What's stopping Tottenham from being great?
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 8 พ.ค. 2024
- Welcome to The Athletic FC's TH-cam channel, where best-in-class journalism meets video.
Tottenham were systematically dissected by Eddie Howe's Newcastle at St. James' Park in a 4-0 defeat. Will Ange Postecoglou deviate from his idealistic approach or will he have to introduce pragmatism to react to the realities of playing in the Premier League?
Joe Devine, JJ Bull and Jon Mackenzie are joined by Alex Barker to review Ange's first season at Tottenham and to figure out how far Spurs can go under the Australian manager's guidance.
This is The Athletic's Week in Football.
#tottenham #premierleague #soccer
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Chapters:
00:00 Intro
00:33 Is Postecoglou doing a good job?
01:37 Idealism vs Pragmatism
04:36 Spurs' Tactical Approach
06:46 Tactical Problems
09:33 How Newcastle Dismantled Spurs
12:42 Tactical Improvements
14:50 Expectations
16:48 Pochettino's Spurs
19:14 Unwise Transfers
21:33 1v1 Wingers
26:10 Other Transfers
28:58 Gut Feelings - What will happen?
31:19 The Perfect Manager
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Music sourced from Epidemic Sound
Additional footage sourced from AP Newsroom - กีฬา
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I like this new content even if the podcast is missed
People bemoan that managers get sacked too easily yet in April they give up on a manager they were calling the best thing since sliced bread in September. If anyone told Spurs fans they would be within a shout of a UCL spot without Kane they would've literally jumped for joy.
Agreed, Last year we were told we would be in a relegation battle without Kane, and we aren't in a relegation battle. Ange is doing well with the players he has, we just need players that postecoglou wants. Ange usually gets rid of the old guard and brings in fresh new players and lowers the average age substantially.
Absolutely spot on
The “fans” calling for his head are closet Chelsibillion, Woolwich and WestSpam fans
I'm a Spurs fan and I'm not giving up on him. Nor is anyone else I know who is Spurs! So there you are..
You can’t expect much from the fans whose main goal of existence is to screw over Arsenal. They’re literally willing to throw away their own ambition to stop Arsenal from winning the title. They don’t deserve Ange. If he can, he should approach Utd and see if Ratcliffs project is any good, and if it is, he should run and run fast.
Jon is that good employee who works the most , and Joe is that manager we all know. Gotta love this crew.
I am an American Spurs fan traveling to London for the NLD and I was lucky enough to meet JJ in a random pub. Lovely and humble guy and it was a pleasure to meet him!
😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
*Note to the Athletic!* we love Joe and the rest of the Tifo boys and specifically click on videos we know they’re in! Make sure your thumbnails let us know that they’re in the videos (like this one)and we’re way more likely to click on and watch them. Thank you, PSA over ❤
Tifo goated, let's goo!
100%. Clicked because of Joe. Would've jumped at it clicked and liked before 2 seconds played if I know The Bullard, Mackenzie and Joe were on
The dream team. @@AdamHetherington
And slowly the best podcast ever is reformed... Please!!!
Im a simple man, I see Joe, I click the video
Lol, my thoughts exactly
Tifo is so back
This chemistry. Never change 😂
Who else is finding JJ's cavalier laptop placement concerning? 🤔
I wanted to give it a little push toward the middle of the desk every time I saw it
It's a power play, he knows what he's doing. Looks like it worked on you mate.
@@fredtheegg7479 I know. The bounder. How he toys with us.
Also, why is that MacBook so massive?
If only this video were available as a podcast
I thought it was fairly obvious what Dier was saying while watching the video, but the quotes are less easy to read.
The conversation between Neville and Dier was initially focusing on tactics given in a lecture type situation. Dier was saying that Ange doesn’t do that, as opposed to Conte.
Dier didn't explicitly say it, but he was implying that they do indeed work on gameplans and tactics but through the process of drilling.
The problem was that in trying to distinguish the two types, he inadvertently downplayed the strategic component of the drilling process.
It would be helpful to have two different names for these two types of tactical work. The lecture-type could be called "explicit tactical work" and the drilling-type could be called "embodied tactical work".
Thanks for the context. I hadn't seen the Dier interview.
Terminology-wise, I like "theoretical" and "practical" tactics, personally. Fits better with distinctions commonly used in education.
Great comment. "Doing" vs "Showing" in learning
@theskankingpigeon965 Yeah, I like these terms also. They'd probably be easier to adopt too
Yes, people also missed that Eric said if he was to become a manager he would follow Postecoglou’s style. So the media used his comment as a stick to beat Postecoglou with, but actually the player was saying I would prefer to emulate Postecoglou.
