If nothing else, this technique makes it clear why high end frequencies so easily dominate a mix. They cut through at such a lower volume than all of the low/mid content. I actually really like how this allowed me to quickly tame my highs.
This sounds like a much better idea. Mix to your taste and then use this process to check if you´ve "over favoured" a particular frequency area. Then decide if you think that needs fixing or if you actually want to favour that frequency.
This is the second video I've ever viewed on this topic. This is definitely a technique that I will start using to get my track levels at a decent setting. I appreciate the fact that this being practical fits in with other techniques such as panning and effects processing to finally arrive at the optimum mix. Thanks for presenting this information!!!
I think its a great trick for balancing your mix that I don’t currently use. I do rely on my ears, and I dont think this technique will fix dynamics and frequency balance (as that should be done prior to get a desirable effect) but for beginners who don’t have a trained ear, I think its a very solid reference, a benchmark that not all other industrial references could offer. If this method gives you a flat sound, that is an absolutely great starting point and is working exactly as it should, from there you could just tune accordingly to your preferences, or possibly utilize a more specific second reference
As you said, white noise is equal amplitude across the spectrum. Pink noise slopes down -3db/oct. Brown noise is -6db/oct. Mose pop/modern music is closer to a -4.5db/oct slope in between pink and brown noise. To create -4.5db/oct noise, I use a pink generator such as Gredland'a free "Pink" plugin and tilt it to -4.5db/oct using the free sTiltv2 plugin and a spectrum analyzer such as Span. With the spectrum's visual slope set to -4.5db/oct, I adjust the sTiltv2 eq until the noise displays flat. Most automatic EQ plugins, such as Smart EQ and Teote, adjusts the spectrum closer to -4.5db/oct. I often get good results with using my -4.5/oct generated noise as a reference with a match EQ such as TDR Nova GE on the master bus, adjusting down to about 20% strength, fine-tuning it further by ear.
Learn and practice your mixing. Mixing is not beat making. It's not just about static level. It's also about the dynamic level that comes from mixing different sources that contain varying characteristics not only in level but also frequency( and effects). And that is the art of mixing. Knowing if it's level that has to be tweaked or EQ. There's no quick and easy way besides practice. Increasing and decreasing levels and Frequency and listen carefully. Start off with two channels at first until you feel it right. You'll hear when it sounds fuller and is one. Then you will develop your own technique. When I started as a Live Sound Engineer (1977) there were no apps or vst. Just your ear and equipment you could afford. Back then you really got what you paid for. And compressors and limiters were for protection, not enhancement or effect. You had to be creative. Great session!! Peace
I did this on headphones because my room isn’t acoustically treated and everything sounded so flat ...I’m gonna try it on my monitors this time hopefully i get a better balance
I have a pink noise generator in my DBX drive rack PA unit. It walks you through a set up where I turn up the master fader to a pretty high level and hit the button. It then sets the EQ. It’s a pretty annoying thing to do because it’s so loud but it really makes a difference how good the room will sound. Although I’ve never felt like I was doing it right.
Here's what I've found testing out this method. Setup: I use internal oscillator in the Behringer Wing to generate the pink noise. I feed it into an available stereo channel and set the gain so that the pink noise in the room is at our target avg dB level for our worship services with the fader are at unity. Process: At sound check, after I set instrument/mic gain to target level, I'll then solo that input along with the pink noise and set the instrument/mic fader til just audible. I set the headphones level a moderate (non annoying) level and mute the mains so I'm not getting bleed through the headphones. Then I repeat the process while setting the gain for each instrument/mic. Findings: It doesn't take much extra time and gives the band more time to set their own monitor in ears mix for each instrument/mic. It seems to provide a fairly good balanced mix that we can then more predictably tweak to our target sound and then actively mix for each song. We have a number of volunteer sound techs so we are looking for ways to predictably get to a target sound more consistently. This technique seems like a promising step in the process.
So much about this on TH-cam! Very on point overview! Thoughts: The process should preferably be done in mono and is a good way to begin a mix. It would possibly be revealing to load some reference tracks, plus a spectrograph on the stereo buss to compare the p/n slope with commercially mastered releases using the Blue Cat fteq analyst. Why not use a VU meter @ -18dB to compare file levels with the pink noise for accuracy without having to listen to the noise? Thanks for your honest and unbiased review.
