I don't give the insta-bet much consideration - that's secondary in my mind. Primary is that everything got there, and a presumably passive player (passive until proven otherwise) suddenly decides to lead for a very value-y half pot. This is not the time to see how he's eating his oreos.
It's a bluff! Pure and simple. I would call...the more he bets, the easier and quicker I'd called. Flush door knocked in and he did not take a second to think about bet size??? Plus, he did not put H on flush draw. (I wouldn't!). So: he tried to scare her by huge surprise bet. Plus: A flush would not bet this huge size into an opponent who does not hold flush. This reg obviously learnt few tips. He wanted opponent out of hand, instead of to get paid for his hand value. BLUFF!
Crucial tip for an up and coming player: 1. Don't show your hand as you fold! I assume you did because you described the table's reaction. You're giving away free information. 2. Don't discuss hands later. People are just weaving fairy tales about what they had. If they tell, but don't show, it's all 🦄🧚♂️🌈. Don't let their fairy tale become part of your game history. I think you made a good fold, regardless of whether it was correct in that moment, and that's what to take away.
pretty easy call i guess, QT is at the top of your range going to the river, he could still have some bluffs like 78o with double gutter on flop or 89o which turns double gutter with one club and turns into bluff to represent backdoor flush. You are basically losing only to flush or barely AT, i guess you should sigh call with sets and big two pairs and fold all one pair hands. But one thing to consider is that at low stakes, are players capable of turning the busted straight draws into bluffs, if the tendency is lower than folding is fine, but anyways i still think top two pair is just too strong to fold
I don't think timing tells are reliable as people think as a general rule. You need to pay attention to how the person normally plays. I see people act very quickly with draws, bluffs, value, the nuts... all I really don't see often is people bet quickly when they KNOW they're going super thin (obviously many players at low stakes think they've got a really strong hand sometimes when it's really not strong and they're accidentally going for thin value). If you play with someone enough you may pick up on their specific timing tells, but I don't let it impact me normally except as a tiebreaker if I really have no idea what to do.
Plus, people have time to think when other people are acting. I also kind of have a pre planned game tree, like an if this then that sort of deal in my head. I try to game out a bunch of the possibilities before I make a play, then make my play.
I'm not sure this would be a "hero call" in my view, 2 pair seems a bit strong to call it that. However, it is hard to find much we beat. Villain has to be turning a missed straight draw into a bluff [and doing so with his first hand at the table]. So I guess 75 or 98 make some sense, but the way this played it seems like the range that makes a flush or aces up is vast by comparison.
@@EllieBanks333your premise is that it’s not a hero call. Then you proceed to contradict yourself. In essence a strong hand can most definitely be put in a spot that’s termed “hero call”. A hero call doesn’t have to be ace high. A hero call can be top two or trips etc.
@@justinhart7172 I don't see the contradiction. I began my post by stating my view that the rank/strength of hero's hand does not really fit with what I consider to be a "hero call". I stand by that. The second part of my post I say [and I assume this is what you think is contradictory] I say that hero does not beat much. But this is simply an assessment of the particular situation. It's quite possible for hero to have a very strong hand & not beat much. I can give you an example. Take a look and tell me if this is a "hero call" by Selbst. th-cam.com/video/Dd_VJ6l29-k/w-d-xo.htmlsi=VXsX3XRHjlYact5K
Mildly suspicious of the insta-donk, but calling feels like too large a deviation. There just aren't that many natural bluffs that should be calling turn, and while certain hands should probably turn themselves into bluffs on the river because that particular card means they are going to want to lead a lot of flushes I certainly don't buy KcTd for example instantly doing that. Also not super sure how many off-suit hands are in a mid position limp call range anyway so bluffs would need to look more like 9c9x that only called turn with intent to steal river on a scary card.
I think you need to give anyone some credit if he decides to put in a pot size bet at the river in his first hand at the table - it is rarely a bluff. I have seen people playing very loose when they just sit down, such as they open with K4o, and somehow gets to the river with a boat. You can't think of a reasonable range of hands that would arrive at the river with some big bet, but from what I have observed it's rarely a bluff.
