How to Build A 10,000RPM Rotary Engine - Part 2
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 27 ธ.ค. 2024
- We show you how to build a 10,000RPM 13B Mazda REW turbo rotary RX7 engine by assembling the rotors and DIY porting the irons.
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Find Part 3 here: th-cam.com/video/r-YvAR8W43g/w-d-xo.html
As I said in the last ep. this is the proper guide that we need to understand how it is done.
And to be honest if someone out there wants to buy an FD3S RX-7/ RX-8( or any rotary car in that matter) they won't find a mechanic that knows how to rebuild a rotary and so they can do it themselves. And again Thanks SA for doing these guides and keep up the good work. Can't wait for the next one. #ForeverFD3S
Why do you say you wont find a shop... There are literally hundreds of us out here rebuilding these in the U.S.A. alone!!!
Until he said I can feel the gap.....I don’t have to measure.....famous last words
@@mustangdemon87 But the audience is international. For example in France Rotary engine are not really known (even by Mazda), and there's only few Rotary experts shops here
@@mustangdemon87 yea go find me an expert in Bulgaria(Balkan states) and even if there are they will cost at least 3k USD(4.5k BGN)
@@mustangdemon87 Find me a rotary specialist in Luxembourg where I live, please :D
Don't bother: There are none.
The knowledge delivered here! Don’t know anything about rotary engines but I’m excited to learn
These guys are great. Check out Rob Dahm's channel if you want some irreverent humor in the rotary madness.
same here
If you would like detailed information about the assembly of a rx8 rotor following the correct steps and the balancing of the shafts and rotors id suggest angel motorsports, they take their channel to the machine shop for every build and walk the audience through the process rather in depth, theres a good bit of work that was skipped here you could learn from their videos
My rather humble claim to fame. My project back in 2007 or so was Joe's first use of RX8 rotors in a ported RX7 motor. Good to see him still at it.
How'd it turn out? Kickin' ass?
The difference in ‘2 stroke’ oils is usually one is ester based and one is castor based. Ester based 2 stroke oils will not mix in alcohol fuels like E85. So if you guys are going to run it on ethanol, make sure the oil is castor based.
Thanks! I’m saving this one 😎😁
I have friends that use normal caster oil in their rotory
There are better synthetic premixes to work in alcohol than castor. Castor separates and gums up. Smells good works bad.
Just stick with what was spend millions on developing specifically for these engines. Idemtisu racing premix.
Premixing is monumentally stupid.
The Wankel engine is 4-stroke and Mazda reccomends 4-stroke engine oil.
Don't be that idiot pouring the wrong oil down the wrong filler hole.
The Valvoline adds are literally amazing. Thumbs up for that. Crushing it.
I believe on the rx8 rotors, when fitting the side seals your meant to use feeler gauges to push the side seal towards the center of the rotor, certainly in all the videos I've watched recently this is what has been done, it's to simulate the compression of the engine once running forcing the side seals inwards (if this isn't done it can cause binding)
4x feeler gauges or you are doing it wrong, you are correct in this case. Can we get los hermanos rotoras over here, wya Angel Motorsports
I came here to say this as well. If you measure at the end you usually end up with the clearances that are too tight and wreck your motor. Unless your going turbo the pre-sized seals are fine and eliminate the possibility of a measurement error.
This is yet another reason i hate people like this giving out wrong info in these videos! If your not going to spend the time to actually give the proper procedures DONT MAKE THE VIDEO IN THE FIRST PLACE! Ether do it right the first time or not at all!
Yes you need 3 or more and you do the entire side of a rotor at the same time
If you want to see how its done right angel motorsports just did this on their 3 rotor with the rx8 rotors, he shows you the right setup, on rx7 rotors you just use 1 but if you want the high compression rotors done right watch theirs and follow the procedure
Please never stop giving us these videos. Very informative 🙏🏾✊🏾
Not measuring side seal clearance isn't very informative...
Jake Hamlin He has been building rotaries for years. I’m pretty sure he knows what he’s doing.
@@tunedbydre good luck building your own engine, based on these informations, and guessing the clearances by feel
The valvoline advert is pure gold 😍
I wonder if it was SA's idea or Valvoline's though lol
@@sk83rboi777 either way it's a great idear 👍
I don't write comments very often, as I watch allot of videos when I am at work on separate screens as my background noise, but your videos are very good. I first came across your channel a year ago and seeing what you guys do is just awesome. I wish you both the best in your future endeavors in this TH-cam world. You guys are awesome and keep doing what you are doing, just don't let the trolls that roam the interwebs bust you both down.
