Why some people are LEAVING Portugal | 5 things that can cause people to leave, and how to fix it
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 30 ก.ค. 2024
- Moving abroad is HARD, y'all! Lately, we've been meeting people who have moved to Portugal from other countries, and are now choosing to leave. This can come with feelings of shame and guilt, but we don't think it should! We're sharing 5 reasons we're seeing some people choose to leave Portugal after moving here, and what we think can help. We hope this helps people better prepare for their move, or if you're already here, we hope it can help you feel less alone. (It's okay to change your mind!)
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Dan and Michelle are travel writers and owners of HoneymoonAlways.com. We both left our corporate digital tech careers and sold our home in Austin Texas to live in Portugal to be able to work full time on our honeymoon travel website.
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0:00 Start time
0:56 Misset expectations
3:21 Moving without a clear purpose
7:01 Lack of community
10:44 Difficult to find support
14:06 Taxes
15:54 Conclusion
As always, very awesome video! Hey Michelle, does it bother you that Dan has such great hair? Do you get jealous about it?
I do, but since he is my partner I try to swallow my pride and accept that some things are simply beyond my control
Lma
I thought the same thing. But it is not like he has better looks.
Lol instantly thought about this, stop it Dan!
I am portuguese, and what I see is that a lot of foreigners want to live in portugal and navigate everyday life situations like portuguese, without speaking portuguese! Learning the local language is CRUCIAL, this would have avoid all things you mentioned on point 2 for example.
Yup, unfortunately for non Portuguese speakers, it’s takes time and a lot of practice.
Unfortunately I don’t have enough life left!
Erica. Unless you’ve done it, you can’t imagine how hard it is to learn a new language. Especially past 40.
It takes way longer than I thought it would.
Hi 🤗 I m taking language course, I love it. People I m surrounded by dont speak any other language but portuguese, and I speak a lot of other languages, so I am forced to lear the language and its so much fun. I love it, altho its hard.
Yesterday I had to call electricity company to get our electricity back, it was weird, coz my understanding is limited 🤣🤣, but I think it will work out. I just dive in !
@@teamdivine5651 that's the best way to learn!
As a Brit living in PT, I talk to many people thinking about moving here and the most obvious issue they
have is that they see PT from what I call Tourist Eyes. I would say most that move here never did enough
'comprehensive research' or even understood what they seriously needed to find out before moving, so were
guaranteed to come up against difficulties. A bit like moving to Sweden when you don't actually like cold
weather but you think about all the nice things it offers....eventually the weather will make you fail.
After 5 years here, I think THE most important thing to understand for anyone thinking of moving here
is that you should read up (just basic) at least on the last 100yrs political history of PT because it is the
past that largely creates today's people/culture. The culture & its people dictate the kind of everyday world
you will find yourself living in.
Portuguese people are incredibly friendly and helpful in general but you must be aware that the majority
of working people here get paid lousy/low wages compared to UK, US, Germany, France etc etc. So, you have
a nation striving to grow and develop but the 'tourist destinations' can give you a quick but narrow view
that everything is great....it's not. The bulk of working class people live in older, smaller, less maintained
apts/houses. This has been so for a long, long time, it is in the main, the normal cultural living landscape.
So, for many generations incl today, people needed by necessity to do their own repairs for example. Hence
many of those repairs were of poor quality for the obvious reasons. Spread that reality across 100 years or
more and what you end up with today is a large part of the population accepting of poor quality work/repairs etc.
That can sometimes translate to the quality of work one can expect (as a foreigner) from 'service people'!
PT is still a relatively poor country attempting to become a modern nation but with limited resources
to actually achieve that. So, things like having your car repaired, shopping, dealing with govt depts etc
you come up against the realities of things being confusing, slow, fragmented etc etc. It's only if you have
taken the time to understand why things are this way that you may become more accepting that living
in Pt IS NOT LIKE LIVING IN UK, US, SCANDINAVIA, GERMANY ETC ETC ETC. The bulk of PT is not like
the tourist areas of Lisbon, Algarve, Porto etc. If you don't do enough of the right research before
coming here, you will eventually feel yourself disappointed! And that is not Portugal's fault!
In the 5 years you have been living here, have you seen this mistake very prevalent from the people who move from the UK? I know a lot of Brits move to Portugal and it is easier to move from the UK than the US, but wondered how many stay long term.
@@HoneymoonAlways My view is that less 'long term' Brits leave PT than Americans.
I have found Brits are less likely to complain
about the common problems (after an initial bitch) living here than Americans, other than the more wealthy Americans who don't tend to live in the normal everyday world as us so can deal with most things via money :) I guess being part of Europe, the Brits are experienced and accept the differing cultural quirks because they have seen it all before via regular visits to other EU nations for vacations?
