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hey plainlydifficult, i wanted to throw this out there for you so you knew for possible future videos! the korean surname “Choi” is actually pronounced as “Chweh”, as its spelled with the letter that sounds like -weh and not the letters that make “-o -i”. thank you for the awesome videos!
I was unsubbed from your channel and you are one of my absolute favourites. Don't know why...just want you to know it happened in case something weird is happening. Heard of problems like this before. Love, love, LOVE your content!
I have to say, the driver of the second train handled the whole thing so poorly. Obviously the fire wasn’t his fault but by the sounds of things, he only seemed to think about his own safety and no one else’s
It strikes me, that the two train operators weren't the only ones negligent. Fire alarms ignored? No emergency lighting? Inadequate or non existent fire suppression systems? Pasengers not able to open the train doors (there's a reason why trains where I live have levers allowing anyone inside to unlock the doors and force them open manualy as well as hammers to break windows)? Train advised to enter the station "cautiously" because of a fire instead of stopping it way ahead of the station? I'd like to know why the two operators were the only ones aside from the arsonist to be jailed.
Yeah, even on Houston's light rail lines there is an emergency lever that disengages the door opening system and allows the doors to be forced open by hand.
You’re right. Aside from (possibly) those ancient subway cars that were still running under Broad Street in Philadelphia in the 1980s, every train I’ve been on has had instructions for passengers on how to open doors and emergency window exits. Heck, here in the SF Bay Area, the instructions are written in English, Spanish, Chinese, Vietnamese and anything else that will fit on the decal.
@@MightyMezzo Instructions are just in English and Spanish here, though signs at polling stations are in Vietnamese countywide, and in Chinese and Korean in parts of town. But not in any South Asian languages, because most of them are somewhat competent in English already.
My ( US ) subway line has no emergency exit that passengers can operate. None. And the windows are made to be unbreakable. Also - no fire alarms. Its a deathtrap.
After this disaster, South Korean subway always teach us how to survive from subway fire, how to open the door, the location of fire extinguishers, and how to get out. It shows from subway commercial screen, boards, and station entrances. This incident was a big shock to South Koreans.
Is there any measure in place to make sure people don't transport highly infla- mable stuff? I do live in the antipodes of South Korea,and we're stunned such thing can be carried by hand in a sub car. Unsure about enforcement, tough
@@SassyyjuicyMaria He had two milk cartons filled with something flammable. To prevent this, they would have had to inspect everybody carrying groceries. For a city subway, I find that level of security impossibly time consuming and burdensome. Itwould likely mean most people wouldn't ride the subway.
I have been living here in Daegu for almost 11 years. They have a whole "theme park" here based on this tragedy. Part of the park involves watching an intense video showing what it would have been like (recreation of phone calls and reading of actual messages sent). Then you go into the basement where they have the burnout car and burnt lockers. The final part is a simulated fire on the subway car to help teach you how to escape. The whole place fills with smoke and you need to get out of the car and then out of the "subway" through the fire doors. It was one of the most intense things I have ever done.
Where is this? I lived there for 4 years and never heard of this. I go back every couple years to see the inlaws, and this is something I would like to see. What's it called?
Kinda surprised you didn't mention the other Daegu Metro disaster that happened in 1995 when the 1st line was still under construction. A gas pipeline was accidentally punctured and leaked into a nearby construction site where it ignited and 101 people died. 42 of which, were middle schoolers.
I've been to south korea. Something odd I noticed about their metros is the presence of many fire extinguishers, emergency flashlights mounted on walls, and even glass stands or cubbies in walls containing advanced equipment such as SCBAs, respirators, and firefighting garmets. I wonder if this equipment was added to stations as a result of this, and how truly effective it (specifically the respirators and more advanced fire fighting equipment) would be at preventing death from fire/inhalation, and in aiding persons within the station to fight the fire.
A lot of subways are designated disaster/bomb shelters too. If war with the north ever pops off Seoul will be the first hit so the city is constantly prepared
The two most critical aspects of any fire procedure are raising the alarm and evacuating the affected premises. These are really time-critical. The first requires staff training and installation of fire alarms; and the second requires the provision of suitable emergency exits and clear signage. The fire extinguishers are a good idea, provided that the fire allows time for a trained member of staff or passenger to use it, and is small enough to be doused by a single extinguisher. Emergency breathing apparatus requires specialist training, so I wonder if it was provided for fire crews to use if needed.
I lived in Seoul for two years. I also noticed and was confused by the cabinets with “smoke escape hoods” as I believe they were labelled. I always wondered exactly what they were, how they were supposed to work, and whether they’d do any good.
This feels like Seawohl ferry. Those in charge of the transport told people to stay put, left before their passengers, and let the exits be blocked by the disaster. Also both had trouble or unwillingness to report the problem when something could be done about it. Leading to death in cramped spaces.
Both disasters were indeed born from the same issues. Worst part is there is actually video footage taken by one of the students who were onboard the ferry telling her friends, when they kept receiving the order to stay put, that the crew are probably saving themselves. She mentioned this specific subway fire as a reference. She probably only meant it in jest but yeah... Edit: Sewol in particular is infuriating because the listing of the ship happened so slowly initially that they had plenty of time to evacuate everyone. In fact maritime experts have commented this was about as ideal a situation you could be in with a sinking ship: close to the coast, more than enough time to evacuate the passengers and crew and plenty of other ships and boats nearby which could assist. There was even a US Navy ship, which literally has the capacity and personnel to perform rescue operations on sinking ships, nearby. Yet their assistance was denied. Even the Japanese coast guard offered its assistance but they were also turned down. Yeah, it's incredibly infuriating. Especially since a similar situation also happened with Costa Concordia, where the passengers were also told to stay put, but since obedience culture isn't really a major thing in the western world most of the passengers still decided to muster at the life raft stations and get off the ship ASAP. And the Italian coast guard wasn't busy turning away everyone's help either.
He had to ask what to do? The thing goes forward and backward. I could understand slowing for a routine stop, but I don't understand fully stopping once you see the fire, yet alone "let me ask someone what I should do first." Unbelievable.
@@AaronShenghao From the sounds of things, the fire was already very visible ahead. Brake hard and stop before the station. Then ask about backing up away from it further.
responsibility is one of the most feared stuff for most people, add the militaristic nature of that country and the traditionally stratified society and you get this, when you need an order to run from a fire, and do anything useful on your own is almost impossible.
There's a wide range of individual freedom between "always do what you're told" and "do whatever you want." Asian and Middle Eastern culture tend to fall closer to the "do what you're told" side, while Western cultures tend to fall closer to the "do whatever you want" side. Which is better varies with situation. There's no single optimal solution. Sometimes "do what you're told" is better (e.g. the pandemic). Sometimes "do whatever you want" is better (e.g. capitalism). So no matter which level of individual freedom you pick, there will always be situations where it's non-optimal. But I do believe that *on average* the Western levels of individual freedom come closer to the happier medium than Asian levels.
It's usually there because of 1 of 2 reasons 1; they didn't realize someone would be stupid enough to to do the thing (ie electronics in the tub) or 2; it wasn't first added to cut costs and was only added to stop public outrage
I'm surprised that point didn't come up again, after he first mentioned it. Like, what do you mean, they "ignored" fire alarms being pulled? That's like seeing a bunch of cars speeding by and trying to cross the road, anyways. Simply staggering.
In any other country, they probably wouldn’t have been charged at all. The fact that they actually were charged convicted and imprisoned is amazing to the years of an American
@@neilkurzman4907 They weren't. the only people charged where the arsonist and the two train drivers. The staff that ignored the alarms and directed the second train into the station went completely unprosecuted.
