I agree that idols should'nt have to go live on their bday. Thats their personal time that they can celebrate with friends and family irl. Performing on their bday is part of their job schedule, but going live is an extra luxury that we aren't entitled to.
Strongly agree. And goodness knows the foreign idols probably want to just talk to their friends and family on that day but people expect the emotional labor of them chatting with you for about an hour.
my opinion regarding ballads is that you really need good vocalists for good ballads. faster songs with more production can cover up flat vocals with no support or emotion put into them, but there’s not really anywhere to hide in a ballad. autotune can’t add depth to someone’s voice. that’s why you see people praising sm ballads, they’re one of the few companies who knows how to train vocals
I agree for the most part. A ballad will be better with strong vocalists: but honesty there are still ballads from vocally weak groups that I still ADORE like Please Please (everglow) and mirror by Itzy, some of my favorite Korean songs of all.
The main thing a ballad needs is good structure but too many are bland and sometimes people just like faster paced songs so even a good vocalist with a ballad is boring 😅
Every time I think about good ballads in kpop I say: "An Encore" By SHINee. In my opinion, one the best examples of how to execute a ballad without making it sound boring.
As a long time Frank Ocean and Kendrick Lamar fan, kpop fans are definitely spoiled. Two comebacks a year, multiple interviews, concerts and lives. YALL dont understand the struggle out here for fans of hiphop.
I'm thinking of Rihanna, granted she released a lot of albums pretty consistently for many years but she hasn't released an album in 7 years. Adele is another artist who is in no rush to make and release new music.
@@audreyparmenter2000 blackpink is the only group who has a "correct" release pattern, the problem is the content but other than that, they have the classical pattern
I don’t like many k-pop ballads because a lot of idols aren’t made for ballads. But groups that are great at it, they don’t sound boring (like the groups you mentioned)
Thank you for mentioning BTOB. Eventhough they called ballad group their ballad is not typical ballad. Each of their song have rap parts that suit the song.
People should be allowed time off during their birthday regardless of their job. Let people take a break, it ain't that serious. And if covid has taught us anything, we should NOT be going to work while we're sick, no matter what it is. Mental health is more excepting in society now. It's still quite late but it is progress.
It's easy for me to say that I won't feel sad if photocards of me weren't being sold as much as fellow members BECAUSE I am not an idol. HOWEVER, if I were an idol, it would mean that I probably would care what fans feel. I would probably be insecure and jealous deep inside no matter how I try to convince myself that it's not a problem. It won't be the BIGGEST DEAL but it would still affect me if I was the lowest price.
Exactly. The money might not be going to you but there's a smaller demand for your items, you don't see as many support banners in the crowd, people don't scream as loud for you when it's your part in the song, you don't get as many opportunities regardless of your passion 😔 like it all trickles down to making your job a little more sucky the longer it goes on
I think rather than high or low standards, I'd argue that many of the more vocal K-pop fans online have no standards at all. At least, not on the things they are judging about. Meaning, if it is someone that they like or support, they will give the idol a pass no matter how good or bad their performance was. Meanwhile, if it is someone they dislike, they will search for and jump on any opportunity to bash the idol no matter how understandable or representative the slip-up was. At the same time, it's unrelated other factors that have more to do with themselves or their relationship with the idol. For example, it's revealed that an idol has secretly been dating someone or engages in an activity that the fan personally disapproves of even though it is not illegal and the idol is a full grown adult. Suddenly, everything the idol does is all bad and they're horrible performers who are untalented, etc etc etc.
for the part of fans being too entitled: i just wish for more music from kun (wayv) he does have a SoundCloud and i just hope he gets more opportunities in the future. His recent NCT LAB wasn't even released on streaming sites but ONLY SoundCloud where not many people are willing to go
If I were an idol, I would feel sad during my rookie days if my PCs were priced lower, but I would eventually get over it. RM has writing credits on every BTS song, he is making a lot of money and producing art. I don't think he even thinks about the price of his PCs at all.
okay on the subject of fans being too entitled- i think a huge part of this is the parasocial relationship people have with idols. to put it bluntly, i think people think their idols love them more than they actually do ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ like… okay, to us, idols are a break from our work and school life. and because of that, we want to see them more often- they foster positive feelings. but people forget, entertaining us is an idol’s job. sometimes, they’re gonna want a break from entertaining fans. they’re not locked in a room clawing at the walls and sobbing because they miss their fans so much, they may just want a break. to us, it can feel like a one on one relationship because we are forming that connection with one single idol. but the idols are forming a connection with a faceless mass of hundreds of thousands of people. it can be exhausting. i know that’s super blunt, and i do think idols do genuinely have a positive opinion of their fans, and like interacting with them. but at the end of the day it is their job.
I’m gonna offer another perspective about the ballad thing: the Korean perspective. Ballad music is a whole separate genre of music that Koreans LOVE. Like they eat ballads up. So adding a “filler” ballad really is such a Western perspective because it caters to their domestic audience. HOWEVER I do believe it’s a separate genre for a reason and the attraction to kpop for a lot of people is now for slow tempo songs. Imo one of the best kpop ballads is Truth Untold by BTS because it still adds that pop element into it. That’s the kind of ballads that should be incorporated if they’re going to keep doing it.
Its also a thing in some sports, as soon as one group dominates everybody thinks about what will happen when they don't play and who then could get the chance to win ir the game is to predictable or boring etc, just like with exo and bts, they started winning years in a row and people asked for others to have a chance if they take a break. Thats not how competition works
I personally agree with the first opinion. I feel like the music industry is using ballads as stereotypical closers for albums and sometimes in some albums. They read as outliers, but I am also not a fan of this genre, so I am biased. I think the only thing I would enjoy a ballad is if the structures go somewhere subverting the expectations of what a stereotypical ballad should sound like and in terms of song structure. I also think artists who can elevate ballads are ones who have a pleasant vocal tone with great vocal technique. Tracks like Maze In The Mirror(TXT), Sunset(Nayeon), When This Rain Stops(Wendy), Joah(Purple Kiss), Only(Lee Hi), One Of These Nights(Red Velvet) and Let Me In(EXO) are something that I want in a ballad. I like it when ballads take influences from jazz and rnb genres along with great vocal runs and deliveries to elevate the arrangements of a ballad.
