Considering he was supposed to die at the end of last season. I thought it was a fantastic choice to keep him around to foreshadow and contrast just how opposite Marcus is. Ashford was angry and lost everything and retains a sense of honor and dignity that may be lacking in the new world without him. Marcus is angry and hurts everyone else when he does not succeed. To the point where his harm could effect those long after he is stopped.
I am sad he died... At first i really didn´t liked him at all, but he grew and at some point his reasons were ALWAYS logical and for the greater good. At least i just loved this character and the actor was such a great choice! Really good arc for a character. I also wanna point out the chemistry between him and Drummer, my favorite duo in this whole series!
Slippy6582 same. I didn’t like him at first, I thought he was going to antagonize Drummer. I really liked how they became good friends and their scenes together were always great. The boss man will be missed
I like weekly episodes. It gives people a chance to discuss the show week to week. All at once you have to binge the whole thing before discussing or you run into spoilers. It's just a lot more fun with weekly episodes, in my opinion.
Don’t worry, it says. We’re gonna be fine. The investigator pushes his hat back, wishes he had a beer. He likes this woman. This Elvi. He wishes he’d had a little more time to know her. He wishes he had a little more time. He doesn’t care. He has died a million times since he died. The void has no mysteries for him now. He connects, and the investigator becomes the world. He feels it everywhere. The orbital bases, the power cores in the crushing depth of the ocean, the library vaults where the old ones had lived, the signaling stations high in the mountains, the cities deep beneath the ground. He is the world. There is a struggle at the end. There’s always a struggle at the end. He’s not scared, and so all through the world, the others aren’t either. You’re like Peter Pan, she says. When a child died, Peter Pan would fall halfway with them. So they wouldn’t be scared. Weird. And that’s a kid’s story? Anyway, it’s not me, the investigator says, smiles at her. Holds her hand. I don’t go for half. - it reaches out and it reaches out and it reaches out and then it stops. Rip Investigator
What I dislike is that they made the investigator and miller separate people. Miller died when they first made the investigator but the investigator is still partially Miller in the books.
@@politicallycorrectredskin796 its not tough it's just the investigators part that is miller it's still the investigator (+ the whole hat thing is just in the show not the books )
@@karlfranzemperorofmandefil5547 No one gives af what is in the books...this is a TV show and millions of viewers don't know (and some don't care) what is in the books. If it's not on screen, it doesn't exist PERIOD
Entropy Generator My only complaint was I have seen DS in so many shows and movies before that I was always distracted by his accent on this show. It felt fake to me. Otherwise, a truly good performance and a really great character that got to evolve through his appearances in the series.
@@kmlammto Unlike you, Strathairn has flown completely under my radar. I looked at his IMDb page and there were a lot of things I had not seen plus a lot of characters I had not noticed in things I had seen. Okay, I get it. Veteran actor with a ton of cred. He was even in the original "Boomer Existentialism" flick , "The Return of the Secaucus Seven" which was released several years before Glenn Close, Jeff Goldberg, et al, made wallowing in fond memories of protesting everything a thing for everyone who was there and a tedium for those of us too young, but thanks for the great music, in "The Big Chill" So he was a new quantity for me and I was completely enthralled with him. I am actually wanting to go back and watch some of his early stuff.
@@kmlammto I don't buy the fake belter slang accent from most actors on the show tbh, takes me right out of it. But Ashford and Drummer are the only ones who sound convincing.
Klaes Ashford - I'll miss him, he always gave this Veteran Vibe who learned that there's more in Life than revenge because he exactly did the fucked up things he don't want others to repeat.
These authors are not terribly sentimental about death. I like it! GIves the show some sting. I hate feeling as if main characters are automatically invincible.
Fantastic season. Burned through the entire thing in two days. Love the nuance and complexity and physics at play. Going to fucking miss Miller and Ashford. Legends.
SciFi channel has been really stupid about dropping good shows for more reruns of other shows like stargate. Remember when they dropped firefly? Imagine if Amazon had saved that tv series. Though the movie Serenity did due some justice to giving the series an ending.
@@jasonlynch282 Scifi is a small channel. They are basically like a start up company. Most start up companies usually create something good in hoping to sell it. Then, they can use that money to create another thing. Same for this. As the show goes on, it will get more expensive. For ex, the actor will demand less money in season 1 because they are not famous. Therefore, they are not in control of demanding a higher salary. But now, as the season 4, it is a different story.
Ashfrod was for me, one of the most annoying character that I love to hate because they don't think much during the past season. But on this one ? He was so good as a character. The whole season was too good. Can't wait for S5 !
The show has had a pattern from the beginning of introducing characters and leaving their allegiances nebulous until they need to reveal who the character actually is. Almost everyone on the Roci was initially, Avasarala toed the line constantly, Fred and Drummer were unknowns (Anderson Dawes too for that matter.) This season it was kinda fuzzy as to which Earthers were trustworthy on Ilus but that sorted itself out quickly. Ashford tho i think was the most suspicious character on the show but by the end of season 3 he was as usual one of the good guys. Im gonna miss him; i also knew he was dead when he gave the booze back to Drummer. 😭
I enjoyed ashfords character also. Only thing I think should have been different is that he should have gone out guns blazing. to me that seems more his character. I get they had to get him sending a message or something to exploit marcos plan but I dont see him being that methodical. I see him knowing its the end, marco in his sights, going out with a bang.
@@buckwilde2212 I hoped that Ashford would take Drummers place as the one to stay loyal and lead the OPA after Freds death and Drummer takes Pas place. Sadly that's not true. I however hope that Ashfords sacrifice wasn't in vain and maybe say that the message he sent out was the reason only a part of earth died not all of it .
The 1 on 1 character interactions and dialogue was always good, but to me, it feels like they just took it to a whole new level this season. Naomi's heart to heart with Lucia that ended with: "There is a path from where you are now..." just captured the best of personal connection and shared humanity. This show is such a pleasure to watch!
Found the pace to be a lot slower this season, but it didn’t take anything away from it. But Amos totally stole the show this time around haha. I also think we’re going to be seeing a lot more of Elvi in the next season. There’s no way she came out of that.... thing, unchanged. She desperately wanted Holden’s “gift” of personal contact and a connection with an alien race. Well.... I’m betting she’s got it now. Probably not for the better, either.
Not sure, but I think Elvi is on earth for the next bit and then disappears for a while before returning in a new capacity in book eight. So we might have a season or two of not an amazing amount of Elvi before they get that far. Hoping they won't rush it though.
There were some key differences from the books versus season four. Some of those are: - Faraz (Elvi's scientist friend) is actually on Ilus with her. - Havelock (Miller's old partner) is actually on the Edward Israel; they kept Faraz on the Israel instead to fill the requirement for a good guy being in orbit - Naomi never goes down to the surface; she is actually captured by Havelock when she attempts to sabotage the shuttle they weaponized - The theft of Martian Tech is actually different; in the books. Filip (Naomi's son) orchestrates a theft from an asteroid controlled by Mars that has the stealth tech they stole - Marcos is never actually captured; he is more of a shadowy figure and takes a more prominent role in subsequent books - Ashford doesn't have a role; his character was changed quite a bit from the books. In the books, he is far nastier and is no friend of Drummer or Fred - Bobbie's role is much more expanded with her discovering the theft of martian tech; as mentioned, in the books, that is done differently - The belter family, where the mother blew up the landing pad does exist, but they are actually the parents of Katoa, the young boy who was transformed into the protomolecule monster that Bobbie killed; also, it is the father that blows up the landing pad. Not the mother The overall narrative is actually pretty in keeping with the books. Including Miller as 'the investigator' and the depiction of the alien technology 'dead zone'; which is like a ball of light. I like the way they depicted that on the show; it matched the way I envisioned in my mind. Very good season on the whole. And in my opinion, the best sci fi show on TV right now.
Just hoping they don't make this into a terminator story. aka Alien(s) who made protomocule, and the alien that destroyed them are one in the same. So a new technology became sentient and overcame their masters. It be a bit like BSG too in that case (Human>Cylons>Cohabitation).
I binged it and loved it. It took about half the first episode to get back up to speed, but once I did, WOW! Production quality has improved with Amazon on board. This is so good that I'm going to start on the books.
Production quality? I found it lacking compared to previous seasons. The colors were highly muted (Avasarala didn't have the bright/shiny clothes as before; the proto-molecule removed from Rocinante was a dull blue...). A couple errors of logic. Alex lying to the captain RE: Noami's medical status; because they havent' yet learned how important it is to be honest. Final episode: a 3 man breaching team... recipe for disaster; Ashford is the big flowlotah now. At least Amos was still Amos, and he did the crazy eye thing masterfully. Serve me up a Season 5 please.
The books are enjoyable. The last two have me really excited about the ending. Read the novels and the novellas in the order that they released them for the full experience.
Did NOT like the recasting of Avasarala's husband, Arjun. Not just the actor was different but the nature of their relationship was too different. After being so hands off before now he is pushing her to be a politician?!
Recasting was total blunder, if old actor was not available, they should have just CGI some video messages using old face or simply forget the character. From age difference perspective, it could been son and mother...
