Top expansions for me are (in no particular order)... Keyflower: The Merchants Istanbul: Mocha and Baksheesh Nothing Personal: The Associates (because I'm featured in that one ;)) Kemet: Ta-Seti Dominion: Prosperity Battlestar Galactica: Pegasus Arkham Horror: Kingsport Elder Sign: Gates of Arkham Tokaido: Crossroads Mondo: Zusatzspieler Erweiterung Pack A/B (added more point conditions and tile diversity)
zux1 That is the first time that has happened, and usually Tom isn't as forgiving as he was in the video. In retrospect, it was probably planned...though he did not tell me (at least) that it was going to happen.
Great list, thanks guys!! I'm really starting to think I need to play Kingsburg haha you guys mention it so often I need to give it a go! Stone age too... My favorite expansion is probably Cosmic Dominion too :D
Sam I would not have cried havoc Sam if you picked both TI3 expansions. They are FANTASTIC expansions. The long war continues! Played a 3 player game this weekend and even that was fun. I do like the Shattered Empires strategic cards (most of them). I don't use the base strategic cards anymore after my first game (especially Imperial I & Tech I).
I am only about 10 minutes in and I am amused because I think the last Top 10 video I watched was the enemies of gaming and children and (smart) phones were on the list.
A tiny quibble about the SM Master Set (and it's not the fact that it is really not an expansion) - both Tom and Zee said it comes with 8 factions - it actually comes with 6. The new one (Alliances) comes with 8, I believe.
Tom = Spongebob, Zee = Squidward, Sam = Patrick. Thanks a ton for all your vids, you've sold an amazing amount of games, to me alone! Hope you guys go to GenCon 2015.
Have and regularly play 'Innovation' with both expansions. Best with just ' Echoes', because foreshadowing never happens with the second expansion, because the extra cards stop enough foreshadowing cards from coming up and the leaders, apart from being cool names, add very poor payoffs.
this list seems very similar to the top 10 essential expansions list, especially considering Tom's opening statement about how he chose the expansions for his list.
Sarah Langer there's actually a lot of crossover, though I will agree that the lists are technically different. I wish they would have gone the opposite way and do the top 10 worst expansions or 10 games they prefer without expansions.
How about a Top Ten List of changes/upgrades you 3 would like to see be made to the most basic 1980's version of "Risk"?? my #1 would be adding "air-power"
Pandemic: In The Lab (specifically the Lab Challenge) and Dominion: Prosperity are probably my top ones. That being said, we don't actually own many expansions to our games (apart from Pandemic), so my experience is limited. For example, I do have Tokaido: Crossroads, but I don't think it actually made the base game that much better, just different. Most games I'm generally happy with the base game.
GrandElemental Well, she has already helped Tom during his Christmas series a year or two ago and has also participated in a few reviews, so she could be an expansion in the future :)
Thanks Sam.. for your input on the Stone Age expansion! Awesome. Also for BSG - Pegasus. Equally fantastic! Memoir 44 I still haven't bought yet. I'm waiting for the BIG BOX version :D. King Of Tokyo is a no-brainer. Way to go, Zee!
Pandemic: In The Lab.. I think I'll get that one too. Again, Sam.. you're the man! Elder Sign.. never saw that one coming. Zee, thanks for pointing that one out :D
I was a little shocked at Tom's reaction to the 'In the Lab' expansion for Pandemic on here. His thoughts/arguments on the 117th episode of Miami Dice when they reviewed in the lab, seemed like he was more on the fence about it and called it clunky. However, here he proudly shakes Sam's hand and says in the lab is the best! :0 I have to say, I'm with Zee when it comes to the 'On the Brink' expansion adds plenty to the base game.
1. Talisman: The Harbinger Expansion: this expansion hasn't even been released, I can't discuss in detail why I like it yet (beta tester). But the theme is awesome, it has Biblical connotations, it changes how Talisman is played dramatically. While Talisman is only my 2nd favorite game, this expansion is just pure awesomeness! 2. Tomb: Cryptmaster: this is a separate game but many people, including me, mix it into Tomb. This made a great game even more fantastic. More monsters, more adventurers, new types of cards, and mercenaries! And while Tomb is only my 3rd favorite game, Cryptmaster just made the original game so much better. 3. RoboRally: Armed and Dangerous: Lots of cool Options and more boards. More RoboRally goodness. You would think that since RoboRally is my favorite game this would be 1 or 2, and it was tough realizing it's only #3, and this expansion is really really good. But the above two, just did more to improve the other games. 4. RoboRally: Grand Prix: brought in a new way to play RoboRally, perhaps my favorite way to play, racing around a circle. 5. BANG! Dodge City: Unfortunately when I bought Bang! I added this right to the base game so I never played it without it. But this is an essential expansion. 6. Alien Frontiers: Outer Belt: I love this expansion, the mechanics of the rotating cards is awesome. The mechanics, the game play, the added cards, and choices adds a lot to the game. This is almost a must have expansion. Not sure if it has changed, but I don't know why Tom on the Dice Tower hasn't played this expansion, it is better than Factions. 7. Talisman City (1989, 2nd edition): I prefer 4th edition Talisman, and have for probably 2 years now. But the City expansion for 2nd edition remained my favorite all time Talisman expansion for any edition, until I play tested #1 above. But I loved this expansion, mostly because of the Master characters in the 2nd City. 2nd edition is clunky compared to 4th, but I loved playing in the 2nd edition city. 8. Talisman: The Reaper Expansion: An enjoyable expansion which adds more base like feel to Talisman. It also adds the dangerous NPC Reaper. 9. Relic: Halls of Terra: Relic is Talisman in space, and I thought Relic ok-good when I first played it, but I like it more every time I play it. But something kept it from shining, and it still could use more, but this expansion did nice things to the game, and kind of reminded me of the Highlands for Talisman by allowing leveling for lower level characters, which you will see below. 10. Talisman: The Highland Expansion: I really like this expansion. A nice place to go for low level characters and a nice place to get gold. Honorable Mentions: 11. RoboRally: Radioactive: Just another great expansion for RoboRally. I loved the mutation mechanic. 