Usually Succession's best lines are witty and acidic snappy lines. With good reason, as they're fantastic. Who forgot Logan belting "He ate my fucking chicken. What's next, stick his cock in my potato salad?" Somehow, the one that stuck with me is the from the same episode the devastating one Tom said to Shiv during the yacht vacation : "I just wonder if the sad I'd be without you is less than the sad I get from being with you."
I've always found it interesting that Succession is completely character driven. Plot points, buyouts, business deals, etc. are only relevant to the show because they create situations where the characters have to adapt, fight, switch teams, etc. When you're that rich, there isn't really material consequences, only personal ones.
Exactly! At first I was bothered by that, but I understood that all that wealth works as a tool, a narrative asset. Without material problems, the actors can develop their characters to the infinite
Great point. When Kendall fired everyone and was spit on, that was maybe the closest to the outside world causing a consequence to one of them, and you can see that is what shocks him, not the action itself. (Also, I've only seen this show via shorts, so I'm ripe to be 'actually'd'.)
As a former finance worker who led regular meetings with trustees, legal counsel and chief ___ officers, I can confirm people in that sphere 100% talk this way (albeit with less swearing). It was like playing 3 chess games at once. This show was a salve on the scars caused by the doublespeak (and double-think?)
Umm. Stop. No one believes rich parasites are bright. Because they aren’t. They’re dim, over-confident nitwits. Don’t fall for the over-confidence. Behind closed doors they beg to be spanked.
@@widowswail888 I think he did know all along though. I think all the siblings knew and just desperately wanted it not to be true, so they never accepted it.
The wild thing about the show is at the end of the day they aren't really talking about anything. It's all anticipation of something big and meaningful happening but nothing concrete happens. Really the kids just wanted love and never got it the way they needed it. You have to wait entire seasons just to see someone get a hug that feels like it has any substance to it.
this is so true. i saw a tweet that said no one really loses anything in succession; there's big fights and squabbles but the characters always end up in the same limbo, going in circles and trying to win while never facing the consequences of their actions. another reason why they're all so miserable
It’s the story of capitalism. Look at diddy he’s the worst capitalist but look at his friends they’re all the same. Other industries are run by perverts too I’m quite sure. It’s a man’s world, not many women rape just saying
It often seemed like Greg was the only one doing any actual work, whenever Tom would burst into his office and go psycho at him lol. God knows what he did, though, probably causing disasters at the theme parks from his computer. Tom did kind of start working when he became head of ATN. The rest of them are always just trying to buy another company or backstab each other to be CEO
As someone who left the corporate culture after getting sick of it, this exactly how most brand managers and directors talk. They just think they're more impressive when they can't be understood. 😂
@@moonbeeps apparently they wanted to portray it more realistically, how a parent or loved one often dies unexpectedly and unceremoniously and when their loved ones aren’t nearby. This doesn’t really fit the tone of the show, so I think it was a bad choice and also think it happened way too early. Still a good show overall, especially seasons 1 and 2
I work in tech and this is just high-level corporate speak lol. you hear stuff like “I need to get altitude on this situation” or “potential upside is mitigated by the situational margins” all the time.
@wrenguitar2813 Can’t imagine what you must tolerate on a daily basis. Hard [and fun] enough to keep learning new languages and frameworks then to add on the interpretation of kooky corporate speak.
@@cUser691 it can be quite annoying at times haha but usually it’s not too bad, you learn the ropes pretty quick (doesn’t help that the environment is sink-or-swim)
I was in the same environment and pretty sure most people were only pretending to understand and wouldn't be able to explain back. Since nobody is ever asking, that is fine. It's 90% conceptual and almost exclusively dealing in imagery. I found it fascinating
This is absolutely fantastic. I love the concept of "real people" or "serious people" and how their mindset essentially unpersons people based on how they are percieved. Like the finale of "we are bullshit" is the ultimate realization that they themselves are not "serious" or "real" people.
Yes. I think Roman can finally acknowledge it because his father is gone. They are spoiled brats who actually could be enjoying a comfortable life instead of trying to be powerful too. Shiv was doing very well before she was dragged into the whole family business. But obviously Logan messed them up so much emotionally that they can’t see it, they can’t be happy without their dad’s approval so they end up like circus monkeys jumping up and down to entertain Logan, trying to be something they are not.
I've unfortunately worked in so many places like this where people never say they mean and deny what they agreed to. I just stopped believing what what was coming out their mouth and kept everything via email and Slack. It's a perfect illustration of WASP speak. Best quote from this video, "Vagueness is a weapon." It absolutely is for those who lack of a moral compass and who emprace a transactional way of life.
So well put. Reminds me of Elon Musk and his endless promises of things that are “coming soon” or things he’s “looking into”. Vagueness allows him to backpedal, constantly.
The truth is that no one knows what they are doing. Including people at the top, but the top are the ones with the power/task of big decision making. So they make decisions, but no one wants to take the accountability for when a decision ends up wrong. So its a game of passing the accountability to others through vagueness and denial. Is it wrong? That's hard to say. Again - no one knows what they are doing, but decisions have to be made.
The main reason why I watch the show with Spanish subtitles is because they make a terrific job at translating these weird expressions to understandable language 😅
i'm gonna have to try watching the show that way! yeah all these characters mostly talk in corporate-legal-pr doublespeak, any method of translation for what these characters do and say is invaluable
No me digas! I was wondering how on earth they would properly translate this show, since it plays around so much with English to begin with. Which dialect would you say they translate into: peninsular, Mexican?
Yeah the use of buzzwords was funny and frustrating at the same time. I never heard people at work speak like this, maybe because i'm not in a high level position that requires riddle to communicate, idk. Also, i noticed the way Matsson speak depends on who he's talking to. He's an obnoxious tech billionaire with Ken, he's a misunderstood awkward guy with Shiv, a condescending bored apathetic rich guy with Roman, a straight forward businessman with Logan, a domineering control freak with Tom. He creeped me out 😅
True, but most people can't precisely fine-tune their personality to appeal to the individual in front of them, which is what pushes Matsson into the relms of a sociopath. That and his complete lack lack of empathy for people who are grieving.
For me, much of the relational dialogue in Succession is classic ‘narcissist word salad’. If you search for Narcissist word salad, there are many videos explaining what it is and how it sounds. I’d say it’s a conscious character choice by the writers and not just Jesse’s writing style.
