Anyone can make this claim... it has to be proven. Where was your church in 33A.D? Or at that 300 A.D? Or at that 500A.D And so on till today? There are Christians who lived during this time that we can read from and about.
Seems every Catholic and Protestant debate I watch, the protestant always seems to be on the defensive. Sometimes with a little anger. I left the Catholic Church and was a protestant for many years, with many fond memories. I found my way back to the One True Church, the Catholic Church, and studied Catholicism. I’ve never been happier or have felt closer to Christ. The Catholic Church was founded 33A.D.
Praise God!! Amen! I left the church to be Protestant as well, but found my way back to the Catholic Church! Btw not sure if you know but the other church in this debate is actually a cult. ICOC and ICC are both cults
Welcome home. When a protestant can trace their lineage, without using a false pamphlet "Trail of Blood" citing groups that professed a heretical view then and would, under the lenses of today still be heretical then I'll listen, but it seems that would be an impossible feat, because Protestants started with Martin Luther...who was certainly not a biblical figure.
“The Trail of Blood,” was a 1931 propaganda pamphlet by James Carroll which sold over 2 million copies. This pamphlet promoted the Landmark theory or “Landmarkism” that the Baptist Church was founded by John the Baptist. Landmarkism was a theory made up by James Graves in 1851 that the Baptist Church dates back to the Apostolic period. James Graves was a founding member of the Southern Baptist convention and was the editor in chief of the first Southern Baptist newspaper. He used this newspaper to promote his new theory of Landmarkism. Graves came up with this idea in reaction because of other movements like the Restoration Movement that did not want to show that they actually broke away from the Catholic Church from past religion schisms. There was no proof of this “Landmark” idea and because there was no proof, the Southern Baptist Convention in a written declaration in 1859 denied Landmarkism and separated themselves from these Landmark Baptist. The Southern Baptist Convention in it’s declaration states that it’s Baptist Denomination was started in 1609 by John Smyth. Unfortunately some Southern Baptist’s still believe this propaganda because it was passed on from generation to generation “as gospel “ or as the truth. The Restoration Movement or Stone-Campbell Movement was started by Protestant Barton Stone, a former Presbyterian minister, Protestant Thomas Campbell, a former Presbyterian minister and his Protestant son Alexander Campbell, a former Baptist minister. These 3 Protestant men merged their new movement idea together in 1834 into a Church called the “Disciples of Christ.” The idea of this movement was that this new Church called the “Disciples of Christ” came directly from the apostles and not the Catholic Church and that it they only go by the Bible and no traditions at all. A Protestant family called the Lipscomb’s heard about this movement, went to one of its tent revivals and decided to join. Granville and William Lipscomb, David Lipscomb's father and uncle, lived in Eastern Kentucky and were members of the Beans Creek Baptist Church, a church that the family left to join this recently formed Disciples of Christ Church. In 1873 William Lipscomb, David Lipscomb uncle, founded the the 1st Church of Christ called the Neely's Bend Church of Christ in Nashville, a new division of the Disciples of Christ Church. Granville Lipscomb Jr, David Lipscomb’s brother, founded the 2nd Church of Christ Church in Weakly County, Tennessee in 1878. In 1906 David Lipscomb petitioned the US government to recognize the Church of Christ as an independent Church from the Disciples of Christ Church because the Church of Christ denomination was more conservative in it’s doctrine than the Disciples of Christ. David Lipscomb and another man, James Harding, went on to found the Nashville Bible College in 1891 in Nashville Tn, which today is called Lipscomb University. David also had a brother named William Lipscomb who founded a private school in 1866 on Concord Road in Brentwood Tn that today is a Williamson County owned school named Lipscomb Elementary.
I appreciate your comments. I had a good friend who attended Lipscomb Bible school in Nashville in the 1940s. He worked on me many years as i searched for the real church to learn salvation. It was finally kicked in by the mid 90s, through my thick skull that he was right Mack Lyon spoke about how the Edmond, OK church of Christ had nothing to do with Stone and Campbell.
@@WLBarton4466 Early Church Fathers on the Catholic Church Being Founded by Jesus The Early Church Fathers on various topics: This was a 3700 hour project which included going through 22896 pages of the 38 volume set called Ante Nicene, Nicene, Post Nicene Fathers. I compiled 255 pages of quotes showing that the Early Church was always and completely Catholic. All of these quotes can be verified and found from the source which is free online. Catholic is used 140 times prior to Constantine Catholic Church appears 656 times Catholic and Apostolic Church is used 48 times Catholics appears 192 times referring to a group Catholic is used 1515 times in total Ignatius of Antioch Epistle to the Smyraeans ch 8 [50-117 AD] See that ye all follow the bishop, even as Jesus Christ does the Father, and the presbytery as ye would the apostles; and reverence the deacons, as being the institution of God. Let no man do anything connected with the Church without the bishop. Let that be deemed a proper Eucharist, which is [administered] either by the bishop, or by one to whom he has entrusted it. Wherever the bishop shall appear, there let the multitude [of the people] also be; even as, wherever Jesus Christ is, there is the Catholic Church... Polycarp The Martyrdom of Polycarp ch 8 [69-155 AD] Now, as soon as he had ceased praying, having made mention of all that had at any time come in contact with him, both small and great, illustrious and obscure, as well as the whole Catholic Church throughout the world, the time of his departure having arrived, they set him upon an ass, and conducted him into the city, the day being that of the great Sabbath. And the Irenarch Herod, accompanied by his father Nicetes (both riding in a chariot), met him, and taking him up into the chariot, they seated themselves beside him, and endeavoured to persuade him, saying, "What harm is there in saying, Lord Caesar, and in sacrificing, with the other ceremonies observed on such occasions, and so make sure of safety?" But he at first gave them no answer; and when they continued to urge him, he said, "I shall not do as you advise me." So they, having no hope of persuading him, began to speak bitter words unto him, and cast him with violence out of the chariot, insomuch that, in getting down from the carriage, he dislocated his leg [by the fall]. But without being disturbed, and as if suffering nothing, he went eagerly forward with all haste, and was conducted to the stadium, where the tumult was so great, that there was no possibility of being heard. Polycarp The Martyrdom of Polycarp ch 16 [69-155 AD] "And of the elect, he was one indeed, the wonderful martyr Polycarp, who in our days was an apostolic and prophetic teacher, bishop of the Catholic Church in Smyrna. For every word which came forth from his mouth was fulfilled and will be fulfilled" (Martyrdom of Polycarp 16:2 [A.D. 155]). Martyrdom of Polycarp greeting (69-155 ad) The Church of God which sojourns at Smyrna, to the Church of God sojourning in Philomelium, and to all the congregations of the Holy and Catholic Church in every place: Mercy, peace, and love from God the Father, and our Lord Jesus Christ, be multiplied. Martyrdom of Polycarp Ch 19 (69-155 ad) Lord Jesus Christ, the Saviour of our souls, the Governor of our bodies, and the Shepherd of the Catholic Church throughout the world Justin Martyr On the Sole Government of God ch 1 (100-165 ad) For the men of former generations, who instituted private and public rites in honour of such as were more powerful, caused forgetfulness of the Catholic faith to take possession of their posterity Irenaeus of Lyon Book 2 ch 9.1 (120-180 ad) For even creation reveals Him who formed it, and the very work made suggests Him who made it, and the world manifests Him who ordered it. The Catholic Church, moreover, through the whole world, has received this tradition from the apostles. Irenaeus of Lyons Adversus Haereses Book I Ch10.3 [120-180 AD] ...as these teachers who are destitute of truly divine wisdom maintain; while the Catholic Church possesses one and the same faith throughout the whole world, as we have already said. Irenaeus of Lyons Adversus Haereses Book III Chapter 4 preface [120-180 AD] The truth is to be found nowhere else but in the Catholic Church, the sole depository of apostolical doctrine. Heresies are of recent formation, and cannot trace their origin up to the apostles. Clement of Alexandria Stromata Book 7 ch 17 (150-215 ad) From what has been said, then, it is my opinion that the true Church, that which is really ancient, is one, and that in it those who according to God's purpose are just, are enrolled. For from the very reason that God is one, and the Lord one, that which is in the highest degree honourable is lauded in consequence of its singleness, being an imitation of the one first principle. In the nature of the One, then, is associated in a joint heritage the one Church, which they strive to cut asunder into many sects. [+] Therefore in substance and idea, in origin, in pre-eminence, we say that the ancient and Catholic Church is alone, collecting as it does into the unity of the one faith -- which results from the peculiar Testaments, or rather the one Testament in different times by the will of the one God, through one Lord -- those already ordained, whom God predestinated, knowing before the foundation of the world that they would be righteous. [+] But the pre-eminence of the Church, as the principle of union, is, in its oneness, in this surpassing all things else, and having nothing like or equal to itself. But of this afterwards. [+] Of the heresies, some receive their appellation from a [person's] name, as that which is called after Valentinus, and that after Marcion, and that after Basilides, although they boast of adducing the opinion of Matthew [without truth]; for as the teaching, so also the tradition of the apostles was one. Some take their designation from a place, as the Peratici; some from a nation, as the [heresy] of the Phrygians; some from an action, as that of the Encratites; and some from peculiar dogmas, as that of the Docetae, and that of the Harmatites; and some from suppositions, and from individuals they have honoured, as those called Cainists, and the Ophians; and some from nefarious practices and enormities, as those of the Simonians called Entychites. Clement of Alexandria Stromata book 4 ch 15 (150-215 ad) For the apostle says, "All other things buy out of the shambles, asking no questions," with the exception of the things mentioned in the Catholic epistle of all the apostles, "with the consent of the Holy Ghost," which is written in the Acts of the Apostles, and conveyed to the faithful by the hands of Paul himself Hippolytus Refutation of All Heresies Book IX ch 7 [170-236 AD] Behold, into how great impiety that lawless one has proceeded, by inculcating adultery and murder at the same time! And withal, after such audacious acts, they, lost to all shame, attempt to call themselves a Catholic Church! ...not discerning with whom they ought to communicate, but indiscriminately offering communion to all... Caius Fragment 3 Muratorianus par 3 [180-240 AD] He wrote, besides these, one to Philemon, and one to Titus, and two to Timothy, in simple personal affection and love indeed; but yet these are hallowed in the esteem of the Catholic Church, and in the regulation of ecclesiastical discipline. There are also in circulation one to the Laodiceans, and another to the Alexandrians, forged under the name of Paul, and addressed against the heresy of Marcion; and there are also several others which cannot be received into the Catholic Church, for it is not suitable for gall to be mingled with honey. Tertullian Prescription Against Heretics ch 32 (160- 240 ad) "Where was [the heretic] Marcion, that shipmaster of Pontus, the zealous student of Stoicism? Where was Valentinus, the disciple of Platonism? For it is evident that those menlived not so long ago,--in the reign of Antoninus for the most part,--and that they at first were believers in the doctrine of the Catholic Church, in the church of Rome under the episcopate of the blessed Eleutherus, until on account of their ever restless curiosity,with which they even infected the brethren, they were more than once expelled Tertullian Prescription Against Heretics ch 35 (160- 240 ad) Catholics appeal always to evidence traceable to apostolic sources. Tertullian Prescription Against Heretics ch 36 (160- 240 ad) Catholics never change the Scriptures, which always testify for them.
Hi @pickup _man_1973, even though all that is likely the case, nevertheless, there were many Christian believers outside of the Roman church scattered in numerous groups in Europe and Asia Minor that actually did have the same basic beliefs as the present day Church of Christ and many of those that are called Baptists. Unfortunately, most of those people and groups were wiped out over several centuries by the Roman Catholic Church and either directly by the forces of the Popes, or by civil forces at their request or at least with their agreement. About the only group that managed to survive into modern times despite the European crusades and genocidal inquisitions; and they are the remnants of the Waldenses, most of who's surviving members merged into the other protestant groups. Therefore, regardless of anything else, there was a trail of blood, and it was shed by the Roman church.
54:40 always easier to make a mess then to clear one up. Throwing out a list like that is done in 30seconds but would take a day of showing the errors and gathering supporting evidence. 1/2 that list can be shown in the bible, the rest can be shown in the writings of the early Church Fathers. I consider that tactic cheap.
It is less than savory. I e seen it used many times against the Orthodox and Catholics in debates. Polemics are a sign of weakness. Priests aren't necessarily the best apologists. A better debate COC vs cc is Sungenis vs Hester it's spicy
That is my grandaddy Conley. I miss him dearly. There is an ever-shortening list of great and honest preachers left. Listen to him please. He only tells the Truth.
In the middle of the passion of Christ, the most important moment in all of salvation history, the blood of the Lamb of God dripping from the cross to the ground, the Son of God is breathing his last breaths, and he says: "BEHOLD YOUR MOTHER"!!! Why did Jesus say this? ... ... Because Jesus wasn't protestant.
While Catholics are sincere, they don’t have the truth and don’t at all resemble the church in first century. “Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood. For I know this, that after my departing shall grievous wolves enter in among you, not sparing the flock. Also of your own selves shall men arise, speaking perverse things, to draw away disciples after them. Therefore watch, and remember, that by the space of three years I ceased not to warn every one night and day with tears.” Acts 20:28-31 This verse clearly shows we can’t trust tracing individuals to the apostles as the Catholic Church believes proves they are the true church. Paul says MEN AMONG THEM WILL ARISE, SPEAKING (oral teaching), to draw away disciples after them. Yet, Paul finishes with this: “And now, brethren, I commend you to God, and to the word of his grace, which is able to build you up, and to give you an inheritance among all them which are sanctified.” Acts 20:32 The “word of his Grace” is the written word of God that is able to build us up.
I think the Catholics could have picked better debaters. They do not have the stage presence or confidence the CoC guy does. People may respond and say it's only what he says that matters, but we are human, and confident presentation speaks volumes. It simply does.
I’m in a study of Catholicism this quarter at Tennessee Bible College. It doesn’t take long to see how corrupt Catholicism is. It’s a religion based upon political power and the main purpose is for the common people to stay ignorant of the Scriptures. They teach that only the leaders can interpret the Bible which is totally false. Somewhere around 1.5 billion people follow Catholicism and do so ignorantly. God wrote the Bible in such a way that the honest soul can understand it. It takes a lot of diligent study but it can be understood alike. Loving the world and sin more than God will make someone follow the easier path. However the easier path is not always the one to heaven. Study your Bible diligently with a honest heart and you will find the truth.
So you trust anti-Catholics to teach you about Catholics? How is that an effective method? If you want to know REAL Catholic teachings you should read the official book of Catholic teachings, i.e. the catechism, and not people with a negative bias toward Catholicism. Also please show in the Bible where implicitly or explicitly says your only authority is scriptures which can be honestly misinterpreted.
Were these claims taken up with a Catholic priest? Personal interview is a critical component of honest research. I'm sure your local parish has one that would be happy to sit down with you and address your statements. Even if you disagree with what he says, you should still base your arguments off of your own research and interviews with what Catholics say, not what the college says what Catholics say.
One more thing, I agree with you 100% that many follow Catholic Church teaching ignorantly. Many who are baptized do not take Mass seriously, nor any of the other commands. They simply think that baptism=prosperity and eternity. This is an issue in all Protestant traditions, including the Christian Churches/Churches of Christ tradition. As Fulton Sheen put it, "There are not one hundred people in the United States who hate The Catholic Church, but there are millions who hate what they wrongly perceive the Catholic Church to be." Please, go talk to a Catholic Priest and conduct an interview with him. Take your strongest argument or grievance and make it your thesis. Did the interview reinforce your grievance? Did it bring up some things you hadn't considered? Publish your findings in a paper, even if it's just a local church paper. I would read it if you linked it here.
Protestants: "we only believe in the word of God and follow what we find in this catholic book that was canonized in 382AD but will only follow the example of the Church shown in Acts, but we trust the catholic book... just not the catholic church..."
That’s where you’re false. It is not a Catholic book. It is the gospel. You simply deeming it as “Catholic” doesn’t make it Catholic. It is a bunch of documents written by a variety of men… that was then LATER compiled together. No one is saying that part wasn’t a good thing to do. But compiling and understanding/obeying scripture are two very different things. Even an archeologist can find artifacts and not really understand the purpose fully. There is much of history we don’t know.. But.. in terms of scripture, it wasn’t the Catholic papecy that made the scriptures we see today. It was apostles of Christ. They wrote down what they saw and some wrote letters to different churches. The Catholic Church adds onto scripture with things that “could or could not” be supported by scripture. Or just completely adds onto in general. The papecy is not biblical. The prostration to the popes are not biblical. Even Peter told Cornelius to stand up when the gentleman tried to bow at Peter’s feet. Peter even added that he was just as man as he was. So there is much we can learn from scripture. If a practice is not supported by it, then we can see falsehood and that’s the job of a Christian to correct. If you do not wish to be corrected to continue in your ways, that’s not the person correcting being false.. that’s you being false because you’d rather be comfortable in what you think is true than what is true.
@@allisontowell2274 So we know that the Catholic church existed from the beginning, which no doubt you would dispute... so in your opinion when did the Catholic church actually start?
@@HOSPlTALLER No what the Catholic Church does wasn’t around during the time of the apostles. We see that through the scriptures. Cause what is in scripture is what they were practicing. Catholics even admit to their oral traditions being passed down at certain points. Also, a title, is not what makes you a body of Christ. Even Romans 16:16 calls them “churches of Christ” so the title “Catholic” wasn’t spread for every single church title.
@Bruce Bronson "f the Bible is not the final authority," Ok, so where does the bible state that it is the final authority? "subjective as opposed to objective and absolute truth" OK.. just the book chapter and verse where the bible says it is the final authority; otherwise you are asking me to believe your subjective and fallible opinion on how to interpret scripture.
@@TruthHasSpoken so you believe there are other authorities? So you believe then that gods words in the Bible contradicts itself if there is other writings out there that are equally important as the Bible?
