Stuck Open Fuel Injectors (GDI) Part 2 (cause and fix)
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 9 ก.ย. 2021
- Is it possible to have multiple injectors that are stuck open at the same time? And if so, what is the root cause? In this part 2 of 2 video we focus on the repair and what the root cause was. The car being worked on is a 2016 Ford 1.6L Ecoboost engine
Here is the link to Part 1 • Stuck Open Fuel Inject...
#injector
#Ecoboost
#GDI
#GasDirectInjection
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To trap the ferrous bits in the plastic container use a magnet on the outside of the container, slide it around and it should collect all of the shavings in a tidy little pile.
As a veteran of many carb cleanings always remember that no matter what passage you spray carb cleaner into the passage will always find a way back to spray into your eyes. Great video
Paul, Caleb, and James.
How else are we supposed to keep our eyes clean? It's just like the sting from rubbing alcohol on a cut, right? 😅
"I've got an important oil change to do." Said no mechanic ever!
🤣🤣
"The pump is always pulling off the bottom of the tank. It's not like pulling fuel from the bottom is what ruins it. It's like an old wives' tale that never dies." Thank for saying it. I hope somebody was listening. Condensation and rust may have been problematic in the past, but those issues are long gone with today's fuel and modern cars. Again, thanks for clearing that up.
"I've got 18 fire extinguishers" No problem!
Excellent video, always like how your brother walks in with the cigar stump, like a real Columbo🤣. Editing is always spot on and good for laughs. Thanks for sharing and caring!! Have a great weekend!!
😂
Wow. I just had a customer scrap their 2013 Fusion for this exact issue prior to me diagnosing it. I will save the car now. This saved me hours of figuring out why three of the four injectors inexplicably clogged.
Some of the metal shavings comes from the metal spring or the valve that moves within the high pressure pump. It tends to clog the injectors and the pressure sensor. Eventually you to start from the tank and come forward cleaning out the shavings. This is good practice
We have the same issue with many common rail diesel engines. After cleaning out metal fragments as much a possible, we always drop a magnet in the fuel tank and leave it in to collect any that has been missed.
Great showstopper you went the extra distance to prevent catastrophic failure. (FIVE STAR) RATING GUYS
My son said “oh, you’re watching Spanner Danner again” 🤣. Quite common over in the UK to change the whole fuel system if the high pressure pump goes in a big way. But normally they last a bit longer than this.
Now after watching this video I will add that it needs basically a whole new fuel system as for the filtration and moving parts flush the lines and hope you got all the metallic chips and debris out of the system. Change out the fuel pump if it has the filter attached to it just to make sure the customer is good to go, plus eat some of the cost for their return business to make sure you don't put the customer into a situation of being homeless.
Now in searching for metal put the manet under the plastic next time as to not contaminate the sample.
So, far I am learning a lot from watching your videos so I'll join the classes as soon as I can afford to do so.
Thank you!
Great video Paul, really appreciate the follow up at the end having closure to the videos and confirming the fix is a major reason i like your videos fantastic.
Fitted an inline filter before the HP pump. As had no filters external after pump tank filter. HP had 2 very small internal filters. I removed them when fitted inline filter. Went onto limp mode sensor wasn't seeing high pressure. Since doing this 2years ago no problems on my Mitsubishi 3,5 GDI. But well done sticking with it doing flush saved dropping tank opening another can of worms. Best wishes from SA Capetown
Yo Caleb Danner. The videos are super bro. Thanks again fellas
good job with the car guys i always like seeing you 3 work together and seeing what you think about things just putting your mind out there and ScannerDanner tell your bother he needs to be in more videos and you did the same thing i was thinking running a line under the hood and just pump the fuel out
I enjoyed the video! The quality and information is second to none! Thanks Guys!
😂😂 the beggining is funny. Great video guys. Blessings from California.
You guys are having far too much fun fixing these cars great job.
I just did one on a cadillac. What a PITA to take off and install.
Honestly I don't see what else it could possibly be! I believe you nailed it!
Caleb, James, and Paul,
Great video, analysis, and explanations as always - thank you!
Paul (in MA)
Thank you!