@@Sockem1223 I liked some of his work, but he seems unhinged now. He literally fried his brain through drug addiction and experimental medical procedures in Russia.
Vagueness being used as a weapon to shift the reponsibilitly to the minon is something i experience every day with my manager who artfully says a lot while saying nothing... and it's always on me to figure it out because if i ask questions then I don't get it.
I work in Corporate Tech. Succession-speak is really just a jaded, sarcastic, vulgar version of actual business / corporate-speak, but the latter exists for a reason. There are important, nuanced concepts that are unique to, or much more common in business contexts, and metaphorical language is developed to reference or illustrate those learned lessons. I could say, "let's not test every possible scenario, because not only is that unnecessary, but it would take far too long, require far too many engineering hours and pull resources away from other efforts", or I could just say "let's not boil the ocean". This is just one example of the hundreds of useful turns of phrases that compress information into fewer words. The downside of corporate-speak is that not everyone understands it equally, resulting in a breakdown in communication. It can also be deployed intentionally to remain vague on project goals or progress.
hmmmmm- as someone who has never worked anywhere even close to the corporate world - I was in the arts, haha - I find that really interesting. But here's my question - is "business/corporate speak" spontaneously metaphorical or is it a language of its own with regularly used catch-phrases and expressions? Because on Succession it sounds like the words are just tumbling out of their mouths and I'm thinking "they are pretty damn brilliant for shallow idiots" !! I guess the writers have elevated it, so in the real world they aren't really that creative or imaginative...?!! Because if everyone in the business world could so easily come up with the inventive turn of phrases that Succession characters come up with (including Roman's gross, inappropriate, rude, and hyper-sexual ones!) they should be writers themselves!! (The first time through I couldn't stand Roman's non-stop disgusting verbal diarrhea; the second time I watched I guess I was inured to it because then I just had to marvel at how funny and creative he was in his revoltingness, haha!)
@@elliott9628 But it doesn't pack the same emotional punch. There's a reaction to the exaggeration of "boiling the ocean". Drives the sentiment much more effectively than a "testing all scenarios would require too many resources". One is heard, the other is FELT.
I think of it as analogous to generational slang. shared experiences and communication channels result in phrasing/metaphors that are particularly good at distilling meaning learned from those experiences. they also connote an in-group status to help build relationships but with corporate speak I wonder if the nebulous/abstract concepts like - markets - capital - power - real vs transactional relationships result in their slang being equally abstract and sometimes only an "implication of meaning"
Whatever Kendall says something he goes overboard to sound like someone who knows what they’re talking about, because he’s insecure to be looked down upon. Rome doesn’t understand the base of human emotions so he try to explain his point with as many references he can come up with And Shiv tries to distance herself from the narrative to disguise her own thoughts and opinions behind a wall of objectiveness because she fears that people won’t listen to her if she isn’t being 100% factual.
It so much easier when it's outlined ahead of time and you have time to rehearse and modify it. No one get's that kind of help and time in real life. But it's great for a TV Show.
I work in design and there's definitely a real obsession with language for marketing and ceo types. There's definitely a code that you have to speak, those all important buzz phrases which are constantly changing. It's definitely a symptom of the vapidity of corporate culture.
Something Important that you didn't overtly mention (although I assume you're implying it by those last two quotes by Logan) is that Logan speaks the EXACT opposite of this style of speech. And I think it's meant to showcase just how direct and meaningful his words are, and why he cuts through all the bullshit that these people otherwise are waist deep in at all times. It's also why the show and these kids just fall right off the rails after his death.
Um, no. He's the biggest bullshit-talker in the show. But he's the best at it because he can present it as "honest, direct" speech. He's so damn good at it that even some of the show's audience fell for it.
@@misssoso5859 To clarify, I'm not saying he's more truthful, simply the way he gets across his lies is the polar opposite of the style presented in this video Although I do genuinely think he is speaking more from experience than ANYONE else around him. He is a dying breed for sure.
I feel like the kids are the “anti-Logan” in a lot of ways, but there are definitely similarities in their metaphors and vague commands. Except - because he’s clearly had a long and storied career, and he’s actually had to work/battle to get to his position - Logan hides a lot of his vagueness in parables and anecdotes, which gives the illusion of it being trustworthy, wise and direct, rather than manipulative and deceptive. Also - words only carry as much weight as the person delivering them, and Logan clearly had a lot more influence/respect/power than the kids ever will - so his phrasing, no matter how similar to the kids, are received through a different filter. Just my read on it! It’s definitely an interesting point.
@@SceneItReviews Yeah, I think I'd remove the part about his words not being bullshit, but I DO believe he is the antithesis of this type of speech. Even if his own method of speaking ends up with the same results. He does it in his own way. And like you said, with more weight carried behind them. Thanks for the response, have loved your Succession videos.
It's funny, because I'v'e always thought everyone spoke weird minus Logan (at least most of the time for Logan). I think it's because he grew up poor so he didn't grow up with an entitled superior attitude from the beginning, as opposed to the kids which is why they speak differently to sound superior to others.
Logan was more direct but he also spoke in riddles. He rarely ever confirm or deny what he's saying. It's always left in the open so he can change his mind later.
@@Manganization " It's always left in the open so he can change his mind later." This is brilliant actually LOL the kids try to emulate this and fail miserably over and over again
exactly... logan has all my respect but his entitled little brats annoy me. especially shiv's speaking gestures and romans humiliation rituals for their employees
"Talk Money to Me" reminds me of one line that really stood out to me which was when the sibs got together to try to tell Kendall they love him after he nearly drowned himself in the pool, Connor goes "we love you Ken", Kendall goes "What's the angle here?"
Their (the Kids) use of Language/'Lexicon' is on brand with the new generation, tech-style of communication. It is largely confounding for me, though nonetheless fascinating and a necessary exposure to this new world way of thinking and operating. I'm thankful to the writers for providing an educational glimpse into it...
The short version: it's corporate speak. Corporate English is a distinct language from Colloquial English and is intended to speak with a emotionally distant tone that instead emphasizes the importance of economic and business cultural values. And it's not wonder Chat GPT is so good at corporate speak. There's so much of it and one of the most valuable aspects of corporate speak is the ability to say little while evoking good feelings.