@@JSJTOUTDOORS Still haven't answered the question: _where does the bible state that it is the final authority?_ "You believe there are other authorities? " Scripture : Christ is the head of his Church (Col 1: 18) Christ''s Church is the pillar of truth (1 Tim 3: 15) Christ's Church is the bulwark of truth. (1 Tim 3: 15) Christ's Church is where the manifold wisdom of God is made known. (Eph 3: 10) *Christ PROMISED to lead it to ALL Truth.* (Jn 16: 13) Christ PROMISED that he would NEVER leave it. (Mt 28: 20) Christ PROMISED that the gates of hell would not prevail (it will not teach doctrinal error) ; (Mt 16: 18) Next open your bible to the table of contents. Where does scripture list what books belong in it? Book Chapter Verse If not in scripture, what other AUTHORITY decided for you?
Connolly, repeatedly refers to the scripture and never did he stumbled with his words, Truth. Paul on the other hand is stumbling all through and only asking to be believed with no scripture to back his claims. This is going just as expected by this servant of God. Thank you for affirmation in the word. Jesus said that "I am the way the truth and the life, no man cometh to the Father if not through me". The Catholic faith is a deception.
You can certainly tell who the catholics in the audience, they are the ones sitting in the defensive position when the Holy and Only Word of God is read.
Priests being called Father, worshiping the virgin Mary, bowing to popes, and calling the pope infallible is more than enough evidence that the catholic organization is not in line with the Bible. Game over!
If all scripture is given by the inspiration of the Holy Spirit as stated in 2 Timothy 3:16-17, then anything that contradicts it would not be the truth since the Holy Spirit does not contradict itself.
And yet Protestants have so many denominations all of which use the Bible as the final authority but cannot agree with each other. That alone tells you the Holy Spirit has nothing to do with those churches
It was the tradition of the Catholic church that put the canon of scripture together in 382 AD in the counsel of Rome. You can thank Catholics for your bible.
@@mfjh505 I agree that the catholic church has done some good, but praying to Mary and the saints, and pedophilia have destroyed the integrity of the church
@@Converterguy Praying to Mary and the saints have been taught by the early church. You can find this in the writings of Jerome, Ignatius of Antioch and Polycarp. This is also biblical. Do not confuse church doctrine and teachings from the sins of men. The Catholic church does teach and condemns pedophilia. The people in the Catholic church are sinners and hypocrites, but the church itself is true and her teachings are true. The Catholic church is the oldest Christian church today and wouldn't be here if it wasn't guided by the Holy Spirit.
@@Converterguy Church of Christ is getting taken to court for sexual abuse as well, be careful of throwing stones while in a glass house - lest they be thrown back. Also all that kind of criminal sin should be punished, regardless of where it occurs.
This man of Catholic faith truly made me dizzy. Satan has confused the minds of some men. This made no sense whatsoever justifying the Catholic Church. He used everything but the Bible to back up his “theory’. It’s absolutely sad. Pray for him.
Try listening to relevant radio. It helped me a lot. They have an app. I’ve called in many times and they actually answer and I get to speak with the hosts.❤
I appreciate people who know their Bible well. However, some people, such as atheists, are seldom converted by the Bible. Many atheists were converted through their profession such as eye doctors who admitted their had to be a creator when they saw the intricate engineering of the eye. We don't always need to use the Bible to back up the Bible. Even God says in Romans 1:20 that creation is provided so that every person will know in their heart someone had to create that. The Bible doesn't always tell man God exists, some men believe God exists just by the evidence they see every day. Churches of Christ/Christian Churches tradition often use 17th century English history to prove they existed before the reformation. They too are using sources other than the Bible to prove their statement that Churches of Christ/Christian Churches existed pre-reformation.
Without a Church that Christ established, and the gates of hell will not prevail against it. The man with the most education leads and wins... Yet the scriptures have always said to submit to those over you. But starting when in the 1500's or 1800's? from A.D 33
Ive been a Catholic for 18 years. My family was a strict Catholic we pray to the roasary very often every evening, had novenas for our patron saints, etc. I was educated by Catholic schools (elementary, highschool and college) run by Jesuit priests and Presentation of Mary nuns. To say the least, I am well doctrinated by Catholicism I understand it. When I started studying the Bible, my mind and heart was opened. 16 years ago I converted to CoC. Best decision of my life. Sola Scriptura. The Bible is our complete guide to salvation. Any man made doctrine and traditions apart from the Bible arent the teachings of Christ.
Dee . Peace be with you. I had the complete opposite experience. It wasn't until the last 15 years that my faith in Jesus Christ became the center of my life and I thank the Lord for his Church. I'm so glad your heart and soul are resting in the love of our mutual Savior.
So why do you ask Mary and the prophet's intercede on your behalf don't pray too the dead saint's and JESUS mother Mary they're not the SAVIOR of the world!
His mother and the SAINTS are happily alive in heaven brother like the thief on the Cross. Are you not aware brother? Mary is the only person who was with Jesus during birth, during his childhood years and during the time he was in the cross. Open your mind and your eyes. Stop protesting. More than 40 thousands denomination as the products of protesting.
@@thegollyer903 may I respectfully ask this question as an ex member of the c of C from 1967 to 2021 ? Christ told Peter in Matthew 16:18 that He would build His church and the gates of Hades shall not prevail against it . With that passage in mind, where was the c of C from the first century to the restoration movement in the 1800s ? If the gates of Hades could not prevail against it , I very respectfully ask , why then did it need to be restored ? Thank you .
@@Reborn_Trooper i personally dont believe the church was ever off the face of the earth at any point after it was started. Where exactly it was im not very educated on. But i believe most of the ani-baptist were christian. Before the restoration movement there is historical evidence of a church of Christ in England in the 1600s if i remember correctly. and a church of Christ in america b4 alexander campbell. Aaron Gallagher was talking about it. I think there may be a book on it. Im sure there is more evidence that i have forgotten. What i believe alexander campbell did was generally restore the church in his life/area instead of reforming his own church.
Brothers and Sisters in Christ Jesus The Lord's Prayer is meant as model design to show you instruct you how exactly to pray what to say in your prayers "Now Jesus was praying in a certain place, and when he finished, one of his disciples said to him, “Lord, teach us to pray, as John taught his disciples.” Luke 11:1 (However using it as a chant so to speak was not intention) "And when you pray, do not use vain repetitions as the heathen do. For they think that they will be heard for their many words." Matthew 6:7 (Don't pray to be admired in public by other people) “And when you pray, you shall not be like the hypocrites. For they love to pray standing in the synagogues and on the corners of the streets, that they may be seen by men. Assuredly, I say to you, they have their reward." Matthew 6:5 Each thing Lord Jesus says in the Lord's prayer helps form your prayers such (pray for others) (pray for God's will to be done)
@@brittoncain5090 , I want you to understand my friend, understand me well: The church of the Lord Jesus Christ is not sectarian. The church of the Lord Jesus Christ is not a denominational body. It is not one of many churches. It is thee church! There is no other church! And if you wanna go to heaven, you get in that church, and that church alone. Because it is the only church that the Lord Jesus Christ will save. That is the only church that He shed His Blood for! And, if you’re not in it, you’ll be lost when He comes back. And, any church that claims to be married to Christ, must ware His Name. And only His Name!
@@brittoncain5090 , Now, why do the Catholic churches refuse to be called churches of Christ? It is because the Catholic church does not line up with the Written Word of God. Thus, it’s “de-nominated.”
Catholics claim that the bible doesn’t claim to be the final authority. If the word of God which the bible claims to be are not the final authority than who is? Can man just make up whatever doctrine he wants since scripture is not the final authority. The bible does not claim to be the final authority because it’s obvious that if scripture is God’s word than it is the supreme authority.
1. Scripture 2. what was taught orally 3. What the church taught, which was before the full Canon of the OT/NT. Scripture alone has been a big disagreement with the lack of unity. Who's right??
@@aggienodari453 No church has it all right, but trusting one group of people in Rome who have historically been inconsistent is leads you to all sorts of clear errors.
You don’t make up your on minds because there is the New Testament Church and the Church Of Christ believes the doctrines are preached by reading the New Testament Bible. We don’t make religion up and make individual minds of what is right. Just read the Bible. If you do not believe what is preached today from the Bible you might wonder if you know where the pearly gate is and if you get there.
It says it and yet the Roman Catholic priests want to be called father. Want to claim their pope can change the commandments and idolize Mary. OBVIOUS RED FLAGS.
Love my Protestant brothers. Please read on Martin Luther, his fight was about indulgence only, or read on John Calvin, once you somehow understand their theology, read on early Christian’s up to 500 AD. You will be shocked. Just a small sample Luther continued to pray the rosary. Both him and Calvin knew for a fact about Mary being a perpetual virgin. Read my brothers!
Where in the bible does it read everything has to be found in the bible and what books are to be in the bible. The word bible is not in the bible. Who put the bible together or canonized it...that would be the Catholics although 7 books were taken out by protestants. This is what you base your authority on ? And who is the authority to interpret ? Since u have 50,000 denominations that disagree on doctrine but claim the Holy spirit guides them or some prophet or angel. Jesus started a church and gave Peter the keys which is the authority to pass down in apostolic succession....simple as that.
Of course they are Protestants of Orthodox Church, because they were these two Churches which were leading believers in the departure of the Church from the true Church of Christ!
That pastor has a great voice. Very euphonious. That being said, I grew up in the Church of Christ, and am now more nondenominational/Baptist (I know, but that's the best description). If it came to it, I would run to the CoC if I had only the choice between that and the RCC. Because I believe that when we find the woman who rides the beast, drunk with the blood of the saints, and see the saints before the throne killed for the testimony of Jesus; we will find they are both embodied in the RCC. There's too much blood on them already, and I feel certain that there is more to come. This is not to say that those who are in the Church of Rome can't be saved; I'm sure that many of them are, but the Church of Rome as an institution is the wrong place to seek the Gospel of salvation through Jesus Christ. I have a few issues with the CoC as well, but they are minor differences in doctrine that I could live with if it came down to it; so far as I know, the folks who run it have never been involved in killing hundreds of thousands of people because they refused to be part of their fellowship, or committed the heinous crime of having, reading, teaching, translating, or printing the Bible without permission. "By their fruits ye shall know them." And those are sour grapes indeed! 😮
This is a pretty bad debate overall. I tried to give it my attention but neither side is doing a good job at the debate portion. I reached 1:28:23 and at this point i’m tired of listening.
Oh Really? Was the Early Church the Roman Catholic Church? 👉😮👈 Hermas The Shepherd of Hermas Book I Vision 2 ch 4 [60-120 AD] "Therefore shall you Hermas write two little books and send one to Clement, The Bishop of Rome, and one to Grapte. Clement shall then send it to the cities abroad, because that is his duty" Irenaeus of Lyons Adversus Haereses book 3 ch 3.3 [120-180 AD] ….the Catholic Church founded and organized in Rome by the two most glorious apostles, Peter and Paul; as also means of the successions of the bishops. For it is a matter of necessity that every Church should agree with this Church of Rome, on account of its preeminent authority... Tertullian Prescription Against Heretics ch 32 (160- 240 ad) "Where was [the heretic] Macron, that shipmaster of Pontus, the zealous student of Stoicism? Where was Valentinus, the disciple of Platonism? For it is evident that those men lived not so long ago,--in the reign of Antoninus for the most part,--and that they at first were believers in the doctrine of the Catholic Church, the Church of Rome, under the episcopate of the blessed Eleutherus, until on account of their ever restless curiosity,with which they even infected the brethren, they were more than once expelled Caius Fragment 2 AGAINST THE HERESY OF ARTEMON ch 1 (180-240 ad) For they say that all those of the first age, and the apostles themselves, both received and taught those things which these men now maintain; and that the truth of Gospel preaching was preserved until the times of Victor, who was the thirteenth bishop in Rome from Peter, Origen De Principiis Book 4 par 8 [185-254 AD] through His only-begotten Son Jesus Christ, what appears to us, who observe things by a right way of understanding, to be the standard and discipline delivered to the apostles by Jesus Christ, and which they handed down in succession to their posterity, the teachers of the holy Catholic Church of Rome. Peter of Alexandria Genuine Acts of Peter (260-311ad) A cycle of two hundred and eighty-five years from the incarnation of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ had rolled round, when the venerable Theonas, the bishop of this city of Rome, by an ethereal flight, mounted upwards to the celestial kingdoms. To him Peter, succeeding at the helm of the Church of Rome, was by all the clergy and the whole Christian community appointed bishop, the sixteenth in order from Mark the Evangelist, who was also archbishop of the city of Rome.
Don't believe that lie you wrote 🤣t (the way) was a Christian Church, the first church, & it was Christian not Catholic sect,. All the disciples belong to the way church,
The Catholic Church has 23 rites. The Roman rite is one of them. The Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church was Founded by Jesus Christ. So much knowledge when we read the writings of the Apostolic Fathers!
Today Bible alone may seem sufficient, but it was not the case during Jesus, the Apostles, the early Church and till the Protestants came along. Till Paul wrote his first letter, there was no written scripture in the early Church, there was only oral preaching, and was there anything lacking in that period? The fact that Jesus did not say anything about the New Testament, its composition, canon, etc., and that he founded a Church with authority to Peter and other Apostles proves that he did not believe in Sola Scriptura. In other words, Jesus was far from being a Protestant. Even 2 Timothy 3:15 seems to indicate that scripture alone is not sufficient. In this verse Paul tells Timothy that the sacred writings are able to instruct him for salvation through faith in Christ Jesus. In other words, sacred writings like the Old Testament are not sufficient without faith in Jesus. It is in this light that the next verse must be read: without faith in Jesus, all scripture though inspired will not be sufficient. The fact that Jesus came into this world with a new message of salvation proves that the Old Testament scriptures though inspired are not sufficient for our salvation. In the same way, the New Testament scriptures though inspired are not sufficient for our salvation without the Church which is the Body of Christ and the pillar and foundation of the Truth.
And the Spirit said to Phillip, "Go over and join this chariot." So Phillip ran to him and heard him reading Isaiah the prophet and asked, " Do you understand what you are reading?" And he said, " How can I, unless someone guides me?" And he invited Phillip to come up and sit with him.- Acts 8:29-31. So there is scriptural support for the teaching magisterium of the Church. Not everyone has the ability to just read Scripture and automatically understand it.
The Ethiopian had never heard the Gospel because he lived in Ethiopia. He recently arrived at Jerusalem for his Jewish practice, so how could he had ever known about who Isaiah talked about when he never heard of Jesus because of where he lived? Thats common sense, that does not prove Catholics are correct with their false doctrine, someone who has heard about Jesus who claimed to be the Messiah then that person would not have needed Philip to explain who Isaiah spoke of. Just like today we have inspired books put together to self explain what God wants men to know. You really need to think things through before speaking about these matters.
@@Kurt2222 There are people who live in this country, who go to "church" every Sunday, who have heard the Gospel, but still they don't understand it, and who have never come to faith in Christ. Some even want to believe, but don't know what to believe. How can they, unless someone guides them? The Lord Jesus said that the Holy Spirit will lead and guide you into all truth. He does that through those whom He has gifted with the gift of teaching His word. But even then, there are some who hear the truth, but their hearts are not opened to receive it. In Acts 16, when Paul and Silas preached the Gospel on the riverbank in Philippi, there were many who heard the Gospel, but the Scripture says that the Lord opened the heart of Lydia to receive the words spoken by Paul, and she believed and was baptized along with her household. Evidently, the others who heard the same word that day, did not have their hearts opened to receive the truth. Salvation is of the Lord. The people who heard the Gospel on the Day of Pentecost in Jerusalem were very familiar with who Jesus was and what He taught, but many of them were among the crowd who had cried for Him to be crucified. They still needed for Peter to explain who Jesus was, and they still needed to have their hearts opened to believe and receive the truth. Only God can do that.
