You're right. Most people don't even know what a movement is. Especially people who shop at malls. If Seiko knew the American market, they'd make gaudy oversized garbage at exorbitant prices.
@skogenburzum yeah but I just don't see the aesthic appealing to large demographic. Honestly Seiko knows what they are doing though, it's hard to see it from my perspective though.
The local watch dealer in my neck of the woods had to Google SKX when I asked him if he had stock. He then claimed that he could get me one. I thanked him and walked away.
Most, not all not all, but most cappers, millennials have no class. They care less about gentlemen wears....cellphones, selfies, throwaway furniture, quick meals is the norm.... oh and they fall apart (sensitive) at everything.
Dave Mendoza I have . Done with Seiko . I own omega , Tudor , and citizen and a couple invicta pro divers that keep better time , align perfectly and have better bezel action . The invictas are my work beaters taking the place of my skxs. Plus I hate Seikos refusal to use sapphire in sub 1000 dollar watches ... come on ...
Dave Mendoza not sure why anyone would be content with spending hard-earned money on a product with known QC issues and be expected to be content because it’s from Seiko? I like many others did take my business elsewhere. As is your right to continue accepting sub-par QC.
Dave Mendoza I’ve seen chapter ring alignment problems on most inexpensive watches that I own. It isn’t just the Seiko’s that have this problem, and I’d like to see a review that addresses this issue, and maybe looks into why this happens. Is it beat amplitude? What else could it be?
This video a little bit old but I have to comment. I got my Seiko 5 (5kx) from a jewelry shop in the mall, and it was my first automatic watch, and my gateway to the mechanical watch world. I wouldn’t be watching your video or finding your channel if its not because of the Seiko 5. So, totally 100% you were right back then. Have a good day .
Hi Marc, this is the best explanation of this subject that I've heard. While it makes sense from a business standpoint for Seiko to do this, it's sad to see the demise of the snk and the skx. The snk was a cool little flieger style automatic you could get cheaper than many quartz watches, and the skx was the only "real" automatic diver you could get for around $200. If the new 5 line is really going to be priced at $350 I think it makes more sense to pay a bit more for the turtle. You get the same movement in a 200 meter iso rated prospex diver as opposed to a "dive style" watch.
In any case, I have admired it for some time, and have just today received my SKX009J from Long Island Watch! Glad I got it when I could. I am wearing it today for the first time and am very happy with it.
A lot of my friends and family buy designer watches thinking they’re getting a great thing, none of them know anything about what makes a good watch, from materials to the movement. I’ve tried to educate them but they just don’t care. They go for the flashy cool looking piece, pay an arm and a leg for something not worth even 1/10th of the retail price, and when the battery dies they throw it in a drawer and go buy another piece of junk. Very little people nowadays do appreciate a good time piece. I guess we are a dying breed.
I have a shiny soft steel Swatch Irony manufactured in 1999 with a plastic movement that runs perfectly 20 years later. The casing has some scratches, but they are easy to polish. Is this a bad watch or a good watch, according to your extended expertise? Educate me !!!
normie x I don’t claim to be an expert, but I feel bad when people give up their hard earned money and get nothing in return. My wife has a Michael Kors that has a hand jumping around the dial. I have a Seiko 5 that my mother gave me on my 18th birthday that still runs, I’m 55 now, so do the math. The best watch is the one you like, I guess. My point is that neither you or my mom paid $200, right?
Very well explained. In fact, I worked almost 20 years at my job and never met someone who wears a mechanical watch. Then smart watches came, there's that!
Ian Butler Never. However, around 30 years ago (give or take) I heard a clunking noise inside, I opened it and found that the screw holding the rotor came loose and the rotor came off. I put it back together and to this date it works like a charm. I’ve replaced the seal several times, and demagnetized it as well to keep it in tune. The movement is a 7009 the model is 8930, all stainless steel with the original SS bracelet. Cheers.
SKX is not a brand. Seiko is a brand; a rotating bezel, water resistance and rubber strap are recognisable traits. There will still be Seikos with rotating bezels etc. I've had an SKX for more than 20 years and had no idea of its model number, or those letters within that number, until a few months ago. It was always just a nice looking watch from a good brand - being an SKX means nothing.
@@shaunpatrick8345 SKX Means a lot to a lot of ppl. I tend to agree with the first statement. Brands would give anything for a product that has the love the SKX has. Even if it not by millions of ppl, it's still loved by lots. Why not build on that. Rolex only has a few watches but it's kind of like those watches GMT, Sub', explorer etc etc have become a brand themselves. The SKX is loved by a lot of watch ppl.
SirStamford27 Agree totally. SKX to Seiko is similar to what Wrangler is to JEEP. It carries imagery and brand value most marketers would kill for. Someday a smart branding guy will come in and the SKX will be revived. The mod market is a good entry level strategy the car companies took over 20 years to embrace. The margins are higher on modified watch parts than the factory models. Seiko should be partnering with dealers like Marc at Long Island Watch to grow the customization business and grow entry level buyers into future higher end Seiko and Grand Seiko watch buyers. The journey has to start somewhere. Strategy might be Orient to Seiko to Grand Seiko. SKX could be the high mod model within Seiko like Mustang is at Ford.
And now we finally have an improved movement in the New Seiko 5 line but lose the higher water resistance and get to pay significantly more in the process. I'm not exactly on board. Just as you have stated Orient has updated their lines and you don't pay any more for the privilege. Seiko has gotten more than their monies worth on the SKX design over the last 20+ years. Upgrading the movement and designs that they have done with the new Seiko 5 line should not be at a 300+ price point. There are far too many watches now offering more at the same or lower prices. Seiko 5 used to be a value brand. Now they are priced twice what they used to be. Adding a hacking movement to a 20 year old design should not be doubling the prices of these watches if you are also losing features such as the higher water resistance. Just my .02
orient watches looks like grandpa watch, skx is a bad ass watch, security guards, police, soldiers, rescue team, mostly wear them and me as a bad ass hunter survivalist wear skx too
@@theripper121 the reason why this s5skx is expensive is because it is made in japan, I will wait for a malaysian version, all my seiko is malaysian version and I don't have a single problem. as you said there are more watches that offers a good value you are right but most of them are ugly for my taste.
@Ray Han a lot of people who bought the skx (before it was discontinued at least) were buying it because they good everyday watch, or a certified diver, not just because it was the skx. In the last couple of years however, people who want a good everyday diver will just go for an orient (if they want an automatic), because they are just better for the money. If seiko would upgrade the skx (and give it a rational price), I can assure you that a lot of people would buy it.
From Seiko’s point of view, they did upgrade the SKX, but they called it the Prospex “Sea” line! The 009 became the SRPB53P9 and the 007 became the SRPB51P9. However. the 013 does not seem to have a corresponding Prospex model.
The Seiko-enthusiast microcosm reminds me of the BMW-enthusiast microcosm. I daily drive a 1989 325i. If you follow the BMW microcosm on FB etc they all insist BMW is blowing it not making a 1989 325i today. But the fact is most of the people buying and driving new BMWs don't even recognize that my old Bimmer is a BMW, and frankly they don't care. Seiko is going to listen to customers buying new product, they likely don't have time for those of us pining for the old days. Oh well...
That is a good analogy. To piggyback, this is the same core reason phone makers still March towards less serviceable phones. Most customers are new customers who don't care about losing features like a headphone jack. So those of us who care about headphone jacks or replaceable batteries get swept away, no matter how much noise we make online. It's all about the wallet noise.