Another disaster I'd missed. I was a first responder at the Kings Cross fire and 7/7 also others. I was on my way to work on 7/7, and was told to go to the nearest Underground station, where my PPE would be waiting. Dreadful day, the bomber was atomised.
The bigger question is: Why was the operator advised to enter the station cautiously because of the fire rather than to stop the train ahead of the station and wait for the fire alarm to be investigated?
It is likely that doing so would trip a train protection system, thus potentially immobilizing the train for a period of time in a position where escape would not be possible. The bigger question is why the decision was made to give the driver authority to enter the station under caution, and why the driver did not stop before entering.
@@JaidenJimenez86 Shouldn't all trains have a manual override allowing the train oeprator to move the train in an emergency despite the objections of any train protection system? After all, the train operator bears the ultimate responsibility for the train and its passengers, therfore they must also have final authority over its operation.
Great presentation on a terrible situation... Sounded a little too familiar... NOT Jon's fault, obviously... It's just depressing how he's covered other incidents so similar before... AND what about those Subway Staff IGNORING FIRE ALARMS???!!! I'm a little bit pissed that they'd throw the figurative book at the driver who obviously screwed up and then panicked... Understandable for locking people in a train, failing to think on his feet entirely, and then abandoning them to die... BUT he just lost his sh*t... Panic can do that to a person, and there's almost no possible way to prepare someone for when they face their moment of truth. BUT NOTHING to the Subway Staff for IGNORING the Fire Alarms going off right, left, and center??? Did anyone AT LEAST get some retraining??? How the F*CK do you justify ignoring an alarm? You don't even send someone down to physically take a LOOK, and see if there's no fire or smoke??? Sure, I'm aware of mischief and false alarms. That's why you pass a security guard a walkie-talkie and send him for a "Look-see"... JUST look. If it's really nothing, he can stop for coffee on his way back, pick up some donuts or french fries... or whatever the equivalent is in South Korea. THEN you can write it off and shut it down... You DO NOT EVER IGNORE A FIRE ALARM!!! GOD... That's pissed me off a LOT more than it probably should. ;o)
@@MightyMezzo Oh, there probably was. It happens all over the U.S., and I suspect largely because nobody likes enforcing the laws with actual consequences... BUT that's entirely why there's more than one person "monitoring" behind the scenes. When an alarm goes off and you don't see anything on the monitors, you SEND SOMEONE to physically check... I've been physical security... I've always just grabbed a walkie-talkie and flashlight, told my shift-buddy to sit at the screens for a bit, and headed out to see what's what... UNLESS of course my shift-buddy decided he needed a walk about more than I did... AND whoever went to look picked up sodas or snacks or whatever on the way back in most places. The one thing I've NEVER done is just ignore it or shut it off without going... Not ever. Kids do dumb sh*t like that to get a rise out of adults... Criminals use alarms for distractions and all... animals chew on electrical lines and piss on sensors... Any number of things can send a false alarm, but if you DON'T go look for yourself to be SURE, then YOU get to live with burning someone's grandma up in her sleep... all screaming to hell and flailing the whole time... because you just couldn't be bothered... I (for one) am NOT going to live with that. ;o)
This is absolutely appalling. How can you have train drivers that don't know what to do in the event of a fire. Didn't anyone in Korea ever hear about the King's Cross fire? I started working on the London Underground a couple of years after the King's Cross fire and we had safety drummed into us every day, what to do in an emergency and what not to do. Fires underground are very very dangerous it can take only a matter of seconds to completely fill a platform with smoke and then people are going to struggle to escape and die. I would have jailed whoever was in charge of okaying the trains to be made out of inflammable materials.😢
I attended school in South Africa, when learning british history, kings cross fire is the first on the list to learn, I'm a big fan of the uk and visit there frequently as for I'm an organist playing all over England, Scotland and Wales, in churches, halls and theatres etc
The King's Cross fire was shocking at the time. I recall reading that trains were still arriving and feeding more people into an inferno. But also that the trains were pushing a lot of air up the escalators
If the guy isn't a buffoon, such tragedies can become inspiring stories of survival and escape. Quick thinking and coordinated action saves the day. Few lives are lost when many could have been.
It's incidents like these that make me rather wary of underground railways, even my first time through the Channel Tunnel back in the early 90s scared the hell out of me (and then, a year or so later, fire happened in there!), I know it's one-in-a-million chances of such things happening today, but, you never know when you might win that particular lottery...
It’s because this channel that I am too. I also don’t want to go in any building over three stories, and I never wanna fly in an airplane and I really don’t wanna ride any trains of any kind ever.
The standards for fire protection in rolling stock have become much more stringent since then, especially when it comes to trains in long tunnels. However, they only apply to new rolling stock and modifications.
Thing is, these events always lead to changes and optimizations. You are so, so much more likely to be killed in a street accident (without any chance to avoid it). Yes, a lot of people died. But most likely more people die in traffic accidents in the same area each month. And nothing really changes.
@@PlainlyDifficult I found your channel about two months ago after searching disasters. I am finally caught up on all of the episodes. Between you and Fascinating Horror, I know about all of them.
Korean culture is very respectful of authority, even when they definately shouldn't be (MV Sewol and Korean Air Cargo 8509 are two other extreme examples). Something I'd dearly like to know: did the train have a "trip cock stop" or similar? if so then I can understand why the driver didn't continue through the station at least.
I remember watching a video and it was showing the Sowel ferry it had tilted and one of the high school girls was talking to another girl and she made reference to this disaster and unfortunately her and her friend she was talkin to perished on the Sowel.
@@Heizenberg32 This is why I support the death penalty, but only for minor crimes. Death penalty is a useless deterrent against murderers, but it sure would stop false alarm pullers and litterbugs. And why not? False alarm pranksters helped kill these people.
@@Heizenberg32 I'd accept that if it were one, two, or maybe even three within a few minutes (some schmuck and a friend or two running from alarm to alarm), but we're talking SEVERAL people pulling SEVERAL alarms in a rather short timespan. How does anyone mistake that for 'a stupid prankster'?
5 years for bad decisions, not criminal intent. Frankly, for those sorts of people, even just 1 year is enough. These weren't people who intentionally did horrible deeds, these were regular people who didn't know WTF to do, and those poor choices lead to a horrific outcome. The guilt alone of knowing what their poor actions resulting is far more punishment than any system could give out. No need for them to rot in jail when they should be out doing community service.
@@FranNyan given the nature of South Korean society, they would be shunned and ostracised by people who knew them. Social inclusion is a massive part of the culture so being shunned in a such a way is more punishment than a jail sentence.
@@FranNyan Americans think that prison exists as a way to torture individuals on behalf of the government. They want the individuals to be tortured and want the "bad people" to go to hell to be further tortured, they don't like the idea of hell only being a temporary destination to cleanse one's sins before they go into paradise once they were genuinely regretful about their actions, they want the individuals to be tortured long after the sun turns into a red giant & swallows the planet. That's not a shocking statement given that a lot of parents and grandparents would force their teenage daughter or grand daughter to carry a baby to full term just to punish their daughter or grand daughter when nobody in that family wants the baby. Imagine being alive at the age of 30 & stuck in a dead end job with costly health complications to have your mother be honest by telling you that the only reason you're alive in the first place is that her parents or grandparents wanted your existence to punish your mother.
It's silly how much we take for granted these days when it comes to safety equipment and our everyday lives. Check out some roadside barrier advancements John, they're really cool if they're done right.
I just wanted to take a moment to appreciate the guys in their hazmat suits and hi-viz vests just going to work at 4:40. If it weren't for these folks, there would be fewer disasters on this channel. Hats off.