I thought ballads were ok. When I first heard K-pop, I (like I assumed most people) wanted to see the ones where they would dance to upbeat songs, but ballads were ok. I liked it when an artist played piano or guitar versions to add to the ballads. I thought it was expected to help when they were touring, so the groups didn’t have to dance the whole time and had a break. I know not everyone watches behind the scenes of artists' concerts and tours, but people do get exhausted. Not just in K-pop but in all genres, artists in America aren’t dancing their whole tour, so they have songs where they sit in a chair.
4:43 TXT promotes a lot of ballads ig (?)like skipping stones in this album… farewell neverland in prev one , etc…. maybe they do not promote much but moas love the ballads from their albums but yes they are very few in an albums….
yeah I agree and TXT does that with almost any genre of music. They have a few r&b songs, quite a few rock ones, srr is heavely disco, they sing ballads too and literally almost every genre lol. In their case I think they are versatile artist that don't limit themselves and they definitely care about every track on the albums. Their bsides>>
@@bamgyuuu304 yup as a moa I agree 1000% they literally have variety in all the albums… even if u r not a fan you will at least like one or 2 songs per album that’s a fact
It's not uncommon now that groups will pre-record a heap content before enlistment. They can't earn money outside of the military while they are enlisted, but pre-recorded stuff is fine as they it was made before they were in the military. It's also why members are still being announced as Ambassadors for brands as Tae was announced as an Ambassador for a coffee company a few days ago as the contracts were signed before they enlisted. BTS have said that there is a whole heap of pre-recorded stuff and co-incidentially, Jimin's digital single releases today.
The NCT opinion is so weird. It's so weird for SM to remove both of them from the NCT line-up when they easily could've been in both groups. Also, I think Shotaro has been in 7 or 8 NCT songs, and Sungchan was in 6 or 7 songs. Will this make their squedule more complicated... yes. But it's just weird for SM to pull this when Mark is in like 4 groups, which is why it was so weird for them to technically remove Winwin from 127 (Even though, they didn't officially remove him) Shotaro only trained for 6 months before debuting in NCT and he was literally a huge fan of NCT. Sungchan trained for 4 years. I will say though, SM has pulled the "Keep them in the background until their ready" multiple times. For example, Ten debuted in NCT back in 2016 and didn't get into an official unit until 2019. If y'all remember Hanbin from SM Rookies, he was supposed to debut in NCT 127, but SM kept him in the chambers, Johnny and Doyoung debuted in NCT 127 but they kept Hanbin in the dark. Which Hanbin left SM apparently because he thought he would never debut. Of course he debuted in a group called Newkidd, but that group has been going through crap these past few years. Shotaro has been in: Make a Wish, Make a Wish (English Version), All About You, I.O.U, Let's Play Ball, Birthday Party, Vroom, and Beautiful. Sungchan was in: Light Bulb, Misfit, All About You, 90s Love, Know Now, Round & Round, Beautiful, and was also on the song "Jet" from the SMCU album. In all honesty, I think SM used Shotaro and Sungchan as a promotional tactic for Riize. Because of course, many NCT fans were waiting for them to get a fixed unit.
Shotaro was in Korea 2 months before he debuted. He was NOT a huge fan of NCT, I'll never know where this rumor started. He just happened to get a chance to go to their concert and this was after SM reached out to him on IG to audition. And them being a promotional tactic for RIIZE is quite silly cause it would have made more sense to just debut both RIIZE and NCTJapan in NCT or to even split SungTaro up so NCT Japan would have more attention if it was really a marketing tactic cause what exactly is their marketing tactic for the new NCT unit? They are getting a pretty good reception but it would have been even bigger with Shotaro in it and help mentoring them through NCT Lastart and WonBin Anton made a big enough splash that SungTaro weren't really that needed to market RIIZE, especially with people anticipating a new boy group like they were. 😂
I love ballad, i admit there are generic ballad but also good one! I wish kpop group could do ballad song like kdrama Ost! Kdrama ost ballad are the best and aren't generic
32:34 yes I’d suggest sakshama srivastav’s interviews… she has good ques & idols also answer them & put their points… even the idols were impressed by her questions…(like joshua , rm , keeho ,etc)
Ballads is not for everyone especially for young stans and people in their early to mid 20's. As you grow old you will realize and appreciate ballads more when the REAL ADULTING LIFE is kicking you left and right nonstop. 😂😂😂
I think the birthday live thing could have a simple compromise. It doesn't have to be one the specific day, it can just be on the day that they are in the company and have more free time that's near enough their actual birthday. Eric from The Boyz recently dropped a Soundcloud mixtape on his birthday as a gift to fans and I would consider things like that more special than a livestream imo. I don't think idols should just not work on their birthdays bc like that isn't realistic, people do work on their birthdays unless they try to get a day off or something but they don't need to do a livestream either imo.
For me the best group with ballads is BTOB. Their ballads song is not typical ballad. They have 3 rap part which suit the songs. But i would like to remind that BTOB was started as dance group until year 2015 they decided to change their genre. Yet they still have fast songs with choreo in every album. Their most famous ballad song is Missing You which one of the longest song charted on Melon.
28:00 I think Hybe will be releasing new bts music while bts are in the military because from what I’ve been seeing, while there was bts members in the military, the rest of the members were still making in music that has yet to be released. I mean Hybe is releasing jimins song “closer than this” tomorrow. And namjoon has posted a lot of pics of him at the studio with his friends so his solo music will probably be released while he’s in the military. Hybe knows that bts is still there biggest money maker because they keep releasing bts merch/vinyls/coins/music/documentaries while there are members in the military, they keep releasing things for armys because after all, armys are still the biggest fanbase. I don’t think bts’s fame will go down because armys are still very much here & active on Twitter, nowadays armys are getting bts’s old Music to top charts by organizing streaming parties. Also I’m seeing more people join the fandom. These two years of bts’s absence will allow more groups to grow/gain more attention but once bts comes back, a lot of eyes will be on them due to the promises they’ve made. Armys are already looking forward to tours, a new album, group content like run bts episodes, etc.
