_The Last Jedi's_ Luke is an inspiration as well. As he inspired the slave kids who reenacted his last stand with homemade action figures. Weird how TLJ detractors accuse TLJ of trying to destroy Luke's character, when he, not Rey or any of the new characters, is the one to save the Resistance and spark hope.
@@teleportedbreadfor3daysAgreed TLJ is just a false hope at the end of the day the resistance still lost Luke is dead the resistance is down to 20 people the galaxy still in control in first order everything about that movie nothing but lies.
Question: Can't many different paths led to the same final destination? After all, that is the journeys of Luke Skywalker in both Legends and Canon. One is a story of resisting the temptation of the Dark Side while the other is about redeeming one's self from apathy. But in the end, these two stories lead to the same conclusion. Luke Skywalker became a Jedi like his father before him, Anakin Skywalker, and died a Jedi like his father before him as well.
Virgin Luke: No my nephew had a nightmare he's evil i will have to kill Him Chad Luke: No I won't give up on Jscen because he's lost his way. If he has fallen under Lumiya influence im going to bring him back under mine Legends Luke is Anakin if the Jedi Order drom the republic wasn't corruption and dogmatic on they view to the dark side
Luke's entire character is quite literally supposed to be anakin had he done everything right. At the moment the emperor says to kill his opponent, anakin folds and does it, luke declines and throws his weapon away.
Agreed. Like Ahsoka mentioned he's so much like his father, but just like Ahsoka he inherited more of the good aspects of Anakin as opposed to the bad, and he also picked up some good from Padme to keep the few negatives of his father he did get in check. And he in turn learned from the failures of his father and the previous Jedi Order to make a better one, one more open and understanding by its ideas to allow Jedi to form attachments, and Luke himself shows that's not a bad thing, as it was his love of his father that allowed his father to return to the Light. Even after losing Mara Jade despite giving more into his negative emotions, he doesn't completely succumb to them, he takes his time away from the Jedi Order to mourn and move on before returning to it, he does the healthy thing here because his Jedi Order isn't as dogmatic as the old one so it allows Jedi to do this.
You don't even need the EU. There's enough in the films to show his development and the changes in him and his mastery of the force. Like it was stated in the video, he was a whiny little farm boy in A New Hope, he gets put in his place in ESB, and he shows how much he's grown in RotJ. When he throws his lightsaber and refuses to strike down his father, he shows he has truly become a Jedi.
Not counting the EU Luke went through a lot and grew throughout the OT. Another issue with Luke character is that he’s an aspirational hero, having him giving up on the Jedi contradicts a quintessential aspect of the character. Oh well, they massacred Luke just as they recently did with Obi Wan.
Luke started out as a whiny kid living on his uncle's and aunt's moisture farm knowing little to nothing about the greater galaxy outside of that, and seeking adventure and glory. As the films go on Luke learns anger, hate, impatience, patience, love, compassion, humility, forgiveness, and hope. He makes several mistakes and learns from them making him a better man. That's a better character development than the sequels ever gave us, and more developed than most films at the time.
Luke Skywalker: The guy who thought his psychotic child-murdering, wife-choking father, was somehow capable of redemption. Notices signs of his nephew potentially turning to the dark side, attempts to kill.
Uh, yeah, I guess that’s one way to look at Anakin heh… But seriously, Vader’s main drive that allowed him to persist as such was self-loathing, regret and despair. If you feel something comparable to that in anyone, maybe killing them, let alone in their sleep, isn’t exactly the way to approach it.
Yeah Disney really did Luke dirty. They tried so hard to push Rey as their new girl boss perfect hero, but all they did was push away any potential audience by crapping all over the Star Wars legacy
Luke, "There's still good in him. I can save him." about the second most evil man in the galaxy. "I have to save my friends." Also Luke, "This Kid is HAVING A BAD DREAM!"(Lights saber and gets ready to murder sleeping nephew) "Screw my friends and the galaxy, I'm sad." And people wonder why the Sequels are rightly panned as poorly written jokes.
@@grandadmiralzaarin4962 Not to mention the Last Jedi was the first draft. It’s very sad how little to no importance people who are put behind Star Wars are putting into it.
I think the mercy of Luke is something the sequels did miss the point of. Legends Luke even tried to save an insane dark Jedi, and he still attempted to save him after he almost successfully brainwashed Luke, cloned Luke so that he could force Luke to fight his doppelgänger in the battle to the death to drive Luke to insanity, and was simultaneously trying to actively kill/ turn Han, Leia, and Mara Jade. Canon Luke would’ve decapitatedC’Baoth after he gets knocked out on Jomark probably ending the Thrawn trilogy a book early.
When does TLJ Luke do anything like decapitating C'baoth? He regretted considering killing Ben as soon as he ignited his saber. "Like a fleeting shadow." And instead of hunting Kylo down and dueling him with a lightsaber, like the TLJ detractors wanted him to, he defeats Kylo nonviolently, psychologically, through meditation, showing true mastery of the Force. TLJ detractors act as though nothing from Force ghost Yoda's scene onwards happen. As if Luke burned down the tree temple, said, "Yeah, I still think Rey was wrong and that the Jedi were a mistake", and then had a heart attack while crying angrily like a soyjak. That's not how it went. Luke inspired the galaxy, becoming even more of a legend than he already was. The slave kids on Cantonica heard the story and made homemade action figures of him to reenact his action on Crait.
@@coreyander286 I guess what I was trying to point out is that Legends luke tried at various occasions to do anything but kill C’Baoth. Which in the situations he was in would take an almost inhuman amount of willpower and strict adherence to the principals he had displayed in return of the Jedi which is in keeping with his character development from that movie. Meanwhile canon Luke slips from his ideals for a brief moment over an issue that many would consider to be far less threatening to either himself or the galaxy at large. While I agree that canon Luke’s reaction to Ben’s touching of the dark side, is a more realistic temporary slip on Luke’s part I admit I am slightly biased towards legends luke for many of the reasons mentioned in the video. I guess my biggest issue with the scene of Luke standing over Ben is that the movie doesn’t take the time to really present younger Ben as a legitimate threat, perhaps showing a scene where we see younger Ben murdering/ harming innocents, force choking a fellow student, or accidentally using sith lightning in a stressful situation might’ve made canon Luke’s reaction be more understandable for the audience.
What I find disturbing from the TLJ is the idea that Luke would consider killing his nephew. A man who would go into a death trap to redeem a father he never knew and was a mass murderer would see a possible future and hold a lightsaber over his nephews head? That is inconceivable. It is one thing for Canon Luke to have a fall from grace but as an uncle I cannot imagine killing my own neice for a fall to the dark side that NEVER happened. It ruins the whole film. Imagine if I am an Evangelical christian and I told you that I was standing over neice with a loaded gun because I thought she was turning atheist. As far as I know she actively going to church but she watched a TH-cam video once and for that I thought about blowing her brains out. That is insane! That is a fall to the darkside. The sequels should have had Luke exiled to center himself and come back to the light and Ben as a bitter hermit.
No no no When Jacen turned to the dark side and. Killed Mara jade Luke is described has a stone who didn’t go after Jacen because he fear of turning to the dark side.
I think the reason Luke was such a grumpy person in the new canon is because he knows that Disney got rid of his smoking-hot red-headed girlfriend. I meant for that to be a funny joke, but the actual idea of a giant, fumbling corporation erasing a loved one from creation leaving only you to remember is deeply horrifying.
No no no When Jacen turned to the dark side and. Killed Mara jade Luke is described has a stone who didn’t go after Jacen because he fear of turning to the dark side.
Luke Skywalker belongs to the Expanded Universe. There he grew as a person, achieved his true potential and brought back a reformed jedi order which serves the will of force and not a government. Meanwhile Disney has a joke called Jake.
EU: Luke becomes so powerful, so one with the Force he literally sees things on an atomic level and can even Will himself back from death. Disney: Luke is an angry hermit drinking alien titty milk all day
Disney made him a joke so that they could give their new heroes, the original gang’s stories, accomplishments and future stories that the OT heroes had in the OT and Legends.
@@primefamous I mean… not really. He kinda just chose to become a hermit, which I assume Rian meant as an act done out of shame. And even that would’ve been more believable if the backstory behind Luke’s fall didn’t include him contemplating murder of his sleeping nephew. Like seriously, just have Luke be away when Ben turns, and Luke returns to see everything he worked for destroyed. His faith is shaken, his confidence in his ability to save people from the Dark Side, shattered. So many bright and young students, all dead because Luke stubbornly believed he could save Ben the way he saved Vader. But alas, I’ve no control over the canon. This is the way things are, for better or worse. Edit: I misspelled Rian’s name
My main gripe with canon Luke was how contrived his apathy was. It's the sort of deconstruction of legacy characters that is increasingly becoming ubiquitous, especially nowadays, all with the aim of replacing said characters with newer ones intended to appeal to "newer" audiences. The formula is quite simple. 1. Completely ignore all the character development and story of the legacy character and make them jaded. 2. Introduce newer and "updated" character who is somewhat an echo of what the legacy character once was. 3. Have said newer character embody all that the legacy character once was, with little of the legacy character's struggles or even undergoing any of the legacy character's journey. 4. Have the legacy character relearn what he already knew or should have known from newer updated character and then pass on his mantle to the newer updated character who will carry everything forward. 5. As a bonus, have the "newer" fans accuse the older fans of gatekeeping when this blatant middle-finger to the legacy character is called out. I cannot buy the idea of Luke wanting to kill Ben in TLJ and his eventual self-exile from the galaxy no matter how many times some people keep on yammering about how it makes Luke flawed and relatable. Luke was already relatable. Episode V saw to that. Luke spent the entirety of the film being humiliated and shown his own faults and the fact that he wasn't too different from Vader and could indeed become Vader. Why would Luke suddenly ,albeit temporarily, want to strike down Ben because of being influenced by Snoke? Luke is the last person in the galaxy who should have been able to judge Ben on account of his knowledge of his own flaws. As a result of Luke wanting to kill Ben, Ben destroys Luke's Jedi Academy (off screen) and Luke goes into self-imposed exile to sulk instead of even attempting to "right" his wrong like any responsible person would do.
It’s worth noting that this video gives us a good idea on who Legends Luke is, but it only tells a fraction of the kind of person and Jedi he really was: Luke revolutionized how the Jedi used the Force. When members of the Imperial Remnants sought to attack Luke during his wedding with Mara Jade and failed, he actually invited them to join the festivities as guests. Luke obtained Oneness with the Force, saved the Yuuzhan Vong over destroying them despite the extragalactic race having brought armageddon to the Galaxy. He convinced the Lost Tribe of the Sith to join forces with him and the New Jedi Order against Abeloth, the embodiment of Chaos in the Force. Luke barely defeated Abeloth alongside Darth Krayt after overcoming multiple near-death experiences, and believing Abeloth to still possibly return some day, he sent multiple Jedi out into the Galaxy to scout out and retrieve the Mortis Dagger, the only weapon that can kill any of the Ones. He lived on as a Force Ghost to help Cade Skywalker, his descendant and quite possibly one of the most powerful Jedi ever at least, no small thanks to having the power to reverse death itself, and I can continue. Still I, too, speak of only a fraction of Luke’s deeds. He was truly the greatest Jedi who ever lived. Luke Skywalker was an apex Jedi, or *the* apex Jedi. Sadly, while Legends Luke is everything Luke should be, Disney’s Luke is everything Luke *isn’t* and becomes seemingly responsible for everything that’s so bad in the very Galaxy he put his life on the line to save, especially the First Order gaining as much power as they did and arguably becoming worse in some way or another with Ben Solo joining the ranks as Kylo Ren.
@@jaieregilmore971 Luke basically fulfilled or surpassed his father’s potential, and he was also the catalyst that helped Anakin free himself from the shadow of Darth Vader and the Emperor, fulfilling the Prophecy in what I arguably believe to be an adapted manner, since the Sith exist to openly defy the Will of the Force.
He was projecting himself across half the galaxy, not just to one person but to an entire army on Crait. It demonstrated his mastery of the Force far greater than an in-person lightsaber battle could have. He used his wits and connection to the Force to humiliate Kylo in front of his troops and save the Resistance. And what's becoming a Force ghost to a Jedi? Ben Kenobi allowed Vader to kill him just so he could talk to Luke from beyond the grave during the Battle of Yavin. The Resistance would not have escaped Crait had Luke not sacrificed himself; the Millennium Falcon crew probably would've had an easier time escaping had Ben fought Vader longer. (Well, admittedly, they probably would've been reluctant to take off so long as there was still a chance of retrieving Ben.)