But BMW have always upgraded their products, not downgraded by removing specs. BMW offer an alternative with the 135I, 235I, 140I, 240I today, but it will be interesting to see what BMW fans will do when 1 series and 2 series is going FWD. BMW is rumoured to still keep a coupe in RWD spec.
Wow great analogy mate. I’ve been a BMW guy all my adult life and follow both the bmw and watch community. Exactly the same “BMW is doomed” saying every single time they change anything. That said: I’m not in any hurry to replace my F36 with the ever growing grills and FWD invading the lineup
I understand what they were getting at, however all they’ve done is drive these older customers (who tend to now have a reasonable amount of disposable income) away from the brand, and any brand associated with them. I have an SKX007 and a 009 in my collection and love both of them. I’ve worked some dangerous jobs and these watches took everything I, and the environment, threw at them and just kept on going. I was considering adding a Grand Seiko but after this move I have lost all respect for the brand. Seiko in any form will be getting precisely zero of my dollars in the future. My next watch purchase will be a Tudor, definitely not a Grand Seiko.
No, there will always be enthusiasts like us about. But Marc’s correct: we count for very little in the big scheme of things. Watch brands make much more money from people like your friends than they ever will from people like us,
Mark, The reason why I keep coming back here. I agree with your reasons 100 percent. I have and wear 007, 009 and 011 and enjoy them in my rotation. This is big picture stuff for Seiko. Still loving my Islander ISL-01 watch by the way. Thanks for producing a stylish, quality product. Keep up the good work. Looking forward to seeing what's up next for Long Island Watch.
Great points Mark. I think why people are upset is because it is such a versatile watch at a great price point and rather discontinue it would hoped for a update at the least. Even as is for the average consumer this timepiece is a legendary classic for all people to enjoy and really demotes all other watches priced above it as it gets the job done just as well or even better. The demand is obviously still there as prices have risen a hundred dollars or so and people are still buying them. This was a watch with amazing appeal for the everyday man regardless of income and that is why people are upset by Seiko discontinuing it. The new Seiko 5s will not be as successful, they are more expensive, don't have the iso rating, and none of them have that all around utilitarian look that is as versatile as the SKX. I think as you said Seiko will eventually come out with a remake, probably a limited edition which I hate because they get bought out and then sold for twice on eBay. I have to disagree and say this was a bad business decision but only time will tell. In the meantime, get your SKX while you can.... maybe two!
thank you for your toughs on this. I have SKX779 purchased from you back in 2010... still alive and kicking. Robust movement that I had no issue with it am I have wear it almost every day for the past 9 years. A lesson I've learned the hard way: never bring your mechanical watch in the sauna - in time, the intense heat will damage the lubricants in the watch (I had to fully service mine twice, but it is kind of cheap where I am ~30usd).
I agree with you Marc. While I don’t personally like the new “SK5” line (as an owner of an SKX013 purchased from LIW), these are still a great watch to get people into automatic watches or even watches in general. Shout out from Canada! I’m surprised you know what Hudson’s Bay is. They were very smart and negotiated an exclusive sales agreement in Canada to be the sole retailer of the new Seiko 5 line (at least for now).
I must confess, I only heard of automatic movements for the first time this year and this new knowledge of them fueled a fascination with time pieces and a growing collection bug. Sad to see the SKX go, even with the limited time I've been growing my appreciation of various styles and brands but your take makes perfect sense.
Great, reasoned and logical video by a very knowledgeable guy. Marc, the community is lucky to have you to help our understanding from within the industry. I don't lament the passing of the SKX personally, because it was due. What I find more saddening is that I don't currently see an out and out replacement from Seiko. They have lots of current dive models, but nothing current that screams 'classic'. The turtle is cool but is a retro recreation. Others are losing the affordability that made Seiko divers so remarkable at punching above their weight.
Hey Marc, thank you for this video. I really appreciate your being genuine and real with us about this and in general. Your honesty and transparency is refreshing and admirable. I have no Seikos, I've been on the fence about buying an SKX, but never did because of many reasons already mentioned. I'm so glad for you doing your own Island watches, however, because it seems they are everything the SKX wasn't, a better version of itself. If/when I get an Island watch from you, I know it will be worth owning because of you and what you stand for. Cheers!👍🙂
Thanks Marc, I believe that micro brands are cutting into the SKX segment ironically using in most cases Seiko NH 35 movement and adding all the bells and whistles that “ watch people “ are looking for in a divers watch. They would need to up their game and costs to compete using a SKX body and could not keep to the present price point especially since ISO certified watches have to be individually checked. I agree with what you are saying , Seiko seems to be moving into the upper end of the market and wants to get closer to the Rolex and Omega status and away from the Timex end of the spectrum. Thanks for keeping us posted. Mike.
Marc, I have to admit I agree with all your points. In Seiko’s advertising of late, the turtle and the samurai will be the affordable iso rated divers. By reimagining the 5’s using the SKX case, they get to use up existing stock as well as not recreate the wheel. I agree with what someone else said about it being a close of one chapter and the beginning of a new chapter. Although, I haven’t seen the new 5’s yet in the metal, so I will hold off judgement. But that being said, there are five of the new 27 sku’s that I really like based on the press photos. A great video. Thanks for sharing your opinion. -Mark
Just sold a Certina DS Action to fund a SKX007J2. The one upgrade I'll do is a flat sapphire, but to keep in line with the original look it will have clear AR. I will rock int on the original bracelet, as it is darn good despite what is said on all the watch forums. Thing is Seiko, despite the modding community being of a different opinion most of the time, did everything right from the start. The dial is great. Crown guards are perfect, along with the placement of the crown. The size is perfect. The stats are perfect. And yes, the bracelet is perfect. Light, comfortable, and looks great. And even the movement is perfect. Let me elaborate on that last part. The 7S26 does everything you can expect from a mechanical movement in a reasonably way. It is rugged, it has day/date. It is cheap to replace the day it gives up the ghost (and then you can upgrade to a hack/handwind if you feel you have to). And no, you do not need to hack/handwind a movement to have it to "work". That is just snobbery. I know, a bit harsh perhaps, but it is still true. If you get a movement that can be regulated to within 5-10 seconds/day, what more can you ask for? I know, I know. Some claim they need to handwind their watches or else they stop working even if they wear them all day. How about getting active enough to keep your watch energized? It cannot be that hard taking a walk after work if you spend all day just sitting in front of a computer? The SKX looks good, it can take a beating, but yet work with a suit unless you really are an executive (but then perhaps you got enough confidence in yourself to throw caution to the wind regarding convention and just wear it anyway because you like it, even at a cocktailparty?) GADA is strong in this watch, and at a price point that is relevant and within reach for most people. But the thing is I did not buy it just because of all that. I bought it because it is actually the epitome of Seiko diver designs. You can trace the roots back to the 60's, and all models since then can be found - in a way - in the SKX. The Willard, the Turtle, the 62MAS. All boilde down to one thing; the SKX. This watch has the pedigree of giants. The SKX line was the last line of real divers from Seiko. With the reintroduction of the Turtle a couple of years back Seiko began what is nothing but an effort to do a "Rolex" transformation.Seiko is trying to "upgrade" the movements (just how different is 4-series from the 7-series besides hack/handwind? And the 6-series over the 4-series?) I am pretty darn sure that in 10-15 years time the price for an unmodded SKX in reasonable shape will not be below $500, despite the "obsolete" movement. Because in that time enough people will have sold theirs, only to then realize they did a mistake selling.
do you think the chapter ring issues will be resolved with the replacement? or will the case construction still offer that notch that lets the ring be off center most of the time (which you so expertly showed in one or more of your videos)?