@@jamestrotter3162 Christ sent the Holy Spirit to the apostles to guide THEM. Nobody today is directly guided by the Holy Spirit, one way to prove that is the fact that people who do claim they are guided actually contradict scriptures on certain doctrines. The early church didn't have all the books written down at the start so they needed the ability to speak the one and only truth, that why Holy Spirit was given, but prophecies would all cease, tongues would cease, and so on, but the Word of God keeps going. Just because some need more help than other doesn't mean some cannot gain the truth from scriptures, Acts 17:11 proves my point, a certain group of people searched the scriptures to see if it fit with what they were told, they did what Paul says in 1 Thessalonians 5:21 to Prove all things, hold fast to that which is good, the same greek word is used in 1 John 4:1 about testing what people say by the Word. 2 Tim 3:16-17 makes clear the scriptures are complete to make man acceptable to God, by teaching, rebuking false doctrine, etc. There are no spiritual gifted people today, no dead being raised, no lame people all of thr sudden walking as the description is in scriptures. So, we can all agree some need help at certain points, but God gave the poor man the ability to reason from what is to what was and is to come. John 7:17 if any man is willing to do His will, he shall know if its from God or Me No pope in bible, no, no. That is entirely man made, and it cannot lead anyone to heaven
julio rivera Scripture and Early Church Fathers on Tradition Scripture “I commend you because you remember me in everything and maintain the traditions even as I have delivered them to you” (1 Corinthians 11:2). “So then, brethren, stand firm and hold to the traditions which you were taught by us, either by word of mouth or by letter.” (2 Thessalonians 2:15) “You, then, my son, be strong in the grace that is in Christ Jesus, and what you have heard from me before many witnesses entrust to faithful men who will be able to teach others also” (2 Timothy 2:1-2). “First of all you must understand this, that no prophecy of Scripture is a matter of one’s own interpretation, because no prophecy ever came by the impulse of man, but men moved by the Holy Spirit spoke from God” (2 Peter 1:20-21). Early Church Fathers Papias Fragment 6 [90-140 AD]. Taught by the Apostle John. Man who tells us who wrote the 4 Gospels! "Papias [A.D. 120], who is now mentioned by us, affirms that he received the sayings of the apostles from those who accompanied them, and he, moreover, asserts that he heard in person Aristion and the presbyter John. Accordingly, he mentions them frequently by name, and in his writings gives their traditions concerning Jesus there are other passages of his in which he relates some miraculous deeds, stating that he acquired the knowledge of them from tradition" Justin Martyr [103-176] First Apology Ch 10 But we have received by tradition that God does not need the material offerings which men can give, seeing, indeed, that He Himself is the provider of all things. Irenaeus of Lyons Against Heresies Book 5 ch 20.1 (120-180 ad) But the path of those belonging to the Church circumscribes the whole world, as possessing the sure tradition from the apostles Irenaeus of Lyons Book 2 ch 9 (120-180 ad) For even creation reveals Him who formed it, and the very work made suggests Him who made it, and the world manifests Him who ordered it. The Catholic Church, moreover, through the whole world, has received this tradition from the apostles. Irenaeus of Lyons Adversus Haereses Book III Ch 2.2 [120-180 AD] But, again, when we refer them to that tradition which originates from the apostles, [and] which is preserved by means of the succession of presbyters in the Churches, they object to tradition, saying that they themselves are wiser not merely than the presbyters, but even than the apostles, because they have discovered the unadulterated truth. Irenaeus of Lyons Adversus Haereses Book III, ch 3.1 [120-180 AD] "It is possible, then, for everyone in every church, who may wish to know the truth, to contemplate the tradition of the apostles which has been made known to us throughout the whole world. And we are in a position to enumerate those who were instituted bishops by the apostles and their successors down to our own times, men who neither knew nor taught anything like what these heretics rave about" Irenaeus of Lyons Adversus Haereses book 3 ch 3.3 [120-180 AD] ….Church founded and organized at Rome by the two most glorious apostles, Peter and Paul; as also means of the successions of the bishops. For it is a matter of necessity that every Church should agree with this Church, on account of its preeminent authority -- that is, the faithful everywhere -- inasmuch as the Apostolic Tradition has been preserved continuously by those who are everywhere. The blessed apostles, then, having founded and built up the Church, committed into the hands of Linus the office of the episcopate. Of this Linus, Paul makes mention in the Epistles to Timothy. To him succeeded Anacletus; and after him, in the third place from the apostles, Clement was allotted the bishopric.… To this Clement there succeeded Evaristus. Alexander followed Evaristus; then, sixth from the apostles, Sixtus was appointed; after him, Telephorus, who was gloriously martyred; then Hyginus; after him, Pius; then after him, Anicetus. Sorer having succeeded Anicetus, Eleutherius does now, in the twelfth place from the apostles, hold the inheritance of the episcopate. In this order, and by this succession, the ecclesiastical tradition from the apostles, and the preaching of the truth, have come down to us. Irenaeus of Lyons Adversus Haereses Book III Ch 4.1-2 [120-180 AD] The truth is to be found nowhere else but in the Catholic Church, the sole depository of apostolical doctrine. Heresies are of recent formation, and cannot trace their origin up to the apostles. "That is why it is surely necessary to avoid them [heretics], while cherishing with the utmost diligence the things pertaining to the Church, and to lay hold of the tradition of truth. . . . What if the apostles had not in fact left writings to us? Would it not be necessary to follow the order of tradition, which was handed down to those to whom they entrusted the churches? Clement of Alexandria Stromata Book 7 ch 18 (150-215 ad) These points, then, having been formerly thoroughly treated, and the department of ethics having been sketched summarily in a fragmentary way, as we promised; and having here and there interspersed the dogmas which are the germs of true knowledge, so that the discovery of the sacred traditions may not be easy to any one of the uninitiated, let us proceed to what we promised. Clement of Alexandria Stromata book 6 ch 15 (150-215 ad) The liars, then, in reality are not those who for the sake of the scheme of salvation conform, nor those who err in minute points, but those who are wrong in essentials, and reject the Lord and as far as in them lies deprive the Lord of the true teaching; who do not quote or deliver the Scriptures in a manner worthy of God and of the Lord; for the deposit rendered to God, according to the teaching of the Lord by His apostles, is the understanding and the practice of the godly tradition. Clement of Alexandria Stromata book 1 ch 1 (150-215 ad) Well, they preserving the tradition of the blessed doctrine derived directly from the holy apostles, Peter, James, John, and Paul, the sons receiving it from the father, came by God's will to us also to deposit those ancestral and apostolic seeds. And well I know that they will exult; I do not mean delighted with this tribute, but solely on account of the preservation of the truth, according as they delivered it. For such a sketch as this, will, I think, be agreeable to a soul desirous of preserving from escape the blessed tradition. Tertullian Prescription Against Heretics ch 20 (160- 240 ad) They then in like manner rounded churches in every city, from which all the other churches, one after another, derived the tradition of the faith, and the seeds of doctrine, and are every day deriving them, that they may become churches. Indeed, it is on this account only that they will be able to deem themselves apostolic, as being the offspring of apostolic churches. Tertullian The Prescription against Heretics ch 28 [160-240 AD] The one tradition of the faith, which is substantially alike in the churches everywhere, a good proof that the transmission has been true and honest in the main...... No casualty distributed among many men issues in one and the same result. Error of doctrine in the churches must necessarily have produced various issues. When, however, that which is deposited among many is found to be one and the same, it is not the result of error, but of tradition. Can any one, then, be reckless enough to say that they were in error who handed on the tradition? Tertullian Against Marcion Book 4 ch 5 (160-240 ad) By the rule of antiquity, the Catholic Gospels are found to be true, including the real St. Luke's. Tertullian Against Marcion book 4 ch 5 [160-240 AD] Such are the summary arguments which we use, when we take up arms against heretics for the faith of the gospel, maintaining both that order of periods, which rules that a late date is the mark of forgers, and that authority of churches which lends support to the tradition of the apostles; because truth must needs precede the forgery, and proceed straight from those by whom it has been handed on. Origen De Principiis Book 4 par 8 [185-254 AD] through His only-begotten Son Jesus Christ, what appears to us, who observe things by a right way of understanding, to be the standard and discipline delivered to the apostles by Jesus Christ, and which they handed down in succession to their posterity, the teachers of the holy Catholic Church.
@@Pickup_man_1973 the only reason the Catholic sect don't want the holyscritures to be the last authority is because the holyscritures will debonk the catholisim DOGMA, we could destroy the catholisim DOGMA with the holyscritures!
julio rivera I sure don’t want to ruin your Saturday morning by looking at this but I felt your Catholic hatred needed to be adjusted a bit. You see Julio, it you will understand and read these 1st generation early church fathers they will tell you they were taught directly by the apostles! These men were 100% Catholic from the start and it is so overwhelming it’s not even funny! practicalapologetics.blogspot.com/2013/07/early-church-fathers-on-catholic-church.html practicalapologetics.blogspot.com/p/255-pages-of-early-church-fathers.html
@@Pickup_man_1973 now that's funny 😂, Christ came to set up a Christian Church, the disciples were call Christians in Antioch , you find all this in the book of acts, Paul was trying to convert everyone to christianity not Catholic, you need read the book of acts, the Catholic sect came from Rome, they Catholic sect was the first division of the first schism, iam Christian just like the teachings of Christ &the diciples, that horrible catholisim DOGMA sect mess up the whole world, with catholisim DOGMA , that have nothing to do with the holyscritures, because if it did the holyscritures Will destroy that dumb catholisim DOGMA.
julio rivera Yeah, I’m sorry your parents did a terrible job in your life brainwashing you. If you simply read these early church fathers that started the church you’d know the truth. Speaking of Church. What’s the pillar and foundation of truth? The Bible or the Church? Well lets see what Paul says....... “If I delay, you will know how you ought to conduct yourself in the household of God, the Church, which is the pillar and foundation of truth”. (1 Tim 3:15) This most never read verse by Protestants tell you this Church has Authority so no such thing as Bible alone. What Chapter and verse does the Bible say that everything has to be in the Bible? It doesn’t. Bible alone is a made up doctrine by Martin Luther. Another fake doctrine by Martin Luther was Faith Alone too. Faith Alone? (Sola Fide) We get the doctrine of “faith alone” from Martin Luther. In his first German Translated Bible, (Lut1545), he actually had the audacity to add the word “alone” to read you are saved by “faith alone” in Romans 3:28. This is straight from Martin Luther’s 1545 Bible where he added the word “alone” (LUT1545) Romans 3:28 - So halten wir es nun, daß der Mensch gerecht werde ohne des Gesetzes Werke, (allein ‘Alone’) durch den ( Glauben ‘Faith’. ) Here is the quote from Martin Luther about Luther adding the word “alone”. It’s pretty shocking! “If your Papist annoys you with the word ‘alone’ - Rom. 3:28, tell him straightway, Dr. Martin Luther will have it so: Papist and asses are one and the same thing. Whoever will not have my translation, let him give it the go-by: the devil’s thanks to him who censures it without my will and knowledge. Luther will have it so, and he is a doctor above all the doctors in Popedom.” (ref. Amic. Discussion, 1, 127,’The Facts About Luther,’ O’Hare, TAN Books, 1987, p. 201. Cf. Also J. Dollinger, La Reforme et les resultants qu’elle a produits. (Trans. E. Perrot, Paris, Gaume, 1848-49), Vol III, pg. 138). James 2:24 - the phrase “faith alone” only occurs once in the Bible. “Man is justified by works and NOT faith alone.” Unlike what some churches teach, no where in Scripture does it say that man is justified or saved by “faith alone.” To the contrary, man is not justified by faith alone. A person is justified by faith and works acting together, which comes solely from God’s divine grace. Faith alone never obtains the grace of justification. Also, the word “justified” is the same word Paul uses for justification in Rom. 4:3 in regard to Abraham (so you cannot argue James is not referring to “justification” in James 2:24 unless they argue Paul wasn’t in Rom. 4:3 either).
The Bereans searched the scriptures to see if these things are so… meaning that they searched the Septuagint Old Testament scriptures that would have included the Apocrypha, there was no established New Testament until 382 AD.
@@wesdavila5274 What you call the "apocrypha" is canonical scripture with the same status as all the rest as decided in the Council of Rome in 382 AD. You follow the Jews in your canon who reject Christ, the apostles used the Septuagint with the so called apocrypha in it.
@@jlouis4407 The trend toward including these works as part of the Scriptures was initiated by Augustine in 354 to 430. Although acknowledging some of the historical values of the books, Augustine admitted there was a definite difference between these “outside books” and the Inspired Word. the Septuagint was the Greek translation of the Old Testament, which contain the apocrypha, Not one of the apocryphal books is written in the Hebrew language,only in greek and maybe in Latin, books contains serious errors in doctrine based on what the Bible teaches, chronological flaw and also contradicts its shelf, for example in the two Books of Maccabees, Antiochus Epiphanes is made to die three different deaths in three different places
@@wesdavila5274 Sorry, the apocrypha was found in Hebrew with the Dead Sea Scrolls, so that argument of Luther is refuted. “We have no other assurance that the books of Moses, the four Gospels, and the other books are the true word of God but by the canon of the Catholic Church.” - Augustine The canon of Augustine included the 7 so called deuterocanonical books. The books were in the Septuagint that the Apostles used.
Im not Catholic, but The Catholic Priest won hands down... The others look like they don't know how to respond. But it's not their fault the Priest had an advantage. Thousands of years to read and study from those before him.
Just too many Christian denominations claiming Bible Only and can't agree with one another, and the Catholic Church does not claim this. And the Bible Only all say they have no human founder yet they all do. It's reformed this or restored that. And all the Bible Only's either began in Northern Europe or the United States. A religious detective or objective court judge would cast a supicious eye on the Bible Only.
One side cannot call the priests "Father" and the other side cannot call the other sides church "The Church of Christ". So much for reconciliation between the sides.
@IndianaJonesTDH It makes plenty of sense. Jesus Himself says call no man father. He's talking about in the spiritual sense, not someone who's your dad. So you're gonna go against the words of Jesus Christ?
Bible scriptures called us Christians, I’m sticking to it. Y’all can choose your path but I’m staying a Christian. Religion shouldn’t even be a debate.
Tradition and oral statements passed down by word of mouth helped to compile the Bible, Robert. Scripture only has authority through the authority given by the Apostles, authors, and prophets from God. These men were inspired by the Holy Spirit in the same way those in authority do today. One needs an interpreter to understand the Scriptures otherwise we quickly fall into error. Christ left this task up to his Apostles who passed down authority to their faithful and trustworthy disciples.
It's cool that Yeshua said hey only the Catholics will be able to hear the Holy Spirit and only the Catholics will be able to tell what the church will be like in the future so listen to them and ignore everything I've said
Jesus gave his mother to all of us from the cross. He’s last dying words. Protestants are so confused and full of hardened hearts for the one true fullness of the faith only found in the Catholic Church.
We change sure, but we are still the same person - that is the point. The Acorn is the same plant as the Oaktree, a mustard seed grows to be a very different thing from where it first began.
The Catholic priests in this debate are extraordinarily well prepared. Praise God. I loved when Fr Rothermel rightly called the Catholic Church "the true Church of Christ."
Yes I come to know that you love to hear the statement - Catholic church is true church of Christ but what about Jesus / God ? Does He love it too ? I don't think it's true because :- 1. You don't follow Jesus' teaching. You are opponents of Christ. (Matt 23:9-10) Q1. If you respect Jesus then why don't you listen to Him / His teaching ? (Mark 12:38-39) 2. Your church dare to modify or change God's law. (Exo 20:1-10) Q2. Is there any wiser or more powerful fellow than God in your church in order to correct God ? Q3. Isn't modifying or changing God's law an act of overtaking Him ? Q4. Besides these, you believe n practise so many unbiblical rituals, for exam : rosary, carrying Mary on streets like Hindu people carry their goddess Durga.........ect. Where do you get such information or idea ? Q5. We don't see such beliefs, rituals in Bible. Is actually your God other than the Creator God Jehova = Jesus ? Q6. I heard Sunday is the day of Sun god, Sunday belongs to Sun God. People used to worship Sun God especially on Sunday. Is it true ? Please let me get explanation to these enquiries. Thanks. May God lead you to the right destination. Amen.
@@crossbilliam Do you love your mother? I knew I loved mine. But I didn’t know how very deeply I loved her until I lost her. God blessed me with her. Do you think Jesus (He who loves the most) loved His mother? How much more do you think Jesus loved His own mother, than do we love ours? How much more precious and dear was she, to Him? Do you think I, or you, or anyone for that matter could possibly love Mary more than Jesus loved her? Do you think when my judgement day comes, Jesus will be angry with me or deny me because I had much love, deep reverence and honor for His mother, Mary? No He won’t deny me for that …
@@strengthtodream9854 your honor is praying to her when she can’t hear millions of Catholics asking her to pray for them she can’t hear us nor the saints just God alone and also Jesus loved Mary but as his friend he never called Mary mother only women
In the whole entire world 🌎 if billions, not millions, of Catholics pray in petition for the Blessed Mother’s intercession, then perhaps Catholics have it right. And perhaps you have it wrong? God gave us 5th Commandment “Honor your father and mother” so don’t you think that surely Mary was especially dear to our Lord Jesus, and more to Him than just a friend?? Moreover, if you think Catholics place her above God the Father, Christ Jesus or the Holy Spirit, then you’re wrong again. See Bible scripture John 2-5 “His mother told the servants ‘Do whatever he tells you.’” Her only desire is for the faithful to give all glory to her son, Jesus! Mary points us to the love of Jesus, all the way around.
And if i have not love... If you prove your right, did you really win? How far does the church have to rip the throat out of another to show the love of Christ in them.