LANDR how low can you pitch you kick drum ? In correlation of the Bass ? I got my kick fundamental peaking around 40 hz, and my bass around 50 and 100 . It feels nice but the attack of the base have to be layered with other kick . To cut thru the mix . Does this have some disadvantages ? Since every sound system is so different
@@alinenunez4270 They should always complement one another and be mixed to sound as one source. Remember deep bass is felt not heard. Also, be careful at boosting lower frequency that aren't there can create a muddy unclear unnatural bass. Peace
@@LANDRmusic update, so I haven't used it directly the way you mentioned, but I've been resampling my basses with pink rather than white noise and so far it's been great. Much easier to control the output/distortion when I add OTT and jazz. Super useful!
Which tools do you reach for when beefing up synthesizers that sit forward in the mix? What tools for synths that sit in the back of the mix? And where do main/background synths need to sit width-wise vs other wide elements?
If this were built into your DAW, with different templates, and you could just press ONE button and it automatically applied a "noise template" to all your faders for you in a few seconds... it might not be a bad idea. You could try various "noise templates" and if one sounded OK, you could then tweak it. BUT, to spend time going through this process manually, to find that it sounds terrible? Just a waste of time. This process is so mechanical, that it seams like something perfect to be built in and automated into your DAW. You could even just load a reference track and ask your DAW to adjust all your faders for you. Add an undo button to reset all your faders as they were (in the case you´re not happy) and then you´ve got another useful tool that you can quickly test out without wasting time or stressing your ears listening to noise.
The main problem I see is what if you have a dynamic mix where by some instruments change volume... Do you do the highest volume for these or lowest volume.. I can't be the only one who makes music with instruments that are not 1 level across all of the song?? It certainly is a good starting point though
I would imagine you would arguably mix at the point where your track reaches its loudest. therefore lowering the fader at that point and therefore it would adjust overall. If you selected all the points at which you make changes but brought it down in line with the noise at the loudest point.
Hello LANDR, appreciate all the tips! I'm a songwriter, artist, and producer, which I have some technical questions about. I'm having troubles with making that "space" or "room" in my mixes. They don't sound muddy but they seem to lack that separation ambiance I hear in other beats or songs. How do I get that without adding too much processing? Thanks.
To those that are new to the art of mixing and mastering - this pink noise method in my opinion is a waste of time, and a horrible alternative to much more effective methods. Reference your music on a variety of speakers. Utilize stereo separation and merging ( sub bass is usually always mono...). Compare it to your favourite songs, songs in the same genre as well as other genres. Try comparing your mix to a live instrument too so you can compare the resonation. DO NOT listen to people that say you MUST do this and that a certain way. Practice separating and merging every single aspect of your beat, use a parametric eq and take off harsh frequencies and pin point them. Break rules and become the new trend setter. Make sure theres no limiter on your master. Send every noise to an individual channel and go through and make those sounds fit like a nice puzzle. Mixing is not purely a mathematical thing.. it requires musicality and artistic vision, plus hours and hours. If you have any questions let me know
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If nothing else, this technique makes it clear why high end frequencies so easily dominate a mix. They cut through at such a lower volume than all of the low/mid content. I actually really like how this allowed me to quickly tame my highs.
Nice insight Tyler.
The best way I’ve found is to mix with your ears and then listen to it against a pink noise. Whatever you find sticking out, just lower it.
Brilliant
Why do you do that?
@@josejayant94 It’s a semi objective way to see what’s sticking out
This sounds like a much better idea. Mix to your taste and then use this process to check if you´ve "over favoured" a particular frequency area. Then decide if you think that needs fixing or if you actually want to favour that frequency.
This is the second video I've ever viewed on this topic. This is definitely a technique that I will start using to get my track levels at a decent setting. I appreciate the fact that this being practical fits in with other techniques such as panning and effects processing to finally arrive at the optimum mix. Thanks for presenting this information!!!