A lot of people just look at the cellphones, some have a hard time reading an analog watch, more buyers fall for affordable luxury AKA trash, or Minimalist AKA leasy design and so on...
Really interesting to revisit this video and commentary! I think the last 3 years has shown that you are right on the money with everything that you presented here! Thanks for your insight and attention to detail. 👍
It's a very easy decision actually. We, the enthusiasts, are basically giving Seiko a case study on how we took 3 entry level nice looking diver watches and made a secondary market for watch parts & developed the whole niche modding community. The idea of personalization is very attractive to anyone, but not everyone is going to go thar route with modding. It can be also very expensive just to mod a watch. They just saw an opportunity to use this great iconic design that's proven within the whole watch community and make all the different color-combos with a less capable watch in terms of raw specs but with a way better movement. They 're basically making a ton of different fashion watches. A lot of s5sports were already diver inspired, only difference is this new seiko5sports were basically a recreation of skx with different splashes of color. I think they took cues from true enthusiasts to target the casual avarage consumers and it will be great for them in the long run.
You are so right about most younger people not knowing the difference between a quartz and automatic watch. I asked a work colleague the other day " is your watch an automatic or quartz?" His reply " I dont know but it stops if I dont wear it "🤔 Thought that was funny. Very informative vid as always Mark , thanks.
I've got two of them from around 2005. The Pepsi still rocking on. Handwinding/hacking have never been issues. But the orange one stopped running a few years back. I'll replace that action if necessary when I find the darn thing. Need a sapphire crystal for the pepsi. Thanks for your info, I've yet to open one up, but am very handy with tools and precision.
And here I am, sitting with my new SKX007, with aligned bezel and chapter ring. The watch I thought 'd never want, I never liked the look of, that I bought purely because Mark said it's going to go. But now that I see it on my wrist, if you want to take it from me you have to chop my hand off. Glad I got one before the prices went all Bitcoin, and on the water resistance note, I have been diving with it twice already.
You are 100% correct. Those of us who live in watch geek land, get a skewed view of the actual realities of the watch business as compared to Seiko’s point of view. So, while the watch geeks may complain, from Seiko’s perspective, i.e., actually making money for the corporation, my guess is that the new 5 Line of watches is going to do very well.
I basically agree. I only got into watches around 2 years ago. Before that I knew what an Automatic was, but never held one. I grew up with digital. From what I heard, many think there is going to be some sort of ISO Diver to replace the SKX. Only speculation so far, but many think Seiko has something planned.
Howdy, Marc - I bought an SKX013 from you a couple of years ago (as a gift). A month ago, I finally bought a near mint 007 for myself. I've tried to find out if SKX actually means something (62MAS is for "autoMAtic Self-dater"). Can't find anything. Do you know if it means something - either in English or in Japanese? Thanx. M
In a small way I'm upset I never pulled the trigger on a SKX but at the same time I'm kind of glad I didn't because I love my Islander. My question is is there any news as to when we can expect to see some different colorways for The Islander?
Hello Mark. In your opinion, if the SKX is not the volume watch one thinks it is, where is the volume for Seiko. As you said in America and in South Africa people generally don't know much about automatic watches. Are they only making their money on high end watches or is the volume in some other area of business like movement manufacture.? Mark.
Thanks for the hard business truths Marc. Yea, those of us watch geeks who like mechanicals are not as large a market as we think. It's all about profits for Seiko--and that's a good thing. Not long ago a friend of mine needed some fast cash and regretfully decided to bring his beloved sarg009 into a pawn shop for some quick cash. They took a glance at it and said they only took Citizens and Bulovas. Perceived value is not universal.
I never really cared for the SKS because of the complaints about the band or the movement. That said I'm sad to see it go but I'm glad to see brands such as your's carry on the legacy while improving the design.
From a marketing perspective, one other point is we have to realise is smart watches are entering this price bracket & watch space. Seiko has to react & came out with "fashion" 5 with 27 designs to cast a wider net. W/o ISO testing to keep cost down. If this brings in new younger customers to love mech watches, eventually they will upgrade. Seiko has to react & can't ignore smart watches trend in ~USD300 worldwide market. SKX ISO testing at this day could be costly, after so many years the watch is almost selling at same price. Buy it while you can. I bought the latest 5, I love it cos +3s/d, the finishing is unbelievable for this price. Marc keep the videos coming. 👍
Thank you, Marc, for the insider explanation of what is going on, and kudos for creating your own line to fill the niche. I'm curious to know if modding to a screw down crown would pick up the new S5 watches to 200m resistance.
With the watch mod and now micro manufacturer community using something like the SKX as the dimensional basis for new components (cases, crystals, etc.) Where does it leave that community? Will they soldier on using an out of production watch as the common element that defines part compatibility? And what about movements? Right now it seems everything short of the movement is manufactured by someone other than Seiko. And that unbranded Seiko movements is used. Will Seiko stop production of the 7s26 movement (I say this without knowing if the have new offerings using that movement)? Will Seiko continue with sales of unbranded movements? Will we see clones of Seiko movements show up or will the community move to ETA clones or other movements?
I agree with you Mark, especially coz your POV is from a different perspective in the equation as a seller. I think Seiko already new they have to get rid of SKX but realized the whole mod community behind so they created a new line wich is inspired by the community but is Not for this community but to entice and introduce a new generation of consumers. Sadly this is how things are developing. Anyway, I'm happy I still could get my SARB033 and SARB017 and by a reasonable price before the pipe really dries out. Nice video 😎👍
Regardless of what fan boys are saying, the new 5 line is pretty solid. I have one and the quality is great. 100m is plenty fine for my use with water sports, beach fun etc. The hacking, winding movement and a see through case back is all things I was looking for in a automatic watch for sub or around $300.
Nice analysis Mark, thank you. I think you've summed it up pretty well. Fortunately I am one of those strange individuals not turned on by the SKX lineup, nor most of the Seiko line, be it the mundane models or the Grand Seikos, my tastes lie elsewhere. Really enjoy you channel though, thank you. Being in the UK if we didn't get hit by the 20% additional tax and duty costs, I would definitely be putting business your way. All the best.
Good analysis. I was recently telling Shane over at Relative Time that your new Islander diver is CRUSHING the new Seiko 5 imitation diver. You offer so much quality it's ridiculous! It's no wonder you sold out right away. I would have bought one of the Islanders but I think the logo throws the symmetry off. I like your logo, as a logo, but I don't like it on the watch dial. It looks too much like a subdial, to me. The word Islander or the letters LIW would be better IMHO.
Love what Marc does online, educational videos and his new Islander entry launch. Great value and upgrade over the SKX and Orient. Kind of agree on the logo with AJ, though. LIW, Island or Islander spelled out in place of the logo would help establish branding and enhance the balance on the dial. The logo can be used on the crown or case back altered with the Long Island etching based on various new models.
Thanks Marc. This allows me to understand Seiko not mfg the 309j1 any more. I have one and love it so much I wanted another one, and was unable to buy it due to Seikos decision not to make it anymore
Times change and renewing is needed. I was surprised to know SKX 007 was so popular in the US. In Latin America they are not as popular nor known. Casio and Citizen are more popular here. The watches you supply with your brand look like good options. Good video! Thank you.