12. Alien Frontiers: Factions: This expansion can be a hit or miss, depending on what comes into the game. I have helped this with faction packs. Some Factions are awesome, others are "meh". But what also makes this expansion great is adding another player. 13. Heroes Incorporated: S.U.P.E.R.: Just like BANG! Dodge City, I got this with the base game and haven't played the base without it. It is essential for the game though. 14. Ticket to Ride 1910: I no longer own the physical game, not popular enough in my circle, but I still have the Xbox version. I agree with the Dice Tower gang, a must have expansion, just like BANG! Dodge City and Heroes Incorporated: S.U.P.E.R. 15. Lord of the Rings: Friends & Foes: The game sat unplayed for probably 8+ years, until recently and need even more play. But this expansion just gives you more of the same for the base game. I can do without the other expansions. Keep an eye on: Cutthroat Caverns: this game I have only played once, but has made my top 10 favorite games nonetheless. I have some expansions but have played none. I have a sneaky suspicion they will emerge highly! Carson City: similar to above, but have played multiple games. I have a good feeling I will like the expansion(s). Cosmic Encounter: I have only played teh game once. Don't even own it, but is on my "to get list" and have already researched the expansions. am sure they will emerge. Dungeon Command: Blood of Gruumsh & Heart of Cormyr: I use these as expansions for my Dungeons and Dragons Adventure System Board Games. Painted mini's! Also helpers for the adventure. I love the Dungeons and Dragons Adventure System Board Games, and they need more play, not sure how influential these games will be as expansions. Runebound 2nd edition: a fantasy game I really like, but only for 2-3 players and a game I haven't played enough of. And while the expansions are very hard to get I have some. Some just add to the base game, and without them the base game has limited re-playability (too small of decks). Just not sure which ones will emerge as I play this more over time. King of New York: I don't think any expansions are out. I bought this game because of the hype, but I think I won't like it until expansions are added.
I doubt they'll be mentioned here, but I'm going to put out both of FFG's Blizzard adaptations: WarCraft the Board Game and StarCraft the Board Game. Their expansions helped them to much better capture the flavor of their respective games, and just added so many more options to them.
I have a suggestion about when one person is talking about a game the other two hate. For example, Tom just said "that game's boring" with no other input after Zee talks about Mr. Jack, and Zee acts about the same after Tom talks about Innovation. But you both talked about expansions that were great because they added variability to a static setup, which is a good point about a great thing expansions can do. I think the discussion would really benefit if you honed in on things like that and talked broadly about the good things rather than just tuning out because such-and-such a game sucks.
Zee's expression of his eyeballs coming from the sockets in 50:07 made me absolutely crack when Tom explains how the campaign of the game could be 200 hours long.
Tom: I have one of the Dice Masters -- but never could get into it. The whole dice moving from zone to zone wasn't very good for me. It was also a hard to understand at first.
Totally agree with Kingsburg. That is a game that I just can't go back to playing without the expansion. It gives me hope for whatever they do with Kingsport Festival. Tuscany is absolutely required for Viticulture. New board, new mechanics, better improved player boards, it's just incredible. Again, you just can't go back to the base game after playing the expansion. Gates of Arkham absolutely MADE Elder Sign. It used to be on my list of games that I would play once in a while, but now - oh man. So good. Excellent video guys, great stuff all around.
My top ten 10 Revolution: Anarchy 9 King of Tokyo: Power up 8 Carcassonne: Inns and Cathedrals 7 Trains: Rising Sun 6 Catan: Seafarers 5 Rivals For Catan: Age of Darkness & Age of Elightenment 4 Dominion: Prosperity 3 7 Wonders: Cities & Leaders 2 Elder Sign: Streets of Arkham 1 Pandemic: In the Lab
Some of my favorite expansions: Titans(Cyclades), Conquest of Planet Earth: Apocalypse, Timber Peak(Last Night on Earth), Scoundrels of Skullport(Lord of Waterdeep), but my favorite expansion is In the Lab.
I truly don't see how you guys like Shards of the Throne more than Shattered Empire. SE singlehandedly fixed the Imperial strategy card problem by adding Bureaucracy, which take away the annoying mechanic of getting 2 VPs when you pick Imperial. And SotT practically breaks the game, it has so many flaws. It's horribly unbalanced. SE tried to balance out the races as best it could, but SotT just threw all that out the window. Yssaril and Mindset, 2 of, if the 2 best races in the game get 2 of the best racial techs, while Sol, a mediocre race, gets the literal worst and most expensive of the game? It's ridiculous. And mechanized units are a cool idea, but they make races whose saving grace was their GFs like Sol and Yin so much worse, while being annoying immune to like everything. They're too good, comparatively. Yes, the expansion added cool and fun things, but I have to heavily house rule the game to prevent it from being broken now, in my opinion.
Two out of 3 expansions (well technically, as mine is 1912 for TtR: Europe) mentioned which i own were on Zee's list. Pied Piper is a good expansion, which i bought quickly after playing Rattus a couple of times. Though i'm now a bit of burned out on this game (after playing too much). But if i play, i usually randomly pick roles from the whole bunch. Leaders is a recent buy and i have only played it once (and have also introduced it to a player who never played 7 Wonders.. insane). I like the feel, and it indeed give you a goal. I remember i was trying to build up for one of my leaders to get lots of points. But it also kind of adds too much. You are torn between so many paths and you can do just so much on your turns. But the more the better :)
After seeing this top 10, we bought Elder Sign: Gates of Arkham, and the game went from good to amazing! Thank you for that tip, Zee! We love these fairly compact co-op games, because we travel a lot, and always try to bring a few games with us. This just became an auto-bring =)
Scoundrels of Skullport, the Lords of Waterdeep expansion, is an awesome one. I surely thought it would be on Tom's list, the way he was going on about it earlier. Probably made his top 20 though :) Btw, the Summoner Wars Master Set only contains six factions, not eight. The Alliances Set has eight.