The problem is that The Last Jedi is a poorly written trash movie by a man whose stated goal as a filmmaker is to divide audiences and get them fighting with each other. A man who admitted he didn't like doing world building in his stories. A man who did not want to do a collaboration on such a huge franchise. And even more recently stated he wanted to absolutely destroy the franchise and give it a viking funeral. To make sure nothing else could follow it. Even if TLJ has an admittedly interesting idea for a character arc for Luke it still doesn't change the fact that he wrote a terrible story and movie to go along with it and had to do things in order to make it work that, when you think about it for five seconds, falls completely apart. That's the problem. That's the fundamental problem of The Last Jedi at its core. It was a movie made by a man who should never have been hired in the first place.
Finally, someone who summed up the reason why The Last Jedi sucked and did so much damage without being an Anti-SJW dirtbag. Rewatching The Force Awakens, I felt that it still held up (deal with it), but even I can't believe I loved The Last Jedi as a teen. The Clone Wars is still the worst Star Wars movie because it lacked a soul and goes against everything the series stood for.... But The Last Jedi has something almost as damaging: A _bad_ soul. Oh, and in case you're wondering, the initial directors for the sequels were hired due to them making uber-profitable sci-fi crowdpleasers: JJ Abrams: Super 8 Rian Johnson: Looper Colin Trevorrow: Safety not Guaranteed It _seemed_ like a good idea at the time, but in hindsight it wound up resulting in Kathleen Kennedy's successful evil genius plan to ruin Star Wars discussion and critique forever by inviting Anti-SJW grifters and Far-Left activists to hijack it once and for all, and thus make everyone forget about the worst thing Lucasfilm has and WILL ever do... *THE STAR WARS HOLIDAY SPECIAL!*
TLJ's Luke was the best possible tribute to Luke anyone could've come up with. A story where an old character still struggles with returning character flaws he had in his youth-and overcomes them-is not character assassination, it's inspiration. TROS's Luke was an insult to TLJ's Luke.
@@coreyander286 L opinion, you don't need a "tribute" to the golden era of a character, you need to make him being the best version of himself, a character like Luke is someone that already went through everything, finished the journey, defeated the empire, he should have been the Hero, instead we got diluted Empire 2.0, sad depressed Luke who gave up, and didn't even get to meet with Leia or Han again, we were robbed from a possible best moment on the entire saga, "best possible tribute to Luke" my ass, Ryan Johnson should stay away from things that aren't his own for good. ''not character assassination'' bruh, the character literally died. That movie Failed to deliver in every single aspect, chreography is bad, story makes no sense, plotpoints that are a waste of screentime, no character get his moment to shine, and gave us the most stupid version of the empire, emenies that cant even stop a ship from moving because their shitps are so slow, music get a pass because John Williams is naturally just good at that always.
The old Jedi Order's ban on attachments and emotion is what lead to their destruction and the galaxy's enslavement. Anakin Skywalker's sacrifice was the first sign of the Force being truly in balance. It was Anakin's attachment to Luke that redeemed him.
Legends Luke is a man who inspires generations to be better, and that there is always a choice, and that the right one is rarely easy, but is always the best choice in the end. So yeah, Legends Luke is the best Luke🙏.
The reason why Obi Wan and Yoda went into hiding is not only because of the Empire, but because they had to teach the next generation(Luke and Leia) about the Force and help them defeat it. Luke just ran away to die
The 2 versions of Luke couldn't be more different. One was written by people who loved and understood star wars. The other was written by a woke hollywood director. Who has no idea what he was doing. And nobody and tell me otherwise.
Disney Luke LITERALLY forgot the lesson of the original Luke. Legends Luke is an expansion on what OG Luke’s philosophy would bring about, Disney Luke has forgotten what he stood for.
Disney Canon Luke suffered from the very same concept that has plagued long-established films, shows, comics, and games since the start of 2015, and that is due to character deconstruction and assassination. I will always prefer EU Luke over his Disney Canon counterpart because at least in the EU he was written for the right reasons while in the Disney Canon he was written for the wrong reasons and thats all im going to say about that.
I agree. One can explain the story in a more appealing way, but that does not change the intent of who wrote the story. JJ and Johnson's intent was to make movies solely to make money, and also as a d*ck measuring contest between the two of them. The story was never important to them.
It's not just Luke either. .Han gives up most of his old smuggler ways to be with Leia, he becomes a general and it's revealed that his last name comes from a royal lineage. .Leia becomes and stays a MASSIVELY prominent member of the Galactic Republic. .3P0 and R2 have so many moments where they save the others or contribute in various ways. I'm fact it's C-3PO who reveals that Han is a prince. .Chewbacca... well he mostly stays the way he was lol. But he does have a lot of cool moments, and he gets a badass (though controversial) death where he saves Han and Leias kids from a freaking moon falling on them. .Vader is this terrifying, cold, calculating, intelligent presence. Almost always commanding respect. Compare that to Canon. .Han gets his last name cuz "derr herr solo get it?", abandons Leia, and dies because he (the lifelong smuggler mind you) couldn't see that his son was obviously about to kill him. .Leias new Republic fell apart just because they lost a couple planets, fails to bring it back together, and she dies for basically no reason at all. .C-3PO and R2 are there for pretty much no reason at all other than a quick laugh. . Vader is ALWAYS CRYING. like seriously, in Legends Anakin was dead okay. Any moments of mercy or humanity were far and few in between. His human body was every bit as machine as his robotic parts. In Disney? "WAAAAAAH PAAAADME", (has a badass scene where kal runs from him), "I DON'T WAAAANNA BE A DARK LOOOOORD", (cool scene where he says the army surrounding him is nothing but fear and dead men), "I MISS BEING AAAAAAANAKIIIIN" (fights a giant monster thing), "SOMEBODY CALL THE WAAAAAAMBULANCE" I know it sounds like a joke OH MY GOSH the amount crying he does!!! Like bruh you're the in the top 10 most powerful people politically and in the top 3 strongest beings of all time. Stop all the crying 😂😂😂 And then he's gotta play with people while he kills them. Like in the show he's all moving around the girl just to go "teehee I'm better than you!", he just kills his dudes off willy nilly, he's always repeating stuff from the friggin movies (im gonna flip if i have to hear "I HAVE YOU NOW!" or "you may fire when ready" one more time). Old Vader would've just one shotted her and left. He didn't play around like that. Yea he'd have a moment or two where he missed Padme or remembered his life as Vader, but for all intents and purposes Anakin died on mustafar. He was dead. He killed insubordinates and incompetents, not anybody who ever failed ever just because he thought it was cool to kill his own men. That's not even going into guys like Thrawn or Akbar or Mon Mothma. Disney removed legends cuz they wanted to be original, then did nothing but rip off Legends 😂
Dude I think your overhating, canon vader is pretty good and if you think that “whines all the time” is bad then by that logic anakin in the prequels is a bad character too, and Thrawn is as good in canon as he is in legends like I don’t see where they fucked up aside from the story he is in, I swear the trend now is to hate all Disney Star Wars
@@PteranoLiv It's not a trend dude it's objectively worse. Yes, Anakin did cry too much in the prequels. Everyone can agree on that. And no, Thrawn isn't even close to being as good as he was in Legends. He lost to space whales, he lost to a child, he lost to Ashoka, heck in the show he sat there explaining exactly how he was losing... and acted like somehow that made it a win.
Back then, one of the big criticisms of the prequels was the presentation of Anakin being a whiny and temperament kid/guy. Which he was, that was part of Lucas’ point. And we see that in Vader during the OT. What they had expected to see in the prequels was an Anakin as he was presented in the Clone Wars. Basically a guy that was good and stable, but who fell in love with being a warrior and military leader. Which ironically would not explain his brashness, impulsiveness and temperamental as we saw in the OT. With Thrawn? lol. That depends on whether you are talking about Thrawn in the books or of the TV shows. In one, he is a complex genius. In the other, he’s just another imperial commander who gets foiled time and again by a group of misfits because of his own arrogance and/or incompetence, (in Ahsoka, it’s the later).
The fact that The Last Jedi did what it was trying to do doesn't make it an admirable effort given what that goal was, nor did it even manage to do it well.
None of the TLJ detractors know what the goal was. To hear it from detractors, TLJ was trying to make everyone hate Luke in order to prop up the new generation of characters. It was a tribute to Luke. The slave kids in the final scene weren't comforting themselves by playing as Rey and Finn with action figures, they were reenacting Luke's heroism on Crait. TLJ was about how inspiring Luke is.
My issue was that canon Luke's fall was from out of nowhere. Hence the break in character. We see no lead up to that breaking point or what would cause him to abandon his friends and family that initially he defied Yoda and Obi wan for at the risk of the galaxy. Therefore his redmeption held little wait because there's no show up to that point why he needed redemption in the first place.
It just pointless for him end up like that it just writers rehash Yoda all over again only make it worse. He didn’t have any problems with the Jedi in his lifetime to turn out like that if it a prequel Jedi sure but with Luke never.
Did we ever find out what the Knights of Ren are? One line in the video made me think of that, I haven't heard about them since the first sequel movie.
This skips why he fell in canon. In canon, Luke starts fairly early on, learning the and practicing the dogma that doomed the old Jedi Order. Then around 28 aby, the truth about his father being Darth Vader comes out, and Luke does something completely out of character, which runs contrary to everything that we knew about him; He has a bad dream about his nephew turning to the Darkside, becoming basically like Darth Vader as part of a new galactic empire, and is so much in fear about it that visits his sleeping nephew in the middle of the night, and activates his lightsaber as he seriously considered killing him, creating a self-fulfilling prophecy. And so he runs and hides, waiting for death, while the galaxy burns which is apparently too big of a situation for someone like him. This is point-by-point complete contrast to his journey during the original trilogy to the point where it might as well been that Return of the Jedi never happened. And it bares little in the way of Lucas’ one time vision for where the character would’ve gone on to become after Return of the Jedi. And why? Because Rain Johnson admittedly wanted to create some controversy and put his own mark on the future of Star Wars as he had hoped to go on to be one of the franchise’s creative directors. Lucas’ original post Return of the Jedi for Luke was that he would go on to be the most powerful Jedi in history and the closest to ever reach the full potential of the Chosen One, but when a new enemy showed up and threatened his sister, he would sacrifice his own life for her, his family and the fate of the galaxy. Hate it or love it, Legends stayed truer to Lucas’ vision, by miles.
The problem with what Disney did to luke is not him betraying his core character traits, but it's that they fail at portraying how he redeems himself and becoming the jedi we know him to be
I like the legend version. However, the way you told the canon version of Luke as if that was the real intent of Rian Johnson, made it sound good. That's not how it was portrayed in the movie.
Luke Skywalker from Legends IS, the official story of Luke after Return of the Jedi. After all, Legends has been established since 1978, and is approved by George Lucas to be secondary Canon. Disney Star Wars and Dave Filoni Star Wars is trash.