It’ll be interesting to see if any changes are made to the plethora of 37mm non diver 5’s on the market. I’ve bought and sold a few of these over time and bracelets aside, the quality of dials, lume plots and placements, sharpness of elements, has improved somewhat since the mid ‘80s and ‘90s models. Quality being improved at the mass produced low end it would make sense to lift the line to a higher perceived tier and price point, from a business perspective at least. A movement upgrade to the 4R would help justify this, with a negligible if any increase in production costs.
I have the 007. I’ll use it until the movement dies. Then maybe replace it with the better movement. This way I can keep using my original skx007 case with screw down crown.
Great points. I think you hit it on the head pretty much. The SKX is a very popular watch with a cult following but for me personally i won't miss it as im an Orient guy anyhow. I own one Seiko and prefer my Orients with their more accurate in house movements, additional features, and better value.
Any news when the full line will hit retailers? I haven't seen the SRPD76 out yet. I for one was never huge on the SKX, but now with a gold PVD coming out I'm considering a black bezel/Belhamel strap mod. (Although, for a couple bucks more I could have the pink gold Steinhart Ocean 39.)
Happy I bought mine from you. My guess is they will bring it back ....limited edition type offering away from the retail channel. Christmas wish - mecha Quartz chronograph. Hope it's in the works. Is the natural progression to first enjoy divers ....then chronographs later on?
What will happen to the literally hundreds of different models of Seiko 5 out there in the market that have the same old 7S26 movement? ie: SNK, SNKL, and many other lines. Will Seiko keep manufacturing them or will they be retired as well like the SKX007?
I do understand your points, Mark, I'm just disappointed they didn't introduce a Seiko 5 with sapphire, >=NH35 movement (36 in Seikos?), and diver rated to 200m. Even if that was more like $500 it would've been a proper successor to the SXK models. And don't count kids out too much: my kids at least know what an automatic movement is. I made sure to teach them :)
Think you could do a video on watch maintenance? Automatic watches do need to be serviced from time to time, and I think a lot of people don't understand what goes into that, and don't anticipate that future cost. I'm requesting this, because you do sell some watches that are $1000+ and once you hit that price point, servicing costs start going up.
All things evolve and change... I’ve tried on the new Seiko 5 and the quality seems pretty good, on a par with my Prospex Turtle. I also discovered yesterday that the Seiko 5 case geometry is the same as the SKX, therefore all the after market SKX mod’s such as bezels, inserts and crystals will fit the new watch 👌 The only exception is the crown because it’s non screw down.
Hi Mark, I have seen the new Seiko 5s and I think they are really beautiful, but can we ate least swim and take five meters dives with them? If it is alright to do that team I think the watches will sell really good? I think the maroon and the green are really different !
You're right. I couldn't understand why they were discontinuing a bread and butter line but it's not. They probably sell 8 or 9 quartz watches to 1 automatic. Though quartz is being unseated from its throne in recent times, by smart watches. When can we expect a full range of Seiko smart watches. Sad for someone who appreciates the art of watchmaking but it's called progress 😥
I, for one, like the 7S26. It is rugged and reliable and not expensive to maintain. It is the VW Beetle of automatics. Hacking and hand-winding are not priorities for me either as I change my watch every two to three days. My Long Island modded SKX007j (Sapphire, coin edged bezel and ceramic insert) is just perfect.... looks like a standard SKX, just better. Anybody who owns a SKX will probably tell you it is the watch that gets the most wrist time, and they just keep going. We are therefore fortunate to have the option of the Islander to fill the boots of the departing SKX.
Always enjoy your videos. I appreciate your honesty and even agreement on their reason for discontinuing the product, even though it affects your own pocket.
I do like the video Marc & I hear you! The aforementioned notwithstanding, I love my 009 & I’ll never give it up. My 4r36 PADI Turtle Pepsi is similar in shape but has attributes missing & wanting in the 009. So...I’m happy 😊
I don't think there's anything official to verify this, but I wouldn't be surprised. They're clearly looking to retire the 7S line of movements... just like they've done with the 6R15. Everything new has a 4R35/36 or 6R35 now. It's a good move for them. Their longevity was impressive, but they're just not competitive anymore.
Most people don't even know you can change the bands and bracelet easily. I don't know how many times I've hear " I'd buy it but I don't like the band." I replace the band or bracelet immediately on 50% of my watches. I'm swapping them all the time. I just find it amazing how a band swap changes the entire look of a watch.
Hi Mark, I have a skx009 and I love it...I I think the new line is very beautyful but what really boders me is that it doesnt have screw down crown.. I will never buy one, its just fashon...Regards from Uruguay
I just don't see the average person who shops for watches in big malls caring about the movement. You are right about us being the minority though.
You're right. Most people don't even know what a movement is. Especially people who shop at malls. If Seiko knew the American market, they'd make gaudy oversized garbage at exorbitant prices.
@skogenburzum yeah but I just don't see the aesthic appealing to large demographic. Honestly Seiko knows what they are doing though, it's hard to see it from my perspective though.
Accept we buy many models of Seiko over a lifetime whereas that person may buy just one.
The local watch dealer in my neck of the woods had to Google SKX when I asked him if he had stock. He then claimed that he could get me one. I thanked him and walked away.
Most, not all not all, but most cappers, millennials have no class. They care less about gentlemen wears....cellphones, selfies, throwaway furniture, quick meals is the norm.... oh and they fall apart (sensitive) at everything.
This represents the closing of a chapter in Seiko history, and hopefully the end of the chapter ... ring problems.
At my ad in France, most of the seiko 5 had ring problems.
Dave Mendoza I have . Done with Seiko . I own omega , Tudor , and citizen and a couple invicta pro divers that keep better time , align perfectly and have better bezel action . The invictas are my work beaters taking the place of my skxs. Plus I hate Seikos refusal to use sapphire in sub 1000 dollar watches ... come on ...
Dave Mendoza not sure why anyone would be content with spending hard-earned money on a product with known QC issues and be expected to be content because it’s from Seiko? I like many others did take my business elsewhere. As is your right to continue accepting sub-par QC.
Dave Mendoza
I’ve seen chapter ring alignment problems on most inexpensive watches that I own. It isn’t just the Seiko’s that have this problem, and I’d like to see a review that addresses this issue, and maybe looks into why this happens. Is it beat amplitude? What else could it be?
Not so. The SRPA21 turtle still is made with misaligned Chapter Rings
This video a little bit old but I have to comment. I got my Seiko 5 (5kx) from a jewelry shop in the mall, and it was my first automatic watch, and my gateway to the mechanical watch world. I wouldn’t be watching your video or finding your channel if its not because of the Seiko 5.
So, totally 100% you were right back then.
Have a good day .
Hi Marc, this is the best explanation of this subject that I've heard. While it makes sense from a business standpoint for Seiko to do this, it's sad to see the demise of the snk and the skx. The snk was a cool little flieger style automatic you could get cheaper than many quartz watches, and the skx was the only "real" automatic diver you could get for around $200. If the new 5 line is really going to be priced at $350 I think it makes more sense to pay a bit more for the turtle. You get the same movement in a 200 meter iso rated prospex diver as opposed to a "dive style" watch.
In any case, I have admired it for some time, and have just today received my SKX009J from Long Island Watch! Glad I got it when I could. I am wearing it today for the first time and am very happy with it.