And we have their brand new disney+ documentary with 2 episodes released so far !! And we have Hope on the Street documentary in 2024. RM new music yess. Tae seemed to have some surprises for us too. Jimin just released close than this. Jin coming back in 6 months and J-Hope in 10. And they come on weverse occasionally. We have so much 💜💜💜
There are some great ballads but Idk if you like them, for example: sour grapes, anti romantic, fairy of shampoo (but I don’t really like txts version of it I prefer “dosii”)SVT minghao 海城 and welcome to my world but at the end of the day everyone has different taste of music even if it’s within the kpop genre.
i actually really like anti romantic! a recent ballad i can remember loving is be with you by ateez, and an all time favourite is in heaven by jyj, i just find it takes more time for me to warm up to ballads usually but you’re right there are some really great ones!
Regarding on Sungtaro, I feel like we all have diff opinions on them being in RIIZE. But as an active Briize who watch ALL of their contents.. in MAMA and MMA.. Sungtaro have their own solo parts and showcase their dancing skills and I noticed that Sungtaro improved their vocals when they are in RIIZE. We should be grateful and happy that Sungtaro have their own fixed group. Also, they are only 3-4months old rookie group.
as a shotaro bias, i honestly think he’s the most promoted member after wonbin. like for both siren and get a guitar, he got his own special dance break. i’m all for more shotaro, but tbh i think he’s doing just fine. especially compared to sungchan, who i couldn’t recognize to save my life 😭😭
The problem isn’t the ballad genre imo, it's that kpop producers love retro concepts, but rarely look to the modern west for inspiration (eg of some great modern ballads: Stephen Sanchez’s When I Found You, Halle’s Angel and Lewis Capaldi’s Someone You Loved). Almost no one in kpop produces ballads that sound like they came from after the early 2000s, their ballad style is stuck too far in the past. And I so agree that kpop stans have the lowest and highest standards, they even hold different standards for different members in the same group. Also, I legit just finished watching the new Hunger Games, kinda eerie, do I also need that hoodie and some glasses lol. Since no one asked, I really like the upside down design
As an economics postgraduate, the concept of economics (supply and demand) is applicable in real-life situations and practical decision-making. Hence, you are still applying the economic concept of supply and demand to your hobby/side hustle.
ballads are fine as bsides, but if the album flows well into it. like if the title is more noisy and then goes to a soft ballad, have the bsides go like a gradient from hard to soft (holy shit ew i hated writing that). ofc for the brokies (me) who dont have premium on music apps we have to do shuffle but listening in a yt playlist it'll flow nice.
On the whole Shotaro and Sungchan issue I have to disagree cause his dancing really shines in Riize. Like everyone notices him. The only Music video would say didn't highlight him in is get a guitar ( which mostly highlited wonbin but in the performance he literally had a dance break). If you want to talk about screen time, Anton usually gets the least but ever since talk saxy I feel every member has been getting a fair amount of screen time and. Taro, Wonbin and Seunghan always get the dance breaks with shotaro in the center soooo ... Yeah I think you just want to see more of him cause he's your bias but speaking honestly everyone in riize has their moments to shine
when u started talking about the variety show members i automatically thought of jackson. he expressed his frustration about jyp pushing his appearances in shows and how he doesn't wanna be only known by the funny member of got7. Nowadays hes an amazing artist with amazing songs and im so proud of him
I think that with ballads, SM producers are awesome, but nugu groups... It's like they have a typical slow song where they blink or smile looking at the camera and that's all
Good Enough by Xdinary Heroes alone makes the ballad opinion invalid /j 😂 No but there are so many beautiful ballads. They don't have to be boring. Just find the right ones👌
I do think ballads to a certain extenct fit to albums well, but not all albums. Itzy is a prime example where the songs in recent albums are too mis matched in the first place. Bet on me and Cake on the same album? Some ballads/soft songs are kind of just filler like, I point twice signal album as a good example. But the answer to good ballads isn't good vocals, aespa failed with forever and taeyeon while having great disgography of ballads falls flat on few of them. For good albums that include ballads I recommend: Taeyeon - INVU (It's good because the songs all fall into heaven and are close to ballad, so songs like some nights and heart are never out of place) Twice - Eyes Wide Open (The progression from sultry songs in the beginning to deep and beautiful ballads is great, I listen to the latter part in the evenings a lot. Handle it, say something and Behind the mask are some of the best ballads I've heard) Dreamcatcher - Tree of language (It's all about the progression, that's why full albums are superior)
I think kpop fan’s standards are low because they expect so little nowadays of kpop groups. They are constantly trying to excuse and normalise things like lip syncing even though an idols whole job is to sing.
But let’s say BTS does a BlackPink where they don’t drop at all for a year. Then they start building up a whole lot a hype leading up till there comeback. That would be great. And im sure Hybe wouldn’t mind, they have a great line up.
Jimin released a new song today. RM has recorded multiple songs probably a 2024 release. Taehyung teased surprises Army should look forward to. They dropped 2 episodes from their brand new disney+ documentary and there will be more episodes each week. J-Hope has his Hope on the Street documentary coming. Jin is back in 6 months and will release his album. J-Hope back in 10. They’re not going for the BP approach
16:52 that's not true to the majority of black artists in the west. Tinashe, to name a few, is the blueprint of K-Pop. Don't get me started with Beyonce's Renaissance tour.
I feel like the older K-pop groups have roles divided clearly (vocal, dancer…) but now the standard of the industry is higher or more investments? So it seems idols are getting trained in every areas. And I do think allrounder and ace has difference, ace is excel in every area while allrounder is good in every area. I would say kfans can claim their idol as allrounder🤣
I do NOT like how Angelina disregards Audrey’s comments or almost feels purposely antagonistic or condescending to her. Honestly I rather just watch Audrey. She’s honest humble and kind. Angelina is letting the views get to her. She honestly doesn’t hear anyone but herself.
While I do prefer more upbeat music, the person who thinks ballads are repetitive and boring hasn’t heard any good ballads. Nothing gives you the emotion and catharsis like a good, well crafted ballad. That said, it’s very easy to make ballads boring, but the good stuff?? Nothing like it. Chef’s kiss. Plus, slower songs are definitely needed on albums. If all we had are the upbeat stuff, that would make the album way too repetitive. Gotta break the monotony, ya know?
