Thanks for those insights. I myself am currently transfering my house be fully Zigbee based. At the moment I have 40+ devices connected. As a controller I use a raspberry pi with an open source hub called "iobroker". I am very fond of iobroker, since it allows to add all types of "adapters" such as zigbee, node-red, mqtt and so on.
Andreas, hue bulbs must be un-registered from the hue hub before they can join the zigbee controller. There are a few ways to do this, but the only "almost" reliable procedure involves the phillips hue remote (a very good zigbee device on its own merit). Then the hue bulb automatically pair with the zigbee controller.
I know that, but did not say it exactly because of the intended joke. I have no hue remote (the bulb was expensive enough ;-) ). So I tried to reset it with the IKEA remote... But zigbee2mqtt will offer in the future a new reset feature which should help. Let's hope.
It is also possible to bind ZigBee switches direct to a lamp over ZigBee 2 mqtt. That has the advantage, that the lamp and the switch still work when the coordinator fails.
I love the humor of your videos, it makes them very entertaining, and easy to remember notable stuff haha Keep up the great content, but remember, don't overload yourself :)
Thank you, thank you, thank you. Running IOTMENU with node red zigbee and 433_rtl. IOTMENU saved so much time over installing everything separately. Now thinking I must go visit ikea this morning
Hi Andreas great video again! FYI - for the Xiaomi Aqara power plug you show on the end of the video I use an adapter from Skross. These adapters are low profile and fit perfectly our EU wall sockets.
Andreas Spiess that’s true but still cheaper than a zwave smartplug from Fibaro, Aeotec etc. Wifi plugs like sonoff’s do not mesh, so for me although the adapter doubles the price its a good choice.
Am I the only one surprised that the products from different manufacturers can inter-operate and talk to each other like that? That is awesome! Is that part of the ZigBee standard, or is there some other standard whose symbol we can look for on products?
That's thanks to two things. Zigbee standard on lower level, and then, good working people on higher lever from the zigbee2mqtt community, that decrypt the zigbee frames and add support for devices. On some cases it is out of the box, on others it is harder. I always check the zigbee2mqtt supported devices page before buying : www.zigbee2mqtt.io/information/supported_devices.html
I'm working for a company that had probably the biggest impact on Bluetooth Mesh. We are developing smart lamps with focus on commercial spaces. Bluetooth Mesh is not really that popular yet as the software is not there yet for other uses. For lighting we do already have commercial installations with hundreds of nodes. We have multiple manufacturer contracts (with giants like Osram and Zumtobel to name the few) so the future is looking bright, pun intended. As for comparisons to Zigbee. I won't give you a very detailed answer right now but there are a few key pros that make Bluetooth Mesh probably the best candidate for the future. 1. Bluetooth radio in basically every appliance or gadget 2. No single point of failure 3. Good performance with hundreds of nodes 4. Whole stack is defined. From radio to application. That makes Bluetooth Mesh certified devices compatible with each other. Not always the case with other radio protocols that do not define the application stack. 5. Good security with network and application layer encryptions. It may be a few more years before you see Bluetooth Mesh usage at homes,
Very interesting. I'm looking forward to this 😀. I once looked for methods to build a encrypted Bluetooth Network with ESP32s. But I found only one proprietary Projekt.
@@marvinblue6825 Espressif apparently has a SIG-certified Bluetooth Mesh stack so you can try to play with it. I gotta warn that it may be little complicated though :)
Thank you for this very informative Video! It will help to setup different Network (instead of 2.4GHz) around the house and will integrate into Node Red. I'm glad to not have sold my Xiaomi devices yet. Make Switzerland more anarchic :-)
@@AndreasSpiess I should have been more precisely (-: - "instead of 2.4GHz means" - instead of 802.1 wifi devices Right now, I got all Zigbee2Mqtt working and all "old" Mi-Devices are registered - next step will be integration of IKEA bulbs (rather inexpensive at the moment - €8 - together with Node Red and Alexa - I hope, this will work somehow
Hello. When pairing Xiaomi (in particular), have you ever managed to pair one "in place" - I.e. out of range of the coördinator, but in range of a router? Or, have you always paired by bringing the Xiaomi to only 1-2m away from the coördinator dongle? Otherwise, nice overview of ZigBee, thanks! :)
As I mentioned I was sitting in front of the screen to see the effect. I am not sure if pairing via router is supported. I anyway pair my devices in front of the computer because I also want to enter a name for it.
@@AndreasSpiess Usually I pair next to the dongle as well, but I've been having trouble when moving the end node (motion sensors in particular) to it's permanent home and it stops talking. Even though it can almost see a cc2530 router from the install site. Was interested if anyone else was having issues, or if it's just me :)
My question is not related to this video: Q. 🤔 will it be a problem to use multiple Lora modules at same time? will they create interference???? I think cheap nrf module will cause interference if two transmitter send message in same time... will such thing happen in Lora module also???
Transmitters never have problems with interference. Only receivers care about more than one channel either on the same or on a similar frequency. These problems have to be solved by the respective network technologies (for example resend messages if they did not arrive).
In Smart Lighting applications (Internet of Lighting, Connected Lighting or IoT Lighting) BLE is becoming primary choice. Link to the topic was mesh feature now part of BLE stack from 5.0 release, included built-in light-oriented commands in order ti be bridged into DALI
For the usage with Node Red zigbee2mqtt is not neccesary. There already exists a node-red-contrib-zigbee node. This is similar to zigbee2mqtt, because it uses same zigbee herdsman library.
7:33 I’m sure the position of the highlighter pen was purely coincidental and not a wry and highly astute comment on the appalling “collectively shooting themselves in both feet” situation going on across The English Channel.
Hi Andreas, Thanks for a nice clear explanation and peek into the possibilities of this mesh network . With, quoting you, the Dutch and the Swedes not wanting to mate will probably be taken care of by the attractive blonde Swedes. As they will with Sonos. Of course reliability and redundancy is a big plus. Not for nothing the basic topology of the internet itself in TCP. Side note: you go to bed too late!
Did you reset the Hue lamp before trying to pair and bond? From personal experimentation, it seems Hue products only allow connections to new devices after a reset. Otherwise, it can only connect to the device which it was connected to before and denies all others.