Definitely. It’s such a large part of what makes it my favourite show. Characters don’t ever sound overly snappy and witty to the point of being obnoxious and unrealistic like they sometimes do in Succession. They often struggle to find the right thing to say, they stumble over themselves when they try to talk, they often make mistakes like using incorrect phrasing and malapropisms. They interrupt and talk over each other, and experience the sorts of misunderstandings you’d expect people to regularly experience in real life. When they talk subliminally or in code, it’s for a practical reason (avoiding self-incrimination when discussing illegal business), not just as a character quirk or an attempt to make the dialogue sound more intelligent. The writers on The Sopranos achieved a level of realism and believability in the character interactions that no other show I’ve seen has quite been able to live up to.
This. I'm wondering why am I so invested even tho I don't fully understand business speak. Same thing happened when I watched The Big Short. I am so fascinated with the combination of business technical terms and almost poetic descriptions of things.
As someone who’s father was a bank executive and who currently works in consulting, “corporatespeak” is kind of my native language. The whole point is to get a point across while denying the culpability directness brings and making every decision “logical” and “strategic” to purposely detach yourself from the human element.
I love when you look at cinema and TV with a telescope, to point at patterns across movie or an actor. And I also love it here's when you pull out your microscope to zoom in on smaller details. Not only their output on all facets of life, from business deals to the most intimate details, is transactional, it's also always on the view of winner/loser. You must crush someone, vanquish them, extricate your gain from them. Or, if they got what they want, it means they beat you. Oof, that sounds exhausting. And I've worked with people like that in the corporate world. They were usually certified sociopaths with no consideration for people whatsoever. Congrats on capping this series with panache and verve!
@@SceneItReviews I'm not one of those who were "rooting" for this and that character to win. It did happen during the show, but mostly because I wanted them to defeat Logan, not because intrinsically Shiv/Kendall/Roman deserved it. For the end, I wanted them to get a final scene as siblings, because those are so fantastic, and we got two, the Dad video and the Meal For for a King one. Splendid. And I also wanted them to be crushed miserably. Ideally, caused by all the wrongdoings they did over the past years. And boy, was I ever satisfied on that point! I'm only missing a final Gerri-Roman scene (which I'm sure they filmed and had to cut), and perhaps Marcia, although her swift absence was by itself so revealing about her, no line could come out any colder. What about you?
Loved it! Really enjoyed the Meal for a King scene because it gave a nice parallel to the ‘boat scene’ from the end of Season 1 - showed that despite the backstabbing, they’ll always be family, and also gave a wholesome moment for the cast to say goodbye. Also loved that no one really “won” - a sobering reminder that they’re all pretty terrible people, and their motivations for retaining the company only boiled down to pride/selfishness/“so that other terrible guy doesn’t get it”. They were all given so many opportunities to “get out”, move on, and work together as a family throughout the season, and instead they chose self destruction. Couldn’t have asked for more, really! Will be forever on my television Mount Rushmore probably. Looking forward to seeing what the talented cast goes on to do 😇
Caroline: "This is Marsha. She was my Carrie". And Marsha at the funeral, sitting with Logan's harem: "At least he won't be grinding his teeth tonight."
My favorite lines and expressions I've heard on Succession: Let us get our ducks in a row Now it's my time to habeas the corpus Everything everywhere is always moving, forever Soups on! People We didn't get you from a hiena farm Come homeward I'm not gonna chase him around the party like a schoolgirl with a crush Age Before Beauty. Oh, no, please, shit Before The shovel Go AWOL It was eventful I've burned villages and overthrown governments in your behalf My nearest and dearest I'm between the devil and the deep blue sea Honey Badger It's not in my best interest I can't see the bottom of the pool
I think the closer Armstrong project is The Thick of It - S2E10 of Succession has a lot of similarities to the select committee episode of Thick of It for example - it mines humour from the same joke (hilarious private emails being read out to a government committee). This isn't a criticism of it at all - I think Armstrong is a genius.
Yeah, this is a well put-together video but I think in reality, Succession's dialogue is just the Peep Show/Fresh Meat template with more corporate lingo stuck in
I work in tech, have worked at a couple fintech and crypto startups and fortune 500 companies, All of this makes sense to me. I've been in this space for 8 years and I've heard all of this at some point in that time. It is... something.
i don't think i ever found it weird. it's just pretty standard linkedin/businessbro talk overdone. it's pretty common to use this kind of speech to make fun of them reinventing really simple and basic things, it's the official out of touch language
This series is incredible! It seems that the strength of authorship of a good director was divided and leveraged between the screenwriters, the actors and the art department. ❤
Funny because I just started watching this show and then you post this. Great timing. I was wondering this so badly, the way they talk is so awkward. Edit: It reminds me of Knives Out when they realize their billionaire is actually stupid but they all believe he's smart because he has money but he literally makes up words because he has no idea and instead steals others.
Yeah, watching Knives out, Edward Norton kept using phrases and words that I, too, thought were wrongly used, I was confused, in fact, at aome point I started to doubt myself thinking, maybe I'm not aware of the expanded use, but It just didn't sit right with me up until the end of the movie when the Detective, to my relief, pointed the absurdity of it all. It was pretty smart and comical what the writers did with that angle of the storyline. 😂😂
the real answer is that most of the writing staff and main cast worked extensively in theater and a lot of theater is written in a way meant to feel dense and layered
As someone who works in the corporate world of creative agencies, the language was my favorite part. They were taking trending business terms we hear daily.its like the 40 year old version of how the 20 year old kids speak. It's still just people begging for relevance
Pinky won tho, She did actually outplay them, and her decision was based on something verging on real human/ maternal instinct. Like her mother, cold but caring. Amazing show, glad I held out for so long to binge it. Made the deal so much juicier.
I used to chauffeur quite a bit for various rich buttholes around NYC and I did not bat an eye with how they talked. I would say the amount of swearing is on point too. Just a new level of vulgarity is unlocked once you’re in the billions club 😂
Ye this is why the show strains my autism - which is also why I’m never working in business lmao But also, I thought this would be about how everyone seems to have the same little verbal tics like saying “nut-nut” instead of “nuts” and almost always asking “yeah?” for confirmation and never “ok?” or “right?”
Brilliant video. I binged the first two seasons and then followed 3 and 4 as they released, so the two halves of the show have always felt a bit separate to me. Very nice seeing this analysis of the show as a unified whole - it makes it all feel more cohesive.
