Or how to piss it all away, I mean they used to be a very successful FBS conference, now they are trying to scrape a conference together just to survive
Weeeell done! Great depth on the breakdown. Hard to find anything like this on mid major moves. Would love to see something for the Mac with umass joining now that we’re at 13, especially if we try to go to 16 schools
If the WAC stay together after the 2024-25, and adds a ton of D2 schools they have to go through 4 more years of waiting for those D2 schools to be active members. If at anytime from now until 2029, a schools leaves, they could be in trouble to maintain their conference status. But, I think the NCAA will grant a waiver/extend the grace period until the D2 schools finish their reclassification period. Yes, even a 2 year extension. So, if the WAC adds 5 D2 schools who start their reclassification in 25-26, but the WAC but loses CBU or any other schools in 25-26, the NCAA won’t shut them down as a conference. Obviously, the question is, can the WAC find 5 schools? I picked 5 so, the WAC would be 12 schools if no teams left. They can’t just add one or two schools 25-26 1st year grace period 26-27 2nd year grace period 27-28 waiver by NCAA 28-29 waiver by NCAA
Do ya think there's a possibility of the WAC adding Northern Colorado? It'd probably give the Bears a conference to be somewhat competitive in instead of gettin' blown out by Big Sky teams every game, and it could help the WAC entice some Colorado schools like Denver & Colorado-Mesa, and maybe Colorado-Mines as well.
How much does it cost for a D2 school to move to D1. Not talking scholarships but the application fee?To go from FBS to FCS football, now costs $5M application fee. And he did a great job listing sports D2 schools need to add if they want to move up!
Not sure of the direction the WAC wants to take. Since moving their conference headquarters from Denver, CO to Arlington, TX it seems that there will be a larger emphasis on the state of Texas schools (namely the Lone Star & to an extent the Southland). Keep in mind the Southland may have a leg up on the WAC on that front. As the WAC was merging with the Great West Conference and the level of play was down it was discussed (in message boards and forums) that Caly Poly - SLO, UC-Davis, & Sacramento St would be appropriate to join the conference since they were associate members of the Big Sky. On the Metro State side, there was chatter (among message boards and other forums) to bring in Drury & SIU-Edwardsville to accommodate UM - Kansas City & Chicago St respectively. From a personal perspective, throughout all of this, I thought that a WAC - GNAC merger would have done the trick before the Texas schools came on the scene. Yes West Texas A & M would be a nice fit (and hopefully E. New Mexico Univ).
Can you do a video talking about D2 schools who are most ready to go D1 and what their options are? I think it would be interesting to judge schools all over the country on a level field and I know my alma mater GVSU definitely needs to make the jump soon
It'll likely be lower soon. UT Arlington is lookin' pretty likely to get that Missouri Valley invite, Cal Baptist is waiting patiently for that Big West invite(I'd be shocked if that didn't happen), and Tarleton State has made it clear that they want to play at the highest level of college sports-- football in particular-- so they'll probably make a legit push for an FBS invite from either C-USA or possibly the Sun Belt in a few years. If the WAC can stay alive after all those almost-guaranteed losses/outcomes, then I'd be very impressed. They gotta work on gettin' Oral Roberts, Denver, some of the D2 Texas & Colorado schools, and maybe Northern Colorado as well.
I’ll put my money on CBU getting that big west invite and hightailing it outta there. They don’t get the football money from the WAC, it would be better for donations to be in big west most likely and better for travel, and the basketball quality will be better than a wac without Seattle and GCU.
It's highly doubtful that the Big West would take CBU according to a friend of mine who calls basketball in the BW. Also remember that for this academic year Seattle and GCU are still in the WAC. They don't depart until '25-'26.
The Big Sky and Summit are not going to take any schools unless they lose any. So, the Utah schools have no place to go. It sounds like the Texas schools do not want to join the Southland (which is now very full as well). Cal-Baptist MIGHT get an invite to the WCC if Gonzaga leaves (and I'm still surprised they were not invited with Seattle and GCU) but they will not be invited to the Big West. I only see Cal-Baptist as a possible flight risk. I think the WAC survives because they have an autobid and that's attractive to D2 candidates. Colorado Mesa, Colorado Mines, CSU-Pueblo, Central Oklahoma and one of the Texas schools would put a lot of stability into the WAC.
