As someone living in an area with relatively high energy prices, I'd love some tests with Idle, low/medium and heavy load powerdraw from the cpu or even preferably the platform.
The behaviour of my Ryzen 5 5500 B450 system with a 550W Seasonic Gold that i built is a little absurd on a wall power meter, apparently caused by the Seasonic if i were to guess. Looks like the Seasonic just shuts down its PFC circuit cold once in a while if you're not drawing much power, as the wall power meter shows flat zero with a 50W blip once every 2-3 seconds. I'm not sure i trust these readings, i think my GTX970 desktop-idles at around 20W at least, driving a 1440p 120Hz 10-bit desktop on one monitor and 1080p60 on another. But it does seem to indicate that the Ryzen system at least the mainboard CPU portion of it has a very lean idle, leaner than i've seen on an Ivy Bridge i5-3570 running the same PSU, which was well above 50W with that same GTX970 and those same monitors and desktop setup.
For performance and power consumption I've moved to the small that you're finding it the five to $600 range. I forget the one I have right now but it's it's power at 35 w at full load. And I'm able to play the similar to your games that he was showing.
if ur running the xeon 24/7 like server would, of course it will be higher but then runnning those xeons just like normal PC etc wont break your bank like buying totally new PC will
I would be interested in the power consumption figures as well as I am thinking of trying to consolidate a bunch of my systems down to a dual Xeon server and then virtualise pretty much everything else.
Xeons usually have a bunch of cache, which is great for gaming performance. This and the large memory bandwidth is probably a large part of the better than expected gaming performance.
@@uruacufutsal1 Most modern games utilize more than 4 cores nowadays. They certainly won't utilize 14 but saying they only use 4 isn't accurate anymore.
@@uruacufutsal1 actuallly that was long ago most modern games ar usinng more core's/threads since gpus are getting strounger cpus need to try to compinstate for the bottlenecking in games
Part of what makes Xeon processors a little more robust against aging versus the consumer CPUs at the same time is the cache size. The Xeon E5-2667 v4 has 25MB of cache while the i7 6700k only has 8MB. Clock speed is only part of the story when it comes to HPC and server focused CPU solutions.
True. I have a HPC distributed system running several old i5/Xeon 3rd gen PCs. They run databases and some python applications just fine. They were bought quite cheap and all combined have huge compute bandwidth.
I7 6850k has 15mb l3 and runs 4chan memory. Has a 3.6ghz boost to 3.8 and can run on lga 2011-3 motherboard with ecc ram , but cannot use the ecc capabilities.
I really glad you did this test and uploaded it. I've being saying for years that that older hardware is often quite capable and that the upgrade path is more profit driven than a real necessity to upgrade if one is careful with ones builds on a budget. That Xeon build is quite nice and many would be quite happy with it.
Old Network/System Admin here.... I rebuilt my Server/Desktop way back in 2016 with a used Xeon E5-2658-V3 (2011-V3 MB). At the time, that was the best bang-4-buck for serious CPU power. And... What I thought would be a future-proof setup for at least a decade. But.... Thanks to the CPU wars that have been going on since early 2022, my next upgrade depends on current pricing of used Xeons vs used Ryzens. The prices on used CPUs has been steadily dropping for months. I want maximum performance on my next upgrade. And I want better power consumption as well. That is my dilemma! Pricing vs Power-Consumption. I decided a long time ago to never pay more than $200 for any CPU. So.... When I upgrade.... If I can get an used Ryzen w/ new MB cheaper than just a faster used Xeon, I'll go AMD. Time will only tell.
I ran these xeons for quite a while for my home server. Ended up getting a 2700x though after started having issues with that system. Honestly if my motherboard didnt start killing ram sticks id still be running the dual xeon system. With the vega 64 in it I could play anything at acceptable framerates and it worked great doing dual duty as a media/file server for the rest of the house.
@@TheRogueBro I have a TrueNAS machine with 9x12TB and 3x10TB running on a Dell R510 with 2x Xeons X5680s :D "free power" at the office but still pretty old hardware still running well with 10G nics and ssds for L2 ARC even 2x 300GB SAS for boot drive redundancy
also remember, its other parts that cost extra as well. Newer gen RAM (pricing instance) is still holding me back, but at the same time finding older gen RAM is getting harder to come by. but somehow im enjoying the options, i feel like im building a little gundam every time lol
I will say, I agree with Jeff's conclusion too, but prices on places like FB Marketplace and Craigslist vary wildly, and you can get some cheap discounts for people looking to offload hardware. For example, I picked up my 3700x for $80. I got lucky, absolutely, but at least in my area it's not an uncommon price.
One thing not mentioned (apologies if I missed it) is that if you build the 3700X system then you can wait a few years and pick up a used 5800X3D for a very nice boost, if you build the X99 system your upgrade path involves a new board/CPU/RAM
@@2muchjpop we're talking gaming performance, which the 5800x3d is better at than the 5950x. But the option of 16 cores may prove quite handy especially in the future as software gets better at utilizing more cores
I don't disagree. But I think by the time that upgrade might come around for someone this budget conscious, there may already be another used platform worth upgrading to. In many parts of the world, the used B450 and R7 3700X may also not be anywhere near as cheap as in the US. And don't forget, there's now plenty of guides for getting ReBar to work with Intel and AMD GPUs on X99.
Your videos helped me to build a DL380 G8 dual xeon 2650 16c/32t 64gb with tesla K80 2x12gb graphic card with 1tb NVME drive, running VMware ESXI. With that machine.. I can run 2 windows gaming vm , running lot of games for something like 800$ . Hard to beat that price for two budget gaming pc. And.. even better... it can run a firewall, windows server and some Linux distros all at the same time.
Where are you drawing power for the 8pin connector on that gpu? It's 300w isn't it? And there are no accessible power rails in the DL380 beyond sas/sata power...
i still have a 775 Qx9770 in my delll xps m1730 with nvidia sli 9800gtx's. I use just for when my main rig goes down due to a bad windows update until its refreshed.
These Xeons shine in multi-threaded workloads. And even newer games get better at multi-threading nowadays which improves the value proposition of older high core count CPUs also for gaming. I use my Haswell-EP Xeon for gaming and code compilation on Linux. Especially if you use advanced compiler optimization techniques on a performance-oriented distribution like CachyOS that already offers x86-64-v3 repos by default, you'd be surprised at what you get: A great low-latency desktop and gaming experience on a platform from 2014.
@@poseidon3032 Yes, while the performance of 1st Gen Threadripper is similar to my Haswell-Xeon, the ecosysem is more exotic and expensive, e.g. CPU coolers and motherboards are far more widespread for X99. Also consider the NUMA-problem of 2nd Gen Threadripper.
The minimums is the only frame rate metric that ever mattered to me as well as smoothness of gameplay. I would gladly hand over better visuals in favor of smoothness any day. 60+ minimum is what is necessary, not 120 maximum FPS (I don't care!) Janky, jittery framerate irritates me to no end.
@@poseidon3032 That's why I am gaming on Linux nowadays and compile performance-sensitive packages with advanced optimization techniques (LTO+PGO) from source myself. This helped me quite a bit to reduce stutter and squeeze more juice out of my system.
@@kadupse Sure, but my undervolted Xeon boosts to 3.8 Ghz if only up to 10C/20T are utilized. So does it matter for older games or apps that are only lightly multi-threaded? No, as 3.8 Ghz is still plenty fast for these tasks. And better-multithreaded tasks profit from the available 18 cores, hence it is a great compromise between both worlds, I would say. At least for now.
Hey, X5650s were great if you wanted to upgrade your momma's computer with lots of cheap RAM so you wouldn't hear about her computer needing to be replaced for a loooooong time. :) 6-core 12-thread is far enough for that sort of usage.
Xeon power consumption isn't too bad server power consumption is due to the fans. 1366 xeons take about 150 watts at max load and most stay within that range especially only an 8 core
Power consumption will be much higher on x99 source: (i am using a i7-5820k on asus x99 pro with a gtx 1050ti with (6pin), (Total system power consuption it idles at 142w and 268w with load) Btw the processor is not overcloked yet. Power consumption will be higher with oc... Edit: ohh nvm it was overclocked 4.5ghz
@@dashtesla The price comparison becomes very different in that case. Once you swap the 3700x to ECC UDIMMs the xeon build becomes half the cost of the Ryzen.
