Disclaimer - made this vid the same day he was released, so thoughts are from that amount of information. May do updated vid in future. Lmk thoughts and what else people want!
Lucario's Rage most likely have been a factor in the counter. So he wouldn't be getting 70% Forward Smashes from countering something like a marth tipper Fsmash. Maybe around 45-50% depending on which characters fsmash is countered? Lariat is going to be very strong if it functions exactly like Zangief's. Both his counter and Lariat can be used as a combo breaker. (you benefit more from Revenge but Lariat can potentially kill) Also, Good video, cant wait to see who else you cover! Do you have any thoughts on Robin, or will you eventually cover him sometime on your channel?
In competitive pokemon, incineroar is not that great in singles but is an absolute beast in doubles. It would be so fitting to have this feature in smash as well.
Quite funny how he is "ok' in singles but scary in doubles. Its exactly the same in pokemon. In singles he is quite bad but in doubles he is one of the best and i think the most used in VGC
@@scarffoxandfriends9401 and a lot of people used him, he is Definitely more than Modest. I just found it funny how incineroar might be in the same tier as in his own games
@@GeneralForster diddy is #2, not cloud. Cloud is ranked 3rd with sheik. And this is smash 4, sheik and diddy don't out perform the other players by the same amount as even fox in melee
@@kennethkjen1996 but there's also the fact a lot of people used him just because they like cloud/FF7. When I say modest i mean he isn't bad, but is also not SS tier like melee fox or brawl meta knight (probably soon to be bayo as well). He has clear weaknesses that a lot of people are able to take advantage of. You feel like you have a chance against him.
His down smash is very interesting since he jumps pretty high into the air when performing it. This essentially means that any attack that isn't aimed upward is going to miss him completely when he's performing this move making it a great option to punish things like dash attacks or grabs.
Kinda surprised you didn’t point out that Incineroar was able to counter pika’s tjolt in the treehouse footage, that seems like a pretty important tool to be used against projectile-heavy opponents.
A good thing to learn is the throw timing for the side throws because if you don't use the sweat spot it would hit him in the air, and if you miss he won't fly as far so at 85% - 90% you can purposely miss so he's closer to you then do a back attack or any available attack, I'm excited to pick up this character too!
I notice cross-chop drags your opponent along for the ride in the scene w/ Palutena. Could you use it like clouds climbhazard and just take your opponent w/ you to the blast zone?
Unfortunately that was mostly because of her final smash. We didn't see much high level play from her, she just had the crutch of a free kill and 60% health regen every single stock. She didn't even use the pan/racket, only knowing how to use the golf club. We didn't see any interesting turnip plays, throw combos, tilts, or specials (which are stronger on daisy then peach supposedly). The only thing we learned from the invitational is that final smash meter should indeed be banned.
Isn't the reason why he did much more damage to Lucario because he had a ton of aura and rage when he hit Incineroar? So the damage he absorved was way higher, therefore he revenged that much more
Rage has no effect on damage, but even though Lucario wasn't at maximum power, a fully charged side smash is still devastatingly powerful. Plus, it's likely that Incineroar's side smash is also extremely powerful to begin with, but even so that damage is ludicrous. Revenge might actually carry Incineroar.
@@GeneralForster Just so that you know, Lucario's Aura makes it so that rage actually does increase his damage. At that percent, with the 1v1 multiplier in Ultimate, an uncharged f-smash would do about 22- 25 damage. Fully charged, it would probably do about 34-37 damage. If Incineroar has a strong f-smash that does about 29 percent (the same as Ganondorf with the 1v1 modifier), you'll find that the number works out perfectly and revenge isn't really overpowered at all, it just add's your opponent's last hit's damage to your next attack.
@@TheBriguy1998 I definitely don't think that's how it works, but if it was that would still be completely busted since you can see a charged smash attack coming, and then absorb that damage and transfer it to your opponent with a really fast move like fair or up air. I think it's just doing some sort of multiplier that will be adjusted to not be so strong.
Can you Revenge even while charged from Revenging a previous attack? And also, do only his next attacks activate it or only specific ones, and does it go away on whiff? So many questions about this ability.
I’m not sure if the names of specials matter to you or not, but Incineroar’s neutral special name is Darkest Lariat, not just lariat. I understand why you call it just lariat though
I hear everyone saying that Incineroar will be super good in doubles because of Revenge; however, I don't think this will be the case. We've seen these types of doubles strategies nerfed before. For example, in Smash 4, Mr. Game & Watch used to be able to absorb his teammate's projectiles with Oil Panic and kill at 0%. The devs realized how broken this strategy was, and so they made it so that when G&W absorbs a teammate's projectile, it will only do a fraction of the damage upon release. I'm quite sure the devs will see that Incineroar would be too powerful in doubles as it is, and give him the G&W treatment.
Everyone talks about him having a ton of landing lag on aerials but nobody wants to throw out numbers... I counted 11 frames of lag for his nair at 5:18. idk about you guys but that seems pretty low to me
I don't know if he'll be that good. Seems a bit too slow and laggy, like even more than Ganondorf (who is also probably stronger with the exception of when Revenge is active)
Not seeing him do the canadian destroyer... So low, bottom actually. Lowest in All fighter game history. It will cause a incineroaration in the fan base as a whole.