Any idea if the Zigbee radiator valve heads are end nodes or routers? I’m only questioning because although they are battery powered it is big batteries (2 AA), the battery life seems a bit short for an end node on 2AA and there was no mention anywhere where I bought them from of needing to buy routers and they would sell loads of valve heads with only 1 hub (12 I think). Incidentally I bought some eWeLink compatible power switches that were not Sonoff made and I don’t think they are routers as they don’t expand the mesh strength. Then I bought some Sonoff ones and they definitely extend the network. They were very cheap, but it was a false economy if they only act as end nodes.
Thank you! Ok so IKEA trådfri Lamp can act as a ZigBee Router. But what if I break the power to the lamp from a switch, then I guess it wont work anymore?
It would be interesting to see a comparison with WiFi meshes and BLE meshes, both can be built on ESP32 and the WiFi one also on ESP8266. I have built a WiFi mesh network with sonoff devices to lower the clients connected to the WiFi router using painlessMesh.
@@AndreasSpiess Please try my code for IOT network and see how it compare with ESPNow and Lora cost wise and power consumption wise. My code is at github.com/happytm/BatteryNode. I am using it for a month now with bare ESP8266 chip, BME280 environment sensor, APDS9960 light sensor, TP4056 battery charger, LIR2450 110 mah button cell battery and 53 x 30 mm 30ma 5V micro solar panel.
I have a bunch of ESP32 and ESP8266 ordered, I want to do an automation for temperature monitoring and plant watering, of course with graphics and internet access? Do I need also a raspi ? What is the best setup, through WiFi or will also Zigbee work?
@@AndreasSpiess I will for sure watch it, but what I found lacking for all the home automation IOT projects is a proper documentation of all the tools and what each of them is supposed to do. And then you get stuck at some point and it gets very frustrating to get further. At this moment I already tried a github project that is supposed to water plants but of course it does not work properly.
Hi Andreas. I'm enjoying your channel. Re Zigbee. The wall timer on my electric hot water immersion has failed (again!) so I've ordered a Sonoff Zigbee switch and a Zigbee dongle and intend to implement zigbee2MQTT with my new Domoticz system. It would be nice to monitor the temperature of the hot water tank (on the outside) but I cannot find any reasonably priced sensors. Commerical offerings are over 100 Euros/£s and the cheap room thermostats are only good for up to 60 Celsius and are measuring air temperature. Do you have any suggestions please?
Excellent video! I've seen a lot of stories recently about IoT security being the new target for hackers. Any thoughts on that, or maybe something to address in a future video?
This is not my specialty, so you should not expect anything about it on this channel. I do not have too much fear because we all create single devices which are not very interesting to attack. Attachers love big numbers of the same devices. Less effort for more success.
Two questions: (1) A network router normally goes between networks. How do these routers separate into two or more networks @2:44? (2) What does zigbee2MQTT mean @8:08? Isn't zigbee a version of MQTT?
@2:44: Router is a Zigbee role. It is different to an internet router. @8:08: Zigbee2MQTT creates MQTT messages from messages inside the Zigbee network. A Zigbee network consists of several layers also below MQTT. It is not comparable.
@@AndreasSpiess re:router: Whoever defined role of Zigbee "router" should explain that role. What exactly does it do? Why is the word "router" selected when that has a [different] well-established role in the internet? re:"Zigbee2MQTT": MQTT was invented around 1999 and is the basis for sensor networks and the publish-subscribe paradigm. (Bluetooth as a peer-peer product does not use it; there's no pub-sub). But home automation requires pub-sub. Where are these layers of "Zigbee2MQTT" explained so we can see they're not comparable? Are these layers of OSI? Doesn't Zigbee work without "Zigbee2MQTT"? (From my experience, when I connected Zigbee dongle to RPI, and it discovered a Philips bulb, I do not remember installing "Zigbee2MQTT". Was it done automatically?) Zigbee and other automation products (some are proprietary) utilize the MQTT protocol in the same way that email products like Gmail follow the SMTP protocol. So I still don't understand the purpose of "Zigbee2MQTT", as if "Zigbee" must be translated to "MQTT". When Matter products are rolled out, will there be a Matter2MQTT?
Thanks for the video. A question, Is it possible to configure one XBee module as coordinator in WI-FI mode (to interface with smartphone) as well as in ZigBee mode transmitting data to other ZigBee modules hooked up with Arduino that are used to control LED lights? I want to build a mesh network using one XBee module connecting with Raspberry PI4 as coordinator to act like a hub interacting with a smartphone via WI-FI, to control endpoint XBee modules/Arduino to adjust LED lightings, probably with another XBee only module as router in the network.
Hi Andrea, great work. I am interested on the Graphviz but I don't know how to make it work. How to run the map.sh script and do I need to install any related Graphviz software on my Pi?
Hi, dependencies to be installed are listed in the script. graphviz, one of them is a command line tool. Also the mosquitto command assumes you run it where your broker is installed. You can see my comment about graphviz on a web tool, but it won't be easier than the shell script to get it running. A good starting points would be help manuals for mosquitto_pub / _sub commands and graphviz.
@@wassfila thanks a lot for your replied. But I still dont understand how the script works. Do I need to put Pub or Sub to each of my control devices? I saw router can be monitored too, how the router pub or sub their existence? I am sorry, I might asking silly question. I got everything running perfectly but just don't know how the script set auto run or how it works that able to generate a fantastic network graph. Do I need to add anything in node red?
@@soovui Hi, no issues, I'll try to help. The more you ask questions, the easier it is. So first, after you install graphviz, you run the script with source command or .script search for "how to run a script on linux" for more details. When it comes to what the mosquitto_pub does, it sends a message (the payload) to the zigbee2mqtt running program itself, which is the program talking to the coordinator flashed zigbee dongle, that coordinator knows everything as all zigbee messages go through it and it can trigger a sort of zigbee ping to check on other devices. Zigbee2mqtt not only publishes sensors info on mosquitto network, but also subscribes itself and use the zigbee2mqtt/bridge topic to take requests from users such as that shell script. More info on what you can do with the bridge subtopic in here (search for bridge on this page) www.zigbee2mqtt.io/information/mqtt_topics_and_message_structure.html
@@wassfila Hi Wassim, tq so much for yr help and extremely appreciated. I try to run the script given by Andrea, run sudo chmod +x map.sh but I got connection refused : cannot authorised but I am happy seeing some results that an svg file created but zero byte might due to unauthorised connection. What happen ya... From Andrea video, there is no username and password required on the script. I like to try to add username and password but I don't know how.