I replied to someone else with this: I run an AMD 3700x as my main, and an HP z440 with a E5-2690 V4 (14 cores, boost up to 3.5GHz) for non gaming stuff (pictures, video, multiprocess python stuff). These values were read off my UPS display (both towers plugged into this): 3700x idle : 125-135W 3700x load : 153-207W (single-multi) cpu-z : 506/5338 2690v4 idle : 45-72W 2690v4 load : 108-180W (single-multi) cpu-z : 413/6946 The 3700x has a Radeon 6600, the z440 got my old GTX 1060. There's other stuff in the 3700x system that will use more power - more harddrives, water cooling, fans etc, though with nothing else active these additions should be minimal. It should also be noted, that I run with PBO off. My 3700x isn't going to clock up, but I've decided I'm not really CPU bound in most games really, and if I were, I don't think PBO would get be out of that hole - so I leave it off. PBO on will make the 3700x use more power on load as well. Biggest oddity is the 3700x is a 65W chip and the 2690V4 is a 135W chip. Again - I'm reading off the UPS, no overclocking. The x99 chipset might be more power hungry than the HP chipset used in the z440, but I don't think it would be too insane. Load testing was done with CPU-z.
I've got a 2667 v4 in my fileserver! Great chip for ZFS. I also have a 6950X-based workstation so I guess you could say I drank the Broadwell-E(P) kool-aid. The 6950X replaced a 1680 v2 that I had overclocked to 4.3GHz all-core (IIRC). Lots of life left in these old Xeons!
I love these Xeon comparisons and it's been so long between drinks. I built an X99 + Xeon E5 2678v3 a few years ago after one of your past builds. Upgraded it to an E5 2696v3 recently when the price of them dropped dramatically to below $100 which boosts to 3.8 GHz and you can enable the all core turbo unlock. It's given new life to my x99 platform.
@@ineligible2267 definitely. The cinebench and aida64 single thread scores are improved significantly with the extra clock speed. It doesn't maintain full turbo boost on all cores but in gaming you don't use all cores anyway so holds the 3.8 GHz nicely. I tested with an rtx 3070 and saw definite improvement in sottr and Jedi fallen order that I was playing at the time of the upgrade.
Intel naming scheme with Xeons baffles me. Like sure, 2696 is a bigger number than 2678 but how much bigger? The steps between desktop parts at least give a reasonable clue. i5 +2 cores = i7 +2 cores = i9.
This is a great video and not what I expected. Those Xeon’s performed a lot better in gaming than I expected based on their age, but the results make sense if there’s a non-CPU bottleneck in the system. And for the record, I 100% agree with the conclusion at the end. I myself am running an AMD 3700X with an RTX2070 Super, and I have no intention of upgrading anytime soon. Gaming performance is ‘good enough’, and the 3700x is overkill for 95% of my productivity tasks. We’re getting to the point where the next generation of Raspberry Pi’s - if they include current gen smartphone level graphics capability - will be perfectly suitable desktop PC’s for over half the population including budget gamers.
I recently picked up a 5600X from my local Microcenter for $160 new in box. Swapped my 2700X out for it on an X470 motherboard from the 2700X’s original build. I’d be willing to bet you could get to about the same cost with the 5600X and a board as you did with the 3700X here.
Or get a used 5700G for ~$160 on ebay. Using AM4 you could really cheap out on the motherboard as well, since you can get A320 boards for ~$50 that will run 5000 series CPUs.
@Craft Computing Very nice showing here. I really like that you kept things focused on real-world use-case scenario's and how objective & impartial you kept things. I think testing with an RTX2080 would have given some interesting results. It isn't unreasonable to think that said card would be paired with one of those tested platforms.
So when we are gpu limited, all cpus perform within margin of error.... I feel like I could have told you that. I think it gets forgotten though and I'm glad you brought up the effectiveness of these cheap older cpus. I would also like to see the difference when the 3700x has pbo enabled as it allows a large performance boost for free in lightly threaded applications like games even with a cheap cooler. I can't say I would recommend a used xeon as I find it hard to fully trust old motherboards, and the amd 5600 or 5500 can be picked up for so cheap
The fact these Xeons have a large cache and a high core count goes a long way now, especially vs when they came out. A quad core isn’t gonna cut it now, even if it’s a high clocked one like a 7700K. I’d take an 8 or 12 core with a lot of cache over a 7700K.
Those Xeon's are crazy good value for money, I use a 3700X everyday and I'm not thinking about an upgrade anytime soon. Similar performance for so cheap is super neat.
At this point, for purely gaming oriented computer the Core i3 13100 is looking really ideal for a $300 build. I believe many would appreciate a video on the subject 😉
Absolutely. I use 2697v3's in new builds. $15 a piece on eBay. board - $60 on ebay. 2400mhz reg ram ? $15 per 16gb. Been selling builds for 100$ profit w used gpu's. Great performance for the money.
excellent video, i agree on your thoughts about the gpu you decided to choose. BUT PLEASE, THROW A COUPLE OF EMULATION BENCHARMKS AS WELL NEXT TIME (pcsx2, rpcs3...) there is a great community out there willing to see some results in emulation beside gaming...
I like how you show the realistic side of hardware. The cutting edge hardware channels often fail at showing the benefits of why you should or shouldn't upgrade they get all those fancy sponsorship hardware. But do the consumer need to replace their yet or alternative upgrade paths that could easily be what is just as good for my parents I build lower cost gaming rig with slightly out dated hardware since they doing email and documentation just need it Tobe snappy. My self I prefer current gen but mid to high within reason and reuse most parts.
I buy the ever loving hell out of used Xeons on eBay. Talk about bang for the buck. Buy a barebones PowerEdge R430, drop in a couple 2690v4 Xeons, a handful of used SAS SSDs and 192GB of cheap, used RAM on eBay and boom, you have a ridiculous ESXi powerhouse with 28 cores / 56 threads on the cheap. I threw together a R420/E5-2470v2/192GB/8x800GB SAS SSDs (RAID 50) machine for the office to get out us out of a pinch and I'm currently running 21 VMs on it and it's humming along like a champ. It was intended to just be temporary to spin up virtual desktops for remote workers during Covid and would get replaced when we got new hardware ordered. It does the job so well, we never bothered to replace it.
Great video, you earned my subscription for sure! I bought an ex-office HP set up with Xeon W-2145, 64gb 2666, 512 nvme really cheap, add in a used RX6800 and it is more machine than any games I play require, for less than what a new machine with half the potential would cost.
Thanks for the tip. It never really occurred to me to investigate Xeon for my old X99 gaming rig. I was able to buy/install/upgrade my proxmox node from an 6850 6-core to the 2697 16-core for a mere $100. Best upgrade ever.
I've gotta say, I like the bench table. It is inexpensive enough that I don't mind going with it over other options, and has a good feature set. It might get a home on my bench.
In Cinebench R15 my stock 5800X3D had 242 single and 2449 multi score, but it wasn't "clean" run. I had everything running in the background. Firestrike Extreme has a score of 28895, almost same score in Ultra. Time Spy was 11527, Extreme was 5330, for those wondering. Since i use a different GPU combined score is different. Right now in Germany at least, the 5800X3D has the lowest price to date with 343€ or 312$ without tax. 2x16GB RAM 3200CL16 is ~77€ and cheap, but good B550 boards go for ~125€. So below 550€ for a high-end gaming CPU, MB and RAM. You might want to invest upto 50€ for a good cooler... You can pair this with a 6700XT for 399€, giving you a good gaming PC for around 1300€, if you don't own any PC parts. And yes for a 6700XT the 5800X3D is just a bit overkill.
I am glad that Xeons continue to be an option in the value end of things because those tech savvy enough to research what chips and boards will give them the speeds they need are usually also good at finding deals. I, however, will NEVER go back to running old xeons. I've had 2 xeon systems, a W3530 with 8GB of DDR3 and a 1620 V1 with 12GB of DDR3, and both were nothing but troubleshooting nightmares. From experience, i've decided that i'm willing to spend more money on new parts for the added peace of mind, and i'm even willing to spend the money on buying a pre-built to have someone else do tech support. That, however, does leave me running an older mid range system that's limping along thanks to FSR's slow but steady adoption into newer titles
I caught this video pretty late but I wanted to thank you anyway. it’s amazing the kind of performance you were able to get out of sub $600 box. Earlier this year I was thinking about building a 13900K/RTX 4090 gaming PC, really glad I didn’t.
One thing that high end builds don’t show is what compromises you have to make to build an $XXX pc! I’ve worked hard my life until a few years ago and been fortunate enough to build higher tier pc’s every few years on average (not super high end), but I see soooo many reviewers touting the latest and greatest and many people simply don’t shop for the top end Intel i9 / AMD 7950X w/ RTX4090 combo ($5k+ USD build) and often limit their pc builds to the $500-1000 USD price points with many going sub$400 USD requiring serious decision making and compromises on everything to get a working pc. Older tech allows many to get in on the pc gaming / productivity scene and still perform, as shown, reasonably well and can more than get you by!
I do appreciate this video. I was considering an upgrade from my 4790k refurbished business/Gaming PC and 1650 and several channels posting videos in a 2 week span have almost perfectly laid out my future plans for me for just about under 500 bucks... Now, I just need the 500 bucks.