These metro fires and several domestic terrorist attacks as well as Tokyo metro gas attacks where cited when Shanghai Metro (and several other metro in Chinese cities) introduced baggage security check at metro station. (Similar to airport security check pre-911), they only check bags to make sure you are not brining knives/flammable liquid. Fire fighting equipment are everywhere and emergency train door (and screen door) release are available throughout the metro.
Yeah, I felt very safe when using the metro in both Shanghai and Beijing while visiting China a few times between late 2006 and summer of 2010. The metro there felt both cleaner and safer than when I went to London in 2004, or even the metro where I lived at the time of my trips to China (I lived in Copenhagen at that time), not to mention that the Chinese metro felt a lot safer than the metro in Stockholm here in Sweden! The Stockholm metro system does feel like a death trap at times because the stations are very old and cramped, some are very deep underground and there are no barriers between platforms and tracks so it does happen that people fall down onto the tracks either by accident or get pushed off the platform by someone. The elevators are beyond tiny and the path between elevator and platform is so narrow that you can't go past another wheelchair or pram inside the path so the one waiting to board the elevator has to back out of the path (only to usually see the elevator door close and elevator leave, then rinse and repeat unless a kind soul who doesn't have any mobility aid or pram can hold the elevator for you) and I don't even dare to think about having to evacuate the station if something happens in the metro in Stockholm because of this. I'm a wheelchair user, thankfully ambulatory so I can if I have to, use the escalator and just have my chair in front of me or even go up an escalator while sitting in my chair, I can even walk in stairs if absolutely needed and just drag my chair up or down said stairs. But far from every wheelchair user has that level of mobility, a fair few are ambulatory to some extent, but many are also completely reliant on their chair to get around. So yeah, Stockholm metro does make me feel a bit uneasy because it's so poorly planned, old and just doesn't feel safe even under normal circumstances
I watch so many of these various "disaster" channels and yours is leagues ahead. I know the topic will be well researched and explained with graphics and technical explanations. And i like knowing the weather in your corner of London. Plus im really high
Tell me you don't know about emergency signalling without telling me you don't know about emergency signalling In an emergency the entire line is shut down, the trains cannot move freely Plus the last thing you need is the second train catching on fire then breaking down in a tunnel
@@amogusisntfunny1464hat’s not what he said happened here though. rewatch that section…he stopped the train hisself, it wasn’t stopped for him. Tell me you don’t know how to listen without telling me.
@tiasky3438 he was told by the dispatcher to approach at caution, this means the next signal was danger, i.e a stop signal, meaning it would have stopped the train if it tried to go through anyway
This accident also shocked entire Mainland China's metro system. For example, Beijing Subway from then on banned lots of "unnecessary" things with potential fire risks, like in-station convenient stores, horizontal escalators, causing lots of inconvenience. Also all underground metro stations have to get at least 2 independent station exits (and every seperate concourse needs to have their own dedicated exit). Causing lots of station opening being postponed.
I read ”A selfish act” and had expected something totally different ….🤬 But as always a very good video. After a few days of slightly warm weather we in W Seden experience some +25 in the shadows 🥵
This is one of the most senseless careless combination of bad decisions and inactions as I think any other thing I've heard you present. So many chances for this to be much less of a disaster. Then there is the infrastructure changes. But just the chain of inaction and incorrect action is mindbogglingly sad.
Unfortunately this lack of "decisiveness" is a rampant aspect of Korean and even Northeast Asian societies with its extreme deference to authority figures and lack/fear of taking initiative. Respect for higher ups is embedded in Korean culture and even its language. Almost no one takes initiative and almost everyone follows orders. This is the major reason that Northeast Asian societies are orderly. There is an oft quoted saying which I'm paraphrasing from Northeast Asia: "The nail which sticks out gets hammered down". Order and harmony above all else. You're not paid to think; your betters are thinking and you only need to follow orders. There have been numerous mass tragedies, but the one I want to highlight is the 2014 Sewol Ferry Disaster where 306 (mostly students) died. The Captain of the sinking ferry told the students to do nothing and remain, condemning them to death. This Captain was the first off the boat when rescuers arrived. The authorities on the scene took no initiative as they were waiting on orders and referred to manuals on how to react. Thinking out of the box is not a strong Northeast Asian trait. No, there were no procedures for a sinking ferry on its side. The rescuers were paralyzed. No one took the initiative of entering the ferry to help students escape. They just waited and waited and waited for higher authority figures to make a decision, which they didn't as they were just as paralyzed as the "rescuers". The ferry sank in front of the rescuers and authority while paralyzed in indecision. They later claimed everyone was rescued which was a bald faced lie.
Shin Godzilla, of all things, criticizes this. During the first act there's an extremely slow response and the gets monster rampage freely because the bureaucracy is tying itself in knots due to the lack of protocol for such a situation. That first act is specifically a criticism of the way the Fukushima disaster was handled by the way.
It's also a problem in China, Japan, and basically any country where an oppressive class (whether it be of employment, race, age, etc.) demands absolute obedience from those under their control. It's to the point where aviation regulatory bodies have to emphasize CRM training harder than ever in such countries. Unquestioning loyalty kills.
For people saying “why the second train stopped next to a burning train?” It’s not always possible to just “not stop” because trains have Automatic train control or train stop system. The driver however can overwrite the system if needed after stopping, that usually needs control center authorization. He is negligent for not opening the doors even when power was cut… Control center shouldn’t let the driver to continue into station (reverse back) or change signal to green and tell the driver not stopping that station. I’m surprised no one there was also penalized.
It sounds a bit more like the drivers were used as scapegoats and the real fault there is on the bigger fish... lacking regulations, poor train construction, and poor overall emergency training. Drivers would only be at fault if they had an emergency protocol and did not follow it. Otherwise, anyone in that situation would panic and not know what would be the best course of action.
Unbelievable that the second conductor stopped the train instead of just passing through the station, which is probably what most people would do in that situation. Why in the world did he stop next to the burning train?!
To be fair it does seem like the drivers were mostly to blame. It wasn't a manager that pulled the train up to an already burning train and then left the doors shut but then saved himself and left the passenges to burn. But up to a point you could be right because maybe thier training could have been better and there should been extinguishers on the train so mabe managers should gone to jail for that.
@@voivod6871it literally was like management that ordered the 2nd train to pull into the station when they could’ve made it wait outside while they deal with the fire. Also they ignored fire alarms being triggered by passengers at the station.
"So we've fitted this fancy fire alarm system with alert points across the station" "Excellent, what should we do if someone presses one?" "Oh just ignore it"
4:40 And apparently two of those passengers saw it fit to be sporting full hazmat haha. Yea that'll keep the populous calm, just casually walking into a metro system wearing that. Maybe a third hazzie too, if that white one on the right with no human face is a hazmat... but I think that's an ancient alien astronaut, who timejumped there to save the guy in blue dangerously eyeballing the tracks. These Where's-Waldo scenes always get me going lol. -edit: 11:57 Ok I see you entered my nightmares there, tread carefully, it feels like Canada in the South Park series....
WTF there were people inside a burning train and the driver first closed the door and later left without ensuring the doors were open. This is the kinda dumb shit which if would have happened here in India we would have said "see these are the reasons why we are still a third world country, we have a long way to go."
Many people are talking about the 2nd train should just go past. I'm not entirely sure if that would have worked. From the sound of it, the train depends on power from the tracks to move, which was cut not long after. It is perfectly possible that the train will end up being trapped in the tunnel which will then cause everyone to die from smoke inhalation/suffocation--remember, tunnels require train movement for air circulation. It is possible that it could get far enough away to prevent this, but that would be no less a gamble of just trying to let the passengers off at the station. Keeping the door closed and trapping them is, ofc, a worse decision than both of the above options.