@@TheLastSongbird124 That's a good point. We had only been to Europe twice before moving so it would make sense that Brits would be more prepared for the cultural differences. And have definitely seen how money can make the transition much easier.
@@HoneymoonAlways Yes money can help
but people with plenty of money tend to live like perm tourists or detached from the real Portugal. And that is the same the world over I guess.....don't know, never been rich:) The point you make about understanding why u want to move and what you think you will/hope get from it is very important. It's the kind of thing you don't notice until you get hit in the face by those things once you have arrived...and that's a little late to be
realizing I think:)
Thank you so much. We moved to Porto in February 2022 and love it. We appreciate your videos. We're finding, like you, that the challenges are not because of Portugal and the Portuguese but with our expectations of ourselves and the little gnawing voices that tell us what we should be doing or should have known to do. Being here puts a whole new slant on having a "beginners mind". Thank you again.
fancy seeing you here Jim. How are you both? xx
there are two ways to live in Portugal. One to remain an expat who only speaks english because everybody speaks english and remain an expat among expats. so everything will be difficult for you. doors will not open. the other way is to learn the language and the culture first and you will find your way more easy and make great friends here. and last not least. DO NOT try to bring your culture to Portugal. People here are proud of their culture so ignoring it closes doors and opportunities. And read what Portugal has gone thru the last 100 years and you will understand why things work very differently.
great vid and thanks for bringing this subject up.
While learning the language helps, there are things that are difficult no matter the country you move to. I speak Portuguese and my wife does not and our experience is very similar.
Good video! When I was your age I moved from Canada to Chile and lived there for 5 years. I found that it took 2 years for me to feel comfortable. From there, I adapted quite a bit and when I moved back to Canada I felt the same kind of culture shock as I did when I arrived in Chile. Cultural re-entry is shocking and difficult. It took another 2 years before I was comfortable in Canada again. More than 20 years later, I have retained some of the cultural perspectives I adopted in Chile. That said, now I'm in my 50s and have been thinking of spending summers in Europe. Portugal is great so I might do that. Love your channel!!
Thank you!
Fantastic video all around, and as an American therapist living in Portugal, your suggestions around seeking therapy *before* you move is spot on. I specialize in helping people work through these issues before they make the commitment to move, as well as helping expats who are are struggling after the move. Well done, you guys nailed it!
Thanks for a nuanced view of living in Portugal. I am an American that has lived in Northern Europe for 12 years recently bought a home in Cascais.
I find it worrisome that many Americans who have never been to Portugal or Europe for that matter believe the marketing of a lot of you tubers and Facebook groups. Some remind me of those vegematic salesmen at county fairs. Real Estate agents, lawyers, you tubers with great drone production skills all selling a dream that is really becomes a psychological projection ( especially if they have never been here). Portugal becomes for some everything they want to flee. Free health care ( you better have private), safety ( violent crime is low) but there are a lot of residential burglaries in the higher rent expat communities such as mine.
Portugal is on the edge of Europe and the Portuguese think differently about life and family. I noticed a more difficult transition here than living in Denmark, Germany and Switzerland.
The people I worry about are not young remote workers like you guys. I worry about rural retired Americans who struggle finding a Doc that takes Medicare and has an open practice. They watch videos and suddenly they think living in Portugal on a 14-1600 social security check is going to give them a much better quality of life. My Portuguese cleaner and husband struggle living on 1500/monthly.
Thanks for keeping things real and not oversell Portugal for clicks and revenue revenue.
I'm 100% with you. I did my homework and am planning to move there but with my eyes opened.
It is not cheap and that is a lie. It is probably affordable if you have more than Social Security Income. But, buyer beware if you believe all the hype. A scouting trip is a must!
I feel the same way, someone young can bounce back easy if it isn’t for them but it will be a lot harder on a fixed income.
Also often times people move and DON"T realize they take themselves with them. So that thing they wanted to "leave" is actually themselves. At the beginning the new country is exciting and there is a bit of a honeymoon, but eventually when that wears out; THERE YOU ARE STILL. you still have to deal with YOU and all you did was change your geography. Lol.
You articulated this very well :)
💯
Thank you so much for these insights. After so many uplifting videos of life in Portugal, I've been yearning for more realistic details.
I'm on various PT forums and TH-cam programs, I've been an expat for years, and I'm moving from Asia to Portugal next week -- OMO (On My Own). EVERYTHING you've mentioned I've learned along the way and will learn with the next journey. This video is a true PSA (Public Service Announcement). You guys rock.
Thanks Amelia!
When you call yourself "expat" I assume you mean immigrant
How is life in Portugal for you now that you came?
Thank you guys for this video! Six weeks and counting before we land! I'm 60 and will adapt but although my 23 year old is really excited about living in Portugal, I am getting her a therapist. Your point that whatever issues she has can get augmented made me think of the importance that she stays mentally healthy. Thank you!!
