is the Chet glazing episode 😂
Cam Whitmore is the best Rockets draft pick in the last 20 years.
Sengun?
For me, G-League with their money are ruining prospects. Those players would be much better playing in college and overseas.
Wemby is CLEARLY better than Chet!!! WTF have I just listened to...
Vecine is such a Wemby hater. It's disgusting. Chet gets rewarded for getting drafted to a team with an MVP. Congrats to Chet being the 3rd option and shooting wide open shots and having guys create for him. Sucks that's Wemby has to do everything on his own, and now he has to even play point center.
Spurs losing more with Wemby and Thunder winning more with Chet. Spurs net rating is historically low with him. He makes the players around him worse.
Lol I think we spent like 20 minutes this episode talking about how great Wemby is. What a wild take lmao
Vecine had an entire episode on how great wemby will be.
Spurs are worse year ovr year with Wemby. thunder better year over year with Chet. Plus Spurs bottom dwelling net rating with Wemby.
Did ROTY ever be about team wins though? Chet is impressive, but let be forreal, yes Chet help a good team to become great, but Chet also benefited to have someone like SGA on his team as well and being the 3rd option on that team meanwhile Wemby is the Spurs best player and the 1st option as a rookie with nobody on the same level as SGA on his team. Chet is in a way better situation now than Wemby is with the Spurs, but Wemby still leads Chet in points, blocks, steals, assists and rebounds.
You dont follow the spurs because if you did you would know that Josh Richardson and Jakob Poeltl were hard carrying last year. We traded all our veterans away this season.
stat sheet boy... watch the games. This is a dumb take.