Jesse Armstrong is so good at capturing character through dialogue and their linguistic choices. You can see it i Peep Show as well. Jeremy is insecure slacker who wants to feels successful and insightful, and grabs at words often in a nonsensical way quite similar to Greg just to try and fill the air when he has to. Mark is just insecurity with a coat of intellectualism over the top and relies heavily on his intellect to feel superior via historical references to intentionally confuse people like Jez who he sees as below him
No one is listening to what you are saying, Everyone is listening to what you are doing, Your only protection from everyone acting, is sewing doubt. I love watching these conversations because you can see both characters guarding against one another, while knowing what is really being said. One scene I recall is Shiv and Sandy; season 3, retired janitors
"It's a fight for a knife in the mud". Plus Roman at the end with the "We are all bullshit". So many great lines, but the old man nailed it with some Shakespearean level poetry.
I think the show just stays on the right side of trying to be too clever for it's own good. In real world people can rarely come up with sharp analogies or witty put downs on the fly like this. The other show I would compare is 'Billions' which has truly jumped the shark on it's ridiculous and obscure cultural references, the dialogue is too unnatural.
Folks. I did it. Even though I have the Succession DVD box, I ordered the Blu-Ray box :D It was re-released back in August this year. LOVE IT! Thanks making such a epic video about the epicness of Succession :)
No one ever says a complete sentence or thought. It’s always a stutter Except for Logan, everyone speaks the same way. Yet somehow we understood. Clever.
Fantastic breakdown of something I also had been wondering about with this show. The dialogue is my biggest draw to the show. Most the time, I ain’t a clue what the hell is being said, but I’m so hooked on every word because it makes no sense to me. Another great show with amazing dialogue that’s more understandable is “Justified.”
I understood every word and creative verbal joke, but it's all so fast I would watch each episode 2 or 3 times to catch everything just because of the speed.
NUTNUT my favorite expression from kendal, it just comes out of nowhere and is like purely randomly doubled, I use it all the time now dads goin nut nut
what's your favourite Succession line??
pillage the village
Usually Succession's best lines are witty and acidic snappy lines. With good reason, as they're fantastic. Who forgot Logan belting "He ate my fucking chicken. What's next, stick his cock in my potato salad?"
Somehow, the one that stuck with me is the from the same episode the devastating one Tom said to Shiv during the yacht vacation : "I just wonder if the sad I'd be without you is less than the sad I get from being with you."
Woof... Woof
It's not that lemony - STOP putting LEMON in his EYES GREG
He's on maneuvers
I've always found it interesting that Succession is completely character driven. Plot points, buyouts, business deals, etc. are only relevant to the show because they create situations where the characters have to adapt, fight, switch teams, etc. When you're that rich, there isn't really material consequences, only personal ones.
I think that's just a good observation. And I think that's why I love the show so much!
Exactly! At first I was bothered by that, but I understood that all that wealth works as a tool, a narrative asset. Without material problems, the actors can develop their characters to the infinite
Only the characters are bad, unrealistic, have no arcs and no development, so the show is pointless lol.
Great point. When Kendall fired everyone and was spit on, that was maybe the closest to the outside world causing a consequence to one of them, and you can see that is what shocks him, not the action itself. (Also, I've only seen this show via shorts, so I'm ripe to be 'actually'd'.)
are the characters bad and show no development? maybe. is that unrealistic? if you live in a utopia, perhaps@@pedro.gandra
i knew my brain was broken when i nodded with Kendall over that $5 million mausoleum bit being a "good deal"
LOL
Same . I nodded like I would do the same lol
Yeah when Con bought the apartment from Marcia, I was like “$63 Million?!? Absolute stealllll”
Thank God i wasn’t the only one! 🤣 jeeeez
Lol, shit I thought it was too 😂
Line of the show:
"You can't make a Tomlette without breaking a few Gregs"
Absolute funniest line - I cackled the first time Gil Eavis said it
I accept your blackmail
I came here to say this 😂
their banter is fucking awesome
As a former finance worker who led regular meetings with trustees, legal counsel and chief ___ officers, I can confirm people in that sphere 100% talk this way (albeit with less swearing). It was like playing 3 chess games at once. This show was a salve on the scars caused by the doublespeak (and double-think?)
Eh it’s not that hard to understand they use pretty simple words so you can get what they’re trying to say 90% of the time
No one talks like that in real life. Stop lying, you sad attention seeker.
@@benjaminford1067it’s not really the words as much as it’s the syntax.
As an Australian who works mostly with CFOs, the swearing is accurate for our country 😂
Umm. Stop. No one believes rich parasites are bright. Because they aren’t. They’re dim, over-confident nitwits. Don’t fall for the over-confidence. Behind closed doors they beg to be spanked.
Logan Roy "smart people know what they are"
Roman "You are BS, we are all BS"
I guess Roman was smart all along.
😂
Well not all along. He’s finally reached that epiphany I’d say just in time.
@@widowswail888 I think he did know all along though. I think all the siblings knew and just desperately wanted it not to be true, so they never accepted it.
Roman was the wittiest one all along
I mean he's dumb but he's smart lol
The wild thing about the show is at the end of the day they aren't really talking about anything. It's all anticipation of something big and meaningful happening but nothing concrete happens. Really the kids just wanted love and never got it the way they needed it. You have to wait entire seasons just to see someone get a hug that feels like it has any substance to it.
this is so true. i saw a tweet that said no one really loses anything in succession; there's big fights and squabbles but the characters always end up in the same limbo, going in circles and trying to win while never facing the consequences of their actions. another reason why they're all so miserable
It’s the story of capitalism. Look at diddy he’s the worst capitalist but look at his friends they’re all the same. Other industries are run by perverts too I’m quite sure. It’s a man’s world, not many women rape just saying
It often seemed like Greg was the only one doing any actual work, whenever Tom would burst into his office and go psycho at him lol. God knows what he did, though, probably causing disasters at the theme parks from his computer.
Tom did kind of start working when he became head of ATN. The rest of them are always just trying to buy another company or backstab each other to be CEO
As someone who left the corporate culture after getting sick of it, this exactly how most brand managers and directors talk. They just think they're more impressive when they can't be understood. 😂
as a non native english speaker i got lost so many times while binge watching this show. This a masterpiece
yeah, same here
Final season wasn’t good.
@@kyleconnor2759 The ending was horrible and (SPOILER)))))))) Logan's death was waaaay too soon. I kinda of lost interest when he was gone.
