Shuffle Steering: Still A Useful Technique?
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 16 ก.ย. 2024
- Most modern drivers use the 9-and-3 steering position and a hand over hand technique when more steering angle is required. This is a great technique and has gained popularity for a number of good reasons, but the old-school "shuffling the wheel" technique perhaps shouldn't be fully discounted.
Shuffling the wheel is simply the method of keeping your hands relatively at 9 and 3, and passing the steering wheel between them to accomplish large steering inputs. While this is not the recommended technique for high speed driving, it accomplishes one very valuable thing: the driver keeps both hands on the wheel in a good position 100% of the time, which is hugely useful for maintaining positive control of the vehicle in less-than-perfect scenarios.
This is the main reason that shuffling the wheel is taught for off-road driving, buy experts around the world and here at Team O'Neil. the driver always keeps both hands on the wheel as the vehicle travels over and through rough terrain and obstacles that exert strong side forces on the front tires.
It is the same reason that LEO and MIL drivers use the shuffling technique, to maintain solid control of the vehicle over potentially rough terrain and small collisions with obstacles and other vehicles during offensive driving and pursuit scenarios.
An added benefit of shuffling the wheel is that the driver's hands and arms stay away from the path of a potential airbag deployment should they get into an accident or other tactical / pursuit driving scenario.
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I use this technique for drifting. This is the best way to control the steering mid drift. Crossing your hands drifting is a no no.
i usually just let go of the wheel and grip the 3 9 position again, even if thats not centered in relation to the steering, feel way more confident that way than "must keep both hands on wheel"
also one handed drifting for the lolz (still legit though)
@@DarkIzo i realease grip and just sorta let the wheel slide through my hand and then grip when i want to but never let go 100%
Team O'Neil has a drift school too. He says in the video that this technique he talks about here was not necessarily for track-type performance driving.
This is not true.
Yeah because you’re making small adjustments and have to steer firmly. Guarantee you don’t use it to initiate or exit a drift, it’s like rule no 1 that you spend more time hands off than the wheel than on.
Lol, when going for your drivers licence in the Netherlands, You MUST use this type of steering or you fail your exam
Same in southeast US. Did hand over hand backing out of the parking space and the instructor made me restart
bruh ice lol, in NC you need to look back to back up, plus they make you cover up backup cameras (even though they’re literally required on new cars). makes me think the differences between states really doesn’t matter considering no one does it the same.
and if you use shuffle steering you fail your exam in france ....
In Italy you fail if you use it
Same here in Oman
i imagine shuffle sterring might have been something useful in low speed no-servo driving
I had a Honda Civic with manual steering. I shuffle steered all the time. I still do it even though I don't have to anymore.
I have been shuffle-steering since 1991, almost at the same time I learned how to drive. it has become a second nature. Friends call it "dish-washing steering". others thank me for the smoothest rides they ever had in their life.
I agree. It allows for smooth inputs.
As a firefighter we’re taught shuffle steering for high speed driving as it gives greater control and to keep our thumbs out of the inside of the steering wheel 👍🏻
I recall car throttle mocking this technique as bad driving. Its something I picked up naturally learning how to drive quickly while being smooth. Allows for smooth even inputs through corners with decreasing radius's etc
Finally i found the way to do this, its used in drifting most of the time, I saw rally drivers turning the steering wheel with one hand in sharp corners in first gear, this thing is useful i want to practice
巻木トリスタン if they’re only using one hand it is by definition not shuffle steering.
Interesting, i've seen some WRC onboard videos where they often used this technique, especially on rough terrain.
pfff, everyone knows correct hand position is left wrist at 12 o'clock, right hand on the gear lever, beside your beer. thats how you get the most height when you jumpy your car :)
or the hand at 12 and the elbow out of the widows (superman style)
right hand on phone taking a pic of your left wrist at 1 o'clock, showing the rolex for the 'gram
😂😂😂😂😂😂😂 these comments
With the set leaned all the way back. Detroit lean, baby! Doesn't matter how you drive, you just gotta look good doing it.
InstaBlaster.