Think TH-cam unsubscribed me from your channel! No idea why. Realised I hadn't got a post for a while today 😕 ...was worried something had happened to you that might've interrupted your regular posts! Followed you for around 2yrs. Fantastic videos! I've complained. Letting you know, just in case...you are one of my favourite creators. Both music and mini docs. Please keep up the awesome work! Hope this isn't a running theme. You deserve better.
What i took from this video is that Korea opens its shops later. If it also shuts them later, that's honestly a really good idea that we should do in the UK too. I sometimes get off work at 5 and because all the shops close at 5, I cant do the shopping I want to. Madness
Amazing video bringing attention on the lazy, stupid, selfish and cowardly people standing alongside us! Too often we assume operational competence and at the very least the operating company fitting out the project correctly!! How can we see these folk? How can we know that survival will be down to us!? We can’t so at least when they are identified put them away for life (actual life!!) so we are protected. With the deepest sorrow for the dead and the surviving passengers and friends and family. Bob England l
@Amanda-C. yeah, but if the engine is on, even if it isn't supposed to be. It makes sense. It is spinning, so dont go near it. A fire on a stopped train means either leave or do go near it. Not stay put. It's not like it was a coal powered train. There is meant to be no fire. Sure, leaving might be dangerous if you have to leave to the tracks, but staying means death. That is what dont understand.
Hi John, I loved this Video like literally the rest of all your vids. I would like to submit a Videoidea for the Future: The Ahrtal Flooding in Germany.
the second train probably should have continued through the station since they were clearly not stopped in tunnel away from it. I am amazed that a 1990s built metro system did not have proper fire suppression and extraction fans. This system was built nearly after nearly a century of safety lessons for subway systems.
When you're responsible for the safety of others it is your sacred duty to put their safety ahead of yours, putting their survival above your own if need be. I can't imagine the guilt he must feel every day but I also can't say he doesn't deserve it.
underground is probably second worst place you can have raging fire (first being very sadistically deep underwater). the tunnel is going to chimney - especially as other trains moving in or out of the tunnels displace significant amounts of air. devious people who use flame or in infamous case of another Asian country gas are sickening.
Was there for this disaster. Which is wild. Only used the local public transportation once or twice before this and then avoided it where possible afterwards.
I heard “the station had some of the network’s narrowest platforms”, made the “Confused Nick Young” face, and just started saying “No…no…that’s so dumb, no…” ETA: In addition, at the time the Sealand Youth Training Centre Fire happened (I think you’ve covered that? If not, look it up), a huge k-pop group (H.O.T.) recorded a song about it, calling out the government failures to protect those that died. I wonder if there’s any songs done about this?
Now, in that station stands a memorial place for those who perished during this disaster. There, you can see charred walls, phone boxes and lockers molten by the heat etc. As the station is right in the centre of this city, many people visit the memorial and mourn for the victims.
Thanks for watching, check out me other bits!
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Your channel is on my must-watch list every time it updates!
hey plainlydifficult, i wanted to throw this out there for you so you knew for possible future videos! the korean surname “Choi” is actually pronounced as “Chweh”, as its spelled with the letter that sounds like -weh and not the letters that make “-o -i”. thank you for the awesome videos!
I was unsubbed from your channel and you are one of my absolute favourites. Don't know why...just want you to know it happened in case something weird is happening. Heard of problems like this before. Love, love, LOVE your content!
You did not give a disaster rating. 9 out of 10?
I have to say, the driver of the second train handled the whole thing so poorly. Obviously the fire wasn’t his fault but by the sounds of things, he only seemed to think about his own safety and no one else’s
It is tragic how bad his actions were
Yeah, that's really bad decision making.... Parking your train next to a train you saw burning? If you were stuck just go past it.
Those poor people
Must have been Sewol's captain's relative...
@@stonefox2546posted 20 seconds ago
Exactly what I thought... Putting fuel next to a fire and entrapping people in it... 😢
It strikes me, that the two train operators weren't the only ones negligent.
Fire alarms ignored?
No emergency lighting?
Inadequate or non existent fire suppression systems?
Pasengers not able to open the train doors (there's a reason why trains where I live have levers allowing anyone inside to unlock the doors and force them open manualy as well as hammers to break windows)?
Train advised to enter the station "cautiously" because of a fire instead of stopping it way ahead of the station?
I'd like to know why the two operators were the only ones aside from the arsonist to be jailed.
Yeah, even on Houston's light rail lines there is an emergency lever that disengages the door opening system and allows the doors to be forced open by hand.
You’re right. Aside from (possibly) those ancient subway cars that were still running under Broad Street in Philadelphia in the 1980s, every train I’ve been on has had instructions for passengers on how to open doors and emergency window exits. Heck, here in the SF Bay Area, the instructions are written in English, Spanish, Chinese, Vietnamese and anything else that will fit on the decal.
@@MightyMezzo Instructions are just in English and Spanish here, though signs at polling stations are in Vietnamese countywide, and in Chinese and Korean in parts of town. But not in any South Asian languages, because most of them are somewhat competent in English already.
They had better legal representation, I'm guessing.
My ( US ) subway line has no emergency exit that passengers can operate. None. And the windows are made to be unbreakable. Also - no fire alarms. Its a deathtrap.
After this disaster, South Korean subway always teach us how to survive from subway fire, how to open the door, the location of fire extinguishers, and how to get out. It shows from subway commercial screen, boards, and station entrances. This incident was a big shock to South Koreans.
Is there any measure in place to make
sure people don't transport highly infla-
mable stuff? I do live in the antipodes
of South Korea,and we're stunned such
thing can be carried by hand in a sub
car. Unsure about enforcement, tough
@@SassyyjuicyMaria He had two milk cartons filled with something flammable. To prevent this, they would have had to inspect everybody carrying groceries. For a city subway, I find that level of security impossibly time consuming and burdensome. Itwould likely mean most people wouldn't ride the subway.
They teach you not to trust anyone in a position of responsibility when you're on a ferry too? Cause that's also an important point.
Now if they can do the same thing for crowds during Halloween maybe they can avoid the 100+ deaths caused from being crushed in a panicked crowd
what if same thing happens in a building or a ship you cant rely on people to constantly tell you what to do
I have been living here in Daegu for almost 11 years. They have a whole "theme park" here based on this tragedy. Part of the park involves watching an intense video showing what it would have been like (recreation of phone calls and reading of actual messages sent). Then you go into the basement where they have the burnout car and burnt lockers. The final part is a simulated fire on the subway car to help teach you how to escape. The whole place fills with smoke and you need to get out of the car and then out of the "subway" through the fire doors. It was one of the most intense things I have ever done.
Well that's one way to ensure the lesson is never forgotten.
Where is this? I lived there for 4 years and never heard of this. I go back every couple years to see the inlaws, and this is something I would like to see. What's it called?
@@the_kombinator It's the Daegu Safety Theme Park. It's close to Palgongsan. I went there with my students on a field trip in like...2016/2017.
Nice, making bank out of a tragedy!
@SupaL33tKillar It's free to enter and use. Koreans use the phrase "theme park" differently then we do. It's just a museum.
Kinda surprised you didn't mention the other Daegu Metro disaster that happened in 1995 when the 1st line was still under construction. A gas pipeline was accidentally punctured and leaked into a nearby construction site where it ignited and 101 people died. 42 of which, were middle schoolers.
Never heard of that horrible disaster, how tragic.
it was overshadowed by some daily news by the media and even not well known in korea.
@@blankjo9113How the hell did a tragedy of that scale get overshadowed?