@@moonbeeps agreed. The final season was way off. It’s being lauded because people don’t want to admit it fizzled badly.
@@moonbeeps apparently they wanted to portray it more realistically, how a parent or loved one often dies unexpectedly and unceremoniously and when their loved ones aren’t nearby.
This doesn’t really fit the tone of the show, so I think it was a bad choice and also think it happened way too early. Still a good show overall, especially seasons 1 and 2
I work for a CFO, I can confirm he loves it whenever he explains something in a way that no one understands
I work in tech and this is just high-level corporate speak lol. you hear stuff like “I need to get altitude on this situation” or “potential upside is mitigated by the situational margins” all the time.
@wrenguitar2813 Can’t imagine what you must tolerate on a daily basis. Hard [and fun] enough to keep learning new languages and frameworks then to add on the interpretation of kooky corporate speak.
@@cUser691 it can be quite annoying at times haha but usually it’s not too bad, you learn the ropes pretty quick (doesn’t help that the environment is sink-or-swim)
I was in the same environment and pretty sure most people were only pretending to understand and wouldn't be able to explain back. Since nobody is ever asking, that is fine. It's 90% conceptual and almost exclusively dealing in imagery. I found it fascinating
The latter sentence does notake any sense. Why would upside be mitigated?
This is absolutely fantastic. I love the concept of "real people" or "serious people" and how their mindset essentially unpersons people based on how they are percieved. Like the finale of "we are bullshit" is the ultimate realization that they themselves are not "serious" or "real" people.
Yup, and then of course there is the lowest of the low… NRPI
Wild. Awesome show!
This is the best thing I've ever read
Exactly, when you're not serious nothing is real and you can do whatever you want.
Yes. I think Roman can finally acknowledge it because his father is gone. They are spoiled brats who actually could be enjoying a comfortable life instead of trying to be powerful too. Shiv was doing very well before she was dragged into the whole family business. But obviously Logan messed them up so much emotionally that they can’t see it, they can’t be happy without their dad’s approval so they end up like circus monkeys jumping up and down to entertain Logan, trying to be something they are not.
I've unfortunately worked in so many places like this where people never say they mean and deny what they agreed to. I just stopped believing what what was coming out their mouth and kept everything via email and Slack. It's a perfect illustration of WASP speak. Best quote from this video, "Vagueness is a weapon." It absolutely is for those who lack of a moral compass and who emprace a transactional way of life.
So well put. Reminds me of Elon Musk and his endless promises of things that are “coming soon” or things he’s “looking into”. Vagueness allows him to backpedal, constantly.
In short: hyper sociopathy
The truth is that no one knows what they are doing. Including people at the top, but the top are the ones with the power/task of big decision making. So they make decisions, but no one wants to take the accountability for when a decision ends up wrong. So its a game of passing the accountability to others through vagueness and denial. Is it wrong? That's hard to say. Again - no one knows what they are doing, but decisions have to be made.
My old boss was like this…. I may or may not have a legal case building against him as we speak lol
Im sorry, what is wasp? Im not english. I know the word wasp is kinda like bee. But i dont think its the real meaning in this.
The main reason why I watch the show with Spanish subtitles is because they make a terrific job at translating these weird expressions to understandable language 😅
i'm gonna have to try watching the show that way! yeah all these characters mostly talk in corporate-legal-pr doublespeak, any method of translation for what these characters do and say is invaluable
No me digas! I was wondering how on earth they would properly translate this show, since it plays around so much with English to begin with. Which dialect would you say they translate into: peninsular, Mexican?
@@GiantPetRat pues el dialecto del español corporativo es igual de horrible 😢 y mezclan muchísimo inglés ya de por si
Tom and Greg's 'We here for you" is atop art of subtlety in a metaphor 😂
We hear for you
Not a metaphor, though.
Yeah the use of buzzwords was funny and frustrating at the same time. I never heard people at work speak like this, maybe because i'm not in a high level position that requires riddle to communicate, idk.
Also, i noticed the way Matsson speak depends on who he's talking to. He's an obnoxious tech billionaire with Ken, he's a misunderstood awkward guy with Shiv, a condescending bored apathetic rich guy with Roman, a straight forward businessman with Logan, a domineering control freak with Tom. He creeped me out 😅
That is a very good abservation on Matsson. It's like he's switching personalities on-the-fly.
So true!
That's the trait of a sociopath. Chameleons.
everyone talks differently with different people. You wouldnt speak to you parents the same way you'll speak to your friends.
True, but most people can't precisely fine-tune their personality to appeal to the individual in front of them, which is what pushes Matsson into the relms of a sociopath. That and his complete lack lack of empathy for people who are grieving.
For me, much of the relational dialogue in Succession is classic ‘narcissist word salad’. If you search for Narcissist word salad, there are many videos explaining what it is and how it sounds. I’d say it’s a conscious character choice by the writers and not just Jesse’s writing style.
Narcissist word salad? Think you're just talking about some complicated airflow there
@@kshamwhizzle6544found the guy who has never listened to JP but feels the need to comment on him anyway
@@Sockem1223 I liked some of his work, but he seems unhinged now. He literally fried his brain through drug addiction and experimental medical procedures in Russia.
Charlie Sheen’s coked out manic interview is a great example
@@BMABEEEEThe sanest Canadian psychologist:
Vagueness being used as a weapon to shift the reponsibilitly to the minon is something i experience every day with my manager who artfully says a lot while saying nothing... and it's always on me to figure it out because if i ask questions then I don't get it.
I work in Corporate Tech. Succession-speak is really just a jaded, sarcastic, vulgar version of actual business / corporate-speak, but the latter exists for a reason. There are important, nuanced concepts that are unique to, or much more common in business contexts, and metaphorical language is developed to reference or illustrate those learned lessons. I could say, "let's not test every possible scenario, because not only is that unnecessary, but it would take far too long, require far too many engineering hours and pull resources away from other efforts", or I could just say "let's not boil the ocean". This is just one example of the hundreds of useful turns of phrases that compress information into fewer words. The downside of corporate-speak is that not everyone understands it equally, resulting in a breakdown in communication. It can also be deployed intentionally to remain vague on project goals or progress.
hmmmmm- as someone who has never worked anywhere even close to the corporate world - I was in the arts, haha - I find that really interesting. But here's my question - is "business/corporate speak" spontaneously metaphorical or is it a language of its own with regularly used catch-phrases and expressions? Because on Succession it sounds like the words are just tumbling out of their mouths and I'm thinking "they are pretty damn brilliant for shallow idiots" !! I guess the writers have elevated it, so in the real world they aren't really that creative or imaginative...?!! Because if everyone in the business world could so easily come up with the inventive turn of phrases that Succession characters come up with (including Roman's gross, inappropriate, rude, and hyper-sexual ones!) they should be writers themselves!! (The first time through I couldn't stand Roman's non-stop disgusting verbal diarrhea; the second time I watched I guess I was inured to it because then I just had to marvel at how funny and creative he was in his revoltingness, haha!)
or you could just say 'testing all scenarios would require too many resouces'. The metaphor isn't the only option.