You are a great , great mechanic Scanner danner... we dont got to many like you in south tx. I enjoy your shows very much..
We love your brother. You 3 make some of the best videos on TH-cam.
german specialty tools sell a great quality GDI injector removal tool. The injectors can actually break on the body if mishandled. Costly if they are seized and need to re-used. Very handy as well if you do GDI injectors on LR4 V8....
That's exactly why I bought that tool also. It saves time and the chance of breaking them.
Yep, removal is made so easy then. And the plastic is easily broken if being twisted like Danner told he did with the vice grips.
I only work on diesel tractors but you guys make this so interesting.. just a bunch of cool guy having fun in a shop! 🤟
Very good brother and Sun. Thanks for your Video Paul. All good for you and your Family.
Another great video by the Danner brothers and son.Everyone stay safe GOD bless.
It's a normal jop here in the Netherlands replace or clean ( replace if the customer want to play for it) don't give guaranty on cleaning
Great video thanks for helping this customer
Superb, Thanks for sharing SD, this one is a great case study👍
SD you hurt yourself twice in this video, but in the end was shocking, that was a serious injury, hope you're fine🙏
Special thanks to James Danner "I've got an important oil change to do" that was new & cool 😎
Thanks Caleb Danner👍
Love you all, Stay Safe❤
Nothing like spendin' a Sunday afternoon with the Danner Bros! Thanks for you warm complements to your viewers! Now you why I jested like I did on the Cadillac OBD1!
YOU could've fix the problem on that by breathin' on it! LOL!
In part one on this...I had a mini thought at first before my last comment on part: That either the pump was somehow putting out way more PSI than it was suppose to...or they were incorrect parts.
Perplexed me as well.
You would've thought those metal pieces would have just stopped up the injectors with those tiny pintle holes!
This Ford is a not a parts cannon...it's a parts cruise missile!
The fact that they require you to replace that metal hose and the 'so called lifetime fuel filter, makes ME think this was by design: to make customers say f**k it, trade it in to buy the newer version!
Awesome video! Two badass bros at work
Hi, Teach!!! Learned A GREAT DEAL today...Thanks:) Note to self, don't forget to wear safety glasses when working on fuel rail cleanings. Also, a recommendation for another video: How to clean the dirtiest/most unorganized shop in PA. With safety glasses of course;) Looking forward to the next one.
Sincerely,
Your favorite student
P.S Sorry for this late message.
Quality learning and laughing Cheers
Excellent video. I really enjoy watching you guys, good wholesome entertainment and learning.
regarding this vehicle, my neighbor has a 2013 Escape with the same engine and fuel system. The whole car is a pig to work on but in fairness it's been somewhat reliable considering 240k miles on the original fuel system. what's scary is the timing belt has never been changed either. she's been warned, just keeps riding on. we'll see how long it can go.
I think Danner is going to be a star in this one looking at the comments. All I could focus on is the tool box, I kept thinking, I hope he doesn’t have to open the bolts/junk drawer or that thing is going over
Great job again tema Danner👍👌🔧
Just a sub-pare design Paul. Great vid!
Nice to be here for a live vid for once! Hey man! from N Florida! 😎
Otc makes the slide hammer attachment for the injectors. I'm a heavy tech at a ford dealership and the tool makes it alot easier to get them out
Safety 7th! Been there man. Your boy putting you on blast is always hilarious for some reason……probably because my kiddos try to do the same when dad screws up. “Why is it red inside!??!?!” Hahahaha. Keep sharing your gifts and faith brother.
You two need to star in a reality show Danner brothers garage
That'd be fun 🙂
@@ScannerDanner Glad you liked it
love your videos. best wishes
Wart apple …..yummy !🤮😳🤣 great video guys ! Always great when the three Amigos get together …keep up the Awesomeness
🤣🤣
Awesome video. Having the same engine in my car, now I know what to do or look for if I ever run into this problem. But hopefully not. Thank you scannerdanner
Tanks for the teaching s d
In diesel applications, when the high pressure fuel pump fails like that it sends metal flakes all around the fuel system. It is recommended to replace the entire fueling system : tank, all the fuel lines, injectors, pump, anything that touches fuel.