I been practicing this, trying to lose the fear of not taking my hands of the steering wheel. I also practice left foot braking/threshold breathing. Thanks you for all you content.
Adding something in case someone doesn't know, shuffle steering is possible for road cars but not really for race cars as the steering lock is tight and you don't turn the wheel that much.
I've never heard of this technique before, interesting
This is the steering method taught by my driving instructor when I first got my driving licence
It's not a technique the Jedi would tell you about
@@sparklygames71 but it's the technique that YS Khong uses. Search him up. Malaysian rally driver
@@ianlee6416 Who cares about a no-name rally driver from a 3rd world country where Chinese are 2nd class citizens. He's a nobody and not even fit to lick Colin McRae's shoes.
@@alexperdo7596 Thanks for your concern. It's better now compared to before. But there's still a long way to go to achieve equality here.
I learned shuffle steering in EVOC years ago, then really started using it all the time after hearing Bobby Ore give it praises (in fact he said he won't train anybody until they master this first). However, when racing, especially in anything with a smaller steering wheel, you literally can not steer as fast with the shuffle. I nearly ran my RZR off the track trying it. Putting it on a stop watch, I could go full lock out right to full lock out left significantly faster using hand over hand. I considered myself a good test subject since I used ONLY shuffle steering for over 10 years, truly believing it was superior.
Woah something I do when driving that team O'Neil doesn't hate 😂
I've been in a car crash once, caused by someone asking the driver why he would shuffle or not. Driver started focussing on that and thats how we knocked down 3 walls.
I dont think about it.. At all. Ever. Shit goes automatically one way or the other.
I use turn signals automatically without thinking.
Once, as an experiment - I thought about it before signaling a merge onto a freeway...
Ok, right stalk or left stalk? Move up or down? Think think think
Had a brain fart & had to stop thinking.
So I don’t think about it anymore & signal correctly every time
I feel the absolute opposite to this, but passed my test this year so a different context.
I use it for dritting. I feel so confy with it. It lets me countersteer all the way as fast as i want
Let the wheel go and it counter-steers as fast as it needs to. If you're trying to actively do it you're making it way harder on yourself.
@@mikaelgaiason688 Depends on the caster angle and a few other factors right? I've felt like the return can be a bit slow on some old cars I've driven
@@mikaelgaiason688 That is mostly true on transitions but there are times you want to steer yourself, winding off steering angle as you straighten coming out of a corner being the most common use for shuffle steering while drifting.
My police officer relatives mentioned during their driver training this technique is of priority for safety in airbag equipped vehicles. They were told of one member in a hard accident with his arms crossed over, injuries sustained were far more severe than they otherwise would have been due die airbag inflation.
ShaneoMac Gardner You hear the odd anecdote about this kind of injury but I would love to know the stats on crossed arm airbag trauma.
Now I realise how much I have adopted this type of steering watching you doing it . Always in revere when park and at almost all situations
driving instructors always teach feeding the wheel which is what its called in england but tbh i kinda hate it, i use it occasionally but its such an awkward and slow way to steer
Thank you for posting the video!
I was wondering why you recommend shuffle steer at low speeds, I remember in a previous steering technique video something was said about being able to get more steering input in faster by using hand over hand?
EDIT: I read the description. I think I understand now, it's more about having your hands at 9-3 in rough situations than it is about being able to get a lot of steering in quickly.
hand over hand is my go too but I definitely use shuffle steering in daily driving without thinking about it because it makes the most sense to use shuffle steering
You should do one on the Walter Röhrl shuffle.
It's steering into the corner with the opposite hand (right hand for a left corner), you let the steering while slide through the other hand, which you position at the bottom of the steering wheel, and when the rear steps out, you steer to the other side (in this example to the right), with the left hand, and since you started from the bottom, you now have a lot more steering range.
When you perfect this, the car can slide from side to side, but your economic steering shuffle will make it look like you're barely using the steering wheel :)
noob here. requesting a video on steering ratios and specifically steering quickeners.
