Being big isn't enough anymore
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 20 มิ.ย. 2023
- How good is Victor Wembanyama? What makes him so intriguing? And is he really the best prospect ever? This film breakdown discusses the 2023 #1 pick in the NBA draft, the evolution of big men prospects from Wilt Chamberlain and Kareem Abdul-Jabbar to Shaquille O'Neal and Tim Duncan, and how the game has changed for giant centers and how they can use their size on today.
My NBA App profile on Wembanyama: app.link.nba.com/TB-Wemby
Support at Patreon: / thinkingbasketball
Book: www.amazon.com/Thinking-Baske...
Podcast: player.fm/series/thinking-bas... or at www.stitcher.com/podcast/ben-...
Website: www.backpicks.com
Twitter: @elgee35
Ben Taylor is the author of Thinking Basketball, a Nylon Calculus contributor, creator of the Backpicks Top 40 series & host of the Thinking Basketball podcast.
Stats courtesy:
www.pbpstats.com @bballport
www.basketball-reference.com
stats.nba.com
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Footage in this video is owned by the NBA and its partners. It is intended for critique and education.
Music by Cody Martin (Epiphany instrumental)
#ThinkingBasketball - กีฬา
Here's my Wembanyama profile on the NBA App: app.link.nba.com/TB-Wemby
you don't think he is more like Ralph Sampson, instead of Kareem?
I think he's scary, he can dream shake with 5"/6" added to height/wingspan than Hakeems, shoot 3s better than Gianni's{not by much but enough to keep defenses honest}, and easily has the best 7'5 handles anyone has ever seen... Imma say he's more like future wemby than Kareem or Ralph
5:23... I heard that, and thank you for finally doing a video on the elbow pass.
@@namkeorb😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊😊 🎉
@@ninety1nethagawd umh what does that mean?
Glad I'm not the only person so see Kareem in this kid, not in build and fluidity, but in approach. Hopefully he can stay as durable as Kareem did.
10+ years of me keeping stats on low or underrated players and 15+ years of being a NBA fan and STILL I've never been more excited about a prospect, sure I saw lebron tear up the beginning of the internet but this kid looks straight outta 2k, although only shooting 27% from 3 he's still a threat cause u can't block the 3😂...
Literally a unblockable shot+no jump dunks+insane mobility=5"taller prime KD?😮
Good comparison to me but ya
Having the same durability as Kareem at that height, weight and hops seems a bit far fetched to me. Kareem is a once in a century type guy.
Dude played in the mf french league lmao stop it
@@ZoinksScoob-lu9ko more than me or u could do u jus can't admit it, french wiped team USA in the Olympics ☠️
Stop it he put up avg numbers in the FRENCH LEAGUE! I expect for someone his size to DOMINATE in rebounding!
Pray for this kids health. Doesnt have to be top 50 to have a great career I hope he can just enjoy his time
Pray he learns to love the weight room. Ain't no one expecting him to bulk up like Giannis but he will need more strength
@@andrewagar9700 agreed, just 20-50 extra pounds and he should be ight, he has a advantage no ones talking about. The french beat USA this Olympics because french league is MORE physical than the NBA, not only is he already used to physicality but the NBA is a step down for him, atleast defensively speaking. I wouldn't doubt it if his 21ppg instantly transfers to the NBA maybe not his 5bpg but I feel like offensively he's gonna be more than used to the physicality of NBA players 🤯😅
@@andrewagar9700 But not too much weight as he relies on being light for his guard like playstyle. His conditioning trainer is going to have one hell of a job tying to mold his body so it fits him the most
no one has beaten the height injuries except shaq kind of
@@joezic it's shaq he killed height related injuries when he broke the hoop and smashed the injury part of his career with it😂🥇🏀
It's going to be interesting to see how Wemby adjusts to the NBA. I feel like going to Pop in San Antonio is the PERFECT situation for him to grow to greatness. Look for Tim Duncan and David Robinson. Even Hakeem Olajuwon to take VERY active roles in developing this young man.
Even Chuck and Shaq
Wemby is soft skinny cant punish smaller players not a good shooter no post game low bball iq takes bad shots etc. He will be bol bol 2.0
@@Adj8llkThat’s also what they said about KG, Durant, and Giannis and look how they turned out
@@domination4892no one said that ab KG, KD has been injured half his career, and Giannis had a generational body transformation (and is way shorter)
@@domination4892 FACTS. TOOK THE WORDS RIGHT OUT OF MY MOUTH. Dirk was skinny, too. About 220 when he entered the league. Jokic wasn't skinny, but he was only 245-250, as opposed to the 280-285 that he is, now. Olajuwon came into the league at 230-235 before retiring at about 260-265.
Bottom line is THIS: nobody leaves out of the NBA at the same weight that they came in at. Wemby doesn't even have his grown man body, yet. He's what? 18? 19? C'mon, man. He'll grow out and up. Another inch or two. Then, put on another 40-50 pounds throughout his career. Kareem was 225 as a rookie, and retired at 267.
JJ Redick got an episode with him on his show his perspective is professional, humbling and patient for a 19 year old he’s gonna be a serious problem instant impact for the spurs
Just ur typical eu type of player
people said the same about zion when he was being drafted. turns out hes a lazy sexual deviant.
@@dextew69 i was gonna say u wrong coz look how much of an asshole Embiid is but i remembered he not from EU lol
a human chopstick a problem ? i personally think he will struggle greatly in the nba lol
@@dextew69 so he will be dominating the league like the other players over the last years?