On the BTS discussion, I don't think HYBE and BTS will release much content for the members during their enlistment period. Outside the K-pop world, BTS received a lot of criticism - particularly amongst conservatives, who are rising in public influence / perception - for perceived special treatment around military service due to the debates and talks about possibly getting exemptions. Generally speaking, Korean males are required to enlist in the military for 1.5 to 2 years; during which time they are expected to put their professional lives on hold and thus miss out on career progression opportunities in order to serve their civic duties. K-pop idols traditionally do this by generally not releasing official content or actively profiting from their idol career during this period. If BTS released official content whilst enlisted, even if recorded beforehand, it would once again be seen by the public as BTS receiving preferential treatment and unpatriotic, as they would be seen as not having to make the same sacrifices ordinary Koreans do or otherwise be in a position of privilege.
@@iyerezm I agree. I don't know how much content BTS will release during their enlistment but lets be honest no matter what BTS do people will mad or jealous. As long as they aren't breaking any laws I don't see an issue.
You basically can't do other jobs only while in millitary which requires earning but since they recorded the stuff before the millitary. I don't see the problem, many other idols have done that but looks like people don't have idea about it.
Jimin just released a new song.. and there’s more songs coming. RM recorded songs and it will be coming out in 2024. They’re not stopping anything. Jin is coming back in 6 months and will release new music. Then J-hope in 10 months. J-hope has a new documentary called ‘Hope on the street’ coming out in 2024. Bts released 2 episodes out of their brand new disney+ documentary. All of this is happening / will happen while they’re in the military. They’re not going anywhere. Hybe is not going to focus on the Korean gp who does not benefit bts or themselves… armys will be happy with everything we get and they know that, so army will invisibly trump what the gp thinks is ‘appropriate’ behaviour.
@@celine9richardson However, I don't think that's necessary the best call from a national social cohesion and equality perspective. Compulsory military service is generally seen as unpopular but a necessary sacrifice due to regional security issues. It places burdens of family (be they the enlistee's children or parents), who have to go without the financial (and non-financial) contributions of the enlistee during their conscription period. As it stands, South Korea's approach where enlistees can choose when to enlist already advantages social elites and disadvantages working class people; compared to similar systems such as in Singapore where every male from a particular cohort is called up at the same time, thereby making the burden shared more equally regardless of social class. Allowing individuals to stockpile content that they then release and profit from throughout the duration of enlistment privileges the creative class and further causes conscription to disproportionately burden the working class (e.g. factory workers, farmers, tradesmen) who don't have that option. Having particular elites abuse loopholes in the system by using them in ways they weren't intended for (i.e. new releases recorded before enlistment likely was to minimise disruption in the lead-up to enlistment) is a surefire way to foster increased resentment and for those loopholes to be closed for future generations (e.g. no more new releases, even for stuff intended for release just after enlistment or that got delayed and couldn't be released beforehand).
I think there isn't much difference between Shotaro and Sungchan in RIIZE and them in NCT except that they might have more content to showcase their talent in RIIZE. RIIZE is a rookie group so they have to establish their name = more content if you follow my logic😆. I really don't see a problem with them redebuting in this group, if you really like them and want to support them then support RIIZE. And if you think RIIZE's music color and concept doesn't fit Shotaro, I think it would be better to give them time to have more than 4 songs to say so. And it's only my story but I have never considered Shotaro to be my bias before he joined RIIZE because he didn't have much of a spotlight in NCT. Now I see the vision 😁
Wtf are you talking about? Shotaro literally had whole dance break in get a guitar and he has always line in chorus. I feel like you dont even know riize
@@moluccensis they have 4 songs and you behave like they mistreat him which isnt true at all. All the members are very talented and theres just not space for all of them to show their talents in every song. There doesnt have to be a dance break in every song. If there was, it would become redundant and boring.
Ok now that BTS is officially in hiatus, What Group or groups will dominate the scene. In my opinion there’s gotta be a group that stuns the scene and takes over. I think the way New Jeans is heading there on the right track, even though they are under the same label basically that’s even more help.
I think the problem with newjeans is that they have GP but not die heart fan like other groups so they need more time before taking BTS down also ADOR prevent them from alots interview because of their age
I think working on their b-day is normal but maybe lives is a bit 🫠 They should be able to spend the evening with friends and family if they have worked all day
I agree that idols should'nt have to go live on their bday. Thats their personal time that they can celebrate with friends and family irl. Performing on their bday is part of their job schedule, but going live is an extra luxury that we aren't entitled to.
Strongly agree. And goodness knows the foreign idols probably want to just talk to their friends and family on that day but people expect the emotional labor of them chatting with you for about an hour.
my opinion regarding ballads is that you really need good vocalists for good ballads. faster songs with more production can cover up flat vocals with no support or emotion put into them, but there’s not really anywhere to hide in a ballad. autotune can’t add depth to someone’s voice. that’s why you see people praising sm ballads, they’re one of the few companies who knows how to train vocals
Good point
I agree for the most part. A ballad will be better with strong vocalists: but honesty there are still ballads from vocally weak groups that I still ADORE like Please Please (everglow) and mirror by Itzy, some of my favorite Korean songs of all.
also for me, personally I prefer when ballads are piano/violin based rather than acoustic guitar. I really hate acoustic guitar 😭
The main thing a ballad needs is good structure but too many are bland and sometimes people just like faster paced songs so even a good vocalist with a ballad is boring 😅
Every time I think about good ballads in kpop I say: "An Encore" By SHINee. In my opinion, one the best examples of how to execute a ballad without making it sound boring.
As a long time Frank Ocean and Kendrick Lamar fan, kpop fans are definitely spoiled. Two comebacks a year, multiple interviews, concerts and lives. YALL dont understand the struggle out here for fans of hiphop.
I'm thinking of Rihanna, granted she released a lot of albums pretty consistently for many years but she hasn't released an album in 7 years. Adele is another artist who is in no rush to make and release new music.
Actually, I think BLINKS are the least spoiled K-Pop fandom when it comes to BLACKPINK comebacks.
Lmfao @@audreyparmenter2000
@@audreyparmenter2000 blackpink is the only group who has a "correct" release pattern, the problem is the content but other than that, they have the classical pattern
Ballads are beautiful and even they need some slow music for concerts as well. I mean we have ballad groups like 2am and BTOB.
