My wife and I were recently on a flight In our Cessna 182 from our home airport in South Carolina to see friends in East Texas. There was a line of thunderstorms about 20 miles in front of us and in talking with ATC and looking at our ADSB radar, understanding that there is a delay with ADSB, we felt we could get around the storm to the north. We climbed to 14,000 feet and turned north, were in VFR conditions and at least 20 miles away from cells, with cumulus becoming higher to our left. Our bug out plan was to turn east and land at an airport we had chosen. We were able to clear the Northern most aspect of the band of clouds, turned West again and then Southwest. We were completely in VFR conditions because I did not want the chance going IFR and running into embedded thunderstorms. If at any time we were getting close to a towering cumulus the plan was to immediately turn East and land at that previously selected airport. The storm had passed the area we were going to and it was still quite turbulent but we certainly were not in convective conditions. My point here is that you have to leave yourself an out. It can't be close, you've got to stay 20 miles away from towering cumulonimmus and any cells and have a plan. I do not fly IFR if there is even a chance of an embedded thunderstorm. By the way, I am also a doctor. Those damn doctors. Because I'm a doctor I do not have a Bonanza 😅. Too bad for the needless loss of life. My default in these situations is to not go and the conditions have to be within my personal minimums before I will go. Get their itis is not in my vocabulary. Additionally, I have a particular aversion to my wins being ripped off.
I've flown into seatac with first a minor and then a major airline as pilot and captain. I don't care what airplane you're flying. When you encounter an updraft, do not try to maintain altitude. This happened to me when I was flying a cabin class twin and had I had tried to maintain altitude. I'm sure the wings would have come right off. I was on approach and all of a sudden. An updraft had me going up 3500 feet a minute. When I should be going down fifteen hundred feet a minute.. A five thousand foot per minute difference. Just declare an emergency and make sure you maintain attitude, not altitude. Good luck and god bless.😊
I was treated to a ride in an acquaintances 112 lovely airplane. Had several beautiful photos of that experience. Lost all in a house fire Feb 2020. Lonely at the top, sigh
Built nice in some areas, but the wings are life limited (in hours) - I doubt that they would have hit that in the 1980s, however all the Commander singles have a scary AD involving the tail falling off.
@@judd_s5643 not so much heavy, but not very aerodynamic. They're not nearly as comfortable inside, but a Mooney with the same engine is a good 40kt faster
The early Aero Commander had a main spar failure in flight very bad reputation. Deadly as, unless all the inflight occupants had working parachutes, and knew how to use them, after somehow exiting from a spinning plummeting aircraft, with one complete whole wing sheared-off from at the fuselage attachment.
Storm scope sees static. Radar sees rain. Scope Static (lightening) Radar Rain. You will never forget now. Static doesnt need to appear for their to be high rates of rain fall
@@motrock93b LLWS advisories? We landed and took off in that all the time at the time at the airlines. The key word is "advisories" there was other qualifying criteria we had to consider.
@@andrewmaclean9810 "hurricane hunters" is part of the USAF. There is continuing weather and thunderstorm research going on all the time. It's just not widely publicized. I'd sign up for that in a heartbeat ! !
@@skyboy1956 The term I used was “avoided.” Of course, we operated at airports which were typically much larger than GA fields, with more runway options. We also were operating jets with much greater performance than typical light GA planes, and had sophisticated on-board windshear detection systems. We also regularly practiced windshear recoveries during recurrent training, and knew how to take precautions to stack the deck in our favor. So, yes. We did operate where windshear advisories were in effect, but the primary safety precaution was avoidance.
Lost a friend due to 'get there itis', 40 year HS reunion. He was the owner and single soul on board at the time, in a Lancair 4P. He ignored the weather briefing and ATC and flew into a severe thunderstorm at 20,000 ft. His last transmission was 'ok, I'm going to turn back'. The left and right wings and horizontal stabilizers were found 1/4 NM from the crash site. Cause of death 'severe blunt force trauma'. We know better. The cause of death was due to poor decision making.
What a shame. This was before XM/Sirius in cockpit weather, ADS-B and ADS-B weather, and the internet weather products weren't all that great. Reminds me of the Scott Crossfield accident, which changed ATC WX reporting nationwide. His Stromscope probably failed and gave no reports of lightning. Clouds associated with a front can be really rough and hiding embedded thunderstorms. We'll go 100s of miles out of our way to avoid them and the front activity.
A perfect example of why I quit flying light aircraft in IFR weather. After flying a caravan for a while, I never felt comfortable in a light single again.