Sequels actually follow George’s vision closer I think (Also Lucas hated Luke having a wife) and I know Filoni is his chosen heir and thus, most likely, following George’s vision. I personally prefer legends Luke if only because of his interactions with Mara (Honestly Luke and Mara and Legends Leía and Han are the most chaotic couples and I love it)
@@m310grass Neither Disney or Dave followed George's vision for Star Wars. Both Iger, and Dave did what they wanted to do with Star Wars and ignored George.
the luke in legends is a far better character in my oppinion. the jedi order faced some realy rough patches in legends during lukes time as grandmaster both during the vong war and when jason solo fell to the dark side and become darth caides. its also the period with abaloth. but he never truly gave up. the vong war he was fighting same during the war aigenst abaloth and afther jason fell to the dark side even though he in some ways gave up for a short period but he never let the fact of jason turning put him into a 6 year long exile where he was feeling sory for himsel on some planet. it did take a little while afther mara was killed before he was back in action aigen but that is fully understandable that needing some time to get over the brutal murder on your wife but he returned afther a few weeks or something like that. and during the abalaoth series he dident abandon the galaxy or the order when he was exiled from curossont and forced to step down temporarly from the roll of grandmaster, he went on a journy to find out why jason fell to the dark side and when doing that he was able to uncover the mystery of what was happening to the young jedi that was going mad and was even able to kill or atleast temporary defeat the force entety known by the name abaloth who was getting close wrecking everything. cannon luke seems far worse of a character in comparison to legends
I may be more of a Prequel fan, but Luke will always be a hero to me, I prefer Legends Luke, but there are bits from Canon I do like, such as his big rescue in the Mandalorian season 2 finale, in that moment he was just like his father, Obi-Wan, Ahsoka, and so many other great Jedi from the Clone Wars, he was badass with how he crushed the Dark Troopers, he was compassionate with how he talked to Din and Grogu about Grogu's future, and he was wise. That's such a great moment for Luke, as many reactors showed it even brought many people to tears of joy. While I wasn't one of the ones who did cry Ii was still overwhelmed by joy. The Clone Wars may have led to the end of the Jedi Order at the time, but ironically enough, I'd argue that during the Clone Wars with how much good Jedi did and how many others fell to the Dark Side that the Jedi Order was simaltiaously at it's best and worst during this time. But much like Luke in Legends I never lost my faith in the Jedi during this time, which is why I say this era of Jedi despite their failures is still a good era.
Respect I could never accept the losing faith archetype of character that wasn’t earn if it Dooku and Anakin sure but with Luke never. Mandalorian season 2 got Luke right fan was exciting and crying in joy when appear he was truly the return of the Jedi that we needed at the time. Plus if you asked if I would join Jedi or Sith I would join the Jedi despite there flaws I would never lose faith in ideals they strive for no order is perfect I’m so done with Jedi haters and the dark side is bullshit.
I could've rolled with Luke becoming a figure like Yoda or Obi-Wan if his setup for reaching it had been any good. Just felt far too forced with the story they gave us. Like Kylo destroying the Jedi Order and Luke going into exile cause it was his fault, ok that works but the reason why it was his fault just awful. Kylo had a bad dream about falling to the dark side, and Luke (depending on if you believe Kylo or Luke, and I honestly believe Kylo since Luke had lied about it before) almost or even tried to kill him. That just isn't what Luke would do. Also Luke just sitting around as an exact replica of his old enemies conquer the galaxy and kill billions. As such, Legends then, Legends now, Legends forever. I don't even bother with new content anymore cause I am simply uninterested.
While I find your analysis of Luke's arc in TLJ Somewhat compelling, perhaps even redeeming some quality to it, I still believe the ultimate execution to be mediocre at best and malicious at worst since it originates from false pretenses of who Luke is and was as a character. Add to that the overall disjointed and illogical ways that canon has handled the post Endor era and I don't think Luke's ST story really has many redeeming qualities when you analyze it in full.
I see what youre saying, but i feel youre ignoring, whether purposefully for the sake of discussion or mistakenly, that in order to reach the luke we see in canon, he has to go against his entire character up to that point. Like, post disillusionment sure he might want to kill ben or abandon his friends and family, but how hes written is that Luke attempted to do all that before he became disillusioned which completely goes against his character up to that point. To be fair though, if Luke's poorly positioned characterisation was the only problem with the sequel trilogy, then thered be a lot less hate. Yes, still hate, but much more restrained/muted. His poor characterisation is also surrounded by Han reverting his character and turning coward as well, the droids being actively useless where theyve always previously mattered somehow, poor villain writing, and so much fanservice/nonsense its ridiculous, and reys story and twist is so much hot garbage that i gave up on modern star wars. Ove been tempted a few times to get back into it but ive been burned each time. Still love legends though, not giving that up
I would have begrudgingly accepted the new interpretation of Luke had there been any narrative tissue between RotJ Luke and Luke when he was about to strike down his own nephew. Unfortunately, Rian fully embraced the "Step 4: Profit" meme and forewent any actual explanation.
They were so close to getting that scene right too. Instead of the slow deliberate drawing of his lightsaber, it needed to be a snap reaction. Like he felt the overwhelming need to defend himself in that moment. The idea of Luke accidentally creating Kylo Ren is a cool one, but the story surrounding it sucks.
I hear what your saying about Legends and Canon Luke. And i might've become a bit less toxic towards the Canon one. But at heart I still prefer the Legends Luke. And part of me still wishes that we got a TV series or movie series about Legends Star Wars.
Yeah I disagree completely and passionately with the notion that sequels Luke is at all as respectable as OG Luke. Trying to kill a child because he's having dark thouthts? That definitely sounds like the guy who chose death over killing his father because he knew Anakon had light in him still /s. Bad take.
There's having a flaw, then there is trying to murder your sleeping nephew over something he hasn't even done yet and might not even do. Utterly abandoning any and all responsibility for said murder attempt, not even trying to redeem or stop said nephew's reactionary rampage to the point of going away not out of a need like Kenobi and Yoda did because they were hunted by the entire galaxy, not with any plan to make things right, abandoning the galaxy, his nephew, his sister, his best friends all just because he was 'sad'. THAT'S the betrayal of character that flies in the face of literally every single facet of Luke Skywalker. It was objectively a poor writing decision that was done solely to reset the stage so that TFA could retell ANH and then for Johnson in TLJ to make a 'Viking Funeral' self contained film...in the middle of a trilogy. Regardless of subjective interpretation, it is objective fact that the Sequels were not coordinated, planned out well and utterly lacked cohesion. Luke Skywalker or should I say "Jake" Skywalker's character was just one casualty of a rushed and incoherent product. Even with the inconsistencies of Legends, its Luke is far and away the better character, with flaws, growth and a legacy to be proud of rather than a pathetic idiot who just repeated the exact same mistakes of the past over and over again and needed a new super character with zero flaws to show him the way and do everything he should have done, just better.
I feel like so many other people here in the comments, I don’t like sequels Luke because his core character trait of thinking he can and should try to redeem anyone just because he is compassionate is just gone. Instead of counseling and showing love to his NEPHEW, he instead decides it’s better to kill him in his sleep? Even if he decided against it last minute, OG Luke would have never stooped to that level. Especially with a member of his family.
Luke was only done right in Legends/EU. What Disney did most recently with the Sequel series mainly just screwed this character up.. an same can be said for well over 90% of the rest of the SW franchise under Disney as well.
I still prefer EU Luke. Disney Luke is disappointing. I still prefer EU Jedi order too, it's a more natural progression of Jedi based on lessons Luke learned, rather than just following the failings of Yoda's order.
I mean let's not even talk about the fact that the man was emperor for fell to the dark side and then came back because of his sister, ya know LEIA. One of the original strong women who got forgotten about thanks to "Darth Disney" Along with Mara Jade and countless others in the books and comics (that were cannon per Lucas)
I have written a long comment, please lend me your thoughts if you wish. Although it is your right to, of course, prefer the New Canon version of Luke, if that is what you want, I beg to differ. And I have to disagree about a couple of your points regarding the comparison with Ulic Qel-Droma and about Luke's redemption in TLJ. Regarding Ulic, first let's reiterate the point you made, that Disney is borrowing heavily from the old EU, The Tales of the Jedi here in particular. In fact they have been doing it a lot in their recent creations, and quite unashamedly so, without even crediting it. You can imagine how the conversations went when they made the EU non-canon: Let's get rid of this canon, so that we have creative freedom and don't have to restrict ourselves to the stories others made before us, all the while being able to recycle and reuse these stories whenever and wherever we want but taken out of their context, as we have the copyright. Quite cynical I should say, and as many say, showcasing that Star Wars is creatively bankrupt. Regarding Ulic himself, although I liked the character and rooted for him when I read the comic many years ago, he does not weigh so heavily into the consciousness of Star Wars fandom as Luke freaking Skywalker. Ulic is a character known only to a minority who have read this extended material, and he is not synonymous to the essence of what made Star Wars famous in the first place, a young humble person, thrust by circumstance and fate into becoming the greatest hero. Luke is the core and the heart of Star Wars, it is his journey that is the main arc of the three original movies, he is the most important character in the whole franchise. The reason why TLJ is hated so much by so many fans is because it took the most important character in the whole of Star Wars and treated him like a useless old fart who has outlived his usefulness and that they needed to get rid of somehow, in order to put some fresh faces on screen that would attract the younger audiences. If Ulic's story is interesting as a character arc of fall and redemption (and it is, I remember it making me quite sad), it is good enough for someone like...well, Ulic, an ancillary character. It is a sad and tragic story. Ulic was a hero before he became a villain and then spent the later years of his life in seclusion, remorseful of his deeds. He unwillingly agreed to train Vima, and this ends up giving him some closure, only to be killed be killed nonsensically by a totally unworthy person, the idiotic shuttle pilot that took Vima to the planet, dying in her arms, finally in peace with himself and becoming one with the Force. It is a good story but not good enough for Luke who is the character around whom the whole franchise revolved. One needs to find a better story for him, give him more to do, give him more things to shine with, even if he eventually has to pass the torch to someone else. And this takes me nicely to my other point. Your presentation here is disingenuous about what actually happened in TLJ. I watched it in the cinema and watched it again afterwards on my own, in order to try to understand if I may have been too harsh with it. The supposed "redemption" of Luke at the end, where he shows up as a projection, makes no sense. He supposedly delays the First Order so that the remnants of the resistance can escape. But if you pay attention, all the while he is confronting Kylo Ren, the Resistance are mostly just staring and they only mobilise to leave towards the end. There is no real escape route 'from the back' as it is collapsed. They are only saved by Rey conveniently showing up and levitating a bunch of rocks. Ultimately, Luke's sacrifice achieves almost nothing, barely gains the Resistance a few minutes, still leaves them trapped in the base and it all hinges on Rey showing up and really saving them. Unless one wants to claim that Luke knew that Rey would show up at the right moment (after the throne room sequence and Snoke's death, mind you) and only delayed them to give her time to do that. How does he know? Did he read the script? Luke doesn't even get heroically killed, fighting to the death or something. He just dies, due to exerting too much effort, drawing on too much of the Force or something. He would have done more good if his projection lifted the rocks in the back entrance. His attempt to help or save the Resistance amounts to almost nothing at all, it is more of a curiosity than any actual help. How is he 'redeemed' by that? Because he (sort of) showed up at the end? As a youtuber said, imagine two First Order soldiers discussing about it afterwards: "Hey John, can you explain to me what happened down there, because I hear all sorts of odd things? Yeah, Jack, to be honest, I don't really understand it myself. This guy showed up from inside the base and we shot him but he just wouldn't die. And then Kylo went down and they fought and then this dude just vanished. Very strange, I don't know what to make of it" And it makes no sense for the kids in the casino world to be re-enacting his "last stand" in their play. Re-enact what? His heroic vanishing act? And how did they find out about it? Did the remnants of the Resistance go around telling people about Luke's heroic disappearance? I can imagine what Rian and the movie makers and the Disney people were thinking of getting into it. "We have to find a way to get rid of Luke, we don't want this old fart getting in the way of introducing our endless score of new characters". "I know, let's reuse the Qel-Droma story arc!". And they used it, and they thought that it would also give the old fans a little nod - "Yes, we turned the main hero of the whole franchise into a grumpy and useless old man but see? We gave him a redemption and a meaningful death. Now take this tissue and dry your fanboy tears." Only, that the death is meaningless, like Ulic's, and therefore tragic, and the supposed redemption is "too little- too late". The old fans were given their consolation prize, only to realise that it was made out of sh.t. I have no rancor (pun intended) towards Rian Johnson specifically, I generally like him as a director. I am not a right wing culture warrior. I do not dislike diversity. But I have given up on Star Wars since TLJ, I didn't go to the cinema to watch TRoS, or Solo. I watched nothing Star Wars for years after it. I have gone back to watch some of the series and have even found Andor to be a reasonably well-made one, but I have stopped caring too much. I get drawn back once in a while, like today, writing long comments with my thoughts, which no one will read, but much like Luke's useless death, it makes no difference. Star Wars is bankrupt. I can at least still enjoy the things in it that I like, the original trilogy, the prequels (to a degree), and some parts of the EU like the Tales of the Jedi and Knights of the Old Republic comics, the Knights of the Old Republic video games, some of the novels.