That all depends on what happens with the Mountain West Conference and PAC 12 conference. If the PAC 12 take 6 Mountain West schools then the Mountain West and few American schools. Mountain West has up to 10 schools they could add to the conference and some of them are in the Big Sky conference. If the Mountain West takes some schools from Conference USA then look for CUSA to raid FCS schools. This all depends on what happens with the PAC 12 and ACC.
@@tylernelson3343 MW commissioner Gloria Nevarez made cherry-picking her conference's members very costly by using the leverage she has. The way the MW's agreement with the Pac-2 is structured, taking the whole MW would be a lot cheaper for Oregon State and Washington State, so they have to either take the entire league or none of it. Otherwise, there are definitely a few certain MW members who the Pac-2 would leave behind.
And this is why the power conferences want to increase the size of the basketball tournament. They are tired of these smaller conferences who get poached trying to lure D2 schools in to stay alive and taking up auto bids. One, in the hopes that one of their teams will be the next 15/16 seed to shock the world against an overseeded 1/2 seed or a 1/2 seed who forgets how to shoot that night. Two, they are luring these D2 schools because the commish will do whatever it takes to avoid being rendered obsolete. Only Kliavkoff of the Pac12 has been rendered obsolete.
From what I understand, Southern Utah rejoining the Big Sky is a non-starter due to how they left a few years ago. Idk if any leadership changes have occurred since then that may have warmed relations a bit more though
Three of the 8 D1 schools you named would have to add a men’s sport for D1. But they would also have to add a women’s sport for Title IX! While Metro and West Texas, are clearly not interested. Would they have to add a men’s sport if they ever wanted to move to D1?
Another great video @d1_360 Random thoughts: 1) I am still not sold that GCU will actually get to change that WAC logo to a WCC one. I just think they have too many red flags. But if Gonzaga leaves then there's no doubt they're in. 2) The show of loyalty by the remaining TX schools is vital to keep the UT schools from going to defcon 1. But if any of these schools does leave it would be Cal Baptist. Especially since none of the schools mentioned as possible replacements are from CA. 3) West Texas A&M needs a new president. They have the facilities, and are ready to move up. 4) I'm wondering if they could convince Denver or Oral Roberts to join the league. They both are geographic outliers in the Summit. 5) The rumors of the WAC's demise have been going on since 2013 and they're still here. 6) I wish Texas A&M Kingsville would make the move to D1.
DU and ORU would be good fits, the problem is it seems the leadership of the WAC is just not up to par. A few years ago the WAC and the ASUN were conferences to fear and look to as success stories, now both are hanging on by a thread. Don’t get me wrong, the Colorado 3 + DU would be a good pickup and likely stabilize the conference for some time, but damn it still looks weak compared to where they were only a few years ago.
Love the Javelinas. Ultimately, the combination of low-ish enrollment, low-ish budget, and them being 5.5-6.5 hours from the WAC TX schools is too much. Central Oklahoma (3.5-4.5 hours) is actually a couple hours closer to those 3 WAC TX schools. TAMU Kingsville hasn't been in the best shape in recent years with administrators considering a merger with TAMU Corpus Christi back in 2016. A&M BOR put that to bed back then, but it wouldn't be a surprise if a merger bubbles up again in the future.
CAA football has to be in trouble now with Richmond going to the patriot league. Have to think W&M will at least *consider* going there, if not just outright going to the SoCon in all sports as well…
West Texas A&M has better facilities than some FCS programs in my opinion. They NEED a new president because they're ready for D1 and the WAC could definitely use them
Not just about football though, better to have an athletic department with worse football that’s a tighter run ship than a big football program with fuck all else. Might be the case with WTAMU, just saying.
@@LymetimeProductions yeah but like I said it seems as though the other sports have to be ready too. I mean SFA going to south land makes more sense when you consider non-revenue sports travel than anything. SFA will likely be profitable and good no matter what conference they are in, it’s the other sports that you worry about
How about a video on the state of the UAC. I mean talking about a Saturday afternoon at a Southland basketball doubleheader? Really? Well, I guess that it beats watching paint dry.