I don’t like many k-pop ballads because a lot of idols aren’t made for ballads. But groups that are great at it, they don’t sound boring (like the groups you mentioned)
Thank you for mentioning BTOB. Eventhough they called ballad group their ballad is not typical ballad. Each of their song have rap parts that suit the song.
omg sungchans rap in 90s love was so popular and it was just his debut, they didnt have to strip away his effort like that
People should be allowed time off during their birthday regardless of their job. Let people take a break, it ain't that serious. And if covid has taught us anything, we should NOT be going to work while we're sick, no matter what it is. Mental health is more excepting in society now. It's still quite late but it is progress.
It's easy for me to say that I won't feel sad if photocards of me weren't being sold as much as fellow members BECAUSE I am not an idol. HOWEVER, if I were an idol, it would mean that I probably would care what fans feel. I would probably be insecure and jealous deep inside no matter how I try to convince myself that it's not a problem. It won't be the BIGGEST DEAL but it would still affect me if I was the lowest price.
Exactly. The money might not be going to you but there's a smaller demand for your items, you don't see as many support banners in the crowd, people don't scream as loud for you when it's your part in the song, you don't get as many opportunities regardless of your passion 😔 like it all trickles down to making your job a little more sucky the longer it goes on
would you be sad if your PCs were cheap?
I think rather than high or low standards, I'd argue that many of the more vocal K-pop fans online have no standards at all. At least, not on the things they are judging about. Meaning, if it is someone that they like or support, they will give the idol a pass no matter how good or bad their performance was. Meanwhile, if it is someone they dislike, they will search for and jump on any opportunity to bash the idol no matter how understandable or representative the slip-up was.
At the same time, it's unrelated other factors that have more to do with themselves or their relationship with the idol. For example, it's revealed that an idol has secretly been dating someone or engages in an activity that the fan personally disapproves of even though it is not illegal and the idol is a full grown adult. Suddenly, everything the idol does is all bad and they're horrible performers who are untalented, etc etc etc.
yes to "WHERE IS SHOTARO" in RIIZE mvs!!!! I've been so frustrated over this LOL, we need to see his face and his dance more!!!!
for the part of fans being too entitled: i just wish for more music from kun (wayv) he does have a SoundCloud and i just hope he gets more opportunities in the future. His recent NCT LAB wasn't even released on streaming sites but ONLY SoundCloud where not many people are willing to go
I get what you mean…but isn’t it sad that you think people wouldn’t go to soundcloud if they liked the song? Fans should go there!
If I were an idol, I would feel sad during my rookie days if my PCs were priced lower, but I would eventually get over it. RM has writing credits on every BTS song, he is making a lot of money and producing art. I don't think he even thinks about the price of his PCs at all.
Hi Angelina and Audrey, I had not a good day but I noticed you posted another episode and it cheered me up, so thanks for making my day better now.
hey, that's so nice to hear! thank you so much 😭💕 wishing you all the best!
You too 🥰
Hope you’ll enjoy the rest of your day 💕
okay on the subject of fans being too entitled- i think a huge part of this is the parasocial relationship people have with idols. to put it bluntly, i think people think their idols love them more than they actually do ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ like… okay, to us, idols are a break from our work and school life. and because of that, we want to see them more often- they foster positive feelings. but people forget, entertaining us is an idol’s job. sometimes, they’re gonna want a break from entertaining fans. they’re not locked in a room clawing at the walls and sobbing because they miss their fans so much, they may just want a break.
to us, it can feel like a one on one relationship because we are forming that connection with one single idol. but the idols are forming a connection with a faceless mass of hundreds of thousands of people. it can be exhausting.
i know that’s super blunt, and i do think idols do genuinely have a positive opinion of their fans, and like interacting with them. but at the end of the day it is their job.
I’m gonna offer another perspective about the ballad thing: the Korean perspective. Ballad music is a whole separate genre of music that Koreans LOVE. Like they eat ballads up. So adding a “filler” ballad really is such a Western perspective because it caters to their domestic audience. HOWEVER I do believe it’s a separate genre for a reason and the attraction to kpop for a lot of people is now for slow tempo songs. Imo one of the best kpop ballads is Truth Untold by BTS because it still adds that pop element into it. That’s the kind of ballads that should be incorporated if they’re going to keep doing it.
Its also a thing in some sports, as soon as one group dominates everybody thinks about what will happen when they don't play and who then could get the chance to win ir the game is to predictable or boring etc, just like with exo and bts, they started winning years in a row and people asked for others to have a chance if they take a break. Thats not how competition works
I personally agree with the first opinion. I feel like the music industry is using ballads as stereotypical closers for albums and sometimes in some albums. They read as outliers, but I am also not a fan of this genre, so I am biased. I think the only thing I would enjoy a ballad is if the structures go somewhere subverting the expectations of what a stereotypical ballad should sound like and in terms of song structure. I also think artists who can elevate ballads are ones who have a pleasant vocal tone with great vocal technique. Tracks like Maze In The Mirror(TXT), Sunset(Nayeon), When This Rain Stops(Wendy), Joah(Purple Kiss), Only(Lee Hi), One Of These Nights(Red Velvet) and Let Me In(EXO) are something that I want in a ballad. I like it when ballads take influences from jazz and rnb genres along with great vocal runs and deliveries to elevate the arrangements of a ballad.
03:20 blinks were literally begging BLACKPINK to sing a ballad (the happiest girl) during the world tour.
I thought ballads were ok. When I first heard K-pop, I (like I assumed most people) wanted to see the ones where they would dance to upbeat songs, but ballads were ok. I liked it when an artist played piano or guitar versions to add to the ballads. I thought it was expected to help when they were touring, so the groups didn’t have to dance the whole time and had a break. I know not everyone watches behind the scenes of artists' concerts and tours, but people do get exhausted. Not just in K-pop but in all genres, artists in America aren’t dancing their whole tour, so they have songs where they sit in a chair.
4:43 TXT promotes a lot of ballads ig (?)like skipping stones in this album… farewell neverland in prev one , etc…. maybe they do not promote much but moas love the ballads from their albums
but yes they are very few in an albums….
yeah I agree and TXT does that with almost any genre of music. They have a few r&b songs, quite a few rock ones, srr is heavely disco, they sing ballads too and literally almost every genre lol. In their case I think they are versatile artist that don't limit themselves and they definitely care about every track on the albums. Their bsides>>
@@bamgyuuu304 yup as a moa I agree 1000%
they literally have variety in all the albums… even if u r not a fan you will at least like one or 2 songs per album that’s a fact
It's not uncommon now that groups will pre-record a heap content before enlistment. They can't earn money outside of the military while they are enlisted, but pre-recorded stuff is fine as they it was made before they were in the military. It's also why members are still being announced as Ambassadors for brands as Tae was announced as an Ambassador for a coffee company a few days ago as the contracts were signed before they enlisted.