Hated Avasarala's husband and his whining, Chrisjen didn't do anything that warranted his reactions. He failed to be supportive of the tough decisions she made.
The wise Patriarch is so rare in media these days, Ashford was one of the best current examples of one, and a badass space pirate on top of that. Loved the character. I will miss him going forward.
Damn, the Ashford-Drummer duo was my favorite somehow. His death imo was the most touching one of the series so far. The Roci's crew is so heavily wrapped up in plot armor that I never really get invested in the drama when they are in trouble. It's the secondary characters that get to me.
That's very true. We can never really feel too concerned about the Roci crew. Instead we worry about the people they're close to. they certainly could have killed Lucia for instance.
I've been waiting for that scene in the final episode since Avarsala was out on the roof with her grandson, talking about how she feared those that threw rocks....
@@TheWolfsnack that scene whrn he made his testflight, half of the scene I had big redxflashing lights in my mind and alerts blurring.... Crying to my Screen:"stop, dont fo this, do not Start the engine.....
Yes, I enjoy binge watching the show, and I hate week to week shows. I really enjoyed this season of the Expanse and love that Amazon picked it up. I'm looking forward to season 5, and I'm going to miss my guy Miller!
The very idea ending needs explaining is also milking it for views. He flung something at Earth to gauge their defensive capabilities, then he obtained a very large rock. Gee I wonder why.
@@idokwatcher2062 More then one rock ...he(belter terrorist) had been travelling around the Solar System gathering Large Asteroids and then using Mars Stealth Technology on them and then shot them off at Earth...From the End Scene it looks like there's around 7 or 8 Asteroids on collision course with Earth..multiple trajectory's striking earth at different times to cover the global with meteor strikes...simple as that. The Terrorist Belter used Mars Stealth Tech to hide the meteors from Earth Defences...
personally I'm more intrigued by the protomolecules and the ancient civilization aspects than the factions. I mean the political intrigue is interesting and shows the human side of the stories, I just want more the "scifi" lore aspect more
i said tht literally verbatim and i hope season 5 isnt all about the factions and mars and stuff bc the accurate alien shit is whats amazing now lmao its like alien and star wars had a baby
@@gentryhaney4713 I'm the opposite. I prefer the human politics and conflict the most, with the sci fi, fantasy stuff just acting as a catalyst. It's probably why season 2 is still my favorite.
But then all you need is know of stories like BSG and terminator to know whats going to happen with that. I hope I am wrong though: "Ultimately I hope they don't make this a terminator/BSG esque story. The fact that the protomocule and alien race that built it with the destruction of "something else" paints the picture to me that the "secret" of the entire story is that new technology gained sentient(ence?) and fought back against their creator. Like Cylon did to Humans in BSG (although the "destruction of mankind" was coexistance) and Machines did to humans in Terminator. If it is that, it's just the human obsession of what we are creating will somehow gain independence and turn on us (the creator). For some reason we always think of what we create, only is for destruction and torment."
@@METALFREAK03 The protomolecule didn't turn on its builders, what destroyed them was something else entirely. It's strongly hinted in the books that the reason those others destroyed the builders of the protomolecule may have been that they found the protomolecule tech itself abominable (I would guess perhaps because of the way it hijacks and in the process destroys all other life.)
I don't usually pay much attention to women's dresses. But Avasarala's outfits are AMAZING. The Expanse should win an award for most beautiful and exotic outfits, of any movies too TVseries.. Love this show, everything about it perfectly right.
Binge watch all the way, I hate weekly releases it just leaves me craving for more and end up annoyoed. So I wait for quite few episodes before watching something I know I will like.
@Matt Fors that was HBO Max released Raised by Wolves. It worked pretty well considering that show prompted a lot of theory discussion week to week. For season 5 of the Expanse they're continuing the release schedule of The Boys s2. 3 episodes on the first week then 1 episode weekly after that.
Ashford seems definitely dead. But it’s not totally clear if Miller is really dead now, since he’s been Protomolecularized, so he might still come back later on. Hope so.
I’ve been hearing this a lot lately so I’m offering up the information for anyone interested. “Whenever” is for a non-specific time. “We can go whenever you want.” “When” is for a specific time. “We’ll go when this show is over.”
Considering the book spends the majority of pov around Illus I was impressed how much leg work they got in exposition with bobby+Ashfords plotlines. The tv audience now have everything they need to understand what will transpire in S5+6 I am curious if Drummers decision to save Marcus this season helps her become queen of the pirates or maybe she will be a trafic cop forever who knows.
I binged all but the last 2 episodes on the 13th when they came out. I was going to finish the next day, but as the saying goes Life Happens. I finally was able to finish the season yesterday.
It's the best sci fi series on still, but story wise, I found it lacking compared to the first 3 seasons. They didn't go that much further with the proto molecule. It was almost like the same thing again with different colors and a bit of origin. Seems like they focused on smaller, more personal stories which shouldn't really matter as much as the fate of mankind. Felt like the first three seasons were layers building a cake and this season they frosted it a little. I do like that everyone stayed in character and didn't suddenly change with motivations being pulled out of their asses because of a new production company though. Also, everything stayed logical.
I think a lot of the problem you are having is that the events haven't come to fruition yet. A lot of huge stuff with massive ramifications for the future of mankind progressed, it just hasn't come to fruition in all cases. - Humanity established it's first viable colony outside of sol system - Earth reversed it's quarantine position and began colonizing in earnest. - Mars has begun to collapse both economically and culturally. Several characters have openly talked about this, and it's obvious ramifications (Why would you work on improving mars, when there are 1300 better starting points you could go to and do the same thing only faster and easier)? But that's the major thread of the season. Mars, the most technologically advanced human military force in existence, has collapsed and is now selling it's military tech to anyone who wants it, no questions asked, soviet union style. - And of course, Inaros has emerged as a major antagonist with massive terrorist plans and martian military tech to back them up. I would argue that season 1 was far smaller in apparent scope. It played out more like a detective story about what the hell was going on with Mao, and only in retrospect did the events take on major importance to humanity at large. It seems like Eros station and the threat to Ceres station are large relative to the collapse of the MCR, but in the fiction, Mars has a population of 9 billion and the combined total pop of Eros/Ceres are under 10 million. They are not even close in scale, even ignoring the militarization of the Martian state. .
@@timmietimmins3780 Yup, I agree totally, loved this new season but its inevitable in a story like this that you end up with some people feeling its a little empty, simply because we haven't seen the story the whole way through yet. It is definitely an important chapter in the story, and sets up a number of things to come, I think in the years ahead when the series finally concludes the value of these intermediate series will be fully realised.
Bare in mind that's mostly because the book apart from the Prelude and epilogue is entirely covering events on Illus. Because in book form you get the sense you are a long way from home without any communication. No one has any clue what's happening. They brought a lot of book 5 stuff in to set up season 5 & 6 To really deliver. Freed them up a lot of exposition because they did the leg work in bobby and asfords lines this season.
I think because in this season they explored the theme of colonizing new worlds (there were a lot of references to colonization back on Earth in 16th-19th centuries). And the thing with colonization is that despite it being actually a huge step in history, it usually starts with small groups of exploreres&settlers - literally dozens as shown in this season. Only after that comes the mass wave of colonizers&immigrants.
After finishing season 4 the night after I had a dream that just before Ashford stops singing the Roci crew comes along and saves him. I guess I was super bummed out by his death in my subconscious. RIP Captain.
I'm fine wit the deviations from book 4 and parts of book 5. (I'm reading Tiamat's Wrath now and re-read books 4 and 5 in preparing for this season. Ashford served a purpose on the show even though he wasn't in the later books. Drummer's a clever survivor and I hope to see her through future seasons. Naomi's and Elvi's dramas in book 4 and the rescue of the Barbi crew, missing from the show, were superfluous and not necessary to advance the story. They did Murtry and Wei just right. I like what they did with the events involving Bobbie on Mars but I hope season 5 will give us a lot of the space action of books 5 and 6. Also, I am looking forward to the churn with the Roci crew in future seasons, in particular Amos', Bobbie's and Alex's back stories and adventures and what they bring to the story. I get how the foundation is established, even in S4E1 for seasons 5 and 6. As soon as I read book 4 it was apparent how some season 1 dialog foreshadowed the end of season 4/beginning of season 5. So I've payed close attention to the dialogs in season 4 for foreshadowing. The authors had a big part in the show just as George RR Martin played a big part in early seasons of GOT. The books work. Sticking to the books will prevent the eyerolling mess that GOT turned into.
My favorite dialogue in the book was the final talk between Bobby and Avasarala. Was a bit disappointed they didn't put that into the series. Instead they leave it to a random cop to deliver the prognosis on mars survival and turn bobby to a thief. They could have put that dialogue,slightly changed, with Avasarala at the dinner and then have Avasarala put Bobby "back on the board", doing a investigation about the ships and thefts or something, doing both characters great service.
Agreed. They should have hired you to do the story. What we got instead just was not Bobby. I was also hoping she might do some weight lifting in the off-season so her arms do not look so much like tapioca pudding.