@@elliott9628 Humans generally prefer making up idioms instead of sounding like a robot
@@elliott9628 But it doesn't pack the same emotional punch. There's a reaction to the exaggeration of "boiling the ocean". Drives the sentiment much more effectively than a "testing all scenarios would require too many resources". One is heard, the other is FELT.
I think of it as analogous to generational slang. shared experiences and communication channels result in phrasing/metaphors that are particularly good at distilling meaning learned from those experiences. they also connote an in-group status to help build relationships
but with corporate speak I wonder if the nebulous/abstract concepts like
- markets
- capital
- power
- real vs transactional relationships
result in their slang being equally abstract and sometimes only an "implication of meaning"
Whatever Kendall says something he goes overboard to sound like someone who knows what they’re talking about, because he’s insecure to be looked down upon.
Rome doesn’t understand the base of human emotions so he try to explain his point with as many references he can come up with
And Shiv tries to distance herself from the narrative to disguise her own thoughts and opinions behind a wall of objectiveness because she fears that people won’t listen to her if she isn’t being 100% factual.
I really like the way they talk makes me feel like i should read more
Lol, so true mate
Wait is this the guy from skillup?
Makes me feel like I should argue more. LOL!
British people in general make me feel this way
It so much easier when it's outlined ahead of time and you have time to rehearse and modify it. No one get's that kind of help and time in real life. But it's great for a TV Show.
I work in design and there's definitely a real obsession with language for marketing and ceo types. There's definitely a code that you have to speak, those all important buzz phrases which are constantly changing. It's definitely a symptom of the vapidity of corporate culture.
Something Important that you didn't overtly mention (although I assume you're implying it by those last two quotes by Logan) is that Logan speaks the EXACT opposite of this style of speech. And I think it's meant to showcase just how direct and meaningful his words are, and why he cuts through all the bullshit that these people otherwise are waist deep in at all times. It's also why the show and these kids just fall right off the rails after his death.
He definitely does talk like this tough
Um, no. He's the biggest bullshit-talker in the show. But he's the best at it because he can present it as "honest, direct" speech. He's so damn good at it that even some of the show's audience fell for it.
@@misssoso5859 To clarify, I'm not saying he's more truthful, simply the way he gets across his lies is the polar opposite of the style presented in this video Although I do genuinely think he is speaking more from experience than ANYONE else around him. He is a dying breed for sure.
I feel like the kids are the “anti-Logan” in a lot of ways, but there are definitely similarities in their metaphors and vague commands.
Except - because he’s clearly had a long and storied career, and he’s actually had to work/battle to get to his position - Logan hides a lot of his vagueness in parables and anecdotes, which gives the illusion of it being trustworthy, wise and direct, rather than manipulative and deceptive.
Also - words only carry as much weight as the person delivering them, and Logan clearly had a lot more influence/respect/power than the kids ever will - so his phrasing, no matter how similar to the kids, are received through a different filter.
Just my read on it! It’s definitely an interesting point.
@@SceneItReviews Yeah, I think I'd remove the part about his words not being bullshit, but I DO believe he is the antithesis of this type of speech. Even if his own method of speaking ends up with the same results. He does it in his own way. And like you said, with more weight carried behind them.
Thanks for the response, have loved your Succession videos.
It's funny, because I'v'e always thought everyone spoke weird minus Logan (at least most of the time for Logan). I think it's because he grew up poor so he didn't grow up with an entitled superior attitude from the beginning, as opposed to the kids which is why they speak differently to sound superior to others.
his children are too dense to even think in cliches
or, rather, they are too vacuous
Logan was more direct but he also spoke in riddles. He rarely ever confirm or deny what he's saying. It's always left in the open so he can change his mind later.
@@Manganization " It's always left in the open so he can change his mind later."
This is brilliant actually LOL the kids try to emulate this and fail miserably over and over again
exactly... logan has all my respect but his entitled little brats annoy me. especially shiv's speaking gestures and romans humiliation rituals for their employees
Also it's so if someone overhears they won't know what the conversation is about
Yeah it’s all smoke and mirrors. Absolves them of any responsibility and therefore accountability.
"Talk Money to Me" reminds me of one line that really stood out to me which was when the sibs got together to try to tell Kendall they love him after he nearly drowned himself in the pool, Connor goes "we love you Ken", Kendall goes "What's the angle here?"
I've grown tired of the "short video essay" format about popular media, but this video was a cut above. So good.
Really good insights.
Their (the Kids) use of Language/'Lexicon' is on brand with the new generation, tech-style of communication. It is largely confounding for me, though nonetheless fascinating and a necessary exposure to this new world way of thinking and operating. I'm thankful to the writers for providing an educational glimpse into it...
If Elon Musk and Pewdiepie had a child, that child would be 100% Lukas Matsson 😂😂😂
Yes!! On point! 😄
The short version: it's corporate speak. Corporate English is a distinct language from Colloquial English and is intended to speak with a emotionally distant tone that instead emphasizes the importance of economic and business cultural values.
And it's not wonder Chat GPT is so good at corporate speak. There's so much of it and one of the most valuable aspects of corporate speak is the ability to say little while evoking good feelings.
that’s right. it’s used to inculcate capitalist values and force the mind into seeing capitalism as the one truth.
I never thought anyone on the show talked weird, it just felt normal to me for the tone of the show and the setting.
Same
Kinda corporate, broish, hip hop-ish, super upper class vernacular
Stuck between identities.
Soprano's had the most realistic dialog to me
I feel like I've just been stabbed in the heart
Definitely. It’s such a large part of what makes it my favourite show. Characters don’t ever sound overly snappy and witty to the point of being obnoxious and unrealistic like they sometimes do in Succession.
