Agreed! That last set giving an ES of 4 and SD of 1.7 was pretty amazing. Soon I will be using that load and playing with seating depth. Thanks for watching, I really appreciate it.
Your comment on not holding the rifle correctly when You had that flier on the 54.0 g load is something every shooter must have felt at some point . I have a lot of experience about hold sensitivity as I mostly shoot spring powered air rifles and they are extremely hold sensitive , It's exasperated by the fact We have a power limit of 12ftlbs and therefore the velocity is artificially stifled so drop is exaggerated and because spring guns have a two directional recoil , both pulling the rifle forwards before the actual Recoil counters it , a spring gun is perfect to train with instilling consistency equally in hold , breathing , and trigger control . the best thing is they are cheap to run and most can be used in a decent sized back garden without upsetting the neighbours to much . Thanks for the video I always enjoy accuracy videos and seeing the consistency in the velocities convinces Me Your definitely on the right track , all You need is the right day and You'll get that magical 1 hole group We all strive for . Catch You next time , Shoot Straight Stay Safe & Stay Well.
It's funny, as soon as I fired the follow up group, my brain said "something felt different"...then I realized I was probably over gripping the rifle and influencing it rather than just moving the trigger. Thanks for the air gun explanation too...I never really thought about dual recoil...forwards and rearwards. But, in hindsight, have fired a couple air rifle I do remember that sensation. I will have to pay closer attention the next time my teammate brings out his air rifle.
"It wasn't your skills, but the powder. The H4831 doesn't completely fill the case, causing the powder to shift inside and leading to inconsistent ignition. I managed to load 54.6 grains in a 6.5 PRC Hornady cartridge, also shooting 147-grain ELD bullets. Getting inconsistent results
I eventually got to 54.3 grains and that shot OK...playing with seating depth didn't change much...I was consistently .6 to .7 inch groups. I did get some H4831sc recently that I will load soon.
You know how to keep making things interesting. Lack of wide deviations is impressive. If it aint broke dont try to fix it 😂. But we look for perfection. 👍🙏🎯🇺🇸
And, Bill, it show that a UniFlow and trickler can still do the job...just a little bit slower, lol. I even impressed myself with the spread on those last charge weights!
Halfmile if you get a chance when you get the load you want I’d like to see you try some Nosler Ballistic Tips in that rifle. It may just be luck but every rifle I’ve shot them through has outstanding accuracy with them and speed. I’ll see if I can find you a box soon. I thank you’ll be surprised.
It is, but we were close to the top load and looking for something good between two nice loads .5 grains apart. I appreciate you watching. And I anneal every time I process Albert.
@@albertlemont5471 I use an older RCBS Chargemaster scale to weigh, I throw my charges on the old UniFlow dispenser and trickler up to the charge weight manually.
I hav ebeen measuring the bullets...more so after breaking down the factory match ammo in prior testing. Length has been pretty consistent but the weight has been all over the map, so I have been sortung by weight. So, when I am testing a specific powder charge, all three (or five if doing a 5 round group) have the same weight bullet. Thanks for watching.
Gord have you noticed when cleaning that the 4831 is overly carbon and hard to clean? I use H 1000 and now 4831SC, they are easier to clean. My competition 300WM has a cleaning schedule of "no more than" 40 rounds. When I was using 4831 it was a chore to get rid of the carbon. My 270 WSM is the same, I will try 7828 on it next. It looks like you have found the node for yours, seating depth is your friend.
There is a little more carbon than usual but it seems to clean out ok, I just let the carbon killer do its thing for a few extra minutes. Now that we have a range of solid ED and SD, we will start playing with seating depth to see if we can tighten that up a little more.
I have been looking for Berger 153.5 and 156 but they are still out of stock everywhere I have been looking. I will find some one day, heck even the Hornady ELDM are getting harder to find...
Not sure if you'll see this or someone else may have experience.... I am getting ready to start handloading 6.5prc and have read that there is issue with getting a reliable full length sizing of the brass. Apparently it leads to clickers with the base becoming expanded just enough on 2-3 x fired brass supposedly. Wondering what die set youve been using if one brand is more effective than the others on sizing closest to saami spec. Thanks for the awesome video series!!!!