Correct. On Volkswagen and Audis it’s under warranty by their stupid lawsuit. It would pay 10 hours to replace entire fuel system. Have to remove timing belt to replace high pressure pump on the Audi A3 tdi. Stupid cars as Paul would say…
36:36 to the end, special thank you to @Hamad Aldeeri for the sand art behind me! I cannot even imagine how much time this took him, nor how he did it! Super awesome.
I haven't get this type of problems at my place. But I do believe those metal shaving most likely coming from the high pressure side. Low side has a strainer before the pump. But the lifetime fuel filter is after the low fuel pump filtering whatever gets in the tank. That filter would filter that right away. Thats just my logic routing where the low fuel pump is between filters (strainer and filter)
A delay in injections is an ECM is looking for a rail pressure first than open injectors. Thanks for the videos. God BLESS
Got it!
Another great video.
It's nice seeing another messy shop. #controlledchaos
Do you and Danner own a lawn mowing business you got plenty of petrol ⛽️. Great video with family in the work shop and having a laugh.😅😂🤣👍🏽
Really enjoyed watching you guys and with how thorough you worked, I'm really impressed. We just don't see low side pumps fail from blowing their guts thru the fuel system, so that's a good call, definitely the high side pump backwashing the fuel system. I am curious if we could have garnered something from graphing the low side fuel pumps amp draw? Might have proven it healthy and made the call a little easier?
Great video 👏🏼
👍 you guys are the best
Good video.
I egged you guys on for something a little pointlessly chaotic in the first video and, oddly enough, you delivered. I definitely didn't expect to see Paul get shot in the face through a fuel rail and then watch him tactically carving his own finger down. Thanks for the laughs, guys.
🤣🤣
Take a big magnet wrap a hose around it put a filter behind.
This you put between the Tank and high pump let customer drive a while then Look for Metall pieces in the filter .
Hope this helps because the metall is in the Tank and it will destroy the other Fuelinjektors.
Thats how we germans do it 😊
Greetings from Germany
Great video 👍
Great job
I had contamination in a Gulfstream GIV years ago. We ran the system and kept changing filters until the system came up clean from our lab. In your situation I would run the fuel through a filter back into the tank until you can visually see no contamination in a clear jar. P.S the contamination on the GIV came from a mechanic not marking a hydraulic drum as bad fluid. The bad drum was with other good drums. I was servicing the aircrafts hydraulic system when I notice the bad fluid. Not a good night on my shift.
LMAO that's one GIGANTIC head!! and I got 18 fire extinguishers plus you need a bath anyway.
well done.
Is there a way to incorporate a second filter? Good video.
Oh shit I was in suspense of whether or not you were gonna have to drop tank !
Brilliant intro.....
Hi Danners, I remember having a discussion with an engineer with respect to what additives one normally finds in todays fuel (petrol and diesel). In his thought prosess he was a bit conserned with the amount of Ethanol, specially now as it rises to 9-10% (earlier it was around 5%, as I understood). Ethanol does not have the lubrication capability, and therefore a typically GDI engine HP fuel pump could be subjected to more wear.
I do not know, and have no proof for the one or other, but I recon if this is the case, more cars will suffer problems with E10 vs E5, but most cars made after/later than the beginning 2000 should be compatible with this fuel. I found quite a few articles abut e5 and e10 on google, some good some bad. I kind of liked one from autotechnician and heycar
Regards
Gremling
By the way, love your videos and e-lecture book. Should have bought the physical book, as my screen now is full of yellow marker pen 🙂
Thank you so much!
"I think it's ok" kills you every time.
It’s pretty standard to see fuel come out of the lines when opening the drivers door on direct injected vehicles. Audi and Volkswagen are like this for sure. And also be careful when reinstalling the injectors. The seal at that bottom around the tips can roll and improperly seat. If this happens it will leak compression out and it will be noticed when the engine is running. Always replace those seals and if you can’t then lube them up with some oil and install carefully. Been burned by this before.
Hey, I hope you doing good. So it only in direct injection were you will have fuel coming out when you open the door?