Just about to purchase one of these Xeon rigs for a multi core Proxmox host as I’ve reached the max of my5 yo rig.. And will be following your tutorial on video pass thru for plex. You sir are a legend. Thanks..
AMEN !! I just got my Lenovo Thinkstation P520 Xeon W-2135 w/8X4 2666 Memory Sticks and included 900W Platinum PSU today... Bought an RX 6600 and 1TB NVME + 1TB SSD... and for $550(ish) - Amazing build quality... LONG LIVE USED XEONS !!!
I would have liked to see the comparison made with the 5600(X) instead of the 3700X. The 5600 non x is new even cheaper compared to an used 3700X. You could also add some GPU scaling benchmarks like Hardware Unboxed does sometimes. So test both CPUs with different classes of GPUs to see at what point a bottleneck is reached.
I finally stopped using my x58 setup as my main in late 2022 . 13 years as my main and it held up incredibly well the entire time. I upgraded the i7 920 with an oc'd xeon x5670 @4.20ghz lol
My main PC has been on X58 since 2013. First I had a W3520 (i7-920) and since 2016 an OC'd X5670 @ 4.4GHz, though currently I have a X5675 @ 4.0GHz which doesn't overclock as well as my X5670 but I've been too lazy to change it back
Just upgraded my i7-920 to an x5680 so I could use that system as a VM server (needed more ram capacity for multiple VMs). Still usable as a desktop for most of what I do at home anyway.
I would be interested in actual power usage while load. With energy price's from 50-70ct per kwh in my area, that would eliminate the 90$ difference pretty fast.
I have a Xeon 2996V4 system that I use for playing with virtualisation, my NAS, Jellyfin and email server. It's fun and it's good enough. Had the X99 board already and got 256GB DDR4 ECC RAM and the chip for like 300 so it works out really well for my usecase
Built a dual socket Xeon E5 2680 v2 system back in 2017 (still in use), now you could have the same amount of cores or even more with one socket :) Times sure have changed.
Running an overclocked 1680V2 as a main rig. Power consumption is high, but it can game at 4K, and the quad-channel DDR3-2400 has higher aggregate memory bandwidth than the vast majority of dual-channel DDR4 systems. Only now starting to consider an upgrade.
I've been on X58 platform since 2013, first with a 4c/8t Xeon W3520 (i7-920) and since 2016 overclocked 6c/12t Xeon. I do also have a X79/C600 based ThinkStation S30 with a 8c/16t Xeon E5-2690
I would love to see how old Ivy Bridge Xeons are doing on the X79 platform in 2023. They are so cheap you can buy a kit off of AliExpress for about $75 shipped. It's nuts. Hope to see some old X79 stuff soon!
Very cool machines. Love the channel. It's October 2024, and I just bought an E5-2699 v3 (18 cores, base 2.3 GHz, released Q3'14) for a whopping $40. Gonna drop it into my Asus X99 board in place of my trusty Core i7 6850K (this machine) and see what happens. I daily drive this machine, but I have many others, so if it fails, no biggie. I don't game on it, and I don't use it for any sort of serious work. I browse and do MS Office. I have no plans to run a bunch of benchmarks. It will just be a very cool thing to have on my desk.
Picked up a e5-2690 v4 a few years back for 200 and I've been loving it with it's fat cache and quad channel memory. Just slapped in an RTX A5000 and an optane L2 cache for primocache and now she's downright singing! =D
Still my daily driver is a x58. My side rig is a i7, 6th Gen laptop. Happy x5690 owner here. Handles my side work/side job editing 4K video with ease. It’s paired with a 1080ti; 2ssds, 1hdd works like a charm. About to upgrade to Lga 1700, a z690 with a Alder Lake just getting all the components and will finally assemble everything beginning of summer end of spring. Even then. My main editing rig will still be the x58. Handles my needs so well. What a beast. Who knew that a system can last 13 years?!!!!!! Really is the goat platform of the last 30 years along with a 1080ti the goat GPU of the last 20.
I have been using a dual Xeon X5690 setup on an EVGA SR-2 motherboard with a water cooling loop since 2014, and it’s still running like a charm! Amazing! Back then, both CPUs and the SR-2 cost around $2,600 USD. Nowadays, the same setup, plus 48GB of RAM and water cooling, would cost around $520.
In 2018 I bought a used Dell T5600 with dual Xeon E5-2680, 16 cores @2.70GHz, and 48GB of RAM. Total cost was $450. I like that I can keep all my productivity apps open, plus I use KDE Activities and have some builder sim games running in the second activity. When I feel like doing lab work, I can open several Windows 10 VMs along with a couple Linux VMs and do network experiments. Those Xeons are serving me well in 2023
V4s are still king when it comes to homelabbing. Having features like ECC, quad channel, tons of memory, more pcie lanes, higher core count and price makes it a good choice for that. Not to mention that you can actually have a server motherboard if you don't trust cheap x99 ones. The next upgrade is for when Epyc platform becomes cheaper.
Honestly even an X79 with an E5-1650V2 (a $16 processor) and a 4.0ghz overclock on a chinese board is still surprisingly capable, especially if you know your way around doing a resizable bar UEFI mod and something like a 3060ti. People sleep on just how capable this old server gear is.
I used to buy used Xeons to upgrade workstations at an engineering firm I used to work for. For some reason they were super tight about spending money to keep the production staff as profitable as possible but it was hard for them to argue when I was dropping $30-$40 on used CPUs and other basic stuff like SSD upgrades to junky old HDDs.
Long live Xeon. I've always been a fan of Xeon since my first xeon setup. My first Xeon setup were dual socket 603 dualcore cpu's on a Asus PC-DL . Pinmodded from original speed 2.2 ghz to 2.93ghz by cutting some pins so the FSB goes from 400mhz to 533mhz.
I would be interested to see how one of those vintage of Xeons stack up when paired with a slightly more recent GPU. thinking 3060ti or 3070ti. Wondering how much of a deficiency would result from the older PCIe revision.
Apparently not much, because while PCIe4 is 2x faster than PCIe3, the bandwidth between the CPU and GPU is rarely the bottleneck, it's throughput IOPS, and even then, most of the time the PCIe is quiet.
@@John-rw9bv Thanks John. I was thinking that would likely be the case. I've been wanting to roll a couple new systems. One as a newer gaming machine to replace my trusty but ancient HP Z400 sporting a hex core Xeon W3670 and a GTX 970. It's been a very trusty old rig for years but I want to upgrade to NVME, more and faster RAM, and of course a newer GPU.
I have a Dual Socket motherboard with (2) E5-2699V3 cpus with a 3060 (12GB version) with 256GB RAM and it runs everything just fine... I also Multibox the hell out of EVE Online.. lol
Mate, do you think an OCed E5-1680 v3 would be nice, if paired with a RTX 3060 ? (I have my old trusty 3770k, that works fine for games, but I need more PCIe lanes...)
I LOVE X99 XEONS! You didn't mention it here, but Overclocking (yes some have unlocked multipliers) I get INSANE Value out of my 1650 v3 I live stream sim racing all day with it. ( 1080p)
i love it when old high-end hardware puts up a fight! i notice the new cpu's outscore the old stuff by a huge margin in the benchmarks, but in regular daily use they just don't feel that much faster. car analogy: corvette is faster than a civic, but do you really feel the performance difference cruising at 70mph down the highway?
For anyone who saw results for the upHere tower cooler, let me share my story with the upHere RGB fan kit. The RGB controller failed within the year, but the fans are working. They just feel like they were built with cheaper components, but that doesn't mean they're horrible. I just feel like I'll be investing in a real solid proper set of case fans sooner than I'd like to. I'm sure the cooler will do good work for you, but just be aware the lifespan may not be the best long term.
The other thing you might want to look at is NAS builds. Used server SAS cards (running SATA SSDs) and 10/40G NICs running PCIE Gen3 x8 are cheap. That means at least two x8 slots which are increasingly rare on modern motherboards built for a single graphics card.
me sat here nodding in agreement with a PC with Xeon E5-1650v3 , 24gb ddr4 2133 and a RTX3060ti at 1440p. works fine for me and i got the PC free (minus the GPU) from my partners work. :)
21:37 "A lot has changed since 2017. Boy, that's a loaded statement." And with that, Craft Computing gets the award for *Understatement of the Year* 👏👏👏👏👋
@@krj15489 Interesting. I hadn't looked into it to closely recently because I'm not currently in the market for anything. Of course, that's pretty standard that you have plenty of CPU's but not as many motherboards 😀 Have run into that problem a time or two, have had a CPU lying around but can't find a decent motherboard to save my life. Now you've got me curious if full systems are also up just because of the motherboard.