That will be great to make things easier!
I’m a Peruvian that moved to the USA IN THE EARLY 80’s
Now fully emerged in the American dream have great respect for what this country has to offer and the sacrifices generations Before made to make this possible.
NOW I struggle with what is my opinion. That a large potion of Americans has lots the respect for each other and only think of self gratification.
So. I’m contemplating Portugal.
It’s not South America with its challenges. It Europe with advance societies. I have two younger kids.
We visited Portugal 5 times. And
We made decision. Portugal it is 😀
Great video you touched on a lot of the things that are my concerns! Thank you
We moved to Germany a few years ago from the US and this is all SO true. We're moving to Portugal next year and while we're super excited, we're not looking forward to going through all the adjustments again. My wife and I agree that it is worth it though. And yep, it does get easier with time. :)
hello can you tell me about germany ill move to germany but i think im not making the right choice is it hard to live there what about buraucratie is it very high im lost
Great perspectives on life here and some of the complexities folks need to be aware of! Muito obrigado!
I saw the same thing while moving around the world with the military. I saw people never leave the base for 4 years because they were scared of the culture or change. People tend to take their lives and expect every thing around them to adjust, I see that with people who come here to the USA as well.
I hear you. I'm active duty about to PCS to my 4th overseas duty station from my current overseas location. Join the Navy, see the world right? Being a single officer, I HAVE to live off base which is advantageous. I'll retire in Portugal when after two duty stations from now.
Another great video Michelle and Dan! I agree with everything you said. I moved at the end of the year last year and if I didn’t have the Facebook contacts that I made before I left, I would’ve been lost. They helped to make my new country a home. It is also true that things aren’t necessarily as inexpensive as I thought and taxes are complicated!! I purchased private insurance in January and just had my first experience going to CUF to get a check up and to be put in the system. So far it’s been a very positive experience. It’s also very important to learn to go with the flow and have patience when dealing with everything in Portugal. That being said, I love it and have no plans of moving back. Obrigada to you both 🥰
Thank you for sheading light on reality. No one else is saying these things. Speaking the language also changes ones aspect. I hear people talking about how cheap Portugal is, but they have low wages, so things have to be cheap to be affordable.I had to live outside the US to appreciate it. I love this country with all of its defects. Great video !
Thank you for sharing your experiences and opinions. My husband and I have been living here (in Funchal, Madeira, Portugal) for just over 2 months and I have been nodding my head in agreement with so much of what you say. It is important for people considering a move to Portugal to look at the pros and cons - which may be different for each person. We are loving it, but many, many things are different - every day is an adventure.
Of course, it is a different country. People also find the United States different from all the countries they come from but they adapt.
better be different that is why one move! Who can put up with America after soooo many years?
Thank you for sharing your experience! Showing the dark side is probably more important than showing the great side of moving abroad.
This is an important topic and you covered it well. Thanks for sharing :)
Finally an honest video on this subject. It would be nice if more TH-camrs would be more honest about living overseas. Good job guys 👏👏
Great video, as always! My partner and I found your channel months ago at the very beginning of our D7 process back in March and bingewatched all your videos! Now we are living here in Lisbon and loving it. We did not move directly from the US and had residencies in a few other countries for several years before our move here, but we still found so much truth in the points you mentioned. However, the one thing I would add that has been majorly discouraging (in Lisbon at least) is the housing situation. It's been shockingly time-consuming, expensive, and complicated to navigate finding a place to live here, and everyone we meet has said the same. We're used to landing in new places and finding housing solutions much more easily, but it's been a bit overwhelming here, and we still haven't found a long-term solution. I've watched your housing/new apartment videos though, and they give us hope! Thanks for all the awesome content you share, we love following you guys on here :)
Great point! We have been able to avoid the issues with housing by timing and luck, but definitely feel for anyone looking for housing right now.
This was so incredibly helpful. It is so much better to get the truth and decide from there. Thank you.
Fantastic episode. Really comprehensive in its approach to the potential downside. Thank you, both!
We are seeing more of this, which has surprised me. Great video (-:
Allo from Singapore!! I was thinking of moving to Portugal and am so glad to have stumbled onto your channel. Great advice!!! Your channel definitely deserve more views.
Thank you!