Postecoglou obviously didn’t like it because he’s doing a good job, but being beaten by the stick.
The simple solution to making everyone appear listened to is for both John and JJ to wear screens on their forheads that show their work. Time will tell if the Athletic have the stones to push the envelope in this way, or if they will remain cowards.
GOATED content.
really like this combo
iconic voice of joe, usual john and jj's charisma.
usual joe doesnt sound like compliment 😂
@@kapselinho9253 I meant John's quirk
Love the content guys. I always learn something and have a laugh at the same time
I am a committed Ange fan since his days coaching in Oz, I am biased no doubt. But he has exceeded expectations for season 1, another window and pre season and its going to be a delight to watch with results to match. Just hope the % of fans unhappy look at the big picture- he hasnt built his squad yet and his current group arent playing exactly to his style yet.
Really like this format of content. Keeps it engaging.
20:13 - and that's all you really need. confidence. and words.
I love you guys. Thanks for the content!
Great having the lads back together and a top cameo from Alex 👌
For me it's simple, if you make attack your priority, score tons of goals and don't miss chances. And you gotta spend for that. Otherwise, no point just having the possession without conversion
Would you please make a video about Aberdeen, and try to explain their struggles as of late?
The only reason i care about Aberdeen is because of JJ Bull😁
These videos are either not coming up as recommended for me on my feed, or the rebranding is failing to make me register them when they flash past me. Funny these are quite enjoyable. Great video strategy guys
This trio is goated, perfect mix of analysis and humour
Listen, I’m a fan for life. I do think the 10-15 min videos were easier to digest. Anytime the board is used is a game changer. Please keep making these long form videos. You guys are the best at this.
It's Joe Devine! Could we please see these three more often? Thanks!
great vid, thx for the spurs content
Joe is back and talking about my team? Let's go
Please do more content on Barça 🙏🙏 our tactical situation is pretty interesting rn let alone our potential transfers this summer
Always top quality analysis plus I now know Joe is paying attention.
Ange can take spurs to new heights, COYS🙌🙌
I'm enjoying the breakdowns more and more. I feel like they're going back slightly to the old podcast style of "having good insights but also having fun". I think it's a shame that the channel was hard pivoted to a more serious brand
With Bergvall confirmed for the summer and lots of good academy players, I don't think it's that necessary to go hunting for young prospects on the cheap -- they're already here. A Nico Williams type seems more sensible
Can someone please explain why Son isn't appropriate for Postecoglou at LW
He has reasonably good take-on stats and has a very good shot - has been a world class player for a long time
Surely they could bring in a backup/competition for Richarlison and keep Son at LW?
i think its mainly because the left wingers in angeball are meant to hug the touchline and the further away from goal u place your most clinical player the less chances they have at scoring. but he has played on the left wing more as an inside forward. it just means u have to send your LB or LCM out to hold the width which could lead to players getting caught out in a switch of possession or something like that, which despite vdv's pace is not ideal for them to be conceding massive chances
Because he can't (or doesn't) takes his man on. He might be able to do it once or twice in a game but Postecoglou's system demands people like Vinicius, Nico Williams, who'll do it consistently.
Son can't operate in tight areas. It might work this season because Spurs aren't a finished product yet. But Spurs want to be a possession-based system, which will give him lesser space. He worked really well with Kane because it created space for him. And obviously under Jose and Conte, he got lot of space on counters.
Son isn't world class though, he's still pretty quick and finishes with both feet bit that's it. His G/A has dropped since Kane who used to drop deep and supply assists for Son. If he was world class he would've been at a bigger club already, he's never won a trophy. Kane is but Son isn't.
@justv88 I feel he could play touchline hugging, mainly due to how good his left and right feet are, it means he can generate output whichever way he goes. And if a team allows space he always had the threat of scoring, since even werner will end up in goal scoring positions nearly every game, those chances will come for son.
@@mainaccount8293 cant remeber what game it was (it was a Spurs home game, maybe it was Burnley or Brentford for Johnson's goal), Son went to the byline and scored the typical Postecoleu system goal of crossing low across the 6 yard box for the opposite winger. I'd rather see Spurs buy a striker in the summer and have Son as an option on the left. I think he could do that role.Werner and Johnson have both managed decent numbers this season and that's I think because they suit the system quite well
If only there was more more of this
Joe, Jon, and JJ is a watchable trio 🎉
The Podcast is back
Amazon shirt of democracia corinthiana! Best regards from Brazil and also from a Corinthians fan
I remember Ossie tried a similar system a few years ago, that didn't go down too well, in fact he was shown the door after a few games . if we go on a losing run, I think Ange will depart. the PL managers quickly sort out how to beat this system as it never changes week to week come what may.