I use the RCBS 2 die set in conjunction with the Cortina Precision 6.5 Expanding Mandrel die, which can be found here: www.shootsmallgroups.com/product/expanding-mandrel-dies-with-mandrels/ The mandrel die will work out that expanded section just above the base. I am also using the .262 mandrel. The RCBS dies in conjunction with Erik's Expanding Mandrel bring my brass back to spec. In fact, I try to mention it in every video, I have been using the same brass for over a year now, for all of these videos. This brass has at least 13 loadings on it now. Thanks for watching, I really appreciate it.
@@Halfmilesniperawesome! I appreciate and have been watching your series on this for a while and your other content. Been handloading/reloading for years and just delving into 6.5 PRC. Trying to get caught up on all the intricacies of the cartridge. Appreciate all your hard work on the subject!
Have you read up on Alex Wheeler's PRC improved reamers for chambering? Might want to read up on those. I have a JGS reamer made to the AW specs to obviate clickers. He did the 6.5 and 7PRC a huge favor over using SAAMI spec which found that SAAMI spec chambers have early pressures/clickers. All of my 7PRCs and 6.5PRCs are chambered with the AW modified reamer.
@@Accuracy1st interesting. My Howa is unaltered and I haven't had a single clicker (other than a dud primer, but that is a different click, lol). I am on the 14th load of this particular brass and have used the Cortina Precision die I mentioned from the onset. It works well.
@@Halfmilesniper I've not loaded for any of my 6.5PRCs in about a year but if I'm remembering my data correctly, all of the videos I've seen on your channel with your Howa are very light loads compared to what I loaded. Thus, you won't get clickers, or shouldn't. Stand by and I'll go read some of my data and velocities for a few test loads....
Did you ever consider variations in your brass? Tenth of a grain increments in powder charge is not going to show the real story if your brass is not super consistent… within a tenth of grain of weight per case
I have and I have weighed the brass, i tried grouping the cases by close weights...might have to try that again for giggle. This brass is pretty close, and considering I am processing it for the 14th load, I should see if I lost much case weight due to trimming.
Love watching these videos, BUT Shooting in .1 grain increments is the biggest waste of time and money you could possibly do while shooting. .5 grain increment jumps with the 6.5 prc and 5 shot groups will tell you a better story. I recommend watching the Hornady podcast and they will help you save a ton of time and money. They don’t even do an OCW test, they load up one powder charge and shoot 10 round groups. If they aren’t happy, the change either powder or bullet.
If I hadn't already run up the scale in .5 grain increments I would completely agree with you. Due to the prior testing I knew we looked ok at 53.5 and 54.0 had potential, so restarting at 53.5 and going up .1 grain let me see if there was anything worth while between 53.5 and 54.0, plus a little extra above 54.0, so it wasn't exactly a waste of time. I do appreciate the feedback, I might have to check out their podcast to see what they've got.
@@Halfmilesniper Definitely check out their videos, they shoot waaay more than I ever could and record every bit of data. I tried debunking their theories and so far, they hold true. Episode #57 is a good one. Another good one is Bryan litz on the ultimate reloader channel. I don’t mean to sound arrogant, Im just super passionate about the sport and want to help people learn wherever I can! Look forward to more videos 👍🏼
@@codyway7424 agree on the sub moa to shoot 1,000....disagree on needing a barrel...barrel only has 500 rounds through it. We'll see how the wind conditions were for that range day in the next video...LOL.
I have days like that buddy. I can get out here and take my bow and knock the nocks off other arrows and then the next day I shoot 4-5 inch groups. I know it’s me not my bow and arrows. We’re human buddy. Yeah I’m the same way.
I am inclined to blame myself more than likely, but then when everything feels right and still goes wonky it does make you wonder...was it me or the load?
Have you watch Applied Ballistics Brian Litz or Hornady Podcast on groups are to small and dispersion of group sizes. Might want listen. Both parties have shot hundreds of thousands to millions of rounds in many different calibers. They shot 100's to 1000's of shots of each load charge weight with same seating depth, brass and primers and the findings from there independent experiments? It might explain how some groups can seem really good until more shots are fired of that load and how small sample sizes (3,5,10) shot groups can be misleading and our expectations of tiny groups all the time is not realistic, especially in regular rifles (non F-class and Bench Rest type rifles).