Loved this video. I'm really glad you emphasized Kareem in this profile. For the last year people have been struggling for a comp and I've been saying "Imagine Kareem, but he's the player Kareem would have developed into if he was born 19 years ago" he didn't develop the skyhook and post moves, he developed the KD jumper and the playground crossovers. Watching him play in France, it's impossible to convey to people just watching occasional highlights how many shots he changes or disrupts without even getting a hand on the ball. I believe his defensive impact will be at an all star level on day one and he'll hopefully have 15-20 healthy years to work on his offense. I am a true believer, I think his potential is limitless. I also think he's actually about 7'7 and not 7'3 but that's for another day.
he’s definitely not 7’7 but he’s 7’5 in shoes
Not close to 7’7
I agree he's way bigger than everyone is saying. If anyone doubts it look at the picture of him next to JJ Reddick yesterday and google JJ Reddick with other 7 footers like Embiid and Dwight Howard.
@@ry_an. He's humongous. They are not being honest about his height because there are already injury concerns about guys over 7' but you can look at him next to Chet, him next to Gobert, him next to any other known players and he's not slightly taller than them he's MUCH taller than they are.
@@rextside well dwights not a legit 7 footer he’s 6’9/10
Kareem was also really into taking care of his body and stretching, etc. Wemby seems to be the same way, much earlier. Hopefully he has a long career.
Such a good take, he reminds of Kareem so much build and flexibility wise. Hopefully it helps wemby sustain a career as long as he did
@@2ClutchCoreyIf he has any sense at all, he should have a few conversations with Kareem about that. Maybe Wemby could get Kareem to teach him the basics of the skyhook, too.
Kareem/Porzingis archetype to me. The one potential problem I see with Victor is protecting himself on jumpers. Whoever works with him should try to eliminate any jumpers leaning forward or the one foot three pointers. Mostly because people don't know how to guard someone of his size as it is. So most defenders are going to try to be as close to him as possible to try to affect his jumper which is going to eliminate his landing space and being that size it won't be as easy to adjust in the air to the ground. Hope he does his thing in the NBA.
He's a bum and a bust. He played Euroleague for a season and it was way too physical for him so he left-injured. Those are 10-minute quarters and 34-game seasons... There he shot a dismal 30% from 3, a disastrous 35% FG, couldn't rebound even as the tallest dude on the court, and emerged as a liability late in games because he couldn't shoot free throws. He goes to Mets where they play 1 game a week and just like the Ignite promotional machine, make sure they showcase their product for sale at all costs. Then we saw him in FIBA last year where large players beat the living crap out of him and Kenneth Lofton Jr violated his manhood. I'm done with the crap mainstream parrots, sports talk conmen, and promotions try selling me. They tried selling me the Lakers, the Suns as a thooper team, the Celtics as a team of destiny, the Bucks as an unstoppable force, the BLM MVP Embiid, Scoot Henderson as the 2nd overall pick, and Wemby as a generational talent. STFU. Just STFU. I'm happy to have profited heavily off my own logic, and what I saw, not what I heard. I'm laying a monstrous bet that "the field" wins rookie-of-the-year over Wemby. The award likely goes to Chet Holmgren who is an absurd +700 currently. So in conclusion, Wemby is 7'2'' vaporware (or who knows how tall he is because we can't even get an honest response there), Scoot is an Ignite promotional product, neither of these dudes will flash in a 30fps NBA broadcast, and I'm here to mop up the bloody mess of red ink the dumb money leaves behind. Thx!
I swear to God if he gets zaza'd I'm gonna lose my mind
I feel like with NBA schemes he will clear that up. It seems like he makes shots more difficult than they have to be. Isoing on the perimiter only to take a stepback 3 is more complicated than simply standing there and shooting over a defender.
The capacity to generate easy inside looks is the most important aspect of basketball.
agreed. if he doesnt improve his strength/handling/footwork then he will struggle to generate easy shots off of drives and postups
@@user-jw9rn4lt4y his entire game still has plenty of time to develop, but for a 7ft5 wing his handles are undoubtedly already better than anyone else his height, and no kap for post game, if he learns the dream shake it's over😅 Hakeems move but with 5 inches more in height and 6 inches more on wingspan 🤯 after development he has a chance to be very scary lol
Congratulations for the opportunity to write for the NBA app! You have some of the best NBA content on TH-cam. Glad to see the recognition.
Was about to sleep, thank you thinking basketball
Loved both videos. Great analysis of Wembanyama. Having San Antonio as the #1 draft pick is probably the best situation for him. He'll have a great coach, great trainers and following the footsteps of 2 Hall of Fame centers. Strength and conditioning will be a big part for him to improve his game. Can't wait to see what he becomes...
Wemby on The Old Man And The Three was very interesting, I’d highly recommend checking it out to get a feel for how he sees the game and his general temperament and philosophy on life.
Very very unique personality and talent. This kid feels really special
Nicola Jokic has reminded us recently that size and reach is still extremely useful. A lot of fans under-valued and under-estimated him because of his lack of athleticism, but height and reach is arguably even more important than great athleticism. Past a certain point, it doesn't matter if you have the worst vertical and the slowest running speed in the league. If your release point is high enough, you're still going to be virtually impossible to block, and you're also going to still be very good at blocking and rebounding. It's a lot easier to time a block if you don't even have to jump. Being super tall (and having disproportionately long arms to further increase your reach) is extremely useful for making it easy for people to pass to you, and also makes it easier to make passes without getting intercepted.
I'm a big believer that a team entirely made up of big men could work really well precisely because of how easy it would be for them to pass to each other. Big men are often seen as centres by default, but I think it's easy to forget just how useful height is for virtually any other role in basketball, simply because the tallest players usually aren't used as much for those other roles, but Jokic is a good example of a big man being used in a more versatile way. His lack of athleticism sort-of forced him to be more well rounded, and to rely more on shooting and passing instead of trying to drive to the hoop. It's interesting how this parallels the way Wilt Chamberlain shifted his play-style later in his career, but it's also reminiscent of how Bill Russell played, as well as (much more recently) Arvydas Sabonis.
People often assume that you wouldn't want a team made up entirely of big men because they tend to over-estimate the extent to which being shorter is an important part of other positions. In my opinion, there'd be nothing wrong with having an entire team of big men, provided that they were well-rounded enough, it's just that it's nearly impossible to actually secure contracts with that many tall well rounded players, and to have them on the same team. The salary cap alone is going to be a major problem.