@@brandonvelde5774 national highschool baseball was broadcasted on tv at the time of disaster and
koreans loved baseball especially in 1990s
I've been to south korea. Something odd I noticed about their metros is the presence of many fire extinguishers, emergency flashlights mounted on walls, and even glass stands or cubbies in walls containing advanced equipment such as SCBAs, respirators, and firefighting garmets.
I wonder if this equipment was added to stations as a result of this, and how truly effective it (specifically the respirators and more advanced fire fighting equipment) would be at preventing death from fire/inhalation, and in aiding persons within the station to fight the fire.
A lot of subways are designated disaster/bomb shelters too. If war with the north ever pops off Seoul will be the first hit so the city is constantly prepared
It absolutely was. Seeing as they didn't even have fire extinguishers on the subway when this happened.
The two most critical aspects of any fire procedure are raising the alarm and evacuating the affected premises. These are really time-critical. The first requires staff training and installation of fire alarms; and the second requires the provision of suitable emergency exits and clear signage.
The fire extinguishers are a good idea, provided that the fire allows time for a trained member of staff or passenger to use it, and is small enough to be doused by a single extinguisher. Emergency breathing apparatus requires specialist training, so I wonder if it was provided for fire crews to use if needed.
I lived in Seoul for two years. I also noticed and was confused by the cabinets with “smoke escape hoods” as I believe they were labelled. I always wondered exactly what they were, how they were supposed to work, and whether they’d do any good.
Probably also due to potential conflict with their northern neighbor
This feels like Seawohl ferry. Those in charge of the transport told people to stay put, left before their passengers, and let the exits be blocked by the disaster. Also both had trouble or unwillingness to report the problem when something could be done about it. Leading to death in cramped spaces.
Both disasters were indeed born from the same issues.
Worst part is there is actually video footage taken by one of the students who were onboard the ferry telling her friends, when they kept receiving the order to stay put, that the crew are probably saving themselves. She mentioned this specific subway fire as a reference.
She probably only meant it in jest but yeah...
Edit: Sewol in particular is infuriating because the listing of the ship happened so slowly initially that they had plenty of time to evacuate everyone. In fact maritime experts have commented this was about as ideal a situation you could be in with a sinking ship: close to the coast, more than enough time to evacuate the passengers and crew and plenty of other ships and boats nearby which could assist.
There was even a US Navy ship, which literally has the capacity and personnel to perform rescue operations on sinking ships, nearby. Yet their assistance was denied. Even the Japanese coast guard offered its assistance but they were also turned down.
Yeah, it's incredibly infuriating. Especially since a similar situation also happened with Costa Concordia, where the passengers were also told to stay put, but since obedience culture isn't really a major thing in the western world most of the passengers still decided to muster at the life raft stations and get off the ship ASAP. And the Italian coast guard wasn't busy turning away everyone's help either.
@@Khenfu_Cake
Wasn’t the Italian coast guard captain also scolding the Costa Concordia captain for abandoning his ship as well?
To be fair, in time of disasters, we assume those in charge know what they’re talking about.
He had to ask what to do? The thing goes forward and backward. I could understand slowing for a routine stop, but I don't understand fully stopping once you see the fire, yet alone "let me ask someone what I should do first." Unbelievable.
Unless he have a red light and maybe he can’t continue because of train stop/ protection systems.
@@AaronShenghao
From the sounds of things, the fire was already very visible ahead. Brake hard and stop before the station. Then ask about backing up away from it further.
Hierarchical society. Do nothing unusual without asking your superiors.
responsibility is one of the most feared stuff for most people, add the militaristic nature of that country and the traditionally stratified society and you get this, when you need an order to run from a fire, and do anything useful on your own is almost impossible.
There's a wide range of individual freedom between "always do what you're told" and "do whatever you want." Asian and Middle Eastern culture tend to fall closer to the "do what you're told" side, while Western cultures tend to fall closer to the "do whatever you want" side. Which is better varies with situation. There's no single optimal solution. Sometimes "do what you're told" is better (e.g. the pandemic). Sometimes "do whatever you want" is better (e.g. capitalism). So no matter which level of individual freedom you pick, there will always be situations where it's non-optimal. But I do believe that *on average* the Western levels of individual freedom come closer to the happier medium than Asian levels.
It still amazes me to this day that so many safety protocols we have around the world are written in blood.
All safety regulations are written in blood.
Every warning label you see is there for the same reason.
It's usually there because of 1 of 2 reasons
1; they didn't realize someone would be stupid enough to to do the thing (ie electronics in the tub)
or 2; it wasn't first added to cut costs and was only added to stop public outrage
All safety regs are. And I suspect we are about to get a few more Maritime safety regs specifically for submersible craft.
Unfortunately, possibly the most accurate statement ever.
The complete disregard from the subway staff should've been capitally punished. You DO NOT ignore a fire emergency
I'm surprised that point didn't come up again, after he first mentioned it. Like, what do you mean, they "ignored" fire alarms being pulled? That's like seeing a bunch of cars speeding by and trying to cross the road, anyways. Simply staggering.
In any other country, they probably wouldn’t have been charged at all. The fact that they actually were charged convicted and imprisoned is amazing to the years of an American
@@neilkurzman4907 They weren't. the only people charged where the arsonist and the two train drivers. The staff that ignored the alarms and directed the second train into the station went completely unprosecuted.
@@darthkarl99
In the United States, nobody would be prosecuted for anything.
As if you would of known what to do..
Most people would have done the same exact thing- or worse.
Another disaster I'd missed. I was a first responder at the Kings Cross fire and 7/7 also others. I was on my way to work on 7/7, and was told to go to the nearest Underground station, where my PPE would be waiting. Dreadful day, the bomber was atomised.
Ah yes, let me just park my train next to fire... yep, this is fine. -Logic
A terrible logic
Fire + tunnel = special kind of
nope
I agree
Why didn't the second train just keep on going? Why stop? Obviously, the other train was on fire. The second train driver killed all of those people.
It is a mystery
The train driver just followed instructions and didn't dare make his own decisions.
The bigger question is: Why was the operator advised to enter the station cautiously because of the fire rather than to stop the train ahead of the station and wait for the fire alarm to be investigated?
It is likely that doing so would trip a train protection system, thus potentially immobilizing the train for a period of time in a position where escape would not be possible. The bigger question is why the decision was made to give the driver authority to enter the station under caution, and why the driver did not stop before entering.
@@JaidenJimenez86 Shouldn't all trains have a manual override allowing the train oeprator to move the train in an emergency despite the objections of any train protection system?
After all, the train operator bears the ultimate responsibility for the train and its passengers, therfore they must also have final authority over its operation.
Great presentation on a terrible situation... Sounded a little too familiar... NOT Jon's fault, obviously... It's just depressing how he's covered other incidents so similar before...
AND what about those Subway Staff IGNORING FIRE ALARMS???!!! I'm a little bit pissed that they'd throw the figurative book at the driver who obviously screwed up and then panicked... Understandable for locking people in a train, failing to think on his feet entirely, and then abandoning them to die... BUT he just lost his sh*t... Panic can do that to a person, and there's almost no possible way to prepare someone for when they face their moment of truth.
BUT NOTHING to the Subway Staff for IGNORING the Fire Alarms going off right, left, and center??? Did anyone AT LEAST get some retraining??? How the F*CK do you justify ignoring an alarm? You don't even send someone down to physically take a LOOK, and see if there's no fire or smoke???
Sure, I'm aware of mischief and false alarms. That's why you pass a security guard a walkie-talkie and send him for a "Look-see"... JUST look. If it's really nothing, he can stop for coffee on his way back, pick up some donuts or french fries... or whatever the equivalent is in South Korea. THEN you can write it off and shut it down... You DO NOT EVER IGNORE A FIRE ALARM!!!