While I have specifically watched any of those I have read a little bit on it. The fact is, as just a regular guy we don't have the time or ability to shoot thousands and thousands to replicate what they are saying. What we can do is load some ammo, shoot it and if we can get a good group, coupled with good numbers we have a good starting point. If the group/load can repeat we are doing great and then we can see if that load will keep it together at distance. Now in the case of the 54.0 grain loading, first time out it gave 2 rounds touching before I had a dud primer. The outing that same load strung vertically...was it the load or was it me or something in my process? I don't know but chance are I will load another set with the 54.0 grains and try one more time just to see.
You are seating the bullets right now at 2.990 so am I but I’m going to try 2.975,2.965 & 2.955 just to see what happens? I’m also going to try the 127 Barnes LR with Retumbo 58-60 in .5 increments at first then decide which way to go?
I will take the last load and start shortening the OAL by .005 in groups of three and see what happens. Using the AICS 3.175" mag you can get feeding issues when you get much shorter than 3 inch OAL...but we'll see.
@@Halfmilesniper Don't do that. Follow Berger's recommendation. Your 54.3 grain charge is working. Seat 12 rounds: 3 just off the lands (pick your starting point - usually around 10th off, then seat 3 more 40th deeper than the first 3, then seat 3 more 40th deeper than those, then the final three another 40th deeper. ONE of these groups will shoot best, then play with that group +3 and -3 thousandths. If you go down the road of 0.005 you will possibly skip right over your rifles node.
@@Accuracy1st I am starting just off the lands...If I try longer I'll be in jam. I will shorten slightly...I was thinking .005" but will probably setting at .003" increments
@@Halfmilesniper Oh Ok. If you're already at the lands or close that's a great starting point. That is what I do as well. For quite a few rifles I tinkered with minimal depth changes from there only to find disappointment. I remembered Berger had a suggestion on testing. I read it again earlier this year and tried it. Sure enough, that advise was what I needed. I found my best loads in 7 rifles with VLD style bullets to be within 6 thousandths of the 40th depth and within 6 thousandths of the 80th off lands. One of my 7PRCs and one of my 7RemMags prefer only 10th off lands
I load in batches...process all the cases, then prime all the cases, then when I sit down to load I throw 3 charges at one weight, then throw 3 more at the next weight up and continue for the batch of test ammo. Then I seat the bullet and inspect each round before putting in the ammo box.
Nah, my bench is fine, it is just an impromptu shooting platform for those locations where there isn't a bench. Not sure what you mean by a proper height rear bag...the bag I am using is just about the perfect height for the 100 yard targets at this range. With the stock on the rear bag the rifle is on target. Thanks for watching, I do appreciate it.
Great day at the range.
Thanks again for sharing.
Glad you enjoyed it, it was a great day at the range.
I was cooking supper but listened to the live while I was cooking. Great video Mike!
Thanks Charles...I appreciate that. Glad you enjoyed it, can't wait to see if we can tighten the group now.
Good shooting Mike, really enjoyed it. I'm with everyone else, really liked the 54.3 group, looking forward to your next video.
Thanks Bob...I too am on the 54.3 gr train, lol...I will be playing with seating depth soon.
Looking really good. The 54.3 is showing great promise. Everything is very, very good. Good stuff. Thank you.
Thanks 👍soon I will try adjusting seating depth to see if we can tighten up the group.
More interesting numbers, but the last set was definitely impressive!!
Agreed! That last set giving an ES of 4 and SD of 1.7 was pretty amazing. Soon I will be using that load and playing with seating depth. Thanks for watching, I really appreciate it.
👍👍good stuff Halfmile…….54.3 looked pretty good.
Thanks 👍54.3 is gonna be the H4831 load I am pretty certain, lol.
Fun project providing lots of range time ! I watched late last night but didn't hit send for comment...lol
Thanks Charles, I am definitely getting some range time with the rifle...and loving it. Thanks for watching.
