Yes still upset. The video shares concepts that are relevant to a standard online merchant application. If I'm doing anything else, like event hosting, or person to person transactions, etc, I don't have the time or inclination to preemptively implement a complex strategy to deal with reducing refunds. I just want to post a simple payment link and be done with it. I wasn't expecting to deal with refunds. I hosted an event, and covid-19 hits so I have to cancel. PayPal gets to profit from our misfortune. The formula 0.30 + 0.29x conveys a fixed cost of performing the transaction plus a cut of the revenue. This seems reasonable, and that's what I signed up for. The actual numbers are subject to competition, so it's all good. But if there's no revenue (after a refund), I don't think it's fare for PayPal to get a cut. It is fair for PayPal to get something for processing the transaction though. This is why I think it is fair to keep the fixed $0.30. That wouldn't be a hardship for me, and it obviously more than covers the incremental cost to PayPal of processing the transaction and refund. The only rationale for PayPal to pocket the 2.9% revenue share is simply that it's a source of profit for PayPal that their customer probably neglected to consider when comparing to other options. In that sense the policy functions as a hidden fee, in other words, a source of free money that their customer wasn't expecting to pay. As such it represents low integrity on the part of PayPal, which is why I'm not inclined to do business with them. Square could easily have implemented the same policy, but they don't. They revert the entire fee, and don't even keep the fixed part. This indicates that they are willing to forgo easy free money in favor of keeping their customers happy. I'm committed to rewarding businesses that operate in that way. Which is why I intend to switch to Square, and why I'm encouraging members of my community to do the same (many are also event leaders). It's more about the principle than the money. I only lost a few hundred, but PayPal will lose much more. I feel that competition in a free market functions best when everyone is operating with maximum awareness. Any time a company profits from an unexpected expense to their customer, that represents a market failure. The remedy is for people like me to make a lot of noise about it. The covid-19 outbreak provides a great opportunity for this. I'm sure there are others in exactly the same situation as me, and I know how to reach them. I'm willing to hear your response though.
Joe xx . I am a buyer and the item I bought was really not as advertised. After weeks of e-mailing the supplier they were willing to refund me 20% back. I was not happy with this and went through a very tiring process to create a dispute with PayPal. They said I am eligible for a refund if I mail the item back to the address they provide and add the tracking information. I did exactly that. I paid for the shipping and thought at least I will get a refund now. WRONG. After waiting several weeks, out of the blue I got a message from PayPal. Sorry, your claim was denied. Reason: Because I did not add the tracking information as requested. Yet, I did. You can even go to the case ( which is now closed) and see the tracking details as well as photos of the receipt and package. So, no Joe, PayPal does not always choose the side of the buyer. This seller got away with advertising a very desirable beautiful item ( photos and videos showing this) and then shipping me a cheap knockoff. I was so disappointed and felt cheated. I really thought I would be able to get my money back because I used PayPal. But no. I think this supplier cheated thousands of people like me and are getting away with it because they somehow managed to get PayPal on their side. Maybe because they are a big client or maybe they are paying PayPal to close cases against them. Who knows? All I know is that something very unjust and sinister is going on. Thanks for reading my runting on. Hope you as a seller feel better that it happens to buyers too.
The same is true with any payment processor. If the buyer files a claim with their card bank, the card processor has to cover it. In these cases the buyer would have to provide tracking to prove the item had been returned back to the seller, and then the refund would be issued.
As you mentioned, Square is still showing that they will refund you your fees when you have to refund your customer. However, if you look at their fee structure you will see they charge 3.5% for "manually entered" transactions, which would be everything you process on your website. So you want to trade a higher rate for ALL of your transactions in exchange for a refund on the (hopefully) few occasions that you have to refund your customer? "Don't bite off your nose to spite your face". I completely agree that competition and free market with maximum awareness is the way to go. With that mind, PayPal is simply the best value. That's the only reason I back them the way I do, as a software developer integrating payment solutions. This particular situation you are facing is unfortunate. The fact remains, though, that if you had processed the original sign-ups as Authorizations, you could have simply Voided those Authorizations once you knew the event couldn't be held. This is a good practice to avoid refunds for any reason an event might get canceled. If you use Square, this same practice should be done in order to avoid unnecessary movement of money across the bank networks. If more sellers had been doing that, PayPal probably would have never had to make this change, and I wouldn't be surprised at all if we see Square making this change before long as well. So again, shop around, and if you find one that really does beat PayPal overall, I'm all for it. Please let me know. Square isn't the one, though. I'd much rather pay 2.9% (or lower with higher volume) than 3.5% for all of my transactions, and combine that with a proper procedure that helps me avoid refunds.