I was a teen in the 90s and read a huge chunk of "legends" there are things about it I think they should have translated over without question. My TWO favorite characters are completely erased, and replaced with a whiny emo boy. Though knowing full well that I can't change it, I have come to accept the story now told.
While the video brings up a good point about the Ulic and Jaded Idealist concepts, it misses one thing. The Sequels had to force Luke into it. The young man who refused both his masters orders (Kenobi and Yoda) to see Vader as just a monster, despite knowing they were essentially the only way he could become a "real Jedi," because he wanted to see Vader/Anakin as having a chance at redemption attempted to kill his own nephew with no preamble. You can't square that circle. Not without a Sith tonne of extra stuff that the films left out.
I probably am biased because I grew up reading legends books but I think I prefer that character arc more for two reasons. 1. I like him being a role model and moral compass. He a good man while also still being very much a human being. 2. I think that while legends had its problems, Luke's story and his character arc left much more room for Star Wars as a story in my opinion. This is probably also a disagreements from me about how Disney handled the timeline of the series as a whole
I lost a lot of respect for your channel. It's not that people don't understand the concept of an idealist getting jaded or a person getting older or a hero returning to the normal world. It has to do with 1. what would make for a more satisfying story, 2. the way it was depicted and handled, 3. the reasons the people making the movie chose to do it that way. The example I always use is that you could have had Luke or Vader killed by a stray blaster bolt on Hoth. Would that be realistic? Sure. Would that "subvert expectations?" Yes. Would it make a better story? Absolutely not. It would be deeply unsatisfying, just like what they did with Luke later.
Well, pretending people said the Last jedi ruined the character of Luke only because they didn't want to see that specific evolution for the character is just neglecting the whole "Luke tried to kill his innocent nephew because of some hunch" plotline. That's where the sequel trilogy completely lost people regarding Luke. Who even wrote that ? Luke decided to save his father, which was literally cyborg Hitler for the rest of the galaxy, and succeded. Vader had a lot of blood on his hands, yet Luke brought him back and proved everyone wrong. Plus Luke knew since The Empire strikes back that future was never set in stone... he wouldn't ignite his lightsaber behind his sleeping nephew because he felt a possible outcome in a distant future. Makes no sense. Never will. The problem of canon Luke is not the low point he has reached at the end of his journey but the sloppy reason why he fell in the first place. 😒
"it would be way to easy to use the 40 years of star wars stories to just literally print money, nobody will remember any of us for that. and obviously we here at Disney are super amazing icons that DESERVE to be remembered. so instead, lets throw all that shit out and make up all new stories! stories so bad they manage to kill an almost universally beloved franchise known the world over in only a few short years! we will leave it in complete ruins, an so everyone will remember our names! MUHAHAHAHA!" -Kathleen Kennedy, probably.
I disagree with your take. While canon may be similar to Lucas's original plan, canon didn't really REDEEM him in the way the Hero's Journey meant for the hero to end their story. His redemption is to the Republic, not his ideals. His goal in the original trilogy, his journey, was not to save a republic, or defeat the empire, it was to defeat evil, bring balance to the force, and restore the light. Canon had no unified plot, and you can't square that circle. He stops moping and being apathetic not because of anyone of importance to him and his journey, but some random new kid he hangs out with for a few days at most. The Hero's Journey is more appropriately completed in legends by his refusal to return to the galaxy at large instead of truly leaving the "underworld" of the dark side, and eventually taking the lessons of his sojourn into the dark to come back to teach the light to a new generation. In Canon, he apparently rushes that sojourn and blindly charges into teaching the light without facing failure, unlike legends, and he in fact gave into fear unlike his legends counterpart. You can make the argument, but it's not a good one from my reckoning, or at least not a strong one. He's not the hero by then, and never completed the journey. He skipped over into a disillusioned supporting character to a new hero, and that's disappointing, not inspiring. The heroes aren't meant to be something real, but an inspirational story, and that's what we are robbed of
You forgot to mention the part about Canon where the guy who risked the fate of the galaxy and the jedi on saving his father tries to murder his nephew because he thought he would become evil. That's where Canon lost me. The truth is, Luke Skywalker is serious and sober hero. Scenes like the one when yoda bonks him even though he's old is a superficial attempt at comedy that often try to cover the fact that they cannot make anything of quality. Subverting old heroes, creating their own. I think the reason Canon is so hated is because they don't respect content and the few things they do add is often a shadow of their former self. Apathy? I can relate. SW is neither the fan powered franchise I grew up with nor the mind blowing trend from back then. Perhaps an outdated idea, but I think I'll stick to legends good guy version until they prove they can make content for more than just 4 years old.
I am most grateful to have found your site where I can receive true Star Wars Lord and let the pain of the Disney abomination drift out of my mind thank you so much!
Luke belongs in legends, Johnson and Disney set out to destroy Luke skywalker since in Disney you can not have a strong male character instead they want a Mary sue who is perfect, makes no mistakes, learns nothing because she knows every thing including the use of mind trick with no training and has no growth. Disney and especially Johnson have destroyed Star Wars.
I can forgive Disney wanting to tell their own story. I can forgive them creating bland narratives that are carbon-copies of older (better) stories. What I cannot forgive is the sheer character assassination of Luke Skywalker.
Disney trilogy does not exist for me. Rey, Fin, Kilo are fun concepts and could be a good story, but I feel they tried to destroy all the significance of the originals and took a terrible execution. Money over fandom
I prefer Luke Skywalker from the EU. Luke in the EU makes a lot more sense to who he is as a hero. I know in Disney Canon he was made to be an apathetic man who gave up on the galaxy and the Jedi. But that destroyed who he is and what he's meant to be. Even if idealistic people lose who they are when they get older. But Luke is different from them. Even Mark Hamill said that Luke is meant to be a symbol for hope, a perfect hero or not, Luke is and always will be a savior, redeemer, and twice a chosen one than his father was once he succeeded in reaching his potential.
Im a fan of the expanded universe it was done right. I spit on Disney vandalism to the lore. I've lost all interest in Star wars because of the trash they shoved out won't even bother with it again till some one else holds the I.P.
wait a second the movie title last jedi makes no sense because of all the order 66 survivors disney created so really the movie title is the last cough* 114 jedi
Those are not the same Master Yoda and Master Kenobi went into exile to survive long enough to pass on the teachings of the Jedi Luke went into exile to stew in his misery and die
>disney's lame fanfic >canon You gotta pick one. Any sane person can see that the rat co. did nothing but write a shitty fanfic version that they are desperately trying to retcon into being "canon"
I think why many people prefer Legends Luke (besides the obvious) is because he has more of a story and gets a better ending. It truly is a waste how this will be the very last time we'll the main trio on screen in theaters after a more than 30 years absence.
For me what really kills Luke in canon is the point of him as a character is that he’s “The New Hope” that’s meant to transcend the dogma of HIS Master’s Jedi Order so having him be yet another Jedi that fell to the dogma in the EXACT SAME WAY and Rey get to live on and be the one who creates a order makes him feel like a failed experiment?
Still not as impressive when comparing the multiple iterations of Batman over the years, especially the contrasts between the DCAU and Arkhamverse variants. Regardless, Multiverse Theory ALWAYS renders that even a great being in one world will be a damned one in another. *If every porkchop were perfect...*
@@michaelandreipalon359 yeah, but it is pretty surprising that such a person can exist in Star Wars. I prefer the legends Luke over the Canon one because that one is depressing.
@@Hello-bi1pm True, it's gotten a bit common, but really, it's still something we necessarily need, like bread in our culinary lives. And face it, it does render a lot of awesome storytelling possibilities and done right, plus continuity fanservice for longtime veterans of certain franchises and media.
I really appreciate how Legends handled Luke's death: He passed away sometime before the Legacy era. I dont think anyone wouldve liked to see him die, and the way he wouldve been shown dying would only have divided people.
To clarify. The reason I dislike it so much is for the fact that episode 9 is literally just a critic response copout. The fan base clearly swayed the way Disney was originally planning to take the story. I feel like they had a much better story than what we actually got. If they just stuck to their original idea for 9 (which they’ll never reveal but I’m sure they did before choosing Palpatine) it was just such a negative initial response before people could calm down about it
Expanded Universe Luke Skywalker is number one they did him justice even as grandmaster of the new Jedi he face some failures he never give up while the Disney screw his character over I would argue it was Yoda brought him back they really wasn’t a reason to kill him off like that. Also the Ulic and Disney canon Luke arc seems more fit for Anakin if he survives Return of the Jedi.
Luke Legends is an inspiration to us all.
Stfu and watch the damn video
It’s sad that Disney is trying to make Legends lost media and push their own writings in its place
_The Last Jedi's_ Luke is an inspiration as well. As he inspired the slave kids who reenacted his last stand with homemade action figures. Weird how TLJ detractors accuse TLJ of trying to destroy Luke's character, when he, not Rey or any of the new characters, is the one to save the Resistance and spark hope.
@@coreyander286 It was still shallow and pathetic
@@teleportedbreadfor3daysAgreed TLJ is just a false hope at the end of the day the resistance still lost Luke is dead the resistance is down to 20 people the galaxy still in control in first order everything about that movie nothing but lies.
Question: Can't many different paths led to the same final destination? After all, that is the journeys of Luke Skywalker in both Legends and Canon. One is a story of resisting the temptation of the Dark Side while the other is about redeeming one's self from apathy. But in the end, these two stories lead to the same conclusion. Luke Skywalker became a Jedi like his father before him, Anakin Skywalker, and died a Jedi like his father before him as well.
It's important to note that in both timeliness he is a drama queen, like his father before him.
Virgin Luke: No my nephew had a nightmare he's evil i will have to kill Him
Chad Luke: No I won't give up on Jscen because he's lost his way. If he has fallen under Lumiya influence im going to bring him back under mine
Legends Luke is Anakin if the Jedi Order drom the republic wasn't corruption and dogmatic on they view to the dark side
Luke's entire character is quite literally supposed to be anakin had he done everything right. At the moment the emperor says to kill his opponent, anakin folds and does it, luke declines and throws his weapon away.
Agreed. Like Ahsoka mentioned he's so much like his father, but just like Ahsoka he inherited more of the good aspects of Anakin as opposed to the bad, and he also picked up some good from Padme to keep the few negatives of his father he did get in check. And he in turn learned from the failures of his father and the previous Jedi Order to make a better one, one more open and understanding by its ideas to allow Jedi to form attachments, and Luke himself shows that's not a bad thing, as it was his love of his father that allowed his father to return to the Light. Even after losing Mara Jade despite giving more into his negative emotions, he doesn't completely succumb to them, he takes his time away from the Jedi Order to mourn and move on before returning to it, he does the healthy thing here because his Jedi Order isn't as dogmatic as the old one so it allows Jedi to do this.
I think Rob Terra or someone else mentioned it but I don't think this quote is being used in the right context
Absolutely night and day difference lol I love those books the legacy era is the best era.
@@freekill1018 Legacy the comics with Cade or Legacy of The Force?
People that claim Luke had no character development until Johnson touched the character either purposely ignored the expanded universe or just stupid.
EU doesn't count when talking about in movie character development.
You don't even need the EU. There's enough in the films to show his development and the changes in him and his mastery of the force. Like it was stated in the video, he was a whiny little farm boy in A New Hope, he gets put in his place in ESB, and he shows how much he's grown in RotJ. When he throws his lightsaber and refuses to strike down his father, he shows he has truly become a Jedi.
I definitely did not like that he just killed Luke off in the end of that movie
Not counting the EU Luke went through a lot and grew throughout the OT. Another issue with Luke character is that he’s an aspirational hero, having him giving up on the Jedi contradicts a quintessential aspect of the character. Oh well, they massacred Luke just as they recently did with Obi Wan.
Luke started out as a whiny kid living on his uncle's and aunt's moisture farm knowing little to nothing about the greater galaxy outside of that, and seeking adventure and glory. As the films go on Luke learns anger, hate, impatience, patience, love, compassion, humility, forgiveness, and hope. He makes several mistakes and learns from them making him a better man. That's a better character development than the sequels ever gave us, and more developed than most films at the time.
Luke Skywalker: The guy who thought his psychotic child-murdering, wife-choking father, was somehow capable of redemption.
Notices signs of his nephew potentially turning to the dark side, attempts to kill.