I would like to chip in. I don't think the weather ripped the wing off. I have flown through moderate and sometimes severe turbulence, and still alive. Before some smart ass starts with the reckless pilot accusations, well, it may happen over the Andes or the Rockies in good weather. An airliner can stand +2.5g to -1. And you never heard an airliner losing a wing in turbulence. A GA airplane can stand more g's. Just check the manuals. What i think happened was disorientation followed by abnormal attitude, followed by excess speed, maybe overcontrol, causing excessive g load. That's the most likely scenario. Unless the airplane had a cracked spar, it's very, very unlikely turbulence will rip a wing off.
Never forget.... In an induced roll, one wing can pull 6, the other 1, and a g meter says 3.5... they only give an AVERAGE. That's why you should have been taught NO ROLLING PULL UPS. Back when we taught spins, always STOP the spin with rudder BEFORE pulling back pressure.
@@Doc-n7u Would you agree the strongest of them all is the P3 Orion. This muscular, broad-bladed, stubby-winged, flying tank is probably the strongest aircraft ever constructed, right??! It is the only one trusted to fly for hours inside of active hurricanes.
Yes, I'm former FAA, the voice recorders back then were giant analog reel-to-reel machines that recorded at a very slow speed so lost a lot of low and high end frequencies.
At 4:50, your assertion "turbulent winds ripped the wings off" seems very unlikely as it's practically for turbulent winds alone a to rip the wings of of any aircraft. What is more likely is that the pilot continued flight IMC conditions (the clouds) and either became disoriented in turbulence and maneuvered the aircraft into an unusual flight attitude and the pilot exceeded it's structural design limits.
@ yep and it still means nothing to me. If I have an emergency, I’m not interested in our imaginary friend. Tell the rescue fire crews how many people are on board not spooky spirits.
You can say what you want about a storm scope but it worked perfectly on a trip from Tallahassee to Vero Beach! There were numerous thunderstorms on our route and the build up blocking my way southwest of Orlando to Vero wasn’t black it was almost purple! However the storm scope lighted up like Christmas tree except for a pie shape area 10 degrees left of my heading! I cleared the screen and waited to see where the pluses showed back up; it was the same screen with clear area to my left. I proceed thru and hit the heaviest rain I’ve ever experienced in 35 years of flying but the ride was smooth! Another pilot called me about the ride I told him it was smooth but don’t take the chance without the storm scope because circumstances could change in seconds!
There are no correlations between spherics displayed an a Stormscope and hazardous weather. One of the most important findings in J.T. Lee data studies published in 1964 was hazardous weather does not necessarily exist at the same location as heaviest rainfall or lighting. That's why there are recommendations to stay "x" distance from thunderstorms.
@@hotrodray6802 If you haven't heard of this channel called Aviation101, I highly recommend watching his latest video as he and his bride to be navigate some weather. Josh shows us all how it is supposed to be done. And the first thing that has to be overcome in one's ego.
I was instructed that should I be unfortunate (read that, stupid) enough to fly into severe turbulence, your safest thing is to keep the attitude level and expect to ride it out; don't try to turn or maintain altitude and be at or below maneuvering speed all of which could increase the stress on the airframe. When you run out of altitude, that is having a bad day and it is likely too late to change your plan. As frankrosenbloom said in his post, know you limits and be flexible with your schedule. Get-there-itis can be fatal. If you goof that up, fatal will really mess up your schedule. That second one was disturbing in that a flight instructor was involved.
Iv flown in a 114B and in light chop you can see the wing oil canning it was unsettling but we were at Vma when my boss pointed it out i remember not being able to look away haha... I think it was because the landing gear well was below that spot and it was a "weak" spot on the skin of the wing very common in the commanders
I’ve always been a fairly conservative pilot for over 30 years.. Dual rated and spent 20 years mostly in EMS helicopters. Now fly for a major airline. The longer I do this the more respect I have for the weather and my risk taking desire is very low. I’ll probably never fly GA airplanes in bad weather at this point. I don’t see the risk being worth it. I’m older and not any bolder. 😂
The first incident speaks for itself. Scary. The second one is super unfortunate, too. Cleared to land in horrible weather with a huge tailwind. Doesn't make sense to me.
The channel apparently has never heard of Tyndall AFB. The on screen graphics just puts in three dots before "approach" when transcribing the ATC comms.
On the first one, did ATC, saying he could see no heavy radar activity, give a false sense of safety? He kept saying the radar didn't indicate serious weather.