The Catholic sect was not founded by Jesus Christ the ROCK, Catholics say it was founded by Peter the rock, also Mary's sons did not believe that Jesus was the son of God,. It is revealed in the book of psalm 69:8-9
julio rivera Early Church Fathers on Peter Being the First Bishop of the Church in Rome Clement Recognitions book 1 (27-97 ad) The epistle in which the same Clement, writing to James the Lord's brother, informs him of the death of Peter, and that he had left him his successor in his chair and teaching, and in which also the whole subject of church order is treated, I have not prefixed to this work, both because it is of later date, and because I have already translated and published it. But I do not think it out of place to explain here what in that letter will perhaps seem to some to be inconsistent. Since Linus and Cletus were bishops in the city of Rome before this Clement, how could Clement himself say that the chair of teaching was handed over to him by Peter? Now of this we have heard this explanation, that Linus and Cletus were indeed bishops in the city of Rome before Clement, but during the lifetime of Peter: that is, that they undertook the care of the episcopate, and that he fulfilled the office of apostleship; as is found also to have been the case at Caesarea, where, when he himself was present, he yet had Zacchaeus, ordained by himself, as bishop. And in this way both statements will appear to be true, both that these bishops are reckoned before Clement, and yet that Clement received the teacher's seat on the death of Peter. Tertullian Prescription Against Heretics ch 22 (160- 240 ad) Was anything withheld from the knowledge of Peter, who is called "the rock on which the church should be built," who also obtained "the keys of the kingdom of heaven," with the power of "loosing and binding in heaven and on earth?" Tertullian Prescription Against Heretics ch 32 (160- 240 ad) For it is evident that those men lived not so long ago,--in the reign of Antoninus for the most part,--and that they at first were believers in the doctrine of the Catholic Church, in the church of Rome under the episcopate of the blessed Eleutherus, the 13th Bishop of Rome until on account of their ever restless curiosity,with which they even infected the brethren, they were more than once expelle Tertullian The Prescription Against Heretics ch 32 [160-240 AD] "[T]his is the way in which the apostolic churches transmit their lists: like the church of the Smyrneans, which records that Polycarp was placed there by John, like the church of the Romans, where Clement was ordained by Peter" (Demurrer Against the Heretics 32:2 [A.D. 200]). Caius Fragment 2 AGAINST THE HERESY OF ARTEMON ch 1 (180-240 ad) For they say that all those of the first age, and the apostles themselves, both received and taught those things which these men now maintain; and that the truth of Gospel preaching was preserved until the times of Victor, who was the fourteenth bishop in Rome after Peter, Origen Commentary on the Gospel of John Book 5 par 3 (185-254 ad) And Peter, on whom Christ had to build his church, against which the gates of hell shall not prevail left only one epistle of acknowledged genuineness. Cyprian of Carthage Epistle 45 par 2 [200-270 AD] We," they say, "know that Cornelius, the twenty-first bishop of the most holy Catholic Church elected by Almighty God, and by Christ our Lord. We confess our error; we have suffered imposture; we were deceived by captious perfidy and loquacity. For although we seemed, as it were, to have held a kind of communion with a man who was a schismatic and a heretic, yet our mind was always sincere in the Church. For we are not ignorant that there is one God; that there is one Christ the Lord whom we have confessed, and one Holy Spirit; and that in the Catholic Church there ought to be one bishop." Cyprian of Carthage epistle 74 par 16 (200-270 ad) But what is the greatness of his error, and what the depth of his blindness, who says that remission of sins can be granted in the synagogues of heretics, and does not abide on the foundation of the one Church which was once based by Christ upon the rock, may be perceived from this, that Christ said to Peter alone, "Whatsoever thou shall bind on earth shall be bound in heaven, and whatsoever thou shall loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven." And again, in the Gospel, when Christ breathed on the apostles alone, saying, remitted unto them, and whose soever sins ye retain they are retained." Therefore the power of remitting sins was given to the apostles, and to the churches which they, sent by Christ, established, and to the bishops who succeeded to them by vicarious ordination. But the enemies of the one Catholic Church in which we are, and the adversaries of us who have succeeded the apostles, asserting for themselves, in opposition to us, unlawful priesthoods, and setting up profane altars, what else are they than Korah, Dathan, and Abiram, profane with a like wickedness, and about to suffer the same punishments which they did, as well as those who agree with them, just as their partners and abettors perished with a like death to theirs? Cyprian of Carthage epistle 72 par 7 (200-270 ad) But it is manifest where and by whom remission of sins can be given; to wit, that which is given in baptism. For first of all the Lord gave that power to Peter, upon whom He built the Church, and whence He appointed and showed the source of unity--the power, namely, that whatsoever he loosed on earth should be loosed in heaven. And after the resurrection, also, He speaks to the apostles, saying, "As the Father hath sent me, even so I send you. And when He had said this, He breathed on them, and saith, unto them, Receive ye the Holy Ghost: whosoever sins ye remit, they are remitted unto them; and whosoever sins ye retain, they are retained." Whence we perceive that only they who are set over the Church and established in the Gospel law, and in the ordinance of the Lord, are allowed to baptize and to give remission of sins; but that without, nothing can either be bound or loosed, where there is none who can either bind or loose anything. Cyprian of Carthage epistle 54 par 14 (200-270 ad) After such things as these, moreover, they still dare--a false bishop having been appointed for them by, heretics--to set sail and to bear letters from schismatic and profane persons to the throne of Peter, and to the chief church whence priestly unity takes its source; and not to consider that these were the Romans whose faith was praised in the preaching of the apostle, to whom faithlessness could have no access. Cyprian of Carthage Epistle 51 par 8 [200-270 AD] "Cornelius was made bishop by the decision of God and of his Christ, by the testimony of almost all the clergy, by the applause of the people then present, by the college of venerable priests and good men, at a time when no one had been made bishop before him-when the place of Pope Fabian, which is the place of Peter, the dignity of the sacerdotal chair, was vacant. Since it has been occupied both at the will of God and with the ratified consent of all of us, whoever now wishes to become bishop must do so outside. For he cannot have ecclesiastical rank who does not hold to the unity of the Church" Cyprian of Carthage Treatise 1 par 4 [200-270 AD] There is easy proof for faith in a short summary of the truth. The Lord speaks to Peter, saying, "I say unto thee, that thou art Peter; and upon this rock I will build my Church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven; and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound also in heaven, and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven." And again to the same He says, after His resurrection, resurrection, He gives an equal power, and says, "As the Father hath sent me, even so send I you: Receive ye the Holy Ghost: He arranged by His authority the origin of that unity, as beginning from one. Cyprian of Carthage epistle 39 par 5 [200-270 AD] There is one God, and Christ is one, and there is one Church, and one chair founded upon the rock by the word of the Lord. Another altar cannot be constituted nor a new priesthood be made, except the one altar and the one priesthood. Peter of Alexandria Genuine Acts of Peter (260-311ad) ...and guardian of all preceding and subsequent occupiers of this pontifical chair ...Peter was the first of the apostles... Peter of Alexandria Genuine Acts of Peter (260-311ad) A cycle of two hundred and eighty-five years from the incarnation of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ had rolled round, when the venerable Theonas, the bishop of this city, by an ethereal flight, mounted upwards to the celestial kingdoms. To him Peter, succeeding at the helm of the Church, was by all the clergy and the whole Christian community appointed bishop, the sixteenth in order from Mark the Evangelist, who was also archbishop of the city. Acts of Andrew (260 ad) And while he was thus speaking, the Lord Jesus Christ appeared to them in the form of a child, and said to them: Hail, Peter, bishop of the whole Church! Peter of Alexandria Genuine Acts of Peter (260-311ad) feared to rend His coat; he was so hurried on by giving the rein to his madness, that, rending asunder the Catholic Church not only in the cities of Egypt, but even in its villages, he ordained bishops of his own party, nor cared he aught for Peter, nor for Christ, who was in the person of Peter.
@@jepreybasanez1208 the Catholic sect is not a biblical religion, catholic church have their own religion not base on biblical truth, catholisim DOGMA is not inspired by the holy spirit.
Ignatius of Antioch used the word "Catholic" in his writings in the first century. The Roman Catholic church was established by Jesus and the authority passed down to Peter and his successors. All other churches are manmade, solo-scripture although the Bible is put together by Catholics and you left out seven books. Which of the 50,000 denominations is the right one and who has the authority ? There is no debate here.
He didn’t respond to the fact that we should not be calling these clowns Rabbi or father. Or how we need to seek forgiveness through someone else (the priest) The main issue with Catholics is they never back their statements with scripture, even though they claim that the word of God is the highest law. Unfortunately, I don’t agree with either group because restoration Christians aren’t correct either.
@@jamesdool618 I don’t agree with their doctrines but not agreeing with someone’s doctrine doesn’t necessarily make them not a Christian. I will say though that Catholicism is one of the few denominations of Christianity that is a cult.
The main issue with Protestants is that they claim catholics never back up their statements with scripture, but then ignore every time they do. 1. The issue of priests forgiving sins: [21 Again Jesus said, “Peace be with you! As the Father has sent me, I am sending you.” 22 And with that he breathed on them and said, “Receive the Holy Spirit. 23 If you forgive anyone’s sins, their sins are forgiven; if you do not forgive them, they are not forgiven.” ] (John 20:21-23) 2. Calling priests father: commenter above already addressed that, Paul called himself a father in the exact same way a priest would call himself father to those of his parish
The Catholic church is a man made non-scriptural denominational church. Miracles have long ceased to exist. The Lord's church is the one true church of the New Testament.
I've been going back and forth with a church of Christ member, he cant even tell me what the Eucharist is in their church. He has no idea because the church of Christ doesn’t know scripture.
@thegollyer903 When speaking of salvation, Jesus offered more details than just his words quoted above. For example, consider these three verses: • He who believes and is baptized will be saved. (Mk 16:16) • [U]nless you repent you will all likewise perish. (Lk 13:3) • [H]e who eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day. (Jn 6:54) Notice that in these three verses Jesus associated salvation with baptism, confession, and the Eucharist, respectively. Catholics recognize that these sacraments are administered through the Church. In fact, in the case of the latter two, a validly ordained priest is necessary for their administration, so the sacrament of ordination must also be associated with salvation. A primary role of the Catholic Church in conjunction with salvation is becoming quite clear. This brings us to the second part of the Catechism’s formulation of the doctrine being considered: “. . . through the Church which is his Body.”
The even larger question is how something physical came from nothing. Until a sufficient answer to that is proven. The. Please respect believers if only a little.
@ean123123Theism doesn't even begin to answer that question. I have zero respect for believers who use their belief to abuse kids, commit racist and homophobic and misogynistic acts, destroy the environment, bring destructive wars, and try and force their imaginary friends down the throats of others. No believer is worthy of my respect. They can respect themselves. The believers deserve nothing but contempt from normal people. I don't for a minute think that they are unaware of the flaws in their reasoning. Reason doesn't enter in to their lives. They are simply murderous psychopaths looking for a societally-acceptable excuse for the torture, abuse, and murder they work on dishing out to the rest of us every day of their lives. What's respectable about that?
This C.C. guy has such simplton atguments "tHe WoRd PoPe Is NoT iN tHe BiBlE!" Lmao neither is trinity my guy. This guy also says bible alone bible alone. And then gets angry whrn catholic use the bible to justify the doctrines. Catholics are also bible alone. They just have a magisterium with the churches tradtion founded by christ to tell you whatbit means. Every C.C. church has a different explanation for dufferent passages in the bible. If its so sufficient then why is that? Also you cant judge the catholic church of its members errors but on the church teaching. The C.C. "church" is devided. You could go to two churches across town from each other and they will teach different things.
@@thegollyer903 being protestant is illogical. you say the word of god is the only infallible rule of faith but the bible doesn't say that. its a self defeating doctrine. you say its the word on who's authority. you own? the Mormons say the same thing. so do Muslims. its the word of god because the church with the authority given by Christ says it is. the catholic church.
I am here starting with two organizations claiming to be the one true church, then it got better when it had a jewish moderator. 😂. Restoration movement are mormons, JW's and coc. They got some things in common they are the one true church "rejecting everyone else and work salvation
@@sparky4581 there were churches of Christ in Europe 100 years before the American restoration movement, most people claim Alexander Campbell started the church but he was simply another guy who had the right conclusion.
@@Kurt2222 there may have been similarities and you can tell yourself that. I most assuredly i say salvation is not within a church, it is in Christ Jesus alone through faith, by Grace apart from works that no one can boost. I sincerely pray that they can see this because everything is at stake. The teaching attacks His atonement and His Justification in His Son. It is a hard thing to believe that God Loves you or me so much that He would give His Son on our behalf. The coc doesn't deny this just the full weight of the implications. May that God blesses you.
@@sparky4581 works don't produce atonement, only Christ is atonement, how a sinner connect to that atonement requires belief, nobody denies, Christ said unless you repent you will perish Lk 13:3-5, He also said to confess before men and Paul said confess with the mouth Rom 10, and Christ said born of water and the Spirit to enter the kingdom Jn 3:3-5 water we see later is baptism into Christ and into forgiveness of sins, Paul stated clearly baptism is into His death, and then raised just as Christ was also, and remain faithful unto death Rev 2:10. The totality of God's word, not cherry picking is what we need. If one is not in the kingdom then one is not saved according to scripture. The kingdom is the church of Christ according to scripture Col 1:13 proves the kingdom was established 1st century contrary to so many people's misinterpretation of future kingdom. Atonement is only from Christ, and man must labor to get there and maintain the atonement of Christ or else he falls from grace just as Paul said was possible in Galatians. There is the church which all real Christians are added to by the Lord Acts 2 proves this. Nobody joins themselves but submits to God's instructions and God adds them to Him. Denominations do not produce Christians, only the seed which is the Word of God produces Christians.
@@Kurt2222 first of all the john 3 about being born or water and spirit never says anything baptism, that is where one has to put on the coc goggles. Jesus was talking to a Pharisee who knew the prophets, the law and psalms, that is why Jesus said are you a teacher of Israel and do not know these things? What was Nicodemus suppose to teach only what is written. So Jesus was referring to the prophets like Ezekiel 36:23-33 and Jeremiah 31 and 32. Jesus was pointing at scripture that up to that point was written referring of Himself. This stays consistent with Jesus. In John 5 Jesus points to the the witness of John and more importantly to the scripture spoken of Jesus by Moses. So no Jesus said nothing of baptism in John 3:3-5. You have to insert the word baptism there. i cant believe you said you have to maintain the atonement, just think about that. Look man, I've been down that road and the end isnt good.
Catholic Church belief was founded by Constantine a mix of Christian belief and Pegeans the gods of the Romans you can evan see symbols in there Church that proove it thats wy there so mutch image and Statue like in Romans and Greek Mythologie that have the same Gods but just with différents names !!!
I’m an evangelical and even I know what you’ve written is false. Do some digging and learn more not what you’ve been brainwashed with before stating something as fact.it wasn’t founded by Constantine at all.
We the christians are the body of Christ the church, not the building.
I agree bro.
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I agree as well
Anyone can make this claim... it has to be proven. Where was your church in 33A.D? Or at that 300 A.D? Or at that 500A.D And so on till today? There are Christians who lived during this time that we can read from and about.
@Golden_writes550 my was in the wilderness with Moses before the ad 33.
After listening to this debate I am convinced that those who are truly seeking to find the truth, their eyes will be opened.
Seems every Catholic and Protestant debate I watch, the protestant always seems to be on the defensive. Sometimes with a little anger. I left the Catholic Church and was a protestant for many years, with many fond memories. I found my way back to the One True Church, the Catholic Church, and studied Catholicism. I’ve never been happier or have felt closer to Christ.
The Catholic Church was founded 33A.D.
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You need to get out again
Praise God!! Amen! I left the church to be Protestant as well, but found my way back to the Catholic Church! Btw not sure if you know but the other church in this debate is actually a cult. ICOC and ICC are both cults
Welcome home. When a protestant can trace their lineage, without using a false pamphlet "Trail of Blood" citing groups that professed a heretical view then and would, under the lenses of today still be heretical then I'll listen, but it seems that would be an impossible feat, because Protestants started with Martin Luther...who was certainly not a biblical figure.
It was founded long after Constantine. Please look into the truth behind the Jesuits and how they affect the world today
“The Trail of Blood,” was a 1931 propaganda pamphlet by James Carroll which sold over 2 million copies. This pamphlet promoted the Landmark theory or “Landmarkism” that the Baptist Church was founded by John the Baptist. Landmarkism was a theory made up by James Graves in 1851 that the Baptist Church dates back to the Apostolic period. James Graves was a founding member of the Southern Baptist convention and was the editor in chief of the first Southern Baptist newspaper. He used this newspaper to promote his new theory of Landmarkism. Graves came up with this idea in reaction because of other movements like the Restoration Movement that did not want to show that they actually broke away from the Catholic Church from past religion schisms. There was no proof of this “Landmark” idea and because there was no proof, the Southern Baptist Convention in a written declaration in 1859 denied Landmarkism and separated themselves from these Landmark Baptist. The Southern Baptist Convention in it’s declaration states that it’s Baptist Denomination was started in 1609 by John Smyth. Unfortunately some Southern Baptist’s still believe this propaganda because it was passed on from generation to generation “as gospel “ or as the truth. The Restoration Movement or Stone-Campbell Movement was started by Protestant Barton Stone, a former Presbyterian minister, Protestant Thomas Campbell, a former Presbyterian minister and his Protestant son Alexander Campbell, a former Baptist minister. These 3 Protestant men merged their new movement idea together in 1834 into a Church called the “Disciples of Christ.” The idea of this movement was that this new Church called the “Disciples of Christ” came directly from the apostles and not the Catholic Church and that it they only go by the Bible and no traditions at all. A Protestant family called the Lipscomb’s heard about this movement, went to one of its tent revivals and decided to join. Granville and William Lipscomb, David Lipscomb's father and uncle, lived in Eastern Kentucky and were members of the Beans Creek Baptist Church, a church that the family left to join this recently formed Disciples of Christ Church. In 1873 William Lipscomb, David Lipscomb uncle, founded the the 1st Church of Christ called the Neely's Bend Church of Christ in Nashville, a new division of the Disciples of Christ Church. Granville Lipscomb Jr, David Lipscomb’s brother, founded the 2nd Church of Christ Church in Weakly County, Tennessee in 1878. In 1906 David Lipscomb petitioned the US government to recognize the Church of Christ as an independent Church from the Disciples of Christ Church because the Church of Christ denomination was more conservative in it’s doctrine than the Disciples of Christ. David Lipscomb and another man, James Harding, went on to found the Nashville Bible College in 1891 in Nashville Tn, which today is called Lipscomb University. David also had a brother named William Lipscomb who founded a private school in 1866 on Concord Road in Brentwood Tn that today is a Williamson County owned school named Lipscomb Elementary.
I appreciate your comments.
I had a good friend who attended Lipscomb Bible school in Nashville in the 1940s.
He worked on me many years as i searched for the real church to learn salvation.
It was finally kicked in by the mid 90s, through my thick skull that he was right
Mack Lyon spoke about how the Edmond, OK church of Christ had nothing to do with Stone and Campbell.
@@WLBarton4466
Early Church Fathers on the Catholic Church Being Founded by Jesus
The Early Church Fathers on various topics: This was a 3700 hour project which included going through 22896 pages of the 38 volume set called Ante Nicene, Nicene, Post Nicene Fathers. I compiled 255 pages of quotes showing that the Early Church was always and completely Catholic. All of these quotes can be verified and found from the source which is free online.
Catholic is used 140 times prior to Constantine
Catholic Church appears 656 times
Catholic and Apostolic Church is used 48 times
Catholics appears 192 times referring to a group
Catholic is used 1515 times in total
Ignatius of Antioch Epistle to the Smyraeans ch 8 [50-117 AD]
See that ye all follow the bishop, even as Jesus Christ does the Father, and the presbytery as ye would the apostles; and reverence the deacons, as being the institution of God. Let no man do anything connected with the Church without the bishop. Let that be deemed a proper Eucharist, which is [administered] either by the bishop, or by one to whom he has entrusted it. Wherever the bishop shall appear, there let the multitude [of the people] also be; even as, wherever Jesus Christ is, there is the Catholic Church...