Uh, yeah, I guess that’s one way to look at Anakin heh…
But seriously, Vader’s main drive that allowed him to persist as such was self-loathing, regret and despair. If you feel something comparable to that in anyone, maybe killing them, let alone in their sleep, isn’t exactly the way to approach it.
Yeah Disney really did Luke dirty. They tried so hard to push Rey as their new girl boss perfect hero, but all they did was push away any potential audience by crapping all over the Star Wars legacy
@@Lawrence_Talbot When you approach things with sexist prejudice and poorly pretend it’s for progress, nothing good is gonna come out of it
Luke, "There's still good in him. I can save him." about the second most evil man in the galaxy. "I have to save my friends."
Also Luke, "This Kid is HAVING A BAD DREAM!"(Lights saber and gets ready to murder sleeping nephew) "Screw my friends and the galaxy, I'm sad."
And people wonder why the Sequels are rightly panned as poorly written jokes.
@@grandadmiralzaarin4962 Not to mention the Last Jedi was the first draft. It’s very sad how little to no importance people who are put behind Star Wars are putting into it.
I think the mercy of Luke is something the sequels did miss the point of. Legends Luke even tried to save an insane dark Jedi, and he still attempted to save him after he almost successfully brainwashed Luke, cloned Luke so that he could force Luke to fight his doppelgänger in the battle to the death to drive Luke to insanity, and was simultaneously trying to actively kill/ turn Han, Leia, and Mara Jade. Canon Luke would’ve decapitatedC’Baoth after he gets knocked out on Jomark probably ending the Thrawn trilogy a book early.
When does TLJ Luke do anything like decapitating C'baoth? He regretted considering killing Ben as soon as he ignited his saber. "Like a fleeting shadow." And instead of hunting Kylo down and dueling him with a lightsaber, like the TLJ detractors wanted him to, he defeats Kylo nonviolently, psychologically, through meditation, showing true mastery of the Force.
TLJ detractors act as though nothing from Force ghost Yoda's scene onwards happen. As if Luke burned down the tree temple, said, "Yeah, I still think Rey was wrong and that the Jedi were a mistake", and then had a heart attack while crying angrily like a soyjak.
That's not how it went. Luke inspired the galaxy, becoming even more of a legend than he already was. The slave kids on Cantonica heard the story and made homemade action figures of him to reenact his action on Crait.
@@coreyander286 I guess what I was trying to point out is that Legends luke tried at various occasions to do anything but kill C’Baoth. Which in the situations he was in would take an almost inhuman amount of willpower and strict adherence to the principals he had displayed in return of the Jedi which is in keeping with his character development from that movie. Meanwhile canon Luke slips from his ideals for a brief moment over an issue that many would consider to be far less threatening to either himself or the galaxy at large. While I agree that canon Luke’s reaction to Ben’s touching of the dark side, is a more realistic temporary slip on Luke’s part I admit I am slightly biased towards legends luke for many of the reasons mentioned in the video. I guess my biggest issue with the scene of Luke standing over Ben is that the movie doesn’t take the time to really present younger Ben as a legitimate threat, perhaps showing a scene where we see younger Ben murdering/ harming innocents, force choking a fellow student, or accidentally using sith lightning in a stressful situation might’ve made canon Luke’s reaction be more understandable for the audience.
What I find disturbing from the TLJ is the idea that Luke would consider killing his nephew. A man who would go into a death trap to redeem a father he never knew and was a mass murderer would see a possible future and hold a lightsaber over his nephews head? That is inconceivable. It is one thing for Canon Luke to have a fall from grace but as an uncle I cannot imagine killing my own neice for a fall to the dark side that NEVER happened. It ruins the whole film.
Imagine if I am an Evangelical christian and I told you that I was standing over neice with a loaded gun because I thought she was turning atheist. As far as I know she actively going to church but she watched a TH-cam video once and for that I thought about blowing her brains out. That is insane! That is a fall to the darkside. The sequels should have had Luke exiled to center himself and come back to the light and Ben as a bitter hermit.
Legends Luke will ALWAYS be better than Disney Luke. Every. Single. Time. You will NEVER change my mind about this.
No no no
When Jacen turned to the dark side and. Killed Mara jade
Luke is described has a stone who didn’t go after Jacen because he fear of turning to the dark side.
I think the reason Luke was such a grumpy person in the new canon is because he knows that Disney got rid of his smoking-hot red-headed girlfriend.
I meant for that to be a funny joke, but the actual idea of a giant, fumbling corporation erasing a loved one from creation leaving only you to remember is deeply horrifying.
Yeah and they took away his own son Ben Skywalker rebranded him as Ben Solo.
Don't watch Brazil by Terry Gilliam because yes, yes it is horrifying.
@@jacktadash
Hey, thanks, I had almost completely managed to suppress that one before you reminded me! 😖
Yup. Sounds like something a Sith Lord would do.
Brazil mentioned
I do not acknowledge Disney Wars.
No no no
When Jacen turned to the dark side and. Killed Mara jade
Luke is described has a stone who didn’t go after Jacen because he fear of turning to the dark side.
Luke Skywalker belongs to the Expanded Universe. There he grew as a person, achieved his true potential and brought back a reformed jedi order which serves the will of force and not a government. Meanwhile Disney has a joke called Jake.
Agreed… 110%.
Agreed infinity
And don’t forget that Luke also got married and became a Father.
EU: Luke becomes so powerful, so one with the Force he literally sees things on an atomic level and can even Will himself back from death.
Disney: Luke is an angry hermit drinking alien titty milk all day
Disney made him a joke so that they could give their new heroes, the original gang’s stories, accomplishments and future stories that the OT heroes had in the OT and Legends.
both have depressing endings....one lost his Wife son and nephews while the other lost......wait what did he lose again?
He lost his nephew to the dark side.
At least one still has his son.
Canon Luke lost Han, Leia, and Ben. That's still a lot to take.
@@primefamous How can he lost Leia and Ben when he was alreary dead, that makes no sense, he only loses Han.
@@primefamous I mean… not really. He kinda just chose to become a hermit, which I assume Rian meant as an act done out of shame.
And even that would’ve been more believable if the backstory behind Luke’s fall didn’t include him contemplating murder of his sleeping nephew. Like seriously, just have Luke be away when Ben turns, and Luke returns to see everything he worked for destroyed. His faith is shaken, his confidence in his ability to save people from the Dark Side, shattered. So many bright and young students, all dead because Luke stubbornly believed he could save Ben the way he saved Vader.
But alas, I’ve no control over the canon. This is the way things are, for better or worse.
Edit: I misspelled Rian’s name
My main gripe with canon Luke was how contrived his apathy was. It's the sort of deconstruction of legacy characters that is increasingly becoming ubiquitous, especially nowadays, all with the aim of replacing said characters with newer ones intended to appeal to "newer" audiences.
The formula is quite simple.
1. Completely ignore all the character development and story of the legacy character and make them jaded.
2. Introduce newer and "updated" character who is somewhat an echo of what the legacy character once was.
3. Have said newer character embody all that the legacy character once was, with little of the legacy character's struggles or even undergoing any of the legacy character's journey.
4. Have the legacy character relearn what he already knew or should have known from newer updated character and then pass on his mantle to the newer updated character who will carry everything forward.
5. As a bonus, have the "newer" fans accuse the older fans of gatekeeping when this blatant middle-finger to the legacy character is called out.
I cannot buy the idea of Luke wanting to kill Ben in TLJ and his eventual self-exile from the galaxy no matter how many times some people keep on yammering about how it makes Luke flawed and relatable.
Luke was already relatable. Episode V saw to that. Luke spent the entirety of the film being humiliated and shown his own faults and the fact that he wasn't too different from Vader and could indeed become Vader.
Why would Luke suddenly ,albeit temporarily, want to strike down Ben because of being influenced by Snoke? Luke is the last person in the galaxy who should have been able to judge Ben on account of his knowledge of his own flaws.
As a result of Luke wanting to kill Ben, Ben destroys Luke's Jedi Academy (off screen) and Luke goes into self-imposed exile to sulk instead of even attempting to "right" his wrong like any responsible person would do.
Canon Luke: sad old man
Legend Luke: humble, achieved oneness with the force, became the most powerful jedi
...He achieves oneness and was humble in canon too. He was still pretty powerful as far as Force feats go as well.
It’s worth noting that this video gives us a good idea on who Legends Luke is, but it only tells a fraction of the kind of person and Jedi he really was: Luke revolutionized how the Jedi used the Force. When members of the Imperial Remnants sought to attack Luke during his wedding with Mara Jade and failed, he actually invited them to join the festivities as guests. Luke obtained Oneness with the Force, saved the Yuuzhan Vong over destroying them despite the extragalactic race having brought armageddon to the Galaxy. He convinced the Lost Tribe of the Sith to join forces with him and the New Jedi Order against Abeloth, the embodiment of Chaos in the Force. Luke barely defeated Abeloth alongside Darth Krayt after overcoming multiple near-death experiences, and believing Abeloth to still possibly return some day, he sent multiple Jedi out into the Galaxy to scout out and retrieve the Mortis Dagger, the only weapon that can kill any of the Ones. He lived on as a Force Ghost to help Cade Skywalker, his descendant and quite possibly one of the most powerful Jedi ever at least, no small thanks to having the power to reverse death itself, and I can continue. Still I, too, speak of only a fraction of Luke’s deeds. He was truly the greatest Jedi who ever lived. Luke Skywalker was an apex Jedi, or *the* apex Jedi.
Sadly, while Legends Luke is everything Luke should be, Disney’s Luke is everything Luke *isn’t* and becomes seemingly responsible for everything that’s so bad in the very Galaxy he put his life on the line to save, especially the First Order gaining as much power as they did and arguably becoming worse in some way or another with Ben Solo joining the ranks as Kylo Ren.
Anakin maybe the chosen one but The title of Greatest Jedi belongs to Luke Skywalker he THE Jedi.
@@jaieregilmore971 agree. Disney massacred my son harder than any youngling I killed
@@Theleaver5088 oh my god lol
@@jaieregilmore971 Luke basically fulfilled or surpassed his father’s potential, and he was also the catalyst that helped Anakin free himself from the shadow of Darth Vader and the Emperor, fulfilling the Prophecy in what I arguably believe to be an adapted manner, since the Sith exist to openly defy the Will of the Force.
I will never forgive Disney for killing Luke to the equivalent of a Force Skype call.
He was projecting himself across half the galaxy, not just to one person but to an entire army on Crait. It demonstrated his mastery of the Force far greater than an in-person lightsaber battle could have. He used his wits and connection to the Force to humiliate Kylo in front of his troops and save the Resistance.
And what's becoming a Force ghost to a Jedi? Ben Kenobi allowed Vader to kill him just so he could talk to Luke from beyond the grave during the Battle of Yavin. The Resistance would not have escaped Crait had Luke not sacrificed himself; the Millennium Falcon crew probably would've had an easier time escaping had Ben fought Vader longer. (Well, admittedly, they probably would've been reluctant to take off so long as there was still a chance of retrieving Ben.)
@@coreyander286haha it’s ok buddy it’s called denial, you’re in denial. 😂
Luke Skywalker is a ture hero
Legends Luke is the best Luke. Nothing will ever be better.
He’s the true Canon Luke!
The problem is that The Last Jedi is a poorly written trash movie by a man whose stated goal as a filmmaker is to divide audiences and get them fighting with each other. A man who admitted he didn't like doing world building in his stories. A man who did not want to do a collaboration on such a huge franchise. And even more recently stated he wanted to absolutely destroy the franchise and give it a viking funeral. To make sure nothing else could follow it.
Even if TLJ has an admittedly interesting idea for a character arc for Luke it still doesn't change the fact that he wrote a terrible story and movie to go along with it and had to do things in order to make it work that, when you think about it for five seconds, falls completely apart.
That's the problem. That's the fundamental problem of The Last Jedi at its core. It was a movie made by a man who should never have been hired in the first place.
EXACTLY what I felt about JJ Abrams.
@@jacktadash but tlj was Rian Jhonson
@@PteranoLiv I think they’re aware, they’re saying they feel about Abrams the same way the OC feels about Rian
@@GGBlaster oh ok
Finally, someone who summed up the reason why The Last Jedi sucked and did so much damage without being an Anti-SJW dirtbag.