Your comment on not holding the rifle correctly when You had that flier on the 54.0 g load is something every shooter must have felt at some point . I have a lot of experience about hold sensitivity as I mostly shoot spring powered air rifles and they are extremely hold sensitive , It's exasperated by the fact We have a power limit of 12ftlbs and therefore the velocity is artificially stifled so drop is exaggerated and because spring guns have a two directional recoil , both pulling the rifle forwards before the actual Recoil counters it , a spring gun is perfect to train with instilling consistency equally in hold , breathing , and trigger control . the best thing is they are cheap to run and most can be used in a decent sized back garden without upsetting the neighbours to much . Thanks for the video I always enjoy accuracy videos and seeing the consistency in the velocities convinces Me Your definitely on the right track , all You need is the right day and You'll get that magical 1 hole group We all strive for . Catch You next time , Shoot Straight Stay Safe & Stay Well.
It's funny, as soon as I fired the follow up group, my brain said "something felt different"...then I realized I was probably over gripping the rifle and influencing it rather than just moving the trigger.
Thanks for the air gun explanation too...I never really thought about dual recoil...forwards and rearwards. But, in hindsight, have fired a couple air rifle I do remember that sensation. I will have to pay closer attention the next time my teammate brings out his air rifle.
"It wasn't your skills, but the powder. The H4831 doesn't completely fill the case, causing the powder to shift inside and leading to inconsistent ignition. I managed to load 54.6 grains in a 6.5 PRC Hornady cartridge, also shooting 147-grain ELD bullets. Getting inconsistent results
I eventually got to 54.3 grains and that shot OK...playing with seating depth didn't change much...I was consistently .6 to .7 inch groups. I did get some H4831sc recently that I will load soon.
You know how to keep making things interesting. Lack of wide deviations is impressive. If it aint broke dont try to fix it 😂. But we look for perfection. 👍🙏🎯🇺🇸
And, Bill, it show that a UniFlow and trickler can still do the job...just a little bit slower, lol. I even impressed myself with the spread on those last charge weights!
@@HalfmilesniperAnd did it at about 60% of factory "Match" ammo which deviations are at least twice yours. Why can't they do it 😱🙊
@@billdye3530 LOL, yep Bill...set me back about $1.20 a pop as opposed to about $2.50 a pop.
Hope it works out for you. You sure have tried. Very hard. 👍👍👍👋👋✅
There is alway more to test, even once I find my load, lol...it is a never ending addiction!!!!
@@Halfmilesniper 😄😄😄
Now This is about to be a good video!
Thank you sir...
Halfmile if you get a chance when you get the load you want I’d like to see you try some Nosler Ballistic Tips in that rifle. It may just be luck but every rifle I’ve shot them through has outstanding accuracy with them and speed. I’ll see if I can find you a box soon. I thank you’ll be surprised.
I was actually looking at some the other days when I went looking for some more Hornady 147s. No one had any around so I ordered from Sage.
That is a decent sized case to run a .1 ladder. Very nice numbers!
Are you anealing ?
It is, but we were close to the top load and looking for something good between two nice loads .5 grains apart. I appreciate you watching.
And I anneal every time I process Albert.
@@Halfmilesniper those numbers are very impressive. What do you use for a scale
@@albertlemont5471 I use an older RCBS Chargemaster scale to weigh, I throw my charges on the old UniFlow dispenser and trickler up to the charge weight manually.
SD’s are good all the way. The numbers look best at 54.3 but in all they’re all really good.
Thinking 54.3 with be my H4831 load...now to play with seating depth.
Have you measured those bullets? For match bullets they are crazy different. I went to 140gr sst’s they are more consistent. Thanks for your testing.❤
I hav ebeen measuring the bullets...more so after breaking down the factory match ammo in prior testing. Length has been pretty consistent but the weight has been all over the map, so I have been sortung by weight. So, when I am testing a specific powder charge, all three (or five if doing a 5 round group) have the same weight bullet. Thanks for watching.
54.3 looks good.
Thanks 👍54.3 is gonna be the H4831 load I am pretty certain, lol.
How did I miss this one now????? I am going to holler at puketube I’m not getting notifications on some of the stuff I’m subbed to
Gort didn't get a notification until about 10 minutes into the video...weird.
Gord have you noticed when cleaning that the 4831 is overly carbon and hard to clean? I use H 1000 and now 4831SC, they are easier to clean. My competition 300WM has a cleaning schedule of "no more than" 40 rounds. When I was using 4831 it was a chore to get rid of the carbon. My 270 WSM is the same, I will try 7828 on it next. It looks like you have found the node for yours, seating depth is your friend.