Jokic is already doing everything this kid can POTENTIALLY do. What are we so hyped about
bro If someone ever was able to potentially become what jokic is, that is a sure fire lottery pick let alone wemby's other skills and size. I don't think him and jokic are remotely similar however. Sure they are both great passing bigs with good spacing and a handle, but jokic dominates in power whereas wemby is mostly finesse and length. But then again, asking why people are exciting and then go to compare his skill set to one of the best players (peak wise) in nba history is almost laughable
@@nugget9997 you read too much into that. I meant why are we so hyped about something we already have and can watch.
Both videos were amazing Ben. I´m glad the nba is giving you the credit you deserve.
best breakdown i've seen on wemby. really showing why hes a unique talent while glossing over his floor and his potential ceiling
He reminds me of a young Kristaps, he used to put the ball on the floor quite a bit but because of his body proportions always struggled to enforce himself downlow. I'm intrigued by him, but his path to greatness isn't the most clear to me right now. And that's not even being as honest as I could be about his injury potential 😅
If Jokic was able to be where he's at now with hard work and high intelligent play, I can't see how pop doesn't bring out a magnificent player once again.
Considering that ifthe rumors are true, Pop held off retiring when they got the #1 pick because he knew they were going to take Wemby.
No matter the era if you're a big, you have to get good at doing the things required as a big.
Congrats on having the NBA recognise you! Well deserved!
As a Spurs fan, to say I'm excited for the future is an understatement. Praying he can stay healthy.
He's a bum and a bust. He played Euroleague for a season and it was way too physical for him so he left-injured. Those are 10-minute quarters and 34-game seasons... There he shot a dismal 30% from 3, a disastrous 35% FG, couldn't rebound even as the tallest dude on the court, and emerged as a liability late in games because he couldn't shoot free throws. He goes to Mets where they play 1 game a week and just like the Ignite promotional machine, make sure they showcase their product for sale at all costs. Then we saw him in FIBA last year where large players beat the living crap out of him and Kenneth Lofton Jr violated his manhood. I'm done with the crap mainstream parrots, sports talk conmen, and promotions try selling me. They tried selling me the Lakers, the Suns as a thooper team, the Celtics as a team of destiny, the Bucks as an unstoppable force, the BLM MVP Embiid, Scoot Henderson as the 2nd overall pick, and Wemby as a generational talent. STFU. Just STFU. I'm happy to have profited heavily off my own logic, and what I saw, not what I heard. I'm laying a monstrous bet that "the field" wins rookie-of-the-year over Wemby. The award likely goes to Chet Holmgren who is an absurd +700 currently. So in conclusion, Wemby is 7'2'' vaporware (or who knows how tall he is because we can't even get an honest response there), Scoot is an Ignite promotional product, neither of these dudes will flash in a 30fps NBA broadcast, and I'm here to mop up the bloody mess of red ink the dumb money leaves behind. Thx!
From point guard dominated league back to the bigs, but not in the same way as the olden days. Jokic, Giannis, AD, and new prospects like Chet and Victor. Basketball is a game of heights after all. Excited to see what this kid can bring to the table.
It was never dominated by point guard, tell me how many point guard won a FMVP ? Curry 1 in 2022, and the last time was like 1988 Isaiah Thomas. Lebron, Duncan, KD, Dirk, KG, Kawhi dominated the last 20 years … Only Kobe and Wade lead a team to a chip and they were Big SG.
So the gaame was always dominated by big men or wings, the only exception are Curry and Isaiah Thomas.
I also find it funny how Lebron who was 6’9 275 in Miami so heavier than Karl Malone, wasn’t considered a big just because of his playstyle, wich is closer to D.Rose or Wade playstyle than to Shaq or Malone himself … Lebron is a big, just like KD who is nearly 7ft with a 7’5 wingspan, i don’t care if they can handle, pass or shoot the ball they are big men for me, prime KD could go coast to coast like Giannis.
Hey, love the channel getting recognized by the NBA, this is channel is one of the best I've ever seen, you definitely deserves the success
dude congrats on working with the NBA, love your breakdowns
Thank you, someone else said it. Hype is good and all, but we have to be realistic about the possibilities he can reach.
Also this whole thing of him being the greatest prospect in sports history is a huge reach especially considering that he is not even the best in this sport.
Hopefully he can stay healthy 🙏🏽
This is the type of analysis I needed. Good stuff fam.
there is no better basketball analysis anywhere on the internet than right here. great video as always keep up the good work
Nah the former NBA players are way better than this channel. Dude seems like he reads to much Analytics doctrine, and has never actually played the game. He constantly criticize long two's/jumpers as ineffective, even if they are going in and putting points on the scoreboard...How you criticize scoring points??? that is bad basketball analysis
Being big truly isn’t enough, performance matters more
The size doesn't matter, it is how you use it that matters
damnit why doesn't she understand
Deadly with a dagger
Eating isnt enough, digesting the food is what matters
the thing you can say both in a bed room and basketball court
There’s nothing about todays game that suggests the post up isn’t viable. Jokic proved that the post up can still be the most dominant play type in basketball and Giannis would have much better scoring resilience if he had a low post game
I agree to an extent. I feel that the post-up, along with the mid-range, is still very viable, however it's become more specialized and exclusive. Meaning that a player can be allowed to have a steady diet of those shots if they can hit them at above league average and generate efficient offense from them. So only the best players at those moves will be allowed to do them
The post-up is viable, but not for Wemby. He's too tall and slim. Jokic and Luka, the two players who incorporate post-play in their game and their team's offense, are both built like semis. They roll over people because of their sturdy and low center of gravity. Wemby is like Durant, Kareem, and Giannis. Lanky, agile, and slender. They have bodies built for rim protection and a very threatening offensive ceiling.