Rewatching The Force Awakens, I felt that it still held up (deal with it), but even I can't believe I loved The Last Jedi as a teen. The Clone Wars is still the worst Star Wars movie because it lacked a soul and goes against everything the series stood for.... But The Last Jedi has something almost as damaging: A _bad_ soul.
Oh, and in case you're wondering, the initial directors for the sequels were hired due to them making uber-profitable sci-fi crowdpleasers:
JJ Abrams: Super 8
Rian Johnson: Looper
Colin Trevorrow: Safety not Guaranteed
It _seemed_ like a good idea at the time, but in hindsight it wound up resulting in Kathleen Kennedy's successful evil genius plan to ruin Star Wars discussion and critique forever by inviting Anti-SJW grifters and Far-Left activists to hijack it once and for all, and thus make everyone forget about the worst thing Lucasfilm has and WILL ever do... *THE STAR WARS HOLIDAY SPECIAL!*
The Mouse's Luke is an insult to real Luke.
Real Luke was going to be ruined by George Lucas with the same hermit too.
@@russianoverkill3715 thats whataboutism, we dont know how his trilogy would have been, stories change and are always different from the drafts.
TLJ's Luke was the best possible tribute to Luke anyone could've come up with. A story where an old character still struggles with returning character flaws he had in his youth-and overcomes them-is not character assassination, it's inspiration. TROS's Luke was an insult to TLJ's Luke.
@@coreyander286 L opinion, you don't need a "tribute" to the golden era of a character, you need to make him being the best version of himself, a character like Luke is someone that already went through everything, finished the journey, defeated the empire, he should have been the Hero, instead we got diluted Empire 2.0, sad depressed Luke who gave up, and didn't even get to meet with Leia or Han again, we were robbed from a possible best moment on the entire saga, "best possible tribute to Luke" my ass, Ryan Johnson should stay away from things that aren't his own for good.
''not character assassination'' bruh, the character literally died.
That movie Failed to deliver in every single aspect, chreography is bad, story makes no sense, plotpoints that are a waste of screentime, no character get his moment to shine, and gave us the most stupid version of the empire, emenies that cant even stop a ship from moving because their shitps are so slow, music get a pass because John Williams is naturally just good at that always.
Luke’s son is my favorite Star Wars Character probably even in all of fiction. Ben Skywalker
It really makes more sense for Luke to name his son Ben over Leia.
In my eyes EU luke Skywalker is the true luke the Disney one is Jake soywalker
Jake Soyborker.
EU Luke Skywalker is the same Luke Skywalker at the end of Return of the Jedi, but much wiser and more powerful.
@@gabrielandjavierpinales3689no not really he’s a lot better, a true Jedi
17:16-17:20 "retaining the ban on attachments, which is for the best."
one question... WHY?!!
Look at this channel’s video on his father to see why.
The channel simps for the corrupt old Jedi order.
The old Jedi Order's ban on attachments and emotion is what lead to their destruction and the galaxy's enslavement.
Anakin Skywalker's sacrifice was the first sign of the Force being truly in balance. It was Anakin's attachment to Luke that redeemed him.
Legends Luke is a man who inspires generations to be better, and that there is always a choice, and that the right one is rarely easy, but is always the best choice in the end. So yeah, Legends Luke is the best Luke🙏.
A nova ordem jedi do legends era 1 trilhão de vezes superior a ordem antiga dos jedi.
cannon luke
and disney luke
Disney wars fanfiction
The reason why Obi Wan and Yoda went into hiding is not only because of the Empire, but because they had to teach the next generation(Luke and Leia) about the Force and help them defeat it. Luke just ran away to die
Facts. It’s an insult to compare Obi Wan and Yoda exile to Luke in TLJ
Disney ruins everything it touches
Disagreed
@@PteranoLiv you’re profile pick says it all my dude
Yeah. Even the “good” content they produce while good and all contradict a ton of things Lucas have set up
I wouldn't say they ruin everything. They do destroy a LOT though...
@@Comicnut64 Dude that's pretty lame to use a pfp to disagree with someone and even more lame to call out that pfp specifically. Don't be weird.
Expanded Universe > anything in Canon.
The ability to speak does not make you inteligent
@@PteranoLivsays the person who never read the EU
Do you even REMEMBER Legacy of the Force and The Holiday Special?
@@NebLleb I'd take that over canon.
@@Quincy299 says the person who never watched canon
The 2 versions of Luke couldn't be more different. One was written by people who loved and understood star wars.
The other was written by a woke hollywood director. Who has no idea what he was doing.
And nobody and tell me otherwise.
Disney Luke LITERALLY forgot the lesson of the original Luke. Legends Luke is an expansion on what OG Luke’s philosophy would bring about, Disney Luke has forgotten what he stood for.
Disney Canon Luke suffered from the very same concept that has plagued long-established films, shows, comics, and games since the start of 2015, and that is due to character deconstruction and assassination. I will always prefer EU Luke over his Disney Canon counterpart because at least in the EU he was written for the right reasons while in the Disney Canon he was written for the wrong reasons and thats all im going to say about that.
I agree. One can explain the story in a more appealing way, but that does not change the intent of who wrote the story. JJ and Johnson's intent was to make movies solely to make money, and also as a d*ck measuring contest between the two of them. The story was never important to them.
It's not just Luke either.
.Han gives up most of his old smuggler ways to be with Leia, he becomes a general and it's revealed that his last name comes from a royal lineage.
.Leia becomes and stays a MASSIVELY prominent member of the Galactic Republic.
.3P0 and R2 have so many moments where they save the others or contribute in various ways. I'm fact it's C-3PO who reveals that Han is a prince.
.Chewbacca... well he mostly stays the way he was lol. But he does have a lot of cool moments, and he gets a badass (though controversial) death where he saves Han and Leias kids from a freaking moon falling on them.
.Vader is this terrifying, cold, calculating, intelligent presence. Almost always commanding respect.
Compare that to Canon.
.Han gets his last name cuz "derr herr solo get it?", abandons Leia, and dies because he (the lifelong smuggler mind you) couldn't see that his son was obviously about to kill him.
.Leias new Republic fell apart just because they lost a couple planets, fails to bring it back together, and she dies for basically no reason at all.
.C-3PO and R2 are there for pretty much no reason at all other than a quick laugh.
. Vader is ALWAYS CRYING. like seriously, in Legends Anakin was dead okay. Any moments of mercy or humanity were far and few in between. His human body was every bit as machine as his robotic parts. In Disney? "WAAAAAAH PAAAADME", (has a badass scene where kal runs from him), "I DON'T WAAAANNA BE A DARK LOOOOORD", (cool scene where he says the army surrounding him is nothing but fear and dead men), "I MISS BEING AAAAAAANAKIIIIN" (fights a giant monster thing), "SOMEBODY CALL THE WAAAAAAMBULANCE"
I know it sounds like a joke OH MY GOSH the amount crying he does!!! Like bruh you're the in the top 10 most powerful people politically and in the top 3 strongest beings of all time. Stop all the crying 😂😂😂
And then he's gotta play with people while he kills them. Like in the show he's all moving around the girl just to go "teehee I'm better than you!", he just kills his dudes off willy nilly, he's always repeating stuff from the friggin movies (im gonna flip if i have to hear "I HAVE YOU NOW!" or "you may fire when ready" one more time).
Old Vader would've just one shotted her and left. He didn't play around like that. Yea he'd have a moment or two where he missed Padme or remembered his life as Vader, but for all intents and purposes Anakin died on mustafar. He was dead. He killed insubordinates and incompetents, not anybody who ever failed ever just because he thought it was cool to kill his own men.
That's not even going into guys like Thrawn or Akbar or Mon Mothma. Disney removed legends cuz they wanted to be original, then did nothing but rip off Legends 😂
Dude I think your overhating, canon vader is pretty good and if you think that “whines all the time” is bad then by that logic anakin in the prequels is a bad character too, and Thrawn is as good in canon as he is in legends like I don’t see where they fucked up aside from the story he is in, I swear the trend now is to hate all Disney Star Wars
@@PteranoLiv
It's not a trend dude it's objectively worse.
Yes, Anakin did cry too much in the prequels. Everyone can agree on that.
And no, Thrawn isn't even close to being as good as he was in Legends. He lost to space whales, he lost to a child, he lost to Ashoka, heck in the show he sat there explaining exactly how he was losing... and acted like somehow that made it a win.
Back then, one of the big criticisms of the prequels was the presentation of Anakin being a whiny and temperament kid/guy. Which he was, that was part of Lucas’ point. And we see that in Vader during the OT.
What they had expected to see in the prequels was an Anakin as he was presented in the Clone Wars. Basically a guy that was good and stable, but who fell in love with being a warrior and military leader. Which ironically would not explain his brashness, impulsiveness and temperamental as we saw in the OT.
With Thrawn? lol. That depends on whether you are talking about Thrawn in the books or of the TV shows. In one, he is a complex genius. In the other, he’s just another imperial commander who gets foiled time and again by a group of misfits because of his own arrogance and/or incompetence, (in Ahsoka, it’s the later).
@@eds1942 let’s be honest, rebels Thrawn is amazing
@@spiffygonzales5160 in Ahsoka I dunno but in rebels he is still amazing I think you need to reconsider
The fact that The Last Jedi did what it was trying to do doesn't make it an admirable effort given what that goal was, nor did it even manage to do it well.
None of the TLJ detractors know what the goal was. To hear it from detractors, TLJ was trying to make everyone hate Luke in order to prop up the new generation of characters. It was a tribute to Luke. The slave kids in the final scene weren't comforting themselves by playing as Rey and Finn with action figures, they were reenacting Luke's heroism on Crait. TLJ was about how inspiring Luke is.
@@coreyander286 none of the 3 people still defending TLJ acknowledge Johnson's statements
@@coreyander286if you call that inspiring then you’re surely are lost!
HK-47 saying apathy is death gets me every time.
My issue was that canon Luke's fall was from out of nowhere. Hence the break in character. We see no lead up to that breaking point or what would cause him to abandon his friends and family that initially he defied Yoda and Obi wan for at the risk of the galaxy. Therefore his redmeption held little wait because there's no show up to that point why he needed redemption in the first place.
It just pointless for him end up like that it just writers rehash Yoda all over again only make it worse. He didn’t have any problems with the Jedi in his lifetime to turn out like that if it a prequel Jedi sure but with Luke never.
Legends Luke was way better.
Legends Luke was forged in fire, facing hardships and challenges that Canon Luke never had to.
This is the best attempt at justifying the sequels I've seen. Great video! Sequels still blow 😔
Did we ever find out what the Knights of Ren are? One line in the video made me think of that, I haven't heard about them since the first sequel movie.
This skips why he fell in canon.
In canon, Luke starts fairly early on, learning the and practicing the dogma that doomed the old Jedi Order. Then around 28 aby, the truth about his father being Darth Vader comes out, and Luke does something completely out of character, which runs contrary to everything that we knew about him;
He has a bad dream about his nephew turning to the Darkside, becoming basically like Darth Vader as part of a new galactic empire, and is so much in fear about it that visits his sleeping nephew in the middle of the night, and activates his lightsaber as he seriously considered killing him, creating a self-fulfilling prophecy. And so he runs and hides, waiting for death, while the galaxy burns which is apparently too big of a situation for someone like him.
This is point-by-point complete contrast to his journey during the original trilogy to the point where it might as well been that Return of the Jedi never happened. And it bares little in the way of Lucas’ one time vision for where the character would’ve gone on to become after Return of the Jedi.
And why?
Because Rain Johnson admittedly wanted to create some controversy and put his own mark on the future of Star Wars as he had hoped to go on to be one of the franchise’s creative directors.
Lucas’ original post Return of the Jedi for Luke was that he would go on to be the most powerful Jedi in history and the closest to ever reach the full potential of the Chosen One, but when a new enemy showed up and threatened his sister, he would sacrifice his own life for her, his family and the fate of the galaxy.
Hate it or love it, Legends stayed truer to Lucas’ vision, by miles.
The problem with what Disney did to luke is not him betraying his core character traits, but it's that they fail at portraying how he redeems himself and becoming the jedi we know him to be
I like the legend version. However, the way you told the canon version of Luke as if that was the real intent of Rian Johnson, made it sound good. That's not how it was portrayed in the movie.