A lot of my friends and family buy designer watches thinking they’re getting a great thing, none of them know anything about what makes a good watch, from materials to the movement. I’ve tried to educate them but they just don’t care. They go for the flashy cool looking piece, pay an arm and a leg for something not worth even 1/10th of the retail price, and when the battery dies they throw it in a drawer and go buy another piece of junk. Very little people nowadays do appreciate a good time piece. I guess we are a dying breed.
I have a shiny soft steel Swatch Irony manufactured in 1999 with a plastic movement that runs perfectly 20 years later. The casing has some scratches, but they are easy to polish. Is this a bad watch or a good watch, according to your extended expertise? Educate me !!!
normie x I don’t claim to be an expert, but I feel bad when people give up their hard earned money and get nothing in return. My wife has a Michael Kors that has a hand jumping around the dial. I have a Seiko 5 that my mother gave me on my 18th birthday that still runs, I’m 55 now, so do the math. The best watch is the one you like, I guess. My point is that neither you or my mom paid $200, right?
Very well explained. In fact, I worked almost 20 years at my job and never met someone who wears a mechanical watch. Then smart watches came, there's that!
@@chemoautotroph Has your Seiko 5 ever needed service?
Ian Butler Never. However, around 30 years ago (give or take) I heard a clunking noise inside, I opened it and found that the screw holding the rotor came loose and the rotor came off. I put it back together and to this date it works like a charm. I’ve replaced the seal several times, and demagnetized it as well to keep it in tune. The movement is a 7009 the model is 8930, all stainless steel with the original SS bracelet. Cheers.
I appreciate your thumbnail images.
The SKX has the kind of legitimacy companies work decades to achieve. Why not build on top of that brand instead of the generic 5 series?
SKX is not a brand. Seiko is a brand; a rotating bezel, water resistance and rubber strap are recognisable traits. There will still be Seikos with rotating bezels etc.
I've had an SKX for more than 20 years and had no idea of its model number, or those letters within that number, until a few months ago. It was always just a nice looking watch from a good brand - being an SKX means nothing.
Most people with a 007 know they have the "Bond" watch
@@shaunpatrick8345 SKX Means a lot to a lot of ppl. I tend to agree with the first statement. Brands would give anything for a product that has the love the SKX has. Even if it not by millions of ppl, it's still loved by lots. Why not build on that. Rolex only has a few watches but it's kind of like those watches GMT, Sub', explorer etc etc have become a brand themselves. The SKX is loved by a lot of watch ppl.
I agree the seiko 5 is garbage
SirStamford27 Agree totally. SKX to Seiko is similar to what Wrangler is to JEEP. It carries imagery and brand value most marketers would kill for. Someday a smart branding guy will come in and the SKX will be revived.
The mod market is a good entry level strategy the car companies took over 20 years to embrace. The margins are higher on modified watch parts than the factory models. Seiko should be partnering with dealers like Marc at Long Island Watch to grow the customization business and grow entry level buyers into future higher end Seiko and Grand Seiko watch buyers.
The journey has to start somewhere. Strategy might be Orient to Seiko to Grand Seiko. SKX could be the high mod model within Seiko like Mustang is at Ford.
Seiko could've upgraded the SKX the same way Orient upgrades their watches: Orient Mako, Orient Mako 2, etc.
And now we finally have an improved movement in the New Seiko 5 line but lose the higher water resistance and get to pay significantly more in the process. I'm not exactly on board. Just as you have stated Orient has updated their lines and you don't pay any more for the privilege.
Seiko has gotten more than their monies worth on the SKX design over the last 20+ years. Upgrading the movement and designs that they have done with the new Seiko 5 line should not be at a 300+ price point. There are far too many watches now offering more at the same or lower prices. Seiko 5 used to be a value brand. Now they are priced twice what they used to be. Adding a hacking movement to a 20 year old design should not be doubling the prices of these watches if you are also losing features such as the higher water resistance. Just my .02
orient watches looks like grandpa watch, skx is a bad ass watch, security guards, police, soldiers, rescue team, mostly wear them and me as a bad ass hunter survivalist wear skx too
@@theripper121 the reason why this s5skx is expensive is because it is made in japan, I will wait for a malaysian version, all my seiko is malaysian version and I don't have a single problem. as you said there are more watches that offers a good value you are right but most of them are ugly for my taste.
@Ray Han a lot of people who bought the skx (before it was discontinued at least) were buying it because they good everyday watch, or a certified diver, not just because it was the skx.
In the last couple of years however, people who want a good everyday diver will just go for an orient (if they want an automatic), because they are just better for the money.
If seiko would upgrade the skx (and give it a rational price), I can assure you that a lot of people would buy it.
From Seiko’s point of view, they did upgrade the SKX, but they called it the Prospex “Sea” line! The 009 became the SRPB53P9 and the 007 became the SRPB51P9. However. the 013 does not seem to have a corresponding Prospex model.
The Seiko-enthusiast microcosm reminds me of the BMW-enthusiast microcosm. I daily drive a 1989 325i. If you follow the BMW microcosm on FB etc they all insist BMW is blowing it not making a 1989 325i today. But the fact is most of the people buying and driving new BMWs don't even recognize that my old Bimmer is a BMW, and frankly they don't care. Seiko is going to listen to customers buying new product, they likely don't have time for those of us pining for the old days. Oh well...
Great analogy.
That is a good analogy. To piggyback, this is the same core reason phone makers still March towards less serviceable phones. Most customers are new customers who don't care about losing features like a headphone jack. So those of us who care about headphone jacks or replaceable batteries get swept away, no matter how much noise we make online. It's all about the wallet noise.
But BMW have always upgraded their products, not downgraded by removing specs. BMW offer an alternative with the 135I, 235I, 140I, 240I today, but it will be interesting to see what BMW fans will do when 1 series and 2 series is going FWD. BMW is rumoured to still keep a coupe in RWD spec.
Wow great analogy mate. I’ve been a BMW guy all my adult life and follow both the bmw and watch community. Exactly the same “BMW is doomed” saying every single time they change anything.
That said: I’m not in any hurry to replace my F36 with the ever growing grills and FWD invading the lineup
I understand what they were getting at, however all they’ve done is drive these older customers (who tend to now have a reasonable amount of disposable income) away from the brand, and any brand associated with them. I have an SKX007 and a 009 in my collection and love both of them. I’ve worked some dangerous jobs and these watches took everything I, and the environment, threw at them and just kept on going. I was considering adding a Grand Seiko but after this move I have lost all respect for the brand. Seiko in any form will be getting precisely zero of my dollars in the future. My next watch purchase will be a Tudor, definitely not a Grand Seiko.
I just think they could have updated the movement and crystal and continued selling a very nice improved watch to us minority customers!
No, there will always be enthusiasts like us about. But Marc’s correct: we count for very little in the big scheme of things. Watch brands make much more money from people like your friends than they ever will from people like us,
@@greva2904 They’ll make money initially, until people realise that Seiko have now become a low brow fashion watch brand.
Mark, The reason why I keep coming back here. I agree with your reasons 100 percent. I have and wear 007, 009 and 011 and enjoy them in my rotation. This is big picture stuff for Seiko. Still loving my Islander ISL-01 watch by the way. Thanks for producing a stylish, quality product. Keep up the good work. Looking forward to seeing what's up next for Long Island Watch.