![[SSBU] The Move That Makes Cloud Good](/img/n.gif)
Disclaimer - made this vid the same day he was released, so thoughts are from that amount of information. May do updated vid in future. Lmk thoughts and what else people want!
Pikachu and Snake thoughts
Zero or a top smash 4 player is more qualified for this.
Corrin or Lucario please
Lucario's Rage most likely have been a factor in the counter. So he wouldn't be getting 70% Forward Smashes from countering something like a marth tipper Fsmash. Maybe around 45-50% depending on which characters fsmash is countered?
Lariat is going to be very strong if it functions exactly like Zangief's. Both his counter and Lariat can be used as a combo breaker. (you benefit more from Revenge but Lariat can potentially kill)
Also, Good video, cant wait to see who else you cover! Do you have any thoughts on Robin, or will you eventually cover him sometime on your channel?
I'll help you with that
In competitive pokemon, incineroar is not that great in singles but is an absolute beast in doubles. It would be so fitting to have this feature in smash as well.
Triggered Woomy imagine if Incineroar had intimidate in smash lol weakens all melee attacks
If only it didn't have intimidate.
Quite funny how he is "ok' in singles but scary in doubles. Its exactly the same in pokemon. In singles he is quite bad but in doubles he is one of the best and i think the most used in VGC
It's how cloud was in smash 4 o3o cloud was modest in singles, but was the doubles meta
#2 on the tier list is not modest
@@scarffoxandfriends9401 and a lot of people used him, he is Definitely more than Modest. I just found it funny how incineroar might be in the same tier as in his own games
@@GeneralForster diddy is #2, not cloud. Cloud is ranked 3rd with sheik. And this is smash 4, sheik and diddy don't out perform the other players by the same amount as even fox in melee
@@kennethkjen1996 but there's also the fact a lot of people used him just because they like cloud/FF7. When I say modest i mean he isn't bad, but is also not SS tier like melee fox or brawl meta knight (probably soon to be bayo as well). He has clear weaknesses that a lot of people are able to take advantage of. You feel like you have a chance against him.
Excellent choice of music. I cannot WAIT to play him!
His down smash is very interesting since he jumps pretty high into the air when performing it. This essentially means that any attack that isn't aimed upward is going to miss him completely when he's performing this move making it a great option to punish things like dash attacks or grabs.
I thought I was the only one to notice that
Could M2K the pichu god, review the new pichu?
"Extra stronger" The great M2K
Kinda surprised you didn’t point out that Incineroar was able to counter pika’s tjolt in the treehouse footage, that seems like a pretty important tool to be used against projectile-heavy opponents.
A good thing to learn is the throw timing for the side throws because if you don't use the sweat spot it would hit him in the air, and if you miss he won't fly as far so at 85% - 90% you can purposely miss so he's closer to you then do a back attack or any available attack, I'm excited to pick up this character too!
Very excited to play Incineroar, I want to find as many combos that can end with Cross Chop.
I'm also looking forward to checking this character out even though his play-style isn't typically what I go for.
Can't wait to try this character! Love all the new heavies in this game!!!
I notice cross-chop drags your opponent along for the ride in the scene w/ Palutena. Could you use it like clouds climbhazard and just take your opponent w/ you to the blast zone?
I am a casual player but loving the insight on these new fighters.
Kill power seems very high on his up B. If it's possible to like tech chase someone on a platform with it, you might get some early kills!
I think liariat got a lot priority
Of thats what I heard.
It beats out projectiles too
According to the Incineroar frame data thread on smashboards, Darkest Lariat has Transcendent Priority.
Definite day 1 main for me. Has all the sauce like spicy poses and some DORYAH-worthy moves.
Chiramijumaru ewgf?
You'll have to unlock him first lol
The one dislike is from Desidueye, lol.
"It seemed to be around 29 frames or so"
-Jason "Mew2king" Zimmerman @4:11
You quoted him on that
YOU WEREN'T SUPPOSED TO QUOTE HIM ON THAT.
Incineroar does have potential.
Nothing broken in my opinion, but that revenge will make him scary.
Could you please consider doing Luigi? I think he has a lot to cover, and I want a pro opinion on if he will be viable.
"If you counter a strong move, it's even extra stronger" XD IDK why I found that so funny
Maybe try analysing daisy (along with peach). Daisy did extremely well in the Spanish invitational so Daisy and peach might be upper teir
She mostly did well because of her Final Smash.
Unfortunately that was mostly because of her final smash. We didn't see much high level play from her, she just had the crutch of a free kill and 60% health regen every single stock. She didn't even use the pan/racket, only knowing how to use the golf club. We didn't see any interesting turnip plays, throw combos, tilts, or specials (which are stronger on daisy then peach supposedly). The only thing we learned from the invitational is that final smash meter should indeed be banned.
Do _not_ use the results of a single tournament with Final Smash meter enabled to try and predict character strength.