GOD... That's pissed me off a LOT more than it probably should. ;o)
Just wondering if there was a “boy who cried wolf” element here, if there had been a history of false alarms. Still inexcusable.
@@MightyMezzo Oh, there probably was. It happens all over the U.S., and I suspect largely because nobody likes enforcing the laws with actual consequences...
BUT that's entirely why there's more than one person "monitoring" behind the scenes. When an alarm goes off and you don't see anything on the monitors, you SEND SOMEONE to physically check... I've been physical security... I've always just grabbed a walkie-talkie and flashlight, told my shift-buddy to sit at the screens for a bit, and headed out to see what's what... UNLESS of course my shift-buddy decided he needed a walk about more than I did... AND whoever went to look picked up sodas or snacks or whatever on the way back in most places.
The one thing I've NEVER done is just ignore it or shut it off without going... Not ever.
Kids do dumb sh*t like that to get a rise out of adults... Criminals use alarms for distractions and all... animals chew on electrical lines and piss on sensors... Any number of things can send a false alarm, but if you DON'T go look for yourself to be SURE, then YOU get to live with burning someone's grandma up in her sleep... all screaming to hell and flailing the whole time... because you just couldn't be bothered...
I (for one) am NOT going to live with that. ;o)
This is absolutely appalling. How can you have train drivers that don't know what to do in the event of a fire. Didn't anyone in Korea ever hear about the King's Cross fire? I started working on the London Underground a couple of years after the King's Cross fire and we had safety drummed into us every day, what to do in an emergency and what not to do. Fires underground are very very dangerous it can take only a matter of seconds to completely fill a platform with smoke and then people are going to struggle to escape and die. I would have jailed whoever was in charge of okaying the trains to be made out of inflammable materials.😢
Korean incompetence is something else entirely
I'll all but guarantee no SOP or recurrent training existed, too many other things were done wrong.
I attended school in South Africa, when learning british history, kings cross fire is the first on the list to learn, I'm a big fan of the uk and visit there frequently as for I'm an organist playing all over England, Scotland and Wales, in churches, halls and theatres etc
Korea was a rice paddy country and experienced explosive growth. They also don't call it the Hermit Kingdom for no reason.
The King's Cross fire was shocking at the time. I recall reading that trains were still arriving and feeding more people into an inferno. But also that the trains were pushing a lot of air up the escalators
Excellent video, always a fascinating analysis of the full story.
Thank you
I hope, if I'm ever in a public disaster like this, the professional overseeing my safety isn't a buffoon.
I agree
If the guy isn't a buffoon, such tragedies can become inspiring stories of survival and escape. Quick thinking and coordinated action saves the day. Few lives are lost when many could have been.
It's incidents like these that make me rather wary of underground railways, even my first time through the Channel Tunnel back in the early 90s scared the hell out of me (and then, a year or so later, fire happened in there!), I know it's one-in-a-million chances of such things happening today, but, you never know when you might win that particular lottery...
It’s because this channel that I am too. I also don’t want to go in any building over three stories, and I never wanna fly in an airplane and I really don’t wanna ride any trains of any kind ever.
The standards for fire protection in rolling stock have become much more stringent since then, especially when it comes to trains in long tunnels. However, they only apply to new rolling stock and modifications.
@@Skullair313 pity it takes so long to referb or replace fire hazard rolling stock and stations.
Thing is, these events always lead to changes and optimizations. You are so, so much more likely to be killed in a street accident (without any chance to avoid it). Yes, a lot of people died. But most likely more people die in traffic accidents in the same area each month. And nothing really changes.
@@squidly6179 More people die in accidents at home than in airplane accidents. Or train accidents.
Why wouldn't the operator of the second train either back up or GO?
Who knows
@@PlainlyDifficult I found your channel about two months ago after searching disasters. I am finally caught up on all of the episodes. Between you and Fascinating Horror, I know about all of them.
Korean culture is very respectful of authority, even when they definately shouldn't be (MV Sewol and Korean Air Cargo 8509 are two other extreme examples). Something I'd dearly like to know: did the train have a "trip cock stop" or similar? if so then I can understand why the driver didn't continue through the station at least.
I remember watching a video and it was showing the Sowel ferry it had tilted and one of the high school girls was talking to another girl and she made reference to this disaster and unfortunately her and her friend she was talkin to perished on the Sowel.
The very definition of a fiery tunnel to hell.
So -- why were the initial fire alarms ignored?
If I could hazard a guess: Complacency from seeing many more false alarms (from kids and bad actors pulling the alarm) than real emergencies.
@@Heizenberg32 This is why I support the death penalty, but only for minor crimes. Death penalty is a useless deterrent against murderers, but it sure would stop false alarm pullers and litterbugs.
And why not? False alarm pranksters helped kill these people.
@@Bacopa68 Okay have fun lynching kids pulling pranks my guy.
@@Heizenberg32 I'd accept that if it were one, two, or maybe even three within a few minutes (some schmuck and a friend or two running from alarm to alarm), but we're talking SEVERAL people pulling SEVERAL alarms in a rather short timespan. How does anyone mistake that for 'a stupid prankster'?
@@Bacopa68Huh???
Right on time for Plainly Difficult
Lets go always a good day when plainly difficult post a video
I’m always very thankful for the Saturday upload. I get to watch it when I get to work
Thank you
"As a side note'
Well played, sir. Well played visual gag
thank you!
FIVE YEARS?! I cannot believe that's all they got. Unbelievable!
The drivers are the scapegoats of the bad design of the trains and the lack of safety measures in the stations.
5 years for bad decisions, not criminal intent. Frankly, for those sorts of people, even just 1 year is enough. These weren't people who intentionally did horrible deeds, these were regular people who didn't know WTF to do, and those poor choices lead to a horrific outcome. The guilt alone of knowing what their poor actions resulting is far more punishment than any system could give out. No need for them to rot in jail when they should be out doing community service.
@@FranNyan given the nature of South Korean society, they would be shunned and ostracised by people who knew them. Social inclusion is a massive part of the culture so being shunned in a such a way is more punishment than a jail sentence.
The true injustice was that they were the only ones to get jailed for negligent homicide.
@@FranNyan Americans think that prison exists as a way to torture individuals on behalf of the government.
They want the individuals to be tortured and want the "bad people" to go to hell to be further tortured, they don't like the idea of hell only being a temporary destination to cleanse one's sins before they go into paradise once they were genuinely regretful about their actions, they want the individuals to be tortured long after the sun turns into a red giant & swallows the planet.
That's not a shocking statement given that a lot of parents and grandparents would force their teenage daughter or grand daughter to carry a baby to full term just to punish their daughter or grand daughter when nobody in that family wants the baby.
Imagine being alive at the age of 30 & stuck in a dead end job with costly health complications to have your mother be honest by telling you that the only reason you're alive in the first place is that her parents or grandparents wanted your existence to punish your mother.
I love the cameos in the train station shots. Stepping on foot guys need to be in every video even if it’s not nuclear related.
It's silly how much we take for granted these days when it comes to safety equipment and our everyday lives. Check out some roadside barrier advancements John, they're really cool if they're done right.
I just wanted to take a moment to appreciate the guys in their hazmat suits and hi-viz vests just going to work at 4:40. If it weren't for these folks, there would be fewer disasters on this channel. Hats off.
do you mean more disasters?
What a horrific incident. I'm speechless.
It was pretty terrible
These metro fires and several domestic terrorist attacks as well as Tokyo metro gas attacks where cited when Shanghai Metro (and several other metro in Chinese cities) introduced baggage security check at metro station. (Similar to airport security check pre-911), they only check bags to make sure you are not brining knives/flammable liquid.