BTS have said that there is a whole heap of pre-recorded stuff and co-incidentially, Jimin's digital single releases today.
The NCT opinion is so weird. It's so weird for SM to remove both of them from the NCT line-up when they easily could've been in both groups.
Also, I think Shotaro has been in 7 or 8 NCT songs, and Sungchan was in 6 or 7 songs.
Will this make their squedule more complicated... yes. But it's just weird for SM to pull this when Mark is in like 4 groups, which is why it was so weird for them to technically remove Winwin from 127 (Even though, they didn't officially remove him) Shotaro only trained for 6 months before debuting in NCT and he was literally a huge fan of NCT. Sungchan trained for 4 years.
I will say though, SM has pulled the "Keep them in the background until their ready" multiple times. For example, Ten debuted in NCT back in 2016 and didn't get into an official unit until 2019. If y'all remember Hanbin from SM Rookies, he was supposed to debut in NCT 127, but SM kept him in the chambers, Johnny and Doyoung debuted in NCT 127 but they kept Hanbin in the dark. Which Hanbin left SM apparently because he thought he would never debut. Of course he debuted in a group called Newkidd, but that group has been going through crap these past few years.
Shotaro has been in: Make a Wish, Make a Wish (English Version), All About You, I.O.U, Let's Play Ball, Birthday Party, Vroom, and Beautiful.
Sungchan was in: Light Bulb, Misfit, All About You, 90s Love, Know Now, Round & Round, Beautiful, and was also on the song "Jet" from the SMCU album.
In all honesty, I think SM used Shotaro and Sungchan as a promotional tactic for Riize. Because of course, many NCT fans were waiting for them to get a fixed unit.
Couldn’t agree more!
Sungchan & Shotaro SHOULDN’T have been kicked out
Shotaro was in Korea 2 months before he debuted. He was NOT a huge fan of NCT, I'll never know where this rumor started. He just happened to get a chance to go to their concert and this was after SM reached out to him on IG to audition.
And them being a promotional tactic for RIIZE is quite silly cause it would have made more sense to just debut both RIIZE and NCTJapan in NCT or to even split SungTaro up so NCT Japan would have more attention if it was really a marketing tactic cause what exactly is their marketing tactic for the new NCT unit? They are getting a pretty good reception but it would have been even bigger with Shotaro in it and help mentoring them through NCT Lastart and WonBin Anton made a big enough splash that SungTaro weren't really that needed to market RIIZE, especially with people anticipating a new boy group like they were. 😂
Hanbin? Did you mean Hansol?
I love ballad, i admit there are generic ballad but also good one! I wish kpop group could do ballad song like kdrama Ost! Kdrama ost ballad are the best and aren't generic
How dare they overwork Angelina for doing banter with herself in a podcast! protest truck!!!
32:34 yes I’d suggest sakshama srivastav’s interviews… she has good ques & idols also answer them & put their points… even the idols were impressed by her questions…(like joshua , rm , keeho ,etc)
i'll check her out! :)
@@moluccensis 🤗
Omg is she the interviewer who asked Seventeen one specific question per member??
@@audreyskarma yup , that’s her…. she asks everyone a question so no one feels left out + when she gives them compliments…. The idols love it ,
@@aditijha8130 I loved her interview with them!
Ballads is not for everyone especially for young stans and people in their early to mid 20's. As you grow old you will realize and appreciate ballads more when the REAL ADULTING LIFE is kicking you left and right nonstop. 😂😂😂
Speaking of ballads, as a KISSY, I am obsessed with the ballad “Says It” from Kiss Of Life
As a non Kissy I am also obsessed with it!
@@5XKXNXA Yeah, Belle And Haneul wrote quite the masterpiece
My favourite song from the last album. ❤❤
@@mickeysminniemeowzz YESSSSS
@@mickeysminniemeowzz Says it, My 808, TTG and Nobody Knows are my favorites from the album (Love Bad News And Gentleman Too But not favorites)
I think the birthday live thing could have a simple compromise. It doesn't have to be one the specific day, it can just be on the day that they are in the company and have more free time that's near enough their actual birthday. Eric from The Boyz recently dropped a Soundcloud mixtape on his birthday as a gift to fans and I would consider things like that more special than a livestream imo. I don't think idols should just not work on their birthdays bc like that isn't realistic, people do work on their birthdays unless they try to get a day off or something but they don't need to do a livestream either imo.
For me the best group with ballads is BTOB. Their ballads song is not typical ballad. They have 3 rap part which suit the songs. But i would like to remind that BTOB was started as dance group until year 2015 they decided to change their genre. Yet they still have fast songs with choreo in every album. Their most famous ballad song is Missing You which one of the longest song charted on Melon.
28:00 I think Hybe will be releasing new bts music while bts are in the military because from what I’ve been seeing, while there was bts members in the military, the rest of the members were still making in music that has yet to be released. I mean Hybe is releasing jimins song “closer than this” tomorrow. And namjoon has posted a lot of pics of him at the studio with his friends so his solo music will probably be released while he’s in the military. Hybe knows that bts is still there biggest money maker because they keep releasing bts merch/vinyls/coins/music/documentaries while there are members in the military, they keep releasing things for armys because after all, armys are still the biggest fanbase. I don’t think bts’s fame will go down because armys are still very much here & active on Twitter, nowadays armys are getting bts’s old Music to top charts by organizing streaming parties. Also I’m seeing more people join the fandom. These two years of bts’s absence will allow more groups to grow/gain more attention but once bts comes back, a lot of eyes will be on them due to the promises they’ve made. Armys are already looking forward to tours, a new album, group content like run bts episodes, etc.
And we have their brand new disney+ documentary with 2 episodes released so far !! And we have Hope on the Street documentary in 2024. RM new music yess. Tae seemed to have some surprises for us too. Jimin just released close than this. Jin coming back in 6 months and J-Hope in 10. And they come on weverse occasionally. We have so much 💜💜💜
This makes me want to do podcasts myslef you two are so respectful and yet your telling your opinions
Either way and shine with me by ive ballads are amazing I LOVEEEE a good ballad stayc also does ballads AMAZINGLY and I always appreciate them.