IT'S EVEN EXTRA STRONGER BOYS
I'm so excited for Incineroar
In doubles your teammate could just use a projectile to activate revenge so that they don't take damage
“It’s even extra stronger.” Sorry had to do it to ‘em. M2K still da bess
He seems a bit like Mac, he's a beast in the ground but if you get him in the air he's pretty screwed except incineroar has good airials
THAT ZANGIEF THEME IS SO CLUTCH!
Do we know whether the revenge thing is used when incineroar hits a shield for instance (is it lost or not) ?
Isn't the reason why he did much more damage to Lucario because he had a ton of aura and rage when he hit Incineroar? So the damage he absorved was way higher, therefore he revenged that much more
Lucario was at 100-ish percent. At best he was at 1.2x strenght, not that much aura and certainly not enough to warrant the damage Incineroar did
Rage has no effect on damage, but even though Lucario wasn't at maximum power, a fully charged side smash is still devastatingly powerful. Plus, it's likely that Incineroar's side smash is also extremely powerful to begin with, but even so that damage is ludicrous. Revenge might actually carry Incineroar.
@@GeneralForster Just so that you know, Lucario's Aura makes it so that rage actually does increase his damage. At that percent, with the 1v1 multiplier in Ultimate, an uncharged f-smash would do about 22- 25 damage. Fully charged, it would probably do about 34-37 damage. If Incineroar has a strong f-smash that does about 29 percent (the same as Ganondorf with the 1v1 modifier), you'll find that the number works out perfectly and revenge isn't really overpowered at all, it just add's your opponent's last hit's damage to your next attack.
@@TheBriguy1998 I definitely don't think that's how it works, but if it was that would still be completely busted since you can see a charged smash attack coming, and then absorb that damage and transfer it to your opponent with a really fast move like fair or up air. I think it's just doing some sort of multiplier that will be adjusted to not be so strong.
@David Tector every character does that... Charging preemptive smash attacks is really bad. That's like the easiest thing in the game to punish lol.
"EGG"- Incineroar 2018
About his run speed.....
Is he gonna be slower or faster than Robin?
Can you Revenge even while charged from Revenging a previous attack? And also, do only his next attacks activate it or only specific ones, and does it go away on whiff? So many questions about this ability.
I’m not sure if the names of specials matter to you or not, but Incineroar’s neutral special name is Darkest Lariat, not just lariat. I understand why you call it just lariat though
Good stuff. Thanks
That SFIV Gief theme yo!
Hold up: revenge can be activated by projectiles? That’s pretty good
bayonetta players are gonna be mad good at using that counter
Perhaps using it, but Incineroar's counter is not easy mode
EVEN EXTRA STRONGER
Double inceneroar
Player 1: counters move from player 2
Player 2: counters now stronger move from player 1
Rinse and repeat until 1 hit KO?
Incineroar took Mac's recovery...
you should do captain falcon next
Rrrawwrrr - Incineroar 2018
"It's even extra stronger" lol
I hear everyone saying that Incineroar will be super good in doubles because of Revenge; however, I don't think this will be the case. We've seen these types of doubles strategies nerfed before. For example, in Smash 4, Mr. Game & Watch used to be able to absorb his teammate's projectiles with Oil Panic and kill at 0%. The devs realized how broken this strategy was, and so they made it so that when G&W absorbs a teammate's projectile, it will only do a fraction of the damage upon release. I'm quite sure the devs will see that Incineroar would be too powerful in doubles as it is, and give him the G&W treatment.
Everyone talks about him having a ton of landing lag on aerials but nobody wants to throw out numbers... I counted 11 frames of lag for his nair at 5:18. idk about you guys but that seems pretty low to me
for a Nair that's slightly below average. the rest of his moves are alot laggier. Nair usually has low landing lag
Bro what if m2k mained Mewtwo?
Everytime I watch a video of yours you seem to have more hair growth.
I just watched the video from the beefy smash doods
Zykel me too
lol same, m2k's analysis vids are better tho, at least pre launch, he goes into more detail
I don't know if he'll be that good. Seems a bit too slow and laggy, like even more than Ganondorf (who is also probably stronger with the exception of when Revenge is active)
Hi guys its me you two king
GanonWuffDkMerph.character
lol zangiefs theme
This is going to be broken in teams.
Ganondorf please don't use Neutral B on Incineroar..
Easy one hit KOs from the other side of Palutena's Temple
@@toyinbode4368 Yikes. :(
Lmao yum
Not seeing him do the canadian destroyer... So low, bottom actually. Lowest in All fighter game history. It will cause a incineroaration in the fan base as a whole.
Furry Zangief is playible
Little Mac but better
Is Incineroar waifu?
He seems pretty cool and it looks like he'll be pretty good but I feel like there are way more deserving Pokemon than him
Like who?
@@emc246 Alot but one that comes to mind is Arceus the God of Pokemon who could be like palutana not heavy but floaty
Hes extremely popular in japan. Also my choice of starter in moon so I ain't mad.
First boi
just shave your head man
Really trying to capitalize on the game that ain't even out yet Omg. Just wait a month.
OverstuffedSofa a lot of people are excited about this game and curious about it, what's wrong with that?
*N O F U N A L L O W E D*
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