Please tell me where he was shown the door. He has won everywhere he's been. Don't make it up.
Haven't been here in ages since it turned into The Atheltic FC lol
ALL THE WAY TO THE TOP BBY!! COYS!!!
I think one aspect of Newcastle's approach to the Spurs game that hasn't really been mentioned, is the constant fouling. As mentioned, the transition between the high-press, super aggressive start and the fall back to a low-block tactic is somewhat enabled by breaking rhythm in tactical fouling. 14 fouls and 0 yellow cards really was a boon to Newcastle, as it allowed them to continue this physical aggression - something not afforded to Spurs with their 12 fouls and 4 cards.
Great vid, hopefully ye will do arne slot
Here are my recommendations for Spurs at their positions of need:
#7 Realistic
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Rayan Cherki - Lyon (probably too similar to Kulusevski without the hard work, but dribbles more than most)
Pedro Neto - Wolverhampton Wanderers (Price)
Kaoru Mitoma - Brighton (recently signed a contract, might be a touch expensive)
Raphina - Barcelona (he would want to stay, but finances might force the club to sell)
Marcus Edwards - Sporting CP (Yes UCL, but buyback clause and he might want to return home, sign him back lol)
Jack Clarke - Sunderland (also sign him back lol)
Abdul Fatawu Issahaku - Leicester
Jaime Bynoe-Gittens - Dortmund
Oscar Aranda - Famalicao
#7 Reach
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Jadon Sancho - Manchester United (out of favor but still expensive and high wages)
Kvicha Kvaratskelia - Napoli (bad team season but still highly regarded)
Michael Olise - Crystal Palace (recently signed a contract, homegrown tax, former Arsenal and Chelsea academy player)
Federico Chiesa - Juventus (UCL)
Matias Soule - Juventus (UCL, top prospect, but might want to flip for profit)
#6 Realistic
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Amadou Onana - Everton
Ederson - Atalanta (might become unrealistic if Atalanta win the Europa league)
Lamine Camara - Metz (repeat the Sarr trick, sign another young, Senegalese midfielder from Metz who just broke into the national team as Metz are about to get relegated)
Quinten Timber - Feyenoord (make it happen for the lols)
#6 Reach
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Frenkie de Jong - Barcelona (never happening 😂)
Bruno Guimaraes - Newcastle (never happening, not even if Spurs pay his clause)
Exequiel Palacios - Bayer Leverkusen (never happening unless he really wants to leave for more game time)
Manuel Ugarte - Paris Saint Germain (UCL, recently signed, but might be frustrated by a lack of game time)
Adrien Rabiot - Juventus (UCL, wages)
Youssouf Fofana - Monaco (UCL)
Angelo Stiller - Stuttgart (UCL)
Ismael Bennacer - AC Milan (UCL, former Arsenal academy player)
Orkun Kokcu - Benfica (UCL, recently signed)
Joao Neves - Benfica (UCL, high potential asset)
Florentino Luis - Benfica (UCL)
#9 Realistic
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Ivan Toney - Brentford (Price)
Matheus Cunha - Wolverhampton Wanderers (Price)
Simon Banza - Braga
Rodrigo Muniz - Fulham (repeat the Richarlison trick for a younger, more clinical Brazilian prem proven striker)
Vangelis Pavlidis - AZ Alkmaar (Vincent Janssen potential)
Santiago Jimenez - Feyenoord
Maximilian Beyer - Hoffenheim
Elie Kroupi Jr. - Lorient (small guy like Georges Kevin Nkoudou or Clinton Njie)
#9 Reach
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Lois Openda - RB Leipzig (UCL, recently signed)
Viktor Gyokeres - Sporting CP (UCL, recently signed)
Serhou Guirassy - Stuttgart (UCL)
Joao Pedro - Brighton (recently signed, homegrown tax)
Evan Ferguson - Brighton (see above)
Joshua Zirkzee - Bologna (UCL)
#10 Realistic
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Albert Gudmundsson - Genoa
Eberechi Eze - Crystal Palace (homegrown tax can be an issue, he is also a former Arsenal academy player)
Lucas Paqueta - West Ham (Price, also West Ham)
Morgan Gibbs-White - Nottingham Forrest (repeat the Brennan Johnson trick and sign young British talent to help Forrest avoid financial penalties)
Teun Koopmeiners - Atalanta (more of a #8 but I’m cheating a bit & might become unrealistic if Atalanta win the Europa league)
#10 Reach
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Julian Brandt - Dortmund (UCL)
Pedro Goncalves - Sporting CP (UCL)
Luis Alberto - Lazio (Age)
#3 Realistic