You guys should consider doing a guilty pleasures list as in games you know are bad mechanically but still enjoy or games that have a silly theme or that you feel ridiculous playing. For example I love Atmosfear but it's an awful game mechanically or I enjoy My Little Pony CCG despite the theme.
Guys, you should play Elder Sign: Gates of Arkham and do a video of your thoughts. All together... I think it could be great. Plus after that performance from Zee I doubt it will be long before you play it anyway.
***** Tom Vasel The TI3 race-specific technologies came 1-1 in the two expansions. The white back strategy cards are essential, we never play with the original set anymore and that was also Shattered Empire. So I'd say both are essential. :)
I had heard a lot of about Gates of Arkham before this, but now I really want to grab it. I've only got Unseen Forces and Omens of Ice. UF adds some great mechanics, and, while I love the flavor and increased difficulty level of OoI, I think it was made a little too difficult.
Warrior Knights: Crown and Glory. I played it with the expansion and afterwards was told what elements came from the expansion and I couldn't see playing it without the expansion being worth doing. It is also one of the most expensive out there, especially for something so small.
I think Zee is right about the effect 'Gates of Arkham' has on Elder sign, but I disagree with him that the original game isn't AS thematic as Base Elder Sign. For such a simple game, I think they do a good job with the Theme.
Umm what's with all the rhetorical questions at the end? Of course Sam is always right. Monsters should never open their mouths Tom made some giant logical leaps into the unknown. Hope that cleared it up for you.
I know the game may be a little light for you guys but I think my number 1 expansion may be Crossroads for Tokaido. I don't think I could imagine playing that game without the expansion.
The way we use the military token in Kingsburg is that we take one set of six out and put them facedown on the table. Instead of rolling the dice, we draw one of the tokens. This keeps some randomness, but as the game goes on, you know what is left. It's pretty fun when you don't know if a zero or a four is going to come up.
I hate "essential" expansions. I think I'll never try Viticulture because buying just the base game seems unsatisfying and buying both the base game and the expansion would be expensive.
Come on Tom and Zee play Sam in Robinson Crusoe and do it as a live play. I enjoyed the list, although Tom, Dice Masters is not an expansion, it is it's own game in it's own right.
Liked for the mention of Winter for New Era. Took what was already my favorite game for three players and rocketed it into the stratosphere! Zee, keep repping the New Era, what a great game!
I dislike when it is becomes necessary to have the expansion for a game. I feel like the publisher is making me pay for a game twice by only selling me half a game.
I'll admit. I don't watch a ton of Dice Tower videos, but I do watch a fair amount and this was the first "shut the door", that I've come across. Happy to see it.
Hey, just a suggestion: next time you put links in the screen use those transparent boxes and put it in the title card below... it'll be nicer that way.
Zee, I have Elder Sign and you have sold me on getting Gates of Arkham ... but, should I get Unseen Forces too? Do the two expansions blend well or does one circumvent the other?
Jeff Moore Cannot say how they blind together but Unseen Forces is hit or miss for me. The blessing/curse mechanic has been almost a non-issue in the games I've played. Whenever a curse happens 99% of the time player was already blessed so that person just loses the extra die. Unseen Forces did add some variety with adding more ancient monsters to fight and more difficult mythos cards. Zee also sold me on checking out Gates of Arkham! Very soon I will be needing to play Elder Sign with this expansion :)
Jeff Moore They blend well. If you wish to go to the streets, then you can mix everything UF brings outside of the Adventure and Mythos cards. Vice versa, if you wish to go back to the museum, then you can mix mostly everything GoA brings outside of the Arkham Adventure and Mythos cards. For anyone wondering, you do not need UF to play GoA.
My favourite expansions are probably Scoundrels of Skullport (transforms an ok worker placement to a good one) and Lost Legion for Mage Knight (Hands down best expansion (in my opinion) ever, which completes an already massive game). I do like 7 wonders Leaders and Tzolk'in expansions
FinnCanDo85 I love Mage Knight, it's my fav game, and while I like the extra cards and monsters from the expansion, pretty much everything else is a miss for me. Co-op makes the game even lengthier, and while that means there is no need for those fiddly PvP combat rules, it just won't work all that well. The new character is hands down the weakest and the most boring of the bunch and there is no way I'll ever play this game with 5 players. However, this expansion becomes essential if (and only if) you want to play the co-op scenarios. In that regard, this expansion really completes the game, as said before.
Including Dice Masters was pretty cheesy, there, Tom. It's practically a CCG, that's a whole different beast. Yes they expand the game, but you go into the game knowing that, and chasing the boosters is almost a game in itself....meh. I'd consider Summoner Wars pretty cheesy too, but the way you explained yourself gives it a pass. I guess. Shouldn't have been so high, though.
salmonblox Listening to it again, I guess I misunderstood. You're not considering the boosters the expansion, but the different base sets? That's almost worse! They're whole new games. Yes, they use the same system, but you wouldn't consider Star Wars Monopoly an expansion to Monopoly, would you?
I don't consider Summoner Wars: Master Set or any part of Dice Masters being actual expansions. There just more of the base game. Thats like having a favorite set of Magic and calling it an expansion.
John Blue From what I recall, it really just depends on how you play Magic...technically it is/was at least...seven...separate games using that or a similar playing system?
Pandemic: On The Brink brings more to the game than In The Lab. More difficulty levels, more roles, extra virus, virulent strain, and a terrorist. And each are better implemented than the Lab. Except maybe the terrorist, i doubt many people play that. But, it doesn't change the game too much, and is more of the good stuff. There is much more chance people like OTB than ITL.
Gabi Koonings Considering you can't play In The Lab without On The Brink it makes sense that OTB is better liked. I have both and think the game is mostly perfect with those two xpacs. The rest are just ways to milk gamers for more money like they hinted at.
+Gabi Koonings On The Brink is more of the same. In The Lab on the other hand makes the game complete. It's so good it feels it must have been in the original box.