If anyone’s looking for good ballads/slower songs, please listen to Xdinary Heroes especially their Deadlock or Livelock album
There are some great ballads but Idk if you like them, for example: sour grapes, anti romantic, fairy of shampoo (but I don’t really like txts version of it I prefer “dosii”)SVT minghao 海城 and welcome to my world but at the end of the day everyone has different taste of music even if it’s within the kpop genre.
i actually really like anti romantic! a recent ballad i can remember loving is be with you by ateez, and an all time favourite is in heaven by jyj, i just find it takes more time for me to warm up to ballads usually but you’re right there are some really great ones!
Angelina thinking that ballads make an album non-cohesive is my villain origin storey
Ballads in K-pop are UNNECESSARY?
Regarding on Sungtaro, I feel like we all have diff opinions on them being in RIIZE.
But as an active Briize who watch ALL of their contents.. in MAMA and MMA.. Sungtaro have their own solo parts and showcase their dancing skills and I noticed that Sungtaro improved their vocals when they are in RIIZE.
We should be grateful and happy that Sungtaro have their own fixed group.
Also, they are only 3-4months old rookie group.
as a shotaro bias, i honestly think he’s the most promoted member after wonbin. like for both siren and get a guitar, he got his own special dance break. i’m all for more shotaro, but tbh i think he’s doing just fine. especially compared to sungchan, who i couldn’t recognize to save my life 😭😭
The problem isn’t the ballad genre imo, it's that kpop producers love retro concepts, but rarely look to the modern west for inspiration (eg of some great modern ballads: Stephen Sanchez’s When I Found You, Halle’s Angel and Lewis Capaldi’s Someone You Loved). Almost no one in kpop produces ballads that sound like they came from after the early 2000s, their ballad style is stuck too far in the past. And I so agree that kpop stans have the lowest and highest standards, they even hold different standards for different members in the same group. Also, I legit just finished watching the new Hunger Games, kinda eerie, do I also need that hoodie and some glasses lol. Since no one asked, I really like the upside down design
And the fact that Shotaro still has the most viewed fancam of all nct it’s crazy, he definitely could be in both
As an economics postgraduate, the concept of economics (supply and demand) is applicable in real-life situations and practical decision-making. Hence, you are still applying the economic concept of supply and demand to your hobby/side hustle.
ballads are fine as bsides, but if the album flows well into it. like if the title is more noisy and then goes to a soft ballad, have the bsides go like a gradient from hard to soft (holy shit ew i hated writing that). ofc for the brokies (me) who dont have premium on music apps we have to do shuffle but listening in a yt playlist it'll flow nice.
On the whole Shotaro and Sungchan issue I have to disagree cause his dancing really shines in Riize. Like everyone notices him. The only Music video would say didn't highlight him in is get a guitar ( which mostly highlited wonbin but in the performance he literally had a dance break). If you want to talk about screen time, Anton usually gets the least but ever since talk saxy I feel every member has been getting a fair amount of screen time and. Taro, Wonbin and Seunghan always get the dance breaks with shotaro in the center soooo ... Yeah I think you just want to see more of him cause he's your bias but speaking honestly everyone in riize has their moments to shine
when u started talking about the variety show members i automatically thought of jackson. he expressed his frustration about jyp pushing his appearances in shows and how he doesn't wanna be only known by the funny member of got7. Nowadays hes an amazing artist with amazing songs and im so proud of him
If I was an idol and my pcs sold for less, I would need to step up my poses, makeup, and start posing with items because it would hurt my feelings 😭😭😭
Its annoying when sellers wont let you claim or buy a popular memeber without also buying a least popular memeber
I think that with ballads, SM producers are awesome, but nugu groups... It's like they have a typical slow song where they blink or smile looking at the camera and that's all
LET! HER! SLEEP!
Wanting Idols to WORK MORE?
BTS have best ballads
The best ballads came from 2ne1. They dont do ballads anymore in kpop. The most recent one is Hurt by New Jeans.
Good Enough by Xdinary Heroes alone makes the ballad opinion invalid /j 😂
No but there are so many beautiful ballads. They don't have to be boring. Just find the right ones👌
I do think ballads to a certain extenct fit to albums well, but not all albums. Itzy is a prime example where the songs in recent albums are too mis matched in the first place. Bet on me and Cake on the same album?
Some ballads/soft songs are kind of just filler like, I point twice signal album as a good example. But the answer to good ballads isn't good vocals, aespa failed with forever and taeyeon while having great disgography of ballads falls flat on few of them.
For good albums that include ballads I recommend:
Taeyeon - INVU (It's good because the songs all fall into heaven and are close to ballad, so songs like some nights and heart are never out of place)
Twice - Eyes Wide Open (The progression from sultry songs in the beginning to deep and beautiful ballads is great, I listen to the latter part in the evenings a lot. Handle it, say something and Behind the mask are some of the best ballads I've heard)
Dreamcatcher - Tree of language (It's all about the progression, that's why full albums are superior)
I think kpop fan’s standards are low because they expect so little nowadays of kpop groups. They are constantly trying to excuse and normalise things like lip syncing even though an idols whole job is to sing.
But let’s say BTS does a BlackPink where they don’t drop at all for a year. Then they start building up a whole lot a hype leading up till there comeback. That would be great. And im sure Hybe wouldn’t mind, they have a great line up.
Bp don't have the same hype they had in 2020
Jimin released a new song today. RM has recorded multiple songs probably a 2024 release. Taehyung teased surprises Army should look forward to. They dropped 2 episodes from their brand new disney+ documentary and there will be more episodes each week. J-Hope has his Hope on the Street documentary coming. Jin is back in 6 months and will release his album. J-Hope back in 10. They’re not going for the BP approach
okay that entire comment at 14:46 was so on the mark it validated my entire existence, sometimes I feel like I'm on crazy pills lmao.