They often struggle to find the right thing to say, they stumble over themselves when they try to talk, they often make mistakes like using incorrect phrasing and malapropisms. They interrupt and talk over each other, and experience the sorts of misunderstandings you’d expect people to regularly experience in real life.
When they talk subliminally or in code, it’s for a practical reason (avoiding self-incrimination when discussing illegal business), not just as a character quirk or an attempt to make the dialogue sound more intelligent. The writers on The Sopranos achieved a level of realism and believability in the character interactions that no other show I’ve seen has quite been able to live up to.
@@kidnameless You know Quasimodo predicted all this...
@@kidnameless The Wire though
Justified is also up there with amazing dialogue
This. I'm wondering why am I so invested even tho I don't fully understand business speak. Same thing happened when I watched The Big Short. I am so fascinated with the combination of business technical terms and almost poetic descriptions of things.
Yeah. Kind of like watching old Star Trek with their sci-fi babble
Wow. Great video. Student of language here and the way people use it to cover up how they really feel and you nailed it here!
I am a linguist and listen every second to how people communicate verbally, and this just blew me away every episode
As someone who’s father was a bank executive and who currently works in consulting, “corporatespeak” is kind of my native language. The whole point is to get a point across while denying the culpability directness brings and making every decision “logical” and “strategic” to purposely detach yourself from the human element.
good analysis, loved the edit, the soundbites were great for exemplifying what was being explained. Great job.
I love when you look at cinema and TV with a telescope, to point at patterns across movie or an actor. And I also love it here's when you pull out your microscope to zoom in on smaller details.
Not only their output on all facets of life, from business deals to the most intimate details, is transactional, it's also always on the view of winner/loser.
You must crush someone, vanquish them, extricate your gain from them. Or, if they got what they want, it means they beat you.
Oof, that sounds exhausting. And I've worked with people like that in the corporate world. They were usually certified sociopaths with no consideration for people whatsoever.
Congrats on capping this series with panache and verve!
thanks Bruno! yeah, i've met people in offices who were definitely...."lacking", shall we say, in empathy.
what did you think of the finale??!
@@SceneItReviews I'm not one of those who were "rooting" for this and that character to win. It did happen during the show, but mostly because I wanted them to defeat Logan, not because intrinsically Shiv/Kendall/Roman deserved it.
For the end, I wanted them to get a final scene as siblings, because those are so fantastic, and we got two, the Dad video and the Meal For for a King one. Splendid.
And I also wanted them to be crushed miserably. Ideally, caused by all the wrongdoings they did over the past years. And boy, was I ever satisfied on that point!
I'm only missing a final Gerri-Roman scene (which I'm sure they filmed and had to cut), and perhaps Marcia, although her swift absence was by itself so revealing about her, no line could come out any colder.
What about you?
Loved it!
Really enjoyed the Meal for a King scene because it gave a nice parallel to the ‘boat scene’ from the end of Season 1 - showed that despite the backstabbing, they’ll always be family, and also gave a wholesome moment for the cast to say goodbye.
Also loved that no one really “won” - a sobering reminder that they’re all pretty terrible people, and their motivations for retaining the company only boiled down to pride/selfishness/“so that other terrible guy doesn’t get it”. They were all given so many opportunities to “get out”, move on, and work together as a family throughout the season, and instead they chose self destruction.
Couldn’t have asked for more, really! Will be forever on my television Mount Rushmore probably. Looking forward to seeing what the talented cast goes on to do 😇
Caroline: "This is Marsha. She was my Carrie".
And Marsha at the funeral, sitting with Logan's harem: "At least he won't be grinding his teeth tonight."
"tell him that I'm going to run up off the fucking beanstalk" is possibly the best line of dialogue ever.
My favorite lines and expressions I've heard on Succession:
Let us get our ducks in a row
Now it's my time to habeas the corpus
Everything everywhere is always moving, forever
Soups on! People
We didn't get you from a hiena farm
Come homeward
I'm not gonna chase him around the party like a schoolgirl with a crush
Age Before Beauty. Oh, no, please, shit Before The shovel
Go AWOL
It was eventful
I've burned villages and overthrown governments in your behalf
My nearest and dearest
I'm between the devil and the deep blue sea
Honey Badger
It's not in my best interest
I can't see the bottom of the pool
It’s just Jesse Armstrong’s dialogue style.
Exactly the same in PeepShow.
I think the closer Armstrong project is The Thick of It - S2E10 of Succession has a lot of similarities to the select committee episode of Thick of It for example - it mines humour from the same joke (hilarious private emails being read out to a government committee). This isn't a criticism of it at all - I think Armstrong is a genius.
Yeah, this is a well put-together video but I think in reality, Succession's dialogue is just the Peep Show/Fresh Meat template with more corporate lingo stuck in
@@ConfusedProud I totally agree!
I work in tech, have worked at a couple fintech and crypto startups and fortune 500 companies, All of this makes sense to me. I've been in this space for 8 years and I've heard all of this at some point in that time. It is... something.
i don't think i ever found it weird. it's just pretty standard linkedin/businessbro talk overdone. it's pretty common to use this kind of speech to make fun of them reinventing really simple and basic things, it's the official out of touch language
Great video analysis, the writing on the show is like nothing else I’ve seen
You should watch others works written by Jesse Armstrong. The Thick of It has many amazing lines, but it's a full comedy satire
Never has a show blended comedy with drama so well
@@sidsrivastava6987 Breaking Bad, Better Call Saul.
This series is incredible! It seems that the strength of authorship of a good director was divided and leveraged between the screenwriters, the actors and the art department. ❤
Funny because I just started watching this show and then you post this. Great timing. I was wondering this so badly, the way they talk is so awkward.
Edit: It reminds me of Knives Out when they realize their billionaire is actually stupid but they all believe he's smart because he has money but he literally makes up words because he has no idea and instead steals others.
Yeah, watching Knives out, Edward Norton kept using phrases and words that I, too, thought were wrongly used, I was confused, in fact, at aome point I started to doubt myself thinking, maybe I'm not aware of the expanded use, but It just didn't sit right with me up until the end of the movie when the Detective, to my relief, pointed the absurdity of it all. It was pretty smart and comical what the writers did with that angle of the storyline. 😂😂
the real answer is that most of the writing staff and main cast worked extensively in theater and a lot of theater is written in a way meant to feel dense and layered
As someone who works in the corporate world of creative agencies, the language was my favorite part. They were taking trending business terms we hear daily.its like the 40 year old version of how the 20 year old kids speak. It's still just people begging for relevance
That's why I love the ending; all of them suffers. 🎉
Tom won tho
@@gherve222 Tom and his Sporus (Greg)
@@williamalfonso1373 and Roman
Pinky won tho,
She did actually outplay them, and her decision was based on something verging on real human/ maternal instinct.