I am very happy you guys made this build possible. I will be using this video for my FD rebuild. No v8 swap here.
Legit never cared about rotary engines until a few weeks ago when I watched a see through one running on another channel. Then you guys dove into this one right after that. It couldnt have been better timing and I'm learning lots
My favorite video series on youtube.
Respect to the attention to details from both of these guys!
The stuff about how the port works with timing, etc, is the kind of content I'm looking for!
Thanks for helping to demystify rotaries. No other rotary content on TH-cam is this well structured and concise. Keep at it👍
This is great insight to what has historically been a secret art of engine building. I hope you meet all your performance goals and have a long lasting ripper of an engine as a result!
Love seeing more and more people coming around to using high compression rotors in turbo builds (specifically with rx-8 rotors). 10.0:1 compression, standard scallops, 9.3 lbs each (9.2 lbs after apex milling and balance corrections typically) making revs much quicker and, most importantly, more power and torque with less boost. In my 76-78 based large streetport 13B i'm currently using S5 na 9.7:1 9.54 lbs rotors and love it as is, but I am building a second engine with a pair of modified rx8 rotors balanced and side clearanced for up to 12,000 rpm (not going that high, but safe to do so if wanted) and I may rebuild my current motor with rx8 rotors as well just because I have many on hand and would make my NA setup just that much better.
*I'm also a huge advocate for OEM apex seals only (with exception to Ianetti ceramics), however, from what i've been seeing with i-rotary seals they may just very well be the first and only cost effective aftermarket apex seal (roughly the same cost as OEM) that is both more durable than oem apex seals, but also matches or exceeds OEM in terms of wear over time and mileage (as in the same or less wear) and I may build one of my engines with them in the nearish future
Do you not like goopy seals?
I always knew about rotary engines and know one of the biggest guys here in Japan but this is awesome!! I definitely like to learn about stuff I don't understand!! Keep up the valvoline moments to 🤣🤣
Those valvoline commercials! Haha
I know NOTHING about rotors other. Tttthan tyr tdd hey sound awesome and the feneral premise. Really cool to see it step by step.
Love the simplicity and precision of rotary engines. I've got an RX-7 on my list.
Love the amount of information in these videos. Hard to find that on YT these days.
Love it! Just recently started entertaining the idea of a rotary after watching Rob and his 4 rotor. Love the info here. Thanks!
His vids made me stop entertaining the idea about a rotory ... 😜
@@earnestbunbury2103 Lol!!! Yea, I could definitely see that too.
Stoked to get a new speed academy video. I was getting withdrawl symptoms
Love this series. Dreams of owning an FD one day.
This is what I love about rotaries.. all you need is proper research basic knowledge and a feeler gauge and you can rebuild your own rotary! And if push comes to shove and you need to replace bearings you can probably go to a shop and borrow a inside micrometer and outside micrometer to figure out bearing clearances. It’s very doable!
The rolled edge is called the Coanda Effect it allows the air and fluid to maintain surface contact in the same direction of the open port.. providing less turbulence .
I think this is going to be a sweet setup with those higher compression rotors.Great content guys
the sports presenter segment is incredible
Lot of debate with oil in rotary engines, but I've always read that synthetic oils should never be used (either in your sump or for pre-mix) as they don't burn in the same way an 'mineral' oils, which I understand means the synthetics will leave gummy deposits. For the 2-stroke pre-mix a high ash mineral is preferable. When I ran my RX8 (standard 230hp six-port) I always used 10W40 'mineral', although I didn't also use pre-mix.
Incidentally, I was also always told that the oil injection (particularly into the rotor chamber) was mainly for the cooling and to provide additional film seal, particularly for the apex seals. Supposedly, mainly due to the minimal moving parts, using oil to actually lubricate really only applies to the rotor and end/e-shaft bearings.
Always interesting discussion. Idemitsu is fully synth: www.amazon.com/Idemitsu-30018100-75000C020-10W-30-Rotary-Racing/dp/B07MMT6W3Q
We’ll be deleting the OMP in order to run synthetic. More on that soon.