@@soovui I see you progress, mosquitto_sub / _pub can be used with -u username -p password. official doc is here mosquitto.org/man/mosquitto_pub-1.html and a good google search with beginners example is here www.steves-internet-guide.com/mosquitto_pub-sub-clients/ you can try to run the sub and pub commands alone without the script, by cpying them on two different consoles, and check the output on the console first without the ">" file redirect and "&" required inside the script, also check withoutthe -C if that is for clean session and requiring an id. Both consoles of course to be run where mosquitto is running, check first with subscription to everything with topic zigbee2mqtt/#
6:06 why different names (SSID) for Wi-Fi networks? Having multiple AP with the same SSID but different channels makes more sense. And with MESH technology end devices like phones switches smoothly in the background. [ok, you mentioned MESH few seconds later, but still, without it just keeping the same SSID did the trick]
Funktioniert das gut, wenn mal der Strom ausfaellt und alle netzbetriebenen Router und der Coordinator neu bootet? Verbindet sich alles einwandfrei? (By the way, the Xiaomi plug should be now available with EU plug....seen on Aliexpress and Amazon)
@@AndreasSpiess it uses IEEE 802.15.4 and is supported by the nrf52840 on 2.4ghz (crazy low power) plus they have an official docker image to use a raspberry pi 3b as a border router (gateway) the protocol is just so "new" it's not really available in retail products yet--so not really a fair comparison with zigbee--but very promising for redundancy with self-healing, ipv6 scalability, and better security/provisioning than most other mesh standards
Hello, do you know if is it possible to change a device from router to endpoint? Because I am using some smart plugs (seen by zigbee2mqtt as router) that most of the time are not connected to main power (like the smart plugs for Christmas lights).
@@AndreasSpiess Thank you very much for the reply :) It is what I suspected.. oh well not a big issue! Have a nice 2022 Andreas! And please continue to provide useful contents like you always did :) Grazie ancora Ciao Roberto
Hallo Andreas, ich möchte Zigbee + ESP durch Amazon Echo steuern (ESP auf WLAN mit Sinric durch Amazon Echo mache ich Schon aber WLAN ist instabil und reicht nicht für die Entfernung dass ich habe).. Sollte ich den XBee Modul zusammen basteln oder gibt es andere kleines/günstiger Variant? Vielen Dank!
the problem with zigbee is that you can't do multiple transmissions in the same CH at the same time like in LoRa. So we cant have as many nodes as LoRa using Zigbee. I would love to be proven wrong
Your statement is true for all RF connections. This is why protocols have to take cate of that. By using algorithms for time slicing or by sending acknowledgements back to the transmitter. LoRaWAN uses an „Aloa“ protocol which has none of those.
@@AndreasSpiess Maybe you have some jokes about black people too? How about some jokes about Jews? 🤦♀️ I know!!! How about stereotyping women... that always gets a laugh from men.
@@cherrymountains72 Everything/body connected to every other body/thing. I'ts a 'free love' comment harping back to the 1960's. (Otherwise - it's just a pair of sad old men, trying to regain their youth, operating off-topic (on a different wavelength) - I'm afraid).
I recently bought a Xiaomi mi gateway with some ZigBee sensors and I'm trying to connect it with node-red but I need some token which is for some reason really hard to get. Can anybody help me how to do it? Or should I just use the method used in this video?
woah, whats going on with your sound fading in and out ? ive had nothing but realiability problems with ikea spot lights and styalised bulbs (the old fashioned looking ones), they dont always respond which is very annoying
Thank you. I am creating a network of iot devices associated with a new service I am proposing to my company. Your examples are a good way for me to explain to mgmt. I will recreate the info in power point. Thank you. I will join paid subscribers
I used products of various manufacturers. You should find the links in the video description. BTW: TH-cam has a "closed caption" button where it automatically creates text for my videos. I do not know how good it is with my Swiss accent...
Thank you for the video, I wasn't aware about availability_timeout and added it now. Few tips: I have Zigbee2MqttAssistant in Docker to check Zigbee network github.com/yllibed/Zigbee2MqttAssistant You can use one of these models to print adapter for chinese socker: www.thingiverse.com/thing:3096800 or www.thingiverse.com/thing:2581670 Soon there will be EU version of socket homekitnews.com/2019/12/12/mi-smart-plug-eu-version-first-look/
Hi Dimitry, thank you for the links. I was looking to the container for the Zigbee2mqttAssistant and I will try it when i have time. Unfortunately the new version in your link is more a "German version" and still will not work here. But at least all countries which use the German system will have a solution...
If you want to dive deeper into the zigbee communication, here is an interesting link for wireshark and a cc2531 sniffer. www.cd-jackson.com/downloads/ZigBeeWiresharkSniffer.pdf
Excellent for deeply committed nerds. But: What % of “makers” understand or would use anything this complex? Based on what’s happening in the Bay area, you’re missing the point entirely. This stuff is for pushing high priced consumer products.
@@AndreasSpiess will it work with solar microinverters which are using zigbee? My gate that are collecting data from them need to be at first floor where is no signal from roof.
Another very informative video. I have created simple DIY IOT network code in star topology which is low cost using ESP8266 devices. My test shows it is more power efficient than even ESPNow protocol. Ever since you publish ESPNow protocol video I wanted to create a network which is lower cost compared to Lora network and more power efficient than ESPNow network. I was able to achieve that goal but It is still work in progress and I hope to get some help from your viewers to improve it and possibly port it to ESP32 hardware. My other goal is to use it for long distance communication like your video # 291 and 292 using ESP32 devices. My code is at github.com/happytm/BatteryNode Thank you again.
Interesting work indeed. I think zigbee, thread and 802.15.4 based protocols differ from wifi on the power consumtion and on the standard differing between sleeping devices and non sleeping ones. Custom protocols can be more efficient even, and simpler than standards. They have other limitations such as, they are not standards, yet, they can get popular. Good luck for your work.