Fire fighting equipment are everywhere and emergency train door (and screen door) release are available throughout the metro.
Yeah, I felt very safe when using the metro in both Shanghai and Beijing while visiting China a few times between late 2006 and summer of 2010. The metro there felt both cleaner and safer than when I went to London in 2004, or even the metro where I lived at the time of my trips to China (I lived in Copenhagen at that time), not to mention that the Chinese metro felt a lot safer than the metro in Stockholm here in Sweden! The Stockholm metro system does feel like a death trap at times because the stations are very old and cramped, some are very deep underground and there are no barriers between platforms and tracks so it does happen that people fall down onto the tracks either by accident or get pushed off the platform by someone. The elevators are beyond tiny and the path between elevator and platform is so narrow that you can't go past another wheelchair or pram inside the path so the one waiting to board the elevator has to back out of the path (only to usually see the elevator door close and elevator leave, then rinse and repeat unless a kind soul who doesn't have any mobility aid or pram can hold the elevator for you) and I don't even dare to think about having to evacuate the station if something happens in the metro in Stockholm because of this. I'm a wheelchair user, thankfully ambulatory so I can if I have to, use the escalator and just have my chair in front of me or even go up an escalator while sitting in my chair, I can even walk in stairs if absolutely needed and just drag my chair up or down said stairs. But far from every wheelchair user has that level of mobility, a fair few are ambulatory to some extent, but many are also completely reliant on their chair to get around. So yeah, Stockholm metro does make me feel a bit uneasy because it's so poorly planned, old and just doesn't feel safe even under normal circumstances
I watch so many of these various "disaster" channels and yours is leagues ahead. I know the topic will be well researched and explained with graphics and technical explanations. And i like knowing the weather in your corner of London. Plus im really high
thank you! XD
Thank you as always John, Really appreciate the contents you've been uploading!
Thank you
Please do Bintaro Tragedy, probably the worst train disaster in Indonesia
Fire and tunnels are horrific.
Indeed.
What about talking about the Mont Blanc tunnel fire? It burned for days and the tunnel nearly collapsed.
I remember it was very intense - but I didn't know it burnt for days
2nd train should not have stopped.
Right I see a train on fire I just either stop or pass through
Tell me you don't know about emergency signalling without telling me you don't know about emergency signalling
In an emergency the entire line is shut down, the trains cannot move freely
Plus the last thing you need is the second train catching on fire then breaking down in a tunnel
@@amogusisntfunny1464hat’s not what he said happened here though. rewatch that section…he stopped the train hisself, it wasn’t stopped for him. Tell me you don’t know how to listen without telling me.
@tiasky3438 he was told by the dispatcher to approach at caution, this means the next signal was danger, i.e a stop signal, meaning it would have stopped the train if it tried to go through anyway
What an acute observation
I have power point on my computer and I'm going to use all the next slide options! Hubs and I enjoy watching you nerd out on trains. More semaphore!
This accident also shocked entire Mainland China's metro system. For example, Beijing Subway from then on banned lots of "unnecessary" things with potential fire risks, like in-station convenient stores, horizontal escalators, causing lots of inconvenience. Also all underground metro stations have to get at least 2 independent station exits (and every seperate concourse needs to have their own dedicated exit). Causing lots of station opening being postponed.
These just sound like sensible steps to me.
Oh, no! Putting lives before convenience. How utterly preposterous. Sounds like you could work as one of the top executives ...
@@bunnymad5049 I don't think they were criticising, just comment on what happened and the general public reaction to it, which is pretty typical.
I read ”A selfish act” and had expected something totally different ….🤬
But as always a very good video. After a few days of slightly warm weather we in W Seden experience some +25 in the shadows 🥵
This is one of the most senseless careless combination of bad decisions and inactions as I think any other thing I've heard you present.
So many chances for this to be much less of a disaster. Then there is the infrastructure changes. But just the chain of inaction and incorrect action is mindbogglingly sad.
Unfortunately this lack of "decisiveness" is a rampant aspect of Korean and even Northeast Asian societies with its extreme deference to authority figures and lack/fear of taking initiative. Respect for higher ups is embedded in Korean culture and even its language. Almost no one takes initiative and almost everyone follows orders. This is the major reason that Northeast Asian societies are orderly. There is an oft quoted saying which I'm paraphrasing from Northeast Asia: "The nail which sticks out gets hammered down". Order and harmony above all else. You're not paid to think; your betters are thinking and you only need to follow orders.
There have been numerous mass tragedies, but the one I want to highlight is the 2014 Sewol Ferry Disaster where 306 (mostly students) died. The Captain of the sinking ferry told the students to do nothing and remain, condemning them to death. This Captain was the first off the boat when rescuers arrived. The authorities on the scene took no initiative as they were waiting on orders and referred to manuals on how to react. Thinking out of the box is not a strong Northeast Asian trait. No, there were no procedures for a sinking ferry on its side. The rescuers were paralyzed. No one took the initiative of entering the ferry to help students escape. They just waited and waited and waited for higher authority figures to make a decision, which they didn't as they were just as paralyzed as the "rescuers". The ferry sank in front of the rescuers and authority while paralyzed in indecision. They later claimed everyone was rescued which was a bald faced lie.
Shin Godzilla, of all things, criticizes this. During the first act there's an extremely slow response and the gets monster rampage freely because the bureaucracy is tying itself in knots due to the lack of protocol for such a situation. That first act is specifically a criticism of the way the Fukushima disaster was handled by the way.
...I'm a polar opposite of this, to a probably stupid degree. So I don't get it.
John (our host) has already covered MV Sewol incident over a year ago
th-cam.com/video/iZg5qqypaSo/w-d-xo.html
It's also a problem in China, Japan, and basically any country where an oppressive class (whether it be of employment, race, age, etc.) demands absolute obedience from those under their control. It's to the point where aviation regulatory bodies have to emphasize CRM training harder than ever in such countries. Unquestioning loyalty kills.
For people saying “why the second train stopped next to a burning train?”
It’s not always possible to just “not stop” because trains have Automatic train control or train stop system. The driver however can overwrite the system if needed after stopping, that usually needs control center authorization. He is negligent for not opening the doors even when power was cut…
Control center shouldn’t let the driver to continue into station (reverse back) or change signal to green and tell the driver not stopping that station. I’m surprised no one there was also penalized.
I like how the main in the hazmat suit snuck into the picture at 4:53 🙂
He gets in everywhere
It sounds a bit more like the drivers were used as scapegoats and the real fault there is on the bigger fish... lacking regulations, poor train construction, and poor overall emergency training.
Drivers would only be at fault if they had an emergency protocol and did not follow it. Otherwise, anyone in that situation would panic and not know what would be the best course of action.
SK train stations now have full emergency equipment kits and trains play videos on how to respond to a developing situation.
That’s good!
Should do the 1993 leve break of west quincyil durring the flood
Yessss awesome work John I knew there was a good reason why I found myself randomly waking up at 1.15 am😂 kia ora from New Zealand ❤🇳🇿
Unbelievable that the second conductor stopped the train instead of just passing through the station, which is probably what most people would do in that situation. Why in the world did he stop next to the burning train?!
God I can already see one of the regulations that would change, the doors going to a locked open position in low battery as a safety measure
Or at least having the trains with emergency egress handles
@@PlainlyDifficult This too! I sorta overthought it haha
7:53 - "Choi chose to condemn the passengers to death by suffocation or burning because he's a selfish bastard."
Of course the drivers get the blame and sent to jail. I bet no supervisors or upper management were charged.