Polycarp The Martyrdom of Polycarp ch 8 [69-155 AD]
Now, as soon as he had ceased praying, having made mention of all that had at any time come in contact with him, both small and great, illustrious and obscure, as well as the whole Catholic Church throughout the world, the time of his departure having arrived, they set him upon an ass, and conducted him into the city, the day being that of the great Sabbath. And the Irenarch Herod, accompanied by his father Nicetes (both riding in a chariot), met him, and taking him up into the chariot, they seated themselves beside him, and endeavoured to persuade him, saying, "What harm is there in saying, Lord Caesar, and in sacrificing, with the other ceremonies observed on such occasions, and so make sure of safety?" But he at first gave them no answer; and when they continued to urge him, he said, "I shall not do as you advise me." So they, having no hope of persuading him, began to speak bitter words unto him, and cast him with violence out of the chariot, insomuch that, in getting down from the carriage, he dislocated his leg [by the fall]. But without being disturbed, and as if suffering nothing, he went eagerly forward with all haste, and was conducted to the stadium, where the tumult was so great, that there was no possibility of being heard.
Polycarp The Martyrdom of Polycarp ch 16 [69-155 AD]
"And of the elect, he was one indeed, the wonderful martyr Polycarp, who in our days was an apostolic and prophetic teacher, bishop of the Catholic Church in Smyrna. For every word which came forth from his mouth was fulfilled and will be fulfilled" (Martyrdom of Polycarp 16:2 [A.D. 155]).
Martyrdom of Polycarp greeting (69-155 ad)
The Church of God which sojourns at Smyrna, to the Church of God sojourning in Philomelium, and to all the congregations of the Holy and Catholic Church in every place: Mercy, peace, and love from God the Father, and our Lord Jesus Christ, be multiplied.
Martyrdom of Polycarp Ch 19 (69-155 ad)
Lord Jesus Christ, the Saviour of our souls, the Governor of our bodies, and the Shepherd of the Catholic Church throughout the world
Justin Martyr On the Sole Government of God ch 1 (100-165 ad)
For the men of former generations, who instituted private and public rites in honour of such as were more powerful, caused forgetfulness of the Catholic faith to take possession of their posterity
Irenaeus of Lyon Book 2 ch 9.1 (120-180 ad)
For even creation reveals Him who formed it, and the very work made suggests Him who made it, and the world manifests Him who ordered it. The Catholic Church, moreover, through the whole world, has received this tradition from the apostles.
Irenaeus of Lyons Adversus Haereses Book I Ch10.3 [120-180 AD]
...as these teachers who are destitute of truly divine wisdom maintain; while the Catholic Church possesses one and the same faith throughout the whole world, as we have already said.
Irenaeus of Lyons Adversus Haereses Book III Chapter 4 preface [120-180 AD]
The truth is to be found nowhere else but in the Catholic Church, the sole depository of apostolical doctrine. Heresies are of recent formation, and cannot trace their origin up to the apostles.
Clement of Alexandria Stromata Book 7 ch 17 (150-215 ad)
From what has been said, then, it is my opinion that the true Church, that which is really ancient, is one, and that in it those who according to God's purpose are just, are enrolled. For from the very reason that God is one, and the Lord one, that which is in the highest degree honourable is lauded in consequence of its singleness, being an imitation of the one first principle. In the nature of the One, then, is associated in a joint heritage the one Church, which they strive to cut asunder into many sects. [+] Therefore in substance and idea, in origin, in pre-eminence, we say that the ancient and Catholic Church is alone, collecting as it does into the unity of the one faith -- which results from the peculiar Testaments, or rather the one Testament in different times by the will of the one God, through one Lord -- those already ordained, whom God predestinated, knowing before the foundation of the world that they would be righteous. [+] But the pre-eminence of the Church, as the principle of union, is, in its oneness, in this surpassing all things else, and having nothing like or equal to itself. But of this afterwards. [+] Of the heresies, some receive their appellation from a [person's] name, as that which is called after Valentinus, and that after Marcion, and that after Basilides, although they boast of adducing the opinion of Matthew [without truth]; for as the teaching, so also the tradition of the apostles was one. Some take their designation from a place, as the Peratici; some from a nation, as the [heresy] of the Phrygians; some from an action, as that of the Encratites; and some from peculiar dogmas, as that of the Docetae, and that of the Harmatites; and some from suppositions, and from individuals they have honoured, as those called Cainists, and the Ophians; and some from nefarious practices and enormities, as those of the Simonians called Entychites.
Clement of Alexandria Stromata book 4 ch 15 (150-215 ad)
For the apostle says, "All other things buy out of the shambles, asking no questions," with the exception of the things mentioned in the Catholic epistle of all the apostles, "with the consent of the Holy Ghost," which is written in the Acts of the Apostles, and conveyed to the faithful by the hands of Paul himself
Hippolytus Refutation of All Heresies Book IX ch 7 [170-236 AD]
Behold, into how great impiety that lawless one has proceeded, by inculcating adultery and murder at the same time! And withal, after such audacious acts, they, lost to all shame, attempt to call themselves a Catholic Church! ...not discerning with whom they ought to communicate, but indiscriminately offering communion to all...
Caius Fragment 3 Muratorianus par 3 [180-240 AD]
He wrote, besides these, one to Philemon, and one to Titus, and two to Timothy, in simple personal affection and love indeed; but yet these are hallowed in the esteem of the Catholic Church, and in the regulation of ecclesiastical discipline. There are also in circulation one to the Laodiceans, and another to the Alexandrians, forged under the name of Paul, and addressed against the heresy of Marcion; and there are also several others which cannot be received into the Catholic Church, for it is not suitable for gall to be mingled with honey.
Tertullian Prescription Against Heretics ch 32 (160- 240 ad)
"Where was [the heretic] Marcion, that shipmaster of Pontus, the zealous student of Stoicism? Where was Valentinus, the disciple of Platonism? For it is evident that those menlived not so long ago,--in the reign of Antoninus for the most part,--and that they at first were believers in the doctrine of the Catholic Church, in the church of Rome under the episcopate of the blessed Eleutherus, until on account of their ever restless curiosity,with which they even infected the brethren, they were more than once expelled
Tertullian Prescription Against Heretics ch 35 (160- 240 ad)
Catholics appeal always to evidence traceable to apostolic sources.
Tertullian Prescription Against Heretics ch 36 (160- 240 ad)
Catholics never change the Scriptures, which always testify for them.
Hi @pickup _man_1973, even though all that is likely the case, nevertheless, there were many Christian believers outside of the Roman church scattered in numerous groups in Europe and Asia Minor that actually did have the same basic beliefs as the present day Church of Christ and many of those that are called Baptists. Unfortunately, most of those people and groups were wiped out over several centuries by the Roman Catholic Church and either directly by the forces of the Popes, or by civil forces at their request or at least with their agreement. About the only group that managed to survive into modern times despite the European crusades and genocidal inquisitions; and they are the remnants of the Waldenses, most of who's surviving members merged into the other protestant groups.
Therefore, regardless of anything else, there was a trail of blood, and it was shed by the Roman church.
54:40 always easier to make a mess then to clear one up. Throwing out a list like that is done in 30seconds but would take a day of showing the errors and gathering supporting evidence. 1/2 that list can be shown in the bible, the rest can be shown in the writings of the early Church Fathers. I consider that tactic cheap.
It is less than savory.
I e seen it used many times against the Orthodox and Catholics in debates.
Polemics are a sign of weakness.
Priests aren't necessarily the best apologists.
A better debate COC vs cc is
Sungenis vs Hester it's spicy
That is my grandaddy Conley. I miss him dearly. There is an ever-shortening list of great and honest preachers left. Listen to him please. He only tells the Truth.
I did listen, but he needs to read more, & learn more, he needs to get rid of catholism dogma because it is false doctrine
@@juliorivera870 my grandaddy is not the catholic.
@@xXpr1son3rXx sorry
@@juliorivera870 you do hear but your bias against the Catholic church makes you bark to anybody whom you think is a catholic.
@@clintdia5100 I dislike catholism dogma, the holy scripture will destroy that false doctrine.
JESUS never said ask in Mary's name i will answer or ask Mary too intercede for you instead of me
But Mary did say, do what he says, and She brought them to her Son
Intercession is part of the bible
Where in scripture does it say never ask anyone to pray for you?
In the middle of the passion of Christ, the most important moment in all of salvation history, the blood of the Lamb of God dripping from the cross to the ground, the Son of God is breathing his last breaths, and he says:
"BEHOLD YOUR MOTHER"!!!
Why did Jesus say this? ...
...
Because Jesus wasn't protestant.
Did the bible record everything that Jesus said or taught, is that in the Bible?
While Catholics are sincere, they don’t have the truth and don’t at all resemble the church in first century.
“Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood. For I know this, that after my departing shall grievous wolves enter in among you, not sparing the flock. Also of your own selves shall men arise, speaking perverse things, to draw away disciples after them. Therefore watch, and remember, that by the space of three years I ceased not to warn every one night and day with tears.”
Acts 20:28-31
This verse clearly shows we can’t trust tracing individuals to the apostles as the Catholic Church believes proves they are the true church. Paul says MEN AMONG THEM WILL ARISE, SPEAKING (oral teaching), to draw away disciples after them.
Yet, Paul finishes with this:
“And now, brethren, I commend you to God, and to the word of his grace, which is able to build you up, and to give you an inheritance among all them which are sanctified.”
Acts 20:32
The “word of his Grace” is the written word of God that is able to build us up.
I think the Catholics could have picked better debaters. They do not have the stage presence or confidence the CoC guy does. People may respond and say it's only what he says that matters, but we are human, and confident presentation speaks volumes. It simply does.
I’m in a study of Catholicism this quarter at Tennessee Bible College. It doesn’t take long to see how corrupt Catholicism is. It’s a religion based upon political power and the main purpose is for the common people to stay ignorant of the Scriptures. They teach that only the leaders can interpret the Bible which is totally false. Somewhere around 1.5 billion people follow Catholicism and do so ignorantly. God wrote the Bible in such a way that the honest soul can understand it. It takes a lot of diligent study but it can be understood alike. Loving the world and sin more than God will make someone follow the easier path. However the easier path is not always the one to heaven. Study your Bible diligently with a honest heart and you will find the truth.
So you trust anti-Catholics to teach you about Catholics? How is that an effective method? If you want to know REAL Catholic teachings you should read the official book of Catholic teachings, i.e. the catechism, and not people with a negative bias toward Catholicism. Also please show in the Bible where implicitly or explicitly says your only authority is scriptures which can be honestly misinterpreted.
Were these claims taken up with a Catholic priest? Personal interview is a critical component of honest research. I'm sure your local parish has one that would be happy to sit down with you and address your statements. Even if you disagree with what he says, you should still base your arguments off of your own research and interviews with what Catholics say, not what the college says what Catholics say.
One more thing, I agree with you 100% that many follow Catholic Church teaching ignorantly. Many who are baptized do not take Mass seriously, nor any of the other commands. They simply think that baptism=prosperity and eternity. This is an issue in all Protestant traditions, including the Christian Churches/Churches of Christ tradition.
As Fulton Sheen put it, "There are not one hundred people in the United States who hate The Catholic Church, but there are millions who hate what they wrongly perceive the Catholic Church to be." Please, go talk to a Catholic Priest and conduct an interview with him. Take your strongest argument or grievance and make it your thesis. Did the interview reinforce your grievance? Did it bring up some things you hadn't considered? Publish your findings in a paper, even if it's just a local church paper. I would read it if you linked it here.
Faith comith by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.
The Mormons and JW's make this claim as well...But study of history will prove they came in late 1700's and 1800's.
But not the word of God alone. No christian in the first century believed this
The word of God is Jesus and the verse isn’t even talking about the Bible.
Protestants: "we only believe in the word of God and follow what we find in this catholic book that was canonized in 382AD but will only follow the example of the Church shown in Acts, but we trust the catholic book... just not the catholic church..."
Thank you! I had no clue what Protestants believed in and why the heck they call themselves that but now I see.
That’s where you’re false. It is not a Catholic book. It is the gospel. You simply deeming it as “Catholic” doesn’t make it Catholic. It is a bunch of documents written by a variety of men… that was then LATER compiled together. No one is saying that part wasn’t a good thing to do. But compiling and understanding/obeying scripture are two very different things. Even an archeologist can find artifacts and not really understand the purpose fully. There is much of history we don’t know..
But.. in terms of scripture, it wasn’t the Catholic papecy that made the scriptures we see today. It was apostles of Christ. They wrote down what they saw and some wrote letters to different churches.
The Catholic Church adds onto scripture with things that “could or could not” be supported by scripture. Or just completely adds onto in general. The papecy is not biblical. The prostration to the popes are not biblical. Even Peter told Cornelius to stand up when the gentleman tried to bow at Peter’s feet. Peter even added that he was just as man as he was. So there is much we can learn from scripture. If a practice is not supported by it, then we can see falsehood and that’s the job of a Christian to correct. If you do not wish to be corrected to continue in your ways, that’s not the person correcting being false.. that’s you being false because you’d rather be comfortable in what you think is true than what is true.
@@allisontowell2274 So we know that the Catholic church existed from the beginning, which no doubt you would dispute... so in your opinion when did the Catholic church actually start?
@@HOSPlTALLER No what the Catholic Church does wasn’t around during the time of the apostles. We see that through the scriptures. Cause what is in scripture is what they were practicing. Catholics even admit to their oral traditions being passed down at certain points. Also, a title, is not what makes you a body of Christ. Even Romans 16:16 calls them “churches of Christ” so the title “Catholic” wasn’t spread for every single church title.
I wouldnt follow the devil either if he claimed to be the one who first canonized the books.
Catholic the orig compile the Bible.
Good to hear ,my friend / God bless
The bible never says anywhere that it is the "only authority." This is a 16th man-made tradition not found in scripture whatsoever.
@Bruce Bronson "f the Bible is not the final authority,"
Ok, so where does the bible state that it is the final authority?
"subjective as opposed to objective and absolute truth"
OK.. just the book chapter and verse where the bible says it is the final authority; otherwise you are asking me to believe your subjective and fallible opinion on how to interpret scripture.
Revelation 22:18-19
@@JSJTOUTDOORS Has nothing to do with Sola Scriptura. Protestant apologists don't use it either.
@@TruthHasSpoken so you believe there are other authorities? So you believe then that gods words in the Bible contradicts itself if there is other writings out there that are equally important as the Bible?
@@JSJTOUTDOORS Still haven't answered the question: _where does the bible state that it is the final authority?_
"You believe there are other authorities? "
Scripture :
Christ is the head of his Church (Col 1: 18)
Christ''s Church is the pillar of truth (1 Tim 3: 15)
Christ's Church is the bulwark of truth. (1 Tim 3: 15)
Christ's Church is where the manifold wisdom of God is made known. (Eph 3: 10)
*Christ PROMISED to lead it to ALL Truth.* (Jn 16: 13)
Christ PROMISED that he would NEVER leave it. (Mt 28: 20)
Christ PROMISED that the gates of hell would not prevail (it will not teach doctrinal error) ; (Mt 16: 18)
Next open your bible to the table of contents. Where does scripture list what books belong in it?
Book
Chapter
Verse
If not in scripture, what other AUTHORITY decided for you?
I would love a gospel preacher debate Catholic apologist Trent Horn
That would be the debate of a lifetime. I wish I knew enough people to get that ball rolling.
Or Joe Heschmeyer.
Connolly, repeatedly refers to the scripture and never did he stumbled with his words, Truth. Paul on the other hand is stumbling all through and only asking to be believed with no scripture to back his claims. This is going just as expected by this servant of God. Thank you for affirmation in the word. Jesus said that "I am the way the truth and the life, no man cometh to the Father if not through me". The Catholic faith is a deception.
You can certainly tell who the catholics in the audience, they are the ones sitting in the defensive position when the Holy and Only Word of God is read.
You sound like such a clown. the most fundamental principle of protestantism: sola scriptura (bible alone) is literally itself unbiblical
Catholics claim that the Bible is a “dead letter.”
Dead?
Priests being called Father, worshiping the virgin Mary, bowing to popes, and calling the pope infallible is more than enough evidence that the catholic organization is not in line with the Bible. Game over!
You should watch more catholic protestant debates in youtube and tell me where protestants won and I'll watch it.
Says you?? Hahaha
I agree
Another blatant lie from the protestants. We Catholics don't worship Mary. We honor her because she is the Mother of God Jesus.
They don’t even worship Mary, that statement alone tells me you don’t know anything about what the Catholic Church believes.
If all scripture is given by the inspiration of the Holy Spirit as stated in 2 Timothy 3:16-17, then anything that contradicts it would not be the truth since the Holy Spirit does not contradict itself.
And yet Protestants have so many denominations all of which use the Bible as the final authority but cannot agree with each other. That alone tells you the Holy Spirit has nothing to do with those churches
"the bible only doctrine!" What other doctrine is there. The tradition of a Catholic is the last thing I want to follow
I understand this, Its because we are rebellious in heart... We want no one to tell us what to do. I was the same way until God humbled me
It was the tradition of the Catholic church that put the canon of scripture together in 382 AD in the counsel of Rome. You can thank Catholics for your bible.
@@mfjh505 I agree that the catholic church has done some good, but praying to Mary and the saints, and pedophilia have destroyed the integrity of the church
@@Converterguy Praying to Mary and the saints have been taught by the early church. You can find this in the writings of Jerome, Ignatius of Antioch and Polycarp. This is also biblical. Do not confuse church doctrine and teachings from the sins of men. The Catholic church does teach and condemns pedophilia. The people in the Catholic church are sinners and hypocrites, but the church itself is true and her teachings are true. The Catholic church is the oldest Christian church today and wouldn't be here if it wasn't guided by the Holy Spirit.
@@Converterguy Church of Christ is getting taken to court for sexual abuse as well, be careful of throwing stones while in a glass house - lest they be thrown back. Also all that kind of criminal sin should be punished, regardless of where it occurs.