Daniel Korolev I like more of the same then something that is quite a change to the game. But i do see it being added further down the road. I think OTB is easier for people to learn and get going, and later add ITL for them. Base game plus ITL might be a bit much right away. So far, i am quite contect with Base+OTB, and The Cure :D
Gabi Koonings I don't care if it's hard to teach, in no way it's the point here. The only way we play the game now is base game + In the lab. We take only roles from On the Brink. And not even that sometimes.
Currently, my favorite expansion would likely be Cosmic Dominion. The new reward deck cards and all of the aliens were top notch, and I love using the Flagship variant introduced here. I won't even have a copy of it for at least another week, but I can almost guarantee that my favorite expansion will soon be The Stuff of Legend expansion for Heroes Wanted. It's going to make an already great game even better, with an insane amount of new variablility and replayability (also why I love Cosmic and it's expansions so much; no two games will ever be the same). At one time, early in my hobby gaming career, Dunwich Horror for Arkham Horror was my favorite expansion. It made AH into a much more fulfillng experience and added to the challenge level. I agree with Zee that Leaders is my favorite 7 Wonders expansion, though I do like all of them (including both parts of Babel). Prosperity is also my favorite Dominion expansion, Tom, though I haven't played anything from Adventures yet, so that could always change.
I think it's weird they rail on RftG Expansions so hard. I guess they just don't like them what can you do. Personally I loved the expansions it opened so many win paths. Then again I like looking at my board at the end of the game and see if I did something different than previous times especially if I win and the expansions just made boards more interesting.
+wroot Think it's because they tried to add interaction (takeover and war), but I would argue all the other rules stuff is awesome. The goals, solitaire variant, drafting, even prestige, it made you think about various things, opened so many possibilities... I think Dice Tower crew doesn't like them because they were looking for more interaction between players and that is the part where the rules are... well... wonky at best. They don't seem to like the multiplayer solitaire nature. But I could be wrong.
The Darwin expansion for Robinson Crusoë is a wonderful expansion. Almost a game by itself. I think that the Solo expansion for Race for the Galaxy is a milestone in game design. Shadows of Nerekhal for Descent is a blast. And I am reaaaaally excited about the solo expansion of Conflict of Heroes (not yet available in the dark pit in the middle of Groenland where I live).
Stefan Heffner Completely different game that uses the cards in a completely different way. In TtR, you are constantly looking at/using/handling your cards, and in BSG you aren't. That would be my defense.
Somehow clicking a few annotations here and links there I landed on you Vasco da Gama review and followup video. That was so good. Its great and educational to see the difference in game complexity and evolution from 2009 to now.
Great top 10 guys! Interesting to see two Cyclades expansions among the top 10.. Have and of you had a chance to play Cyclades Hades? I've heard it is better suited for 2 player games..
There's no robot named c3k in Star Wars or Star Trek. it was a joke play on cp30 and the confusion some people get between SW/ST. Joke comment still works.
Tom: " A campaign system which could be 200 hours long" Zee's face... invaluable. The best expansion I have come across is Battles of the third age for the first edition of War of the Ring.
![ผัวเถื่อน - ยูริ โตเกียวมิวสิค [ OFFICIAL MUSIC VIDEO ]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/P08ORRVDGl8/mqdefault.jpg)
![[ TEASER ] เงาะป่า - วงL.กฮ. | TMG RECORD](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/M4ObdFfcPww/mqdefault.jpg)
Another bonus of the Kingsburg expansion is that the whole base game fits in the smaller expansion box.
Top expansions for me are (in no particular order)...
Keyflower: The Merchants
Istanbul: Mocha and Baksheesh
Nothing Personal: The Associates (because I'm featured in that one ;))
Kemet: Ta-Seti
Dominion: Prosperity
Battlestar Galactica: Pegasus
Arkham Horror: Kingsport
Elder Sign: Gates of Arkham
Tokaido: Crossroads
Mondo: Zusatzspieler Erweiterung Pack A/B (added more point conditions and tile diversity)
Sam experienced some serious squirrel moments there! Spooky. I thought he'd have the best concentration in the trio.. :)
zux1 That is the first time that has happened, and usually Tom isn't as forgiving as he was in the video. In retrospect, it was probably planned...though he did not tell me (at least) that it was going to happen.
Totally agree with Zee's number 1. Really enjoyed the base but absolutely love it with the expansion.
Great list, thanks guys!!
I'm really starting to think I need to play Kingsburg haha you guys mention it so often I need to give it a go! Stone age too...
My favorite expansion is probably Cosmic Dominion too :D
Sam I would not have cried havoc Sam if you picked both TI3 expansions. They are FANTASTIC expansions. The long war continues! Played a 3 player game this weekend and even that was fun. I do like the Shattered Empires strategic cards (most of them). I don't use the base strategic cards anymore after my first game (especially Imperial I & Tech I).
I am only about 10 minutes in and I am amused because I think the last Top 10 video I watched was the enemies of gaming and children and (smart) phones were on the list.
Leaders is my favorite of the 7 Wonders expansion as well. It's pretty much considered part of the basic game for us at this point.
A tiny quibble about the SM Master Set (and it's not the fact that it is really not an expansion) - both Tom and Zee said it comes with 8 factions - it actually comes with 6. The new one (Alliances) comes with 8, I believe.
Tom = Spongebob, Zee = Squidward, Sam = Patrick. Thanks a ton for all your vids, you've sold an amazing amount of games, to me alone! Hope you guys go to GenCon 2015.
Have and regularly play 'Innovation' with both expansions. Best with just ' Echoes', because foreshadowing never happens with the second expansion, because the extra cards stop enough foreshadowing cards from coming up and the leaders, apart from being cool names, add very poor payoffs.
Th embers of Muaat are from the other TWI3 expansion Tom - Sam was right this time :)
10:25, oh goodness gracious, AN ALPHA GAMER HAS APPEARED!
this list seems very similar to the top 10 essential expansions list, especially considering Tom's opening statement about how he chose the expansions for his list.