@@frankrosenbloom This guy is an idiot. He’s not a pilot and never will be. Doesn’t know the first thing about airplanes or flying. Seems that all he does is make ass wipe comments on several GA accident videos. Just another clueless keyboard warrior saying things about subjects he has no clue about
Fueled Dr. D's V tail to 120 gallons. Later he loaded up his 3 friends and landed at a local airshow. 1,000 people waving at him as he landed full flaps gear up right in front of the crowd. FACT. I had to ferry it back and fix it. SMH
Why do small airplanes lose their wings so easily? Do airliners or bigger jets have this same problem? I've seen those Boeing tests on their wings. It's nuts how much they can flex.
One of my biggest complaints as an airline pilot, was the use of the word “request” for weather deviation. The word is “REQUIRE”; use it. Think about it, you are heading straight for a thunderstorm of the planned track, a TCU is right in front of you; or you radar is painting a bright red arc with nothing but black behind it: You “request” a turn for weather and the ATC says no, unable. A request is just that, a request which indicates that it can be denied. Whereas a “require a turn to the right or left for weather deviation” is a requirement and warrants a much greater threat response from ATC. If still denied (absolutely should not be) then what is your next call? PAN PAN PAN now in a turn due to weather. Still no help, elevate that to MAYDAY MAYDAY MAYDAY now in a turn for weather. Geoff Quickfall BSc, MSc, PhD candidate with 28,000hrs; DC10, B737, B757, B767, B777, B787, DHC2F, DHC3F, B18, C-185F (F=floats)
@@geoffquickfall No, the word is not "require". The FAR/AIM still uses the word "request" for weather deviation. Regarding MAYDAY or PAN PAN, both have the same effect in this case. Except a MAYDAY aircraft will have the priority over a PAN aircraft (refer to FAA safety bulletin mar/apr 2024). A pilot in command can always deviate from the controller's instructions when acting on the best interest of safety. He'll have some paperwork to do afterwards, but provide the aviation authority finds it justified, all good.
@@MrRicardovicentin and that is my problem with the FAR/AIM; that it uses the word “request”. Yes, “request” but when denied take it to “require” which is not documented but does impart the seriousness of the “request”. In 45 years, the number of times I have “requested” and been denied granted, has been a handful. But one of those handfuls was going into Hong Kong via China. That controller refused my F/O’s request for a turn due weather. We were flying towards a visible 60’000 anvil topped TCU. It was 80nm in front of us, on our track to a waypoint residing in the middle of it. The weather radar had the classic red arc with pure black behind it. That “request” was turned down and my inexperienced F/O said roger. I asked him nicely, what next? His answer was “well they don’t want us to turn off track” So I called the Chinese ATC and told them we “require” a turn to the right to a heading of xxx degrees or direct to the next waypoint which was clear of cloud. The answer was, “Roger, turn as required” The problem is, when overseas many terms are not required, not recognized or just plainly misunderstood. If the request is needed then: Request then Require then PAN PAN then MAYDAY MAYDAY With due consideration to the effects of each statement. I would rather stress the request as a requirement prior to the PAN or MAYDAY call regardless of the FAR/AIM terminology, especially overseas. This was a problem going into Montreal during isolated TCU and CB activity. Again, the request was denied but accepted when the phrase “require” was substituted. So knowing the initial phraseology is mandatory, but knowing how to elevate that request is airmanship. I never had an issue with “Flight xxx requires a turn to the right or left due to weather.” It takes the request up a notch and reduces radio chatter and explanations when using the word request in a time sensitive situation.
On my first flying lesson, in turbulent weather near a thunderstorm, a lot of input was needed to keep the wings level. I have since learned not to react too quickly. Most light aircraft, especially high wing, like to stay upright. Keep corrections gentle, and the wings should stay on. I’m sure my instructor would have commented if I was overdoing it. She recently celebrated 27,000 flying hours!
Aluminum shower - I have actually seen this happen before ! Central Florida . OMG ! Piston single of some sort , unknown - 3 were aboard that ill - fated aircraft . Sad … Flew directly into a thunderstorm from north to south ----> |*☠️
Commanders fall apart alarmingly frequently. I turned down my first charter job because it was in a commander, a year later, one of their fleet aircraft fell apart at 8000’.
that's an absolutely untrue statement, Commanders are considered to be overbuilt, an old spar issue was corrected and the 114 basically has an unlimited life limit on the wing and spar... and are you talking about single engine Commanders or twins?