This man of Catholic faith truly made me dizzy. Satan has confused the minds of some men. This made no sense whatsoever justifying the Catholic Church. He used everything but the Bible to back up his “theory’. It’s absolutely sad. Pray for him.
The problem with the Catholic church is they listen a read the early church fathers who were clearly catholic!
Was clear enough to me.
Try listening to relevant radio. It helped me a lot. They have an app. I’ve called in many times and they actually answer and I get to speak with the hosts.❤
The Bible doesn’t require that everything be backed up by the Bible. Jesus gave us a church not a Bible
I appreciate people who know their Bible well. However, some people, such as atheists, are seldom converted by the Bible. Many atheists were converted through their profession such as eye doctors who admitted their had to be a creator when they saw the intricate engineering of the eye. We don't always need to use the Bible to back up the Bible. Even God says in Romans 1:20 that creation is provided so that every person will know in their heart someone had to create that. The Bible doesn't always tell man God exists, some men believe God exists just by the evidence they see every day. Churches of Christ/Christian Churches tradition often use 17th century English history to prove they existed before the reformation. They too are using sources other than the Bible to prove their statement that Churches of Christ/Christian Churches existed pre-reformation.
Without a Church that Christ established, and the gates of hell will not prevail against it. The man with the most education leads and wins... Yet the scriptures have always said to submit to those over you. But starting when in the 1500's or 1800's? from A.D 33
Ive been a Catholic for 18 years. My family was a strict Catholic we pray to the roasary very often every evening, had novenas for our patron saints, etc. I was educated by Catholic schools (elementary, highschool and college) run by Jesuit priests and Presentation of Mary nuns. To say the least, I am well doctrinated by Catholicism I understand it. When I started studying the Bible, my mind and heart was opened. 16 years ago I converted to CoC. Best decision of my life. Sola Scriptura. The Bible is our complete guide to salvation. Any man made doctrine and traditions apart from the Bible arent the teachings of Christ.
CoC?
Church of Christ.
Dee . Peace be with you.
I had the complete opposite experience. It wasn't until the last 15 years that my faith in Jesus Christ became the center of my life and I thank the Lord for his Church. I'm so glad your heart and soul are resting in the love of our mutual Savior.
Amen! Former Catholic, I was recently baptized in the Church of Christ
@@jm7150
Only one baptism.
The one you got when you were an infant. Then confirmed as a young adult.?
So why do you ask Mary and the prophet's intercede on your behalf don't pray too the dead saint's and JESUS mother Mary they're not the SAVIOR of the world!
His mother and the SAINTS are happily alive in heaven brother like the thief on the Cross. Are you not aware brother? Mary is the only person who was with Jesus during birth, during his childhood years and during the time he was in the cross. Open your mind and your eyes. Stop protesting. More than 40 thousands denomination as the products of protesting.
The COC started in 1827 with the Walter Scott plan of salvation.
No it started in acts 2 actually
@@thegollyer903 may I respectfully ask this question as an ex member of the c of C from 1967 to 2021 ? Christ told Peter in Matthew 16:18 that He would build His church and the gates of Hades shall not prevail against it . With that passage in mind, where was the c of C from the first century to the restoration movement in the 1800s ? If the gates of Hades could not prevail against it , I very respectfully ask , why then did it need to be restored ? Thank you .
@@Reborn_Trooper i personally dont believe the church was ever off the face of the earth at any point after it was started. Where exactly it was im not very educated on. But i believe most of the ani-baptist were christian. Before the restoration movement there is historical evidence of a church of Christ in England in the 1600s if i remember correctly. and a church of Christ in america b4 alexander campbell. Aaron Gallagher was talking about it. I think there may be a book on it. Im sure there is more evidence that i have forgotten.
What i believe alexander campbell did was generally restore the church in his life/area instead of reforming his own church.
@@Reborn_Trooper did u get my reply bc i think youtube deleted it
@@thegollyer903 I believe you are correct sir. I did not receive one, mine two are deleted at times .
Wow this Jewish man got offended by the reading and teaching of who Christ truely is 😞.
The apostles had no idea of sola scriptura.
We are before the restoration!! Way way way before that..in the beginning the word was with God and the word was God..that where we start!
Brothers and Sisters in Christ Jesus The Lord's Prayer is meant as model design to show you instruct you how exactly to pray what to say in your prayers "Now Jesus was praying in a certain place, and when he finished, one of his disciples said to him, “Lord, teach us to pray, as John taught his disciples.” Luke 11:1 (However using it as a chant so to speak was not intention) "And when you pray, do not use vain repetitions as the heathen do. For they think that they will be heard for their many words." Matthew 6:7
(Don't pray to be admired in public by other people) “And when you pray, you shall not be like the hypocrites. For they love to pray standing in the synagogues and on the corners of the streets, that they may be seen by men. Assuredly, I say to you, they have their reward." Matthew 6:5 Each thing Lord Jesus says in the Lord's prayer helps form your prayers such (pray for others) (pray for God's will to be done)
This catholic preacher mentions “common sense.”
Why does he refer to “catholic” as “common sense” when it’s so uncommon?
Uncommon in what way?
@@brittoncain5090 ,
I want you to understand my friend, understand me well:
The church of the Lord Jesus Christ is not sectarian.
The church of the Lord Jesus Christ is not a denominational body.
It is not one of many churches.
It is thee church!
There is no other church!
And if you wanna go to heaven, you get in that church, and that church alone.
Because it is the only church that the Lord Jesus Christ will save.
That is the only church that He shed His Blood for!
And, if you’re not in it, you’ll be lost when He comes back.
And, any church that claims to be married to Christ, must ware His Name. And only His Name!
@@walterlahaye2128 That's correct. Only the Catholic Church is the true Church as established by Christ, all other groups have broken away from her.
@@brittoncain5090 ,
Now, why do the Catholic churches refuse to be called churches of Christ?
It is because the Catholic church does not line up with the Written Word of God.
Thus, it’s “de-nominated.”
@@walterlahaye2128 Do you know what the word Catholic means?
Rather strange a Catholic priest having the surname Luther and a good job his first name isn't Martin!
Catholics claim that the bible doesn’t claim to be the final authority. If the word of God which the bible claims to be are not the final authority than who is? Can man just make up whatever doctrine he wants since scripture is not the final authority. The bible does not claim to be the final authority because it’s obvious that if scripture is God’s word than it is the supreme authority.
The deposits of faith: scripture, oral tradition and the church and magisterium.
@@aggienodari453 prove the last two.
1. Scripture
2. what was taught orally
3. What the church taught, which was before the full Canon of the OT/NT.
Scripture alone has been a big disagreement with the lack of unity. Who's right??
That's what the church calls the deposits of faith. The three legged stool unlike the non biblical approach of Sola fide and Sola scriptura.
@@aggienodari453 No church has it all right, but trusting one group of people in Rome who have historically been inconsistent is leads you to all sorts of clear errors.
You don’t make up your on minds because there is the New Testament Church and the Church Of Christ believes the doctrines are preached by reading the New Testament Bible. We don’t make religion up and make individual minds of what is right. Just read the Bible. If you do not believe what is preached today from the Bible you might wonder if you know where the pearly gate is and if you get there.
“Call no man Father we take that seriously.” How about your biological father do you take it really seriously?
Call your biological Dad, Dad
He was referring to religious leaders if you read the verse above he was talking to a rabbi to not call religious leaders father lol
@@ramonfuentes9955 He says no man.
It says it and yet the Roman Catholic priests want to be called father. Want to claim their pope can change the commandments and idolize Mary. OBVIOUS RED FLAGS.
What makes you believe Jesus was speaking about the flesh? Jesus was worried for the soul.. He was referring to "father" in a spiritual sense.
Love my Protestant brothers.
Please read on Martin Luther, his fight was about indulgence only, or read on John Calvin, once you somehow understand their theology, read on early Christian’s up to 500 AD. You will be shocked.
Just a small sample Luther continued to pray the rosary. Both him and Calvin knew for a fact about Mary being a perpetual virgin.
Read my brothers!
Those arent inspired men. They came out of the Catholic church, did they not? They unfortunately brought some bad tradition with them
Where in the bible does it read everything has to be found in the bible and what books are to be in the bible. The word bible is not in the bible. Who put the bible together or canonized it...that would be the Catholics although 7 books were taken out by protestants. This is what you base your authority on ? And who is the authority to interpret ? Since u have 50,000 denominations that disagree on doctrine but claim the Holy spirit guides them or some prophet or angel. Jesus started a church and gave Peter the keys which is the authority to pass down in apostolic succession....simple as that.
Of course they are Protestants of Orthodox Church, because they were these two Churches which were leading believers in the departure of the Church from the true Church of Christ!
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That pastor has a great voice. Very euphonious.
That being said, I grew up in the Church of Christ, and am now more nondenominational/Baptist (I know, but that's the best description).
If it came to it, I would run to the CoC if I had only the choice between that and the RCC. Because I believe that when we find the woman who rides the beast, drunk with the blood of the saints, and see the saints before the throne killed for the testimony of Jesus; we will find they are both embodied in the RCC. There's too much blood on them already, and I feel certain that there is more to come. This is not to say that those who are in the Church of Rome can't be saved; I'm sure that many of them are, but the Church of Rome as an institution is the wrong place to seek the Gospel of salvation through Jesus Christ. I have a few issues with the CoC as well, but they are minor differences in doctrine that I could live with if it came down to it; so far as I know, the folks who run it have never been involved in killing hundreds of thousands of people because they refused to be part of their fellowship, or committed the heinous crime of having, reading, teaching, translating, or printing the Bible without permission.
"By their fruits ye shall know them." And those are sour grapes indeed! 😮
Is the catholic arguing his points? I dont think hes doing his job as the denier or negative, i forgot the term.
This is a pretty bad debate overall. I tried to give it my attention but neither side is doing a good job at the debate portion. I reached 1:28:23 and at this point i’m tired of listening.
that old protestant preacher can not stand catholics you can tell. His opening was indirectly to the catholic side.
Oh Really? Was the Early Church the Roman Catholic Church? 👉😮👈
Hermas The Shepherd of Hermas Book I Vision 2 ch 4 [60-120 AD]
"Therefore shall you Hermas write two little books and send one to Clement, The Bishop of Rome, and one to Grapte. Clement shall then send it to the cities abroad, because that is his duty"
Irenaeus of Lyons Adversus Haereses book 3 ch 3.3 [120-180 AD]
….the Catholic Church founded and organized in Rome by the two most glorious apostles, Peter and Paul; as also means of the successions of the bishops. For it is a matter of necessity that every Church should agree with this Church of Rome, on account of its preeminent authority...
Tertullian Prescription Against Heretics ch 32 (160- 240 ad)
"Where was [the heretic] Macron, that shipmaster of Pontus, the zealous student of Stoicism? Where was Valentinus, the disciple of Platonism? For it is evident that those men lived not so long ago,--in the reign of Antoninus for the most part,--and that they at first were believers in the doctrine of the Catholic Church, the Church of Rome, under the episcopate of the blessed Eleutherus, until on account of their ever restless curiosity,with which they even infected the brethren, they were more than once expelled
Caius Fragment 2 AGAINST THE HERESY OF ARTEMON ch 1 (180-240 ad)
For they say that all those of the first age, and the apostles themselves, both received and taught those things which these men now maintain; and that the truth of Gospel preaching was preserved until the times of Victor, who was the thirteenth bishop in Rome from Peter,
Origen De Principiis Book 4 par 8 [185-254 AD]
through His only-begotten Son Jesus Christ, what appears to us, who observe things by a right way of understanding, to be the standard and discipline delivered to the apostles by Jesus Christ, and which they handed down in succession to their posterity, the teachers of the holy Catholic Church of Rome.
Peter of Alexandria Genuine Acts of Peter (260-311ad)
A cycle of two hundred and eighty-five years from the incarnation of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ had rolled round, when the venerable Theonas, the bishop of this city of Rome, by an ethereal flight, mounted upwards to the celestial kingdoms. To him Peter, succeeding at the helm of the Church of Rome, was by all the clergy and the whole Christian community appointed bishop, the sixteenth in order from Mark the Evangelist, who was also archbishop of the city of Rome.
Don't believe that lie you wrote 🤣t (the way) was a Christian Church, the first church, & it was Christian not Catholic sect,. All the disciples belong to the way church,
The Catholic Church has 23 rites. The Roman rite is one of them. The Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church was Founded by Jesus Christ. So much knowledge when we read the writings of the Apostolic Fathers!
@@juliorivera870 The Church you go to, when was it founded? if its Lutheran then 500 yrs plus. other than that its even later...
Today Bible alone may seem sufficient, but it was not the case during Jesus, the Apostles, the early Church and till the Protestants came along. Till Paul wrote his first letter, there was no written scripture in the early Church, there was only oral preaching, and was there anything lacking in that period? The fact that Jesus did not say anything about the New Testament, its composition, canon, etc., and that he founded a Church with authority to Peter and other Apostles proves that he did not believe in Sola Scriptura. In other words, Jesus was far from being a Protestant.
Even 2 Timothy 3:15 seems to indicate that scripture alone is not sufficient. In this verse Paul tells Timothy that the sacred writings are able to instruct him for salvation through faith in Christ Jesus. In other words, sacred writings like the Old Testament are not sufficient without faith in Jesus. It is in this light that the next verse must be read: without faith in Jesus, all scripture though inspired will not be sufficient. The fact that Jesus came into this world with a new message of salvation proves that the Old Testament scriptures though inspired are not sufficient for our salvation. In the same way, the New Testament scriptures though inspired are not sufficient for our salvation without the Church which is the Body of Christ and the pillar and foundation of the Truth.
And the Spirit said to Phillip, "Go over and join this chariot." So Phillip ran to him and heard him reading Isaiah the prophet and asked, " Do you understand what you are reading?" And he said, " How can I, unless someone guides me?" And he invited Phillip to come up and sit with him.- Acts 8:29-31. So there is scriptural support for the teaching magisterium of the Church. Not everyone has the ability to just read Scripture and automatically understand it.
Exactly my point, how are they going to understand what it written if they have not received the Holy Spirit, the most beautiful gift from God.
The Ethiopian had never heard the Gospel because he lived in Ethiopia. He recently arrived at Jerusalem for his Jewish practice, so how could he had ever known about who Isaiah talked about when he never heard of Jesus because of where he lived? Thats common sense, that does not prove Catholics are correct with their false doctrine, someone who has heard about Jesus who claimed to be the Messiah then that person would not have needed Philip to explain who Isaiah spoke of. Just like today we have inspired books put together to self explain what God wants men to know.
You really need to think things through before speaking about these matters.
@@Kurt2222 There are people who live in this country, who go to "church" every Sunday, who have heard the Gospel, but still they don't understand it, and who have never come to faith in Christ. Some even want to believe, but don't know what to believe. How can they, unless someone guides them? The Lord Jesus said that the Holy Spirit will lead and guide you into all truth. He does that through those whom He has gifted with the gift of teaching His word. But even then, there are some who hear the truth, but their hearts are not opened to receive it. In Acts 16, when Paul and Silas preached the Gospel on the riverbank in Philippi, there were many who heard the Gospel, but the Scripture says that the Lord opened the heart of Lydia to receive the words spoken by Paul, and she believed and was baptized along with her household. Evidently, the others who heard the same word that day, did not have their hearts opened to receive the truth. Salvation is of the Lord. The people who heard the Gospel on the Day of Pentecost in Jerusalem were very familiar with who Jesus was and what He taught, but many of them were among the crowd who had cried for Him to be crucified. They still needed for Peter to explain who Jesus was, and they still needed to have their hearts opened to believe and receive the truth. Only God can do that.
@@jamestrotter3162 Christ sent the Holy Spirit to the apostles to guide THEM. Nobody today is directly guided by the Holy Spirit, one way to prove that is the fact that people who do claim they are guided actually contradict scriptures on certain doctrines. The early church didn't have all the books written down at the start so they needed the ability to speak the one and only truth, that why Holy Spirit was given, but prophecies would all cease, tongues would cease, and so on, but the Word of God keeps going.
Just because some need more help than other doesn't mean some cannot gain the truth from scriptures, Acts 17:11 proves my point, a certain group of people searched the scriptures to see if it fit with what they were told, they did what Paul says in 1 Thessalonians 5:21 to Prove all things, hold fast to that which is good, the same greek word is used in 1 John 4:1 about testing what people say by the Word. 2 Tim 3:16-17 makes clear the scriptures are complete to make man acceptable to God, by teaching, rebuking false doctrine, etc.
There are no spiritual gifted people today, no dead being raised, no lame people all of thr sudden walking as the description is in scriptures. So, we can all agree some need help at certain points, but God gave the poor man the ability to reason from what is to what was and is to come. John 7:17 if any man is willing to do His will, he shall know if its from God or Me
No pope in bible, no, no. That is entirely man made, and it cannot lead anyone to heaven
@@Kurt2222 Are you saying that the Holy Spirit does not indwell Christians today? You can't find that anywhere in Scripture.
We must hold fast the tradition's of the apostles, not of the Catholic Church.
julio rivera Scripture and Early Church Fathers on Tradition
Scripture
“I commend you because you remember me in everything and maintain the traditions even as I have delivered them to you” (1 Corinthians 11:2).
“So then, brethren, stand firm and hold to the traditions which you were taught by us, either by word of mouth or by letter.” (2 Thessalonians 2:15)
“You, then, my son, be strong in the grace that is in Christ Jesus, and what you have heard from me before many witnesses entrust to faithful men who will be able to teach others also” (2 Timothy 2:1-2).
“First of all you must understand this, that no prophecy of Scripture is a matter of one’s own interpretation, because no prophecy ever came by the impulse of man, but men moved by the Holy Spirit spoke from God” (2 Peter 1:20-21).
Early Church Fathers
Papias Fragment 6 [90-140 AD]. Taught by the Apostle John. Man who tells us who wrote the 4 Gospels!