There is a rumor that a Lone Star Conference school is thinking about moving up to D1 and WAC now since Seattle and Grand Canyon is gone. The cost of travel went down before SFAU drove a knife in the back of the WAC like they did knowing that the cost of flying went down. The school is Angelo State. McBroom formally of West Texas A&M on a podcast that yes, he would like to see West Texas A&M move up to D1. He said several large D2 schools are fed up with the D2 leadership right now. He talked about them, Pittsburg State, NW Missouri State, West Georgia, etc as flight risked to D1 now. We just saw West Georgia moving up. What West Texas A&M needs to do is get the president retire, and hire a new one so that they can move up. Plus, there is pressure on Midwestern State by the city leaders and local businesses to have them move up to D1 as well. Colorado Mesa does sponsor 29 sports. They could easily move up, and is ready to. Central Oklahoma was making some signs that they could be moving up to D1. Southland is now too full and MVC won't take a D2 school. WAC is the place to be. There is also talks that someone from within Central Missouri is also hinting to go D1 as well. We might see more D2 schools now willing to jump as Seattle is gone. California Baptist is a place you can recruit talent from California to play the sports which SFA stupidly gave up. Same with UTRGV and Lamar.
@@renaeknight9266 Look at how many schools is in the Lone Star Conference? More than 20 now. They could be getting Hardin-Simmons, Mary Hardin Baylor, Howard Payne and East Texas Baptist as they are the last 4 schools in the D3 schools in their conference. That would put Colorado College in a bine as well.
An All Texas FCS conference! All Texas teams in SLC 6 WAC teams ACU, UTA- no FB. No Tarleton as they get a FBS invite. That’s 8 schools. Four D2 schools for 12! So depending on the D2 schools, you will have 11 football schools! You’re forcing the Utah schools and CBU to find other conferences and damaging the SLC!
@@Lawomenshoops WAC is also still by the rules that they are an FBS conference. Angelo State, West Texas A&M and Eastern New Mexico with a couple of Colorado schools could balance Texas side with the Utah/Colorado/New Mexico side. ENM and West Texas A&M could be a protected cross rival. As it was, UAC of the WAC/ASUN schools had a much better fans turning out for football including SFA. Southland had a poor turnout. The fan support is not there in the Southland as most of the schools are in FBS now.
@@Spitfirethedragon until the West Texas President retires, they are off the board. Angelo St. and/or Midwestern St are more likely to be WAC members within the next two years.
The WAC has such an awkward footprint, really the only option they have is the Colorado schools and the D2 Texas schools. And even after that you still have CBU on an island. And don’t even get me started on the footprint with that WAC-ASUN nonsense.
D1 360, Subscribed because your videos are so much fun!
The WAC is a case study on how to always survive no matter how great the odds are against you
Or how to piss it all away, I mean they used to be a very successful FBS conference, now they are trying to scrape a conference together just to survive
Weeeell done! Great depth on the breakdown. Hard to find anything like this on mid major moves.
Would love to see something for the Mac with umass joining now that we’re at 13, especially if we try to go to 16 schools
If the WAC stay together after the 2024-25, and adds a ton of D2 schools they have to go through 4 more years of waiting for those D2 schools to be active members. If at anytime from now until 2029, a schools leaves, they could be in trouble to maintain their conference status. But, I think the NCAA will grant a waiver/extend the grace period until the D2 schools finish their reclassification period. Yes, even a 2 year extension.
So, if the WAC adds 5 D2 schools who start their reclassification in 25-26, but the WAC but loses CBU or any other schools in 25-26, the NCAA won’t shut them down as a conference.
Obviously, the question is, can the WAC find 5 schools? I picked 5 so, the WAC would be 12 schools if no teams left. They can’t just add one or two schools
25-26 1st year grace period
26-27 2nd year grace period
27-28 waiver by NCAA
28-29 waiver by NCAA
Do ya think there's a possibility of the WAC adding Northern Colorado? It'd probably give the Bears a conference to be somewhat competitive in instead of gettin' blown out by Big Sky teams every game, and it could help the WAC entice some Colorado schools like Denver & Colorado-Mesa, and maybe Colorado-Mines as well.