Another interesting topic, but the swiss accent is now gone especially for the 2.4Ghz mesh!! by the way, i have a wifi ap connected with lan cables per concrete floor. wifi mesh via wifi didn't work for me, its get "confusing" but we do like anarchy here. anyhow, such a scheme might create the need for wifi police, th-cam.com/video/EbetD2LMbeQ/w-d-xo.html and by the way hue is no longer philips, its "signify" and its mesh sometimes works and sometimes not...but i do like the mesh idea. maybe i will get that programmable chip oneday, right now i am entangled in the mesh created by my wife.
unfortunately, i was exposed within a week and she saw the multi-meters and oscilloscope. so i took her to a few palaces from the past and took her shopping, and she enjoyed it th-cam.com/video/wzwjOQ6XIME/w-d-xo.html but i have to say, shopping for women is more complicated than buying from bangood. they know their stuff well. th-cam.com/video/2DMvnxV-CJ8/w-d-xo.html but thanks to my experience with datasheets and specs, even the shopkeepers were impressed by my shopping and bargaining skills ;-)
Amer Fort is really impressive! And it was interesting to watch what your women buy ;-) Glad to read that you can use your skills to impress her. Good start!
@@AndreasSpiess Maybe truth in your head, but it's just as true as saying every Swiss citizen is a Heroin® junkie. The Summer of Love WAS NOT ABOUT FREE SEX, it was about caring for each other and advancing humanity. It was more than a decade before the rise of AIDS but sadly people thousands of kilometers away don't understand that and appear confused. I'm a Hippie from San Francisco and I've only led only long term committed relationships. I've also worked in the medical field in San Francisco, one of the two points of origin of AIDS, and I watched over 100 patients with AIDS die in the most agonizing ways. Your generalizing is based in degrading stereotypes and not worthy of merit.
@Andreas Spiess, please stick to your brilliant technical videos. They have always been helpful and very well done. I did a double-take on the AIDS comment as well as it seemed so out of place and out of character. It didn’t add anything positive to this video and has indeed offended more than a few, including myself.
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I like how you explain things: clear and to the point. Thanks.
You are welcome!
Love that pointing stick❤️
Thank you!
It took me almost three seconds to dredge up the definition of anarchic. Cool stuff.
Thank you!
Thanks for those insights. I myself am currently transfering my house be fully Zigbee based. At the moment I have 40+ devices connected. As a controller I use a raspberry pi with an open source hub called "iobroker". I am very fond of iobroker, since it allows to add all types of "adapters" such as zigbee, node-red, mqtt and so on.
There are a few different packages around like Home Assistant etc. So far I did not look into them. But I hear a lot of good things.
"like the hippies before AIDS", lol that came out of nowhere.
Not everybody agrees to the fact ;-)
@@AndreasSpiess I certainly don't - unsubscribed
@@dilenkozi Well I turned on notifications for the channel. Rekt.
...shows image of bikers XD
@@AndreasSpiess I was about to subscribe until that came out so the blue. Not a funny joke.
Andreas, I can assure you, Dutch do like to pair with Swedes … :-)
Some sort of quantum entanglement I assume :D
I hope so. Mine refused right away ;-)
@@AndreasSpiess They can be a bit stubbørn at first ...
@@AndreasSpiess - I can also assure you, Swedes also like to pair with Dutch.. why would I otherwise be subscribed to this channel? :D
@@ChrisFredriksson Dutch != Swiss
Andreas, hue bulbs must be un-registered from the hue hub before they can join the zigbee controller. There are a few ways to do this, but the only "almost" reliable procedure involves the phillips hue remote (a very good zigbee device on its own merit). Then the hue bulb automatically pair with the zigbee controller.
I know that, but did not say it exactly because of the intended joke. I have no hue remote (the bulb was expensive enough ;-) ). So I tried to reset it with the IKEA remote... But zigbee2mqtt will offer in the future a new reset feature which should help. Let's hope.
It is also possible to bind ZigBee switches direct to a lamp over ZigBee 2 mqtt. That has the advantage, that the lamp and the switch still work when the coordinator fails.
I do not think so. Maybe if you use only stuff from one supplier.
I love the humor of your videos, it makes them very entertaining, and easy to remember notable stuff haha
Keep up the great content, but remember, don't overload yourself :)
Thank you for your feedback! I hope that I am old enough to say "no" sometimes. We will see...
Thank you, thank you, thank you. Running IOTMENU with node red zigbee and 433_rtl. IOTMENU saved so much time over installing everything separately. Now thinking I must go visit ikea this morning
Just replacing bulbs with connected ones is a simple way to automate a home...
Wow, bin Anfänger und komme aus der Mechanik, aber deine Videos sind der Hammer!
Vielen Dank. Ich verstehe dafür nichts von Mechanik ;-)
Hi Andreas great video again! FYI - for the Xiaomi Aqara power plug you show on the end of the video I use an adapter from Skross. These adapters are low profile and fit perfectly our EU wall sockets.
Thank you for the tip. But adding one or two Skross adapters would probably more than double its price ;-)
Andreas Spiess that’s true but still cheaper than a zwave smartplug from Fibaro, Aeotec etc. Wifi plugs like sonoff’s do not mesh, so for me although the adapter doubles the price its a good choice.
Am I the only one surprised that the products from different manufacturers can inter-operate and talk to each other like that? That is awesome! Is that part of the ZigBee standard, or is there some other standard whose symbol we can look for on products?
That's thanks to two things. Zigbee standard on lower level, and then, good working people on higher lever from the zigbee2mqtt community, that decrypt the zigbee frames and add support for devices. On some cases it is out of the box, on others it is harder. I always check the zigbee2mqtt supported devices page before buying : www.zigbee2mqtt.io/information/supported_devices.html
Something about Bluetooth 5 mesh would be interesting, how does it compare to Zigbee?
So far I do not see a lot of BLE devices for Home Automation. Maybe later, when the technology will be ready for use.
I'm working for a company that had probably the biggest impact on Bluetooth Mesh. We are developing smart lamps with focus on commercial spaces. Bluetooth Mesh is not really that popular yet as the software is not there yet for other uses. For lighting we do already have commercial installations with hundreds of nodes. We have multiple manufacturer contracts (with giants like Osram and Zumtobel to name the few) so the future is looking bright, pun intended.
As for comparisons to Zigbee. I won't give you a very detailed answer right now but there are a few key pros that make Bluetooth Mesh probably the best candidate for the future.