Luke Skywalker from Legends IS, the official story of Luke after Return of the Jedi. After all, Legends has been established since 1978, and is approved by George Lucas to be secondary Canon. Disney Star Wars and Dave Filoni Star Wars is trash.
Sequels actually follow George’s vision closer I think (Also Lucas hated Luke having a wife) and I know Filoni is his chosen heir and thus, most likely, following George’s vision. I personally prefer legends Luke if only because of his interactions with Mara (Honestly Luke and Mara and Legends Leía and Han are the most chaotic couples and I love it)
@@m310grass Neither Disney or Dave followed George's vision for Star Wars. Both Iger, and Dave did what they wanted to do with Star Wars and ignored George.
We must be low on SW content of we’re making the sequel trilogy to be good
the luke in legends is a far better character in my oppinion. the jedi order faced some realy rough patches in legends during lukes time as grandmaster both during the vong war and when jason solo fell to the dark side and become darth caides. its also the period with abaloth. but he never truly gave up. the vong war he was fighting same during the war aigenst abaloth and afther jason fell to the dark side even though he in some ways gave up for a short period but he never let the fact of jason turning put him into a 6 year long exile where he was feeling sory for himsel on some planet. it did take a little while afther mara was killed before he was back in action aigen but that is fully understandable that needing some time to get over the brutal murder on your wife but he returned afther a few weeks or something like that. and during the abalaoth series he dident abandon the galaxy or the order when he was exiled from curossont and forced to step down temporarly from the roll of grandmaster, he went on a journy to find out why jason fell to the dark side and when doing that he was able to uncover the mystery of what was happening to the young jedi that was going mad and was even able to kill or atleast temporary defeat the force entety known by the name abaloth who was getting close wrecking everything.
cannon luke seems far worse of a character in comparison to legends
I may be more of a Prequel fan, but Luke will always be a hero to me, I prefer Legends Luke, but there are bits from Canon I do like, such as his big rescue in the Mandalorian season 2 finale, in that moment he was just like his father, Obi-Wan, Ahsoka, and so many other great Jedi from the Clone Wars, he was badass with how he crushed the Dark Troopers, he was compassionate with how he talked to Din and Grogu about Grogu's future, and he was wise. That's such a great moment for Luke, as many reactors showed it even brought many people to tears of joy. While I wasn't one of the ones who did cry Ii was still overwhelmed by joy.
The Clone Wars may have led to the end of the Jedi Order at the time, but ironically enough, I'd argue that during the Clone Wars with how much good Jedi did and how many others fell to the Dark Side that the Jedi Order was simaltiaously at it's best and worst during this time. But much like Luke in Legends I never lost my faith in the Jedi during this time, which is why I say this era of Jedi despite their failures is still a good era.
Respect I could never accept the losing faith archetype of character that wasn’t earn if it Dooku and Anakin sure but with Luke never. Mandalorian season 2 got Luke right fan was exciting and crying in joy when appear he was truly the return of the Jedi that we needed at the time. Plus if you asked if I would join Jedi or Sith I would join the Jedi despite there flaws I would never lose faith in ideals they strive for no order is perfect I’m so done with Jedi haters and the dark side is bullshit.
@@jaieregilmore971 Agreed.
I could've rolled with Luke becoming a figure like Yoda or Obi-Wan if his setup for reaching it had been any good. Just felt far too forced with the story they gave us. Like Kylo destroying the Jedi Order and Luke going into exile cause it was his fault, ok that works but the reason why it was his fault just awful.
Kylo had a bad dream about falling to the dark side, and Luke (depending on if you believe Kylo or Luke, and I honestly believe Kylo since Luke had lied about it before) almost or even tried to kill him. That just isn't what Luke would do. Also Luke just sitting around as an exact replica of his old enemies conquer the galaxy and kill billions.
As such, Legends then, Legends now, Legends forever. I don't even bother with new content anymore cause I am simply uninterested.
While I find your analysis of Luke's arc in TLJ Somewhat compelling, perhaps even redeeming some quality to it, I still believe the ultimate execution to be mediocre at best and malicious at worst since it originates from false pretenses of who Luke is and was as a character. Add to that the overall disjointed and illogical ways that canon has handled the post Endor era and I don't think Luke's ST story really has many redeeming qualities when you analyze it in full.
I see what youre saying, but i feel youre ignoring, whether purposefully for the sake of discussion or mistakenly, that in order to reach the luke we see in canon, he has to go against his entire character up to that point. Like, post disillusionment sure he might want to kill ben or abandon his friends and family, but how hes written is that Luke attempted to do all that before he became disillusioned which completely goes against his character up to that point.
To be fair though, if Luke's poorly positioned characterisation was the only problem with the sequel trilogy, then thered be a lot less hate. Yes, still hate, but much more restrained/muted. His poor characterisation is also surrounded by Han reverting his character and turning coward as well, the droids being actively useless where theyve always previously mattered somehow, poor villain writing, and so much fanservice/nonsense its ridiculous, and reys story and twist is so much hot garbage that i gave up on modern star wars. Ove been tempted a few times to get back into it but ive been burned each time.
Still love legends though, not giving that up
Luke's story aside, let's not pretend that Disney Canon doesn't HEAVILY "borrow" from Legends without crediting it
If I was a student under Luke in the Expanded Universe, I’d have a ride of a lifetime!😊
I would have begrudgingly accepted the new interpretation of Luke had there been any narrative tissue between RotJ Luke and Luke when he was about to strike down his own nephew.
Unfortunately, Rian fully embraced the "Step 4: Profit" meme and forewent any actual explanation.
They were so close to getting that scene right too. Instead of the slow deliberate drawing of his lightsaber, it needed to be a snap reaction. Like he felt the overwhelming need to defend himself in that moment. The idea of Luke accidentally creating Kylo Ren is a cool one, but the story surrounding it sucks.
I hear what your saying about Legends and Canon Luke. And i might've become a bit less toxic towards the Canon one. But at heart I still prefer the Legends Luke. And part of me still wishes that we got a TV series or movie series about Legends Star Wars.
Yeah I disagree completely and passionately with the notion that sequels Luke is at all as respectable as OG Luke. Trying to kill a child because he's having dark thouthts? That definitely sounds like the guy who chose death over killing his father because he knew Anakon had light in him still /s. Bad take.
I wish Disney would just bring back the EU. Why do they hate money?
There's having a flaw, then there is trying to murder your sleeping nephew over something he hasn't even done yet and might not even do. Utterly abandoning any and all responsibility for said murder attempt, not even trying to redeem or stop said nephew's reactionary rampage to the point of going away not out of a need like Kenobi and Yoda did because they were hunted by the entire galaxy, not with any plan to make things right, abandoning the galaxy, his nephew, his sister, his best friends all just because he was 'sad'. THAT'S the betrayal of character that flies in the face of literally every single facet of Luke Skywalker.
It was objectively a poor writing decision that was done solely to reset the stage so that TFA could retell ANH and then for Johnson in TLJ to make a 'Viking Funeral' self contained film...in the middle of a trilogy. Regardless of subjective interpretation, it is objective fact that the Sequels were not coordinated, planned out well and utterly lacked cohesion. Luke Skywalker or should I say "Jake" Skywalker's character was just one casualty of a rushed and incoherent product.
Even with the inconsistencies of Legends, its Luke is far and away the better character, with flaws, growth and a legacy to be proud of rather than a pathetic idiot who just repeated the exact same mistakes of the past over and over again and needed a new super character with zero flaws to show him the way and do everything he should have done, just better.
I feel like so many other people here in the comments, I don’t like sequels Luke because his core character trait of thinking he can and should try to redeem anyone just because he is compassionate is just gone. Instead of counseling and showing love to his NEPHEW, he instead decides it’s better to kill him in his sleep? Even if he decided against it last minute, OG Luke would have never stooped to that level. Especially with a member of his family.
Expanded Universe Luke is the best, what the sequel trilogy did was character assasination.
It will always be canon that Luke Skywalker rebuilt the Jedi and improved it, not remain complacent in a system he knew was terrible
Luke was only done right in Legends/EU. What Disney did most recently with the Sequel series mainly just screwed this character up.. an same can be said for well over 90% of the rest of the SW franchise under Disney as well.
I still prefer EU Luke. Disney Luke is disappointing. I still prefer EU Jedi order too, it's a more natural progression of Jedi based on lessons Luke learned, rather than just following the failings of Yoda's order.
I mean let's not even talk about the fact that the man was emperor for fell to the dark side and then came back because of his sister, ya know LEIA. One of the original strong women who got forgotten about thanks to "Darth Disney" Along with Mara Jade and countless others in the books and comics (that were cannon per Lucas)
I have written a long comment, please lend me your thoughts if you wish.
Although it is your right to, of course, prefer the New Canon version of Luke, if that is what you want, I beg to differ.
And I have to disagree about a couple of your points regarding the comparison with Ulic Qel-Droma and about Luke's redemption in TLJ.
Regarding Ulic, first let's reiterate the point you made, that Disney is borrowing heavily from the old EU, The Tales of the Jedi here in particular. In fact they have been doing it a lot in their recent creations, and quite unashamedly so, without even crediting it. You can imagine how the conversations went when they made the EU non-canon: Let's get rid of this canon, so that we have creative freedom and don't have to restrict ourselves to the stories others made before us, all the while being able to recycle and reuse these stories whenever and wherever we want but taken out of their context, as we have the copyright. Quite cynical I should say, and as many say, showcasing that Star Wars is creatively bankrupt.
Regarding Ulic himself, although I liked the character and rooted for him when I read the comic many years ago, he does not weigh so heavily into the consciousness of Star Wars fandom as Luke freaking Skywalker. Ulic is a character known only to a minority who have read this extended material, and he is not synonymous to the essence of what made Star Wars famous in the first place, a young humble person, thrust by circumstance and fate into becoming the greatest hero. Luke is the core and the heart of Star Wars, it is his journey that is the main arc of the three original movies, he is the most important character in the whole franchise.
The reason why TLJ is hated so much by so many fans is because it took the most important character in the whole of Star Wars and treated him like a useless old fart who has outlived his usefulness and that they needed to get rid of somehow, in order to put some fresh faces on screen that would attract the younger audiences.
If Ulic's story is interesting as a character arc of fall and redemption (and it is, I remember it making me quite sad), it is good enough for someone like...well, Ulic, an ancillary character. It is a sad and tragic story. Ulic was a hero before he became a villain and then spent the later years of his life in seclusion, remorseful of his deeds. He unwillingly agreed to train Vima, and this ends up giving him some closure, only to be killed be killed nonsensically by a totally unworthy person, the idiotic shuttle pilot that took Vima to the planet, dying in her arms, finally in peace with himself and becoming one with the Force.
It is a good story but not good enough for Luke who is the character around whom the whole franchise revolved. One needs to find a better story for him, give him more to do, give him more things to shine with, even if he eventually has to pass the torch to someone else.
And this takes me nicely to my other point. Your presentation here is disingenuous about what actually happened in TLJ. I watched it in the cinema and watched it again afterwards on my own, in order to try to understand if I may have been too harsh with it. The supposed "redemption" of Luke at the end, where he shows up as a projection, makes no sense. He supposedly delays the First Order so that the remnants of the resistance can escape. But if you pay attention, all the while he is confronting Kylo Ren, the Resistance are mostly just staring and they only mobilise to leave towards the end. There is no real escape route 'from the back' as it is collapsed. They are only saved by Rey conveniently showing up and levitating a bunch of rocks. Ultimately, Luke's sacrifice achieves almost nothing, barely gains the Resistance a few minutes, still leaves them trapped in the base and it all hinges on Rey showing up and really saving them. Unless one wants to claim that Luke knew that Rey would show up at the right moment (after the throne room sequence and Snoke's death, mind you) and only delayed them to give her time to do that. How does he know? Did he read the script?
Luke doesn't even get heroically killed, fighting to the death or something. He just dies, due to exerting too much effort, drawing on too much of the Force or something.
He would have done more good if his projection lifted the rocks in the back entrance. His attempt to help or save the Resistance amounts to almost nothing at all, it is more of a curiosity than any actual help. How is he 'redeemed' by that? Because he (sort of) showed up at the end?