Jens Thernström Almost no crossover to that list though. There is a diffenrence. Plus, that list is now two years old...
Sarah Langer there's actually a lot of crossover, though I will agree that the lists are technically different. I wish they would have gone the opposite way and do the top 10 worst expansions or 10 games they prefer without expansions.
How about a Top Ten List of changes/upgrades you 3 would like to see be made to the most basic 1980's version of "Risk"?? my #1 would be adding "air-power"
As the poet Chester Cheetah once said "It's not easy, being cheesy"
Pandemic: In The Lab (specifically the Lab Challenge) and Dominion: Prosperity are probably my top ones. That being said, we don't actually own many expansions to our games (apart from Pandemic), so my experience is limited. For example, I do have Tokaido: Crossroads, but I don't think it actually made the base game that much better, just different. Most games I'm generally happy with the base game.
Cyclades Titans should have been #1-10 on ALL three of your lists! Amazing game! They may as well not even sell the two games separately anymore :)
Hey woah.. Is Tom falling asleep at 20:40 in?
edit: haha.. that was a brilliant impression of sleeping!!!
Tom, you need a red light on the outside of your "recording studio" !
"You know we're recording, right?"
That was so cute at 10:00
kilinu85 Ruby Intrusion :D
wr00t Is that an expansion to The Dice Tower?
GrandElemental Well, she has already helped Tom during his Christmas series a year or two ago and has also participated in a few reviews, so she could be an expansion in the future :)
Great countdown. Quite a few surprises.
Tom took a few liberties, but hey, it's his list, right...? ;)
Thanks Sam.. for your input on the Stone Age expansion! Awesome. Also for BSG - Pegasus. Equally fantastic! Memoir 44 I still haven't bought yet. I'm waiting for the BIG BOX version :D. King Of Tokyo is a no-brainer. Way to go, Zee!
This was one of your best Top Tens for quite a while, boys. Cool Stuff (They Pack well) are gonna be busy for a while. Frying tonight.
Pandemic: In The Lab.. I think I'll get that one too. Again, Sam.. you're the man! Elder Sign.. never saw that one coming. Zee, thanks for pointing that one out :D
I was a little shocked at Tom's reaction to the 'In the Lab' expansion for Pandemic on here. His thoughts/arguments on the 117th episode of Miami Dice when they reviewed in the lab, seemed like he was more on the fence about it and called it clunky. However, here he proudly shakes Sam's hand and says in the lab is the best! :0
I have to say, I'm with Zee when it comes to the 'On the Brink' expansion adds plenty to the base game.
Learned of some old games I might have to pick up.
I also love the unedited nature of these videos.
Can we make a Dice Tower Top 10 Drinking game? I say take a shot every time Zee says "flavor".
noodleiv How about for Zee, "short", "quick", "cute", "little", and "cardgame"?
noodleiv If you watch Dice Tower enough (I think specifically that Brewcraft game or whatever its called) Tom says he doesn't drink.
Doma Agape The drinking part is for us, the viewers, not for them.
Whenever Zee says flavor
Whenever Sam says theme
Whenever Tom disagrees with the others
Whenever anyone says "for me"
noodleiv when ever Zee says "exPANsion"
1. Talisman: The Harbinger Expansion: this expansion hasn't even been released, I can't discuss in detail why I like it yet (beta tester). But the theme is awesome, it has Biblical connotations, it changes how Talisman is played dramatically. While Talisman is only my 2nd favorite game, this expansion is just pure awesomeness!
2. Tomb: Cryptmaster: this is a separate game but many people, including me, mix it into Tomb. This made a great game even more fantastic. More monsters, more adventurers, new types of cards, and mercenaries! And while Tomb is only my 3rd favorite game, Cryptmaster just made the original game so much better.
3. RoboRally: Armed and Dangerous: Lots of cool Options and more boards. More RoboRally goodness. You would think that since RoboRally is my favorite game this would be 1 or 2, and it was tough realizing it's only #3, and this expansion is really really good. But the above two, just did more to improve the other games.
4. RoboRally: Grand Prix: brought in a new way to play RoboRally, perhaps my favorite way to play, racing around a circle.
5. BANG! Dodge City: Unfortunately when I bought Bang! I added this right to the base game so I never played it without it. But this is an essential expansion.
6. Alien Frontiers: Outer Belt: I love this expansion, the mechanics of the rotating cards is awesome. The mechanics, the game play, the added cards, and choices adds a lot to the game. This is almost a must have expansion. Not sure if it has changed, but I don't know why Tom on the Dice Tower hasn't played this expansion, it is better than Factions.
7. Talisman City (1989, 2nd edition): I prefer 4th edition Talisman, and have for probably 2 years now. But the City expansion for 2nd edition remained my favorite all time Talisman expansion for any edition, until I play tested #1 above. But I loved this expansion, mostly because of the Master characters in the 2nd City. 2nd edition is clunky compared to 4th, but I loved playing in the 2nd edition city.
8. Talisman: The Reaper Expansion: An enjoyable expansion which adds more base like feel to Talisman. It also adds the dangerous NPC Reaper.
9. Relic: Halls of Terra: Relic is Talisman in space, and I thought Relic ok-good when I first played it, but I like it more every time I play it. But something kept it from shining, and it still could use more, but this expansion did nice things to the game, and kind of reminded me of the Highlands for Talisman by allowing leveling for lower level characters, which you will see below.
10. Talisman: The Highland Expansion: I really like this expansion. A nice place to go for low level characters and a nice place to get gold.
Honorable Mentions:
11. RoboRally: Radioactive: Just another great expansion for RoboRally. I loved the mutation mechanic.
12. Alien Frontiers: Factions: This expansion can be a hit or miss, depending on what comes into the game. I have helped this with faction packs. Some Factions are awesome, others are "meh". But what also makes this expansion great is adding another player.
13. Heroes Incorporated: S.U.P.E.R.: Just like BANG! Dodge City, I got this with the base game and haven't played the base without it. It is essential for the game though.