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Tosin Adarabioyo - Fulham
Giorgio Scalvini - Atalanta (UCL maybe, repeat the Romero trick and sign the best young defender in Serie A from Atalanta)
Jean-Clair Todibo - OGC Nice
Marc Guehi - Crystal Palace (homegrown tax can be an issue, he is also a former Chelsea academy player)
Lloyd Kelly - Bournemouth
Maxence Lacroix - Wolfsburg (repeat the van de Ven speedy Wolfsburg centerback trick, although he is a walking red card)
#3 Reach
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Edmond Tapsoba - Bayer Lerverkusen (UCL, Price)
Fikayo Tomori - AC Milan (UCL, former Chelsea academy player)
Goncalo Ignacio - Sporting CP (UCL, Price)
Nico Schlotterbeck - Dortmund (UCL)
Antonio Silva - Benfica (UCL, Price)
Ousmane Diomande - Sporting CP (UCL, Price)
#5 Realistic
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Michael Kayode - Fiorentina (repeat the Udogie trick, sign another young, speedy Nigerian-Italian wingback with high upside about to break into the national team)
Archie Gray - Leeds
Lutsharel Geertruida - Feyenoord
#5 Reach
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Yan Couto - Girona (UCL)
#4 Realistic
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Antonee Robinson - Fulham
Leif Davis - Ipswich
Ferdi Kadioglu - Fenerbahce
Francisco Moura - Famalicao
#4 Reach
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Maximilian Mittelstaedt - Stuttgart (UCL, Age)
I view signings like romantic relationships, lots of options that can do the job fairly well, can be complicated if they were with an ex that doesn’t like you, often helps if interest is reciprocated, and is bound to fail if one party needs to persuade the other.
🙌
To touch on the comment Joe addressed, I feel like many fans may have forgotten how well Joe runs the podcasts & videos & narrations due to the little stint of randomness & going off on wild tangents that was happening for a while lol & I can imagine any new fans that came on during that time must feel like he has no sort of control & now he’s dialing back in to show how great he is at it.
Excellent work! It's the transfers that will take us higher for sure. Can't wait to see it!
Ange needs 3 years and some quality players to give his system a real chance
“is that a good ending?” 😂
My head says we will lose about 5:0 tomorrow, but if we can score the first goal, maybe we can sneak a win. A big if though given our current form against theirs.
Pre season and with not being Europe so hopefully not many injuries we’d he fresh and felt we’d be top 3 with Kane and if he left top 5 maybe sneak 4th - if I’d have known amount of injuries especially defence I’d have said mid table - was at game yesterday and Saka goal was like a replay of pre goals conceded and it’s due to our midfield being so inconsistent whoever comes on plays well and force themselves into starting line up then poor when start - I think we’ll challenge next year and be 6 or 7 outgoings and as many coming in that fit ange system better - plus his first season always inconsistent like this and 2nd 3rd much stronger
But Ange has already gotten more out of the players than Conte did - the X factor isn’t a question. Spend some time on the work he did at Japan or Celtic and you will see how his strategy adjusts and tweaks - but the philosophy doesn’t. That’s how Plan A is done better
A lot of our issues have stemmed from Bissouma no longer beating the press with his dribbling. Just doesnt dribble anymore, no idea why
I'm glad Joe is concentrating now
Joe & Alex & Seb & JJ
Not a spurs fan but here are my two cents. Ange is an ideologue about a certain way of football. This is part of the reason he speaks so well and passionately about the game, he believes there is a correct way to go about it. This is a double-edged sword. On one hand you have beautiful and exciting attacking football, but it also means he will not learn from his mistakes, nor does he want to. I believe in the world of control freak managers (pep, arteta) and teams using every marginal gain to their advantage (Brentford, Brighton) this will not see long term success. Will you have an exciting cup run and get a trophy? Possibly. Will you ever win the league? I don't think so. It depends what Spurs want out of it.
Some of the key players have rapidly lost their brilliance, confidence and teamwork after their injuries. That’s why.
I thought the thumbnail was a before and after picture of Ange.