1. Bluetooth radio in basically every appliance or gadget
2. No single point of failure
3. Good performance with hundreds of nodes
4. Whole stack is defined. From radio to application. That makes Bluetooth Mesh certified devices compatible with each other. Not always the case with other radio protocols that do not define the application stack.
5. Good security with network and application layer encryptions.
It may be a few more years before you see Bluetooth Mesh usage at homes,
Very interesting. I'm looking forward to this 😀.
I once looked for methods to build a encrypted Bluetooth Network with ESP32s. But I found only one proprietary Projekt.
@@marvinblue6825 Espressif apparently has a SIG-certified Bluetooth Mesh stack so you can try to play with it. I gotta warn that it may be little complicated though :)
Talking about Bluetooth steering smart lighting www.plejd.com/en (dutch pairing warning: made in Sweden)
Thanks for the thorough and clear explanation!
My pleasure!
Fantastic walk through as always
Thanks for sharing👍😀
You are welcome!
Thank you for this very informative Video! It will help to setup different Network (instead of 2.4GHz) around the house and will integrate into Node Red. I'm glad to not have sold my Xiaomi devices yet. Make Switzerland more anarchic :-)
Zigbee is also on 2.4 GHz ;-)
@@AndreasSpiess I should have been more precisely (-: - "instead of 2.4GHz means" - instead of 802.1 wifi devices
Right now, I got all Zigbee2Mqtt working and all "old" Mi-Devices are registered - next step will be integration of IKEA bulbs (rather inexpensive at the moment - €8 - together with Node Red and Alexa - I hope, this will work somehow
Hello. When pairing Xiaomi (in particular), have you ever managed to pair one "in place" - I.e. out of range of the coördinator, but in range of a router? Or, have you always paired by bringing the Xiaomi to only 1-2m away from the coördinator dongle? Otherwise, nice overview of ZigBee, thanks! :)
As I mentioned I was sitting in front of the screen to see the effect. I am not sure if pairing via router is supported. I anyway pair my devices in front of the computer because I also want to enter a name for it.
@@AndreasSpiess Usually I pair next to the dongle as well, but I've been having trouble when moving the end node (motion sensors in particular) to it's permanent home and it stops talking. Even though it can almost see a cc2530 router from the install site. Was interested if anyone else was having issues, or if it's just me :)
Is there multipath mesh Networks with zigbee?
Multiple routers connecting and resending the same device signal at time?
I did not investigate the routes of messages and if they are transferred via several routes. I just saw that the network was self-healing.
I assume a light would have to be left on to function as a router? Thanks for the great video!
No. It only has to be plugged in. Zigbee does the switching remotely.
My question is not related to this video:
Q. 🤔 will it be a problem to use multiple Lora modules at same time? will they create interference????
I think cheap nrf module will cause interference if two transmitter send message in same time... will such thing happen in Lora module also???
Transmitters never have problems with interference. Only receivers care about more than one channel either on the same or on a similar frequency. These problems have to be solved by the respective network technologies (for example resend messages if they did not arrive).
Pretty interesting, indeed. When a BLE 5x analysis and comparison ?
I do not see a lot of BLE devices for home automation for the moment...
In Smart Lighting applications (Internet of Lighting, Connected Lighting or IoT Lighting) BLE is becoming primary choice. Link to the topic was mesh feature now part of BLE stack from 5.0 release, included built-in light-oriented commands in order ti be bridged into DALI
My reference for popularity is AliExpress ;-)
For the usage with Node Red zigbee2mqtt is not neccesary. There already exists a node-red-contrib-zigbee node. This is similar to zigbee2mqtt, because it uses same zigbee herdsman library.
7:33 I’m sure the position of the highlighter pen was purely coincidental and not a wry and highly astute comment on the appalling “collectively shooting themselves in both feet” situation going on across The English Channel.
We will see how they deal with the new situation after the voting ;-) Maybe resilience will be important...
Hi Andreas,
Thanks for a nice clear explanation and peek into the possibilities of this mesh network . With, quoting you, the Dutch and the Swedes not wanting to mate will probably be taken care of by the attractive blonde Swedes. As they will with Sonos.
Of course reliability and redundancy is a big plus. Not for nothing the basic topology of the internet itself in TCP.
Side note: you go to bed too late!
We had nice people for dinner. So I had to finish a little later than usual ;-)
Did you reset the Hue lamp before trying to pair and bond? From personal experimentation, it seems Hue products only allow connections to new devices after a reset. Otherwise, it can only connect to the device which it was connected to before and denies all others.
My problem was, that it did not want to reset using the IKEA button. I read that zigbee2mqtt will support this resetting process in the future.
Any idea if the Zigbee radiator valve heads are end nodes or routers? I’m only questioning because although they are battery powered it is big batteries (2 AA), the battery life seems a bit short for an end node on 2AA and there was no mention anywhere where I bought them from of needing to buy routers and they would sell loads of valve heads with only 1 hub (12 I think).
Incidentally I bought some eWeLink compatible power switches that were not Sonoff made and I don’t think they are routers as they don’t expand the mesh strength. Then I bought some Sonoff ones and they definitely extend the network. They were very cheap, but it was a false economy if they only act as end nodes.
AFAIK: All mains connected devices are routers, the rest not. I do not know if there are exceptions.
Thank you! Ok so IKEA trådfri Lamp can act as a ZigBee Router. But what if I break the power to the lamp from a switch, then I guess it wont work anymore?
These bulbs are switched by Zigbee. So they should be powered all the time. Otherwise it would not make a lot of sense (for me)...
@@AndreasSpiess True! Tell that to my family using the wall switch all the time ;)
I guess the only solution is to remove the switches..
It would be interesting to see a comparison with WiFi meshes and BLE meshes, both can be built on ESP32 and the WiFi one also on ESP8266. I have built a WiFi mesh network with sonoff devices to lower the clients connected to the WiFi router using painlessMesh.
I might try a Wi-Fi mesh one day. But I do not have a real use case because our house is very small.
@@AndreasSpiess Please try my code for IOT network and see how it compare with ESPNow and Lora cost wise and power consumption wise. My code is at github.com/happytm/BatteryNode. I am using it for a month now with bare ESP8266 chip, BME280 environment sensor, APDS9960 light sensor, TP4056 battery charger, LIR2450 110 mah button cell battery and 53 x 30 mm 30ma 5V micro solar panel.