Hell, I would even add Denver at that point
I would like to see UCO move up. I don't think it will happen though.
How much does it cost for a D2 school to move to D1. Not talking scholarships but the application fee?To go from FBS to FCS football, now costs $5M application fee.
And he did a great job listing sports D2 schools need to add if they want to move up!
Not sure of the direction the WAC wants to take. Since moving their conference headquarters from Denver, CO to Arlington, TX it seems that there will be a larger emphasis on the state of Texas schools (namely the Lone Star & to an extent the Southland). Keep in mind the Southland may have a leg up on the WAC on that front. As the WAC was merging with the Great West Conference and the level of play was down it was discussed (in message boards and forums) that Caly Poly - SLO, UC-Davis, & Sacramento St would be appropriate to join the conference since they were associate members of the Big Sky. On the Metro State side, there was chatter (among message boards and other forums) to bring in Drury & SIU-Edwardsville to accommodate UM - Kansas City & Chicago St respectively. From a personal perspective, throughout all of this, I thought that a WAC - GNAC merger would have done the trick before the Texas schools came on the scene. Yes West Texas A & M would be a nice fit (and hopefully E. New Mexico Univ).
Can you do a video talking about D2 schools who are most ready to go D1 and what their options are? I think it would be interesting to judge schools all over the country on a level field and I know my alma mater GVSU definitely needs to make the jump soon
With all this chatter about UT Arlington possibly jumping to the Missouri Valley Conference, I'm not sure how viable the WAC is long-term.
Everyone who’s left:
1. Abilene Christian
2. California Baptist
3. Southern Utah
4. Tarleton
5. UT Arlington
6. Utah Tech
7. Utah Valley
GUYS THATS BELOW 8 THATS BELOW 8
Yeah I would be surprised if the WAC makes it out as a D1 conference.
@@Chef.WolfHTT i agrée
Cal Baptist waiting for that Big West invite
It'll likely be lower soon. UT Arlington is lookin' pretty likely to get that Missouri Valley invite, Cal Baptist is waiting patiently for that Big West invite(I'd be shocked if that didn't happen), and Tarleton State has made it clear that they want to play at the highest level of college sports-- football in particular-- so they'll probably make a legit push for an FBS invite from either C-USA or possibly the Sun Belt in a few years.
If the WAC can stay alive after all those almost-guaranteed losses/outcomes, then I'd be very impressed. They gotta work on gettin' Oral Roberts, Denver, some of the D2 Texas & Colorado schools, and maybe Northern Colorado as well.
“An all Texas conference”
Translation: the lone star conference (which is all but two Texas teams)
WAC is in a horrible place they need 5-6 of those schools to join D1. They would also need to have nobody leave in the next 2-3 years
The WAC will find a way to avoid death again, just wait
I’ll put my money on CBU getting that big west invite and hightailing it outta there. They don’t get the football money from the WAC, it would be better for donations to be in big west most likely and better for travel, and the basketball quality will be better than a wac without Seattle and GCU.
I'm just hoping that the Big West says yes
@@GlassJoe1337 they have no reason not to. It would give them the perfect even 12!
@@rangersking6699 11 gives them a even 20 game schedule for basketball home and away. Though 12 would be interesting if you only 9 teams home and away
I’m skeptical of a Big West invite. The balance of the universities are public. All but one is Cal State or University of Cal system. Good luck.
@@dennistuel898 pacific has been there before, and CBU being involved would not upset the cal state vs UC balance. I don’t see the negatives here
It's highly doubtful that the Big West would take CBU according to a friend of mine who calls basketball in the BW. Also remember that for this academic year Seattle and GCU are still in the WAC. They don't depart until '25-'26.
The Big Sky and Summit are not going to take any schools unless they lose any. So, the Utah schools have no place to go. It sounds like the Texas schools do not want to join the Southland (which is now very full as well). Cal-Baptist MIGHT get an invite to the WCC if Gonzaga leaves (and I'm still surprised they were not invited with Seattle and GCU) but they will not be invited to the Big West. I only see Cal-Baptist as a possible flight risk. I think the WAC survives because they have an autobid and that's attractive to D2 candidates. Colorado Mesa, Colorado Mines, CSU-Pueblo, Central Oklahoma and one of the Texas schools would put a lot of stability into the WAC.