Having spent the better part of my almost over career flying a couple of Boeing types, there is no way in the world I would be confident or brave enough to fly IFR in a light aircraft, especially a single. Of course I use too.
Man , he had that thing twisted ! Sounded like take off power set - Omg ! gatu ! If ya know , ya know . 😢. Nasty conditions. I have watched this exact thing happen - Over farmton , Fl.
Doctor pilots. Same holds true for Doctors in business. Ego. Made it through 12 years of medical school and residency so they MUST be proficient at everything. Sad. Use the $$ to charter a plane.
Daytona kid was … a fool . Dang , Why did he fly directly into that storm north of the field at Daytona 16 Directly in to the bad thunderstorm ? Crazy student or instructor ? O!
flying into a storm....not a good idea when your plane can be blown off the ground if not strapped down. People have little sense, pilot's have even less.
more like an overconfident pilot flew his commander into a storm and lost control.. got into an unusual attitude.. instinctively yanked back on the yoke... instead of reducing speed and gradually gaining control.. that's what pulled the wings off.. guaranteed said doctor pulled the wings off.. the 114A is a TANK... this was a panic situation..
The storm scope is dangerous junk, my Father n law had one in his Geronimo, we were flying from Va to Fl, we were heading towards a fairly large cumulus cloud but nothing showing on his storm scope so he said we can fly through it! Well I said we are not flying through that thing at all and I deviated around it, it would have at least knocked our teeth out and worse maybe lose a wing or two!
Well many doctors spend nearly a decade in an education environment that tells them what a special and elite class of human being they are. After so much smoke being blown up their rear ends it is coming out their ears and blocks them from hearing anything that isn't their own thoughts and opinions.
![แฉกลโกงงานวัด 2024 [ โกงมั้ยครับ ep.106 ] | DOM](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/taC5dpP3HXA/mqdefault.jpg)
My wife and I were recently on a flight In our Cessna 182 from our home airport in South Carolina to see friends in East Texas. There was a line of thunderstorms about 20 miles in front of us and in talking with ATC and looking at our ADSB radar, understanding that there is a delay with ADSB, we felt we could get around the storm to the north. We climbed to 14,000 feet and turned north, were in VFR conditions and at least 20 miles away from cells, with cumulus becoming higher to our left. Our bug out plan was to turn east and land at an airport we had chosen. We were able to clear the Northern most aspect of the band of clouds, turned West again and then Southwest. We were completely in VFR conditions because I did not want the chance going IFR and running into embedded thunderstorms. If at any time we were getting close to a towering cumulus the plan was to immediately turn East and land at that previously selected airport. The storm had passed the area we were going to and it was still quite turbulent but we certainly were not in convective conditions. My point here is that you have to leave yourself an out. It can't be close, you've got to stay 20 miles away from towering cumulonimmus and any cells and have a plan. I do not fly IFR if there is even a chance of an embedded thunderstorm. By the way, I am also a doctor. Those damn doctors. Because I'm a doctor I do not have a Bonanza 😅. Too bad for the needless loss of life. My default in these situations is to not go and the conditions have to be within my personal minimums before I will go. Get their itis is not in my vocabulary. Additionally, I have a particular aversion to my wins being ripped off.
geezuz. you talk too much
I share that aversion - I want to land with the same number of wings as I had when I took off. 😂
@@dermick roger that
That's one of the reasons you're still with us, Doctor.
Stay well, be safe.
If the wings come off it's very difficult to recover from the dive
Agreed. His confidence in the storm scope was alarming.
They are useless.
And this was 1983
Got a lot of time with the storms cope as the first one was installed in a club plane that I flew. Worked pretty well.
Sometimes follow your instruments is fatal.
@@markmartin9346 lol, compared to what? Nothing?
I've flown into seatac with first a minor and then a major airline as pilot and captain. I don't care what airplane you're flying. When you encounter an updraft, do not try to maintain altitude. This happened to me when I was flying a cabin class twin and had I had tried to maintain altitude. I'm sure the wings would have come right off. I was on approach and all of a sudden. An updraft had me going up 3500 feet a minute. When I should be going down fifteen hundred feet a minute.. A five thousand foot per minute difference. Just declare an emergency and make sure you maintain attitude, not altitude. Good luck and god bless.😊
I was treated to a ride in an acquaintances 112 lovely airplane. Had several beautiful photos of that experience.
Lost all in a house fire Feb 2020.
Lonely at the top, sigh
A 114A is a Rockwell Commander. They are an overbuilt airplane I can’t imagine what he flew into.