I’ve binge watched this series 3 times already, and learn new information every time. This is a beautiful show, well made, and well depicted. Excited to read the books!
I actually didn't, it felt like they were trying too hard to make her likeable. Half of the swearing this time around felt gratuitous and juvenile. It had more impact before _because_ it was used more sparingly.
@@d0nj03 Before it was on SYFY so she couldn't swear much. Season 4 she swore about as much as she did in the books so she was actually more true to her character
@@deedoubleyou7116 She was better in the first seasons. Sometimes the TV adaptation does some things better than the source material, and this was one example.
yeah they made great use of him again this season. For some reason I prefer his old look. He almost looks 'too respectable'. I guess he's growing. but maybe not :)
Sooo, I'd planned to watch this as a Xmas Marathon. Welp binged it last night. Thanks to Amazon for bringing this series back. And bravo to the costume designer. Avasarala was SERVING in every episode!
Hi Pete, just trudging through your videos that I overlooked during "The Expanse" run (this was one) and re-watching others. Missing "The Expanse" greatly, presently reading the final trilogy and short stories and enjoying the hell out of them Planning to go back and read the first six novels and accompanying short stories once I've finished. Great videos. Peace.
While season 1-3 each progressed the main story by a lot, season 4 starts out strong and it pretty much keeps the pace till the end, but it doesn't progress the story as much. I was missing a big showdown/ season finale. Don't get me wrong, amazon did an amazing job - it's just a little bit different. At no point was I bored and there were interesting turn of events. I recently heard that TE is based off books - I haven't read those, so maybe the 4th book was just not as story intensive.
As mentioned in the video Book 4 Prelude and epilogue has a small bit with bobby and Avasaralas plots but 90% of the book is the events on Illus. It creates this sense that they are a long way from home, with no communication and the Roci crew are the only sane people keeping the peace whilst resolving the mystery of the planet. Everything else sets up a lot of action for book 5 and 6.
This show is fantastic, real gritty personable characters which you get to follow as the show unwinds. Special effects, ship battles and a continuous epic storyline, never fail to deliver results. It's hats off to the main cast, as they pull it out the bag. Here's to season 5 + 6 and beyond! Nice simple 12-minute reminder from Pete Peppers!
I hope they get Bobby back in the band. She was so great taking on the proto creature. Season 4 was like she was confined to quarters. Ashford and Miller gone........................ New Doctor is very good and someone please kill Murtry ASAP. Too bad about Amos's flame. Don't mess with Amos.
It was sad because it made no sense. What was the point of not crippling the ship hard and boarding with just 2 other people? Retarded and only written that way to pull Naomi's son out of some writer's arse. Ashford died a fool thanks to the writers.
You got a glimpse of the horror that awaits toward the end of season 4. Not the rocks...they are bad enough, but the thing that shut down all the machines. I can hardly wait for book 9 to come out.
I think they could have had the raids Bobby ended up being involved in being for something else as a pre-cursor to Filip's raid at the ship yard as that was a pretty intense start to Nemesis Games and was hoping that would be visualised
These small metal things swarming on New Terra and their behaviour recalls for me Stanislaw Lem's Invincible (Niezwyciężony). Actually, the story lines have a suspicious number of parallels.
Thanks for the recap, it helped clear up a few things. I think this is the best show on tv. And it's the writing. The characters have real motivations that are relatable, and usually they don't act stupid.
I binged season 4 yesterday and I prefer it that way than week to week. I have never read the books so I cannot compare however I absolutely love these series. Shame Miller is killed off as I really liked his character. Great breakdown Man!
@@PetePeppers1 One thing I could not help while reading the book series (which I started after binge-watching S3) was to portray the characters in my mind as the actors in the series!
What bothered me was after Murtry’s second murder the local belters did not lynch him, its not like the belters in new terra were unarmed and this guy was clearly a murderer and hated the belt. It seemed like all his fun stories involved screwing belters out of money
Personally, I enjoyed all the book changes/adaptation and the whole season A LOT more that Cibola Burn and I wish I could see S5 and S6 right now LOL Can't wait to see whom they'll cast as a certain future "mystery man".
@@PetePeppers1 I wouldn't call it worst, but it can be a different experience (tho less obvious when binging). I'm a spoiler addict. I've been reading the last pages first since I was a child so Idk how many ppl can relate to that but, when it comes to longform storytelling, knowing how it ends (or where it goes) allows me to enjoy the ride getting there. I wish ppl who say "you ruined it for yourself" could've seen me while binging this season literally at the edge of my seat through the most part. This being said, I can see how ppl who don't have the knowledge of future events or don't focus on the bigger story are not particularly happy with Avasarala or Bobby's storyline this season or w. Ashford/Strathairn exiting the show or wanting more Dawes and Fred Johnson and so on. Great characters/actors but the story is bigger than any of them. As much as I enjoy all individual contributions, I can understand the show's choices when trying to adapt book events to 10 episode of TV, moving the plot forward while also keeping touch w. fan favorites. I actually think that the way they showed the effects on the Inners through Avasarala and Bobby was very inspired even if they were made "weak" as some have said. Imo, that was the point. PS: as for binging vs. weekly release, these too can provide a different experience. While binging one can lose many of the details and, ofc, post season conversations are not as long and in depth as the weekly post episode analysis. But now that I've binged it, I will go rewatch it just to pay extra attention to details. I literally jumped when they gave us that close shot of Holden administering his cancer meds in beginning of the season knowing their significance later one. I'll go back to look for more details like this in case I missed them the first time around plus other easter eggs for the future like the a certain name drop of our "mystery man" on one of them screens. I think u can make such "easter eggs" videos or even episode by episode reviews if u want to, I'm sure Expanse fans will love them even if it's not the same as the weekly thing. PPS: looks like I've overcompensated for the brevity of the first comment LOL
I loved it. I binge watched ALL if season 4. From what I read on Wikipedia, the TV shows follows the books pretty close. i really want more. Probably will buy the remaining books. Great video you made! Thanks!
The quality of the series has gone way up this season I was impressed all around. It was cool seeing a lot of people from other shows that I love. Good serious grown up scifi no bullshit this season ; )
Loved this season. I think Amazon stepped it up, the effects were better, the story really was satisfying, and I couldn’t stop watching once I started.
Great re-cap and heads up on the major storylines to follow. Book 4 was very narrow being only about Illus. I'm glad they added the Earth and Mars aspects to keep Season 4 much broader in scope. I haven't read past book 4 yet..
It seemed to me Miller broke free of the protomolecule constraints to finally lay to rest the echoes of all those consumed on Eros. He talked about hearing the voices of those who were on Eros like they were still suffering.
I thought they did a good job, given the material at hand. The 4th book was the slowest by far, hence the drive to pull in aspects of the novellas and following book.
Me too, tho on second watching I skipped most of the parts not on Ilus, mostly to catch Miller's investigative ramblings. I like bobbies character and the actor that plays her, the Mars storyline was, imo, a smart way to keep her on board and by itself a decent story. I find her life of crime to be a stretch though. Same with Avasarala for that matter.
@@Grandude77 "Thank you," says Amos to Murtry for punching him. Murtry just signed his death warrant. Can't wait for season 5 and to see how that turns out.
Ashford's ending, the entire time I was just sitting there shouting CAMINA IS BEHIND THAT DOOR!! SHE DOCKED A SHUTTLE BEFORE ANYONE COULD SEE IT.... and nope.
I get vibes the that Ring Builders are the Xeelee and they are fighting the Photino Birds by blowing up the stars. I find it interesting that consciousness itself is what they attack, and their weapon is black holes... so yeah. Xeelee. I'm not complaining, really cool to see hard sci-fi concepts mixed together and put on HD CGI. I get heavy Mass Effect vibes too from Holden, reminds me so much of a straight Paragon Shepard. hahaha Love this show. Can't wait to see the Magnetar Class in action on my big screen.
I did not mind the 10 episode season. I was totally blown away. It really made the story telling tight and kept my interest. I binge watched the last four episodes and hate to have to wait for the next season. Amazon, hurry up, please.
I just finished watching it... it was very thrilling, I love all the space scenes - they did a way better job with those compared to previous seasons... and cant wait for season 5!!! I was actually hoping that we see a lot of planet exploration in season 4 but now it looks like it will happen in season 5 :)))
I misread actually :D it was in July this year that they announced there was going to be a fifth season but in any case.. looking forward to the next season and a lot others to come :)
@AdamBlacksburg there is no announcement, but they started filming in October and will finish filming in February. For months may be enough for them to finish the vfx.
@@VitorHugoOliveiraSousa Season 5 started around the same that season 4 started filming the year prior. So season 5 will most likely air around the same time. And let's keep our fingers crossed for a weekly episode release, instead of the entire season at once. I really cannot be trusted *not* to binge. Nemesis Games is the big thing every Expanse fan has been looking forward to ever since season 1. In a sense, it's the Empire Strikes Back of The Expanse. It should be given the honor of having only one or two episodes per week.