14. Ticket to Ride 1910: I no longer own the physical game, not popular enough in my circle, but I still have the Xbox version. I agree with the Dice Tower gang, a must have expansion, just like BANG! Dodge City and Heroes Incorporated: S.U.P.E.R.
15. Lord of the Rings: Friends & Foes: The game sat unplayed for probably 8+ years, until recently and need even more play. But this expansion just gives you more of the same for the base game. I can do without the other expansions.
Keep an eye on:
Cutthroat Caverns: this game I have only played once, but has made my top 10 favorite games nonetheless. I have some expansions but have played none. I have a sneaky suspicion they will emerge highly!
Carson City: similar to above, but have played multiple games. I have a good feeling I will like the expansion(s).
Cosmic Encounter: I have only played teh game once. Don't even own it, but is on my "to get list" and have already researched the expansions. am sure they will emerge.
Dungeon Command: Blood of Gruumsh & Heart of Cormyr: I use these as expansions for my Dungeons and Dragons Adventure System Board Games. Painted mini's! Also helpers for the adventure. I love the Dungeons and Dragons Adventure System Board Games, and they need more play, not sure how influential these games will be as expansions.
Runebound 2nd edition: a fantasy game I really like, but only for 2-3 players and a game I haven't played enough of. And while the expansions are very hard to get I have some. Some just add to the base game, and without them the base game has limited re-playability (too small of decks). Just not sure which ones will emerge as I play this more over time.
King of New York: I don't think any expansions are out. I bought this game because of the hype, but I think I won't like it until expansions are added.
I love the logo for the top ten, because it looks like zee and sam have high top fades.
I doubt they'll be mentioned here, but I'm going to put out both of FFG's Blizzard adaptations: WarCraft the Board Game and StarCraft the Board Game. Their expansions helped them to much better capture the flavor of their respective games, and just added so many more options to them.
I have a suggestion about when one person is talking about a game the other two hate. For example, Tom just said "that game's boring" with no other input after Zee talks about Mr. Jack, and Zee acts about the same after Tom talks about Innovation. But you both talked about expansions that were great because they added variability to a static setup, which is a good point about a great thing expansions can do. I think the discussion would really benefit if you honed in on things like that and talked broadly about the good things rather than just tuning out because such-and-such a game sucks.
Zee's expression of his eyeballs coming from the sockets in 50:07 made me absolutely crack when Tom explains how the campaign of the game could be 200 hours long.
Tom: I have one of the Dice Masters -- but never could get into it. The whole dice moving from zone to zone wasn't very good for me. It was also a hard to understand at first.
Sam, your theme complaint about Egypt/Greece doesn't make any sense. Both civilizations were around at the same time.
Totally agree with Kingsburg. That is a game that I just can't go back to playing without the expansion. It gives me hope for whatever they do with Kingsport Festival.
Tuscany is absolutely required for Viticulture. New board, new mechanics, better improved player boards, it's just incredible. Again, you just can't go back to the base game after playing the expansion.
Gates of Arkham absolutely MADE Elder Sign. It used to be on my list of games that I would play once in a while, but now - oh man. So good.
Excellent video guys, great stuff all around.
My top ten
10 Revolution: Anarchy
9 King of Tokyo: Power up
8 Carcassonne: Inns and Cathedrals
7 Trains: Rising Sun
6 Catan: Seafarers
5 Rivals For Catan: Age of Darkness & Age of Elightenment
4 Dominion: Prosperity
3 7 Wonders: Cities & Leaders
2 Elder Sign: Streets of Arkham
1 Pandemic: In the Lab
Some of my favorite expansions: Titans(Cyclades), Conquest of Planet Earth: Apocalypse, Timber Peak(Last Night on Earth), Scoundrels of Skullport(Lord of Waterdeep), but my favorite expansion is In the Lab.
I truly don't see how you guys like Shards of the Throne more than Shattered Empire. SE singlehandedly fixed the Imperial strategy card problem by adding Bureaucracy, which take away the annoying mechanic of getting 2 VPs when you pick Imperial.
And SotT practically breaks the game, it has so many flaws. It's horribly unbalanced. SE tried to balance out the races as best it could, but SotT just threw all that out the window. Yssaril and Mindset, 2 of, if the 2 best races in the game get 2 of the best racial techs, while Sol, a mediocre race, gets the literal worst and most expensive of the game? It's ridiculous. And mechanized units are a cool idea, but they make races whose saving grace was their GFs like Sol and Yin so much worse, while being annoying immune to like everything. They're too good, comparatively. Yes, the expansion added cool and fun things, but I have to heavily house rule the game to prevent it from being broken now, in my opinion.
Two out of 3 expansions (well technically, as mine is 1912 for TtR: Europe) mentioned which i own were on Zee's list. Pied Piper is a good expansion, which i bought quickly after playing Rattus a couple of times. Though i'm now a bit of burned out on this game (after playing too much). But if i play, i usually randomly pick roles from the whole bunch. Leaders is a recent buy and i have only played it once (and have also introduced it to a player who never played 7 Wonders.. insane). I like the feel, and it indeed give you a goal. I remember i was trying to build up for one of my leaders to get lots of points. But it also kind of adds too much. You are torn between so many paths and you can do just so much on your turns. But the more the better :)
After seeing this top 10, we bought Elder Sign: Gates of Arkham, and the game went from good to amazing! Thank you for that tip, Zee!
We love these fairly compact co-op games, because we travel a lot, and always try to bring a few games with us. This just became an auto-bring =)
Scoundrels of Skullport, the Lords of Waterdeep expansion, is an awesome one. I surely thought it would be on Tom's list, the way he was going on about it earlier. Probably made his top 20 though :)
Btw, the Summoner Wars Master Set only contains six factions, not eight. The Alliances Set has eight.
You guys should consider doing a guilty pleasures list as in games you know are bad mechanically but still enjoy or games that have a silly theme or that you feel ridiculous playing.