Hi Dan and Michelle, I met you guys at the meet up in the Estrella Jardim. I don’t think you got my vibe, or maybe it was just my age lol oh well.This is an excellent video and gives people important things to think about. As I tell people, I didn’t choose Portugal, Portugal chose me, and what I mean by that is that I was looking for the “biggest bang for your buck” Golden Visa offer from all of the European countries, and Portugal was the best- it had the least dollar investment cost and the fewest years to citizenship, because my goal is to get EU citizenship and then have many options of where I might want to live. It also did not require that you live here, but because I’m eligible for citizenship next year and I must learn the language, I moved here a year ago. By myself, just with my dog and not knowing anybody really. For better or for worse, I made a decision to move around the country and see the north, the central and the south and live in each one for a few months before I settle down. So in that semi transient lifestyle, it was more difficult to make friendships, or even to try much because I will be leaving shortly anyway. I got to Lisbon this spring and settled down. It still was difficult and there have been times that I have felt very lonely, and most recently very frustrated with living in this country. Obviously the reason I chose Portugal was not the best in terms of seeing me through those difficult times. I’m still uncertain if I’m going to stay here once I get citizenship, but I always said that if I stayed for a year and then decided to move back to the United States, that that was perfectly OK, it was not a failure and it was an experience and I could go home with my head held high. I may do that but not right now, partly because I signed a three-year lease lol. Portugal in many ways is similar to California where I’ve lived most of my life, and in many ways I have fallen in love with this country and it’s very easy place to live, and overall the people are really friendly decent people. They are very family oriented and I think that’s another reason why it is harder to “get in“ with the locals. sometimes I have experienced a cliquishness when I have lived in apartment building inhabited mostly by local people I was definitely feeling like the outsider, and also occasional brusqueness with an attitude about me being an American and their perception of me because of that. once they see that I am learning the language I see their faces soften because they’re impressed that I’m even trying. The biggest frustration has been the government bureaucracies which are truly a nightmare and where the difficulty getting something done in one bureaucracy completely impedes your ability to get something done in another office. many goals large and small have come to a complete standstill because I cannot get my visa renewed, and without that I can’t update my identity card with my new address. Because of that, I can’t get the neighborhood parking permit, I cannot even change my address at my local bank, I cannot get my Portuguese drivers license and I am illegally driving. without an updated identity card theoretically I could be prevented from getting back into the country. their immigration and customs office is totally broken down dysfunctional. Recently an English person sued that department because after they had paid a lot of money for their investment in the Golden Visa program they expected to get their residential visa and move within a few weeks and it’s been 16 months! Moreover, this bureaucratic nightmare is seen in their healthcare systems (public and private), and private businesses like tap airlines which I’ve had the most horrendous and nightmare situations, all of which makes me feel like I’m living in a dystopia with remnants of complete socialist bureaucratic paralyzation. I know the Germans do this better. It may be colder there but I know they do this stuff better as do many others. In moving to another country I certainly would have to start all over. So I honestly don’t know what I will do, and I don’t have to know right now ; I’m living day today and it’s OK. But it is truly an experience of being a stranger in a strange land and I empathize now a lot more with immigrants who have come to the United States who are simply trying to do their best. mostly I am reminded of that pithy saying, “wherever you go, there you are.“ And I’ve learned that no one is going to come to the door and invite me out and you just have to get comfortable with doing things by yourself if you have no one to do them with.
This video could easily be titled “Reality Check” lol. Although I’ve enjoyed all your content over the past several months, this video by far is the most informative, especially for those like myself who are considering a big move outside my home country and what will definitely be a life changing experience! I’ve travelled 20 different countries and have found that with each new territory came with it its own set of challenges…and that was only when I was on a brief holiday! I’ve come to recognize that my main weakness is having patience in pretty much any challenging situation I might find myself in. As you’ve alluded to…slow down, learn the language, adapt and actively engage your local community. You nailed it here and are well on your way! 😊
Thank you!
Great video! Like the old saying goes… the grass isn’t always greener on the other side. Seems like no matter where you go, some patches of your grass will get greener and others will get browner.
Your point about adjusting to life beyond the US hustle culture is spot-on, and something I've been wrestling with. I never saw myself as part of that hustle culture, but even just being around it for so many years has an impact. I knew coming into this that there would be struggles, but knowing and doing are two different things. I've put a lot of effort into calibrating my expectations for the day. No more big "to-do" lists. Getting one thing done in a day when you're living in a new country and don't know the language is actually a pretty big accomplishment. If people are not prepared for that adjustment, I can see why they'd struggle. In Portugal, patience and persistence beats hustle every day of the week.
I am the same way! Had not idea I would struggle with this, 1 year in and I’m starting to see a light at the end of the tunnel.
You guys this video has been done SOOoOOO well! We have to give ourselves grace to manage through change. It’s all worth it in the end ❤️
Hello Honeymooners! This is a great video. We currently live in Round Rock, Texas and are wanting to move to Portugal. We look forward to your videos to get the "scoop" on moving to Portugal! We should meet up in Portugal next summer when we go "scope the land"!
Great video you two. I think a lot of Americans aren't prepared for life outside the US.
Thanks Robert!