@@STR33TSofJUST1C3 I recently started listening to the audiobooks and just started the sixth one - luckily as a they brought some of the things from 5th to this season. To be honest I didn't like 5th book that much - with all the characters going their separate ways and the story not even going beyond the ring - just another human war inside the Solar System. The only impactful event of the 5th book were the asteroids and at some point I actually hoped they'll finish this season with the resolution of the asteroids storyline - they could then basically skip book five and go straight to six in season 5 :P
Great review, Pete. I don't think I've missed anything and agree with your interpretation. To me, as an old timer, I think Corey's books are the greatest works of "Hard" SF since the later Arthur C Clarke's "Songs of Distant Earth" and Stanislav Lev's "Solaris". People live messy lives in The Expanse, they often die bad deaths, often betrayed ..... Mars is the technocratic dream that loses its way after the protomolecule comes on the scene, and later when the Ring Gate is opened ..... Earth is riding its imperialism for a fall, as the Mother of Humanity, but is doing a poor job to control the Belters, who have mined the raw materials of Earth and Mars' largesse, without reaping the benefits. There are parallels with contemporary history, of course, with the mysterious precursor races that built the protomolecule and ring gate hovering in the background, in the way such civilisations did in ACC's work. The Expanse is just an amazing achievement. Thank you for providing such a cogent analysis.
I haven't read the books, and not planning to until the end of the series. Having said that, I love this season, but it barely answered the protomolecule creators/enemy question. From what you said, I guess this season won't provide much about that. I was still puzzled about the Ilus structures though. Does the the book Cibola Burn provide more details as to what the structure that was moving trying to do prior to the missile hit? And why did that one island exploded? Was it a response by the structures from the missile hit? If caused by the structures, then why would the protomolecule respond by adjusting the physics to avoid it happenning again if they caused it? And why the hell was the moon melting? I have a feeling that these actions by the structures are beyond the understanding of the characters at the moment, but does the book at least shed some light on this?
I'll try not to spoil anything, the books themselves don't really give a lot of information about the Builders, even in the later books we barely know anything about them. The only things left behind are their tools. Ilus is one of such tools and in the books Miller calls it a "gas station" of sorts, the entire thing is similar to a refinery on a planetary scale
In the books a lot more details are given about the nature of the different artifacts on the planet, especially in conversations with Miller and Holden. For example, Miller explains that there are gigantic nuclear reactors beneath the sea on the chain of islands. When Miller starts snooping around the planetary energy network he turns everything on so a lot of artifacts start to wake up, but after 2 billion years, a lot of things obviously malfunction. The nuclear explosion was probably caused by one of those nuclear reactors beneath the islands melting down. So was the melting moon. After the explosion, the planetary defense network goes into alert and interprets any high energy source as a threat, which is why the fusion reactors on the ships stop working, and why the shuttle the Edward Israel sends to evacuate the colonists gets shot down. As Miller explains, the moons are part of a defense network set up by the Builders that could "vaporize Ceres if it wanted to". There are a million other cool snippets of information that let you know just how badass the Builders were and how much control they had over their environment.
I am a book reader and I loved what they did with Bobbie's arc here in Season 4. Although I also loved what was happening on Ilus and knew pretty much what to expect and liked the actors they chose for the characters, Bobbie's arc was unexpected and truly entertaining and in the end thrilling. Looking forward to Season 5 which I already know will be epic!
Ashford was such a good character, I hated him, but respected him, then loved him. he went out like a boss.
Mark Welschmeyer like when he blasted through the door... that was SO BALLER
Exact same thing here.
...went out like a Bosmang.
rip bosmang
Drummer is gonna freaking hulk out on Marco. I loved the chemistry between her and Ashford. Now they wont get to enjoy that bottle together. :(
Bummed about Ashford. He was just a damn boss. His actor was great.
I was about to say the same thing, it was a letdown, great character, great actor.
Considering he was supposed to die at the end of last season. I thought it was a fantastic choice to keep him around to foreshadow and contrast just how opposite Marcus is. Ashford was angry and lost everything and retains a sense of honor and dignity that may be lacking in the new world without him. Marcus is angry and hurts everyone else when he does not succeed. To the point where his harm could effect those long after he is stopped.
I am sad he died... At first i really didn´t liked him at all, but he grew and at some point his reasons were ALWAYS logical and for the greater good. At least i just loved this character and the actor was such a great choice! Really good arc for a character. I also wanna point out the chemistry between him and Drummer, my favorite duo in this whole series!
Slippy6582 same. I didn’t like him at first, I thought he was going to antagonize Drummer. I really liked how they became good friends and their scenes together were always great. The boss man will be missed
I will miss his character greatly.
I love binge series, only down side is the withdrawal you get after your done.
Yup.
I like weekly episodes. It gives people a chance to discuss the show week to week. All at once you have to binge the whole thing before discussing or you run into spoilers.
It's just a lot more fun with weekly episodes, in my opinion.
@@TheCapn23 I agree. I didn't originally plan on binging the whole season, but just couldn't help myself. :)
Weekly is cool too but i have terrible memory so binge is better for me
After you get done, re-watch it.
Bet you will find stuff you missed in your first run thru. I am.
strongest ongoing sci-fi tv series..it's amazing
@Zerebrat Eightyseven this was a great save 😉
I have to say, cause I'm in a foul mood, that Cibola Burn was disappointing.
@@michaelholloway2295 book? It was slow paced..and season 4 tv series manage to speed it up a bit but kept the storyline,and set up for the next one
Absolutely!
One of the top scifi shows ever.
It reaches out... It reaches out, It stops. RIP Miller Bot
Don’t worry, it says. We’re gonna be fine. The investigator pushes his hat back, wishes he had a beer. He likes this woman. This Elvi. He wishes he’d had a little more time to know her. He wishes he had a little more time. He doesn’t care. He has died a million times since he died. The void has no mysteries for him now. He connects, and the investigator becomes the world. He feels it everywhere. The orbital bases, the power cores in the crushing depth of the ocean, the library vaults where the old ones had lived, the signaling stations high in the mountains, the cities deep beneath the ground. He is the world. There is a struggle at the end. There’s always a struggle at the end. He’s not scared, and so all through the world, the others aren’t either. You’re like Peter Pan, she says. When a child died, Peter Pan would fall halfway with them. So they wouldn’t be scared. Weird. And that’s a kid’s story? Anyway, it’s not me, the investigator says, smiles at her. Holds her hand. I don’t go for half. - it reaches out and it reaches out and it reaches out and then it stops.
Rip Investigator
What I dislike is that they made the investigator and miller separate people. Miller died when they first made the investigator but the investigator is still partially Miller in the books.
It was real Miller though. Didn't have a hat.
@@politicallycorrectredskin796 its not tough it's just the investigators part that is miller it's still the investigator (+ the whole hat thing is just in the show not the books )
@@karlfranzemperorofmandefil5547 No one gives af what is in the books...this is a TV show and millions of viewers don't know (and some don't care) what is in the books. If it's not on screen, it doesn't exist PERIOD
David Strathairn's performance in this show was sublime.
R.I.P. in peace Commander Klaes Ashford
Entropy Generator My only complaint was I have seen DS in so many shows and movies before that I was always distracted by his accent on this show. It felt fake to me. Otherwise, a truly good performance and a really great character that got to evolve through his appearances in the series.
@@kmlammto Unlike you, Strathairn has flown completely under my radar. I looked at his IMDb page and there were a lot of things I had not seen plus a lot of characters I had not noticed in things I had seen. Okay, I get it. Veteran actor with a ton of cred. He was even in the original "Boomer Existentialism" flick , "The Return of the Secaucus Seven" which was released several years before Glenn Close, Jeff Goldberg, et al, made wallowing in fond memories of protesting everything a thing for everyone who was there and a tedium for those of us too young, but thanks for the great music, in "The Big Chill" So he was a new quantity for me and I was completely enthralled with him. I am actually wanting to go back and watch some of his early stuff.
@@kmlammto I don't buy the fake belter slang accent from most actors on the show tbh, takes me right out of it. But Ashford and Drummer are the only ones who sound convincing.
metea Anderson Daws also has a convincing accent. Kara Gee based her accent on his.
@@tracymetherell8744
It's sad he's apparently been written out. He certainly made an impression in season 1.
Klaes Ashford - I'll miss him, he always gave this Veteran Vibe who learned that there's more in Life than revenge because he exactly did the fucked up things he don't want others to repeat.
him and Cotyar were my favourite. now only Amos
I hated Ashford in the books, but they made him a loveable character in the series. I like this contrast.
These authors are not terribly sentimental about death. I like it! GIves the show some sting. I hate feeling as if main characters are automatically invincible.
@@verne1986
He was delightful. The showrunners would have liked to keep him around longer but the actor is very much in demand.
Alan Pennie really? Never seen him before but he was very good.
I thought that the actor who plays Fiilip looks like he could be the son of both the actors who play his parents.
Yeah really good casting, lol.
@@takanara7 we're yet to see him as an actor. But I believe both male actors looks played a role in heir casting.
And that's what attentive casting is supposed to make you believe when it's done right.