"Papias [A.D. 120], who is now mentioned by us, affirms that he received the sayings of the apostles from those who accompanied them, and he, moreover, asserts that he heard in person Aristion and the presbyter John. Accordingly, he mentions them frequently by name, and in his writings gives their traditions concerning Jesus there are other passages of his in which he relates some miraculous deeds, stating that he acquired the knowledge of them from tradition"
Justin Martyr [103-176] First Apology Ch 10
But we have received by tradition that God does not need the material offerings which men can give, seeing, indeed, that He Himself is the provider of all things.
Irenaeus of Lyons Against Heresies Book 5 ch 20.1 (120-180 ad)
But the path of those belonging to the Church circumscribes the whole world, as possessing the sure tradition from the apostles
Irenaeus of Lyons Book 2 ch 9 (120-180 ad)
For even creation reveals Him who formed it, and the very work made suggests Him who made it, and the world manifests Him who ordered it. The Catholic Church, moreover, through the whole world, has received this tradition from the apostles.
Irenaeus of Lyons Adversus Haereses Book III Ch 2.2 [120-180 AD]
But, again, when we refer them to that tradition which originates from the apostles, [and] which is preserved by means of the succession of presbyters in the Churches, they object to tradition, saying that they themselves are wiser not merely than the presbyters, but even than the apostles, because they have discovered the unadulterated truth.
Irenaeus of Lyons Adversus Haereses Book III, ch 3.1 [120-180 AD]
"It is possible, then, for everyone in every church, who may wish to know the truth, to contemplate the tradition of the apostles which has been made known to us throughout the whole world. And we are in a position to enumerate those who were instituted bishops by the apostles and their successors down to our own times, men who neither knew nor taught anything like what these heretics rave about"
Irenaeus of Lyons Adversus Haereses book 3 ch 3.3 [120-180 AD]
….Church founded and organized at Rome by the two most glorious apostles, Peter and Paul; as also means of the successions of the bishops. For it is a matter of necessity that every Church should agree with this Church, on account of its preeminent authority -- that is, the faithful everywhere -- inasmuch as the Apostolic Tradition has been preserved continuously by those who are everywhere. The blessed apostles, then, having founded and built up the Church, committed into the hands of Linus the office of the episcopate. Of this Linus, Paul makes mention in the Epistles to Timothy. To him succeeded Anacletus; and after him, in the third place from the apostles, Clement was allotted the bishopric.…
To this Clement there succeeded Evaristus. Alexander followed Evaristus; then, sixth from the apostles, Sixtus was appointed; after him, Telephorus, who was gloriously martyred; then Hyginus; after him, Pius; then after him, Anicetus. Sorer having succeeded Anicetus, Eleutherius does now, in the twelfth place from the apostles, hold the inheritance of the episcopate. In this order, and by this succession, the ecclesiastical tradition from the apostles, and the preaching of the truth, have come down to us.
Irenaeus of Lyons Adversus Haereses Book III Ch 4.1-2 [120-180 AD]
The truth is to be found nowhere else but in the Catholic Church, the sole depository of apostolical doctrine. Heresies are of recent formation, and cannot trace their origin up to the apostles.
"That is why it is surely necessary to avoid them [heretics], while cherishing with the utmost diligence the things pertaining to the Church, and to lay hold of the tradition of truth. . . . What if the apostles had not in fact left writings to us? Would it not be necessary to follow the order of tradition, which was handed down to those to whom they entrusted the churches?
Clement of Alexandria Stromata Book 7 ch 18 (150-215 ad)
These points, then, having been formerly thoroughly treated, and the department of ethics having been sketched summarily in a fragmentary way, as we promised; and having here and there interspersed the dogmas which are the germs of true knowledge, so that the discovery of the sacred traditions may not be easy to any one of the uninitiated, let us proceed to what we promised.
Clement of Alexandria Stromata book 6 ch 15 (150-215 ad)
The liars, then, in reality are not those who for the sake of the scheme of salvation conform, nor those who err in minute points, but those who are wrong in essentials, and reject the Lord and as far as in them lies deprive the Lord of the true teaching; who do not quote or deliver the Scriptures in a manner worthy of God and of the Lord; for the deposit rendered to God, according to the teaching of the Lord by His apostles, is the understanding and the practice of the godly tradition.
Clement of Alexandria Stromata book 1 ch 1 (150-215 ad)
Well, they preserving the tradition of the blessed doctrine derived directly from the holy apostles, Peter, James, John, and Paul, the sons receiving it from the father, came by God's will to us also to deposit those ancestral and apostolic seeds. And well I know that they will exult; I do not mean delighted with this tribute, but solely on account of the preservation of the truth, according as they delivered it. For such a sketch as this, will, I think, be agreeable to a soul desirous of preserving from escape the blessed tradition.
Tertullian Prescription Against Heretics ch 20 (160- 240 ad)
They then in like manner rounded churches in every city, from which all the other churches, one after another, derived the tradition of the faith, and the seeds of doctrine, and are every day deriving them, that they may become churches. Indeed, it is on this account only that they will be able to deem themselves apostolic, as being the offspring of apostolic churches.
Tertullian The Prescription against Heretics ch 28 [160-240 AD]
The one tradition of the faith, which is substantially alike in the churches everywhere, a good proof that the transmission has been true and honest in the main...... No casualty distributed among many men issues in one and the same result. Error of doctrine in the churches must necessarily have produced various issues. When, however, that which is deposited among many is found to be one and the same, it is not the result of error, but of tradition. Can any one, then, be reckless enough to say that they were in error who handed on the tradition?
Tertullian Against Marcion Book 4 ch 5 (160-240 ad)
By the rule of antiquity, the Catholic Gospels are found to be true, including the real St. Luke's.
Tertullian Against Marcion book 4 ch 5 [160-240 AD]
Such are the summary arguments which we use, when we take up arms against heretics for the faith of the gospel, maintaining both that order of periods, which rules that a late date is the mark of forgers, and that authority of churches which lends support to the tradition of the apostles; because truth must needs precede the forgery, and proceed straight from those by whom it has been handed on.
Origen De Principiis Book 4 par 8 [185-254 AD]
through His only-begotten Son Jesus Christ, what appears to us, who observe things by a right way of understanding, to be the standard and discipline delivered to the apostles by Jesus Christ, and which they handed down in succession to their posterity, the teachers of the holy Catholic Church.
@@Pickup_man_1973 the only reason the Catholic sect don't want the holyscritures to be the last authority is because the holyscritures will debonk the catholisim DOGMA, we could destroy the catholisim DOGMA with the holyscritures!
julio rivera I sure don’t want to ruin your Saturday morning by looking at this but I felt your Catholic hatred needed to be adjusted a bit. You see Julio, it you will understand and read these 1st generation early church fathers they will tell you they were taught directly by the apostles! These men were 100% Catholic from the start and it is so overwhelming it’s not even funny!
practicalapologetics.blogspot.com/2013/07/early-church-fathers-on-catholic-church.html
practicalapologetics.blogspot.com/p/255-pages-of-early-church-fathers.html
@@Pickup_man_1973 now that's funny 😂, Christ came to set up a Christian Church, the disciples were call Christians in Antioch , you find all this in the book of acts, Paul was trying to convert everyone to christianity not Catholic, you need read the book of acts, the Catholic sect came from Rome, they Catholic sect was the first division of the first schism, iam Christian just like the teachings of Christ &the diciples, that horrible catholisim DOGMA sect mess up the whole world, with catholisim DOGMA , that have nothing to do with the holyscritures, because if it did the holyscritures Will destroy that dumb catholisim DOGMA.
julio rivera Yeah, I’m sorry your parents did a terrible job in your life brainwashing you. If you simply read these early church fathers that started the church you’d know the truth. Speaking of Church. What’s the pillar and foundation of truth? The Bible or the Church? Well lets see what Paul says.......
“If I delay, you will know how you ought to conduct yourself in the household of God, the Church, which is the pillar and foundation of truth”. (1 Tim 3:15)
This most never read verse by Protestants tell you this Church has Authority so no such thing as Bible alone.
What Chapter and verse does the Bible say that everything has to be in the Bible? It doesn’t. Bible alone is a made up doctrine by Martin Luther. Another fake doctrine by Martin Luther was Faith Alone too.
Faith Alone? (Sola Fide)
We get the doctrine of “faith alone” from Martin Luther. In his first German Translated Bible, (Lut1545), he actually had the audacity to add the word “alone” to read you are saved by “faith alone” in Romans 3:28.
This is straight from Martin Luther’s 1545 Bible where he added the word “alone”
(LUT1545) Romans 3:28 - So halten wir es nun, daß der Mensch gerecht werde ohne des Gesetzes Werke, (allein ‘Alone’) durch den ( Glauben ‘Faith’. )
Here is the quote from Martin Luther about Luther adding the word “alone”. It’s pretty shocking!
“If your Papist annoys you with the word ‘alone’ - Rom. 3:28, tell him straightway, Dr. Martin Luther will have it so: Papist and asses are one and the same thing. Whoever will not have my translation, let him give it the go-by: the devil’s thanks to him who censures it without my will and knowledge. Luther will have it so, and he is a doctor above all the doctors in Popedom.” (ref. Amic. Discussion, 1, 127,’The Facts About Luther,’ O’Hare, TAN Books, 1987, p. 201. Cf. Also J. Dollinger, La Reforme et les resultants qu’elle a produits. (Trans. E. Perrot, Paris, Gaume, 1848-49), Vol III, pg. 138).
James 2:24 - the phrase “faith alone” only occurs once in the Bible. “Man is justified by works and NOT faith alone.” Unlike what some churches teach, no where in Scripture does it say that man is justified or saved by “faith alone.” To the contrary, man is not justified by faith alone. A person is justified by faith and works acting together, which comes solely from God’s divine grace. Faith alone never obtains the grace of justification. Also, the word “justified” is the same word Paul uses for justification in Rom. 4:3 in regard to Abraham (so you cannot argue James is not referring to “justification” in James 2:24 unless they argue Paul wasn’t in Rom. 4:3 either).
The Bereans searched the scriptures to see if these things are so… meaning that they searched the Septuagint Old Testament scriptures that would have included the Apocrypha, there was no established New Testament until 382 AD.
Apocrypha is not Canon to the Bible, Apocrypha contradicts its self and scripture
@@wesdavila5274 What you call the "apocrypha" is canonical scripture with the same status as all the rest as decided in the Council of Rome in 382 AD. You follow the Jews in your canon who reject Christ, the apostles used the Septuagint with the so called apocrypha in it.
@@jlouis4407 The trend toward including these works as part of the Scriptures was initiated by Augustine in 354 to 430. Although acknowledging some of the historical values of the books, Augustine admitted there was a definite difference between these “outside books” and the Inspired Word. the Septuagint was the Greek translation of the Old Testament, which contain the apocrypha, Not one of the apocryphal books is written in the Hebrew language,only in greek and maybe in Latin, books contains serious errors in doctrine based on what the Bible teaches, chronological flaw and also contradicts its shelf, for example in the two Books of Maccabees, Antiochus Epiphanes is made to die three different deaths in three different places
@@wesdavila5274 Sorry, the apocrypha was found in Hebrew with the Dead Sea Scrolls, so that argument of Luther is refuted. “We have no other assurance that the books of Moses, the four Gospels, and the other books are the true word of God but by the canon of the Catholic Church.” - Augustine The canon of Augustine included the 7 so called deuterocanonical books. The books were in the Septuagint that the Apostles used.
catholic priest "du, uh, uhm, by the way, all that"
Im not Catholic, but The Catholic Priest won hands down... The others look like they don't know how to respond. But it's not their fault the Priest had an advantage. Thousands of years to read and study from those before him.
What’s needed from “doctrines of demons?” (I TIMOTHY 4:1-3)
Doctrines of demons are “catholic disorder.”
Just too many Christian denominations claiming Bible Only and can't agree with one another, and the Catholic Church does not claim this. And the Bible Only all say they have no human founder yet they all do. It's reformed this or restored that. And all the Bible Only's either began in Northern Europe or the United States. A religious detective or objective court judge would cast a supicious eye on the Bible Only.
Joseph Smith doctrine said every church on the face of the earth are all wrong as they preach but they do differently!
One side cannot call the priests "Father" and the other side cannot call the other sides church "The Church of Christ". So much for reconciliation between the sides.
THESE ARE THE WORDS OF JESUS
And call no man your father upon the earth: for one is your Father, which is in heaven.
Matthew 23:9 KJV
@@kac0404
That makes no sense in this context
People are called to fatherhood and one them can be spiritual
Also God called Father to Abraham
@IndianaJonesTDH It makes plenty of sense. Jesus Himself says call no man father. He's talking about in the spiritual sense, not someone who's your dad. So you're gonna go against the words of Jesus Christ?
Calling another man father in the Catholic Church would be considered worshipping a false idol. There is only one father.
Bible scriptures called us Christians, I’m sticking to it. Y’all can choose your path but I’m staying a Christian. Religion shouldn’t even be a debate.
Brother Darrell CLEARLY won this debate!
Everyone has an opinion.
@@HOSPlTALLER ,
God’s Word transcends “opinion.”
If what one says squares with Divine Truth, it’s perfect!
@@walterlahaye2128 Brother Darrell's word is the Word of God... okay bold, I'll give you that.
If you consider tradition as the same authority as scripture, you can defend anything,
Catechism 95
Tradition and oral statements passed down by word of mouth helped to compile the Bible, Robert. Scripture only has authority through the authority given by the Apostles, authors, and prophets from God. These men were inspired by the Holy Spirit in the same way those in authority do today. One needs an interpreter to understand the Scriptures otherwise we quickly fall into error. Christ left this task up to his Apostles who passed down authority to their faithful and trustworthy disciples.
Why is the guy lying having such a hard time? ?🤔
The Catholic Church is Lutheran, we won.
Pope alone what is that The pope consults experts and theologians when making a decision
It's cool that Yeshua said hey only the Catholics will be able to hear the Holy Spirit and only the Catholics will be able to tell what the church will be like in the future so listen to them and ignore everything I've said
The funny is when hypocrites say, you hypocrites, to the other hypocrites hahahahaha
And so as the one commenting a hypocrite of all...
It’s really funny when you consider that Christ called us all hypocrites😂
Hi I'm Ariel Budan, of the Philiines I won't more Doctrine about of the church of Christ.
What would you like to know
Acts 2: 42. The apostles doctrine is founded in the Bible. It is inspired. There is only one Gosple. It's in the bible.
So your telling us that the Gospel is in the Bible?
Jesus gave his mother to all of us from the cross. He’s last dying words. Protestants are so confused and full of hardened hearts for the one true fullness of the faith only found in the Catholic Church.
The Reagan analogy was awful. People change as we age. The Lord's church does not change.
We change sure, but we are still the same person - that is the point. The Acorn is the same plant as the Oaktree, a mustard seed grows to be a very different thing from where it first began.
Both of you , you can not solidify you belief and faith and teaching according to the bubble . You are just merly coding the verse of the bible.
READ DESCRIPTION UNDER MY VIDEOS AND DESTROY ISLAM IN 10 MINUTES. th-cam.com/video/EdSzZCuqtLI/w-d-xo.html
The Catholic priests in this debate are extraordinarily well prepared. Praise God. I loved when Fr Rothermel rightly called the Catholic Church "the true Church of Christ."
Yes I come to know that you love to hear the statement - Catholic church is true church of Christ but what about Jesus / God ? Does He love it too ?
I don't think it's true because :-
1. You don't follow Jesus' teaching. You are opponents of Christ. (Matt 23:9-10)
Q1. If you respect Jesus then why don't you listen to Him / His teaching ? (Mark 12:38-39)
2. Your church dare to modify or change God's law. (Exo 20:1-10)
Q2. Is there any wiser or more powerful fellow than God in your church in order to correct God ?
Q3. Isn't modifying or changing God's law an act of overtaking Him ?
Q4. Besides these, you believe n practise so many unbiblical rituals, for exam : rosary, carrying Mary on streets like Hindu people carry their goddess Durga.........ect. Where do you get such information or idea ?
Q5. We don't see such beliefs, rituals in Bible. Is actually your God other than the Creator God Jehova = Jesus ?
Q6. I heard Sunday is the day of Sun god, Sunday belongs to Sun God. People used to worship Sun God especially on Sunday. Is it true ?
Please let me get explanation to these enquiries. Thanks. May God lead you to the right destination. Amen.
He doesn't even have the confidence
I think you didn't watch the video, watch it again
The Catholic faith is the ☝🏼 true faith! 🕊🔥🙏🏼 💯 😇
Please find purgatory in the Bible or that Mary was sinless in the Bible 😒 or that she hears our prayers
@@crossbilliam Do you love your mother? I knew I loved mine. But I didn’t know how very deeply I loved her until I lost her. God blessed me with her.
Do you think Jesus (He who loves the most) loved His mother?
How much more do you think Jesus loved His own mother, than do we love ours?
How much more precious and dear was she, to Him?
Do you think I, or you, or anyone for that matter could possibly love Mary more than Jesus loved her?
Do you think when my judgement day comes, Jesus will be angry with me or deny me because I had much love, deep reverence and honor for His mother, Mary? No He won’t deny me for that …
@@strengthtodream9854 your honor is praying to her when she can’t hear millions of Catholics asking her to pray for them she can’t hear us nor the saints just God alone and also Jesus loved Mary but as his friend he never called Mary mother only women
In the whole entire world 🌎 if billions, not millions, of Catholics pray in petition for the Blessed Mother’s intercession, then perhaps Catholics have it right. And perhaps you have it wrong? God gave us
5th Commandment
“Honor your father and mother” so don’t you think that surely Mary was especially dear to our Lord Jesus, and more to Him than just a friend??
Moreover, if you think Catholics place her above God the Father, Christ Jesus or the Holy Spirit, then you’re wrong again. See Bible scripture John 2-5 “His mother told the servants ‘Do whatever he tells you.’” Her only desire is for the faithful to give all glory to her son, Jesus! Mary points us to the love of Jesus, all the way around.
th-cam.com/video/_TjiOvd7iik/w-d-xo.html
And if i have not love... If you prove your right, did you really win? How far does the church have to rip the throat out of another to show the love of Christ in them.