Like her mother, cold but caring.
Amazing show, glad I held out for so long to binge it.
Made the deal so much juicier.
Everything is code in this f-ing show.
I used to chauffeur quite a bit for various rich buttholes around NYC and I did not bat an eye with how they talked. I would say the amount of swearing is on point too. Just a new level of vulgarity is unlocked once you’re in the billions club 😂
Ye this is why the show strains my autism - which is also why I’m never working in business lmao
But also, I thought this would be about how everyone seems to have the same little verbal tics like saying “nut-nut” instead of “nuts” and almost always asking “yeah?” for confirmation and never “ok?” or “right?”
No one speaks like this in the corporate world, and I actually work in finance (investment banking).
Correct. The family seemed inbred.
Same lol and agreed
sometimes whenever i hear dialogue from succession my brain is not braining. i thought i was the only one
0:48 😂😂😂😂😂 i want to see how people reacted in the background
Brilliant video. I binged the first two seasons and then followed 3 and 4 as they released, so the two halves of the show have always felt a bit separate to me. Very nice seeing this analysis of the show as a unified whole - it makes it all feel more cohesive.
I think this is what makes Logan saying you're not serious people so impactful. It's actually to the point.
You can't say there's gonna be "minor" spoilers, then include Shiv's eulogy for Logan
Awesome videos ! Your analyses are brilliantly spotted! Congrats
This was a super interesting and unique take! Subscribed, your channel is underrated!
Jesse Armstrong is so good at capturing character through dialogue and their linguistic choices. You can see it i Peep Show as well. Jeremy is insecure slacker who wants to feels successful and insightful, and grabs at words often in a nonsensical way quite similar to Greg just to try and fill the air when he has to. Mark is just insecurity with a coat of intellectualism over the top and relies heavily on his intellect to feel superior via historical references to intentionally confuse people like Jez who he sees as below him
Best succession video I’ve seen since the final
No one is listening to what you are saying,
Everyone is listening to what you are doing,
Your only protection from everyone acting, is sewing doubt.
I love watching these conversations because you can see both characters guarding against one another, while knowing what is really being said.
One scene I recall is Shiv and Sandy; season 3, retired janitors
"The bear is sticky with honey." - Gavin Belson
Mark fisher’s concept of “business ontology”
Where did he write about that? I have his ghosts of the future and capitalism realism books, is it in one of those?
@@marlboroprime657 I know for sure he mentions business ontology in capitalist realism
@@punchgod thank you!
Its an incredibly ambitious compliment to Musk in comparing him to Madsen...
"It's a fight for a knife in the mud".
Plus Roman at the end with the "We are all bullshit".
So many great lines, but the old man nailed it with some Shakespearean level poetry.
Killer video man! I usually don’t noticed the script in video essays like this but you had some well worded points. Keep it up 🤙🏼
Being a non-native English speaker, this show was somewhat hard to understand at times...
Kendall talks like Bojack Horseman, if Bojack were the failson of a corporate robber Baron
Nan Pierce is iconic....she's direct, firm, insufferable....no misunderstanding that woman.
She literally says she finds the negotiations disgusting, fakes a headache and forces them to give her the best deal.
This is terrific. You nailed it.
Bring ambiguous is an important leadership skill
While I was watching I did wonder who in this world speaks the way they do.
wish this video and others on your channel had captions!
0:28 OMFG!!!!! Thats an INSANE amount of power
I know I was clueless and just went with the white noise all season because yeah fast-talking business guys were talking.😏
I think the show just stays on the right side of trying to be too clever for it's own good. In real world people can rarely come up with sharp analogies or witty put downs on the fly like this. The other show I would compare is 'Billions' which has truly jumped the shark on it's ridiculous and obscure cultural references, the dialogue is too unnatural.
Transatlantic banter (content and speed not the accent)
Folks. I did it. Even though I have the Succession DVD box, I ordered the Blu-Ray box :D It was re-released back in August this year. LOVE IT!
Thanks making such a epic video about the epicness of Succession :)
amazing video man, you nailed it!
Someone should count the # of times characters in succession say “yeah” the screenwriters’ favorite word 😂
Yeah?
Definitely not. I’ll bet if you counted the times the F word was used, you’d surely lose. 😂
I was looking for this comment! Lol I can’t unhear it. Pretty sure its the british writers to blame 😂
I think we should give it a try, yeah?
Ugh my hubby keeps pointing this out and repeating "yeah" everytime a character says it...
Nothing like a fictional character to make actual people feel less intelligent with the most ridiculous babble.
it's almost like obscure Yoda finance speak. kind of backwards with riddles and interpretations.
No one ever says a complete sentence or thought. It’s always a stutter Except for Logan, everyone speaks the same way. Yet somehow we understood. Clever.
if you watch peep show--another jesse armstrong show--you can see them speak in the same way. it's hilarious in both shows.
I'm so used to the show that the language isn't even weird to me lol
❤❤❤ just started watching now and I'm hooked ❤❤❤
When Logan dies and Roman shows them the stock drop and say “that’s dad” was dark as shit
I just learned that Vampire Erik is in Succession. I may need to finish watching it.
Fantastic breakdown of something I also had been wondering about with this show. The dialogue is my biggest draw to the show. Most the time, I ain’t a clue what the hell is being said, but I’m so hooked on every word because it makes no sense to me.
Another great show with amazing dialogue that’s more understandable is “Justified.”
When Greg was worried about an "attack child" breaking into the room during a lockdown!
i kept wondering why they spoke using words that made no sense together as terms. it was clearly a great stylistic choice
This is simply American business talk for ya.
Im in corporate, so I completely understand their language haha 😂
I understood every word and creative verbal joke, but it's all so fast I would watch each episode 2 or 3 times to catch everything just because of the speed.
brilliant video, well-titled
NUTNUT
my favorite expression from kendal, it just comes out of nowhere and is like purely randomly doubled, I use it all the time now
dads goin nut nut
This video is absolutely fascinating!!!