Also low speeds normal roads driving when the occasional non-constant radius turns pops up. I've practiced all of them and find myself switching between them depending on the circumstances. There's no one technique good for everything. Learn the techniques and be prepared it's really all I can say and if you have the chance I HIGHLY recommend taking a defensive driving course or the like, such as the ones Team O'Neil offers even if you think you are a pretty good driver. Statistically you are not. And the amount of information and experience you get after a real driving course like that will leave you in shock that you were allowed to drive based only on what they teach you at the normal driving course.
Excellent drivers know how to use all the steering types depending on the situation
That's what they teach in my country's driving school (Spain) because of the airbag. If you don't shuffle you fail
Ever drive a car with a blown power steering pump, you'll be shuffle steering around town! Ive done some fast driving with it buts its sketchy non the less
You guys should do a will it rally with a 95-05 chevy s10 blazer they are all over the place, cheap, somewhat reliable and you can change from rwd to 4wd by a click of a button
When I'm about to turn right I put my left hand at 6 o'clock and right hand at 12 o'clock. For left turn right hand at 6 o'clock left at 12 o'clock. Hands then will be perfectly positioned through the turn. Then back to 9 and 3 .
I use shufflesteering a lot on my 206... It may not be "the fastest" but in my personal experience, it does give me the most control and precision.
And I can let go of the wheel a bit to have it straighten itself.
For me:
- flipping hands: shallow corners.
- hand over hand: when I need to be fast and precision is second.
- shuffle: when I need to be precise but speed is second.
I didn't know this was the name of this technique.
police in canada use this method, allows driver to keep radio mic in right hand and on the steering wheel.
Something that I haven't understood here in the discussion about shuffle steering that maybe you can clarify. As far as I can tell, the biggest proponents of it, the precision/stunt driving community influenced by Bobby Ore, seem to also imply that when you're coming out of a turn, you let the wheel return to center via the castor effect. So if you are doing some kind of slalom or the like, you supposedly let the wheel spin back to center and then keep turning as it reach center to continue your turn into the opposite direction. I never see this discussed in these videos at the same time with shuffle steering itself, and most people seem to assume that you also shuffle the wheel back out instead of letting the wheel slide through your fingers to return via castor effect.
How does this addition affect shuffle steering as a technique? I've seen "releasing the wheel to counter steer" in videos about drifting, a few rally driving videos, and videos about skid recovery, but otherwise, not so much. It would be nice if it were discussed in more detail somewhere.
Keep those thumbs from wrapping around. If you have an impact, less likely to break them.
Wasn't Ari Vatanen using shuffle steering at Pikes Peak in the Climb Dance video?
For normal road use the shuffle steering is the way to go for the airback safety alone. I'm old school enough to still cross my hands which allows turning the wheel 360 with only one release of the wheel per hand which is nicer for rapid movement, but I think I should try to learn shuffle steering these days.
For optimal results, do you learn to move your hands constant amount (e.g. 90 degrees per hand move) or how do you keep track where the middle position of the wheel is when you need to rapidly get your wheels straight again?
Good tips...
Thank you.
I only palm the wheel when I'm doing a multi point turn, if not then I'm usually NASCAR mode
I like the intro at the end - it's a bit long to sit through for every video.
9-3 hand over hand is the only correct way to do fast driving in rallying context
9-3 I agree with, over hand being the only way, sorry no can't agree with that one. Not saying that you shouldn't use it, but I use the 'shuffle' most of the time on stage. You can get pretty much full lock one way with 2 hand moments with say, a 2.5 ratio steering rack, and not have to cross over your hands.
Works good in rallycross when you don't want your hands flayling about and hitting the wipers or mirror
I'm going to fully discount the 'shuffle steer' though. Keep posting these videos, while i hate the technique this was a great video to watch.
I have the terrible habit of driving with my left hand at 9 o'clock and my right hand on my lap ready for either 3 o'clock or shifter. I do consciously decide to drive at 3 and 9 at speeds above 80mph at twisty bits for the reason of good 2 points of contact but rarely need to cross hands doing "performance driving". I'll cross hands for the slower stuff like parking lots and slightly shuffle in reverse only for the reason I'm normally moving around getting better angles on my mirrors where my body isn't at the best angle to do hand over maneuvers. But I've trained to have me hands attached to 3 and 9 even at higher steering angles since I can return to center or counter steer quickly while always knowing where the steering wheel is at.