I think its a great trick for balancing your mix that I don’t currently use. I do rely on my ears, and I dont think this technique will fix dynamics and frequency balance (as that should be done prior to get a desirable effect) but for beginners who don’t have a trained ear, I think its a very solid reference, a benchmark that not all other industrial references could offer. If this method gives you a flat sound, that is an absolutely great starting point and is working exactly as it should, from there you could just tune accordingly to your preferences, or possibly utilize a more specific second reference
As you said, white noise is equal amplitude across the spectrum. Pink noise slopes down -3db/oct. Brown noise is -6db/oct. Mose pop/modern music is closer to a -4.5db/oct slope in between pink and brown noise. To create -4.5db/oct noise, I use a pink generator such as Gredland'a free "Pink" plugin and tilt it to -4.5db/oct using the free sTiltv2 plugin and a spectrum analyzer such as Span. With the spectrum's visual slope set to -4.5db/oct, I adjust the sTiltv2 eq until the noise displays flat. Most automatic EQ plugins, such as Smart EQ and Teote, adjusts the spectrum closer to -4.5db/oct. I often get good results with using my -4.5/oct generated noise as a reference with a match EQ such as TDR Nova GE on the master bus, adjusting down to about 20% strength, fine-tuning it further by ear.
I wonder if an even better mix using pink noise starting point can be achieved if monitoring in mono instead of stereo.
Learn and practice your mixing. Mixing is not beat making. It's not just about static level. It's also about the dynamic level that comes from mixing different sources that contain varying characteristics not only in level but also frequency( and effects). And that is the art of mixing. Knowing if it's level that has to be tweaked or EQ. There's no quick and easy way besides practice. Increasing and decreasing levels and Frequency and listen carefully. Start off with two channels at first until you feel it right. You'll hear when it sounds fuller and is one. Then you will develop your own technique. When I started as a Live Sound Engineer (1977) there were no apps or vst. Just your ear and equipment you could afford. Back then you really got what you paid for. And compressors and limiters were for protection, not enhancement or effect. You had to be creative. Great session!! Peace
Sound advice. Cheers for sharing mate!
Thanks for your time, I enjoyed reading that. Creativity, consistency and loving what you do is key. Well, aside from promotion!
Being new to mixing, the pink noise method (I've not heard of that) might point out where I'm completely erring in levels in some instruments.
I did this on headphones because my room isn’t acoustically treated and everything sounded so flat ...I’m gonna try it on my monitors this time hopefully i get a better balance
I agree regarding the ears being your best guide as long you don't fatigue the sense.
I have a pink noise generator in my DBX drive rack PA unit. It walks you through a set up where I turn up the master fader to a pretty high level and hit the button. It then sets the EQ. It’s a pretty annoying thing to do because it’s so loud but it really makes a difference how good the room will sound. Although I’ve never felt like I was doing it right.
Here's what I've found testing out this method. Setup: I use internal oscillator in the Behringer Wing to generate the pink noise. I feed it into an available stereo channel and set the gain so that the pink noise in the room is at our target avg dB level for our worship services with the fader are at unity. Process: At sound check, after I set instrument/mic gain to target level, I'll then solo that input along with the pink noise and set the instrument/mic fader til just audible. I set the headphones level a moderate (non annoying) level and mute the mains so I'm not getting bleed through the headphones. Then I repeat the process while setting the gain for each instrument/mic. Findings: It doesn't take much extra time and gives the band more time to set their own monitor in ears mix for each instrument/mic. It seems to provide a fairly good balanced mix that we can then more predictably tweak to our target sound and then actively mix for each song. We have a number of volunteer sound techs so we are looking for ways to predictably get to a target sound more consistently. This technique seems like a promising step in the process.
So much about this on TH-cam! Very on point overview! Thoughts: The process should preferably be done in mono and is a good way to begin a mix. It would possibly be revealing to load some reference tracks, plus a spectrograph on the stereo buss to compare the p/n slope with commercially mastered releases using the Blue Cat fteq analyst. Why not use a VU meter @ -18dB to compare file levels with the pink noise for accuracy without having to listen to the noise? Thanks for your honest and unbiased review.
Thanks for this breakdown 👌🏿
Need help with your mix? Post your question in the comments below!
LANDR how low can you pitch you kick drum ? In correlation of the Bass ? I got my kick fundamental peaking around 40 hz, and my bass around 50 and 100 . It feels nice but the attack of the base have to be layered with other kick . To cut thru the mix . Does this have some disadvantages ? Since every sound system is so different
Thanks for the question! Will forward it to Al.
@@alinenunez4270 They should always complement one another and be mixed to sound as one source. Remember deep bass is felt not heard. Also, be careful at boosting lower frequency that aren't there can create a muddy unclear unnatural bass. Peace
"Show, don't tell!" This advice for writers should even more apply to TH-camrs.
