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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 12 ก.ย. 2024
- This is one of my favorite debates, going back to 2008, because Arif Ahmed conceded so much to Habermas and still had him flustered.
Dr Arif Ahmed is Senior Lecturer in the Faculty of Philosophy at the University of Cambridge. Previously he was a Leverhulme Research Fellow in the University of Sydney, an Early Career Research Fellow at CRASSH, and a Temporary Lecturer at the University of Birmingham. Before that he worked in London and Bristol after studying mathematics at St Anne's College Oxford.
His main professional interests are Wittgenstein and Decision Theory and his recent and forthcoming publications include Wittgenstein's 'Philosophical Investigations': A Critical Guide and Evidence, Decision and Causality (both Cambridge University Press).
Gary Robert Habermas is an American historian, New Testament scholar, philosopher of religion, and Christian apologist who frequently writes and lectures on the resurrection of Jesus.
Habermas is Distinguished Professor of Apologetics and Philosophy and chairman of the department of philosophy and theology at Liberty University in Lynchburg, Virginia. He holds a PhD (1976) from Michigan State University in history and philosophy of religion and a master's degree (1973) from the University of Detroit in philosophical theology. He has specialized in cataloging and communicating trends among scholars in the field of historical Jesus and New Testament studies.
1 Cor.15:6 says at once or at one time.
Yes you are correct, I was wrong in the video. The 500 appearance is reported to be at the same time (nice even number). Thank you for the correction.
Psalm 22 is the 500th chapter! Coincidence, I think not! Checkmate atheists!
Darken the chapters and verses were added and are not part of the original Bible so it doesn't prove anything. But very interesting though
I was being sarcastic friend :)
I can’t remember which apocryphal gospel.. it may be the Thomas one. But it speaks of 500 soldiers of pilot being sent to the tomb and falling down witnessing Jesus. So this could be the 500 Paul’s speaking of which I believe was a falsity that made it into the creed. The Romans would have written on such an event. But it’s silent on their end
One of your favorite videos? I agree! I think Aria Ahmed was so strongly clear and logical that it blew Habermas’ usual song and dance into near triviality. Habermas is no dummy, but he sometimes sounds foolish. See the debate between Habermas and Ken Humphreys, of Jesus Never Existed. It’s fun, funny and lightly enlightening. I would hope Ahmed would do a cast with you. He’s brilliant.
They're all just stories in an ancient book and we have no way of knowing if any of them are true.
It's notable that Ahmed was very generously granting premises to the opposition at every chance where as Habermas is pleading with the audience to grant him premises such as God exists and there is an afterlife.
And near death experiences are supposed to convince him, don't forget.
Arif Ahmed is fantastic. Somehow I had never heard off him before. Thank you so much for showing me this debate.
Sadly Habermas is terribly underequipped to take Ahmed on. I always felt Habermas to be a piss poor apologist.
This is one of my favorite debates too. I have the handout Ahmed uses if you want it.
@Joe Sonseed, I'll take a copy.
27:33 Speaking of Ben Franklin and lightning, and the question of whether it's supernatural or not, at the time of Franklin's invention of the lightning rod, many Christian leaders advocated against the use of lightning rods because using them would be an attempt to contravene the will of God: for example, "the Reverend Thomas Prince, pastor of Boston’s Old South Church, asserted that the Cape Ann earthquake of 1755 could be attributed to the ubiquitous placement of lightning rods in New England, especially in Boston. Centered off the coast of what’s now Massachusetts, the earthquake, Reverend Prince seemed to imply, was no accident given man’s unwise attempts to deflect the hand of God." Rob Tircoles, "The Thunderstorm Whisperers
" The Atlantic, Aug. 31, 2017.
Interesting fun fact!
Great breakdown. Arif is one of the best debaters out there.
I started watching this at 6 am. It was worth it. 👍
I remember watching this debate ages ago and being very impresses with Arif.
Habermas cites James as an initial skeptic of Jesus. I’ve never understood why James and the rest of Jesus’ family, including Mary, were skeptical of Jesus and actually thought he was crazy (Mark 3:21, 31-32). Did they all just somehow forget he was the Son of God born of a Virgin (Luke 1:26-38)? It doesn’t make any sense...
Joshua Jackson The confusion only happens when you take Mark 3:21 out of the context of Mark chapter 3.
Bryson Townsend World renowned New Testament scholar, Craig A. Evans, PhD, writes of Mark 3:31-35, the scene in which Jesus claims his “true family”: “It is in this sensitive setting that Jesus’ family tries to communicate with him. Mark’s readers will wonder just where Jesus’ family stands. Only two paragraphs earlier in the narrative (3:21) they (and this is probably the family speaking) said, ‘He has lost his senses,’ and then Jesus warns of eternal sin for blaspheming the work of the Holy Spirit... The strains on the family are evident; Jesus’ pronouncement on who his true family is will do nothing to lesson this tension.”