I own a Dell R720 with two Xeons. I bought it for less than $300 and it came with 16GB of ram and two 500GB SAS drives. I was actually quite surprised to learn that it could idle under 100 watts with both CPU's and the SAS drives installed. Sure it's a chunk of power. But compared to the price of streaming services and cloud storage, it's been a great investment. Better than the RPi3 I was using before, even if it does consume a bit of power.
Nobody on Gods Green Earth thinks "under 100 watts" is even considered a "chunk of power". 20 years ago, people would have thought that was some form of Alien Tech verily sipping that much power.... Funny how perceptions change.
I just bought a Machinist “x99” Xeon 2670v3, 16 GB RAM combo for $100 and I was cautiously optimistic. Honestly I was really satisfied with the value of it. Add a decent graphics card, in my case a used 2080, and it’s one hell of a decent PC for around $400. Got a cheap Liontech (I think) 6 heat pipe direct contact cpu cooler with dual RGB fans for $25, and I was really surprised by how cool it runs. It’s amazing how cheap you can build a decent gaming PC for these days if you really plan it out right. Plays Destiny 2 at 4K max settings average 55-60 fps, lows 40 fps. A very playable experience.
I originally built a Xeon rig for AI applications due to its price and 40 PCIe lanes. Ended up not doing that and when I broke my main rig, I had no choice but to use it for the time being and I gotta say after flashing a custom BIOS with turbo boost unlock and resizeable BAR mod, the gaming performance is unbelievable for its age. Literally a decade old CPU and still kicking, thanks to its cache size. I agree that the power consumption is not good, owners just have to make sure they don't have it on performance mode all the time.
I love my e5-2696v3. Its absolutely overkill for what I use it for but I was able to reuse my ddr3 ram which saved me some money and the cpu and motherboard were fairly cheap. I'm hooked on Xeons, they still perform quite well if you're budget oriented and if nothing else they are very fun to tinker with.
@@deepspacecow2644 Not exactly, Intel made some off-label parts which they directly sold to specific OEMs, these specific models got both DDR4 and DDR3 memory controllers on the chip and there are some Chinese X99-DDR3 motherboards taking advantage of that. At the time I was building that rig the used DDR3-ECC-RAM prices were way cheaper, so this was a no brainer for me. You can also use these CPUs in DDR4 boards. There are even boards that have both DDR3 and DDR4 slots, as the famous Huananzhi X99-TF.
Surprised by the gaming results. Definitely cool to see that Xeon's are keeping up. I happen to have both the Xeon 2697a v4 and a Ryzen 3700x as well. For anyone interested, my Cinebench R23 multicore scores were 14132 for the Xeon and 12116 for the Ryzen. These were taken about a year ago as I no longer have the Ryzen in a PC. I have the Xeon in a home server running ESXI currently and it performs very well for that. I definitely think there was some minor IPC improvements between the v3 and v4 Xeon's. Most likely down to their change in process node from 22nm to 14nm. Definitely some good X99 options out there. However I don't see X299 being a worthwhile option anytime soon. The Xeon's for socket 2066 as still quite expensive for the higher core count versions. Although with enough time, given there are some chips that will hit over 5ghz for a Xeon, it may pick up.
I am extremely happy that I bought a few sets of both 67v4 and 97Av4 before this video dropped. I don’t know how much these will jump up in price after this video
This Xeon fashion is great for me. My main PC is an i8086k with 32GB and RTX2080 and because I play in 1080p and target 60fps, every game runs fine... I keep my older PCs and I upgraded each of them with the highest Xeon and max memory for each motherboard. For a budget, I've got a handfull of older PCs to power all my projects
1680v2 and x79 or bust. Overclocked to 4-4.5ghz and profit. Ebay and can often ask for lower prices on some of them. Think you can get them around $60-80. Match it up with a 1080ti and perfect.
I like the ideas expressed about the budget build capable Xeons and the real-world hardware aspect in this testing. However... One thing that was failed to mention was that the newer Ryzen platform has a better upgrade path for someone looking to upgrade in a couple of years. Most PC gamers (that DIY systems) will upgrade their GPU before upgrading to a new platform. The Ryzen will most likely perform significantly better than the older Xeon once you start easing up on the GPU bottleneck. Also, the RAM can be overclocked a bit more, and the storage could be potentially faster with PCIe 4.0 instead of 3.0. Couple that with the ability to drop in a 5800X3D or 5950X to max out CPU performance well beyond anything that could socket into those Xeon platforms. I like the idea of keeping old hardware relevent. As long as you have an alternate use for the Xeon system when it's time to upgrade any hardware component (that is basically going to warrant building a new system), it's a good way to go. But if you want more potential upgrade headroom where you can get a lot more performance by replacing individual components, the Ryzen system is a no-brainer IMHO.
Quick hint...IMHO you need (more) Graphics.. too many words and numbers, after a while begin to lose relative context., But your insight is palpable, brilliant and worth stopping for. Being able to see the basics easily makes picturing the hard concepts much easier. I appreciate that they take extra work, Best wishes
![PASULOL รามเกียรติ์ ตอนที่ 4 นนทกพบรัก [Ramakien Ep.4: Nonthok in love]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/tMUQgmZzf_A/mqdefault.jpg)
As someone living in an area with relatively high energy prices, I'd love some tests with Idle, low/medium and heavy load powerdraw from the cpu or even preferably the platform.
im also pretty curious to know what the difference in power consumption between these machines is. Would certainly be a neat bit of information.
The behaviour of my Ryzen 5 5500 B450 system with a 550W Seasonic Gold that i built is a little absurd on a wall power meter, apparently caused by the Seasonic if i were to guess. Looks like the Seasonic just shuts down its PFC circuit cold once in a while if you're not drawing much power, as the wall power meter shows flat zero with a 50W blip once every 2-3 seconds. I'm not sure i trust these readings, i think my GTX970 desktop-idles at around 20W at least, driving a 1440p 120Hz 10-bit desktop on one monitor and 1080p60 on another.
But it does seem to indicate that the Ryzen system at least the mainboard CPU portion of it has a very lean idle, leaner than i've seen on an Ivy Bridge i5-3570 running the same PSU, which was well above 50W with that same GTX970 and those same monitors and desktop setup.
For performance and power consumption I've moved to the small that you're finding it the five to $600 range. I forget the one I have right now but it's it's power at 35 w at full load. And I'm able to play the similar to your games that he was showing.
if ur running the xeon 24/7 like server would, of course it will be higher but then runnning those xeons just like normal PC etc wont break your bank like buying totally new PC will
I would be interested in the power consumption figures as well as I am thinking of trying to consolidate a bunch of my systems down to a dual Xeon server and then virtualise pretty much everything else.
Xeons usually have a bunch of cache, which is great for gaming performance. This and the large memory bandwidth is probably a large part of the better than expected gaming performance.
yep that's literally what he said, watch the video
And some of them can run with unlock turbo boost in ALL cores like the e5v3. A 10-14 core running at 3.3ghz is nothing to sneeze at 😊
@@chiari4833most games dont use more than 4 cores anyway
@@uruacufutsal1 Most modern games utilize more than 4 cores nowadays. They certainly won't utilize 14 but saying they only use 4 isn't accurate anymore.
@@uruacufutsal1 actuallly that was long ago most modern games ar usinng more core's/threads since gpus are getting strounger cpus need to try to compinstate for the bottlenecking in games
Part of what makes Xeon processors a little more robust against aging versus the consumer CPUs at the same time is the cache size. The Xeon E5-2667 v4 has 25MB of cache while the i7 6700k only has 8MB. Clock speed is only part of the story when it comes to HPC and server focused CPU solutions.
True. I have a HPC distributed system running several old i5/Xeon 3rd gen PCs. They run databases and some python applications just fine. They were bought quite cheap and all combined have huge compute bandwidth.
I7 6850k has 15mb l3 and runs 4chan memory. Has a 3.6ghz boost to 3.8 and can run on lga 2011-3 motherboard with ecc ram , but cannot use the ecc capabilities.
I really glad you did this test and uploaded it. I've being saying for years that that older hardware is often quite capable and that the upgrade path is more profit driven than a real necessity to upgrade if one is careful with ones builds on a budget. That Xeon build is quite nice and many would be quite happy with it.
Old Network/System Admin here.... I rebuilt my Server/Desktop way back in 2016 with a used Xeon E5-2658-V3 (2011-V3 MB). At the time, that was the best bang-4-buck for serious CPU power. And... What I thought would be a future-proof setup for at least a decade. But.... Thanks to the CPU wars that have been going on since early 2022, my next upgrade depends on current pricing of used Xeons vs used Ryzens. The prices on used CPUs has been steadily dropping for months. I want maximum performance on my next upgrade. And I want better power consumption as well. That is my dilemma! Pricing vs Power-Consumption. I decided a long time ago to never pay more than $200 for any CPU. So.... When I upgrade.... If I can get an used Ryzen w/ new MB cheaper than just a faster used Xeon, I'll go AMD. Time will only tell.