@@szethcaligo3735 Kareem though was probably the most dominant post scorer ever though, the skyhook has always been labeled "the most sure 2 points in basketball" for a reason. That skyhook was unguardable and always hit it's mark. Yes Kareem couldn't push defenders around, but as long as he got in range he would get his 2 points ALWAYS. So I agree with what @francisayala9310 said. Kareem was the best paint scorer ever at the time and IMO if wemby could develop the same we would see him warp the post around him just like Kareem did.
@@bowmain1577I feel like having only 1 example of a slender guy posting up efficiently and it being a shot type so difficult that it's connected to 1 person means it's not very viable/easy to do.
@@bowmain1577 You make a fair point, and I'm not saying he can't be a great scorer in the paint. Giannis scores almost exclusively from the paint and he's not a prototypical post player. But the importance is he doesn't play in the paint. He uses his athleticism, long stride, and wingspan to get high release floaters, midranges, and dunks. That's probably where Wemby'll excel too.
Probably the most honest breakdown of wemby's concerns i have seen, great vudeo
Best analysis about Victor I have seen so far. Great job! I think he will struggle on offense at least for a couple of years but will have a great impact on D immediately.
I really think people have made a mistake thinking the post-up is dead. Any of those HoF big guys you mentioned could be plopped right into today's NBA and still be incredibly dominant. Imagine if Jokic never shot beyond 15 feet, he would still be an incredible player and a value add on offense (just in terms of his scoring, let alone his passing). Yes, Kendrick Perkins or Kristaps Porzingis should never have gotten post-ups, but playing in the post is not inherently inefficient. Victor is skinny right now but i hope he's not totally eschewing his offensive development in the paint to shoot stepback thees. A 6' guard can pullup off the dribble. Victor's elite height and atheleticism give him a unique advantage near the rim, not handling the ball or out near the perimeter. This guy is playing on a nerf hoop, I hope he and the Spurs don't forget that
post ups are dead for those who arent good enough at it, which is 99% of the league. and even so, zone defenses make it waaay more difficult to post up compared to back then. this is kind of why even talented post scoring bigs are still somewhat ineffective.. you have to be able to capitalize when the defense collapses with playmaking, so not only do you have to be a good post scorer, but also a good decision maker/passer. there are a few exceptions for this but it is much more difficult to score down low compared to the eras of bigs
U weren’t allowed to double for real back then. Post up is dead. Rules are different. Flopping, 5 second rule
@@user-jw9rn4lt4y Shaq averaged 28 and 11 on 58% FG in the 2001-02 which was the first year they implemented the new “zone defense ” rules lol.
@@WalterFlanagin Double teams have been 100% legal since the beginning of the nba lol.
@@NikoBellic20080 “Isolation post-ups were the go-to offensive play. Teams would place all their players above the three-point arc, which gave the post-player isolation with no help. If a team were to send a player to a double team, they would leave a player wide open. Under the illegal defense rule, teams had to respect non-shooting centers like Greg Ostertag as a floor spacer.
Getting physically imposing centers like Karl Malone, Hakeem Olajuwon, and Charles Barkley’s deep post position was almost a guaranteed foul or score since there was no help defense”
I'd love to see him get to play with an elite PnR guard like Trae or Luka. That dunk radius is so massive, catching lobs from Trae would be just silly, and a 2 man game between Luka and Wemby would actually introduce the first triple team on a PnR
One of your best , if only because it shows how much you are not carried away by trands but really talk pure basketball
Keep up the great work!
@ThinkingBasketball This works so good I hope the NBA renumerates you for it!
I think it would be worth mentioning that size never really was enough. Even in Wilt's era, plenty of huge and athletic guys didn't go beyond weak starting player. Wilt (and others) didn't dominate because of his size, but because of the skillset possessed.
How many times should I have mentioned it? ;)
In the 50s it did matter tho
Wilt played janitors bro. Wilt had no one his equal in terms of size and athleticism outside of bill Russell
Wilt couldn’t shoot
@@ThinkingBasketball I think it's always worth to be bolded strongly. A lot of people think that in the earlier eras you only had to be big and athletic. Look no further than in the comments below.
Most guys this size are super injury prone. Gonna be interesting to see how it goes
That's awesome the NBA asked you to make this video. Congrats man, you've earned it.
I'm intrigued with Wemby's playmaking potential. Probably won't be as developed until he becomes a more consistent shot creator but bigs being even a partial hub of the offense has helped kickstart young teams and gives flexibility for the FOs to invest and develop the type of talent around that big. Another example was the growth of Bam when the Heat finally moved away from Whiteside and they borrowed concepts from the Warriors to involve Bam's playmaking/passing with their development of moving shooters. We saw it this year with Domas and newfound two man game with Kevin Huerter with the Kings which opened up the offense for everyone on that team. I remember Al Horford back in 2016 being a connective passer/screener to help move the ball around and get IT efficient looks and making him a 25+ ppg scorer. If Wemby's promise holds up, its because it will allow the Spurs FO to build a young team with length/size all over.
Watching Wemby feels like watching a 2K noob trying to use a 7'5" 99 ovr while messing up all of the timings
You know what else makes the truly great ones? Character! Also this guy is his own archetype, he is one of one, we see how it goes for him, personally i don't expect a hall of fame career.
p.s. i love your videos and podcast keep it up
Man hopefully no early major injuries downside this kid and wishing him the best success in the league. But I have to say the amount of pressure the media and the fans bringing on him already is insane. Hopefully doesn’t break him in the long term.
The Kareem comparison is great. I don't think he needs to be overpowering in the post like Shaq was, but he does need to gain strength to not be bullied himself. IMHO once he gets into the NBA he can focus his offensive development on two things first:
1. Proficiency with the mid-post/low post turnaround. He doesn't need to hit it like MJ does, but maybe Lamarcus Aldridge would be a good target to strive for.