That's what I was thinking. Those things are tanks.
@@PeregrinesFuryI believe the 114 was built to airline standards. That is why it’s such an underperforming aircraft… heavy.
Built nice in some areas, but the wings are life limited (in hours) - I doubt that they would have hit that in the 1980s, however all the Commander singles have a scary AD involving the tail falling off.
@@judd_s5643 not so much heavy, but not very aerodynamic. They're not nearly as comfortable inside, but a Mooney with the same engine is a good 40kt faster
The early Aero Commander had a main spar failure in flight very bad reputation. Deadly as, unless all the inflight occupants had working parachutes, and knew how to use them, after somehow exiting from a spinning plummeting aircraft, with one complete whole wing sheared-off from at the fuselage attachment.
Storm scope sees static. Radar sees rain. Scope Static (lightening) Radar Rain. You will never forget now. Static doesnt need to appear for their to be high rates of rain fall
@@Themheals we use to laugh about an ADF being a lightning locator.
Light planes…storm activity….just NO. Turn around and land somewhere.
Even in airliners, such weather is avoided. They also don't land on runways with low level wind shear advisories in effect.
ANY and all planes besides maybe that one storm plane the NWS uses to fly into hurricanes and gather data
@@motrock93b LLWS advisories? We landed and took off in that all the time at the time at the airlines. The key word is "advisories" there was other qualifying criteria we had to consider.
@@andrewmaclean9810 "hurricane hunters" is part of the USAF. There is continuing weather and thunderstorm research going on all the time. It's just not widely publicized. I'd sign up for that in a heartbeat ! !
@@skyboy1956 The term I used was “avoided.” Of course, we operated at airports which were typically much larger than GA fields, with more runway options. We also were operating jets with much greater performance than typical light GA planes, and had sophisticated on-board windshear detection systems. We also regularly practiced windshear recoveries during recurrent training, and knew how to take precautions to stack the deck in our favor. So, yes. We did operate where windshear advisories were in effect, but the primary safety precaution was avoidance.
Lost a friend due to 'get there itis', 40 year HS reunion. He was the owner and single soul on board at the time, in a Lancair 4P. He ignored the weather briefing and ATC and flew into a severe thunderstorm at 20,000 ft. His last transmission was 'ok, I'm going to turn back'. The left and right wings and horizontal stabilizers were found 1/4 NM from the crash site. Cause of death 'severe blunt force trauma'. We know better. The cause of death was due to poor decision making.
20,000 ft with no wings. That seems like a long time to realize how bad you just messed up! I can't imagine that ride back down😢.
Absolutley incredible that the pilot would take this kind of chance… sad
My grandad was really happy when he got his storm scope installed in his Mooney back in the 80s maybe 90s.
What a shame. This was before XM/Sirius in cockpit weather, ADS-B and ADS-B weather, and the internet weather products weren't all that great. Reminds me of the Scott Crossfield accident, which changed ATC WX reporting nationwide. His Stromscope probably failed and gave no reports of lightning. Clouds associated with a front can be really rough and hiding embedded thunderstorms. We'll go 100s of miles out of our way to avoid them and the front activity.
AAAAMEN... GET AWAY.... BTDT.
A perfect example of why I quit flying light aircraft in IFR weather. After flying a caravan for a while, I never felt comfortable in a light single again.
Storm scopes are NOT weather radar!
I would like to chip in. I don't think the weather ripped the wing off. I have flown through moderate and sometimes severe turbulence, and still alive. Before some smart ass starts with the reckless pilot accusations, well, it may happen over the Andes or the Rockies in good weather. An airliner can stand +2.5g to -1. And you never heard an airliner losing a wing in turbulence. A GA airplane can stand more g's. Just check the manuals. What i think happened was disorientation followed by abnormal attitude, followed by excess speed, maybe overcontrol, causing excessive g load. That's the most likely scenario. Unless the airplane had a cracked spar, it's very, very unlikely turbulence will rip a wing off.
Yes
Even the tiny Cessna A150M is built to withstand +6g/-3g if one is not mistaken.
Never forget....
In an induced roll, one wing can pull 6, the other 1, and a g meter says 3.5... they only give an AVERAGE.
That's why you should have been taught NO ROLLING PULL UPS.
Back when we taught spins, always STOP the spin with rudder BEFORE pulling back pressure.