Great points Mark. I think why people are upset is because it is such a versatile watch at a great price point and rather discontinue it would hoped for a update at the least. Even as is for the average consumer this timepiece is a legendary classic for all people to enjoy and really demotes all other watches priced above it as it gets the job done just as well or even better. The demand is obviously still there as prices have risen a hundred dollars or so and people are still buying them. This was a watch with amazing appeal for the everyday man regardless of income and that is why people are upset by Seiko discontinuing it. The new Seiko 5s will not be as successful, they are more expensive, don't have the iso rating, and none of them have that all around utilitarian look that is as versatile as the SKX. I think as you said Seiko will eventually come out with a remake, probably a limited edition which I hate because they get bought out and then sold for twice on eBay. I have to disagree and say this was a bad business decision but only time will tell. In the meantime, get your SKX while you can.... maybe two!
Do you think at a high level Epson is positioning Seiko more upmarket and letting Orient keep the "value" niche?
Where are the new upmarket watches? Grand Seiko? Nothing new there recently.
@@thestig007 well now they have spring drive presage models. And pretty much everything in their line up went up in price now
Absolutely Jim
thank you for your toughs on this. I have SKX779 purchased from you back in 2010... still alive and kicking. Robust movement that I had no issue with it am I have wear it almost every day for the past 9 years. A lesson I've learned the hard way: never bring your mechanical watch in the sauna - in time, the intense heat will damage the lubricants in the watch (I had to fully service mine twice, but it is kind of cheap where I am ~30usd).
Waiting for my Island GMT with bi directional bezel.
Thank you for the video, I plan on keeping my SKX’s
I agree with you Marc. While I don’t personally like the new “SK5” line (as an owner of an SKX013 purchased from LIW), these are still a great watch to get people into automatic watches or even watches in general. Shout out from Canada! I’m surprised you know what Hudson’s Bay is. They were very smart and negotiated an exclusive sales agreement in Canada to be the sole retailer of the new Seiko 5 line (at least for now).
Right on the nose Marc, it’s a little disappointing to realize we are a minority in this business. Just a sad truth.
+1
I must confess, I only heard of automatic movements for the first time this year and this new knowledge of them fueled a fascination with time pieces and a growing collection bug. Sad to see the SKX go, even with the limited time I've been growing my appreciation of various styles and brands but your take makes perfect sense.
All valid points, definitely. When I tell my mid-to-late-20’s friends (I’m 27) about my sapphire crystal and hacking, they could not care any less.
But they know what is gold Rolex )) ?
Jollopukki2 maybe, I’m not sure. They know what an Apple Watch is though
@@papachung6639 My kids couldn't care about a mechanical watch either. They want an Apple Watch, or a Fit Bit, or something cheap and disposable.
I’m 27 and I care friend
Peter Cureton lol thanks man!
Great, reasoned and logical video by a very knowledgeable guy. Marc, the community is lucky to have you to help our understanding from within the industry.
I don't lament the passing of the SKX personally, because it was due. What I find more saddening is that I don't currently see an out and out replacement from Seiko. They have lots of current dive models, but nothing current that screams 'classic'. The turtle is cool but is a retro recreation. Others are losing the affordability that made Seiko divers so remarkable at punching above their weight.
Thanks for the info shared. I have a query. Should one buy an SKX at this point in time? Would it be worth an investment? please advise
Do you think this is the end for the Urchin SNZF17 and fifty fathoms snzh55 lines also? Especially since they also have the 7s26
7s36 to be precise.
Hey Marc, thank you for this video. I really appreciate your being genuine and real with us about this and in general. Your honesty and transparency is refreshing and admirable. I have no Seikos, I've been on the fence about buying an SKX, but never did because of many reasons already mentioned. I'm so glad for you doing your own Island watches, however, because it seems they are everything the SKX wasn't, a better version of itself. If/when I get an Island watch from you, I know it will be worth owning because of you and what you stand for. Cheers!👍🙂
Thanks Marc, I believe that micro brands are cutting into the SKX segment ironically using in most cases Seiko NH 35 movement and adding all the bells and whistles that “ watch people “ are looking for in a divers watch. They would need to up their game and costs to compete using a SKX body and could not keep to the present price point especially since ISO certified watches have to be individually checked. I agree with what you are saying , Seiko seems to be moving into the upper end of the market and wants to get closer to the Rolex and Omega status and away from the Timex end of the spectrum. Thanks for keeping us posted. Mike.
Marc, I have to admit I agree with all your points. In Seiko’s advertising of late, the turtle and the samurai will be the affordable iso rated divers. By reimagining the 5’s using the SKX case, they get to use up existing stock as well as not recreate the wheel. I agree with what someone else said about it being a close of one chapter and the beginning of a new chapter. Although, I haven’t seen the new 5’s yet in the metal, so I will hold off judgement. But that being said, there are five of the new 27 sku’s that I really like based on the press photos. A great video. Thanks for sharing your opinion. -Mark
Just sold a Certina DS Action to fund a SKX007J2. The one upgrade I'll do is a flat sapphire, but to keep in line with the original look it will have clear AR. I will rock int on the original bracelet, as it is darn good despite what is said on all the watch forums.
Thing is Seiko, despite the modding community being of a different opinion most of the time, did everything right from the start.
The dial is great. Crown guards are perfect, along with the placement of the crown. The size is perfect. The stats are perfect. And yes, the bracelet is perfect. Light, comfortable, and looks great.
And even the movement is perfect. Let me elaborate on that last part.
The 7S26 does everything you can expect from a mechanical movement in a reasonably way. It is rugged, it has day/date. It is cheap to replace the day it gives up the ghost (and then you can upgrade to a hack/handwind if you feel you have to). And no, you do not need to hack/handwind a movement to have it to "work". That is just snobbery. I know, a bit harsh perhaps, but it is still true. If you get a movement that can be regulated to within 5-10 seconds/day, what more can you ask for?
I know, I know. Some claim they need to handwind their watches or else they stop working even if they wear them all day. How about getting active enough to keep your watch energized? It cannot be that hard taking a walk after work if you spend all day just sitting in front of a computer?
The SKX looks good, it can take a beating, but yet work with a suit unless you really are an executive (but then perhaps you got enough confidence in yourself to throw caution to the wind regarding convention and just wear it anyway because you like it, even at a cocktailparty?)
GADA is strong in this watch, and at a price point that is relevant and within reach for most people.
But the thing is I did not buy it just because of all that. I bought it because it is actually the epitome of Seiko diver designs. You can trace the roots back to the 60's, and all models since then can be found - in a way - in the SKX. The Willard, the Turtle, the 62MAS. All boilde down to one thing; the SKX. This watch has the pedigree of giants.
The SKX line was the last line of real divers from Seiko. With the reintroduction of the Turtle a couple of years back Seiko began what is nothing but an effort to do a "Rolex" transformation.Seiko is trying to "upgrade" the movements (just how different is 4-series from the 7-series besides hack/handwind? And the 6-series over the 4-series?)
I am pretty darn sure that in 10-15 years time the price for an unmodded SKX in reasonable shape will not be below $500, despite the "obsolete" movement. Because in that time enough people will have sold theirs, only to then realize they did a mistake selling.
"Grand scheme" = Long term business strategy 🤑
btw- any news on the Islander 38?
YESSSS PLZZZZ.......also make it compatible with SKX013 mod parts............
do you think the chapter ring issues will be resolved with the replacement? or will the case construction still offer that notch that lets the ring be off center most of the time (which you so expertly showed in one or more of your videos)?
Thanks for this video. So many people missed these points. Keep up the good work.
A lot of people just look at the cellphones, some have a hard time reading an analog watch, more buyers fall for affordable luxury AKA trash, or Minimalist AKA leasy design and so on...