16:52 that's not true to the majority of black artists in the west. Tinashe, to name a few, is the blueprint of K-Pop. Don't get me started with Beyonce's Renaissance tour.
the problem is having a ballad for a group that can't even actually perform it live bc their vocals are so weak or just so untrained
I feel like the older K-pop groups have roles divided clearly (vocal, dancer…) but now the standard of the industry is higher or more investments? So it seems idols are getting trained in every areas. And I do think allrounder and ace has difference, ace is excel in every area while allrounder is good in every area. I would say kfans can claim their idol as allrounder🤣
46:51 this hurt me 🥲
but well ur opinion
anyways I like your podcasts
I do NOT like how Angelina disregards Audrey’s comments or almost feels purposely antagonistic or condescending to her. Honestly I rather just watch Audrey. She’s honest humble and kind. Angelina is letting the views get to her. She honestly doesn’t hear anyone but herself.
Maybe with more choreo and such there were less ballads because what kind of choreo would you do for ballads
I recommend you to watch BTOB ballad songs. Each of their ballads come with choreo.
Look up choreos for Farewell, Neverland and Ring by TXT😊
While I do prefer more upbeat music, the person who thinks ballads are repetitive and boring hasn’t heard any good ballads. Nothing gives you the emotion and catharsis like a good, well crafted ballad. That said, it’s very easy to make ballads boring, but the good stuff?? Nothing like it. Chef’s kiss. Plus, slower songs are definitely needed on albums. If all we had are the upbeat stuff, that would make the album way too repetitive. Gotta break the monotony, ya know?
On the BTS discussion, I don't think HYBE and BTS will release much content for the members during their enlistment period. Outside the K-pop world, BTS received a lot of criticism - particularly amongst conservatives, who are rising in public influence / perception - for perceived special treatment around military service due to the debates and talks about possibly getting exemptions. Generally speaking, Korean males are required to enlist in the military for 1.5 to 2 years; during which time they are expected to put their professional lives on hold and thus miss out on career progression opportunities in order to serve their civic duties. K-pop idols traditionally do this by generally not releasing official content or actively profiting from their idol career during this period. If BTS released official content whilst enlisted, even if recorded beforehand, it would once again be seen by the public as BTS receiving preferential treatment and unpatriotic, as they would be seen as not having to make the same sacrifices ordinary Koreans do or otherwise be in a position of privilege.
@@iyerezm I agree. I don't know how much content BTS will release during their enlistment but lets be honest no matter what BTS do people will mad or jealous. As long as they aren't breaking any laws I don't see an issue.
You basically can't do other jobs only while in millitary which requires earning but since they recorded the stuff before the millitary. I don't see the problem, many other idols have done that but looks like people don't have idea about it.
Jimin just released a new song.. and there’s more songs coming. RM recorded songs and it will be coming out in 2024. They’re not stopping anything. Jin is coming back in 6 months and will release new music. Then J-hope in 10 months. J-hope has a new documentary called ‘Hope on the street’ coming out in 2024. Bts released 2 episodes out of their brand new disney+ documentary. All of this is happening / will happen while they’re in the military. They’re not going anywhere. Hybe is not going to focus on the Korean gp who does not benefit bts or themselves… armys will be happy with everything we get and they know that, so army will invisibly trump what the gp thinks is ‘appropriate’ behaviour.
@@crystalsnow1138read my other comment for a little sneak park on what BTS will be putting out / has already 🙃
@@celine9richardson However, I don't think that's necessary the best call from a national social cohesion and equality perspective. Compulsory military service is generally seen as unpopular but a necessary sacrifice due to regional security issues. It places burdens of family (be they the enlistee's children or parents), who have to go without the financial (and non-financial) contributions of the enlistee during their conscription period.
As it stands, South Korea's approach where enlistees can choose when to enlist already advantages social elites and disadvantages working class people; compared to similar systems such as in Singapore where every male from a particular cohort is called up at the same time, thereby making the burden shared more equally regardless of social class. Allowing individuals to stockpile content that they then release and profit from throughout the duration of enlistment privileges the creative class and further causes conscription to disproportionately burden the working class (e.g. factory workers, farmers, tradesmen) who don't have that option.
Having particular elites abuse loopholes in the system by using them in ways they weren't intended for (i.e. new releases recorded before enlistment likely was to minimise disruption in the lead-up to enlistment) is a surefire way to foster increased resentment and for those loopholes to be closed for future generations (e.g. no more new releases, even for stuff intended for release just after enlistment or that got delayed and couldn't be released beforehand).
i love the podcast
As a Namjoon stan, I'm all for member pricing lol
I think there isn't much difference between Shotaro and Sungchan in RIIZE and them in NCT except that they might have more content to showcase their talent in RIIZE. RIIZE is a rookie group so they have to establish their name = more content if you follow my logic😆. I really don't see a problem with them redebuting in this group, if you really like them and want to support them then support RIIZE. And if you think RIIZE's music color and concept doesn't fit Shotaro, I think it would be better to give them time to have more than 4 songs to say so. And it's only my story but I have never considered Shotaro to be my bias before he joined RIIZE because he didn't have much of a spotlight in NCT. Now I see the vision 😁
I love your videos
ballads are so boring i literally could live without them lol
Wtf are you talking about? Shotaro literally had whole dance break in get a guitar and he has always line in chorus. I feel like you dont even know riize
a 17 second dance break isn't going to change my mind
@@moluccensis they have 4 songs and you behave like they mistreat him which isnt true at all. All the members are very talented and theres just not space for all of them to show their talents in every song. There doesnt have to be a dance break in every song. If there was, it would become redundant and boring.
@@tp5510they could make more space for him by giving Wonbin’s face less screen time 🫠
@@tp5510 and you're making a big ass deal for?
@@KyndraRenee well i hate toxic solo stans
Ok now that BTS is officially in hiatus, What Group or groups will dominate the scene. In my opinion there’s gotta be a group that stuns the scene and takes over. I think the way New Jeans is heading there on the right track, even though they are under the same label basically that’s even more help.
I think the problem with newjeans is that they have GP but not die heart fan like other groups so they need more time before taking BTS down also ADOR prevent them from alots interview because of their age
I don't think that's happening
THINK YOU LOOK ALIKE? i was convinced ur twins
u sound like kylie jenner
First one🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥
second 💀
Most kpop ballads suck lol
Nah it just your fav's ballad are sucks lol
I think working on their b-day is normal but maybe lives is a bit 🫠
They should be able to spend the evening with friends and family if they have worked all day