I'm still rocking an i7-3770 for homelab. Have been wanting to upgrade and waiting for used prices to be half decent in my area.
I ran these xeons for quite a while for my home server. Ended up getting a 2700x though after started having issues with that system. Honestly if my motherboard didnt start killing ram sticks id still be running the dual xeon system. With the vega 64 in it I could play anything at acceptable framerates and it worked great doing dual duty as a media/file server for the rest of the house.
@@TheRogueBro I have a TrueNAS machine with 9x12TB and 3x10TB running on a Dell R510 with 2x Xeons X5680s :D "free power" at the office but still pretty old hardware still running well with 10G nics and ssds for L2 ARC even 2x 300GB SAS for boot drive redundancy
also remember, its other parts that cost extra as well. Newer gen RAM (pricing instance) is still holding me back, but at the same time finding older gen RAM is getting harder to come by. but somehow im enjoying the options, i feel like im building a little gundam every time lol
I will say, I agree with Jeff's conclusion too, but prices on places like FB Marketplace and Craigslist vary wildly, and you can get some cheap discounts for people looking to offload hardware. For example, I picked up my 3700x for $80. I got lucky, absolutely, but at least in my area it's not an uncommon price.
One thing not mentioned (apologies if I missed it) is that if you build the 3700X system then you can wait a few years and pick up a used 5800X3D for a very nice boost, if you build the X99 system your upgrade path involves a new board/CPU/RAM
Or even a 5950x
@@2muchjpop we're talking gaming performance, which the 5800x3d is better at than the 5950x. But the option of 16 cores may prove quite handy especially in the future as software gets better at utilizing more cores
I don't disagree. But I think by the time that upgrade might come around for someone this budget conscious, there may already be another used platform worth upgrading to. In many parts of the world, the used B450 and R7 3700X may also not be anywhere near as cheap as in the US. And don't forget, there's now plenty of guides for getting ReBar to work with Intel and AMD GPUs on X99.
or an upgrade to a 22 core broadwell chip
Not true by then amd cpu already kick the bucket. Amd cpus has high fail rate.
Your videos helped me to build a DL380 G8 dual xeon 2650 16c/32t 64gb with tesla K80 2x12gb graphic card with 1tb NVME drive, running VMware ESXI. With that machine.. I can run 2 windows gaming vm , running lot of games for something like 800$ . Hard to beat that price for two budget gaming pc. And.. even better... it can run a firewall, windows server and some Linux distros all at the same time.
Perfect system since it has avx
Where are you drawing power for the 8pin connector on that gpu? It's 300w isn't it? And there are no accessible power rails in the DL380 beyond sas/sata power...
awesome
How teach me
I’m pretty sure that you can run more stuff on your setup concurrently than you think.
I'm old enough to remember the 771/775 mod, and it's great to see that old enterprise CPU's can still hold their own, even today.
LGA775 was the OG slot!
Can't say the same for AMD's Opteron
I don't think that market's about to die anytime soon.
I feel old now
i still have a 775 Qx9770 in my delll xps m1730 with nvidia sli 9800gtx's. I use just for when my main rig goes down due to a bad windows update until its refreshed.
These Xeons shine in multi-threaded workloads. And even newer games get better at multi-threading nowadays which improves the value proposition of older high core count CPUs also for gaming. I use my Haswell-EP Xeon for gaming and code compilation on Linux. Especially if you use advanced compiler optimization techniques on a performance-oriented distribution like CachyOS that already offers x86-64-v3 repos by default, you'd be surprised at what you get: A great low-latency desktop and gaming experience on a platform from 2014.
AMD Threadripper can be thought about in this scenario. It has quadchannel memory
@@poseidon3032 Yes, while the performance of 1st Gen Threadripper is similar to my Haswell-Xeon, the ecosysem is more exotic and expensive, e.g. CPU coolers and motherboards are far more widespread for X99. Also consider the NUMA-problem of 2nd Gen Threadripper.
The minimums is the only frame rate metric that ever mattered to me as well as smoothness of gameplay. I would gladly hand over better visuals in favor of smoothness any day. 60+ minimum is what is necessary, not 120 maximum FPS (I don't care!) Janky, jittery framerate irritates me to no end.
@@poseidon3032 That's why I am gaming on Linux nowadays and compile performance-sensitive packages with advanced optimization techniques (LTO+PGO) from source myself. This helped me quite a bit to reduce stutter and squeeze more juice out of my system.
@@kadupse Sure, but my undervolted Xeon boosts to 3.8 Ghz if only up to 10C/20T are utilized. So does it matter for older games or apps that are only lightly multi-threaded? No, as 3.8 Ghz is still plenty fast for these tasks. And better-multithreaded tasks profit from the available 18 cores, hence it is a great compromise between both worlds, I would say. At least for now.
Damn. Was not expecting the Xeon 2667 to pack a punch like that still. Literally a hidden gem along with its Xeon brothers
In Brazil the 2667 is a very popular choice, although many could not afford and opt for more inexpensive Xeons like 2640
Great video! I used to build X5650s and x5680s all the time with 10 series GTX GPUs. Now I learned the newer Xeons are even better for budget builds!
Hey, X5650s were great if you wanted to upgrade your momma's computer with lots of cheap RAM so you wouldn't hear about her computer needing to be replaced for a loooooong time. :) 6-core 12-thread is far enough for that sort of usage.
Gino nieves
Play old games, why cry that here ?
Need negative attention ?
@@lucasrem what the hell are you talking about? Your comment makes no sense.....troll 🧌
I love these Xeon and other "non-standard" builds. Thanks for doing them!
Would love to see power usage comparisons and some workstation workloads.
Xeon power consumption isn't too bad server power consumption is due to the fans. 1366 xeons take about 150 watts at max load and most stay within that range especially only an 8 core
The eBay cpu pricing is similar, but we can get a new am4 motherboard with like $50, seem like a much better choice.
Would be great to see the power consumption as well!
I would also like to see a comparison for server applications such as vms and zfs easy to test
Power consumption will be much higher on x99 source: (i am using a i7-5820k on asus x99 pro with a gtx 1050ti with (6pin), (Total system power consuption it idles at 142w and 268w with load)
Btw the processor is not overcloked yet. Power consumption will be higher with oc...
Edit: ohh nvm it was overclocked 4.5ghz
@@dashtesla The price comparison becomes very different in that case. Once you swap the 3700x to ECC UDIMMs the xeon build becomes half the cost of the Ryzen.
I replied to someone else with this:
I run an AMD 3700x as my main, and an HP z440 with a E5-2690 V4 (14 cores, boost up to 3.5GHz) for non gaming stuff (pictures, video, multiprocess python stuff).
These values were read off my UPS display (both towers plugged into this):
3700x idle : 125-135W
3700x load : 153-207W (single-multi)
cpu-z : 506/5338
2690v4 idle : 45-72W
2690v4 load : 108-180W (single-multi)
cpu-z : 413/6946
The 3700x has a Radeon 6600, the z440 got my old GTX 1060. There's other stuff in the 3700x system that will use more power - more harddrives, water cooling, fans etc, though with nothing else active these additions should be minimal.
It should also be noted, that I run with PBO off. My 3700x isn't going to clock up, but I've decided I'm not really CPU bound in most games really, and if I were, I don't think PBO would get be out of that hole - so I leave it off. PBO on will make the 3700x use more power on load as well.
Biggest oddity is the 3700x is a 65W chip and the 2690V4 is a 135W chip.
Again - I'm reading off the UPS, no overclocking. The x99 chipset might be more power hungry than the HP chipset used in the z440, but I don't think it would be too insane. Load testing was done with CPU-z.
@@ryancipriani5757 3700x idle seems really high, my 3600 idles just over 50w(not including monitor).
I've got a 2667 v4 in my fileserver! Great chip for ZFS. I also have a 6950X-based workstation so I guess you could say I drank the Broadwell-E(P) kool-aid. The 6950X replaced a 1680 v2 that I had overclocked to 4.3GHz all-core (IIRC). Lots of life left in these old Xeons!
You either aren’t going hard enough or you got a rubbish chip. My 1680 V2 would do 4.5ghz all core at 1.36V
@@MarshallSambell Rubbish motherboard.
@@MarshallSambell I have two 1680 V2's that do 4.7GHz @1.3 core volts or less.
Here always for these old Xeon builds! thank you for another one of these videos! Hope to see a updated dual socket videos too! :)
I love these Xeon comparisons and it's been so long between drinks. I built an X99 + Xeon E5 2678v3 a few years ago after one of your past builds. Upgraded it to an E5 2696v3 recently when the price of them dropped dramatically to below $100 which boosts to 3.8 GHz and you can enable the all core turbo unlock. It's given new life to my x99 platform.