I'd love it if they said Sangare as the midfield replacement 😅
With conte from period jan to may we were only couple points off Man City - but then obviously fell apart - but also every player was an 8 or 9 out of 10 which isn’t sustainable and you need players when not in form still put in a 6/7 out of 19 as opposed to a 3/4 which is what we do and what think ange id changing and be a lot if incoming and outgoing of players this window
Hey Atheltic how to you do tactical analysis
Please tell me I want to do it
They have a book called How to watch football! I haven't read it but presumably it's about this
@@savethetowels oh nice where can I get it
@@savethetowels I live in pakistan I hope I could get it
Nice shirt mister Jon 🤝🏻
nice one. i hand screen print the sweats Jon often wears. bornagainprints lots of footy stuff
Using Newcastle at home as a barometer for how a manager had done, in my opinion, is bad considering how volatile Newcastle has been as well as Newcastle knowing exactly how to deal with Spurs
Ange is the perfect social media manager, twitter thinks he is a genius because they see some clips of his teams playing and they have this mentality that 'beautiful football' is all you need lmao
I want a top gear style football show with these three
But without the weak jokes that normalise bigotry a la Jeremy Clarkson
"Sonic the hedgehog if he was a streamer" is weirdly so accurate
The consistent feature in this mess of ours is the chairman, Mr Daniel Levy
I think you’re underselling what Ange has done this season - losing Harry Kane and bringing in several players in their first year of the premier league, completely changing the style of play and improving their position from 8th to 5th? Take that every day of the week. Van de Ven and Vicario have both been outstanding, and no one had heard of them before. Ange finds talent he knows he can work with. Once he’s had a couple more transfer windows to shape his squad then I’m excited to see where he is.
Spoiler: spurs don’t win.
20:00 JJ Bull reveals that Ange Postecoglou is secretly Mauricio Pochettino and the Chelsea manager is just Graham Potter with a mask. It all makes sense now!
Every one of these videos ends with Joe saying something like "Jon, what do you think will happen?" which is followed with the most non-committal answer imaginable.
Big Ange is very very evolutionary... He has always been a revolutionary.. He would rather quit than fail. So YES HE WILL EVOLVE
Huh?
A video on Arne Slot?
Very cool
SpursY under Ange peaked in October, top of the league...I'm afraid it wont happen again, the opposition managers know how to combat Plan A(NGE) and know theres no Plan B that will come on the day.
I think the Fullbacks get caught a little too far forward sometimes. Wheras his celtic Fullbacks were more Conservative with going forward
Now if you could just do this once a week that would be great 👍
Daniel Levy is what's stopping the club moving forward. He won't get rid of the deadwood.
I wonder if Mikel Arteta watches this and thinking "Oh, maybe we can use that" for the upcoming North London Derby
The best u can hope for.Sorted us out may get CL.
Well if they get Europa league spurs could go as far as Kazakhstan
Sancho and Williams would solve our issues
Great episode guys, there’s a high pitched buzzing in the background that you might want to get fixed though
Sorry, I don't hear it?
Arteta and Klopp didn’t do as well as AP in their first seasons. I can’t stand the Spuds but I like AP. Next season is the time to judge him.
Is this the tifo football Podcast🦋
Does Jon know how often he says as well ?
10:15 Johnson V Burn = it's time to see your GP
There best shot at 4th was this season. They will struggle next year imo and finish 7/8th
SKY IS THE LIMIT BABY
TO THE TOP OF THE PREM
JJ always excludes Arsenal and Arteta from "elite" conversations. You can't have it both ways, either Arsenal have elite players or Arteta is getting more out of them or both.
5:16 🤣
Even this season arsenal fans have called for sacking Arteta? We need to learn and be patient to stop questioning our managers! If we dont like it dont go and watch spurs! Let the man get on with it eh!
Pochettino did not have the best ever Spurs team. The best ever was the one that beat Inter 4-3 as they had Bale, Modric, Van der Vaart, Defoe
i really don't like these narratives where managers are characterized as the chess player, while the footballers are treated as chess pieces. the game at the highest level is still decided by player talent and 1v1's. there's always some next big tactical innovator that the media hypes up just for them to burn out in a couple of seasons. meanwhile carlo anchilotti has been at the top for decades being a high level man manager and a pragmatic tactician that just looks to enable the talent in the squad.
I didn't you guys were Spurs fans😮
Hosted by Joe Devine and including a tidbit of Tifo type music… but no song 😳😫😤😭😭😭😭😭😭
Not far, thanks for your attention y'all.
Made a start that SpursY fans hadn't dreamed of, THEN the reality of an inadequate squad emerged.....Now, both cups and league opportunities are gone and probably CL...Europa league is a better result than a dismal 22/23 season....5 games to go, how many points?
"Sorry about Jon's beautiful head. Don messed up the camera. We'll cut to the other board where possible"
Yes.
In answer to your question. As far as they want with Ange at the helm.