There is a little more carbon than usual but it seems to clean out ok, I just let the carbon killer do its thing for a few extra minutes. Now that we have a range of solid ED and SD, we will start playing with seating depth to see if we can tighten that up a little more.
Have you thought about changing to a Sierra or Berger?
I have been looking for Berger 153.5 and 156 but they are still out of stock everywhere I have been looking. I will find some one day, heck even the Hornady ELDM are getting harder to find...
Not sure if you'll see this or someone else may have experience.... I am getting ready to start handloading 6.5prc and have read that there is issue with getting a reliable full length sizing of the brass. Apparently it leads to clickers with the base becoming expanded just enough on 2-3 x fired brass supposedly. Wondering what die set youve been using if one brand is more effective than the others on sizing closest to saami spec. Thanks for the awesome video series!!!!
I use the RCBS 2 die set in conjunction with the Cortina Precision 6.5 Expanding Mandrel die, which can be found here: www.shootsmallgroups.com/product/expanding-mandrel-dies-with-mandrels/
The mandrel die will work out that expanded section just above the base. I am also using the .262 mandrel. The RCBS dies in conjunction with Erik's Expanding Mandrel bring my brass back to spec. In fact, I try to mention it in every video, I have been using the same brass for over a year now, for all of these videos. This brass has at least 13 loadings on it now.
Thanks for watching, I really appreciate it.
@@Halfmilesniperawesome! I appreciate and have been watching your series on this for a while and your other content. Been handloading/reloading for years and just delving into 6.5 PRC. Trying to get caught up on all the intricacies of the cartridge. Appreciate all your hard work on the subject!
Have you read up on Alex Wheeler's PRC improved reamers for chambering? Might want to read up on those. I have a JGS reamer made to the AW specs to obviate clickers. He did the 6.5 and 7PRC a huge favor over using SAAMI spec which found that SAAMI spec chambers have early pressures/clickers. All of my 7PRCs and 6.5PRCs are chambered with the AW modified reamer.
@@Accuracy1st interesting. My Howa is unaltered and I haven't had a single clicker (other than a dud primer, but that is a different click, lol). I am on the 14th load of this particular brass and have used the Cortina Precision die I mentioned from the onset. It works well.
@@Halfmilesniper I've not loaded for any of my 6.5PRCs in about a year but if I'm remembering my data correctly, all of the videos I've seen on your channel with your Howa are very light loads compared to what I loaded. Thus, you won't get clickers, or shouldn't. Stand by and I'll go read some of my data and velocities for a few test loads....
Did you ever consider variations in your brass?
Tenth of a grain increments in powder charge is not going to show the real story if your brass is not super consistent… within a tenth of grain of weight per case
I have and I have weighed the brass, i tried grouping the cases by close weights...might have to try that again for giggle. This brass is pretty close, and considering I am processing it for the 14th load, I should see if I lost much case weight due to trimming.
Love watching these videos, BUT Shooting in .1 grain increments is the biggest waste of time and money you could possibly do while shooting. .5 grain increment jumps with the 6.5 prc and 5 shot groups will tell you a better story. I recommend watching the Hornady podcast and they will help you save a ton of time and money. They don’t even do an OCW test, they load up one powder charge and shoot 10 round groups. If they aren’t happy, the change either powder or bullet.
If I hadn't already run up the scale in .5 grain increments I would completely agree with you. Due to the prior testing I knew we looked ok at 53.5 and 54.0 had potential, so restarting at 53.5 and going up .1 grain let me see if there was anything worth while between 53.5 and 54.0, plus a little extra above 54.0, so it wasn't exactly a waste of time. I do appreciate the feedback, I might have to check out their podcast to see what they've got.
@@Halfmilesniper Definitely check out their videos, they shoot waaay more than I ever could and record every bit of data. I tried debunking their theories and so far, they hold true. Episode #57 is a good one. Another good one is Bryan litz on the ultimate reloader channel. I don’t mean to sound arrogant, Im just super passionate about the sport and want to help people learn wherever I can! Look forward to more videos 👍🏼
Waiting to see you shoot a half mile.
We will be stretching the legs on this 6.5 in the next video...in pretty tough conditions.
@@Halfmilesniper You need sub 1/2 moa to do well at 1000. You probably need a new barrel.