I raced karts ,was good at it , held the steering wheel at 7 and 5 and I could concentrate like a mother fucker and relax at the same time while out of my comfort zone
Why 7 and 5?
Precise
Shuffle steering with my leather gardening work gloves, while I throttle steer and late brake.
You can shuffle steer from the bottom of the wheel as well.
Great job.
what is this car's make and model?
I’m so used to shuffle steering. How do I learn hand over hand
I have one airbag and I'm pretty sure it doesn't work
so I don't really have to worry about that
tbh, i was teached by instructor to not do it like you are doing it in video. ofc one hand steering is no go, but you also shouldnt slide your hands on a steering wheel - and again as i said, thats how i was teached
Hopefully not the same way you were "teached" about grammar..
Fantastic video. I have a question though. For street driving, how do you place your hands to do 1.5 turns (fully lock out a street car wheel) for a right turn or for parking, and then back to straight? I can't find any race/professional technique for that extra turn which is precise and reliable. I've seen hand over hand by reaching over further than usual (reaching 180º accross instead of 90º), that's the best I've found.
This is something I never really thought about. I'll have to pay attention what I'm doing when hussling.
I suspect the definition of 'high speed' is relative. I'm going to have to pay attention to hand positions when watching WRC in-car footage.
Wrc cars don't even have 2 turns lock to lock so this doesn't apply. Maybe watch some saxo/106 n2 rally cars
Almost all the WRC drivers stay at 9 and 3, if they need more they'll go hand-over-hand... But like Lorenzo says they have quick steering racks and also sequential transmissions. Check out this one with a vintage escort on gravel, it's an insane display of skill but also more relevant because it's a 2WD car and normal H-pattern gearbox: th-cam.com/video/EWBOKD6fGu0/w-d-xo.html You'll see he keeps his left hand PLANTED at 10 o'clock and his right hand is all over the place.
@@Teamoneilrally this video is a very good example of the car being driven by the driver, and not the driver being driven by the car
Needs neon lit sneakers for win.
Hand over hand and shuffle steering good, crossover bad, M'kay.
You missed the point
Sir in america it hand over hand method use,but i use both.
Safer if airbag goes off.
wat year is that toyota hi lux?
Around 94 I'd say. That generation of. Hilux
I have learned hand over and every fast driver I know do the same on road car
the other thing is, you have more control when you pull your wheel, with shuffle steering you push then pull then push etc and it's not very precise ... you can also preset your hand (right corner, you preset your right hand higher)
for me it's not natural and I will need a lot of practice to steer as fast as hand over technique
You shouldn't push pull, its always pull push. As you say, if you turn right, use your right hand as a lead to pull the wheel down and follow with the left pushing up. Its not always what feels right but once you get the feeling for it, it's m0re comfortable and more controlled
How do you guys mount your footcams? If I were to use a smartphone, where would you recommend putting it?
We use a GoPro, typically clamped to the steering column because it doesn't wobble around. You could do the same thing with a smartphone depending what kind of mounting system you have.
imagine trying to do this in a driver's test, with one of those Tesla pilot steering wheels. They will fail you or just give you a pass cause the steering wheel ain't shuffleable
You look exactly like Casey Putsch.
What car are you in? Ford Focus?
It appears to be an ex-police Dodge Charger.
Come kind of dodge
Older charger cop car. This one: th-cam.com/video/RQZSuHD13JY/w-d-xo.html
My car has too heavy steering to shuffle.. it's ok for parking lots tho
Even non power assisted steering cars have light steering while moving. What sort of car are you driving for it to be so heavy?
Yeah well I don't have an airbag so 🤷🏼♂️
ftp
I heard Rolls Royce drivers must have such shuffle steering technique for the sake of sleeping in the rear sheet passenger.
so normal steering.. ok
Make more videos on tactical driving. Skills that would be helpful in defensive situations.