I assure you sir, severe turbulence can make confetti of any aircraft
@@Doc-n7u Would you agree the strongest of them all is the P3 Orion. This muscular, broad-bladed, stubby-winged, flying tank is probably the strongest aircraft ever constructed, right??! It is the only one trusted to fly for hours inside of active hurricanes.
Used properly, the Mark One Eyeball will never fail you; technology is still discovering new ways to fail.
pretty hard to see hazardous weather when one is in the clouds.
Five on board?
These older recordings sound different. Older technology? Tape maybe?
Yes, I'm former FAA, the voice recorders back then were giant analog reel-to-reel machines that recorded at a very slow speed so lost a lot of low and high end frequencies.
I thought the 114A Commander was a 4 seater? 5 fatalities ?
At 4:50, your assertion "turbulent winds ripped the wings off" seems very unlikely as it's practically for turbulent winds alone a to rip the wings of of any aircraft. What is more likely is that the pilot continued flight IMC conditions (the clouds) and either became disoriented in turbulence and maneuvered the aircraft into an unusual flight attitude and the pilot exceeded it's structural design limits.
Souls on board? What exactly does that mean?
People
live human bodies
You know….souls. Those things God gave us.
@ yep and it still means nothing to me. If I have an emergency, I’m not interested in our imaginary friend. Tell the rescue fire crews how many people are on board not spooky spirits.
@ it’s the FAA procedure not a Billy Graham question
At 1:10 You are showing Mooney N231PQ instead of N231PD. But apparently only one of several mistakes in this video.
You can say what you want about a storm scope but it worked perfectly on a trip from Tallahassee to Vero Beach! There were numerous thunderstorms on our route and the build up blocking my way southwest of Orlando to Vero wasn’t black it was almost purple! However the storm scope lighted up like Christmas tree except for a pie shape area 10 degrees left of my heading! I cleared the screen and waited to see where the pluses showed back up; it was the same screen with clear area to my left. I proceed thru and hit the heaviest rain I’ve ever experienced in 35 years of flying but the ride was smooth! Another pilot called me about the ride I told him it was smooth but don’t take the chance without the storm scope because circumstances could change in seconds!
There are no correlations between spherics displayed an a Stormscope and hazardous weather. One of the most important findings in J.T. Lee data studies published in 1964 was hazardous weather does not necessarily exist at the same location as heaviest rainfall or lighting. That's why there are recommendations to stay "x" distance from thunderstorms.
How's that for a inflight weather report !! Just don't understand what keeps pilots thinking they are in an indestructible piece of sheet metal.
Scott Crossfield, one of America's best test pilots EVER did the same thing.
Repeatedly sneaking through weather until it catches up to them.
Kinda like driving you car fast in the rain... Then whoopsie, hydroplaning.
@@hotrodray6802 If you haven't heard of this channel called Aviation101, I highly recommend watching his latest video as he and his bride to be navigate some weather. Josh shows us all how it is supposed to be done. And the first thing that has to be overcome in one's ego.
I was instructed that should I be unfortunate (read that, stupid) enough to fly into severe turbulence, your safest thing is to keep the attitude level and expect to ride it out; don't try to turn or maintain altitude and be at or below maneuvering speed all of which could increase the stress on the airframe. When you run out of altitude, that is having a bad day and it is likely too late to change your plan. As frankrosenbloom said in his post, know you limits and be flexible with your schedule. Get-there-itis can be fatal. If you goof that up, fatal will really mess up your schedule. That second one was disturbing in that a flight instructor was involved.
There is a typo in the onscreen titles at 3:26. The title should read "No response from N215XP" (not "N215PD").
Iv flown in a 114B and in light chop you can see the wing oil canning it was unsettling but we were at Vma when my boss pointed it out i remember not being able to look away haha... I think it was because the landing gear well was below that spot and it was a "weak" spot on the skin of the wing very common in the commanders
So many things have changes since this accident FORTY ONE YEARS AGO as to diminish the value of studying it. Not eliminate the value, but diminish.
I realize this is a stereotypical comment, but every doctor I ever met that was a pilot didn’t know what the hell he was doing in the cockpit.
Va speed nobody ever just slows down 5 people on board max strutural exceed in gusts
I’ve always been a fairly conservative pilot for over 30 years.. Dual rated and spent 20 years mostly in EMS helicopters. Now fly for a major airline. The longer I do this the more respect I have for the weather and my risk taking desire is very low. I’ll probably never fly GA airplanes in bad weather at this point. I don’t see the risk being worth it. I’m older and not any bolder. 😂
The first incident speaks for itself. Scary. The second one is super unfortunate, too. Cleared to land in horrible weather with a huge tailwind. Doesn't make sense to me.