That all depends on what happens with the Mountain West Conference and PAC 12 conference. If the PAC 12 take 6 Mountain West schools then the Mountain West and few American schools. Mountain West has up to 10 schools they could add to the conference and some of them are in the Big Sky conference. If the Mountain West takes some schools from Conference USA then look for CUSA to raid FCS schools. This all depends on what happens with the PAC 12 and ACC.
@@tylernelson3343 MW commissioner Gloria Nevarez made cherry-picking her conference's members very costly by using the leverage she has. The way the MW's agreement with the Pac-2 is structured, taking the whole MW would be a lot cheaper for Oregon State and Washington State, so they have to either take the entire league or none of it. Otherwise, there are definitely a few certain MW members who the Pac-2 would leave behind.
And this is why the power conferences want to increase the size of the basketball tournament. They are tired of these smaller conferences who get poached trying to lure D2 schools in to stay alive and taking up auto bids.
One, in the hopes that one of their teams will be the next 15/16 seed to shock the world against an overseeded 1/2 seed or a 1/2 seed who forgets how to shoot that night.
Two, they are luring these D2 schools because the commish will do whatever it takes to avoid being rendered obsolete. Only Kliavkoff of the Pac12 has been rendered obsolete.
From what I understand, Southern Utah rejoining the Big Sky is a non-starter due to how they left a few years ago. Idk if any leadership changes have occurred since then that may have warmed relations a bit more though
I had a feeling that might have been the case. Southern Utah had better hope the WAC can remain viable.
Can you clarify Dallas Baptist University's candidacy for the WAC since they are D1 Baseball, but D2 all others.
Left them out as they have no WBB team. IMO: if they were leaving open the possibility of D-I one day, they'd sponsor WBB.
Three of the 8 D1 schools you named would have to add a men’s sport for D1. But they would also have to add a women’s sport for Title IX!
While Metro and West Texas, are clearly not interested. Would they have to add a men’s sport if they ever wanted to move to D1?
5:30 I would take 2020-21 revenue numbers with a geain of salt. Therly are likely deflated due to the tail end of the pandemic.
Just wanted to say you put out amazing videos! Keep it up!
Another great video @d1_360
Random thoughts:
1) I am still not sold that GCU will actually get to change that WAC logo to a WCC one. I just think they have too many red flags. But if Gonzaga leaves then there's no doubt they're in.
2) The show of loyalty by the remaining TX schools is vital to keep the UT schools from going to defcon 1. But if any of these schools does leave it would be Cal Baptist. Especially since none of the schools mentioned as possible replacements are from CA.
3) West Texas A&M needs a new president. They have the facilities, and are ready to move up.
4) I'm wondering if they could convince Denver or Oral Roberts to join the league. They both are geographic outliers in the Summit.
5) The rumors of the WAC's demise have been going on since 2013 and they're still here.
6) I wish Texas A&M Kingsville would make the move to D1.
DU and ORU would be good fits, the problem is it seems the leadership of the WAC is just not up to par.
A few years ago the WAC and the ASUN were conferences to fear and look to as success stories, now both are hanging on by a thread.
Don’t get me wrong, the Colorado 3 + DU would be a good pickup and likely stabilize the conference for some time, but damn it still looks weak compared to where they were only a few years ago.
Love the Javelinas. Ultimately, the combination of low-ish enrollment, low-ish budget, and them being 5.5-6.5 hours from the WAC TX schools is too much. Central Oklahoma (3.5-4.5 hours) is actually a couple hours closer to those 3 WAC TX schools. TAMU Kingsville hasn't been in the best shape in recent years with administrators considering a merger with TAMU Corpus Christi back in 2016. A&M BOR put that to bed back then, but it wouldn't be a surprise if a merger bubbles up again in the future.
The WAC does need to learn how to schedule better.
I personally think we need to kick out some teams from division 1 for either financial issues or not being good at all
IUPUI
@@colorfulmarbles156 Yep, and hell Houston Christian, UMKC, Chicago State, SIU-Edwardsville
@@WDB2005 no leave SIUE.