Hey guys, what a great video! I normally don't comment on videos but you did such an honest take on why some people would leave Portugal and I have a few points to make to anyone who might bother to read this.
Lisbon is my hometown but I've been living abroad for 8 years and only came back to live here again this year, it was not an easy decision as changing countries never is (even if it's to go back to your own) and finding Dan and Michelle on TH-cam who are sharing their experience with the whole move to Portugal from the US , explaining it from the point of view of someone who decided to live here when they could easily choose anywhere else to live, was one of the things that motivated me the most to power through the re-adaptation process required to adjust to a life back in Lisbon.
With this said, I found many challenges coming back as things are way more expensive now than they were before I left, rent prices in the city are ridiculous (in comparison to local salaries) and the locals are struggling to be able to pay rent (it's not unusual to have people in their 30s living with their parents) if you are a digital nomad with a salary from a rich country then you should be able to afford a pretty comfortable life.
A sense of community is important, I know I'm lucky as I have friends and family here so a sense of community is not something I was lacking but let me tell you I missed meeting people from all over the world, so I did join some meetup groups and met some nice people! It can be a great experience, just bear in mind that most people on these meetup groups do not live in the city they're usually just passing through, if you choose to stay then get accustomed to seeing people come and go.
To your point about finding a therapist, if anyone is looking for one we have an online resource where you can choose licensed therapists (and other types of doctors) who speak English, it's called: www.doctoralia.com.pt/
However, based on my personal experience, despite English not being an issue for me, I can honestly say that the only time I ever "clicked" with a therapist was with a Portuguese person, there's something about speaking your native language with someone with a similar cultural background that made it easier to communicate the difficult things.
Also doctors here are difficult 😂it's unfortunate but you really need to be lucky to find a good doctor, but they exist, I can say I'm lucky in that department with my family doctor but I also know some people don't have access to that, it might be worth considering health insurance in case you need a faster response time with a doctor, however, please know that they basically do the same thing the public doctors do, just at a faster pace as they have fewer patients.
And yes it's true, strong pain killers are not a thing here, if you're suffering they'll give you ibuprofen or something similar, but rest assured they'll give you something stronger if you break a leg or something serious.
And lastly, I've had trouble adjusting when I left my country for the first time too, the adaptation process takes a while when you move somewhere new and even though I already spoke the language (English) when I left it didn't mean I understood the culture or people's background or what they actually meant when they said certain things.
This is something that took some time, for me it became easier and started getting better after my first 2 years living there and to this day it was the best thing I ever did. Anywhere you move will have its challenges so if you want to stay comfortable then it might be best to stay where you are, change is always uncomfortable but it's totally worth it if done for the right reasons, knowing why you're moving somewhere rather than just having a vague idea, or the need to escape where you're from, really does make a difference, thanks Michelle for pointing this out.
If anyone is considering moving please know that the adaptation process will always take a while and will probably be difficult in the beginning, so good luck!
Thank you so much for this thoughtful comment!
@@HoneymoonAlways Thank you for taking the time to read and reply! :)
Thanks for sharing such great insights!
We are loving our exploration of Portugal in the past year. We watch a ton of videos and are making our own now too (our new favorite media to consume). Thank you for your informative and thoughtful contribution!
I like how you gave specific examples to explain the reasons you gave us. Thank you.
Thanks Gina
Great video as always! I can relate to all of it. We came to Portugal as a scouting mission to see if this was the place we wanted to live after leaving the US. I think, because we are such introverts, we felt alone for 2-1/2 months. While we enjoy each others company, we should have been more social. We joined meetup but it was when we were a week away from leaving Lisbon. Once we got to Porto we were sick for a week, then her dad came to visit. We should have made more of an effort in the Facebook groups we were in, FOR SURE.
The positive side though, it did help us establish our work life on this new adventure, which may have been more important than friends at this stage. Perspective is key.
We still LOVED Portugal and plan to come back! What we learned in the process was incredibly valuable either way. We learned so much about what we really want, where we feel comfortable, what we crave as far as food and nature, vs city and touristy. We left Portugal with the feeling of SUCCESS. Did we buy a house or apply for a year long stay, nope, but we now have a greater understanding of the country and what we want. Living there is definitely an option and it is still high on the list.
For now, we go see the world 🙂
Sounds like a success to me!
Thanks for sharing this video! We moved to rural France (from Belgium) and a lot of these reasons could also be reasons to leave here.
Another one to add in my opinion, for those with kids, is SCHOOL! That’s something we’ve been struggling with a lot. On paper and from what we researched before we moved, it is very similar here than in Belgium, but in real life, our kids are verry unhappy in school and that has a huge effect on our life here. So we don’t know if we’ll stay. It is something you can’t really know unless you move and try it out, like a lot of things!