Mark’s context is clear, which is precisely why both Matthew and Luke alter the story and the alleged words of Jesus in order to ease the apparent tension between Jesus and his biological family as seen in Mark. Matthew’s version (Matthew 12) says nothing about Jesus’ family hoping to seize him or thinking he is out of his mind, and Luke’s version (Luke 8) rephrases Jesus’ words so that there is no hint that Jesus’ biological family has been excluded or diminished in anyway.
Joshua Jackson You’re giving me an assertion of yours. Can you prove it?
Bryson Townsend In other words, in Mark 3, Jesus disowns his biological family because they don’t believe in him.
Bryson Townsend If you don’t get it, then I guess you just don’t get it. Just read all the way through Mark 3:34. It’s obvious.
It's shocking that we are still trying to overturn such silly, primitive ideas in the 21st Century, but then we have seen the rise of the flat earthers recently!
There really is no way that rationality can overcome some people's indoctrinated beliefs and yearnings for some sort of magic saviour. It's actually rather sad!
What is more likely, that God exists or storytellers exist?
@Language and Programming Channel, We know that storytellers exist. We can see them. But we can't see gods. We are told they are invisible. I think it is more likely they do not exist.
I'm sad, Doug mentioned 'disappearing' this video which leads me to believe that there could be live streamed content that was never published! For shame!
There's a few videos hidden in the archives.
“If there was a a god” we would not be having this discuss the.answer would be clear. If there was no Adam there would be no original sin. Christianity would not exist with out the salvation from this sin. I still see no real evidence from Habermas
I watched the full video. Kinda didn't want to cuz it was weak. But it's nice when you guys can relax and say what's on your mind without being to rigid. That's why I like this channel. I found this channel by watching the Robert Price video. Sweet stuff. Thanks. Keep it up.
37:53 "I wouldn't use the word faith because it's a trigger word for so many [Christians]..." Isn't it remarkable that some Christians recoil from faith, of all things?
A question for you Doug, been thinking about this one my self. Taking Habermas argument that a God existing would change the probability of a miracle, which of these two options would you say is better as a reply? The God existing doesn't raise the prior probability of a miracle at all, or the God existing does raise the prior probability of a miracle but only by a tiny amount so small that miracles should be considered highly improbable in any individual case.
I think the guy on the right was high during this.
The role playing at 24:00 was the best part. Gold.
In what sense is Gary Habermas an historian?
How long did he spend talking about NDE?
Hey Doug, any chance you could get Dennis R. MacDonald and Richard Carrier on together? It would be super interesting to hear them talking about what they agree on and what they disagree on, and why.
I think that could happen.
PineCreek Better yet, Richard Carrier and Jordan Peterson. Lol.
Better yet, Jordan Peterson and Donald Trump!
54:30 i just wanna timestamp where i knew i needed to sub to this channel.
If all the thermometers say 600 degrees maybe it's not water.
I've been trying figure out who Habermas's voice sounds like. Go and listen to Dan Akroyd as that sleazy toy maker from that classic SNL skit.
Does anyone here think he also sounds like Peter Griffin from Family Guy?
Doug, maybe it was a high quality LSD...😇
Am still only a way into the video and am just watching Doug grin in response to what he's hearing.
What is the theory that Satan raised Jesus? To deceive the Christians away from YHWH?
Yes. Yahweh is the one and only God. Satan raised Jesus to make people worship Jesus instead of Yahweh, thus breaking the first commandment. If one is going to allow supernatural explanations then the sky's the limit!!
I solved the 500 hallucinations Mystery ,Doug, Paul didnt mention his source, it could be anyone but what about Jesus himself ? why not? Then you have only 1 hallucination to explain and that is pretty normal.
You lie, Peter said it in front of the Sanhedrin and the fact that Christianity started from Jerusalem makes nonsense of your claims
haha..the gullible have been 'buying' the 'afterlife' off con artists for centuries...
I believe in Loki. I've seen him! He kind of looks like the actor Tom Hiddleston - but with shoulder-length black hair. lol.
OK Doug what is with all the little girl snickering between you two....
Jesus Christ...frankly, it was a great show but all that little girl snickering just got so tiring after about the 2nd time... I have never heard you do that nearly so often before...it was a little weird dude....
Greg Logan did you have a bad day Greg?
I found those bits the funniest tbh