For example I love Atmosfear but it's an awful game mechanically or I enjoy My Little Pony CCG despite the theme.
Guys, you should play Elder Sign: Gates of Arkham and do a video of your thoughts. All together... I think it could be great. Plus after that performance from Zee I doubt it will be long before you play it anyway.
***** Tom Vasel The TI3 race-specific technologies came 1-1 in the two expansions. The white back strategy cards are essential, we never play with the original set anymore and that was also Shattered Empire. So I'd say both are essential. :)
I had heard a lot of about Gates of Arkham before this, but now I really want to grab it. I've only got Unseen Forces and Omens of Ice. UF adds some great mechanics, and, while I love the flavor and increased difficulty level of OoI, I think it was made a little too difficult.
Warrior Knights: Crown and Glory. I played it with the expansion and afterwards was told what elements came from the expansion and I couldn't see playing it without the expansion being worth doing. It is also one of the most expensive out there, especially for something so small.
I think Zee is right about the effect 'Gates of Arkham' has on Elder sign, but I disagree with him that the original game isn't AS thematic as Base Elder Sign.
For such a simple game, I think they do a good job with the Theme.
Umm what's with all the rhetorical questions at the end?
Of course Sam is always right.
Monsters should never open their mouths
Tom made some giant logical leaps into the unknown.
Hope that cleared it up for you.
I know the game may be a little light for you guys but I think my number 1 expansion may be Crossroads for Tokaido. I don't think I could imagine playing that game without the expansion.
The way we use the military token in Kingsburg is that we take one set of six out and put them facedown on the table. Instead of rolling the dice, we draw one of the tokens. This keeps some randomness, but as the game goes on, you know what is left. It's pretty fun when you don't know if a zero or a four is going to come up.
I hate "essential" expansions.
I think I'll never try Viticulture because buying just the base game seems unsatisfying and buying both the base game and the expansion would be expensive.
Come on Tom and Zee play Sam in Robinson Crusoe and do it as a live play. I enjoyed the list, although Tom, Dice Masters is not an expansion, it is it's own game in it's own right.
Liked for the mention of Winter for New Era. Took what was already my favorite game for three players and rocketed it into the stratosphere! Zee, keep repping the New Era, what a great game!
Gates of Arkham really ramped up the difficulty level as well. Vanilla Elder Sign more often than not was just a player beat down of the ancient one.
I dislike when it is becomes necessary to have the expansion for a game. I feel like the publisher is making me pay for a game twice by only selling me half a game.
What about top 10 disappointing expansions? You seem to get very "passionate" when it comes to dissing games which is always entertaining to watch:).
The best expansion of all time is hands down Pandemic In The Lab. It should have been in the original box. It makes the game complete.
Or slows it down to a crawl depending on who you ask.
I'll admit. I don't watch a ton of Dice Tower videos, but I do watch a fair amount and this was the first "shut the door", that I've come across. Happy to see it.
Am I the only person who really liked the alchemy expansion for dominion? I still do not get why this expansion gets so much hate....
I agree with Sam. Just adding the large card to Ticket to Ride made it playable for me. Without the bigger cards I will not play.
Hey, just a suggestion: next time you put links in the screen use those transparent boxes and put it in the title card below... it'll be nicer that way.
Zee, I have Elder Sign and you have sold me on getting Gates of Arkham ... but, should I get Unseen Forces too? Do the two expansions blend well or does one circumvent the other?
Jeff Moore I would like to know that too.
Jeff Moore Cannot say how they blind together but Unseen Forces is hit or miss for me. The blessing/curse mechanic has been almost a non-issue in the games I've played. Whenever a curse happens 99% of the time player was already blessed so that person just loses the extra die. Unseen Forces did add some variety with adding more ancient monsters to fight and more difficult mythos cards.
Zee also sold me on checking out Gates of Arkham! Very soon I will be needing to play Elder Sign with this expansion :)
Jeff Moore They blend well.
If you wish to go to the streets, then you can mix everything UF brings outside of the Adventure and Mythos cards.
Vice versa, if you wish to go back to the museum, then you can mix mostly everything GoA brings outside of the Arkham Adventure and Mythos cards.
For anyone wondering, you do not need UF to play GoA.
LOL @ 7:16 I'm trying to figure out which president was most scary!
My favourite expansions are probably Scoundrels of Skullport (transforms an ok worker placement to a good one) and Lost Legion for Mage Knight (Hands down best expansion (in my opinion) ever, which completes an already massive game). I do like 7 wonders Leaders and Tzolk'in expansions
FinnCanDo85 I love Mage Knight, it's my fav game, and while I like the extra cards and monsters from the expansion, pretty much everything else is a miss for me. Co-op makes the game even lengthier, and while that means there is no need for those fiddly PvP combat rules, it just won't work all that well. The new character is hands down the weakest and the most boring of the bunch and there is no way I'll ever play this game with 5 players.
However, this expansion becomes essential if (and only if) you want to play the co-op scenarios. In that regard, this expansion really completes the game, as said before.
Don't let them get you down Tom. Dicemasters is awesome and my kids love playing in tournaments when we can find them.
Scoundrels of Skullport for Lords of Waterdeep is mine. Corruption is a huge addition to that game and makes a good game great.
Disappointed at the lack of Skullport. That expansion is pretty much required.
The Summoner Wars master set has 6 factions, it's the Alliances set that has 8.
I'm just going to assume Tom's list will be the exact same list he had in Board Game Breakfast.
Heh, Zee could not be any more bored during Zee's explanation of Memoir 44' Op Overlord
I swear guys, when I watch your videos I have to go to the nearest store and buy all the drinks I see that you guys drink!
Mega 1910 expansion is a must for TTR
Exodus > The Cylon Fleet was a fantastic addition to BSG
Including Dice Masters was pretty cheesy, there, Tom. It's practically a CCG, that's a whole different beast. Yes they expand the game, but you go into the game knowing that, and chasing the boosters is almost a game in itself....meh.