Any significant gain in games?? I've been trying to figure out if the extra cache on the 2696v3 would be worthwhile if there's a good deal
@@ineligible2267 definitely. The cinebench and aida64 single thread scores are improved significantly with the extra clock speed. It doesn't maintain full turbo boost on all cores but in gaming you don't use all cores anyway so holds the 3.8 GHz nicely. I tested with an rtx 3070 and saw definite improvement in sottr and Jedi fallen order that I was playing at the time of the upgrade.
Intel naming scheme with Xeons baffles me. Like sure, 2696 is a bigger number than 2678 but how much bigger? The steps between desktop parts at least give a reasonable clue. i5 +2 cores = i7 +2 cores = i9.
@@ufukpolat3480 wat
@@ufukpolat3480 compare the core count and gigahertz and cachd
I bought a used Xeon E3-1270 v2 (quad core 8T) for £30 to put in my HTPC build a year or so ago, It has performed superbly!
This is a great video and not what I expected. Those Xeon’s performed a lot better in gaming than I expected based on their age, but the results make sense if there’s a non-CPU bottleneck in the system. And for the record, I 100% agree with the conclusion at the end. I myself am running an AMD 3700X with an RTX2070 Super, and I have no intention of upgrading anytime soon. Gaming performance is ‘good enough’, and the 3700x is overkill for 95% of my productivity tasks. We’re getting to the point where the next generation of Raspberry Pi’s - if they include current gen smartphone level graphics capability - will be perfectly suitable desktop PC’s for over half the population including budget gamers.
U will be lucky to get a snapdragon 845 in the next Raspberry pi
games all about GPU anyway and since consoles still rocking low-clock zen2 CPU.. we wont need faster CPU anytime soon
@@beavermml on Raspberry pi most people that game use it for emulation which is more cpu dependent than gpu.
@@StruggleBoxing emulation is a special case
If want performance on a platform like Raspberry Pie, then there are better options for that class. Most are x86-base though.
Jeff it would be great to see productivity benchmarks like video encode/decode, compression, encryption, compiler bench, etc.
I recently picked up a 5600X from my local Microcenter for $160 new in box. Swapped my 2700X out for it on an X470 motherboard from the 2700X’s original build. I’d be willing to bet you could get to about the same cost with the 5600X and a board as you did with the 3700X here.
Or get a used 5700G for ~$160 on ebay. Using AM4 you could really cheap out on the motherboard as well, since you can get A320 boards for ~$50 that will run 5000 series CPUs.
@@kisiello 5700G is Zen2 based though, afair.
@Craft Computing
Very nice showing here. I really like that you kept things focused on real-world use-case scenario's and how objective & impartial you kept things. I think testing with an RTX2080 would have given some interesting results. It isn't unreasonable to think that said card would be paired with one of those tested platforms.
So when we are gpu limited, all cpus perform within margin of error.... I feel like I could have told you that. I think it gets forgotten though and I'm glad you brought up the effectiveness of these cheap older cpus. I would also like to see the difference when the 3700x has pbo enabled as it allows a large performance boost for free in lightly threaded applications like games even with a cheap cooler. I can't say I would recommend a used xeon as I find it hard to fully trust old motherboards, and the amd 5600 or 5500 can be picked up for so cheap
The fact these Xeons have a large cache and a high core count goes a long way now, especially vs when they came out. A quad core isn’t gonna cut it now, even if it’s a high clocked one like a 7700K. I’d take an 8 or 12 core with a lot of cache over a 7700K.
Can't wait for next year's review, hopefully with EYPC 7002 F, non F, Xeon Scalable, and comparable consumer parts
Thankyou! I really appreciate your take on giving us non-traditional budget gaming options. You are filling a niche the others aren't.
Finally seeing someone doing down to earth reviews. PC hardware and reviews are about the money grab and not real world.
Those Xeon's are crazy good value for money, I use a 3700X everyday and I'm not thinking about an upgrade anytime soon. Similar performance for so cheap is super neat.
@aaronmorrow8128 I like building PC-s. ;-)
At this point, for purely gaming oriented computer the Core i3 13100 is looking really ideal for a $300 build. I believe many would appreciate a video on the subject 😉
12100f is also a great option. i have one paired with an rx6600xt and it runs great, no bottleneck
I have a 12100F. waiting for the 14100F. then this cpu goes into wifey's new machine I'll build.
Absolutely. I use 2697v3's in new builds. $15 a piece on eBay. board - $60 on ebay. 2400mhz reg ram ? $15 per 16gb. Been selling builds for 100$ profit w used gpu's. Great performance for the money.
only problem is valorant since it requires the physical tpm 2.0 module
@OwlyEagle great to know!! Thanks
excellent video, i agree on your thoughts about the gpu you decided to choose. BUT PLEASE, THROW A COUPLE OF EMULATION BENCHARMKS AS WELL NEXT TIME (pcsx2, rpcs3...) there is a great community out there willing to see some results in emulation beside gaming...
I like how you show the realistic side of hardware. The cutting edge hardware channels often fail at showing the benefits of why you should or shouldn't upgrade they get all those fancy sponsorship hardware. But do the consumer need to replace their yet or alternative upgrade paths that could easily be what is just as good for my parents I build lower cost gaming rig with slightly out dated hardware since they doing email and documentation just need it Tobe snappy. My self I prefer current gen but mid to high within reason and reuse most parts.
I buy the ever loving hell out of used Xeons on eBay. Talk about bang for the buck. Buy a barebones PowerEdge R430, drop in a couple 2690v4 Xeons, a handful of used SAS SSDs and 192GB of cheap, used RAM on eBay and boom, you have a ridiculous ESXi powerhouse with 28 cores / 56 threads on the cheap. I threw together a R420/E5-2470v2/192GB/8x800GB SAS SSDs (RAID 50) machine for the office to get out us out of a pinch and I'm currently running 21 VMs on it and it's humming along like a champ. It was intended to just be temporary to spin up virtual desktops for remote workers during Covid and would get replaced when we got new hardware ordered. It does the job so well, we never bothered to replace it.
Great video, you earned my subscription for sure!
I bought an ex-office HP set up with Xeon W-2145, 64gb 2666, 512 nvme really cheap, add in a used RX6800 and it is more machine than any games I play require, for less than what a new machine with half the potential would cost.
Thanks for the tip. It never really occurred to me to investigate Xeon for my old X99 gaming rig. I was able to buy/install/upgrade my proxmox node from an 6850 6-core to the 2697 16-core for a mere $100. Best upgrade ever.
I've gotta say, I like the bench table. It is inexpensive enough that I don't mind going with it over other options, and has a good feature set. It might get a home on my bench.
In Cinebench R15 my stock 5800X3D had 242 single and 2449 multi score, but it wasn't "clean" run. I had everything running in the background.
Firestrike Extreme has a score of 28895, almost same score in Ultra. Time Spy was 11527, Extreme was 5330, for those wondering. Since i use a different GPU combined score is different.
Right now in Germany at least, the 5800X3D has the lowest price to date with 343€ or 312$ without tax.
2x16GB RAM 3200CL16 is ~77€ and cheap, but good B550 boards go for ~125€. So below 550€ for a high-end gaming CPU, MB and RAM. You might want to invest upto 50€ for a good cooler...
You can pair this with a 6700XT for 399€, giving you a good gaming PC for around 1300€, if you don't own any PC parts. And yes for a 6700XT the 5800X3D is just a bit overkill.
I am glad that Xeons continue to be an option in the value end of things because those tech savvy enough to research what chips and boards will give them the speeds they need are usually also good at finding deals. I, however, will NEVER go back to running old xeons. I've had 2 xeon systems, a W3530 with 8GB of DDR3 and a 1620 V1 with 12GB of DDR3, and both were nothing but troubleshooting nightmares. From experience, i've decided that i'm willing to spend more money on new parts for the added peace of mind, and i'm even willing to spend the money on buying a pre-built to have someone else do tech support. That, however, does leave me running an older mid range system that's limping along thanks to FSR's slow but steady adoption into newer titles
I caught this video pretty late but I wanted to thank you anyway. it’s amazing the kind of performance you were able to get out of sub $600 box. Earlier this year I was thinking about building a 13900K/RTX 4090 gaming PC, really glad I didn’t.
One thing that high end builds don’t show is what compromises you have to make to build an $XXX pc! I’ve worked hard my life until a few years ago and been fortunate enough to build higher tier pc’s every few years on average (not super high end), but I see soooo many reviewers touting the latest and greatest and many people simply don’t shop for the top end Intel i9 / AMD 7950X w/ RTX4090 combo ($5k+ USD build) and often limit their pc builds to the $500-1000 USD price points with many going sub$400 USD requiring serious decision making and compromises on everything to get a working pc. Older tech allows many to get in on the pc gaming / productivity scene and still perform, as shown, reasonably well and can more than get you by!