2. Jokic's running floater, which combined with Wemby's size, mobility and fluidity will really give defenses fits (just like the skyhook did back in the day).
Once those two moves become automatic for him, it will unlock everything else. Once he develops his court sense and vision more (we've already seen flashes of it) and becomes a better distance shooter (35% would be nice for someone like him, but if he gets into the 37-39 range, good Lord...) then he might become truly unstoppable.
He is in the line of great big men with amazing foot work and finesse game. Kareem. Robinson. Hakeem. And while not getting banged up so much will protect against injury, the extreme footwork movements he has execute that emulate wing players at the perimeter maybe too much for his 7 '3 frame. He may injure himself without any contact at all. Just the physics of it all.
Man this kid has a lotta hype to live up to.
This ia rhe only analysis i trusted
Watching this kid makes me realize how much Porzingis skillset gets slept on
Dirk Nowitzki did it first
I honestly think that Kareem would still develop the sky hook, and I think Victor might want to develop it too.
I don't know that you can just call all the past bigs as only needing to be big. Olajuwon and Kareem were very skilled. Wilt led the league in assists as a center, something that wouldn't be accomplished until many decades later with Jokic. You can say that the more perimeter oriented nature of the game has changed things for bigs. But I don't like the connotation that these past players only needed to be big. Many of the greatest bigs of all time were much more than just their size.
Facts!!!
Wilt led the league in assists in a fuck-you-unwinning way. Dude passed up easy shots to prove a point. Immensely talented, and also kinda a dumbass.
You're hole statement is illogical and doesn't even try to negate the quoted point. "Olajuwon and Kareem were very skilled" - of course you dummy, nobody denies that. The point is that with less skill they would've also been quite successful anyway. That's why there used to be a lot of unskilled centers in the league in the first place.
Yeah even in the past you always got these other tantalizing prospects who had the size, near freakish athleticism but in some cases were more raw coming out. Those guys had the biggest hurdles to overcome because they had to instinctively succeed playing the big man role and the niches regarding it especially in a more enclosed half court style offense. The game being perimeter based just means bigs who have the skills to play in that environment can just as easily succeed without needing a 3-point shot requisite. If anything much like how shot creating big wings are demanded to be better ball handlers and playmakers which add offensive versatility to their game, same can be said with bigs with a versatile offensive game. Especially because ultimately bigs see the half court at all angles better than small guards even if they are good passers. AND can make harder passes (ala the skip pass) when defenses try put the clamps on a specific action that helps move the ball around.
Yeah this channel sounds like Reddit hot takes from 12-year old kids. NBA history is littered with big men who became busts because being tall was their only attribute. This has been true for all decades. This isn't some new groundbreaking phenomenon.
There is one fact which remains true since the game was invented, when both teams are equally matched, the team with the better center always wins
The defensive breakdown on the NBA App was intriguing. His block radius is uncanny. 2k is going to have to reprogram their defensive coding to adjust to him!
Lol like 2k is going to adjust anything
@@tonyschimmoeller they did for Steph's 3pt shooting
He reminds me of Ralph Sampson, tbh. Let’s just hope his career lasts longer, that he has more health and can fulfill his potential at a maximum level. Sampson who was also a VERY hyped prospect (people forget), had incredible height/length as well, was slender and very mobile, a great athlete, blocking shots, catching lobs, was crazy at them rim attacks, he could play more on the perimeter and had a jumper (obviously not out to 3pt land because that wasn’t the game back then), had handles, he even matched up pretty well with Hakeem due to the fact that Olajuwon could be more of a center while Ralph more of a PF… They even made their way to the Finals at an early stage of their careers, imagine what they could’ve done if Ralph stayed healthy and such (because you could also argue that he WASN’T mentally wired to live up to an all-time great potential like that)!
Its hard enough to luck into athletic bigs who also have the skills that scale amazingly well. It is even harder to find them being durable as hell. I know people have mentioned how the modern medicine has helped athletes but it hasn't stopped Anthony Davis from averaging 60 some games played prior to 2018 (and had 2 of his best seasons playing the most games around that time at 75). Its no mystery either as he's got some chronic shoulder issue that he's been nursing even at the college level. Doesn't also help the way he moves biomechanically leads to his leg injuries he's suffered. If anything the amazing testament is that with the modern medicine, he's managed 11 seasons playing in the NBA whereas in the past he's probably last as long as Sampson did and retire early due to injuries. So it would be interesting to see if Wemby could show durability even before his first contract extension comes up.
So refreshing to listen to a sober, realistic analysis as opposed to the rampant hyperbole and exaggeration you see from too many so-called talent evaluators. I always appreciate Ben's perspective, but never more so than when everyone else seems to be completely unhinged.
All i really heard was a generic take that offered nothing new.
We'll see, great job
The skill cap in the nba just keeps rising
No, it doesn't. The NBA requires *less* skill now than it did 30 years ago. You need a good jump-shot, a layup, and passable dribbling skills. That's it. You don't need to work on your footwork, you don't need to protect your dribble, you don't need to learn a fadeaway, a hook, or any back-to-basket game whatsoever. You certainly don't need to learn how to maneuver in traffic, because to counter the "zone", teams are resorting to spacing. The bigs *still* can't just camp out under the basket, because of the defensive 3-second rule, so you just have a different style of iso clearout.
What doesn't work anymore is *strength*, because the 2001 zone defense changes made it far too easy to bring help against a big working in the post, which is post play is all but dead in the NBA. Sorry, but a 7 foot guy making jump shots and layups is not evidence of more skill than Olajuwon's footwork down low.
@@AaronMichaelLong It's a skill based game now. It requires it. Back then, you use to be able to use physicality, etc. to cheat the game.
@@AaronMichaelLongyou realize back in the 80s and 90s that there were guys on the court just because they were big and played hard with almost zero skill? Guys like Vanderbilt get played off the floor cause their lack of skill.