People, you are not putting yourself in his shoes and thinking about what he thinking about her. Let's face it, men think all women are tight and can be bluffed off hands. Big mistake btw if you sit in the wynn. Ask yourself what he thinks she has, lone 10, draw, overs? Is he really putting her on two pair which would kind of only make sense with Q 10 or backed in A10. So if you want a bluff river wouldn't Aclubs be literally the dream card? Is he ever assuming she has a flush? It is insane to not call this river, particularly with the snap bluff tell bet. Call 100% of the time here.
I don’t think that about women. I also think this was a good fold. Show me a bluff here and I’ll tip my hat and say well played. Call on the turn contains a lot of flush draws and kj. I also think that if your going to bluff a player who you think is “tight”, betting half pot on a river ace is suicidal when she could easily have aq or a10 or even AK which might call for half pot.
On paper with just the action it seems like a clear fold, but the insta bet and sizing is super fishy. Players with a flush would usually think for a little trying to figure out the largest bet that's likely to get called. Slight deviations from standard sizing usually give away some thought process. 85% pot is usually a bluff thinking "I'll get the same fold percentage and save a little money". Just like betting 115% is usually value thinking "if they'll call pot they'll call a little more".
I thought the exact same. Any player who gets there, would think at least 3-5 seconds at the minimum to bet. The insta bet of $240 is just too weird. The fact he did it so quickly and a $240 bet into $280 screams BLUFF.
Caller says bet sizing is based on being new to the stakes. That suggests that You may not be properly bankrolled for this game, as the price of the game is affecting You betting correctly. Maybe a bigger turn bet he folds or if he calls You can assess his range better. I think he had A10 for a better 2 pair that got there, I'd be more sure of this if the turn bet was bigger. But he could also have a broadway combo that stuck around hoping for a straight and made a straight or paired their ace. So then I'm thinking You beat AJ, KQ and AK J10 (not clubs), You lose to KJ, AQ and A10 and K10, J10 and T9 of clubs which are the only possible flushes here. Correct fold but a bigger turn bet would narrow this down to where You call and know for certain.
Caller is also a beginner, doesn’t understand the concept of bet-sizing. Proper bet sizing will give you more info on opponents hand. That small sizing makes it harder to put him on anything. My two cents
It’s inconsistent to donk bluff river and not bluff check raise turn. Not saying people don’t do it but just doesn’t seem like a line a bluffer would take
I owe so much to this channel. Names of fishes, their syles and places they play. I've visited those places, played with them and won easy money. Keep up the interviews Bart. This content is invaluable to me.
The river goes toward the principle about which weaker hands will call? While QT is most certainly ahead of the villains entire range, will any part of that range call a bet? The stronger range will certainly call.... so yea we check behind. Even so if we bet say $20 as a ridiculously small river bet to get some 6x hand to call we open ourselves up to a XR bluff. Now we are put in a tough decision. So to the hand OTR before the reveal. Hmmm..... This is some goofy 4xcc hand or it's a busted SD. I believe you said he is unknown. I would lean on folding. If he had a 50%VPIP and you saw him bluff before I would lean on a call. Because then hands like 75o and 53s are in his range.
I don't think he even had a 10 he was calling to float, assuming he could Bluff you off your hand on any even slightly scary River card. And he was right
I would say it's zero chance he had 4 10 clubs and everything about this hand says bluff on literally a dream bluff river. First the snap river bet is screaming bluff as the made flush usually would send the low stakes player into a song and dance Hollywood act before betting. He isn't putting her on flush, or Ace or likely 2 pair so it's a snap call on the river.
I would of called. If he has it he has it. But then again it is a cali casino where the shuffler is like from pokerstars so it was probably a good fold.
have a look at hand number 1 on hustler yesterday. Torelli sits with 150 bbs but the straddle is on, meaning he has 75 effective bbs in the hand. He's first to act with KJo in the HJ and makes it 2.5x the straddle, gets 3 callers before the straddle then makes it 5.6x Torelli's bet. Torelli shoves for 5x the raise, knowing he's up against a wide range in the straddle. Lots of fold equity and if someone wants to gamble, there are lots of hands that he can be in decent shape against.