If what you are saying is true (and I have no reason to believe it's not) then call PayPal and they should be able to open the case and look at it again. If there really is tracking in the dispute details that shows the returned item is delivered to the address it should be, and the system is saying it's not, then they will fix that for you. I would recommend you give them a call, get them to look at what you're seeing, and logically it would make sense that it's clear a mistake was made with the automated system. They can reverse that for you. Just be kind and patient with them (especially now...might be difficult to get on the phone for a while) and they will help. If all else fails, and you funded the payment with a credit card or debit card, then you could file a dispute directly with your card bank. You can show them the tracking info proving return, and you would get your money back that way.
I believe this practice is illegal and should has final in court. As soon as I send Bank Transfer to somebody I agree to pay transfer fees (can use different way if dissagree). By selling here on ebay if someone buys, pays and request cancel it is beyond our hands. The fees should be passed to the buyer at least because it is the buyer's fault not the seller. PAYPAL SEEMS TO BE A SCAMMER! , however, everybody knows that SCAM is a crime... I have contacted my local lawyer and been confirmed that such practice is at least suitable for CLOSER look by some financial authorities. Paypal should be classified as bank and be subjected to banking law , however, it is not. This "organisation" seems to be illegal at all. We all should sign global petition against paypal. This is not ethical what they are doing. They simply scam people, there is no question about it.
So with a given transaction you have the following parties: The seller, the buyer, the eBay platform, the PayPal platform, and card issuing banks. eBay allows people to buy things and then cancel without penalty. eBay does NOT provide the Authorization and Capture feature that would solve this problem. A feature that both PayPal and Adyen Payments (the payment processor behind eBay Managed Payments) provides. The buyer pulled the trigger and then canceled on you. The card issuing banks will almost always award disputes to the card holder (the buyer) if a chargeback occurs. PayPal simply allowed you the buyer to send a payment quickly, easily, and securely, and allowed the seller to receive that payment quickly, easily, and securely. They provided their service exactly as advertised. Yet they are the ones that you blame for this problem? It makes no logical sense. Why don't you get mad at eBay for not providing the Auth/Capture functionality that would solve this problem for good? Why does the disdain immediately go towards PayPal? I just do not understand why that is the natural reaction of so many when they are only one small piece of the puzzle, and they did EXACTLY what they said they would, and charged you their fee for it.
@@angelleye From what planet are you from? Are you serious by telling this bull? Did you sell anything on ebay? I guess not. Paypal keeps our money (billions of dollars, pounds, euros, etc). By having this money they can make even bigger money. Only this should be enough, however, paypal charge us unusual fees comparing to the banks. Do you know any bank who charge fee which is percentage on total amount? Ha? Do you know how much paypal takes on exchange currency? Probably the highest rates on the world!. Paypal became greedy and some day it will be GAME OVER for this company. Paypal shouldn't charge the seller if the buyer decides to cancel an order because it is beyond the seller hands. This is basically a scam. Can you imagine that someone has access to your bank account and transfer some money (your money) somewhere without your permition? This is exactly what paypal do. Ebay and paypal should create some rules regarding this issue and maybe charge the buyer for changing their mind... Seller shouldn't pay for somebody's mistakes. So don't be ridiculous. Just ask your local lawyer about this practicles and you will be clarified...
Maybe not stealing if its a smalll transaction. Thats ok. Understandable. But what if you refunded a large amount of money, you didn't get any money from it but you need to still pay the fee?
It's super bonkers. I put in a large order (thousands) with a distributor last week, then realized I had over ordered some products. I asked them to reverse it so I could put through the proper amount. They told me they couldnt, because the processing fee would be $120+. Turns out they could, because the fee doesnt take effect until Thursday-- but man, going forward, dont make a mistake, because youll be stuck. If they did have this fee, the distributor would either have to call paypal and beg for a refund, or I would have to pay it to continue doing business with the distributor OR they would just refuse to refund the order because of the fee. They say its "Industry Standard". Which is nonsense. No other company does this. They WANT it to be industry standard... but its not, and hopefully it wont be, because its dumb and very customer unfriendly for both buyers and sellers. Time to drop paypal wherever you can... even if youre not a seller, youll need to be ready for sellers to be unwilling to cancel transactions because of the fee.
It seems that you didn't watch my video. I provide details directly from the terms of service for other processors where they show they do not refund fees on refunded orders. Also, the person you made this purchase from could adjust their procedure to do Authorization and Capture (again explained in the video) and could have avoided this altogether. If they had simply Authorized the order, and then you wanted to cancel it, they could Void the authorization and no fee would have ever been charged in the first place. That's really what triggered this change. Too many unnecessary refunds were being processed because people are not following proper procedures.