Really interesting to revisit this video and commentary! I think the last 3 years has shown that you are right on the money with everything that you presented here! Thanks for your insight and attention to detail. 👍
It's a very easy decision actually. We, the enthusiasts, are basically giving Seiko a case study on how we took 3 entry level nice looking diver watches and made a secondary market for watch parts & developed the whole niche modding community. The idea of personalization is very attractive to anyone, but not everyone is going to go thar route with modding. It can be also very expensive just to mod a watch. They just saw an opportunity to use this great iconic design that's proven within the whole watch community and make all the different color-combos with a less capable watch in terms of raw specs but with a way better movement. They 're basically making a ton of different fashion watches. A lot of s5sports were already diver inspired, only difference is this new seiko5sports were basically a recreation of skx with different splashes of color. I think they took cues from true enthusiasts to target the casual avarage consumers and it will be great for them in the long run.
You are so right about most younger people not knowing the difference between a quartz and automatic watch. I asked a work colleague the other day " is your watch an automatic or quartz?" His reply " I dont know but it stops if I dont wear it "🤔 Thought that was funny. Very informative vid as always Mark , thanks.
When is the 38mm Islander Watch coming?
Excellent point. Plus, once you add modding options to the new Seiko 5s...boom
I picked up my SKX007 a few years ago from you based your advice. Still my favorite watch, so thank you!
I agree with you . A company like Seiko needs to do what makes business since . They aren’t worried about us Collectors .
I've got two of them from around 2005. The Pepsi still rocking on. Handwinding/hacking have never been issues. But the orange one stopped running a few years back. I'll replace that action if necessary when I find the darn thing. Need a sapphire crystal for the pepsi. Thanks for your info, I've yet to open one up, but am very handy with tools and precision.
Please advise me on the best choice between skx009 and Seiko 5?
I just purchased a Save the Ocean Turtle. Do you plan on doing customizing options on these?
will there be mod parts available for the seiko 5 series? is the skx crystal compatible?
And here I am, sitting with my new SKX007, with aligned bezel and chapter ring. The watch I thought 'd never want, I never liked the look of, that I bought purely because Mark said it's going to go. But now that I see it on my wrist, if you want to take it from me you have to chop my hand off.
Glad I got one before the prices went all Bitcoin, and on the water resistance note, I have been diving with it twice already.
i have to wonder what prices they are fetching for a Orange Monster SKX 781K3 as I bought mine from you in 2013.
Ordered my 013 custom yesterday, can't wait to receive it.
Friend, you will not regret it! In a week, you'll be used to the size! And save him, I think in a few years he'll be worth more than 007!
@@MrVatorico Thanks. Yeah I've had my eye on it for some time. It's one I'll keep for a long while.
Sad to see the SKX discontinued but then I've already bought mine and I'm happy to see the new Seiko 5s and planning on buying one of the orange ones.
You are 100% correct. Those of us who live in watch geek land, get a skewed view of the actual realities of the watch business as compared to Seiko’s point of view. So, while the watch geeks may complain, from Seiko’s perspective, i.e., actually making money for the corporation, my guess is that the new 5 Line of watches is going to do very well.
I basically agree. I only got into watches around 2 years ago. Before that I knew what an Automatic was, but never held one. I grew up with digital.
From what I heard, many think there is going to be some sort of ISO Diver to replace the SKX. Only speculation so far, but many think Seiko has something planned.
Howdy, Marc - I bought an SKX013 from you a couple of years ago (as a gift). A month ago, I finally bought a near mint 007 for myself. I've tried to find out if SKX actually means something (62MAS is for "autoMAtic Self-dater"). Can't find anything. Do you know if it means something - either in English or in Japanese? Thanx. M
In a small way I'm upset I never pulled the trigger on a SKX but at the same time I'm kind of glad I didn't because I love my Islander. My question is is there any news as to when we can expect to see some different colorways for The Islander?
Hello Mark. In your opinion, if the SKX is not the volume watch one thinks it is, where is the volume for Seiko. As you said in America and in South Africa people generally don't know much about automatic watches. Are they only making their money on high end watches or is the volume in some other area of business like movement manufacture.? Mark.
Great editorial, Marc. Most people wear the Apple Watch and would not care over the difference between an auto vs a quartz watch.
no i wanted to buy one! what is a good alternative???
Thanks for the hard business truths Marc. Yea, those of us watch geeks who like mechanicals are not as large a market as we think. It's all about profits for Seiko--and that's a good thing.
Not long ago a friend of mine needed some fast cash and regretfully decided to bring his beloved sarg009 into a pawn shop for some quick cash. They took a glance at it and said they only took Citizens and Bulovas. Perceived value is not universal.
So glad my friend pushed me into buying an SKX009J one week before they announced it was discontinued :p
Well considered video. As a loyal skx user I still get your rational.. Thanks Mark
Dear Mark, it will be possible to ship your watches from inside Europe?
I never really cared for the SKS because of the complaints about the band or the movement. That said I'm sad to see it go but I'm glad to see brands such as your's carry on the legacy while improving the design.
What complaints? The bracelet is comfortable and light and my SKX007 7s26 is -1s a day.
@@ThisIsDavesGarage Different storks for different folks I guess. Sorry I don't like your beloved watch.
From a marketing perspective, one other point is we have to realise is smart watches are entering this price bracket & watch space. Seiko has to react & came out with "fashion" 5 with 27 designs to cast a wider net. W/o ISO testing to keep cost down.
If this brings in new younger customers to love mech watches, eventually they will upgrade. Seiko has to react & can't ignore smart watches trend in ~USD300 worldwide market.
SKX ISO testing at this day could be costly, after so many years the watch is almost selling at same price. Buy it while you can.
I bought the latest 5, I love it cos +3s/d, the finishing is unbelievable for this price. Marc keep the videos coming. 👍
will the prices of the prospex line get affected w/ the entry of the new seiko 5 series?
Thank you, Marc, for the insider explanation of what is going on, and kudos for creating your own line to fill the niche. I'm curious to know if modding to a screw down crown would pick up the new S5 watches to 200m resistance.
With the watch mod and now micro manufacturer community using something like the SKX as the dimensional basis for new components (cases, crystals, etc.) Where does it leave that community? Will they soldier on using an out of production watch as the common element that defines part compatibility? And what about movements? Right now it seems everything short of the movement is manufactured by someone other than Seiko. And that unbranded Seiko movements is used. Will Seiko stop production of the 7s26 movement (I say this without knowing if the have new offerings using that movement)? Will Seiko continue with sales of unbranded movements? Will we see clones of Seiko movements show up or will the community move to ETA clones or other movements?
Agree. Hopefully we'll one day see the Seiko's on the shelves at eye level rather than tucked away under the Fasion quartz
I agree with you Mark, especially coz your POV is from a different perspective in the equation as a seller. I think Seiko already new they have to get rid of SKX but realized the whole mod community behind so they created a new line wich is inspired by the community but is Not for this community but to entice and introduce a new generation of consumers. Sadly this is how things are developing. Anyway, I'm happy I still could get my SARB033 and SARB017 and by a reasonable price before the pipe really dries out. Nice video 😎👍
So SNK800 series will be discontinued? Will there be a replacement?
Just received my Long Islander from you - very impressed and happy with your take on the SKX.
Regardless of what fan boys are saying, the new 5 line is pretty solid.
I have one and the quality is great. 100m is plenty fine for my use with water sports, beach fun etc.
The hacking, winding movement and a see through case back is all things I was looking for in a automatic watch for sub or around $300.