@@codyway7424 agree on the sub moa to shoot 1,000....disagree on needing a barrel...barrel only has 500 rounds through it. We'll see how the wind conditions were for that range day in the next video...LOL.
I have days like that buddy. I can get out here and take my bow and knock the nocks off other arrows and then the next day I shoot 4-5 inch groups. I know it’s me not my bow and arrows. We’re human buddy. Yeah I’m the same way.
I am inclined to blame myself more than likely, but then when everything feels right and still goes wonky it does make you wonder...was it me or the load?
Have you watch Applied Ballistics Brian Litz or Hornady Podcast on groups are to small and dispersion of group sizes. Might want listen. Both parties have shot hundreds of thousands to millions of rounds in many different calibers. They shot 100's to 1000's of shots of each load charge weight with same seating depth, brass and primers and the findings from there independent experiments? It might explain how some groups can seem really good until more shots are fired of that load and how small sample sizes (3,5,10) shot groups can be misleading and our expectations of tiny groups all the time is not realistic, especially in regular rifles (non F-class and Bench Rest type rifles).
While I have specifically watched any of those I have read a little bit on it. The fact is, as just a regular guy we don't have the time or ability to shoot thousands and thousands to replicate what they are saying. What we can do is load some ammo, shoot it and if we can get a good group, coupled with good numbers we have a good starting point. If the group/load can repeat we are doing great and then we can see if that load will keep it together at distance.
Now in the case of the 54.0 grain loading, first time out it gave 2 rounds touching before I had a dud primer. The outing that same load strung vertically...was it the load or was it me or something in my process? I don't know but chance are I will load another set with the 54.0 grains and try one more time just to see.
You are seating the bullets right now at 2.990 so am I but I’m going to try 2.975,2.965 & 2.955 just to see what happens? I’m also going to try the 127 Barnes LR with Retumbo 58-60 in .5 increments at first then decide which way to go?
I will take the last load and start shortening the OAL by .005 in groups of three and see what happens. Using the AICS 3.175" mag you can get feeding issues when you get much shorter than 3 inch OAL...but we'll see.
@@Halfmilesniper Don't do that. Follow Berger's recommendation. Your 54.3 grain charge is working. Seat 12 rounds: 3 just off the lands (pick your starting point - usually around 10th off, then seat 3 more 40th deeper than the first 3, then seat 3 more 40th deeper than those, then the final three another 40th deeper. ONE of these groups will shoot best, then play with that group +3 and -3 thousandths. If you go down the road of 0.005 you will possibly skip right over your rifles node.
@@Accuracy1st I am starting just off the lands...If I try longer I'll be in jam. I will shorten slightly...I was thinking .005" but will probably setting at .003" increments
@@Halfmilesniper Oh Ok. If you're already at the lands or close that's a great starting point. That is what I do as well. For quite a few rifles I tinkered with minimal depth changes from there only to find disappointment. I remembered Berger had a suggestion on testing. I read it again earlier this year and tried it. Sure enough, that advise was what I needed. I found my best loads in 7 rifles with VLD style bullets to be within 6 thousandths of the 40th depth and within 6 thousandths of the 80th off lands. One of my 7PRCs and one of my 7RemMags prefer only 10th off lands
Goodnight y'all
Hey there SeaWolf...apologies if I didn't see you in the chat. Thanks for watching!
@@Halfmilesniper You're welcome. I got here late so I wasn't in the chat.
You load one round at a time don’t you?????? I mean the whole process from priming to seating the bullet I mean you know what I mean.
I load in batches...process all the cases, then prime all the cases, then when I sit down to load I throw 3 charges at one weight, then throw 3 more at the next weight up and continue for the batch of test ammo. Then I seat the bullet and inspect each round before putting in the ammo box.
Get rid of that bench and get a proper height rear rest and your groups will improve
Your just just wasting components and time
Nah, my bench is fine, it is just an impromptu shooting platform for those locations where there isn't a bench. Not sure what you mean by a proper height rear bag...the bag I am using is just about the perfect height for the 100 yard targets at this range. With the stock on the rear bag the rifle is on target.
Thanks for watching, I do appreciate it.
SD’s are good all the way. The numbers look best at 54.3 but in all they’re all really good.