Great video, thanks for your honesty.
Such a great video and topic!!!
Great video. Very informative. Thanks so much for your thoughts.
Great video! Definitely good to have a balanced view and finding a close community that is nurturing and supportive. People forget you’re moving to a new country with a whole set of values, so there’s bound to be some differences there.
Very smart video. Thanks for broaching this topic
Great video Dan & Michelle! Check out the luscious locks on both yall! Gorgeous Couple! I understand all the valid points mentioned... however.... none of them sound/feel like deal breakers to us. Our crystal clear reasons and purpose for taking this leap are ingrained in our fibers. The first year will be hella challenging but our souls require this next chapter and new environment. The learning curve will expand our minds, hearts, and show us what we're made of.
We'll be in Porto next month on a one-way ticket. Looking forward to hopefully crossing paths with you at some point. 💞
With that mentality, you should be just fine!
So well said...🙏 best of luck
Great video Michelle and Dan! Look forward to the next one 😊 Btw, Dan, your hair !! 👍👍
Haha, I know! I honestly was surprised when I saw the footage of this video. Just hit different then what it looks like in the mirror.
Thanks for yours beautiful vídeos. We’re from Texas. It’s very interesting recognizing to be great have your tribe . But everybody is so busy with life. Very understanding.
Thanks for shareing, it was really help full for us.
I like this video, you’re sharing more of the “immigrant” reality and less of the glamorized online “expat life”. Great Portugal information and love hearing seeing your journey!
Great content and definitely necessary. Some people give up EVERYTHING for some rosie expectation and the reality is that it's hard and yes about the community! Especially away from the coast, it can be much harder and my friend, a male, got a bit man handled by a doctor! He was grumpy because my friend was a foreigner.
Great video appreciate you sharing tips and your persinsl experience and honesty
Thank you for a level-headed take on living in this year's trendy expat destination. Thirty years ago, it was Prague. It is always someplace, but people need to approach expat living understanding that it might bring both the best and worst of experiences. Also be prepared for what Uncle Sam does to expats in terms of taxation. Expat living is mostly rewarding for those who have ALWAYS been globally minded. It is not a panacea for American problems.
I'm with you on all of this. I am working on my D7 Visa and it has been a real challenge.
Great video as always! I love your philosophy that "every situation is a chance to learn". Currently trying to learn patience as our house is taking longer than expected to sell, so it's pushing our timeline back. You both look calm and healthy--happy for you. Can we get the details on those earrings?
The hoops are from Nordstrom! (the teen section lol) ✨
I’m glad you posted this. As the old saying goes, “If you live in paradise, where do you go to get away?”
Thank you for the transparency around taxes. A lot of TH-camrs in Portugal walk around the subject and totally mislead their audience.
I saw you once in LX Factory last month! Your content is great, keep going ;)
Well said moon crew,
Definitely moments of ,wtf am I doing here arise ,until I remember why and remind ourselves those reasons.You are correct about “Everything is different “….thanks for the post.
Chalice….
Great video, you made good points
Thank you 🙏
Great seeing you all today! It's a small world!
You mentioned taxes. Can you share a few recommendations? We want to retire to Portugal. We're scouting this October. Like you I've gotten tons of figures but nothing concrete. I have 1 meeting set up for next week with a Portuguese accountant. Everyone's on holiday in August ☺️ Thank you!
G’day from Andrew and Monica
I always love your content and excellent insight
By watching your videos we are getting free therapy sessions.
We have been fortunate to have both lived in different countries besides USA and we look forward to the daily challenges and cultural differences. Life is a journey and we are so happy to become residents soon in Portugal.
Thank you for taking time out of your day to produce excellent videos
Cheer!
Andrew and Monica
If you have already lived outside the US that experience is going to help a lot.
These are all issues, but aren't necessarily tied to Portugal. I live in South Korea and all these things apply to my life here.
Good info thanks tons
Great video guys! I think people get lost romanticizing "moving to Europe," without really knowing why they're coming here or what they're getting into. Adjusting is definitely different for everyone, and really parallels how people adjust to any of life's challenges. Thanks for keeping it real 😍-Kirsten
Portugal is not for everyone and that’s a good thing. It’s the same for every country. It all depends what’s important to you and what you want from life.
I moved form the Uk to PT a year ago and there’s a few adjustments to make but overall Portugal aligns with my soul and the kids seem super happy which was all I wanted.
Been in Portugal for 3 years. Spend most of my time waiting for documents and driving past car accidents.
Already been run over and the insurance won't pay out for injuries.
Nice weather though.
😂😂😂
I had thousands of dollars stolen from a real estate agent in Tavira. Portugal is changing. The police were unresponsive when I filed the police report. I haven't seen an investigation yet and the robbery was last October. I understand theft is a big issue in Tavira. The safety ratings for Portugal have gone down dramatically everywhere. It used to be considered safe. Not any more. Be careful. Be safe.