Not 100 percent sure on all of the models but I can tell you from experience. Audi and Volkswagens are like this. It’s funny because you can remove spark plugs and open the drivers door. And take a flash light and look down into the cylinders and see if you have a stuck open injector. It will spray constantly
As a fellow VW guy who has serviced many TSI engines, I feel you. I really do like the nuances of the TSI engines. They're beautifully engineered IMO.
any debris in the rail would likely go past the nearest injectors and collect toward the dead ends, then keep being swirled around by fuel turbulence and engine harmonics, until it happens to find an exit, which would be an injector. that's when the real trouble starts :)
next time place the magnet below (plastic like the oil bottle with thin oil) to the capture the partials into one clump for a better visual.
Black particles are from the O-rings coming apart due to the wear of the piston alignment in the bore.
Disconnect the primary pump and test for pintle hump?
I didn't much care about the pintle hump and to be honest they are not easy to see on these anyway 😉
Ford thought it was a German car. On VW direct injected engines, the fuel system is very similar. Door open primes the pump. Fuel injectors are seated in the head and take a special slide hammer to remove. They have nylon seals which use a special tool to shape and seat the seal into the injector body. Very neat design if you ask me. With the prominence of DI defines, most parts stores carry the specialty loaner tools to remove and replace the injectors and seals. Unfortunately, the issues we see with these newer turbo charged direct injection engines is mainly caused by neglect. They need high quality fuel and serviced as written in the manual to last. People drive them like their 2005 MPFI Corolla.
The metal flakes could be coming from the Fuel station the Customer is using. As a small Engine TEC I have seen this from fuel station.
One possible idea would be to put a very strong magnet in an appropriate spot in the system to keep the ‘colours’ out of the fuel rail/injectors. I’m not sure if you could do it as I haven’t seen that system close up..just what you showed on camera. Do this before dropping tank to see if there is an accumulation of metal debris then judge whether or not it’s worth it to drop tank…?
Magnet along with or attached to a good inline filter? Just spitballing. 🤷🏻♂️
“Want a little apple with that wart??” Lol
Great video guys. These GDI’s are more fickle about clean fuel than diesel’s are. This is a good video on why you don’t want a GDI engine, good for shops but not the motoring public. When we bought our 2016 Ford Explorer the salesman’s said you sure you don’t want the eco boost 3.5 engine, ha ha, I said absolutely not and I then explained why not.
Since we're on the subject of Direct Injection hi pressure pump problems, I have a similar case and system on a 2014 Jaguar XF 5.0 V8. It utilizes 2 HP pumps mounted on the engine block - cam driven mechanical, and the low pressure pump in the tank.
Problem: code stored for low rail pressure. New supply pump and normal readings, but on high side scanner data shows desired 1460psi on start-up actual about 80-90psi. Replaced both HP pumps with transplant donor engine, same thing- no change. Suspect a restriction. Now here's the thing, all 4 cylinders on the drives side, Bank 2 show misfires, there is also a "rattle same side similar to a chain noise but more pronounced near the injectors. Engine starts and idle good. (by the way this is an engine swap) but restricted performance and bucking under load. Suspect dry firing on injectors (hearing pindle noise- no or low fuel), passenger side normal which is the side fuel from hi pressure pumps supply 1st.
Before I go pulling injectors (which are these exact ones in this video) , I've done them before but they are a real pain in the a_ _ !
Any thoughts out there Paul & crew on options, possible issues? Would make an excellent teaching moment!
I've done high pressure pumps on chevy 1500 pick ups for fuel leak in crank case(rich condition).But never injectors.Great video
What was the web sight that you were looking at for the pump? Thanks good video.
Autonerdz.com
should do an episode With the big head treatment it would be hilarious
Getting chunky since the last time I saw u Bro! Been thinking about u! BTW this is Mouse… hope all is well. Get with me ✌🏾
Mouse! What's up my brother. How have you been? It's been a long time!
Been about 2 months back at the gym 💪, I did slack off a bit over the past few years and age is catching up with me. But I got this. Wish we were lifting together again!
This is why I like point's, condenser's & carburator's. Fuel injection is fine but I would rather be blown.
If you don't have a paint filter, you can use a coffee filter, it's just a little bit more restrictive.