To be fair it does seem like the drivers were mostly to blame. It wasn't a manager that pulled the train up to an already burning train and then left the doors shut but then saved himself and left the passenges to burn. But up to a point you could be right because maybe thier training could have been better and there should been extinguishers on the train so mabe managers should gone to jail for that.
@@voivod6871it literally was like management that ordered the 2nd train to pull into the station when they could’ve made it wait outside while they deal with the fire.
Also they ignored fire alarms being triggered by passengers at the station.
"So we've fitted this fancy fire alarm system with alert points across the station"
"Excellent, what should we do if someone presses one?"
"Oh just ignore it"
4:40 And apparently two of those passengers saw it fit to be sporting full hazmat haha. Yea that'll keep the populous calm, just casually walking into a metro system wearing that.
Maybe a third hazzie too, if that white one on the right with no human face is a hazmat... but I think that's an ancient alien astronaut, who timejumped there to save the guy in blue dangerously eyeballing the tracks.
These Where's-Waldo scenes always get me going lol. -edit: 11:57 Ok I see you entered my nightmares there, tread carefully, it feels like Canada in the South Park series....
Was nothing learned from the horrors of Kings Cross?
WTF there were people inside a burning train and the driver first closed the door and later left without ensuring the doors were open. This is the kinda dumb shit which if would have happened here in India we would have said "see these are the reasons why we are still a third world country, we have a long way to go."
Since you didn't provide.
9 on the tragedy scale.
8 on the legacy scale.
That ending was cool, I didn't need to sleep tonight anyways.
Bon Appetite
As always, another excellent episode of a very horrific event, thank you Sir!!!🙏😢❣️
Nerd on, John! Nerd on. Love all the parts of your documentaries. ❤️
Yo, work for the Daegu subway, thanks for covering this one. My seniors recall having to do cleanup after the fire.
Oh look a giant fire. imma just pull up beside it like a frigging idiot.
It was pretty dumb
..then trap everyone in
이사건에 대해 영상을 제작해서 감사합니다 한국은 급격한 성장으로 인해 안전사고가 많이 발생헀다.
이사건 몇년전에 같은 대구 지하철 공사중에 폭발이 일어나 백명 넘게죽기도 했다
This is so sad. The second train driver is just as guilty as the guy that started the fire.
Thanks for the vid John, keep up the great work mate 👍
Thank you
I lived in Daegu for 4 years in the mid 2010s. This is still being talked about, my 5-7 year olds brought it up once in a while.
Many people are talking about the 2nd train should just go past. I'm not entirely sure if that would have worked. From the sound of it, the train depends on power from the tracks to move, which was cut not long after. It is perfectly possible that the train will end up being trapped in the tunnel which will then cause everyone to die from smoke inhalation/suffocation--remember, tunnels require train movement for air circulation.
It is possible that it could get far enough away to prevent this, but that would be no less a gamble of just trying to let the passengers off at the station.
Keeping the door closed and trapping them is, ofc, a worse decision than both of the above options.
Stopping anywhere but right next to the burning train
seems like a better option.
Think TH-cam unsubscribed me from your channel! No idea why. Realised I hadn't got a post for a while today 😕 ...was worried something had happened to you that might've interrupted your regular posts! Followed you for around 2yrs. Fantastic videos! I've complained. Letting you know, just in case...you are one of my favourite creators. Both music and mini docs. Please keep up the awesome work! Hope this isn't a running theme. You deserve better.
I’ve been binging all your videos for the last month, love your content. Much love from Minnesota, US!
What i took from this video is that Korea opens its shops later. If it also shuts them later, that's honestly a really good idea that we should do in the UK too. I sometimes get off work at 5 and because all the shops close at 5, I cant do the shopping I want to. Madness
There was also the BART tunnel fire in 1979, between Oakland & San Francisco. While only one died, 40 were injured. It could have been much worse.
Thank you for the suggestion!
Amazing video bringing attention on the lazy, stupid, selfish and cowardly people standing alongside us! Too often we assume operational competence and at the very least the operating company fitting out the project correctly!!
How can we see these folk? How can we know that survival will be down to us!? We can’t so at least when they are identified put them away for life (actual life!!) so we are protected.
With the deepest sorrow for the dead and the surviving passengers and friends and family.
Bob
England l
Well if the fire doesnt get you at first, the staff well do their upper most to make sure it does second time around.
Sadly very true
Far out. As soon as you said plastic and vinyl I knew, and then it got worse ...
4:56 everyone is duplicated cept hat man!
During a fire how is the advice of "stay where you are" ever considered? WTF am I missing something?
On an airplane, you don't want to go near the engines if they're still running. Don't know if trains have a similar hazard for evacuees.
Didn't a "shelter in place" policy also contribute to the death toll at Grenfell?
So, this is still a thing.
@Amanda-C. yeah, but if the engine is on, even if it isn't supposed to be. It makes sense. It is spinning, so dont go near it. A fire on a stopped train means either leave or do go near it. Not stay put. It's not like it was a coal powered train. There is meant to be no fire. Sure, leaving might be dangerous if you have to leave to the tracks, but staying means death. That is what dont understand.
Hi John,
I loved this Video like literally the rest of all your vids.
I would like to submit a Videoidea for the Future: The Ahrtal Flooding in Germany.
Thank you for the lovely words and the suggestion!!
@@PlainlyDifficult You're welcome!
And the first recommended video under this, is the film unstoppable about the crazy 8s train!
the second train probably should have continued through the station since they were clearly not stopped in tunnel away from it. I am amazed that a 1990s built metro system did not have proper fire suppression and extraction fans. This system was built nearly after nearly a century of safety lessons for subway systems.
The handling of the emergency was so bad it made you forget it was arson
When you're responsible for the safety of others it is your sacred duty to put their safety ahead of yours, putting their survival above your own if need be. I can't imagine the guilt he must feel every day but I also can't say he doesn't deserve it.
At first I thought he was committing suicide and rudely involved a lot of others, but it was even worse than that.
underground is probably second worst place you can have raging fire (first being very sadistically deep underwater).
the tunnel is going to chimney - especially as other trains moving in or out of the tunnels displace significant amounts of air. devious people who use flame or in infamous case of another Asian country gas are sickening.
Your end mannequins are really creepy. Thanks for the nightmare fuel! 😂
Your welcome 🌞
Just when I thought they couldn't bungle a response as bad as the ferry sinking....
Was there for this disaster. Which is wild. Only used the local public transportation once or twice before this and then avoided it where possible afterwards.
Its fascinating to know that this whole disaster happened at the time I was born
I love this channel, always an awesome job 👏🏼👍🏻👍🏻
I heard “the station had some of the network’s narrowest platforms”, made the “Confused Nick Young” face, and just started saying “No…no…that’s so dumb, no…”
ETA: In addition, at the time the Sealand Youth Training Centre Fire happened (I think you’ve covered that? If not, look it up), a huge k-pop group (H.O.T.) recorded a song about it, calling out the government failures to protect those that died. I wonder if there’s any songs done about this?
the takeaway is a bit ironic considering the Kaprun disaster, which was also covered on this channel
Wait, are you telling me the doors don't have an emergency release?!
Now, in that station stands a memorial place for those who perished during this disaster. There, you can see charred walls, phone boxes and lockers molten by the heat etc. As the station is right in the centre of this city, many people visit the memorial and mourn for the victims.
My spouse was living in the west side of Daegu and missed this fire by less than a half-hour while on a shopping trip.
Fantastic way to wrap my night up. Thank you very much!
Why the hell would part of the fire detection protocol be to lock the station doors? That goes beyond stupidity.
Daegu, Sewol, Itaewon… there’s an unfortunate repeated lack of action from the Korean government that keeps leading to the gross loss of life.
Once again proves that safety regulations are written in blood.