I think this is an excellent video. I can't stress enough how valuable it is--not only for moving to Portugal, but for anyone wanting to become an expat anywhere in he world--and I hope it gets viewed widely. Can I assume your intended audience is 20-something Americans?
A quick note on therapists. Yes, CA law does require therapists to meet other US states' requirements when the client is in a different state or jurisdiction. Because Portugal has no formal requirements, CA therapists can offer telehealth services to current clients traveling or living there. Something to check out.
I'm a therapist. It is tricky. I am choosing to become a mental health coach and avoid
all the legal issues. The states I'm licensed in require that you are licensed in both jurisdictions.
On top of that, no one will probably insure you so if something goes wrong, the consequences are unknown. Not so easy. But it is possible.
Wow. There's a certain way to stand in line for the restroom in Portugal?
I know some people who have come to Portugal on a true trial basis. They haven't divested themselves of their home in the US and after a year or two, its a big decision for them to stay or go back
Whatever the place you pick to live, always will happen issues, that's normal, you are in a different country, culture, language, costumes, food...everything is new, and takes time to adjust to new environment.
Good advice! I am traveling in Lisbon now for a few days. I wonder whether you can refer me a good English spoken accountant to speak to. Also, I would like to know where to shop for the required medicine policy? Thanks 🙏
Wherever you go, then there you are!
I am a therapist am planning to establish myself as a mental health coach for expats when I get there. So you have any suggestions as to how I can meet the needs of others as you described in this video?
Not sure specifically, but going through it yourself is going to help.
I get what you are saying, I'm a Brit and after a few years living in France I just don't bother with local people anymore (we both speak French btw), Just a few English speaking friends. Having said that I never bothered with many people back in the UK. The reason I'm happy here in France is living in the country. House prices are lower than the UK. running a vehicle is cheaper and less people around too, We (my wife and I) often go to places and very often we are the only one's, when we lived in the UK (South of England), you really could not do anything without people all over the place. so it's the fact France suits our live style why we will be spending the rest of our lives here, The country not the people.
This is what many people do that immigrate to USA...they form communities of their tribe, for some reason this is verboten for Americans to do when they move abroad.
I don't think they are saying it's "verboten", only that your experience will be different.
@Maisie Poot It is obvious that it is easier to learn the local way of things but let's stop with the constant harranging and virtue signaling that it's somehow politely or otherwise required.
How exciting enjoy!!
This is great for moving anywhere. I lived in China and Thailand for 11 years, and I found similar things there as well.
Thanks!
Hey guys, my husband is a therapist and we are moving to Portugal in less than 5 years. (Our son is in college.). We are hoping he can still practice when we move. What are issues might we face?
I have no idea how that works
Brasilian imigrants tend wrongly to consider Portugal a second Brasil. They come, ( 400.000) between 2016/2022 ) they struggle for 3 years at least and some ( 3500 ) returned to Brasil with economic faillure, while all the others remain working and living here. After getting portuguese residence card in 2 years some 8% go to other european countries but they soon realize that portuguese quality of life is only possible here and they return. Our diversity attracts 170 different nations of students studying here during this year. Golden visa coming from China from 2010 wich are now leaving are being substitued by Americans. It's like a wave of oportunity. Those who found their roots here will stay, others will go away
Out of curiosity, how proficient are you folks with the Portuguese language? I imagine there is a strong relationship between language proficiency and cultural adaptability.
I (Dan) am pretty fluent and Michelle is a beginner still. Knowing the language definitely helps!
I'm submitting my D7 application in 3 weeks. Yes, I relate to the stress and terror.
After living there for more than a year, have you guys put any effort in learning the language, just like you would expect from people who migrate to the US?
I (Dan) speak the language almost fluently. Michelle took lessons and still is practicing.
@@HoneymoonAlways excellent. How did you learn it and how long did it take you to become fluent?
I am a Portuguese citizen living in Toronto since I was a child. I am fluent in Portuguese and love visiting Portugal. I would never live there.There are reasons they continually lose 100,000 people a year. Low disposable income !! Very inconvenient to live. Extreme humid apartments, noise, climate not really that great ( summers cool in evenings). Anyway. Good luck. You are doing something I would never even consider
Americans are fed up. Guns, bad schools, bad food, fat people and more. That is why they are looking for greener places.
I respect that. I am a Portuguese Canadian. My sister & I were born in Canada, and my parents were born in Portugal. In 2006, my family & I took a vacation to Portugal. I have to be honest with you, I did not have a good time there. I 😢 get me wrong I love seeing the island, but I just felt like I was out of place. I couldn't speak the language cause the only language I speak is English and the time zone affected me too. Plus I started to feel homesick. I was missing my home. I was happy to be back home. That was my experience when I went to Portugal. I do not want to live there either.