No way he had 10-4 clubs imo, 10-4 clubs is definitely check raising on turn. I put him on king-ten off suit. He’s trying to rep flush but imo that bet is too big for value. He knows you won’t call that. Look at what ur betting $30 after flop, $70 after turn. He knows you would only call with a flush but he knows u hit the flop with how u bet. Also poker players lie all the time never believe anything u hear
While I also find it quite hard to believe that he had T4cc: it is indeed one of the few hands that make a fair share of sense with the quick River bet.
I personally would have ripped my stack in on the turn, but I guess people don't normally do that at this level. Or Depending on how aggressive my opponents are, I would have bet small, let him c/r and then ripped my stack in. If you run into a set, you run into a set, but usually you win the pot then and there. If villain calls and has a flush draw, he isn't getting odds to draw, so that play would be profitable, unless he has an open ender w/ flush draw. Other than sets, I can't think of anything that beats her that isn't a draw there.
How would you interpret the villian's river insta bet?
100% bluff and snap call.
I don't give the insta-bet much consideration - that's secondary in my mind. Primary is that everything got there, and a presumably passive player (passive until proven otherwise) suddenly decides to lead for a very value-y half pot. This is not the time to see how he's eating his oreos.
Either a flush or a bluff. There are enough missed straight draws possible (98 87 75s), I would call.
It's a bluff! Pure and simple. I would call...the more he bets, the easier and quicker I'd called. Flush door knocked in and he did not take a second to think about bet size??? Plus, he did not put H on flush draw. (I wouldn't!). So: he tried to scare her by huge surprise bet. Plus: A flush would not bet this huge size into an opponent who does not hold flush. This reg obviously learnt few tips.
He wanted opponent out of hand, instead of to get paid for his hand value. BLUFF!
Insta bet on a nut-changing board is usually a bluff
I once remember Dan Harrington saying “for $5 I’ll tell you what I had. For $10 I’ll tell you the truth. “
Crucial tip for an up and coming player:
1. Don't show your hand as you fold! I assume you did because you described the table's reaction. You're giving away free information.
2. Don't discuss hands later. People are just weaving fairy tales about what they had. If they tell, but don't show, it's all 🦄🧚♂️🌈. Don't let their fairy tale become part of your game history.
I think you made a good fold, regardless of whether it was correct in that moment, and that's what to take away.
pretty easy call i guess, QT is at the top of your range going to the river, he could still have some bluffs like 78o with double gutter on flop or 89o which turns double gutter with one club and turns into bluff to represent backdoor flush. You are basically losing only to flush or barely AT, i guess you should sigh call with sets and big two pairs and fold all one pair hands. But one thing to consider is that at low stakes, are players capable of turning the busted straight draws into bluffs, if the tendency is lower than folding is fine, but anyways i still think top two pair is just too strong to fold
Against a middle aged lady ,of course they're bluffs, especially on his home court ...
I don't think timing tells are reliable as people think as a general rule. You need to pay attention to how the person normally plays. I see people act very quickly with draws, bluffs, value, the nuts... all I really don't see often is people bet quickly when they KNOW they're going super thin (obviously many players at low stakes think they've got a really strong hand sometimes when it's really not strong and they're accidentally going for thin value). If you play with someone enough you may pick up on their specific timing tells, but I don't let it impact me normally except as a tiebreaker if I really have no idea what to do.
Plus, people have time to think when other people are acting.
I also kind of have a pre planned game tree, like an if this then that sort of deal in my head.
I try to game out a bunch of the possibilities before I make a play, then make my play.
ahhh just bet the turn bigger, you gotta be setting up to jam blank rivers Rachel!
I'm not sure this would be a "hero call" in my view, 2 pair seems a bit strong to call it that. However, it is hard to find much we beat. Villain has to be turning a missed straight draw into a bluff [and doing so with his first hand at the table]. So I guess 75 or 98 make some sense, but the way this played it seems like the range that makes a flush or aces up is vast by comparison.
If it was socal I’d say his range is as wide as a set to 7-2 off
Read what you wrote. It was a hero call decision
@@justinhart7172 Sorry, English only.
@@EllieBanks333your premise is that it’s not a hero call. Then you proceed to contradict yourself. In essence a strong hand can most definitely be put in a spot that’s termed “hero call”. A hero call doesn’t have to be ace high. A hero call can be top two or trips etc.