Not rly. He looks way more like marco and not enough naomi
@@OgZz73
really? his skin lips and the leaness of his figure reminds me a lot of Naomi
Fantastic season. Burned through the entire thing in two days. Love the nuance and complexity and physics at play. Going to fucking miss Miller and Ashford. Legends.
Haven't seen such a good scifi in years, I'm glad it wasn't canceled and amazon took over.
SciFi channel has been really stupid about dropping good shows for more reruns of other shows like stargate. Remember when they dropped firefly? Imagine if Amazon had saved that tv series. Though the movie Serenity did due some justice to giving the series an ending.
@@jasonlynch282 Scifi is a small channel. They are basically like a start up company. Most start up companies usually create something good in hoping to sell it. Then, they can use that money to create another thing. Same for this. As the show goes on, it will get more expensive. For ex, the actor will demand less money in season 1 because they are not famous. Therefore, they are not in control of demanding a higher salary. But now, as the season 4, it is a different story.
@@bloodbath-and-beyond got a link?
youre so right
youre so right
Ashfrod was for me, one of the most annoying character that I love to hate because they don't think much during the past season.
But on this one ? He was so good as a character. The whole season was too good. Can't wait for S5 !
The show has had a pattern from the beginning of introducing characters and leaving their allegiances nebulous until they need to reveal who the character actually is. Almost everyone on the Roci was initially, Avasarala toed the line constantly, Fred and Drummer were unknowns (Anderson Dawes too for that matter.) This season it was kinda fuzzy as to which Earthers were trustworthy on Ilus but that sorted itself out quickly. Ashford tho i think was the most suspicious character on the show but by the end of season 3 he was as usual one of the good guys. Im gonna miss him; i also knew he was dead when he gave the booze back to Drummer. 😭
ashford almost made me cry
F for Ashford
The "villain" who lived long enough to become a hero. And the actor is just superb, definitely one of the highlights of the season
I enjoyed ashfords character also. Only thing I think should have been different is that he should have gone out guns blazing. to me that seems more his character. I get they had to get him sending a message or something to exploit marcos plan but I dont see him being that methodical. I see him knowing its the end, marco in his sights, going out with a bang.
"To the execution block... i have come tili go... to the execution dock..."
I am not crying... That's just rain on my face.
Man I hated book Ashford but Show Ashford was my favorite.
Agreed, splitting Bull from the book between Ashford and Drummer (rather, Drumichio) was a fantastic move, especially for Ashford.
@@buckwilde2212 I hoped that Ashford would take Drummers place as the one to stay loyal and lead the OPA after Freds death and Drummer takes Pas place. Sadly that's not true. I however hope that Ashfords sacrifice wasn't in vain and maybe say that the message he sent out was the reason only a part of earth died not all of it .
@@karlfranzemperorofmandefil5547 dude f*cking spoiler alert!!!!!!
@@karlfranzemperorofmandefil5547 It's just my eyeballs sweating...
The 1 on 1 character interactions and dialogue was always good, but to me, it feels like they just took it to a whole new level this season. Naomi's heart to heart with Lucia that ended with: "There is a path from where you are now..." just captured the best of personal connection and shared humanity. This show is such a pleasure to watch!
Found the pace to be a lot slower this season, but it didn’t take anything away from it. But Amos totally stole the show this time around haha.
I also think we’re going to be seeing a lot more of Elvi in the next season. There’s no way she came out of that.... thing, unchanged. She desperately wanted Holden’s “gift” of personal contact and a connection with an alien race. Well.... I’m betting she’s got it now. Probably not for the better, either.
My favorite Amos part was his las interaction with Multry. That face made me scared!
Not sure, but I think Elvi is on earth for the next bit and then disappears for a while before returning in a new capacity in book eight. So we might have a season or two of not an amazing amount of Elvi before they get that far. Hoping they won't rush it though.
Fishslap 33
Fair point... I really gotta start reading the books!
@@@HeliRy I recommend that. If you start now you might be able to get through all eight before the last one comes out in May-ish.
Gamal Gonzalez
Haha yeah that was rad. Blood soaked grin.... “Thank you”
He’s such a frigging psycho 🤣🤣
There were some key differences from the books versus season four. Some of those are:
- Faraz (Elvi's scientist friend) is actually on Ilus with her.
- Havelock (Miller's old partner) is actually on the Edward Israel; they kept Faraz on the Israel instead to fill the requirement for a good guy being in orbit
- Naomi never goes down to the surface; she is actually captured by Havelock when she attempts to sabotage the shuttle they weaponized
- The theft of Martian Tech is actually different; in the books. Filip (Naomi's son) orchestrates a theft from an asteroid controlled by Mars that has the stealth tech they stole
- Marcos is never actually captured; he is more of a shadowy figure and takes a more prominent role in subsequent books
- Ashford doesn't have a role; his character was changed quite a bit from the books. In the books, he is far nastier and is no friend of Drummer or Fred
- Bobbie's role is much more expanded with her discovering the theft of martian tech; as mentioned, in the books, that is done differently
- The belter family, where the mother blew up the landing pad does exist, but they are actually the parents of Katoa, the young boy who was transformed into the protomolecule monster that Bobbie killed; also, it is the father that blows up the landing pad. Not the mother
The overall narrative is actually pretty in keeping with the books. Including Miller as 'the investigator' and the depiction of the alien technology 'dead zone'; which is like a ball of light. I like the way they depicted that on the show; it matched the way I envisioned in my mind. Very good season on the whole. And in my opinion, the best sci fi show on TV right now.
Thanks for that, i havent read the books but it's interesting to read where they deviate from it.
Just hoping they don't make this into a terminator story. aka Alien(s) who made protomocule, and the alien that destroyed them are one in the same. So a new technology became sentient and overcame their masters. It be a bit like BSG too in that case (Human>Cylons>Cohabitation).
@@METALFREAK03 it’s not
EST Sci Fi show EVER!
Thanks for the rundown!
I binged it and loved it. It took about half the first episode to get back up to speed, but once I did, WOW! Production quality has improved with Amazon on board. This is so good that I'm going to start on the books.
Production quality? I found it lacking compared to previous seasons. The colors were highly muted (Avasarala didn't have the bright/shiny clothes as before; the proto-molecule removed from Rocinante was a dull blue...). A couple errors of logic. Alex lying to the captain RE: Noami's medical status; because they havent' yet learned how important it is to be honest. Final episode: a 3 man breaching team... recipe for disaster; Ashford is the big flowlotah now. At least Amos was still Amos, and he did the crazy eye thing masterfully. Serve me up a Season 5 please.
The books are enjoyable. The last two have me really excited about the ending. Read the novels and the novellas in the order that they released them for the full experience.
I have one complaint, the episodes end with bigger cliffhangers to make you binge watch the show harder.
@@Silverhawk100 And that's something to complain about?
TV show is actually much better than the books. I actually feel that having read the books ruined season 4 for me.
Amos' face at the end....holy shit I almost feel sorry for Murtry
I don't. Hope next season opens to Murtry dying.
@@SGTShootToKi11 Wishing a person's death, whoever he is, makes you look like a killer
Nathanpix !! He’s a fictional person, now I’m wishing someone with poor reasoning skills death.
Almost.
Did NOT like the recasting of Avasarala's husband, Arjun. Not just the actor was different but the nature of their relationship was too different. After being so hands off before now he is pushing her to be a politician?!
There were some scenes with him that were just really bad. Terrible acting.
Recasting was total blunder, if old actor was not available, they should have just CGI some video messages using old face or simply forget the character. From age difference perspective, it could been son and mother...
In the show's defense, plotwise here, she had asked him to run her campaign and he didn't necessarily want to.
Agreed. I don't think you'll have to worry about him in Season 5.
Hated Avasarala's husband and his whining, Chrisjen didn't do anything that warranted his reactions. He failed to be supportive of the tough decisions she made.
The wise Patriarch is so rare in media these days, Ashford was one of the best current examples of one, and a badass space pirate on top of that. Loved the character. I will miss him going forward.
Damn, the Ashford-Drummer duo was my favorite somehow. His death imo was the most touching one of the series so far. The Roci's crew is so heavily wrapped up in plot armor that I never really get invested in the drama when they are in trouble. It's the secondary characters that get to me.
That's very true. We can never really feel too concerned about the Roci crew. Instead we worry about the people they're close to. they certainly could have killed Lucia for instance.
I've been waiting for that scene in the final episode since Avarsala was out on the roof with her grandson, talking about how she feared those that threw rocks....
I started rewatching from the beginning and heard her say it and was like ..oh shit foreshadowing right from the beginning..
The authors are great.
martin Bassett Same
@@vikingodin1986
Yep. We shouldn't assume she's normally in favour of torture but she immediately saw how dangerous stealth tech was.
Ironicly the creator of the epstien drive didn't kill himself
cecollins68 He died testing it.
@@joemancini2988 exactly so he didn't kill himself the Machine did
@@joemancini2988 ...due to piss poor planning, as per an alternate shut down.
Y’all are missing the point. The OP was referring to the modern day late epstien.