SUBSCRIBED! ❤
Damn these are going to be maintenance nightmares.
I remember when I changed my in tank fuel pump it was elevated off the bottom of the actual tank ,so even if you ran it low probably wouldn't have showed too much debris
all those flakes caleb should have put in a unicorn exploding lol
😂
Any experience with Chrysler crossfire immobilized problems?
How's the low pressure pump? There should be some kind of fuel filter also.
instead of using the fuel "prime" function, connect scan tool and manually run the pump full flow through hose into a large container and rattle all the lines around while it's pumping.
heck even feed it into a tall glass jar/vase inside a bucket, the glass will catch the heavy debris and overflow into the bucket.
probably wise to run multiple gallons out that way to be sure it's clean or if there's an in tank issue, my last worry would be wasting fuel! just pour it off leaving debris in bottom or pump back into tank through a filter
Guys...check around the opening of the fuel filler neck for rust!
Have you done anything on fully electric cars, ie Tesla ?
The shops I’ve worked at over 20 yrs were all commission based pay so getting all the brains together with differing techniques were very seldom unless there was a car checked by everyone and nobody could figure it like a stalling Buick 3.8 a guy changed the MAP and it finally got to me and on scanner it was showing battery voltage when running and long story short the ground wire under coil pack was loose sparking causing the stalling I like a group of 2-3 good mechanics going over a problem child car
I’ve only just recently found your channel and every one is brilliant, I was shocked to hear you say there’s not a changeable filter on the line, do you think it would be worth fitting one in between the tank and engine and between the bleed back line and engine, maybe??
I don't (add a fuel filter) and that is because of liability. This car has been fine since the repair. But if there is ever a question about debris, the tank should be removed and cleaned.
Thank you so much and I'm glad you found me!
BTW welcome to the channel and thank you!
I was wondered how scotty could have more subs and views then you and I think I figured it out. Most people that watch scotty are looking for that magical fix which we all know there isn't one. They're looking for scotty to tell them what's wrong. They dont want to learn the system.
The cloudy fuel at 33:58 is a bit concerning since it got pumped towards the end when the fuel level dropped, could it have been water or possibly wrong fuel in the tank? The gdi pump would eat itself up quickly and send metal throughout when the lift pump supplies contaminated fuel. I’m thinking enough water might have been in the tank from a bad fuel station or after several fuel-ups which could have caused a phase separation if there is ethanol in the gas.
agree, but I think it was the lighting, I didn't mention it again and remember thinking it was okay
Water is heavier than fuel so it sist on the bottom and gets sucked in first.
In my car about one a year or every other i put a can of condensate remover in the tank as it makes the water blend with the fuel and gets it all out and burn without any form of water droplets, just flushes it out.
Did it on my lawn mower also that had maybe 3 tablespoons of water in the tank, and a half bottle and it was gone within a minute 😁
I don't have a bore scope so Ive cut a long thin piece of paper towel card board tubing to stick in the bore to see if I have fuel spraying when I turn the key on. It should be soaked in gas.
I was wondering Scanner Danner, what triggers the blinking check engine light?
Rich 02 sensor?
I have a 2000 ford Windstar 3.8L with a misfire on number and a blinking chk eng light.
Also wondering if a cylinder is being drowned in gas will it also cause a plug not to fire giving the false allusion that there is a coil or plug wire issue when using the glass inline spark plug tester?
A catalyst damaging misfire is generally what makes the check engine light blink
@@ScannerDanner Ok thx! It turns out this time I had a dead #4 fuel injector. It would not buzz at all on my tester and read 2.1 ohms while all others 12.2 to 12.5 ohms.
I was worried I had a blown head gasket because Id been loosing coolant. A coolant pressure test revealed that the lower intake was leaking coolant so retorqued all that put new injector in and its running good.😀
I would use a coffee filter and pour the fuel into a clean container as to not waste fuel but also to filter out the smaller pieces and the white background is a good contrast for specs.
I forget what we used
@@ScannerDanner lol yeah it’s an old video but I’m still going to comment and like the videos.
Play the begging of the video for my little kids, they almost die laughing 😆 🤣