The channel apparently has never heard of Tyndall AFB. The on screen graphics just puts in three dots before "approach" when transcribing the ATC comms.
On the first one, did ATC, saying he could see no heavy radar activity, give a false sense of safety? He kept saying the radar didn't indicate serious weather.
You cannot tell a medical doctor anything once thier EGOs take over. Its even worse when your the A&P they want to repair their last mistake.
Not all of us are that way.
@@frankrosenbloom This guy is an idiot. He’s not a pilot and never will be. Doesn’t know the first thing about airplanes or flying. Seems that all he does is make ass wipe comments on several GA accident videos. Just another clueless keyboard warrior saying things about subjects he has no clue about
Fueled Dr. D's V tail to 120 gallons. Later he loaded up his 3 friends and landed at a local airshow.
1,000 people waving at him as he landed full flaps gear up right in front of the crowd.
FACT.
I had to ferry it back and fix it.
SMH
@@hotrodray6802 he probably thought "Hey! They're waving at us! Everyone wave back!"
Why do small airplanes lose their wings so easily? Do airliners or bigger jets have this same problem? I've seen those Boeing tests on their wings. It's nuts how much they can flex.
Mooney photo showing N231PQ.
Camera wasn't handy just before the crash
nightmare fuel. RIP
"For Christ sake Icarus, what did I tell you about flying to close to the sun?"
He was relying on modern day wax
One of my biggest complaints as an airline pilot, was the use of the word “request” for weather deviation. The word is “REQUIRE”; use it. Think about it, you are heading straight for a thunderstorm of the planned track, a TCU is right in front of you; or you radar is painting a bright red arc with nothing but black behind it:
You “request” a turn for weather and the ATC says no, unable. A request is just that, a request which indicates that it can be denied. Whereas a “require a turn to the right or left for weather deviation” is a requirement and warrants a much greater threat response from ATC. If still denied (absolutely should not be) then what is your next call?
PAN PAN PAN now in a turn due to weather. Still no help, elevate that to MAYDAY MAYDAY MAYDAY now in a turn for weather.
Geoff Quickfall BSc, MSc, PhD candidate with 28,000hrs; DC10, B737, B757, B767, B777, B787, DHC2F, DHC3F, B18, C-185F (F=floats)
@@geoffquickfall No, the word is not "require". The FAR/AIM still uses the word "request" for weather deviation. Regarding MAYDAY or PAN PAN, both have the same effect in this case. Except a MAYDAY aircraft will have the priority over a PAN aircraft (refer to FAA safety bulletin mar/apr 2024). A pilot in command can always deviate from the controller's instructions when acting on the best interest of safety. He'll have some paperwork to do afterwards, but provide the aviation authority finds it justified, all good.
@@MrRicardovicentin and that is my problem with the FAR/AIM; that it uses the word “request”. Yes, “request” but when denied take it to “require” which is not documented but does impart the seriousness of the “request”. In 45 years, the number of times I have “requested” and been denied granted, has been a handful.
But one of those handfuls was going into Hong Kong via China. That controller refused my F/O’s request for a turn due weather. We were flying towards a visible 60’000 anvil topped TCU. It was 80nm in front of us, on our track to a waypoint residing in the middle of it. The weather radar had the classic red arc with pure black behind it. That “request” was turned down and my inexperienced F/O said roger. I asked him nicely, what next? His answer was “well they don’t want us to turn off track”
So I called the Chinese ATC and told them we “require” a turn to the right to a heading of xxx degrees or direct to the next waypoint which was clear of cloud. The answer was, “Roger, turn as required”
The problem is, when overseas many terms are not required, not recognized or just plainly misunderstood. If the request is needed then:
Request then
Require then
PAN PAN then
MAYDAY MAYDAY
With due consideration to the effects of each statement. I would rather stress the request as a requirement prior to the PAN or MAYDAY call regardless of the FAR/AIM terminology, especially overseas.
This was a problem going into Montreal during isolated TCU and CB activity. Again, the request was denied but accepted when the phrase “require” was substituted.
So knowing the initial phraseology is mandatory, but knowing how to elevate that request is airmanship.
I never had an issue with “Flight xxx requires a turn to the right or left due to weather.” It takes the request up a notch and reduces radio chatter and explanations when using the word request in a time sensitive situation.
Possible microburst in Daytona Beach.