@@justinhart7172 I don't see the contradiction. I began my post by stating my view that the rank/strength of hero's hand does not really fit with what I consider to be a "hero call". I stand by that. The second part of my post I say [and I assume this is what you think is contradictory] I say that hero does not beat much. But this is simply an assessment of the particular situation. It's quite possible for hero to have a very strong hand & not beat much.
I can give you an example. Take a look and tell me if this is a "hero call" by Selbst.
th-cam.com/video/Dd_VJ6l29-k/w-d-xo.htmlsi=VXsX3XRHjlYact5K
Mildly suspicious of the insta-donk, but calling feels like too large a deviation. There just aren't that many natural bluffs that should be calling turn, and while certain hands should probably turn themselves into bluffs on the river because that particular card means they are going to want to lead a lot of flushes I certainly don't buy KcTd for example instantly doing that. Also not super sure how many off-suit hands are in a mid position limp call range anyway so bluffs would need to look more like 9c9x that only called turn with intent to steal river on a scary card.
I think you need to give anyone some credit if he decides to put in a pot size bet at the river in his first hand at the table - it is rarely a bluff. I have seen people playing very loose when they just sit down, such as they open with K4o, and somehow gets to the river with a boat. You can't think of a reasonable range of hands that would arrive at the river with some big bet, but from what I have observed it's rarely a bluff.
People, you are not putting yourself in his shoes and thinking about what he thinking about her. Let's face it, men think all women are tight and can be bluffed off hands. Big mistake btw if you sit in the wynn. Ask yourself what he thinks she has, lone 10, draw, overs? Is he really putting her on two pair which would kind of only make sense with Q 10 or backed in A10. So if you want a bluff river wouldn't Aclubs be literally the dream card? Is he ever assuming she has a flush? It is insane to not call this river, particularly with the snap bluff tell bet. Call 100% of the time here.
I don’t think that about women. I also think this was a good fold. Show me a bluff here and I’ll tip my hat and say well played. Call on the turn contains a lot of flush draws and kj. I also think that if your going to bluff a player who you think is “tight”, betting half pot on a river ace is suicidal when she could easily have aq or a10 or even AK which might call for half pot.
@@ethanj5328 so: you're folding at every 50% pot bet when flush card hits?
On paper with just the action it seems like a clear fold, but the insta bet and sizing is super fishy. Players with a flush would usually think for a little trying to figure out the largest bet that's likely to get called. Slight deviations from standard sizing usually give away some thought process. 85% pot is usually a bluff thinking "I'll get the same fold percentage and save a little money". Just like betting 115% is usually value thinking "if they'll call pot they'll call a little more".
I thought the exact same. Any player who gets there, would think at least 3-5 seconds at the minimum to bet. The insta bet of $240 is just too weird. The fact he did it so quickly and a $240 bet into $280 screams BLUFF.
Caller says bet sizing is based on being new to the stakes. That suggests that You may not be properly bankrolled for this game, as the price of the game is affecting You betting correctly. Maybe a bigger turn bet he folds or if he calls You can assess his range better.
I think he had A10 for a better 2 pair that got there, I'd be more sure of this if the turn bet was bigger.
But he could also have a broadway combo that stuck around hoping for a straight and made a straight or paired their ace.
So then I'm thinking You beat AJ, KQ and AK J10 (not clubs), You lose to KJ, AQ and A10 and K10, J10 and T9 of clubs which are the only possible flushes here.
Correct fold but a bigger turn bet would narrow this down to where You call and know for certain.
Caller is also a beginner, doesn’t understand the concept of bet-sizing. Proper bet sizing will give you more info on opponents hand. That small sizing makes it harder to put him on anything. My two cents
It’s inconsistent to donk bluff river and not bluff check raise turn. Not saying people don’t do it but just doesn’t seem like a line a bluffer would take
It's not in walnut creek it's in Pacheco ca. Not is great area. Nice food but it's OK to play a lot of local players.
I owe so much to this channel. Names of fishes, their syles and places they play. I've visited those places, played with them and won easy money.
Keep up the interviews Bart. This content is invaluable to me.
Right buddy
@@justinhart7172 I was there I was them
Stop the cap ! 😂 you prob just listen and use this as guidance.