@@TheWolfsnack that scene whrn he made his testflight, half of the scene I had big redxflashing lights in my mind and alerts blurring.... Crying to my Screen:"stop, dont fo this, do not Start the engine.....
Yes, I enjoy binge watching the show, and I hate week to week shows. I really enjoyed this season of the Expanse and love that Amazon picked it up. I'm looking forward to season 5, and I'm going to miss my guy Miller!
*Shohreh Aghdashloo ... Chrisjen Avasarala:* "Everybody gets a pony and a B.J." I'm in but someone else can have the pony. 🐎
Best Avasarala line right there, and she's had a lot of great ones.
Madonna is still alive in 2350? LMAO!
LOL! Great line. No ponies for me, either.
"But what was she wearing?!"
You wouldn't want to get paid for receiving a BJ?
pony = 25 quid in cockney.
Ehem, you didn't explained the ending, you gave us a summary of the season...
because any explanation will be spoiler. welcome to hell in next season (no spoiler, just intrigue) :)
The very idea ending needs explaining is also milking it for views. He flung something at Earth to gauge their defensive capabilities, then he obtained a very large rock. Gee I wonder why.
@@idokwatcher2062 More then one rock ...he(belter terrorist) had been travelling around the Solar System gathering Large Asteroids and then using Mars Stealth Technology on them and then shot them off at Earth...From the End Scene it looks like there's around 7 or 8 Asteroids on collision course with Earth..multiple trajectory's striking earth at different times to cover the global with meteor strikes...simple as that.
The Terrorist Belter used Mars Stealth Tech to hide the meteors from Earth Defences...
Did Amos kill Murtry ?In that case Holden will be pissed of :)
What explanation is needed anyway? Asteroids on course to earth. Wow, hard to understand.
Drummer to become the Pirate Queen!
And then traffic cop?
Exactly! That is why she had to have a falling out with Fred Johnson!
She's gonna be pissed, when she finds out about Ashford.
Zombie Moose82 especially cause the blame (while it will always ultimately be with Marco) will fall squarely on her shoulders.
@@NickRobbins82 can't wait for that her chemistry with Ashford was amazing the actors did a perfect performance
personally I'm more intrigued by the protomolecules and the ancient civilization aspects than the factions. I mean the political intrigue is interesting and shows the human side of the stories, I just want more the "scifi" lore aspect more
i said tht literally verbatim and i hope season 5 isnt all about the factions and mars and stuff bc the accurate alien shit is whats amazing now lmao its like alien and star wars had a baby
@@gentryhaney4713 I'm the opposite. I prefer the human politics and conflict the most, with the sci fi, fantasy stuff just acting as a catalyst. It's probably why season 2 is still my favorite.
But then all you need is know of stories like BSG and terminator to know whats going to happen with that. I hope I am wrong though:
"Ultimately I hope they don't make this a terminator/BSG esque story. The fact that the protomocule and alien race that built it with the destruction of "something else" paints the picture to me that the "secret" of the entire story is that new technology gained sentient(ence?) and fought back against their creator. Like Cylon did to Humans in BSG (although the "destruction of mankind" was coexistance) and Machines did to humans in Terminator.
If it is that, it's just the human obsession of what we are creating will somehow gain independence and turn on us (the creator). For some reason we always think of what we create, only is for destruction and torment."
@@METALFREAK03 The protomolecule didn't turn on its builders, what destroyed them was something else entirely. It's strongly hinted in the books that the reason those others destroyed the builders of the protomolecule may have been that they found the protomolecule tech itself abominable (I would guess perhaps because of the way it hijacks and in the process destroys all other life.)
I think it’s going to be like Early Stargate when the scope was narrow and small, but it grew larger and more epic slowly step by step.
I don't usually pay much attention to women's dresses. But Avasarala's outfits are AMAZING. The Expanse should win an award for most beautiful and exotic outfits, of any movies too TVseries.. Love this show, everything about it perfectly right.
They need to take revenge for Ashford in season 5 in a good way.
I am sure Drummond will have some dry and pithy comments as she finishes of Daddy and Junior....
Drummer will
Read the books, and Marco is the new long term 2 books or 2 more seasons) until is finally dealt with
Oh my sweet summer child
Binge watch all the way, I hate weekly releases it just leaves me craving for more and end up annoyoed. So I wait for quite few episodes before watching something I know I will like.
I know a lot of people prefer binging and that's cool. I like the time in between episodes to follow the theories and speculate on what's to come.
Week to week episodes SUCK I always wait for the entire season to be out before watching 👍
@Matt Fors that was HBO Max released Raised by Wolves. It worked pretty well considering that show prompted a lot of theory discussion week to week. For season 5 of the Expanse they're continuing the release schedule of The Boys s2. 3 episodes on the first week then 1 episode weekly after that.
Two of the best characters dead, Miller and Ashford :{
Still have Amos, thank God
@@soundninja99 Out of the whole season his face when he is about to kill Murtry is one of the highlights.
Ashford seems definitely dead. But it’s not totally clear if Miller is really dead now, since he’s been Protomolecularized, so he might still come back later on. Hope so.
@@speedtribejp
well the Investigator is sth we might still get right.
ill take anything to see the actor that plays Miller back on the show
The show is great because the characters do not have invulnerable plot armor. When it is time for a character to die they DIE.
I’ve been hearing this a lot lately so I’m offering up the information for anyone interested. “Whenever” is for a non-specific time. “We can go whenever you want.” “When” is for a specific time. “We’ll go when this show is over.”
Karyn Hill That bothered me too!
Considering the book spends the majority of pov around Illus I was impressed how much leg work they got in exposition with bobby+Ashfords plotlines. The tv audience now have everything they need to understand what will transpire in S5+6 I am curious if Drummers decision to save Marcus this season helps her become queen of the pirates or maybe she will be a trafic cop forever who knows.
Who just finished watching (like me)? 🙂
I binged all but the last 2 episodes on the 13th when they came out. I was going to finish the next day, but as the saying goes Life Happens. I finally was able to finish the season yesterday.
@@leslieshafer6343 13th and 14th for me...
I just did! 👍
One last episode to watch for season 5
graphics were awesome also. The planet lighting up with all the protomolicule tech was amazing.
It's the best sci fi series on still, but story wise, I found it lacking compared to the first 3 seasons. They didn't go that much further with the proto molecule. It was almost like the same thing again with different colors and a bit of origin. Seems like they focused on smaller, more personal stories which shouldn't really matter as much as the fate of mankind. Felt like the first three seasons were layers building a cake and this season they frosted it a little. I do like that everyone stayed in character and didn't suddenly change with motivations being pulled out of their asses because of a new production company though. Also, everything stayed logical.
I think a lot of the problem you are having is that the events haven't come to fruition yet. A lot of huge stuff with massive ramifications for the future of mankind progressed, it just hasn't come to fruition in all cases.
- Humanity established it's first viable colony outside of sol system
- Earth reversed it's quarantine position and began colonizing in earnest.
- Mars has begun to collapse both economically and culturally. Several characters have openly talked about this, and it's obvious ramifications (Why would you work on improving mars, when there are 1300 better starting points you could go to and do the same thing only faster and easier)? But that's the major thread of the season. Mars, the most technologically advanced human military force in existence, has collapsed and is now selling it's military tech to anyone who wants it, no questions asked, soviet union style.
- And of course, Inaros has emerged as a major antagonist with massive terrorist plans and martian military tech to back them up.
I would argue that season 1 was far smaller in apparent scope. It played out more like a detective story about what the hell was going on with Mao, and only in retrospect did the events take on major importance to humanity at large.
It seems like Eros station and the threat to Ceres station are large relative to the collapse of the MCR, but in the fiction, Mars has a population of 9 billion and the combined total pop of Eros/Ceres are under 10 million. They are not even close in scale, even ignoring the militarization of the Martian state. .
@@timmietimmins3780 Yup, I agree totally, loved this new season but its inevitable in a story like this that you end up with some people feeling its a little empty, simply because we haven't seen the story the whole way through yet. It is definitely an important chapter in the story, and sets up a number of things to come, I think in the years ahead when the series finally concludes the value of these intermediate series will be fully realised.
Bare in mind that's mostly because the book apart from the Prelude and epilogue is entirely covering events on Illus. Because in book form you get the sense you are a long way from home without any communication. No one has any clue what's happening.
They brought a lot of book 5 stuff in to set up season 5 & 6 To really deliver. Freed them up a lot of exposition because they did the leg work in bobby and asfords lines this season.
I think because in this season they explored the theme of colonizing new worlds (there were a lot of references to colonization back on Earth in 16th-19th centuries). And the thing with colonization is that despite it being actually a huge step in history, it usually starts with small groups of exploreres&settlers - literally dozens as shown in this season. Only after that comes the mass wave of colonizers&immigrants.
Great response
It reaches out and it reaches out and it reaches out and then it stops. RIP Miller ghost.
My hubby and I like being able to sit and watch all episodes. This show is really good and has gotten better on Amazon. Thanks for the review.