From what I’ve gathered everyone that does premix runs fully synth. The debate later is whether you should run synthetic or mineral in the engine. My conclusion is. Mineral in engine if you have the OMP, Valvoline VR1 Racing for example! And the a smaller amount of premix with fully synthetic. No OMP you can run fully synthetic in the engine and a fully synthetic premix but a increased amount of it :)
Two strokes put to bed a long time ago whether or not synthetic pre-mix is better. It is MUCH better than non-synthetic in every way.
Them Valvoline sponsor spots are great :') Awesome video with excellent information
You guys are the ORIGINAL dorks
Enjoyed this video. Rotary stuff is something I've always wanted to mess with but is a complete mystery to me. Thanks for helping demystify it.
Ito!!!!!!!!! This video series makes me so happy! 😁👍
One other benefit for the RX-8 rotor is that it has a 3rd oil seal on the face of the rotor for better oil control. I wouldn't use the higher compression rotor on a gasoline build but on E85 it is cool.
With higher compression I personally would choose a slightly larger turbo with a well-matched compressor/turbine, and run lower boost to achieve the same output (although with a higher thermal efficiency), then what I would run with stock compression REW rotors. I enjoy seeing the results from what you guys do and wouldn't change it (except if I could change what blew up the EVO motor).
I love this series! There's some good information here!
love the in depth technical breakdown. great work as always
So glad you're doing series!! My last comment made an impact. Great!
Great to see Joe is doing well!! Rotary guru for the longest time. I'm enjoying these vids. Hopefully I'll be able to do 1 of my own whenever that day arrives (hoipefully not within my life time.. lol) :-)
Glad to see that you guys decided to keep it up! This is going to be an interesting build, looking forward to seeing how the rotary turns out!
10:35 if this engine fails you guys already know why
Lol “I just do it by feel”
Can you please share the proper technique with us?
@@aronharper7001 angel motorsport will teach you
Loving the series so far guys. Thanks!
So much knowledge shared here! Pretty awesome well done video!
I want a mock see-through rotary engine. The way I understand how they work it seems like they would slam themselves apart in no time so seeing the inside of one running would help simplify things, at least for me. Peaces!
I think warped perception actually had a video on a glass sided rotary engine from like a rc airplane. Definitely worth a look
This is so awesome, props to Joel (Joe?), absolutely love this channel, hope you guys are enjoying your time off
Man this build is going to be sick!
are there shops that use a cnc to do the porting so that is comes out perfect everytime?
I love this channel, such in-depth learning and knowledge.
Love the original intermission .... Valvoline.
the 'stache must be in EVERY episode
Learning a lot as usual, thanks guys!!!...
Valvoline should do a run of commercials just with your facts all in one commercial. If it were played on other TH-cam videos, I might not even skip it after 5 seconds.
I am really excited about the whole project.Want to see the gains and the fuel consumption of this engine.
Fantastic video! I can't wait to see how this turns out.
Run maxima castor 927 with some race gas. You will not be disappointed by the smell.
first time ive seen the shim thing between the corner seal and apex seal , can you explain that please?
Lucas oil makes an ashless oil that doesnt produce alot of smoke. I run it on my H1 it's pretty good stuff. Can mix it pretty fat and still not smoke a ton.
dang...how does the 2 cycle oil effect the O2 sensor in RX7s and RX8s??? very interesting engine...
They aren't that bad on them, if you have issues you can use a spark plug non fouler to space it out, will make it think its lean so tune it on a dyno with a dedicated afr gauge for a proper lamda reading, but its not typically a issue it gets burned up
I don't recall but don't the side seals get a different cut if it's going to be NA or turbo? I don't recall but I think it was like 0.2 gap for NA and a 0.5 for turbo set ups. I'd like to get mr ferguson :)
Loving the series so far keep up the good work!
Valvoline high mileage is all I have put into my car 👌🏻
Looking forward to seeing this rip!
You could always port the rotors and use equal volume of liquid to ensure equal compression ratio, or use an octane booster.
What HP levels are you expecting with the RX8 rotors? Looking forward to how you guys tackle heat management!
Depends on the turbo they're going to use. With a small-ish turbo, about 450hp. With a decent sized one like a 35R or equivalent-sized BW EFR, can get you to about 500-600 easy. The issue is tuning at that point. High compression on a rotary - any detonation event, even a single one can be enough to pinch an apex seal.