I have a bunch of ESP32 and ESP8266 ordered, I want to do an automation for temperature monitoring and plant watering, of course with graphics and internet access? Do I need also a raspi ? What is the best setup, through WiFi or will also Zigbee work?
Maybe you watch my Raspberry Pi playlist? There you should find some scenarios lik you want to build. It is not a simple task.
i developped a project with a raspberry pi in zigbee, maybe it can help you (github.com/monk31/gateway_zigbee-3.0)
@@AndreasSpiess I will for sure watch it, but what I found lacking for all the home automation IOT projects is a proper documentation of all the tools and what each of them is supposed to do.
And then you get stuck at some point and it gets very frustrating to get further. At this moment I already tried a github project that is supposed to water plants but of course it does not work properly.
Thanks for this, exactly what I needed!
You are welcome!
nice you took zigbee's ;-)
They are now cheap enough to be mainstream.
very educational video, thanks for working it all out
Glad you liked it!
Kannst du mir mal bitte erklären, in welchen Zusammenhang die Hippies, Aids und Zigbee stehen?
very cool, thanks Andreas.
You are welcome!
Hi Andreas. I'm enjoying your channel. Re Zigbee. The wall timer on my electric hot water immersion has failed (again!) so I've ordered a Sonoff Zigbee switch and a Zigbee dongle and intend to implement zigbee2MQTT with my new Domoticz system. It would be nice to monitor the temperature of the hot water tank (on the outside) but I cannot find any reasonably priced sensors. Commerical offerings are over 100 Euros/£s and the cheap room thermostats are only good for up to 60 Celsius and are measuring air temperature. Do you have any suggestions please?
I never built a Zigbee sensor myself, So I have no suggestion.
Excellent video! I've seen a lot of stories recently about IoT security being the new target for hackers. Any thoughts on that, or maybe something to address in a future video?
This is not my specialty, so you should not expect anything about it on this channel. I do not have too much fear because we all create single devices which are not very interesting to attack. Attachers love big numbers of the same devices. Less effort for more success.
Two questions: (1) A network router normally goes between networks. How do these routers separate into two or more networks @2:44? (2) What does zigbee2MQTT mean @8:08? Isn't zigbee a version of MQTT?
@2:44: Router is a Zigbee role. It is different to an internet router.
@8:08: Zigbee2MQTT creates MQTT messages from messages inside the Zigbee network. A Zigbee network consists of several layers also below MQTT. It is not comparable.
@@AndreasSpiess re:router: Whoever defined role of Zigbee "router" should explain that role. What exactly does it do? Why is the word "router" selected when that has a [different] well-established role in the internet? re:"Zigbee2MQTT": MQTT was invented around 1999 and is the basis for sensor networks and the publish-subscribe paradigm. (Bluetooth as a peer-peer product does not use it; there's no pub-sub). But home automation requires pub-sub. Where are these layers of "Zigbee2MQTT" explained so we can see they're not comparable? Are these layers of OSI? Doesn't Zigbee work without "Zigbee2MQTT"? (From my experience, when I connected Zigbee dongle to RPI, and it discovered a Philips bulb, I do not remember installing "Zigbee2MQTT". Was it done automatically?) Zigbee and other automation products (some are proprietary) utilize the MQTT protocol in the same way that email products like Gmail follow the SMTP protocol. So I still don't understand the purpose of "Zigbee2MQTT", as if "Zigbee" must be translated to "MQTT". When Matter products are rolled out, will there be a Matter2MQTT?
@@georgeseese In Matter, the role of Zigbee2MQTT will be taken over by the "Border Router". Similar, but not the same...
As far as I know, thread can have multiple border routers which has the connectivity to the outside world.
I will have a look into thread.
sir between lorawan and zigbee which is better for smart parking
I do not know. You have to define your requirements and then select the right technology.
How much node we can connect in one gateway?
Thanks for the video.
A question, Is it possible to configure one XBee module as coordinator in WI-FI mode (to interface with smartphone) as well as in ZigBee mode transmitting data to other ZigBee modules hooked up with Arduino that are used to control LED lights? I want to build a mesh network using one XBee module connecting with Raspberry PI4 as coordinator to act like a hub interacting with a smartphone via WI-FI, to control endpoint XBee modules/Arduino to adjust LED lightings, probably with another XBee only module as router in the network.
You have to ask the supplier of XBee. I do not own such modules. Zigbee and Wi-Fi are very different protocols.
@@AndreasSpiess thanks Andreas. XBee supports ZigBee and WI-FI. I asked the manufacture, they said it'll work, but I need to figure out how.
Hi Andrea, great work. I am interested on the Graphviz but I don't know how to make it work. How to run the map.sh script and do I need to install any related Graphviz software on my Pi?
Hi, dependencies to be installed are listed in the script. graphviz, one of them is a command line tool. Also the mosquitto command assumes you run it where your broker is installed. You can see my comment about graphviz on a web tool, but it won't be easier than the shell script to get it running. A good starting points would be help manuals for mosquitto_pub / _sub commands and graphviz.
@@wassfila thanks a lot for your replied. But I still dont understand how the script works. Do I need to put Pub or Sub to each of my control devices? I saw router can be monitored too, how the router pub or sub their existence? I am sorry, I might asking silly question. I got everything running perfectly but just don't know how the script set auto run or how it works that able to generate a fantastic network graph. Do I need to add anything in node red?
@@soovui Hi, no issues, I'll try to help. The more you ask questions, the easier it is. So first, after you install graphviz, you run the script with source command or .script search for "how to run a script on linux" for more details. When it comes to what the mosquitto_pub does, it sends a message (the payload) to the zigbee2mqtt running program itself, which is the program talking to the coordinator flashed zigbee dongle, that coordinator knows everything as all zigbee messages go through it and it can trigger a sort of zigbee ping to check on other devices. Zigbee2mqtt not only publishes sensors info on mosquitto network, but also subscribes itself and use the zigbee2mqtt/bridge topic to take requests from users such as that shell script. More info on what you can do with the bridge subtopic in here (search for bridge on this page) www.zigbee2mqtt.io/information/mqtt_topics_and_message_structure.html
@@wassfila Hi Wassim, tq so much for yr help and extremely appreciated. I try to run the script given by Andrea, run sudo chmod +x map.sh but I got connection refused : cannot authorised but I am happy seeing some results that an svg file created but zero byte might due to unauthorised connection. What happen ya... From Andrea video, there is no username and password required on the script. I like to try to add username and password but I don't know how.