On my first flying lesson, in turbulent weather near a thunderstorm, a lot of input was needed to keep the wings level. I have since learned not to react too quickly. Most light aircraft, especially high wing, like to stay upright. Keep corrections gentle, and the wings should stay on. I’m sure my instructor would have commented if I was overdoing it. She recently celebrated 27,000 flying hours!
Starting in January, good to know!
using the flight aware sire will give a better idea of what took place. i doubt that the wings fell off.
Twenty-one years ago. OK.
rockwell...not Mooney...got it?
Aluminum shower - I have actually seen this happen before ! Central Florida . OMG !
Piston single of some sort , unknown - 3 were aboard that ill - fated aircraft . Sad …
Flew directly into a thunderstorm from north to south ----> |*☠️
ADM lesson in effect
Imma fly right into this active convection oven and see what this plane is made of… oh shit.. where the wings go Bob..
You do not play with TCU's. 4:56
“When in doubt , don’t” sadly the was never in doubt. ,
Commanders fall apart alarmingly frequently.
I turned down my first charter job because it was in a commander, a year later, one of their fleet aircraft fell apart at 8000’.
😯 wow!!!
There was AD.for cracking spar back in 2011 I think but all of those should be fixed by now.
I disagree.
that's an absolutely untrue statement, Commanders are considered to be overbuilt, an old spar issue was corrected and the 114 basically has an unlimited life limit on the wing and spar... and are you talking about single engine Commanders or twins?
Yes I was talking about the twin. The shrike always scared me.
Having spent the better part of my almost over career flying a couple of Boeing types, there is no way in the world I would be confident or brave enough to fly IFR in a light aircraft, especially a single.
Of course I use too.
Why do controllers talk so fast? It sounds like gobbledegook and i'm sure it must confuse many pilots.
VA speed is only 116kts for the 114, bet he was way above that.. RIP
lol, I don't remember them indicating much faster than that in cruise.
Why do these pilots seem to always risk weather? Keep it on the ground.
Man , he had that thing twisted ! Sounded like take off power set - Omg ! gatu ! If ya know , ya know . 😢. Nasty conditions. I have watched this exact thing happen - Over farmton , Fl.
Doctor pilots. Same holds true for Doctors in business. Ego. Made it through 12 years of medical school and residency so they MUST be proficient at everything. Sad. Use the $$ to charter a plane.
This whole video contains much superb English but "I think he's went down" tops it. Meanwhile we worry about immigrants.
The background engine wise kills my ears. Your blocked
stormscope = garbage
That Daytona approach was ridiculous. What does it take?
Daytona kid was … a fool . Dang , Why did he fly directly into that storm north of the field at
Daytona 16 Directly in to the bad thunderstorm ? Crazy student or instructor ? O!
flying into a storm....not a good idea when your plane can be blown off the ground if not strapped down. People have little sense, pilot's have even less.
more like an overconfident pilot flew his commander into a storm and lost control.. got into an unusual attitude.. instinctively yanked back on the yoke... instead of reducing speed and gradually gaining control.. that's what pulled the wings off.. guaranteed said doctor pulled the wings off.. the 114A is a TANK... this was a panic situation..
Completely avoidable - Poor airmanship . ( stupid )
stay away from storms and check wing bolts once in awhile. short version of vidya
Seriously, if you are going to do some text over, at least be marginally coherent. This is too difficult to listen to, or read. Thumbs down.
"Wing-off checklist"
Since they never teach it anymore.... Study up on the Gs of rolling pullouts.
Bye bye wing.
The storm scope is dangerous junk, my Father n law had one in his Geronimo, we were flying from Va to Fl, we were heading towards a fairly large cumulus cloud but nothing showing on his storm scope so he said we can fly through it! Well I said we are not flying through that thing at all and I deviated around it, it would have at least knocked our teeth out and worse maybe lose a wing or two!
sounds like the only thing dangerous was father-in-law. There are no correlations between spherics displayed on a Stormscope and hazardous weather.
This is 30 year old technology
tried to wing it and lost his wings
Pi rep:
I'm dead💀
Trump, J.D Vance, Moreno 2024!
Wings falling off , that’s pretty much what I expect to occur in light planes.
These people flying single-engine planes never truly understand that their aircraft is a recreational vehicle and nothing more.
Can’t tell Doctors anything. More money than brains, over and over again .
Well many doctors spend nearly a decade in an education environment that tells them what a special and elite class of human being they are. After so much smoke being blown up their rear ends it is coming out their ears and blocks them from hearing anything that isn't their own thoughts and opinions.