I'd consider Summoner Wars pretty cheesy too, but the way you explained yourself gives it a pass. I guess. Shouldn't have been so high, though.
salmonblox Listening to it again, I guess I misunderstood. You're not considering the boosters the expansion, but the different base sets?
That's almost worse! They're whole new games. Yes, they use the same system, but you wouldn't consider Star Wars Monopoly an expansion to Monopoly, would you?
We needed Monty Python to scream "Get on with it!" to Sam at #9.
You guys should do top ten of, 2 to 4 player games that are better played with just two players
No Lords of Waterdeep: Scoundrels of Skullport? I am disappointed. : /
Sam, your affinity for pandas carry over into any Takenoko love? Or just a pandakai fan?
Why does vanilla ice cream get such a bad rap?
Vanilla ice cream with no toppings is my favorite ice cream.
really surprised that Tragedy Looper: Midnight Circle isn't on this list.
I wonder where galaxy trucker: big expansion is on Tom's list.
I don't consider Summoner Wars: Master Set or any part of Dice Masters being actual expansions. There just more of the base game. Thats like having a favorite set of Magic and calling it an expansion.
John Blue From what I recall, it really just depends on how you play Magic...technically it is/was at least...seven...separate games using that or a similar playing system?
have they done a top 10 games with to much setup because they should lol ie rum and bones
have they done a top 10 games with to much setup because they should lol ie rum and bones
Pandemic: On The Brink brings more to the game than In The Lab. More difficulty levels, more roles, extra virus, virulent strain, and a terrorist. And each are better implemented than the Lab. Except maybe the terrorist, i doubt many people play that. But, it doesn't change the game too much, and is more of the good stuff. There is much more chance people like OTB than ITL.
Gabi Koonings Considering you can't play In The Lab without On The Brink it makes sense that OTB is better liked. I have both and think the game is mostly perfect with those two xpacs. The rest are just ways to milk gamers for more money like they hinted at.
Haven't tried the new one yet, and am very curious about a Legacy version they're supposed to be working on
+Gabi Koonings On The Brink is more of the same. In The Lab on the other hand makes the game complete. It's so good it feels it must have been in the original box.
Daniel Korolev I like more of the same then something that is quite a change to the game. But i do see it being added further down the road. I think OTB is easier for people to learn and get going, and later add ITL for them. Base game plus ITL might be a bit much right away.
So far, i am quite contect with Base+OTB, and The Cure :D
Gabi Koonings I don't care if it's hard to teach, in no way it's the point here. The only way we play the game now is base game + In the lab. We take only roles from On the Brink. And not even that sometimes.
Zee, Mr. Jack with the Extension, or Mr. Jack in New York. Which one?
Currently, my favorite expansion would likely be Cosmic Dominion. The new reward deck cards and all of the aliens were top notch, and I love using the Flagship variant introduced here.
I won't even have a copy of it for at least another week, but I can almost guarantee that my favorite expansion will soon be The Stuff of Legend expansion for Heroes Wanted. It's going to make an already great game even better, with an insane amount of new variablility and replayability (also why I love Cosmic and it's expansions so much; no two games will ever be the same).
At one time, early in my hobby gaming career, Dunwich Horror for Arkham Horror was my favorite expansion. It made AH into a much more fulfillng experience and added to the challenge level.
I agree with Zee that Leaders is my favorite 7 Wonders expansion, though I do like all of them (including both parts of Babel).
Prosperity is also my favorite Dominion expansion, Tom, though I haven't played anything from Adventures yet, so that could always change.
I think it's weird they rail on RftG Expansions so hard. I guess they just don't like them what can you do. Personally I loved the expansions it opened so many win paths. Then again I like looking at my board at the end of the game and see if I did something different than previous times especially if I win and the expansions just made boards more interesting.
amn1088 I think most people like the new cards the expansions add. But the war and other weird and complicated mechanisms get all the hate.
wr00t I concur, I refuse to play war variations in RftG, an thankfully my circle of gamers agree.
+wroot Think it's because they tried to add interaction (takeover and war), but I would argue all the other rules stuff is awesome. The goals, solitaire variant, drafting, even prestige, it made you think about various things, opened so many possibilities... I think Dice Tower crew doesn't like them because they were looking for more interaction between players and that is the part where the rules are... well... wonky at best. They don't seem to like the multiplayer solitaire nature. But I could be wrong.
surprised the waterdeep expansion didnt make it, it is definitely a serious changer
The Darwin expansion for Robinson Crusoë is a wonderful expansion. Almost a game by itself.
I think that the Solo expansion for Race for the Galaxy is a milestone in game design.
Shadows of Nerekhal for Descent is a blast.
And I am reaaaaally excited about the solo expansion of Conflict of Heroes (not yet available in the dark pit in the middle of Groenland where I live).
Sam, if you can't stand the small cards of the TTR tickets, how do you survive a game of BSG with its skill cards?
Stefan Heffner Completely different game that uses the cards in a completely different way. In TtR, you are constantly looking at/using/handling your cards, and in BSG you aren't. That would be my defense.
Somehow clicking a few annotations here and links there I landed on you Vasco da Gama review and followup video. That was so good.
Its great and educational to see the difference in game complexity and evolution from 2009 to now.
Where do I get similar Carcassonne coasters?
Peter Wehmeier I think at geekygoodies.com
smallworlds-underworld is really good
Great top 10 guys! Interesting to see two Cyclades expansions among the top 10.. Have and of you had a chance to play Cyclades Hades? I've heard it is better suited for 2 player games..
ZEE! C3K... a robot from that "Star Trek" movie! NOOOO! You mean STAR WARS! *facepalm.
There's no robot named c3k in Star Wars or Star Trek. it was a joke play on cp30 and the confusion some people get between SW/ST. Joke comment still works.
Tom: " A campaign system which could be 200 hours long"
Zee's face... invaluable.
The best expansion I have come across is Battles of the third age for the first edition of War of the Ring.
i really like the Tzol'kin expansion. I think it's a must-have and it makes the game feel much more complete
Yes, I agree.