In the NBA you need to have some tangible skill to play deep into the playoffs. Not just play hard and be an enforcer just like the 90s
@@AaronMichaelLongnot true. Everyone in the NBA needs to be able to do something. Explain how dudes like Duncan Robinson and Jared Vanderbilt were essentially unplayable for stretches during the playoffs.
You need a three ball, you need elite shot making, elite defense, playmaking, 1 on 1 creation, rim attacking, you need stamina. No more 6’7 dennis Rodman’s averaging 4ppg
@@AaronMichaelLongalmost everything u said isn’t true
Webby shoots 29% from 3. I think we're in the middle of an over-correction, where tall players are forcing the 3 to adapt to the new game, but we'll see in 5-10 years that not everyone has to force the 3.
Durant also shot that clip as a rookie. Wemby is also a terrific free-throw shooter already, which is a strong sign he's a naturally capable shooter overall. Time will tell if that three-ball develops or it eludes him like it did with Anthony Davis.
29% with him as the defenses main focus isn't bad when he gets elite teammates for space he could improve 5-10% tbh
@@siphillis Durant was taking 2.6 a game in an era where the 3pt shot wasn’t as valuable. Webby is taking 5 a game at a 29% clip…. Yikes 😳. Hopefully he improves
@@siphillisIt was 28% actually, and that was in the French league which uses the shorter FIBA three-point line.
@@kb.brandyn6798 Yup wemby played on a bad team that he was their main offensive weapon. One of his teammates even said he forced shots that otherwise he would not have taken if he played on a team with other capable scorers.
Goat nba YTchannel
I said this months ago!
(+30 Year LA Lakers fan)
Spurs fans should hope Victor talks to Kareem and make him his mentor 💯 dude was the best College prospect of All time Coming in the League! He would go #1 if he were in this draft.
In a 3 year period of College his UCLA team went 88-2 won 🏆🏆🏆3 straight championships, College player of the year 3 years straight & NCAA Tournament MVP 3 years straight 🔥
In the NBA Kareem is arguably the greatest of all-time 🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆 six championships six MVPs and a longevity stat king 🤴🏿. 7'2 played 20 seasons career near 25 ppg 11 reb 3 blks 1 steal.
We have seen Victor before with Kareem. He had all the moves but was handicapped due to the Era he played in. Anyone tell you differently is a liar 💯.
Historically most other Bigs 7'2 & up had short careers & injuries early that ultimately changed their playstyle completely. To name a few Yao Ming, Hakeem, Ralph Samson, Manute Bol, & Kristaps Porziņģis.
Victor has waaay too much hype 💯.
(+30 Year LA Lakers fan)
You forgot to mention Dirk Nowitzki
I feel bad for the expectations, I dont see him being a bron/jordan two way HOF impact guy but instead will be the best defender with servicable offense like garnett
Yeah the movement demands are different now -- hopefully he stays healthy!
@@ThinkingBasketball just subbed to your patreon youre the best content out there
He's mentioned he wants to bulk up and have a Giannis type body. Wouldn't be surprised if he wants to model his game after him in other ways.
I think it would make sense for him to work on using his handles to get within 5-10 ft of basket. Then develop quick back to the basket moves, (spins, jordan ball/head fake type fadeaways, etc.) To take advantage of his size and mobility against small/quicker and bigger/slower defenders alike.
Focus more on getting to 40% at 3pt range, instead of honing his mid-range game.
If he could push to the inside using his handles, imagine a dream shake but with 8' of arms to move with😂
He body everyone if he develops Hakeems move mixed with his
If he is handled correctly, he will never be Giannis’ weight. Giannis is 6’11 and thus he is able to carry his 270+ pounds just fine. Wemby actually shouldn’t pack on too much muscle outside of his lowerbody. I feel like a lighter upper half and stronger base will be the key to stardom, like luka. Luka has tree trunks for legs, and just slimmed out his upper half this offseason. I ser wemby being in the 270 range also which will not look like 270 on giannis. For him to look like Giannis at 270, would mean he would have to be 300+. Embiid is 300+ and can never stay on the court. However, I hope the best for him, he is disgustingly good
@@purpleirklegrovestreetU wrote all dat dumb shit to be wrong Giannis aint no 270 never was that his weight he's like 240-245 he's to lean and tall to be 270 u crazy
@@purpleirklegrovestreet I actually think his extreme height makes it tricky between having to manage his potential for injury vs him reaching his ceiling on the basketball court.
If he really wants to be a superstar leve big man, he needs to do it inside just as much as outside.
But this is tricky when he has a thin frame.
Handles are nice. But big men with handles aren't quite as necessary a tool to have in my opinion.
If his shot creation and variety is on the level of a KD, he's a more effective mid range merchant. You can always flank Wemby with cutters and moving shooters when the promise of his shot creation comes through. Because in the playoffs mid range efficiency and shot difficulty creation becomes king.
wemby da 🐐 already. the way nba develops their player, he will certainly be the 🐐. his ceilings probably 10 chips.
I'm glad this video doesn't over sensationalize his talents like other media has, its much more fair to him and the fans
Well, I just saw Jokic punish the Miami Heat in the low post-playing inside out🥴 y'all got to stop OVER HYPING THIS KID!
I think the same, if he reaches Porzingis-level offense I think that will be great for him, I don't see his dribbling abilities being of any use so he should focus on shooting and rim-rolling. He can surpass Porzingis passing-wise however. His real impact will be on defense.
porzingis was a better prospect.
how can dribbling not be of use. thats ridiculous
i don’t expect him to slice dudes up on the perimeter but if he turns into a good shooter his handle will be essential attacking hard close outs.
Thanks
I saw the Kareem archetype during the JJ Redick Podcast. Him sitting in the chair looked like Kareem sitting in interviews back in the day.
Damn
KAT really changed the game
Reminds me of Ralph Sampson with better ball skills/shooting . I’m afraid for his body type versus the rigors of 82 games… knees, other joints, Cartlidge, on such a slender frame while his body hasn’t matured yet. Hopefully, they are smart about his minutes and he has good strength and conditioning coaches.