GO TEAM XEON!!! Like the video Jeff! Especially some of your hilarious comments! Brilliant EDIT: and your 'class' Doom T-shirt as well
I do appreciate this video. I was considering an upgrade from my 4790k refurbished business/Gaming PC and 1650 and several channels posting videos in a 2 week span have almost perfectly laid out my future plans for me for just about under 500 bucks... Now, I just need the 500 bucks.
16:20 Jeff, that goal in Rocket League was absolute gold 🏆🥇my man 💪🥳🎉🎊
Thanks!
Just about to purchase one of these Xeon rigs for a multi core Proxmox host as I’ve reached the max of my5 yo rig.. And will be following your tutorial on video pass thru for plex.
You sir are a legend. Thanks..
AMEN !! I just got my Lenovo Thinkstation P520 Xeon W-2135 w/8X4 2666 Memory Sticks and included 900W Platinum PSU today... Bought an RX 6600 and 1TB NVME + 1TB SSD... and for $550(ish) - Amazing build quality... LONG LIVE USED XEONS !!!
Wow. 2017... time flies! I have the exact same motherboard from machinist. Building a nas following your tips. Thanks mate!
How do you like that motherboard? I've seen mixed reviews on it. Does it "sleep" properly?
I would have liked to see the comparison made with the 5600(X) instead of the 3700X. The 5600 non x is new even cheaper compared to an used 3700X. You could also add some GPU scaling benchmarks like Hardware Unboxed does sometimes. So test both CPUs with different classes of GPUs to see at what point a bottleneck is reached.
Watching in non-fullscreen and that shirt with youtube compression had me questioning if someone dosed my dinner delivery. Awesome shirt, tho.
I finally stopped using my x58 setup as my main in late 2022 . 13 years as my main and it held up incredibly well the entire time. I upgraded the i7 920 with an oc'd xeon x5670 @4.20ghz lol
My main PC has been on X58 since 2013. First I had a W3520 (i7-920) and since 2016 an OC'd X5670 @ 4.4GHz, though currently I have a X5675 @ 4.0GHz which doesn't overclock as well as my X5670 but I've been too lazy to change it back
Just upgraded my i7-920 to an x5680 so I could use that system as a VM server (needed more ram capacity for multiple VMs). Still usable as a desktop for most of what I do at home anyway.
Thank god. Finally someone who knows that people who sign up for Patreon are not "patreons", they're patrons.
These are my favorite kind of videos! Very happy with my Z440 I copied from one of your builds a few months back.
I would be interested in actual power usage while load. With energy price's from 50-70ct per kwh in my area, that would eliminate the 90$ difference pretty fast.
indeed this should be taken into account in any case, at least if you take about money saving.
@@username8644 Welcome to german electric prices. I have now seen close to 1€ electric prices. If you dont believe me maybe i can send screenshots 😂
I have a Xeon 2996V4 system that I use for playing with virtualisation, my NAS, Jellyfin and email server. It's fun and it's good enough. Had the X99 board already and got 256GB DDR4 ECC RAM and the chip for like 300 so it works out really well for my usecase
Built a dual socket Xeon E5 2680 v2 system back in 2017 (still in use), now you could have the same amount of cores or even more with one socket :) Times sure have changed.
Running an overclocked 1680V2 as a main rig. Power consumption is high, but it can game at 4K, and the quad-channel DDR3-2400 has higher aggregate memory bandwidth than the vast majority of dual-channel DDR4 systems. Only now starting to consider an upgrade.
@@asm_nop Nice! If it works it works.
My bunch of dual Intel XeonE5-2630 are doing just fiiiiiiine.
I've been on X58 platform since 2013, first with a 4c/8t Xeon W3520 (i7-920) and since 2016 overclocked 6c/12t Xeon. I do also have a X79/C600 based ThinkStation S30 with a 8c/16t Xeon E5-2690
Wish I could run mw2 with my x5675
I would love to see how old Ivy Bridge Xeons are doing on the X79 platform in 2023. They are so cheap you can buy a kit off of AliExpress for about $75 shipped. It's nuts. Hope to see some old X79 stuff soon!
I just picked up a Xeon E3-1275v2 for $30 on eBay to upgrade my HP Z220 workstation. Replacing i5 3470.
Very cool machines. Love the channel. It's October 2024, and I just bought an E5-2699 v3 (18 cores, base 2.3 GHz, released Q3'14) for a whopping $40. Gonna drop it into my Asus X99 board in place of my trusty Core i7 6850K (this machine) and see what happens. I daily drive this machine, but I have many others, so if it fails, no biggie. I don't game on it, and I don't use it for any sort of serious work. I browse and do MS Office. I have no plans to run a bunch of benchmarks. It will just be a very cool thing to have on my desk.
What is idle power consuption and in max cpu?
Picked up a e5-2690 v4 a few years back for 200 and I've been loving it with it's fat cache and quad channel memory. Just slapped in an RTX A5000 and an optane L2 cache for primocache and now she's downright singing! =D
Still my daily driver is a x58. My side rig is a i7, 6th Gen laptop.
Happy x5690 owner here. Handles my side work/side job editing 4K video with ease. It’s paired with a 1080ti; 2ssds, 1hdd works like a charm.
About to upgrade to Lga 1700, a z690 with a Alder Lake just getting all the components and will finally assemble everything beginning of summer end of spring.
Even then. My main editing rig will still be the x58. Handles my needs so well. What a beast. Who knew that a system can last 13 years?!!!!!!
Really is the goat platform of the last 30 years along with a 1080ti the goat GPU of the last 20.
I have been using a dual Xeon X5690 setup on an EVGA SR-2 motherboard with a water cooling loop since 2014, and it’s still running like a charm! Amazing! Back then, both CPUs and the SR-2 cost around $2,600 USD. Nowadays, the same setup, plus 48GB of RAM and water cooling, would cost around $520.
In 2018 I bought a used Dell T5600 with dual Xeon E5-2680, 16 cores @2.70GHz, and 48GB of RAM. Total cost was $450. I like that I can keep all my productivity apps open, plus I use KDE Activities and have some builder sim games running in the second activity. When I feel like doing lab work, I can open several Windows 10 VMs along with a couple Linux VMs and do network experiments. Those Xeons are serving me well in 2023
Can't give enough thumbs up. Good research and delivery
V4s are still king when it comes to homelabbing. Having features like ECC, quad channel, tons of memory, more pcie lanes, higher core count and price makes it a good choice for that. Not to mention that you can actually have a server motherboard if you don't trust cheap x99 ones. The next upgrade is for when Epyc platform becomes cheaper.
Honestly even an X79 with an E5-1650V2 (a $16 processor) and a 4.0ghz overclock on a chinese board is still surprisingly capable, especially if you know your way around doing a resizable bar UEFI mod and something like a 3060ti. People sleep on just how capable this old server gear is.
Try out a 1680v2 and oc to 4.5ghz but... You may need a better vrm than the Chinese boards provide.
@@tacticalcenter8658 oh 100% but I am just saying even chinese x79 can match the performance of a Ryzen 1600 to 2600
@@JC7119 tech yes city has been testing these for a long time if you want to check out his benchmarks with and without the security patches.
@@tacticalcenter8658 already know all about it. Even with spector and meltdown it's not even that bad
I used to buy used Xeons to upgrade workstations at an engineering firm I used to work for. For some reason they were super tight about spending money to keep the production staff as profitable as possible but it was hard for them to argue when I was dropping $30-$40 on used CPUs and other basic stuff like SSD upgrades to junky old HDDs.
Very interesting! Still humming along with a X99 6800K here, always surprises me how well it still runs.
Long live Xeon. I've always been a fan of Xeon since my first xeon setup. My first Xeon setup were dual socket 603 dualcore cpu's on a Asus PC-DL . Pinmodded from original speed 2.2 ghz to 2.93ghz by cutting some pins so the FSB goes from 400mhz to 533mhz.
I would be interested to see how one of those vintage of Xeons stack up when paired with a slightly more recent GPU. thinking 3060ti or 3070ti. Wondering how much of a deficiency would result from the older PCIe revision.
Apparently not much, because while PCIe4 is 2x faster than PCIe3, the bandwidth between the CPU and GPU is rarely the bottleneck, it's throughput IOPS, and even then, most of the time the PCIe is quiet.
@@John-rw9bv Thanks John. I was thinking that would likely be the case. I've been wanting to roll a couple new systems. One as a newer gaming machine to replace my trusty but ancient HP Z400 sporting a hex core Xeon W3670 and a GTX 970. It's been a very trusty old rig for years but I want to upgrade to NVME, more and faster RAM, and of course a newer GPU.