Hi Mark ! Any update on Orient Triton bezel insert ?
Triton is nice replacement fro SKX , but normal insert is 100 % necessary ))
so for those of us that have an SKX009, will the value increase? ...in your opinion
Nice analysis Mark, thank you. I think you've summed it up pretty well. Fortunately I am one of those strange individuals not turned on by the SKX lineup, nor most of the Seiko line, be it the mundane models or the Grand Seikos, my tastes lie elsewhere. Really enjoy you channel though, thank you. Being in the UK if we didn't get hit by the 20% additional tax and duty costs, I would definitely be putting business your way. All the best.
Good analysis. I was recently telling Shane over at Relative Time that your new Islander diver is CRUSHING the new Seiko 5 imitation diver. You offer so much quality it's ridiculous! It's no wonder you sold out right away. I would have bought one of the Islanders but I think the logo throws the symmetry off. I like your logo, as a logo, but I don't like it on the watch dial. It looks too much like a subdial, to me. The word Islander or the letters LIW would be better IMHO.
Love what Marc does online, educational videos and his new Islander entry launch. Great value and upgrade over the SKX and Orient. Kind of agree on the logo with AJ, though. LIW, Island or Islander spelled out in place of the logo would help establish branding and enhance the balance on the dial. The logo can be used on the crown or case back altered with the Long Island etching based on various new models.
Thanks Marc. This allows me to understand Seiko not mfg the 309j1 any more. I have one and love it so much I wanted another one, and was unable to buy it due to Seikos decision not to make it anymore
Times change and renewing is needed. I was surprised to know SKX 007 was so popular in the US. In Latin America they are not as popular nor known. Casio and Citizen are more popular here. The watches you supply with your brand look like good options.
Good video! Thank you.
Marc, I think your points, from an informed business perspective, are bang on the money. Well said.
It’ll be interesting to see if any changes are made to the plethora of 37mm non diver 5’s on the market. I’ve bought and sold a few of these over time and bracelets aside, the quality of dials, lume plots and placements, sharpness of elements, has improved somewhat since the mid ‘80s and ‘90s models. Quality being improved at the mass produced low end it would make sense to lift the line to a higher perceived tier and price point, from a business perspective at least. A movement upgrade to the 4R would help justify this, with a negligible if any increase in production costs.
I have the 007. I’ll use it until the movement dies. Then maybe replace it with the better movement. This way I can keep using my original skx007 case with screw down crown.
The movement will wear out fast. After a year, mine went to $&:/.
@@Ferien7 what a load of bullshit. I've had mine for 9 years and it gains 5 seconds per day, it came like that from the factory. 1 year my ass.
Hey Mark, I was at Wind Up NYC yesterday and didn't see you. Did you bow out this year?
Great points. I think you hit it on the head pretty much. The SKX is a very popular watch with a cult following but for me personally i won't miss it as im an Orient guy anyhow. I own one Seiko and prefer my Orients with their more accurate in house movements, additional features, and better value.
Any idea if the Sea Urchin will be discontinued?
I agree. These days I'd rather wear a Citizen Eco-drive than a 7s Seiko movement.
My problem with the new Seiko 5 line is that for what you get I would only be willing to pay $150, with no desire to go above that.
Any news when the full line will hit retailers? I haven't seen the SRPD76 out yet.
I for one was never huge on the SKX, but now with a gold PVD coming out I'm considering a black bezel/Belhamel strap mod. (Although, for a couple bucks more I could have the pink gold Steinhart Ocean 39.)
Happy I bought mine from you. My guess is they will bring it back ....limited edition type offering away from the retail channel.
Christmas wish - mecha Quartz chronograph. Hope it's in the works. Is the natural progression to first enjoy divers ....then chronographs later on?
What will happen to the literally hundreds of different models of Seiko 5 out there in the market that have the same old 7S26 movement? ie: SNK, SNKL, and many other lines. Will Seiko keep manufacturing them or will they be retired as well like the SKX007?
I do understand your points, Mark, I'm just disappointed they didn't introduce a Seiko 5 with sapphire, >=NH35 movement (36 in Seikos?), and diver rated to 200m. Even if that was more like $500 it would've been a proper successor to the SXK models. And don't count kids out too much: my kids at least know what an automatic movement is. I made sure to teach them :)
Hey, I like Citizen watches, just bought a Navihawk Atomic and love the damn thing to bits.
Think you could do a video on watch maintenance? Automatic watches do need to be serviced from time to time, and I think a lot of people don't understand what goes into that, and don't anticipate that future cost. I'm requesting this, because you do sell some watches that are $1000+ and once you hit that price point, servicing costs start going up.
All things evolve and change... I’ve tried on the new Seiko 5 and the quality seems pretty good, on a par with my Prospex Turtle.
I also discovered yesterday that the Seiko 5 case geometry is the same as the SKX, therefore all the after market SKX mod’s such as bezels, inserts and crystals will fit the new watch 👌 The only exception is the crown because it’s non screw down.
Hi Mark, I have seen the new Seiko 5s and I think they are really beautiful, but can we ate least swim and take five meters dives with them? If it is alright to do that team I think the watches will sell really good? I think the maroon and the green are really different !
Great points. Still don't like the Seiko 5 "replacements", though. Appreciate your dealer perspective!
You're right. I couldn't understand why they were discontinuing a bread and butter line but it's not. They probably sell 8 or 9 quartz watches to 1 automatic. Though quartz is being unseated from its throne in recent times, by smart watches. When can we expect a full range of Seiko smart watches. Sad for someone who appreciates the art of watchmaking but it's called progress 😥
I, for one, like the 7S26. It is rugged and reliable and not expensive to maintain. It is the VW Beetle of automatics. Hacking and hand-winding are not priorities for me either as I change my watch every two to three days. My Long Island modded SKX007j (Sapphire, coin edged bezel and ceramic insert) is just perfect.... looks like a standard SKX, just better. Anybody who owns a SKX will probably tell you it is the watch that gets the most wrist time, and they just keep going. We are therefore fortunate to have the option of the Islander to fill the boots of the departing SKX.
I bought both my skx007 and my original Orange Monster from LIW. Very happy I got both back when I did.
Always enjoy your videos. I appreciate your honesty and even agreement on their reason for discontinuing the product, even though it affects your own pocket.
I do like the video Marc & I hear you! The aforementioned notwithstanding, I love my 009 & I’ll never give it up. My 4r36 PADI Turtle Pepsi is similar in shape but has attributes missing & wanting in the 009. So...I’m happy 😊
The SNK field watches are discontinued too!?! When did that happen!?! Does Seiko have anything down the line to replace it?
Never mind the SKX. The SNK gone 😕? And the rest of the 5's?
I don't think there's anything official to verify this, but I wouldn't be surprised. They're clearly looking to retire the 7S line of movements... just like they've done with the 6R15. Everything new has a 4R35/36 or 6R35 now. It's a good move for them. Their longevity was impressive, but they're just not competitive anymore.
Where can I buy the math clock in the background?
Most people don't even know you can change the bands and bracelet easily. I don't know how many times I've hear " I'd buy it but I don't like the band." I replace the band or bracelet immediately on 50% of my watches. I'm swapping them all the time. I just find it amazing how a band swap changes the entire look of a watch.
Hi Mark, I have a skx009 and I love it...I I think the new line is very beautyful but what really boders me is that it doesnt have screw down crown.. I will never buy one, its just fashon...Regards from Uruguay