I like the Sampson connection physically, but I shy away from it because of their feel/awareness/approach.
@@ThinkingBasketballI immediately thought of Ralp when I saw this kid..
@@99alfailiwaqain51Same.
Wemby is certainly going to be a fun player to watch no matter what.
Good video :)
I honestly don't see the "greatest prospect in the history of basketball" hype that the media has sold. I do think his mobility and jump shooting will make help him offensively early on in his career and his length will make him a very good weak side defender in the paint right away. But in order to dominate the boards and be a significant presence in the paint offensively he'll have to gain some mass, similar to how Giannis evolved his physique.
He has the size that very few have ever had. He has the offensive skills that nobody his size ever had. Those 2 things combine for the greatest prospect ever. Doesn't mean anything if it doesn't result in something, though.
@@tonyschimmoellerright, greatest prospect means incredibly high ceiling if enough goes right
Having your unicorn center jacking 3's lolllllllll
Being big was never enough. The old days had big bodies to come off the bench for fouls and to spell minutes for their starter-sure, but most of the starting bigs had skill necessary for their era. It's really a matter of freedom of position-less style now and freedom of movement with the ball in their hand all players never had before. Bigs have always wanted to play like guards but were never allowed to.
Sure there's been guys who were just freakishly tall like Manute Bol and Muresan, but even those guys played like 20 minutes a game or less...this evolution has been in the works for 20 years even. The true Centers died out with Shaq and Yao. Boogie was playing like a big guard, but there was still the Dwights and Deandre Jordans of the world-but the post big was already fading out. If Wemby changes the game, i expect NBA rosters to reserve several spots for big bodies to throw at Wemby and Joker and Embiid. Let's see how Wemby does with big strong guys like Steven Adams pushing him around.
Excellent post. Imagine Bill Laimbeer guarding Wemby. Wemby would curl up in a fetal position
I honestly think he'll have a David Robinson type career projection. On defense I think he'll be a DPOY type player for multiple years, but on offense I think he'll always be limited in certain aspects and won't reach the lofty expectations some people seem to have for him
David Robinson is a HOFer, 2x champ, MVP, and made the 50 and 75 greatest players teams. He also scored 71 points in a game while averaging 29.4 ppg that season.
Robinson is one of the 10 greatest centers to ever play. If Wemby is a modern David Robinson, the Spurs will win a lot of games.
@dvs620 yea I think homie didn’t know D Rob was a beast on offense early in his career. He probably only remember D rob circa 2000’s
@@dvs620 to be fair, DRob was able to do that because he was able to focus on offense because of Rodman, BUT, that isn't to take away. It's just we were finally able to see what he could do on offense that season because of it. He had a high ceiling for scoring, it's just tough to put the energy in when you're also being one of the best defenders in the league constantly.
@@brentbronze And Wemby will have Sochan for defense, who also wears #10.
@@kemlloyd5192 I think its more about understanding the profile of a player David Robinson is to get a better understanding of IF it actually applies to Wemby. THinking basketball did a video on D Rob in his one of the best basketball peaks and it wasn't like he didn't have inherent flaws in being a scoring big man and before the injury in '96. For one I think Robinson was more of a stronger, explosive, face up 7 footer coming out of college than Wemby. Which is why Robinson did more damage playing in the high post/elbow than an actual classic post up big who parked themselves by the rim and asked for the ball. So with Wemby that may be where he would operate closer to the perimeter and drag mismatches to him. But of course with his ability to pull up and having a smoother jumper, he can attack the basket in other ways.
It matters more on defense. He will be a defensive stud with tons of blocks and opponents will shoot poorly when he contests. On offense he will be flawed for a while until he matures a lot. He might look like a legit bum on offense for a while
It’s going to more of a problem on defense. Everyone’s going to be able to drop below his center of gravity and rive before he can react. Those Bambi legs won’t hold up against anyone down low. He should be a good help defender but he’s gonna be a major liability guarding guys one-on-one.
@@grahamstrouse1165 They can drive past him but still get swatted. I imagine so many unexpected blocks by him. Fundamentally he will be shaky but he will make up for it.
@@nts4906 Yeah he has the length/athleticism to do what Embiid does which is recover after the initial blow by and erase the shot coming from behind. If his ball tracking skills are on that level he will constantly find ways to have his hands on the play. Which the only way he'll miss it are due to mental lapses as a young player trying to read the game.
UCLA: not licensed for use.
Thinking basketball: that's adorable
Beautiful music 😁
What we are all thinking but didn’t know how to say. Another banger video
People forgot that Dirk Nowitzki existed, If he was in the draft right now people would say he is the next KD. 2002 - 2007 was Dirk’s athletic prime, a quick and fluid 7ft SF/PF with handles, and I see the same motor skill talent that Wemby has. Wemby is in a era that he can use these skills to the absolute fullest potential. all of us can see a bright future of Big men 6’9 and up, using skills that were discouraged before.
Dirk is a choker and poor on defense
This bum is no Dirk. He is another bol bol and that is it.
@@ry_an.Don’t know why you are saying and what you are saying is irrelevant. Just saying that Dirk was one of the OGs of what people describe as a “Unicorn”, and showed a glimpse of the future of what Big men can do
@@ry_an.Dirk changed the game but color people don't want to admit it😂 color people mad cuz Jokic is the best player in the league 😂
@@Adj8llk I’m a coloured lad and not mad Jokic is the best player
Only one center in NBA history has demonstrated the skills to succeed in all these eras: Brook Lopez.
They can’t treat this kid, like he’s Tim Duncan. Pop, has to let him shot 3s even if he’s miss. He’s a 7’5 SF. They can’t have him put on 50Lbs, then he’s just Porzingis
Can he be an SF? That’s where I think his greatest potential would be. he’d then still be able to be paired with legit Centers and PF’s for a ridiculously sized lineup.