If you are not secure with yourself in mind, body and spirit...It does not matter where you move...I have been a legal resident here almost 6 years...Orginally from Austin, Tx...My choice of living in Portugal was quality of life across the board...Is it perfect, uuuummm no, however hands down I would not trade it for the world...The country has plenty of opportunities to explore and meet local folks...Get out of Lisboa and Oporto and etc...I connect with more people in the smaller communities, that are more authentic and outgoing and actually want to engage in conversation...and they are more than happy to show you there Portugal...Get Busy Living! Boa Sorte! 😉🇺🇲❤️🇵🇹✌️🤙🤟😎
A lot of these things are likely to be true no matter where you immigrate to especially if you don't speak the local language. People have to remember that they may get to a new country and decide it's not for them long term. It's a good reason to invest time/money in a discovery trip that allows you to stay there for a few weeks, not just a short vacation.
Good info
Love your vlogs and you bring out the basic things that one needs to learn to adjust in a new environment. How was the summer in Lisbon this year. Dallas Tx was brutal this year and Lisbon s should have been a a lot better i suppose, despite this year's hotter summer across the world. Keep up the Good work!. On the tax front for me coming on a D7 with no reason to work the Tax situation should be fairly straight forward under the 10 year NHR rule
We are from Austin and the weather is very mild here compared to Texas. Only people complaining about heat are during the hot days not having AC.
I appreciate the real content here! Also EFF TAXES!!
Thanks Kara!
GURL! When you said “US News” my husband and I laughed out loud. We JUST had that discussion 5 minutes before watching this video.
I moved to MX. For 10 years I have changed, irritability, depression, anxiety and so on. It’s like one has to wait forever to get 1 important thing done. Every morning when I wake up, I feel like this morning is going to be great. Wrong, everything seems difficult .
I thought I would give Portugal would be better. Sounds like my life would be worse than it is in MX. Thanks for letting us know your opinion .
We hope this helps you prepare for your move, or if you're already here, can give you some ideas on how to combat some of the difficulties many people face when moving to a new country! Have you experienced any of these? Is there anything we should add to this list?
I was wondering can you use Google Translate for instance, at the Pharmacy? Or maybe that is not sufficient? It is very important to get your meds correct, especially for depression or anxiety.
you have both inspired and informed us alot thank you we move to madeira next month !
About pharmacys one other information: in Lisbon we have a 24h pharmacy open 365 days a year in Benfica at Av. do Uruguai.
I've actually met too many people that it's overwhelming. I can't keep up with all the people that want to hangout every day and I'm having to actively trim my "friends" network. Most of these people are from the Meetup groups, some are random people from restaurants/bars, and some are from another good source not mentioned in this video... WhatsApp groups. We have a "long term friends group", a local neighborhood group, a "social life" group that posts events and random hangouts almost daily, a hiking group, etc.
We have the same issue, now we are working on more meaningful relationships like your long term group. Now I haven’t really used WhatsApp groups for making friends before but sounds awesome.
Thanks Michelle & Dan for this video. After 2+ years considering a move to PT, I’ve learned to put more weight in YT videos by folks like yourself that live there vs others just passing through. I lived in Italy many years ago and, yes, it takes a lot of time to “figure stuff out”-and I didn’t have Facebook to help me either! BTW-on taxes (not trying to get Dan’s hair to fall out 😁) my approach prior to moving to PT is to consult with both a tax expert at home as well as in PT. Does this make sense? Cheers.
I would add to consult more than one Tax expert in Portugal since some may not be telling you the whole story
@@HoneymoonAlways Thanks for your input.
I guess you can’t use Turbo Tax anymore in PT. 😏
I have been looking into taxes prior to making the move. Have gotten conflicting answers on various issues. Taxation of Roth IRAs, IRA withdrawals and Social Security, etc. Fell into a rabbit hole when I found out that US brokerage companies don’t like expats and investing in Europe can trigger severe issues with the IRS. Not stopping me though, I will someday make sense of it all!
Yes. It also amazes me that the answers to these (what I consider straightforward questions) are not available. And that various tax "experts" differ in their views.
So glad I'm not an American and I don't have to deal with the IRS. Have many American friends abroad and its scary what they have to deal with.
Excellent video. Thank you for sharing your thoughts and experiences.
I am smiling here because this is supposed to be 5 reasons but you keep turning back to the positives. ☺️
It’s great that they don’t over-prescribe narcotics. It’s a horrible situation in the US! Americans are the only people who are double-taxed. (Not my favourite subject either Dan).
We don’t get “double taxed” in countries that have a tax treaty with the US.