I have a Dual Socket motherboard with (2) E5-2699V3 cpus with a 3060 (12GB version) with 256GB RAM and it runs everything just fine... I also Multibox the hell out of EVE Online.. lol
The turn of the century... Not wrong but that wounds sir. LOL
Mate, do you think an OCed E5-1680 v3 would be nice, if paired with a RTX 3060 ? (I have my old trusty 3770k, that works fine for games, but I need more PCIe lanes...)
I LOVE X99 XEONS! You didn't mention it here, but Overclocking (yes some have unlocked multipliers) I get INSANE Value out of my 1650 v3 I live stream sim racing all day with it. ( 1080p)
I have 2 systems using dual E5 Xeons for rendering etc. and I love them! I get 12k scores on CPUiD.
i love it when old high-end hardware puts up a fight! i notice the new cpu's outscore the old stuff by a huge margin in the benchmarks, but in regular daily use they just don't feel that much faster. car analogy: corvette is faster than a civic, but do you really feel the performance difference cruising at 70mph down the highway?
For anyone who saw results for the upHere tower cooler, let me share my story with the upHere RGB fan kit. The RGB controller failed within the year, but the fans are working. They just feel like they were built with cheaper components, but that doesn't mean they're horrible. I just feel like I'll be investing in a real solid proper set of case fans sooner than I'd like to. I'm sure the cooler will do good work for you, but just be aware the lifespan may not be the best long term.
The other thing you might want to look at is NAS builds. Used server SAS cards (running SATA SSDs) and 10/40G NICs running PCIE Gen3 x8 are cheap. That means at least two x8 slots which are increasingly rare on modern motherboards built for a single graphics card.
me sat here nodding in agreement with a PC with Xeon E5-1650v3 , 24gb ddr4 2133 and a RTX3060ti at 1440p. works fine for me and i got the PC free (minus the GPU) from my partners work. :)
21:37 "A lot has changed since 2017. Boy, that's a loaded statement."
And with that, Craft Computing gets the award for *Understatement of the Year* 👏👏👏👏👋
I'm actually looking forward to a time when the Epic CPU's start to hit the 2nd hand market for reasonable prices.
The CPU's are cheap, it's the motherboards that are the problem. Still 500+ for anything good
@@krj15489 Interesting. I hadn't looked into it to closely recently because I'm not currently in the market for anything.
Of course, that's pretty standard that you have plenty of CPU's but not as many motherboards 😀 Have run into that problem a time or two, have had a CPU lying around but can't find a decent motherboard to save my life.
Now you've got me curious if full systems are also up just because of the motherboard.
still running a overclocked x5650 with a 1080gtx and 24gb ram 1080p no problems
i lovethe drinking beer aspect of your videos
Still rocking the Xeon's here, and very happy too.
I own a Dell R720 with two Xeons. I bought it for less than $300 and it came with 16GB of ram and two 500GB SAS drives. I was actually quite surprised to learn that it could idle under 100 watts with both CPU's and the SAS drives installed. Sure it's a chunk of power. But compared to the price of streaming services and cloud storage, it's been a great investment. Better than the RPi3 I was using before, even if it does consume a bit of power.
Nobody on Gods Green Earth thinks "under 100 watts" is even considered a "chunk of power".
20 years ago, people would have thought that was some form of Alien Tech verily sipping that much power....
Funny how perceptions change.
2:02 an A550 motherboard? wow. truly one of a kind!
I just bought a Machinist “x99” Xeon 2670v3, 16 GB RAM combo for $100 and I was cautiously optimistic. Honestly I was really satisfied with the value of it. Add a decent graphics card, in my case a used 2080, and it’s one hell of a decent PC for around $400. Got a cheap Liontech (I think) 6 heat pipe direct contact cpu cooler with dual RGB fans for $25, and I was really surprised by how cool it runs. It’s amazing how cheap you can build a decent gaming PC for these days if you really plan it out right. Plays Destiny 2 at 4K max settings average 55-60 fps, lows 40 fps. A very playable experience.
I originally built a Xeon rig for AI applications due to its price and 40 PCIe lanes. Ended up not doing that and when I broke my main rig, I had no choice but to use it for the time being and I gotta say after flashing a custom BIOS with turbo boost unlock and resizeable BAR mod, the gaming performance is unbelievable for its age. Literally a decade old CPU and still kicking, thanks to its cache size. I agree that the power consumption is not good, owners just have to make sure they don't have it on performance mode all the time.
Nice! E5-2697A v4 gang! I have that CPU in my Dell R730 and use it in my homelab. I love it.
I love my e5-2696v3. Its absolutely overkill for what I use it for but I was able to reuse my ddr3 ram which saved me some money and the cpu and motherboard were fairly cheap. I'm hooked on Xeons, they still perform quite well if you're budget oriented and if nothing else they are very fun to tinker with.
Exactly my thoughts, from another happy 2696v3 user on DDR3-ECC-RAM. :)
@@seylaw I thought v3 were only ddr4?
@@deepspacecow2644 Not exactly, Intel made some off-label parts which they directly sold to specific OEMs, these specific models got both DDR4 and DDR3 memory controllers on the chip and there are some Chinese X99-DDR3 motherboards taking advantage of that. At the time I was building that rig the used DDR3-ECC-RAM prices were way cheaper, so this was a no brainer for me. You can also use these CPUs in DDR4 boards. There are even boards that have both DDR3 and DDR4 slots, as the famous Huananzhi X99-TF.
@@seylaw I just never saw any enterprise rack machines that had 2011-3 and ddr3
Surprised by the gaming results. Definitely cool to see that Xeon's are keeping up. I happen to have both the Xeon 2697a v4 and a Ryzen 3700x as well. For anyone interested, my Cinebench R23 multicore scores were 14132 for the Xeon and 12116 for the Ryzen. These were taken about a year ago as I no longer have the Ryzen in a PC. I have the Xeon in a home server running ESXI currently and it performs very well for that. I definitely think there was some minor IPC improvements between the v3 and v4 Xeon's. Most likely down to their change in process node from 22nm to 14nm. Definitely some good X99 options out there. However I don't see X299 being a worthwhile option anytime soon. The Xeon's for socket 2066 as still quite expensive for the higher core count versions. Although with enough time, given there are some chips that will hit over 5ghz for a Xeon, it may pick up.
Great concept and demo. I do recommend that you use fewer words and a table of contents in your description
I am extremely happy that I bought a few sets of both 67v4 and 97Av4 before this video dropped. I don’t know how much these will jump up in price after this video
Thanks bud, I think I'll be using this cpu/motherboard combo in my old TS440 chassis.
This Xeon fashion is great for me. My main PC is an i8086k with 32GB and RTX2080 and because I play in 1080p and target 60fps, every game runs fine... I keep my older PCs and I upgraded each of them with the highest Xeon and max memory for each motherboard. For a budget, I've got a handfull of older PCs to power all my projects
1680v2 and x79 or bust. Overclocked to 4-4.5ghz and profit. Ebay and can often ask for lower prices on some of them. Think you can get them around $60-80. Match it up with a 1080ti and perfect.
That modular test bench looks nice.
I just got a chinese x99 mb and E5-2670-V3 for my home lab. Upgrading from a pair of i5 2400 desktops. Love your tutorials
I'm kinda floored by how well the Xeons are keeping up, ngl.
Why not. I built a PC with 2xGold 6148 ES (20C/40T, 2.8-3.5 GHz) in 2017, has served me well ever since.
I like the ideas expressed about the budget build capable Xeons and the real-world hardware aspect in this testing. However...
One thing that was failed to mention was that the newer Ryzen platform has a better upgrade path for someone looking to upgrade in a couple of years. Most PC gamers (that DIY systems) will upgrade their GPU before upgrading to a new platform. The Ryzen will most likely perform significantly better than the older Xeon once you start easing up on the GPU bottleneck. Also, the RAM can be overclocked a bit more, and the storage could be potentially faster with PCIe 4.0 instead of 3.0. Couple that with the ability to drop in a 5800X3D or 5950X to max out CPU performance well beyond anything that could socket into those Xeon platforms.
I like the idea of keeping old hardware relevent. As long as you have an alternate use for the Xeon system when it's time to upgrade any hardware component (that is basically going to warrant building a new system), it's a good way to go. But if you want more potential upgrade headroom where you can get a lot more performance by replacing individual components, the Ryzen system is a no-brainer IMHO.
Quick hint...IMHO you need (more) Graphics.. too many words and numbers, after a while begin to lose relative context.,
But your insight is palpable, brilliant and worth stopping for.
Being able to see the basics easily makes picturing the hard concepts much easier.
I appreciate that they take extra work,
Best wishes
suprising how much performance is on the table with old xeons a very overlooked cpu option