Do you really want him guarding small forwards full time? His best skill imo is his paint protection, if he's not of a c or pf you are neutering that.
Greatest potential is at center spot, regardless of whether he hones his 3pt shooting ability.
He should be guarding the rim not on an island with guys like Tatum
He'd be the slowest SF in the league + shoots 29% from 3. He'd be a liability.
@@DrWNoLs 🥶
Kareem wasn’t just big. He was agile, had finesse and an inimitable scoring ability. He is also an underrated defender and passer. Had he not been tasked to score in the post I’m sure he would have evolved with a 3 point shot had the game called for it. He only shot 12 of them over 20 years!
Enjoyable vid
I think he should change his shooting arc to be lower. He's 7'4, he doesnt need a high arch shot, and while it theoretically increases the basket width by dropping in straight from above, it also changes the shot form and increases the travel distance of the ball. I think he'd benefit off of giving it a much lower arch.
That’s why I’m not insanely hyped on him, how big is too big. The best shooter of all time is 6ft 3, probably honestly 6ft 2. The best dribblers of all time are around that height too. What’s the point of being so big, if you ain’t going to be doing big man stuff? Post ups, offensive rebounds, pick and roll etc. He obviously can do these things, but I think there’s basically no purpose for him to even be good at some of the stuff he’s good at. Truthfully the ideal modern day big is more like Jokic then web.
he obviously wont ever be as strong and as good as jokic offensively as far as the total package but he can definitely become more than serviceable from 3 while also using his height to spread the rock and find teammates. hes going to be a way better defender than jokic. picture maybe a tim duncan type where hes the number 2 option on offense while being the anchor for possibly the best defense in the league.
KD's height was only ever super important when ISO offense was king. Durant still plays that way, thus his height allows him to shoot uncontested from anywhere, but the current meta is shots are created from movement leading to good catch-and-shoot opportunities. Wemb is an enormous liability and honestly looks REALLY bad as some sort of ball-dominant ISO scorer. This hype is fake and if he somehow stays healthy, being taller directly correlates with poorer shooting/dexterity and there's a reason almost noone over 6'10 can shoot beyond 12-15 feet and for the record, KD is like 6'10 but not a legit 7ft.
Chasing your own step back 3 for a tip dunk….impossible
Wemby is very level headed, his skill set plus his size is unmatched, he just needs to keep up those workouts and prevent injury.
Loved this. The only guy Wemby’s skill set is comparable to is KDs, who’s still half a foot shorter. We’ve never seen a dude this tall combine longe range shooting and ball handling and be a true threat.
The problem is bigs today settle and aren't aggressive against smaller players in the post. It's not because they're not capable of doing it or that it's harder today. The gameplans and focus simply aren't there. Jokic punished every smaller guy by going at them towards the hoop unlike Embiid who settles for jumpers and finish in those same situations
the problem is that as soon as you walk backwards towards someone they fall down and you get a charge call.
So much “Back in my day” bullshit. I’m 50 & miss the ‘90s but I can still know what bullshit smells like. Go home , Gramps. Your porridge is getting cold.
I think actually the biggest think Wemby can do to become immediately valuable before his shot making comes around is the playmaking component, with his floor being literal Rudy Gobert level defense(I know he probably won't be that good on defense immediately but he is really good)
Gobert was a lot stronger than Wemby was as a rookie. Wemby’s ceiling is high but is floor is closer to Bol Bol.
@@grahamstrouse1165 he’s much more coordinated the bol, and his timing is better, I think you’re underselling him, he won’t he Gobert overall but he’s an awesome rim protector
Honestly, I just hope he has teammates that will back him up. Whether or not he becomes an extremely good player, or just has the advantage of being taller, and fast while being able to dunk standing, there might be players that try to injury him. There might be a 2017 warriors team out to get him or something like that, so hopefully his teammates will back him up.
Dude I say this every time I see this kid, he has an excellent jump shot for someone who’s 7’4.
If I had to pick one player to start my franchise out of Wembanyama and JOKIC, I would pick JOKIC without a doubt. IQ is everything. I am not suggesting Wembanyama is dumb or any of that, but JOKIC is in a complete different level, maybe only Lebron is on the same level as JOKIC.
That's easy to say now....
Obviously you would pick a 2 time MVP in the middle of his prime over someone who hasn’t even played yet
Would you have said that in 2017?
@@lukeinvictus69 I meant if they both were rookies.
I would have picked Luka Doncic as well over Wembanyama. (also as a rookie)
Wembanyama is not big, he is tall. At best, he'll be KD 2.0. But more likely, he'll be Porzingis or Ralph Sampson 2.0. I just don't know how he can survive all the bumping and grinding with a lanky build like that. Yes, he is still young, and he will definitely develop further physically. But with a frame like that, Wembanyama will not likely develop sufficient bulk to dominate the paint. He also hasn't exhibited that kind of lower-body dexterity like Olajuwon, and since his center of gravity is so high, I doubt he'll ever develop that level of post-up moves... And worse yet, how well can he take a beating in the NBA?
He'll probably feel most comfortable shooting over people from afar, but
Hopefully the glass they made him out of is stronger than what they used for KD
FInally, a measured anaylsis without any hyperbole. Wemby looks great but people saying he has GOAT potential when he hasn't played a single game in the NBA is putting unnecessary pressure on the kid. Media is setting him up for failure because they will be the first to tear him down when he doesn't reach their lofty expectations. I am very excited to watch him play and grow as a player. Just take him for the player he is and will become and don't put your unfair expectations on him and everybody will have a fun time.
I have a feeling Victor Wembanyama is going to be a Giannis-KD hybrid. He just needs to improve his shooting percentages.
That's basically like taking Shaq height and fusing it with Kobe skills 🤯
no he need to stop spam 3s lol
Just another Bol Bol
He's a lot more mobile