@@soovui I see you progress, mosquitto_sub / _pub can be used with -u username -p password. official doc is here mosquitto.org/man/mosquitto_pub-1.html and a good google search with beginners example is here www.steves-internet-guide.com/mosquitto_pub-sub-clients/ you can try to run the sub and pub commands alone without the script, by cpying them on two different consoles, and check the output on the console first without the ">" file redirect and "&" required inside the script, also check withoutthe -C if that is for clean session and requiring an id. Both consoles of course to be run where mosquitto is running, check first with subscription to everything with topic zigbee2mqtt/#
6:06 why different names (SSID) for Wi-Fi networks? Having multiple AP with the same SSID but different channels makes more sense. And with MESH technology end devices like phones switches smoothly in the background. [ok, you mentioned MESH few seconds later, but still, without it just keeping the same SSID did the trick]
In the old days it was needed. Now no more, you are right.
Funktioniert das gut, wenn mal der Strom ausfaellt und alle netzbetriebenen Router und der Coordinator neu bootet? Verbindet sich alles einwandfrei? (By the way, the Xiaomi plug should be now available with EU plug....seen on Aliexpress and Amazon)
Wir haben hier wenig Stromausfälle... Aber natürlich bleibt ein Risiko mit all diesen Dingen.
That dialogue: this is called after play; not foreplay :-)
:-)
what do you think about thread and IP-addressable nodes?
I do not know thread, but I will dig into it.
@@AndreasSpiess it uses IEEE 802.15.4 and is supported by the nrf52840 on 2.4ghz (crazy low power) plus they have an official docker image to use a raspberry pi 3b as a border router (gateway)
the protocol is just so "new" it's not really available in retail products yet--so not really a fair comparison with zigbee--but very promising for redundancy with self-healing, ipv6 scalability, and better security/provisioning than most other mesh standards
I read that Zigbee Wil exchange parts of its stack with thread.
Hello, do you know if is it possible to change a device from router to endpoint? Because I am using some smart plugs (seen by zigbee2mqtt as router) that most of the time are not connected to main power (like the smart plugs for Christmas lights).
I do not know if this is forseen in the concept without changing the firmware. And I doubt you will find new firmware for those devices.
@@AndreasSpiess Thank you very much for the reply :)
It is what I suspected.. oh well not a big issue!
Have a nice 2022 Andreas! And please continue to provide useful contents like you always did :)
Grazie ancora
Ciao
Roberto
Hallo Andreas, ich möchte Zigbee + ESP durch Amazon Echo steuern (ESP auf WLAN mit Sinric durch Amazon Echo mache ich Schon aber WLAN ist instabil und reicht nicht für die Entfernung dass ich habe).. Sollte ich den XBee Modul zusammen basteln oder gibt es andere kleines/günstiger Variant?
Vielen Dank!
Du kannst ja sehen wie ich die diversen Module mit MQTT verbinde und dann entscheiden.
İ like it your video. İt is helpful 👍
Thank you!
Hallo Andreas. Hab ich das richtig verstanden? Freifunk ist bei euch in der Schweiz nicht erlaubt? Gibt’s dafür nen Grund?
Ja. Das anonyme Benutzen scheint nicht erlaubt.
the problem with zigbee is that you can't do multiple transmissions in the same CH at the same time like in LoRa. So we cant have as many nodes as LoRa using Zigbee. I would love to be proven wrong
Your statement is true for all RF connections. This is why protocols have to take cate of that. By using algorithms for time slicing or by sending acknowledgements back to the transmitter. LoRaWAN uses an „Aloa“ protocol which has none of those.
Any recommendations on router devices?
No. My DIY devices worked and the IKEA router also worked.
Delightful topic coverage - loved the hippie comment! :)
Can you explain it to me because I don’t understand the hippie comment?
I thought, this is how we can keep it best. And I love the film "Easy Rider"
@@AndreasSpiess Maybe you have some jokes about black people too? How about some jokes about Jews? 🤦♀️
I know!!! How about stereotyping women... that always gets a laugh from men.
@@cherrymountains72 Everything/body connected to every other body/thing. I'ts a 'free love' comment harping back to the 1960's. (Otherwise - it's just a pair of sad old men, trying to regain their youth, operating off-topic (on a different wavelength) - I'm afraid).
@@Peter_S_ Not sure you understood the reference. This is not an offensive channel.
Hi Andreas, could you please have a quick look on the channel "bnbe club" because he talked about one of your videos and made a CO2 kit ;)
I am already one of his subscribers :-)
@@AndreasSpiess Oh, that is awesome!
I recently bought a Xiaomi mi gateway with some ZigBee sensors and I'm trying to connect it with node-red but I need some token which is for some reason really hard to get. Can anybody help me how to do it? Or should I just use the method used in this video?
I do not know the Xiaomi gateway. So I cannot help.
Hi Andreas, the link to Ikea Tradfri gives a 404
Thanks. Now it should work...
Cool!
Thank you!
I must know... why no Node2?
Because this video is not about music.
Esp8266 mesh are possible or not?
YES
Its limited by node depth due to memory restrictions.
woah, whats going on with your sound fading in and out ?
ive had nothing but realiability problems with ikea spot lights and styalised bulbs (the old fashioned looking ones), they dont always respond which is very annoying
Nobody else mentioned the fading sound, and I did not recognize it in my check before uploading. Where is it the worst?
Iam Dutch and love to pair with a Swedish but our Hue is a Facist.
I understand what you mean :-))
SVG viewers: just drag them on any modern browser :)
I started with tat. But unfortunately, I was not able to pan and zoom. This is necessary to see the details. But maybe I missed something.
"Each can connect with each, like the Hippies before AIDS........" I nearly wet myself
That is how it was ;-)
Thank you. I am creating a network of iot devices associated with a new service I am proposing to my company. Your examples are a good way for me to explain to mgmt. I will recreate the info in power point. Thank you. I will join paid subscribers
Thank you for your support! And I hope you can convince management...
Could you provide info on your wireless manufacturer? I can’t understand you. Years of explosive work has trashed my ears.