As a youtuber said, imagine two First Order soldiers discussing about it afterwards: "Hey John, can you explain to me what happened down there, because I hear all sorts of odd things? Yeah, Jack, to be honest, I don't really understand it myself. This guy showed up from inside the base and we shot him but he just wouldn't die. And then Kylo went down and they fought and then this dude just vanished. Very strange, I don't know what to make of it"
And it makes no sense for the kids in the casino world to be re-enacting his "last stand" in their play. Re-enact what? His heroic vanishing act? And how did they find out about it? Did the remnants of the Resistance go around telling people about Luke's heroic disappearance?
I can imagine what Rian and the movie makers and the Disney people were thinking of getting into it. "We have to find a way to get rid of Luke, we don't want this old fart getting in the way of introducing our endless score of new characters". "I know, let's reuse the Qel-Droma story arc!". And they used it, and they thought that it would also give the old fans a little nod - "Yes, we turned the main hero of the whole franchise into a grumpy and useless old man but see? We gave him a redemption and a meaningful death. Now take this tissue and dry your fanboy tears." Only, that the death is meaningless, like Ulic's, and therefore tragic, and the supposed redemption is "too little- too late". The old fans were given their consolation prize, only to realise that it was made out of sh.t.
I have no rancor (pun intended) towards Rian Johnson specifically, I generally like him as a director. I am not a right wing culture warrior. I do not dislike diversity. But I have given up on Star Wars since TLJ, I didn't go to the cinema to watch TRoS, or Solo. I watched nothing Star Wars for years after it. I have gone back to watch some of the series and have even found Andor to be a reasonably well-made one, but I have stopped caring too much. I get drawn back once in a while, like today, writing long comments with my thoughts, which no one will read, but much like Luke's useless death, it makes no difference. Star Wars is bankrupt.
I can at least still enjoy the things in it that I like, the original trilogy, the prequels (to a degree), and some parts of the EU like the Tales of the Jedi and Knights of the Old Republic comics, the Knights of the Old Republic video games, some of the novels.
Those were some pretty broad strokes.... I disagree. No ranting....I just disagree. Enjoy your apathetic hero.
Evil cannot create, only destroy. Disney wars fanfiction is destruction incarnate to the star wars name.
I was a teen in the 90s and read a huge chunk of "legends" there are things about it I think they should have translated over without question. My TWO favorite characters are completely erased, and replaced with a whiny emo boy. Though knowing full well that I can't change it, I have come to accept the story now told.
I believe “legends” is canon and not what we got. I do not except the newer story because it’s inferior to the former.
While the video brings up a good point about the Ulic and Jaded Idealist concepts, it misses one thing. The Sequels had to force Luke into it. The young man who refused both his masters orders (Kenobi and Yoda) to see Vader as just a monster, despite knowing they were essentially the only way he could become a "real Jedi," because he wanted to see Vader/Anakin as having a chance at redemption attempted to kill his own nephew with no preamble.
You can't square that circle. Not without a Sith tonne of extra stuff that the films left out.
I probably am biased because I grew up reading legends books but I think I prefer that character arc more for two reasons.
1. I like him being a role model and moral compass. He a good man while also still being very much a human being.
2. I think that while legends had its problems, Luke's story and his character arc left much more room for Star Wars as a story in my opinion.
This is probably also a disagreements from me about how Disney handled the timeline of the series as a whole
I lost a lot of respect for your channel. It's not that people don't understand the concept of an idealist getting jaded or a person getting older or a hero returning to the normal world. It has to do with 1. what would make for a more satisfying story, 2. the way it was depicted and handled, 3. the reasons the people making the movie chose to do it that way.
The example I always use is that you could have had Luke or Vader killed by a stray blaster bolt on Hoth. Would that be realistic? Sure. Would that "subvert expectations?" Yes. Would it make a better story? Absolutely not. It would be deeply unsatisfying, just like what they did with Luke later.
Luke legends the true luke 👊🏽👊🏽🤟🏽🤟🏽🤟🏽🤟🏽🤟🏽
Well, pretending people said the Last jedi ruined the character of Luke only because they didn't want to see that specific evolution for the character is just neglecting the whole "Luke tried to kill his innocent nephew because of some hunch" plotline. That's where the sequel trilogy completely lost people regarding Luke.
Who even wrote that ? Luke decided to save his father, which was literally cyborg Hitler for the rest of the galaxy, and succeded.
Vader had a lot of blood on his hands, yet Luke brought him back and proved everyone wrong.
Plus Luke knew since The Empire strikes back that future was never set in stone... he wouldn't ignite his lightsaber behind his sleeping nephew because he felt a possible outcome in a distant future. Makes no sense. Never will.
The problem of canon Luke is not the low point he has reached at the end of his journey but the sloppy reason why he fell in the first place. 😒
"it would be way to easy to use the 40 years of star wars stories to just literally print money, nobody will remember any of us for that. and obviously we here at Disney are super amazing icons that DESERVE to be remembered. so instead, lets throw all that shit out and make up all new stories! stories so bad they manage to kill an almost universally beloved franchise known the world over in only a few short years! we will leave it in complete ruins, an so everyone will remember our names! MUHAHAHAHA!" -Kathleen Kennedy, probably.
I disagree with your take. While canon may be similar to Lucas's original plan, canon didn't really REDEEM him in the way the Hero's Journey meant for the hero to end their story. His redemption is to the Republic, not his ideals. His goal in the original trilogy, his journey, was not to save a republic, or defeat the empire, it was to defeat evil, bring balance to the force, and restore the light. Canon had no unified plot, and you can't square that circle. He stops moping and being apathetic not because of anyone of importance to him and his journey, but some random new kid he hangs out with for a few days at most. The Hero's Journey is more appropriately completed in legends by his refusal to return to the galaxy at large instead of truly leaving the "underworld" of the dark side, and eventually taking the lessons of his sojourn into the dark to come back to teach the light to a new generation. In Canon, he apparently rushes that sojourn and blindly charges into teaching the light without facing failure, unlike legends, and he in fact gave into fear unlike his legends counterpart. You can make the argument, but it's not a good one from my reckoning, or at least not a strong one. He's not the hero by then, and never completed the journey. He skipped over into a disillusioned supporting character to a new hero, and that's disappointing, not inspiring. The heroes aren't meant to be something real, but an inspirational story, and that's what we are robbed of
You forgot to mention the part about Canon where the guy who risked the fate of the galaxy and the jedi on saving his father tries to murder his nephew because he thought he would become evil. That's where Canon lost me. The truth is, Luke Skywalker is serious and sober hero. Scenes like the one when yoda bonks him even though he's old is a superficial attempt at comedy that often try to cover the fact that they cannot make anything of quality. Subverting old heroes, creating their own. I think the reason Canon is so hated is because they don't respect content and the few things they do add is often a shadow of their former self. Apathy? I can relate. SW is neither the fan powered franchise I grew up with nor the mind blowing trend from back then. Perhaps an outdated idea, but I think I'll stick to legends good guy version until they prove they can make content for more than just 4 years old.
I am most grateful to have found your site where I can receive true Star Wars Lord and let the pain of the Disney abomination drift out of my mind thank you so much!
Luke belongs in legends, Johnson and Disney set out to destroy Luke skywalker since in Disney you can not have a strong male character instead they want a Mary sue who is perfect, makes no mistakes, learns nothing because she knows every thing including the use of mind trick with no training and has no growth. Disney and especially Johnson have destroyed Star Wars.
I can forgive Disney wanting to tell their own story. I can forgive them creating bland narratives that are carbon-copies of older (better) stories.
What I cannot forgive is the sheer character assassination of Luke Skywalker.
Disney trilogy does not exist for me. Rey, Fin, Kilo are fun concepts and could be a good story, but I feel they tried to destroy all the significance of the originals and took a terrible execution. Money over fandom
Legends Luke is my canon
I prefer Luke Skywalker from the EU. Luke in the EU makes a lot more sense to who he is as a hero. I know in Disney Canon he was made to be an apathetic man who gave up on the galaxy and the Jedi. But that destroyed who he is and what he's meant to be. Even if idealistic people lose who they are when they get older. But Luke is different from them. Even Mark Hamill said that Luke is meant to be a symbol for hope, a perfect hero or not, Luke is and always will be a savior, redeemer, and twice a chosen one than his father was once he succeeded in reaching his potential.
F*ck Disney canon. Absolute trash. I want my Sword of the Jedi trilogy
much prefer legends luke to disney luke. that being said, disney gave luke something that legends never did. and ending.
Im a fan of the expanded universe it was done right. I spit on Disney vandalism to the lore. I've lost all interest in Star wars because of the trash they shoved out won't even bother with it again till some one else holds the I.P.
What disney did to Luke is straight up criminal! The legnds Luke will always be the true luke to me. Nothing and no one will ever change that.
wait a second the movie title last jedi makes no sense because of all the order 66 survivors disney created so really the movie title is the last cough* 114 jedi
Those are not the same
Master Yoda and Master Kenobi went into exile to survive long enough to pass on the teachings of the Jedi
Luke went into exile to stew in his misery and die
I still love EU Luke over Cannon Luke I think he is more about to come back then being old and disillusioned
>disney's lame fanfic
>canon
You gotta pick one. Any sane person can see that the rat co. did nothing but write a shitty fanfic version that they are desperately trying to retcon into being "canon"
legends has ther better stories and to be honest is more cannon than whatever disney is putting out. that shit is just ugh terrible.
I think why many people prefer Legends Luke (besides the obvious) is because he has more of a story and gets a better ending. It truly is a waste how this will be the very last time we'll the main trio on screen in theaters after a more than 30 years absence.
I hate Jake Skywalker so much.
Others like him and that’s ok
@@PteranoLiv
...on opposite day.
@@wompastompa3692 watch the video and then tell me
@@PteranoLiv
Original comment was made after the video btw.
@@wompastompa3692 well then why do you tell me nobody likes canon Luke?
I prefer Legends and Originals Luke
For me what really kills Luke in canon is the point of him as a character is that he’s “The New Hope” that’s meant to transcend the dogma of HIS Master’s Jedi Order so having him be yet another Jedi that fell to the dogma in the EXACT SAME WAY and Rey get to live on and be the one who creates a order makes him feel like a failed experiment?
Try as you might mate, those sequels are still dogshit.
Still not as impressive when comparing the multiple iterations of Batman over the years, especially the contrasts between the DCAU and Arkhamverse variants.
Regardless, Multiverse Theory ALWAYS renders that even a great being in one world will be a damned one in another. *If every porkchop were perfect...*
Still interesting that he managed to melt Mara Jade's heart given she's the original definition of a tsundere.
@@merafirewing6591 Granted, there are already retro anime tsunderes before Mara Jade was a thing, and WAY BEFORE Star Wars was a thing.
@@michaelandreipalon359 yeah, but it is pretty surprising that such a person can exist in Star Wars. I prefer the legends Luke over the Canon one because that one is depressing.
Multiverse isn't needed
@@Hello-bi1pm True, it's gotten a bit common, but really, it's still something we necessarily need, like bread in our culinary lives.
And face it, it does render a lot of awesome storytelling possibilities and done right, plus continuity fanservice for longtime veterans of certain franchises and media.
I really appreciate how Legends handled Luke's death: He passed away sometime before the Legacy era. I dont think anyone wouldve liked to see him die, and the way he wouldve been shown dying would only have divided people.
I'm pretty sure they were banned from killing the trio from high up. So even if they wanted to they couldn't do it.
22:45 literally why I constantly say. The Last Jedi is flawed for sure. But Rise of Skywalker is what made the sequels so uncomfortably bad.
To clarify. The reason I dislike it so much is for the fact that episode 9 is literally just a critic response copout. The fan base clearly swayed the way Disney was originally planning to take the story. I feel like they had a much better story than what we actually got. If they just stuck to their original idea for 9 (which they’ll never reveal but I’m sure they did before choosing Palpatine) it was just such a negative initial response before people could calm down about it
Expanded Universe Luke Skywalker is number one they did him justice even as grandmaster of the new Jedi he face some failures he never give up while the Disney screw his character over I would argue it was Yoda brought him back they really wasn’t a reason to kill him off like that. Also the Ulic and Disney canon Luke arc seems more fit for Anakin if he survives Return of the Jedi.
Can we just not include the Disney version of Star Wars as cannon as the fanbase??