The epstian drive didn’t kill it self👍
After finishing season 4 the night after I had a dream that just before Ashford stops singing the Roci crew comes along and saves him. I guess I was super bummed out by his death in my subconscious.
RIP Captain.
I'm fine wit the deviations from book 4 and parts of book 5. (I'm reading Tiamat's Wrath now and re-read books 4 and 5 in preparing for this season.
Ashford served a purpose on the show even though he wasn't in the later books. Drummer's a clever survivor and I hope to see her through future seasons. Naomi's and Elvi's dramas in book 4 and the rescue of the Barbi crew, missing from the show, were superfluous and not necessary to advance the story. They did Murtry and Wei just right. I like what they did with the events involving Bobbie on Mars but I hope season 5 will give us a lot of the space action of books 5 and 6. Also, I am looking forward to the churn with the Roci crew in future seasons, in particular Amos', Bobbie's and Alex's back stories and adventures and what they bring to the story. I get how the foundation is established, even in S4E1 for seasons 5 and 6. As soon as I read book 4 it was apparent how some season 1 dialog foreshadowed the end of season 4/beginning of season 5. So I've payed close attention to the dialogs in season 4 for foreshadowing. The authors had a big part in the show just as George RR Martin played a big part in early seasons of GOT. The books work. Sticking to the books will prevent the eyerolling mess that GOT turned into.
And the books will be finished in good time too.
Love your explanations of expense. Great pace and very understandable.
Glad to hear it, thanks.
My favorite dialogue in the book was the final talk between Bobby and Avasarala. Was a bit disappointed they didn't put that into the series. Instead they leave it to a random cop to deliver the prognosis on mars survival and turn bobby to a thief. They could have put that dialogue,slightly changed, with Avasarala at the dinner and then have Avasarala put Bobby "back on the board", doing a investigation about the ships and thefts or something, doing both characters great service.
Agreed. They should have hired you to do the story. What we got instead just was not Bobby.
I was also hoping she might do some weight lifting in the off-season so her arms do not look so much like tapioca pudding.
I’ve binge watched this series 3 times already, and learn new information every time. This is a beautiful show, well made, and well depicted. Excited to read the books!
This was amazing! I like the way Amazon really bumped up Avasarala's potty mouth.
I actually didn't, it felt like they were trying too hard to make her likeable. Half of the swearing this time around felt gratuitous and juvenile. It had more impact before _because_ it was used more sparingly.
@@d0nj03 Before it was on SYFY so she couldn't swear much. Season 4 she swore about as much as she did in the books so she was actually more true to her character
@@deedoubleyou7116 She was better in the first seasons. Sometimes the TV adaptation does some things better than the source material, and this was one example.
Awesome video! Loved how you explained the tie in with the books without any spoilers.
Amos is my favorite character by far.
yeah they made great use of him again this season. For some reason I prefer his old look. He almost looks 'too respectable'. I guess he's growing. but maybe not :)
Great video. Thank you. So yeah, I watched all 4 seasons in one go! That was so good.
Loved the season! Can’t wait for the new season and Ashford was AMAZING in this season!! Loved everything about him! Will miss him!
Sooo, I'd planned to watch this as a Xmas Marathon. Welp binged it last night. Thanks to Amazon for bringing this series back. And bravo to the costume designer. Avasarala was SERVING in every episode!
I hoped Lucia would stay on Roci for good, just to watch her in the next seasons. The actress playing her is unbelievably beautiful :) and talented
She was annoying and she need to be in jail.
Hi Pete, just trudging through your videos that I overlooked during "The Expanse" run (this was one) and re-watching others. Missing "The Expanse" greatly, presently reading the final trilogy and short stories and enjoying the hell out of them Planning to go back and read the first six novels and accompanying short stories once I've finished. Great videos. Peace.
Can't wait to see the Nemesis Games story play out. Going to be epic.
indeed : )
I think it’s the best show on TV . Translation from book to screen is excellent, got the whole family loving it now
While season 1-3 each progressed the main story by a lot, season 4 starts out strong and it pretty much keeps the pace till the end, but it doesn't progress the story as much. I was missing a big showdown/ season finale. Don't get me wrong, amazon did an amazing job - it's just a little bit different. At no point was I bored and there were interesting turn of events.
I recently heard that TE is based off books - I haven't read those, so maybe the 4th book was just not as story intensive.
As mentioned in the video Book 4 Prelude and epilogue has a small bit with bobby and Avasaralas plots but 90% of the book is the events on Illus. It creates this sense that they are a long way from home, with no communication and the Roci crew are the only sane people keeping the peace whilst resolving the mystery of the planet. Everything else sets up a lot of action for book 5 and 6.
Binged seasons 1-4 Amazon -Ashford became his vision of the unified Belter, and what a commander Drummer is Cara Gee is Perfect!! I'm hooked
The only sad thing for this season is WE DONT SEE ROCI USE THAT FREAKING RAILGUNS IB BATTLE!! haha
Happens a few times in book 5, so presumably will be shown of in season 5.
Season 1-2 build up to 3 / season 4 is build up to season 5....
This show is fantastic, real gritty personable characters which you get to follow as the show unwinds. Special effects, ship battles and a continuous epic storyline, never fail to deliver results. It's hats off to the main cast, as they pull it out the bag. Here's to season 5 + 6 and beyond! Nice simple 12-minute reminder from Pete Peppers!
I found this riveting and had to binge it to the end.
Thanks for doing a video without book spoilers. Good video, cheers.
Rest in peace, Ashford. Truly saddening death.
I hope they get Bobby back in the band. She was so great taking on the proto creature. Season 4 was like she was confined to quarters. Ashford and Miller gone........................ New Doctor is very good and someone please kill Murtry ASAP. Too bad about Amos's flame. Don't mess with Amos.
It was sad because it made no sense. What was the point of not crippling the ship hard and boarding with just 2 other people? Retarded and only written that way to pull Naomi's son out of some writer's arse. Ashford died a fool thanks to the writers.
Dude, you rock. Great room tone and script. Thank you.
I feel dirty that after 3 episodes, I binged on the rest of the show
You got a glimpse of the horror that awaits toward the end of season 4. Not the rocks...they are bad enough, but the thing that shut down all the machines. I can hardly wait for book 9 to come out.
I think they could have had the raids Bobby ended up being involved in being for something else as a pre-cursor to Filip's raid at the ship yard as that was a pretty intense start to Nemesis Games and was hoping that would be visualised
I love it, this series gets people energized and they each have a different direction and all are valid just like real life.
These small metal things swarming on New Terra and their behaviour recalls for me Stanislaw Lem's Invincible (Niezwyciężony). Actually, the story lines have a suspicious number of parallels.
Thanks for the recap, it helped clear up a few things. I think this is the best show on tv. And it's the writing. The characters have real motivations that are relatable, and usually they don't act stupid.
I binged season 4 yesterday and I prefer it that way than week to week. I have never read the books so I cannot compare however I absolutely love these series. Shame Miller is killed off as I really liked his character. Great breakdown Man!
what I like about binging a show, is that it is more like reading a book.....I don;t pick up a book to only read one chapter a week.
Thanks Pete. Very informative. Thanks for clearing up a few things. I love the TV series
Damn I haven't even started watching season 4😆 but I'm a sucker for expanse so I'm diving in. Thank you very much
You're in for a treat.
@@PetePeppers1 One thing I could not help while reading the book series (which I started after binge-watching S3) was to portray the characters in my mind as the actors in the series!
Agree with all... and loved how in one of your last clips Amos is explaining the universe to Murtry... in his iconic and very pragmatic manner.
They need to cast Jon Bernthal ( Shaaaaaane!!!!) in a major role
What bothered me was after Murtry’s second murder the local belters did not lynch him, its not like the belters in new terra were unarmed and this guy was clearly a murderer and hated the belt. It seemed like all his fun stories involved screwing belters out of money
I think a lot of Murtry's crew had paramilitary training. I don't reckon a battle between then and the Belters would have ended well.
Personally, I enjoyed all the book changes/adaptation and the whole season A LOT more that Cibola Burn and I wish I could see S5 and S6 right now LOL Can't wait to see whom they'll cast as a certain future "mystery man".
Yeah, the worst part of reading ahead is that my attention is on focused on how the whole thing ends rather than where the show is at.
@@PetePeppers1 I wouldn't call it worst, but it can be a different experience (tho less obvious when binging). I'm a spoiler addict. I've been reading the last pages first since I was a child so Idk how many ppl can relate to that but, when it comes to longform storytelling, knowing how it ends (or where it goes) allows me to enjoy the ride getting there. I wish ppl who say "you ruined it for yourself" could've seen me while binging this season literally at the edge of my seat through the most part.
This being said, I can see how ppl who don't have the knowledge of future events or don't focus on the bigger story are not particularly happy with Avasarala or Bobby's storyline this season or w. Ashford/Strathairn exiting the show or wanting more Dawes and Fred Johnson and so on. Great characters/actors but the story is bigger than any of them. As much as I enjoy all individual contributions, I can understand the show's choices when trying to adapt book events to 10 episode of TV, moving the plot forward while also keeping touch w. fan favorites. I actually think that the way they showed the effects on the Inners through Avasarala and Bobby was very inspired even if they were made "weak" as some have said. Imo, that was the point.