Lol the rabbi moderating is everything wrong with modern Christianity.
Priest hit it out of the ballpark! Pax Christi! ✝️🙏🏻
th-cam.com/video/_TjiOvd7iik/w-d-xo.html
See this video about your church. That they are hiding. And this is the beginning
The Catholic priests Schooled them
GOD IS GOOD ALLELUIA BLESS YOU WHO TALKED ABOUT YOUR FATH THE CATHOLIC FATH ALLELUIA AMEN GOD BLESS AND BLESS YOU AMEN 🙏🙏🙏🙏🙏🙏
The Catholic sect was not founded by Jesus Christ the ROCK, Catholics say it was founded by Peter the rock, also Mary's sons did not believe that Jesus was the son of God,. It is revealed in the book of psalm 69:8-9
julio rivera Early Church Fathers on Peter Being the First Bishop of the Church in Rome
Clement Recognitions book 1 (27-97 ad)
The epistle in which the same Clement, writing to James the Lord's brother, informs him of the death of Peter, and that he had left him his successor in his chair and teaching, and in which also the whole subject of church order is treated, I have not prefixed to this work, both because it is of later date, and because I have already translated and published it. But I do not think it out of place to explain here what in that letter will perhaps seem to some to be inconsistent. Since Linus and Cletus were bishops in the city of Rome before this Clement, how could Clement himself say that the chair of teaching was handed over to him by Peter? Now of this we have heard this explanation, that Linus and Cletus were indeed bishops in the city of Rome before Clement, but during the lifetime of Peter: that is, that they undertook the care of the episcopate, and that he fulfilled the office of apostleship; as is found also to have been the case at Caesarea, where, when he himself was present, he yet had Zacchaeus, ordained by himself, as bishop. And in this way both statements will appear to be true, both that these bishops are reckoned before Clement, and yet that Clement received the teacher's seat on the death of Peter.
Tertullian Prescription Against Heretics ch 22 (160- 240 ad)
Was anything withheld from the knowledge of Peter, who is called "the rock on which the church should be built," who also obtained "the keys of the kingdom of heaven," with the power of "loosing and binding in heaven and on earth?"
Tertullian Prescription Against Heretics ch 32 (160- 240 ad)
For it is evident that those men lived not so long ago,--in the reign of Antoninus for the most part,--and that they at first were believers in the doctrine of the Catholic Church, in the church of Rome under the episcopate of the blessed Eleutherus, the 13th Bishop of Rome until on account of their ever restless curiosity,with which they even infected the brethren, they were more than once expelle
Tertullian The Prescription Against Heretics ch 32 [160-240 AD]
"[T]his is the way in which the apostolic churches transmit their lists: like the church of the Smyrneans, which records that Polycarp was placed there by John, like the church of the Romans, where Clement was ordained by Peter" (Demurrer Against the Heretics 32:2 [A.D. 200]).
Caius Fragment 2 AGAINST THE HERESY OF ARTEMON ch 1 (180-240 ad)
For they say that all those of the first age, and the apostles themselves, both received and taught those things which these men now maintain; and that the truth of Gospel preaching was preserved until the times of Victor, who was the fourteenth bishop in Rome after Peter,
Origen Commentary on the Gospel of John Book 5 par 3 (185-254 ad)
And Peter, on whom Christ had to build his church, against which the gates of hell shall not prevail left only one epistle of acknowledged genuineness.
Cyprian of Carthage Epistle 45 par 2 [200-270 AD]
We," they say, "know that Cornelius, the twenty-first bishop of the most holy Catholic Church elected by Almighty God, and by Christ our Lord. We confess our error; we have suffered imposture; we were deceived by captious perfidy and loquacity. For although we seemed, as it were, to have held a kind of communion with a man who was a schismatic and a heretic, yet our mind was always sincere in the Church. For we are not ignorant that there is one God; that there is one Christ the Lord whom we have confessed, and one Holy Spirit; and that in the Catholic Church there ought to be one bishop."
Cyprian of Carthage epistle 74 par 16 (200-270 ad)
But what is the greatness of his error, and what the depth of his blindness, who says that remission of sins can be granted in the synagogues of heretics, and does not abide on the foundation of the one Church which was once based by Christ upon the rock, may be perceived from this, that Christ said to Peter alone, "Whatsoever thou shall bind on earth shall be bound in heaven, and whatsoever thou shall loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven." And again, in the Gospel, when Christ breathed on the apostles alone, saying, remitted unto them, and whose soever sins ye retain they are retained." Therefore the power of remitting sins was given to the apostles, and to the churches which they, sent by Christ, established, and to the bishops who succeeded to them by vicarious ordination. But the enemies of the one Catholic Church in which we are, and the adversaries of us who have succeeded the apostles, asserting for themselves, in opposition to us, unlawful priesthoods, and setting up profane altars, what else are they than Korah, Dathan, and Abiram, profane with a like wickedness, and about to suffer the same punishments which they did, as well as those who agree with them, just as their partners and abettors perished with a like death to theirs?
Cyprian of Carthage epistle 72 par 7 (200-270 ad)
But it is manifest where and by whom remission of sins can be given; to wit, that which is given in baptism. For first of all the Lord gave that power to Peter, upon whom He built the Church, and whence He appointed and showed the source of unity--the power, namely, that whatsoever he loosed on earth should be loosed in heaven. And after the resurrection, also, He speaks to the apostles, saying, "As the Father hath sent me, even so I send you. And when He had said this, He breathed on them, and saith, unto them, Receive ye the Holy Ghost: whosoever sins ye remit, they are remitted unto them; and whosoever sins ye retain, they are retained." Whence we perceive that only they who are set over the Church and established in the Gospel law, and in the ordinance of the Lord, are allowed to baptize and to give remission of sins; but that without, nothing can either be bound or loosed, where there is none who can either bind or loose anything.
Cyprian of Carthage epistle 54 par 14 (200-270 ad)
After such things as these, moreover, they still dare--a false bishop having been appointed for them by, heretics--to set sail and to bear letters from schismatic and profane persons to the throne of Peter, and to the chief church whence priestly unity takes its source; and not to consider that these were the Romans whose faith was praised in the preaching of the apostle, to whom faithlessness could have no access.
Cyprian of Carthage Epistle 51 par 8 [200-270 AD]
"Cornelius was made bishop by the decision of God and of his Christ, by the testimony of almost all the clergy, by the applause of the people then present, by the college of venerable priests and good men, at a time when no one had been made bishop before him-when the place of Pope Fabian, which is the place of Peter, the dignity of the sacerdotal chair, was vacant. Since it has been occupied both at the will of God and with the ratified consent of all of us, whoever now wishes to become bishop must do so outside. For he cannot have ecclesiastical rank who does not hold to the unity of the Church"
Cyprian of Carthage Treatise 1 par 4 [200-270 AD]
There is easy proof for faith in a short summary of the truth. The Lord speaks to Peter, saying, "I say unto thee, that thou art Peter; and upon this rock I will build my Church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven; and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound also in heaven, and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven." And again to the same He says, after His resurrection, resurrection, He gives an equal power, and says, "As the Father hath sent me, even so send I you: Receive ye the Holy Ghost: He arranged by His authority the origin of that unity, as beginning from one.
Cyprian of Carthage epistle 39 par 5 [200-270 AD]
There is one God, and Christ is one, and there is one Church, and one chair founded upon the rock by the word of the Lord. Another altar cannot be constituted nor a new priesthood be made, except the one altar and the one priesthood.
Peter of Alexandria Genuine Acts of Peter (260-311ad)
...and guardian of all preceding and subsequent occupiers of this pontifical chair ...Peter was the first of the apostles...
Peter of Alexandria Genuine Acts of Peter (260-311ad)
A cycle of two hundred and eighty-five years from the incarnation of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ had rolled round, when the venerable Theonas, the bishop of this city, by an ethereal flight, mounted upwards to the celestial kingdoms. To him Peter, succeeding at the helm of the Church, was by all the clergy and the whole Christian community appointed bishop, the sixteenth in order from Mark the Evangelist, who was also archbishop of the city.
Acts of Andrew (260 ad)
And while he was thus speaking, the Lord Jesus Christ appeared to them in the form of a child, and said to them: Hail, Peter, bishop of the whole Church!
Peter of Alexandria Genuine Acts of Peter (260-311ad)
feared to rend His coat; he was so hurried on by giving the rein to his madness, that, rending asunder the Catholic Church not only in the cities of Egypt, but even in its villages, he ordained bishops of his own party, nor cared he aught for Peter, nor for Christ, who was in the person of Peter.
Catholic is not a sectarian group...it's a religion ..please study history ..you are lost
@@jepreybasanez1208 the Catholic sect is not a biblical religion, catholic church have their own religion not base on biblical truth, catholisim DOGMA is not inspired by the holy spirit.
@@Pickup_man_1973 bro, you know killing is a sin right? cause you just murdered the guy 😂
@@theoe354 this is the most flattering comments I’ve ever read! Thank you!
The non-Catholic failed miserably in this debate.
You didn't listen
Ooh I bet this will be good.
They both teach the same things.
I love God I am from Ripley WV lmao you guys are from Spencer lol
Ignatius of Antioch used the word "Catholic" in his writings in the first century. The Roman Catholic church was established by Jesus and the authority passed down to Peter and his successors. All other churches are manmade, solo-scripture although the Bible is put together by Catholics and you left out seven books. Which of the 50,000 denominations is the right one and who has the authority ? There is no debate here.
Established by the Romans.
WRONG!
1:23:05
He didn’t respond to the fact that we should not be calling these clowns Rabbi or father. Or how we need to seek forgiveness through someone else (the priest)
The main issue with Catholics is they never back their statements with scripture, even though they claim that the word of God is the highest law. Unfortunately, I don’t agree with either group because restoration Christians aren’t correct either.
That right you have the only true interpretation!
@@jamesdool618 I don’t agree with their doctrines but not agreeing with someone’s doctrine doesn’t necessarily make them not a Christian. I will say though that Catholicism is one of the few denominations of Christianity that is a cult.
I guess Paul didn't get the message to not call anyone "father". (Romans 4 and 1 Cor 4:15)
The main issue with Protestants is that they claim catholics never back up their statements with scripture, but then ignore every time they do.
1. The issue of priests forgiving sins: [21 Again Jesus said, “Peace be with you! As the Father has sent me, I am sending you.” 22 And with that he breathed on them and said, “Receive the Holy Spirit. 23 If you forgive anyone’s sins, their sins are forgiven; if you do not forgive them, they are not forgiven.” ] (John 20:21-23)
2. Calling priests father: commenter above already addressed that, Paul called himself a father in the exact same way a priest would call himself father to those of his parish
Do a simple YT search for the Catholic answers on all these questions and you'll get comprehensive scriptural answers, failure to do so is dishonest.
Catholicism is the only thing that makes sense to me. And it has all the miracles to confirm it
The Catholic church is a man made non-scriptural denominational church. Miracles have long ceased to exist. The Lord's church is the one true church of the New Testament.
@@retrolightman6737 lol is all I have to say. You never heard of Fatima, lanciano? To name only 2 of many
@ChrisEvani33 naturally you would laugh. Got any scriptures to prove the catholic church?
Two false religions trying to debate.
This man from the catholic church is extremely dishonest. Bro Conley let the Word of God do what it does ❤.
Thas easy to say. Prove it a quote it
Did not age well for Catholic. Got Zesty.
the Catholic church isn't part of the LORD'S body at all
Explain
Because you say so
I've been going back and forth with a church of Christ member, he cant even tell me what the Eucharist is in their church. He has no idea because the church of Christ doesn’t know scripture.
Eucharist isnt a scriptural term bud. Thats a Roman Papist invention
@thegollyer903 When speaking of salvation, Jesus offered more details than just his words quoted above. For example, consider these three verses:
• He who believes and is baptized will be saved. (Mk 16:16)
• [U]nless you repent you will all likewise perish. (Lk 13:3)
• [H]e who eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day. (Jn 6:54)
Notice that in these three verses Jesus associated salvation with baptism, confession, and the Eucharist, respectively. Catholics recognize that these sacraments are administered through the Church. In fact, in the case of the latter two, a validly ordained priest is necessary for their administration, so the sacrament of ordination must also be associated with salvation. A primary role of the Catholic Church in conjunction with salvation is becoming quite clear.
This brings us to the second part of the Catechism’s formulation of the doctrine being considered: “. . . through the Church which is his Body.”
The larger question is why the Bible should be considered as any kind of authority on anything except how Bronze Age literature worked.
The even larger question is how something physical came from nothing. Until a sufficient answer to that is proven. The. Please respect believers if only a little.
@ean123123Theism doesn't even begin to answer that question. I have zero respect for believers who use their belief to abuse kids, commit racist and homophobic and misogynistic acts, destroy the environment, bring destructive wars, and try and force their imaginary friends down the throats of others. No believer is worthy of my respect. They can respect themselves. The believers deserve nothing but contempt from normal people. I don't for a minute think that they are unaware of the flaws in their reasoning. Reason doesn't enter in to their lives. They are simply murderous psychopaths looking for a societally-acceptable excuse for the torture, abuse, and murder they work on dishing out to the rest of us every day of their lives. What's respectable about that?
Just lying through his teeth😂😂
EXODUS,,,20, 1,4,5, 8, 12, 13, 14,, REVELATION,,22, 10, 14, 18,
Bible dose t gifts are gone or done away with
The catholic guy said "dont be decieved" you better listen
This C.C. guy has such simplton atguments "tHe WoRd PoPe Is NoT iN tHe BiBlE!" Lmao neither is trinity my guy.
This guy also says bible alone bible alone. And then gets angry whrn catholic use the bible to justify the doctrines. Catholics are also bible alone. They just have a magisterium with the churches tradtion founded by christ to tell you whatbit means. Every C.C. church has a different explanation for dufferent passages in the bible. If its so sufficient then why is that?
Also you cant judge the catholic church of its members errors but on the church teaching. The C.C. "church" is devided. You could go to two churches across town from each other and they will teach different things.
The idea of trinity is the idea of pope is not. The rest of what u said are just claims and arguments that arent logical.
@@thegollyer903 being protestant is illogical. you say the word of god is the only infallible rule of faith but the bible doesn't say that. its a self defeating doctrine. you say its the word on who's authority. you own? the Mormons say the same thing. so do Muslims. its the word of god because the church with the authority given by Christ says it is. the catholic church.
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I already know this is gonna be a wild debate. I’m far from catholic and coc😂
I am here starting with two organizations claiming to be the one true church, then it got better when it had a jewish moderator. 😂.
Restoration movement are mormons, JW's and coc. They got some things in common they are the one true church "rejecting everyone else and work salvation
@@sparky4581 there were churches of Christ in Europe 100 years before the American restoration movement, most people claim Alexander Campbell started the church but he was simply another guy who had the right conclusion.
@@Kurt2222 there may have been similarities and you can tell yourself that. I most assuredly i say salvation is not within a church, it is in Christ Jesus alone through faith, by Grace apart from works that no one can boost. I sincerely pray that they can see this because everything is at stake. The teaching attacks His atonement and His Justification in His Son. It is a hard thing to believe that God Loves you or me so much that He would give His Son on our behalf. The coc doesn't deny this just the full weight of the implications. May that God blesses you.
@@sparky4581 works don't produce atonement, only Christ is atonement, how a sinner connect to that atonement requires belief, nobody denies, Christ said unless you repent you will perish Lk 13:3-5, He also said to confess before men and Paul said confess with the mouth Rom 10, and Christ said born of water and the Spirit to enter the kingdom Jn 3:3-5 water we see later is baptism into Christ and into forgiveness of sins, Paul stated clearly baptism is into His death, and then raised just as Christ was also, and remain faithful unto death Rev 2:10. The totality of God's word, not cherry picking is what we need. If one is not in the kingdom then one is not saved according to scripture. The kingdom is the church of Christ according to scripture Col 1:13 proves the kingdom was established 1st century contrary to so many people's misinterpretation of future kingdom.
Atonement is only from Christ, and man must labor to get there and maintain the atonement of Christ or else he falls from grace just as Paul said was possible in Galatians. There is the church which all real Christians are added to by the Lord Acts 2 proves this. Nobody joins themselves but submits to God's instructions and God adds them to Him. Denominations do not produce Christians, only the seed which is the Word of God produces Christians.
@@Kurt2222 first of all the john 3 about being born or water and spirit never says anything baptism, that is where one has to put on the coc goggles. Jesus was talking to a Pharisee who knew the prophets, the law and psalms, that is why Jesus said are you a teacher of Israel and do not know these things? What was Nicodemus suppose to teach only what is written. So Jesus was referring to the prophets like Ezekiel 36:23-33 and Jeremiah 31 and 32. Jesus was pointing at scripture that up to that point was written referring of Himself. This stays consistent with Jesus. In John 5 Jesus points to the the witness of John and more importantly to the scripture spoken of Jesus by Moses. So no Jesus said nothing of baptism in John 3:3-5. You have to insert the word baptism there.
i cant believe you said you have to maintain the atonement, just think about that.
Look man, I've been down that road and the end isnt good.
Father Paul put Darrel in his place.
Catholic Church belief was founded by Constantine a mix of Christian belief and Pegeans the gods of the Romans you can evan see symbols in there Church that proove it thats wy there so mutch image and Statue like in Romans and Greek Mythologie that have the same Gods but just with différents names !!!
The apostolic father's written in the first century affirm the same doctrine. Not of the roman, but the eastern orthodox church
Wrong
I’m an evangelical and even I know what you’ve written is false. Do some digging and learn more not what you’ve been brainwashed with before stating something as fact.it wasn’t founded by Constantine at all.
Two false religions
Bible alone doesn’t work, but neither does Pope alone. Both of these sides have it wrong.
The Catholic church is known as the false prophet in Revelations. She gave Roam its second breath.