We neeed it for SIUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU
@@colorfulmarbles156 Fair point, now what about most of the NEC and MAAC the ones not named Saint Peters and Fairleigh Dickinson
@@WDB2005keep the MAAC’s name out yo mouth
I Think Texas-Permian Basin Falcons Will Join The WAC
CAA football has to be in trouble now with Richmond going to the patriot league. Have to think W&M will at least *consider* going there, if not just outright going to the SoCon in all sports as well…
West Texas A&M has better facilities than some FCS programs in my opinion. They NEED a new president because they're ready for D1 and the WAC could definitely use them
Not just about football though, better to have an athletic department with worse football that’s a tighter run ship than a big football program with fuck all else. Might be the case with WTAMU, just saying.
@@nashmonti120 fair enough but football runs realignment, especially at the D1 level
@@LymetimeProductions yeah but like I said it seems as though the other sports have to be ready too. I mean SFA going to south land makes more sense when you consider non-revenue sports travel than anything.
SFA will likely be profitable and good no matter what conference they are in, it’s the other sports that you worry about
Another informative video 👍
How about a video on the state of the UAC. I mean talking about a Saturday afternoon at a Southland basketball doubleheader? Really? Well, I guess that it beats watching paint dry.
Imagine that’s coming, but at this point it’s a the State of the ASUN video
There is a rumor that a Lone Star Conference school is thinking about moving up to D1 and WAC now since Seattle and Grand Canyon is gone. The cost of travel went down before SFAU drove a knife in the back of the WAC like they did knowing that the cost of flying went down. The school is Angelo State. McBroom formally of West Texas A&M on a podcast that yes, he would like to see West Texas A&M move up to D1. He said several large D2 schools are fed up with the D2 leadership right now. He talked about them, Pittsburg State, NW Missouri State, West Georgia, etc as flight risked to D1 now. We just saw West Georgia moving up. What West Texas A&M needs to do is get the president retire, and hire a new one so that they can move up. Plus, there is pressure on Midwestern State by the city leaders and local businesses to have them move up to D1 as well.
Colorado Mesa does sponsor 29 sports. They could easily move up, and is ready to.
Central Oklahoma was making some signs that they could be moving up to D1. Southland is now too full and MVC won't take a D2 school. WAC is the place to be.
There is also talks that someone from within Central Missouri is also hinting to go D1 as well. We might see more D2 schools now willing to jump as Seattle is gone. California Baptist is a place you can recruit talent from California to play the sports which SFA stupidly gave up. Same with UTRGV and Lamar.
Angelo State maybe? 🤨
@@renaeknight9266 Look at how many schools is in the Lone Star Conference? More than 20 now. They could be getting Hardin-Simmons, Mary Hardin Baylor, Howard Payne and East Texas Baptist as they are the last 4 schools in the D3 schools in their conference. That would put Colorado College in a bine as well.
An All Texas FCS conference!
All Texas teams in SLC 6
WAC teams ACU, UTA- no FB. No Tarleton as they get a FBS invite.
That’s 8 schools. Four D2 schools for 12! So depending on the D2 schools, you will have 11 football schools!
You’re forcing the Utah schools and CBU to find other conferences and damaging the SLC!
@@Lawomenshoops WAC is also still by the rules that they are an FBS conference. Angelo State, West Texas A&M and Eastern New Mexico with a couple of Colorado schools could balance Texas side with the Utah/Colorado/New Mexico side. ENM and West Texas A&M could be a protected cross rival. As it was, UAC of the WAC/ASUN schools had a much better fans turning out for football including SFA. Southland had a poor turnout. The fan support is not there in the Southland as most of the schools are in FBS now.
@@Spitfirethedragon until the West Texas President retires, they are off the board. Angelo St. and/or Midwestern St are more likely to be WAC members within the next two years.
The WAC has such an awkward footprint, really the only option they have is the Colorado schools and the D2 Texas schools.
And even after that you still have CBU on an island. And don’t even get me started on the footprint with that WAC-ASUN nonsense.
It’s only for football. Not a big deal
@@the915rooster kinda is though, not cheap to fly a bunch of people, in fact that was a big point in the video