I used products of various manufacturers. You should find the links in the video description. BTW: TH-cam has a "closed caption" button where it automatically creates text for my videos. I do not know how good it is with my Swiss accent...
"Each can connect with Each, like the hippies before AIDS"💀💀
Thank you for the video, I wasn't aware about availability_timeout and added it now.
Few tips:
I have Zigbee2MqttAssistant in Docker to check Zigbee network github.com/yllibed/Zigbee2MqttAssistant
You can use one of these models to print adapter for chinese socker: www.thingiverse.com/thing:3096800 or www.thingiverse.com/thing:2581670
Soon there will be EU version of socket homekitnews.com/2019/12/12/mi-smart-plug-eu-version-first-look/
Hi Dimitry, thank you for the links. I was looking to the container for the Zigbee2mqttAssistant and I will try it when i have time. Unfortunately the new version in your link is more a "German version" and still will not work here. But at least all countries which use the German system will have a solution...
If you want to dive deeper into the zigbee communication, here is an interesting link for wireshark and a cc2531 sniffer.
www.cd-jackson.com/downloads/ZigBeeWiresharkSniffer.pdf
Thank you for the link. Maybe one day when I have enough time. Link saved ;-)
How about more videos about micro python or circuit python? Would love to have an esp32 micro python wireless mesh network with mqtt and ota updates
I will cover micropython in hte future, but maybe not the mesh aspect.
Excellent for deeply committed nerds. But: What % of “makers” understand or would use anything this complex? Based on what’s happening in the Bay area, you’re missing the point entirely. This stuff is for pushing high priced consumer products.
I do not know a percentage. But the video got around 30'000 views. So a few "*nerds" seem to understand it ;-)
Like the hippies before aids XD you got me there lol
That adapter is the worst: it even doesn't work on EU outlets, because it should be round.
It is not only their fault. It is also not easy to keep up wit all the different standards around the world...
So... Hippies found Mesh Networking? I guess Wikipedia needs to add this new Fact. 😁
You did not know that? This is taught here in school ;-)
_Dutch do not want to pair with sweeds_
😂
Kind regards from the netherlands.
:-))
"Like the hippies before AIDS" xD
Stupid bigotry that relies on multiple tropes, and nothing more.
Do you consider the IKEA "amplifier" a good solution to extend range? www.ikea.com/us/en/p/tradfri-signal-repeater-30400407/
It worked in my setup. That is what I can say.
@@AndreasSpiess will it work with solar microinverters which are using zigbee? My gate that are collecting data from them need to be at first floor where is no signal from roof.
Another very informative video. I have created simple DIY IOT network code in star topology which is low cost using ESP8266 devices. My test shows it is more power efficient than even ESPNow protocol. Ever since you publish ESPNow protocol video I wanted to create a network which is lower cost compared to Lora network and more power efficient than ESPNow network. I was able to achieve that goal but It is still work in progress and I hope to get some help from your viewers to improve it and possibly port it to ESP32 hardware. My other goal is to use it for long distance communication like your video # 291 and 292 using ESP32 devices.
My code is at github.com/happytm/BatteryNode
Thank you again.
Interesting work indeed. I think zigbee, thread and 802.15.4 based protocols differ from wifi on the power consumtion and on the standard differing between sleeping devices and non sleeping ones. Custom protocols can be more efficient even, and simpler than standards. They have other limitations such as, they are not standards, yet, they can get popular. Good luck for your work.
@@wassfila Thank you.
Thank you for the link. Looks promising! I will have a look into it when I have time.
@@AndreasSpiess Thank you for your consideration.
Another interesting topic, but the swiss accent is now gone especially for the 2.4Ghz mesh!! by the way, i have a wifi ap connected with lan cables per concrete floor. wifi mesh via wifi didn't work for me, its get "confusing" but we do like anarchy here. anyhow, such a scheme might create the need for wifi police, th-cam.com/video/EbetD2LMbeQ/w-d-xo.html and by the way hue is no longer philips, its "signify" and its mesh sometimes works and sometimes not...but i do like the mesh idea. maybe i will get that programmable chip oneday, right now i am entangled in the mesh created by my wife.
I am glad to read the word "wife" in your comment, and hope that the mesh is strong enough ;-) An thank you for the video link. I enjoyed it!
unfortunately, i was exposed within a week and she saw the multi-meters and oscilloscope. so i took her to a few palaces from the past and took her shopping, and she enjoyed it th-cam.com/video/wzwjOQ6XIME/w-d-xo.html but i have to say, shopping for women is more complicated than buying from bangood. they know their stuff well. th-cam.com/video/2DMvnxV-CJ8/w-d-xo.html but thanks to my experience with datasheets and specs, even the shopkeepers were impressed by my shopping and bargaining skills ;-)
Amer Fort is really impressive! And it was interesting to watch what your women buy ;-) Glad to read that you can use your skills to impress her. Good start!
This dude's got the weirdest vibe
:-)
this technology doesn't fit me .. I live in a flat :D
Lucky you!
1:29 wtf?
Anything wrong with it? A colorful analogy!
Only the truth. I am sure it will help memorize the content ;-) At least for the guys which were already alive back then.
@@AndreasSpiess Maybe truth in your head, but it's just as true as saying every Swiss citizen is a Heroin® junkie. The Summer of Love WAS NOT ABOUT FREE SEX, it was about caring for each other and advancing humanity. It was more than a decade before the rise of AIDS but sadly people thousands of kilometers away don't understand that and appear confused. I'm a Hippie from San Francisco and I've only led only long term committed relationships. I've also worked in the medical field in San Francisco, one of the two points of origin of AIDS, and I watched over 100 patients with AIDS die in the most agonizing ways. Your generalizing is based in degrading stereotypes and not worthy of merit.
@Andreas Spiess, please stick to your brilliant technical videos. They have always been helpful and very well done. I did a double-take on the AIDS comment as well as it seemed so out of place and out of character. It didn’t add anything positive to this video and has indeed offended more than a few, including myself.
Chill out folks - it was just a "Dad joke". Andreas is clearly a nice guy, and no offense was intended.
like the hippies before aids .. hahaaaa .. der vergleich bleibt hängen. :-D
War Absicht...
This video is unrealistic.
How am I supposed to afford a property with multiple floors?
We have here small houses with multiple floors because the land is extremely expensive.