PS: as for binging vs. weekly release, these too can provide a different experience. While binging one can lose many of the details and, ofc, post season conversations are not as long and in depth as the weekly post episode analysis. But now that I've binged it, I will go rewatch it just to pay extra attention to details. I literally jumped when they gave us that close shot of Holden administering his cancer meds in beginning of the season knowing their significance later one. I'll go back to look for more details like this in case I missed them the first time around plus other easter eggs for the future like the a certain name drop of our "mystery man" on one of them screens. I think u can make such "easter eggs" videos or even episode by episode reviews if u want to, I'm sure Expanse fans will love them even if it's not the same as the weekly thing.
PPS: looks like I've overcompensated for the brevity of the first comment LOL
yeah I didn't really like Cibola Burn. The next one is way better with lots of space battles.
@@alexandrasandu3947 Maybe Edward James Olmos!!
I’m with you. I like watching week to week. I think binge watching you miss a lot of things. This definitely helped me tie things together. Thanks!
I will miss Miller immensely. :-(
I loved it. I binge watched ALL if season 4. From what I read on Wikipedia, the TV shows follows the books pretty close. i really want more. Probably will buy the remaining books. Great video you made! Thanks!
The quality of the series has gone way up this season I was impressed all around. It was cool seeing a lot of people from other shows that I love. Good serious grown up scifi no bullshit this season ; )
Everyone is either finding love or uniting with their families except for our poor Alex..
I really wish he gets accepted back into his family ❤️
Loved this season. I think Amazon stepped it up, the effects were better, the story really was satisfying, and I couldn’t stop watching once I started.
Great re-cap and heads up on the major storylines to follow. Book 4 was very narrow being only about Illus. I'm glad they added the Earth and Mars aspects to keep Season 4 much broader in scope. I haven't read past book 4 yet..
Did anyone think Bobby's nephew David looked like Diogo with that hairdo or is it just me?
It isn't. I thought the same.
I rather miss that other stupid teen.
It seemed to me Miller broke free of the protomolecule constraints to finally lay to rest the echoes of all those consumed on Eros. He talked about hearing the voices of those who were on Eros like they were still suffering.
The voices of Eros have been mentioned quite a lot.
I seem to remember that they were set to music by some Belters.
I thought they did a good job, given the material at hand. The 4th book was the slowest by far, hence the drive to pull in aspects of the novellas and following book.
Thank you for sharing! I already watched season 4 so it wasn’t spoiling anything - it was a very helpful summary.
I have watched the 4th season twice in two days and will watch it again.
Me too, tho on second watching I skipped most of the parts not on Ilus, mostly to catch Miller's investigative ramblings.
I like bobbies character and the actor that plays her, the Mars storyline was, imo, a smart way to keep her on board and by itself a decent story. I find her life of crime to be a stretch though.
Same with Avasarala for that matter.
@@Grandude77 "Thank you," says Amos to Murtry for punching him. Murtry just signed his death warrant. Can't wait for season 5 and to see how that turns out.
I've been waiting for timats wrath in paperback but I expect I'll cave soon. Got a lot of free time over Christmas
Ashford's ending, the entire time I was just sitting there shouting CAMINA IS BEHIND THAT DOOR!! SHE DOCKED A SHUTTLE BEFORE ANYONE COULD SEE IT.... and nope.
Ashford was really good this season, still not as great as in the books, but much better than in previous seasons of the show
Great job , Great video ! I have seen all 4 seasons. I have ordered the books, from Amazon .
I get vibes the that Ring Builders are the Xeelee and they are fighting the Photino Birds by blowing up the stars. I find it interesting that consciousness itself is what they attack, and their weapon is black holes... so yeah. Xeelee. I'm not complaining, really cool to see hard sci-fi concepts mixed together and put on HD CGI. I get heavy Mass Effect vibes too from Holden, reminds me so much of a straight Paragon Shepard. hahaha Love this show. Can't wait to see the Magnetar Class in action on my big screen.
I did not mind the 10 episode season. I was totally blown away. It really made the story telling tight and kept my interest. I binge watched the last four episodes and hate to have to wait for the next season. Amazon, hurry up, please.
I just finished watching it... it was very thrilling, I love all the space scenes - they did a way better job with those compared to previous seasons... and cant wait for season 5!!! I was actually hoping that we see a lot of planet exploration in season 4 but now it looks like it will happen in season 5 :)))
I misread actually :D it was in July this year that they announced there was going to be a fifth season but in any case.. looking forward to the next season and a lot others to come :)
@@christotaku They already started filming S5, so we'll see S5 drop around november-january 2020-2021
@AdamBlacksburg there is no announcement, but they started filming in October and will finish filming in February. For months may be enough for them to finish the vfx.
@@VitorHugoOliveiraSousa Season 5 started around the same that season 4 started filming the year prior. So season 5 will most likely air around the same time.
And let's keep our fingers crossed for a weekly episode release, instead of the entire season at once. I really cannot be trusted *not* to binge. Nemesis Games is the big thing every Expanse fan has been looking forward to ever since season 1. In a sense, it's the Empire Strikes Back of The Expanse. It should be given the honor of having only one or two episodes per week.
@@STR33TSofJUST1C3 I recently started listening to the audiobooks and just started the sixth one - luckily as a they brought some of the things from 5th to this season. To be honest I didn't like 5th book that much - with all the characters going their separate ways and the story not even going beyond the ring - just another human war inside the Solar System. The only impactful event of the 5th book were the asteroids and at some point I actually hoped they'll finish this season with the resolution of the asteroids storyline - they could then basically skip book five and go straight to six in season 5 :P
The whole cast& crew did an amazing job & this is the best Sci-Fi made till date period.
Just give me Avasalara and Bobbie being Badasses together and I'll be extremely happy
Looks like we may get that next season.
It would be pretty cool if Gao sends Avasarala to Mars to track down the sponsors of the attack on Earth.
i binged it over the weekend. the move to amazon has been great so far imo. hopefully we get a longer season next.
I... Want... More...
that's all I know
Great review, Pete. I don't think I've missed anything and agree with your interpretation. To me, as an old timer, I think Corey's books are the greatest works of "Hard" SF since the later Arthur C Clarke's "Songs of Distant Earth" and Stanislav Lev's "Solaris". People live messy lives in The Expanse, they often die bad deaths, often betrayed ..... Mars is the technocratic dream that loses its way after the protomolecule comes on the scene, and later when the Ring Gate is opened ..... Earth is riding its imperialism for a fall, as the Mother of Humanity, but is doing a poor job to control the Belters, who have mined the raw materials of Earth and Mars' largesse, without reaping the benefits. There are parallels with contemporary history, of course, with the mysterious precursor races that built the protomolecule and ring gate hovering in the background, in the way such civilisations did in ACC's work. The Expanse is just an amazing achievement. Thank you for providing such a cogent analysis.
I haven't read the books, and not planning to until the end of the series. Having said that, I love this season, but it barely answered the protomolecule creators/enemy question. From what you said, I guess this season won't provide much about that. I was still puzzled about the Ilus structures though. Does the the book Cibola Burn provide more details as to what the structure that was moving trying to do prior to the missile hit? And why did that one island exploded? Was it a response by the structures from the missile hit? If caused by the structures, then why would the protomolecule respond by adjusting the physics to avoid it happenning again if they caused it? And why the hell was the moon melting? I have a feeling that these actions by the structures are beyond the understanding of the characters at the moment, but does the book at least shed some light on this?
Pete pepper plz shed some light here..
yes pls
I'll try not to spoil anything, the books themselves don't really give a lot of information about the Builders, even in the later books we barely know anything about them. The only things left behind are their tools. Ilus is one of such tools and in the books Miller calls it a "gas station" of sorts, the entire thing is similar to a refinery on a planetary scale
@@gastono8179 thanks :)
In the books a lot more details are given about the nature of the different artifacts on the planet, especially in conversations with Miller and Holden. For example, Miller explains that there are gigantic nuclear reactors beneath the sea on the chain of islands. When Miller starts snooping around the planetary energy network he turns everything on so a lot of artifacts start to wake up, but after 2 billion years, a lot of things obviously malfunction. The nuclear explosion was probably caused by one of those nuclear reactors beneath the islands melting down. So was the melting moon. After the explosion, the planetary defense network goes into alert and interprets any high energy source as a threat, which is why the fusion reactors on the ships stop working, and why the shuttle the Edward Israel sends to evacuate the colonists gets shot down. As Miller explains, the moons are part of a defense network set up by the Builders that could "vaporize Ceres if it wanted to". There are a million other cool snippets of information that let you know just how badass the Builders were and how much control they had over their environment.
I am a book reader and I loved what they did with Bobbie's arc here in Season 4. Although I also loved what was happening on Ilus and knew pretty much what to expect and liked the actors they chose for the characters, Bobbie's arc was unexpected and truly entertaining and in the end thrilling. Looking forward to Season 5 which I already know will be epic!