The river goes toward the principle about which weaker hands will call? While QT is most certainly ahead of the villains entire range, will any part of that range call a bet? The stronger range will certainly call.... so yea we check behind. Even so if we bet say $20 as a ridiculously small river bet to get some 6x hand to call we open ourselves up to a XR bluff. Now we are put in a tough decision.
So to the hand OTR before the reveal. Hmmm..... This is some goofy 4xcc hand or it's a busted SD. I believe you said he is unknown. I would lean on folding. If he had a 50%VPIP and you saw him bluff before I would lean on a call. Because then hands like 75o and 53s are in his range.
I don't think he even had a 10 he was calling to float, assuming he could Bluff you off your hand on any even slightly scary River card. And he was right
I would say it's zero chance he had 4 10 clubs and everything about this hand says bluff on literally a dream bluff river. First the snap river bet is screaming bluff as the made flush usually would send the low stakes player into a song and dance Hollywood act before betting. He isn't putting her on flush, or Ace or likely 2 pair so it's a snap call on the river.
A lot of players snap bet out of sheer excitement when they make their hand
The numbers don't matter if you're using consistent betting like half pot third pot full pot
I would of called. If he has it he has it. But then again it is a cali casino where the shuffler is like from pokerstars so it was probably a good fold.
WOULD HAVE*
Wow so little 😮 thank you for your show. Good luck 🍀
Reluctant fold, too much got there imo. Wouldn't read too much into the insta bet.
Only thing that gets there is trip aces or a flush lol
How do you "print" with a short stack strategy?
Play tight and get it all in when you have a good hand.
by targeting your opponents with short stack.
have a look at hand number 1 on hustler yesterday. Torelli sits with 150 bbs but the straddle is on, meaning he has 75 effective bbs in the hand. He's first to act with KJo in the HJ and makes it 2.5x the straddle, gets 3 callers before the straddle then makes it 5.6x Torelli's bet. Torelli shoves for 5x the raise, knowing he's up against a wide range in the straddle. Lots of fold equity and if someone wants to gamble, there are lots of hands that he can be in decent shape against.
Jam equity and get folds without risking too much.
At best he also has Q10 and was targeting an A, caller was god and should have called or raised.
Anyone think villian could have check raised the turn?
No way he had 10-4 clubs imo, 10-4 clubs is definitely check raising on turn. I put him on king-ten off suit. He’s trying to rep flush but imo that bet is too big for value. He knows you won’t call that. Look at what ur betting $30 after flop, $70 after turn. He knows you would only call with a flush but he knows u hit the flop with how u bet. Also poker players lie all the time never believe anything u hear
What does "Ethnic" mean Bart? Blacks? Mexicans? Asian? Who is it!!!
While I also find it quite hard to believe that he had T4cc: it is indeed one of the few hands that make a fair share of sense with the quick River bet.
Just slow plays crap two and the decides to spazz lead when two back doors come in?
Yea exactly opposite at this stake level. The made flush would put this guy into an act and the snap bet is probably 85% bluff.
I personally would have ripped my stack in on the turn, but I guess people don't normally do that at this level.
Or
Depending on how aggressive my opponents are, I would have bet small, let him c/r and then ripped my stack in.
If you run into a set, you run into a set, but usually you win the pot then and there.
If villain calls and has a flush draw, he isn't getting odds to draw, so that play would be profitable, unless he has an open ender w/ flush draw.
Other than sets, I can't think of anything that beats her that isn't a draw there.
discussing about what V said he had?
try playing with 8-10 seconds to make your decitions.not easy!
This was definitely a call.
100% got bluffed😂
Lol this is just a sigh call, I dont think folding is the right move here.
I would have called. It sure looks like a bluff on a scary card.
But what hand is he turning into a bluff?
No.
100% call
@@EllieBanks333A losing hand
@@EllieBanks333some stupid random ace. In his mind he probably wasn't even bluffing, he thinks he just got her when he rivered top pair
There’s no decision where it’s either a hero fold or hero call that makes no sense
limped called T4s?
SHITREG🤣
Dont think you used the word ethnic correctly Bart....
i call.😂
This is just a fold on the river.
I feel like when a guy sits down and every single person greers them by their first name, they're more likely a fish than a good player.
Painful.
I don't believe his 10-4cc story.
ethnic men bluff women more ? come on bro