Facts
Very interesting, I will definitely try this technique out on my next tune
Let us know how it goes!
@@LANDRmusic update, so I haven't used it directly the way you mentioned, but I've been resampling my basses with pink rather than white noise and so far it's been great. Much easier to control the output/distortion when I add OTT and jazz. Super useful!
Thanks for the update! Glad you've found a process that works for you!
Anyone prefer brown noise? I sidechain it to SPAN and use targeted visual mixing for pink/ brown noise so I don’t have to listen to it
Can you elaborate?
@@BukanIbuMuIts a nice technique, one I hadn't quite thought of before. Essentially the same methodology as iZotope’s Tonal Balance
Which tools do you reach for when beefing up synthesizers that sit forward in the mix? What tools for synths that sit in the back of the mix? And where do main/background synths need to sit width-wise vs other wide elements?
Thanks for the question! Will forward it to Al.
You can eq Match the Pink Noise!
When you’re balancing the individual tracks over the pink or white noise, are the tracks raw or already individually processed?
Hey Kamil! Thanks for the question. I'll forward it to Al and reach out if it gets chosen :)
From what I was taught...raw/unprocessed is the route.
@@jelaniwarner1529both
Great stuff!
HI
What monitors are those in the background?
Is that Amon Düül II - Halluzination Guillotine playing at the beginning?
Thank you
If this were built into your DAW, with different templates, and you could just press ONE button and it automatically applied a "noise template" to all your faders for you in a few seconds... it might not be a bad idea. You could try various "noise templates" and if one sounded OK, you could then tweak it. BUT, to spend time going through this process manually, to find that it sounds terrible? Just a waste of time.
This process is so mechanical, that it seams like something perfect to be built in and automated into your DAW. You could even just load a reference track and ask your DAW to adjust all your faders for you. Add an undo button to reset all your faders as they were (in the case you´re not happy) and then you´ve got another useful tool that you can quickly test out without wasting time or stressing your ears listening to noise.
I love this guy, this dude would be my partner in crime xD
The main problem I see is what if you have a dynamic mix where by some instruments change volume... Do you do the highest volume for these or lowest volume.. I can't be the only one who makes music with instruments that are not 1 level across all of the song?? It certainly is a good starting point though
I would imagine you would arguably mix at the point where your track reaches its loudest. therefore lowering the fader at that point and therefore it would adjust overall. If you selected all the points at which you make changes but brought it down in line with the noise at the loudest point.
Hello LANDR, appreciate all the tips!
I'm a songwriter, artist, and producer, which I have some technical questions about. I'm having troubles with making that "space" or "room" in my mixes. They don't sound muddy but they seem to lack that separation ambiance I hear in other beats or songs. How do I get that without adding too much processing? Thanks.
Thanks for the question! Will forward it to Al.
Hey! Good news :) You question's been selected for Ask An Engineer. Can you send us you Instagram handle?
Video drops tomorrow.
Found it! Video is live here: th-cam.com/video/UpxPbaeMt9Q/w-d-xo.html
If I use pink noise I mix in mono...try it.
And you’re ears are toast from the constant noise
You can do it at low volume
@@matthijshebly Low volume definitely the best way to do it
Try it in mono.
To those that are new to the art of mixing and mastering - this pink noise method in my opinion is a waste of time, and a horrible alternative to much more effective methods. Reference your music on a variety of speakers. Utilize stereo separation and merging ( sub bass is usually always mono...). Compare it to your favourite songs, songs in the same genre as well as other genres. Try comparing your mix to a live instrument too so you can compare the resonation.
DO NOT listen to people that say you MUST do this and that a certain way. Practice separating and merging every single aspect of your beat, use a parametric eq and take off harsh frequencies and pin point them. Break rules and become the new trend setter.
Make sure theres no limiter on your master. Send every noise to an individual channel and go through and make those sounds fit like a nice puzzle.
Mixing is not purely a mathematical thing.. it requires musicality and artistic vision, plus hours and hours.
If you have any questions let me know
Thank you soo fucking much brooooo
How to calibrate your ear?
Thanks for the question! Will forward it to Al.
Thank you for your quick response to the question.
Don't use pink noise. Use brown noise. Much warmer
there is a scream sound to the left in minuto 5:04
Good catch!
he looks like off brand Justin Vernon
Just don't do it lol