Watched this after file fitting 16 rings for a V8 today. I don't feel bad for you guys hahaha.
Two questions.
1. Are you going to run on E85 or not? This will determine the oil both for the engine and pre-mix.
2. How do you intend to make power at 10k rpm with such a small turbo? From the dynos i've seen they cannot deliver enough airflow past 6-7k rpm.
Love your videos btw!
There's no pump E85 local to them so I doubt that's what they'll be running
I've always wanted to make a hybrid rotary to drop into an frs high compression rotors and some. Mild porting and shoot for 9000 rpm like the renesis. Would be awesome!
Are they the old rotor housings
Resurfaced?
Rx8 rotating assembly or just rotors?
If you dremil the water jacket out it really helps to keep it cold to dude
good stuff, looking forward to the next installment
Very interesting video! Got to learn alot of new stuff about the rotary, loved it🔥!
Have the rotors been lightened by drilling? Or is that some kind of balancing thing, I noticed there were a different number and size of drill marks on the sides of each rotor tip.
Excellent work and video!!! How is the battery life on that Milwaukee grinder??
U guys should do a comparison between the rx7 fc housing and the fd housing.
The housings are rather similar there would be a difference between na fc and the fd but the turbo 2 fc used the same housings as the rew. The biggest difference would be a rx8 housing, they changed the water seal location and couple other things
Very informative vid mate
Glad to see you boys keep going👍
Why do you need to work on the granite slab when doing the seals?
Commenting to show support.
Keep it up guys good content 👌 don't get down about channel views it will come back around!
Judge ito is a name I haven't heard in years
Advertising made me laugh 22 years old from quebec! Keep it up
This would give Vargas brothers a hart attack
FACTS😂
Gave me one 😂🤷🏻♂️
WAS WAITING FOR THIS!
So funny! Great stuff guys!
sheit, building rx8 rotors is more of a pain in the ass than regular REW rotors. Must have yourselves a rly talented dorito engineer there.
if you remove the metering pump then you need to treat it like a 2 stroke, meaning you can't coast on it!!! Alternatively, you can just add a special 2 stroke oil tank to feed the meetering pump while you use nicer oil in the sump.
Yeah......noo.... on a rx8 this is ok but the rx7 the oil jets are bad.... really bad. The Reason we do premix is because with it coming in the 6 injectors you get better oiling because of the spray pattern of the nozzle. There are plenty of us who daily 400hp rotarys who coast and commute on the highway, long as you recline them once a day (who am I kidding if you own one your on it all the time) you will be fine
I just watched one of the Vargas Brothers Instagram story and boy did you make them cringe at the fact that guy said he goes by the feel 😂
instagram.com/stories/vargas_fb/2399767276504289365?igshid=1tu5wugty5qrl
They also show a video in how to properly put together RX8 rotaters maybe y'all should check them out lol
Should be using 4 feeler gauges for RX8 rotors. Also ianetti didn’t invent ceramic seals, Mazda in japan had the original ones produced in japan for the 13G race engine.
Thank you, came down here to say the exact same thing
I love rotary content!
Really want to see the result of RX8 rotors in a RX7 housing.
I've seen several, the spooling of the turbo is a bit better, i haven't seen much power difference in them however, they are lighter as well so you can rev up near 10 k If its built right
Will you be using oversize studs in this engine?
thanks for another great video! currently watching this before work. always have to learn something new! ps i dont own an rx7
‘The Valvoline Commercial’ 🤣🤣🤣 GOLD!!
Vargas bro’s cringing at 10:39 😂😂😂
Keep it up guys
Nice episode ❤️
Ok... question. When you premix your rotary, do you disable the oil injectors from the system for the rotary?
you can do both, you just use less premix... its best to just eliminate the OMP entirely and premix more
@@mikestudzinski9263 yes cuz the omp can fail
Yes, you’ll see us delete it in a future episode.
is that .002" on each side of the side seal?
He did it by feel my guess is.... too tight, he didn't properly load the spring to measure it so whatever it is, its not accurate. Is it possible he has the muscle memory to know how much to take off? Possibly. Would i trust that??? No
05:11 that reminds me, I need to book my dentist appointment.
What are you going to run for a premix ratio?