@@angelleye I commented before finishing watching. I see you compared them to merchant services Ive not heard of (though, maybe they are huge and ive just yet to run into them). You didnt compare them to Square; which has no fee on returns, and refunds the fees. You also didnt compare to traditional credit card processors that use Verifone and similar hardware, like my stores use-- which likewise, returns fees (at least the one I use does). So in my experience, this is a total deviation from the normal... and as my example demonstrates, makes doing business harder and more expensive.
@@MikeSaltzman Adyen is the processor that eBay is now using for their Managed Payments system. I specifically used them because lots of eBay users are making comments like "I'm so glad eBay is leaving PayPal". The processor they are replacing PayPal with not only doesn't refund the fees, but also charges additional for the refund itself. Square is still showing that they will refund the fees. However, their fees in general are higher than PayPal charges for web transactions. I'd rather deal with 1% or less refund rates than pay higher fees on every single transaction I process. Also, I wouldn't be surprised to see them make this change now that PayPal has. They tend to follow their lead on many things like this. I've worked with many different processors, and most of them do indeed keep fees when you refund. Square and Verifone, like you mention, are hardware based primarily. Square is more expensive on all transactions for integration into a website. I'd be curious to see what Verifone fees are for integrating into a website. I'm actually not finding any info about that on their website (although I haven't really dug deep.) Since they're doing hardware, POS processing, I would guess that they are using an Interchange+ model. So there again, if you integrate that service into your website you will likely be paying higher fees for all transactions than you are paying with PayPal's flat rate. Any keyed transaction at all, especially on a website, is going to be a "mid-qualified" or "non-qualified" rate, which can be anywhere from 2.5% - 5% depending on a variety of variables. Just make sure you study all of these types of things before deciding to make a change. I truly feel that simply adjusting procedures to use Authorization and Capture will solve the problem for most people.
Its a couple years later now, and i can report that I've basically not needed to cancel an order like this since... so its more or less been a non-issue. The real issue I've seen is tons and tons of scam sellers using Paypal to perpetrate wrong item scams-- and using Paypals systems to help facilitate their frauds at scale.
I just found out about this in the worst way possible...I had $170 balance in paypal, I sell something on ebay for $3,500 the buyer immediately has remorse and wants to cancel the order, so after refunding them i look at my paypal balance and its now $60...so I was confused where the $110 went...i call paypal and they made me aware of this policy. So basically i lost $110 all because a buyer decided he didn't want the product anymore.
As I mentioned in this video and in articles I've written about this, the solution to that problem is to use Authorization and Capture. PayPal (and all payment processors) provide this functionality. However, it's up to platforms like to eBay to make this available to its sellers. Unfortunately, eBay does not include this functionality. As such, I believe the problem is with them, and that's where we should be aiming our concerns about this matter. With Authorization and Capture, when the order first comes through it would be Authorized, but no money would be moved yet. Only when you Capture that Auth does the money get moved, and only then does a fee get charged. If a buyer cancels before you capture, you simply Void the Auth, and no fee would have ever been charged in the first place. Again, if eBay had this functionality implemented it would eliminate this problem that is indeed very common on their platform.
When a person pays by credit card (not debit) a large percentage of the fee is the Intetchange Fee which pays for reward programs. When a refund is done the card programs refund back a set interchange fee for card not present sales which depends on the card type but is about 2.20%. So PayPal is keeping around 2.20% of the interchange refund that they paid out to the card brands originally to fund reward and miles programs. So they are almost triple dipping thier revenue and keeping the refund given back by the interchange program. That means they were make (for arguements sake) 0.75% as thier fee after paying association fees and IC fees by getting back say a Reward Card Not Present IC fee of 2.20% they are making 2.95% instead of 0.75% that is over 3X the revenue than the original transaction. I think PayPal should at a min give the seller back the interchange refund fee or a certain percentage of the orig fee paid. FYI- I was a merchant sales officer for 15 years for a top 10 bank. This I think is unfair that PayPal is keeping money that is being returned by the card brands interchange programs. For 2 decades they gave it all back to turn around and say no more under the guise that all the other kids play that way is wrong I believe. I think a certain portion should be refunded, not all but more than 50%. That is my opinion.
The card programs don't always refund back, though. That's part of the problem. The interchange change have literally hundreds of variables involved for what will get charged at transaction time, and based on some of those variables, the result of a refund can be affected. There are just too many if's, and's, and but's involved, and that's why most processors have been keeping original fees after refunds all along. PayPal was offering a perk that few others do by doing this. As of now, Square is the only one I can see that does it all, but they have lots of other things to consider like the fact that all of your transactions would be charged a higher fee when compared with PayPal, so it wouldn't be good to switch to them over this. Also, I won't be surprised at all to see them make the same change with their policy soon. The fact is there are plenty of other things that people can do to avoid this problem...a problem that will happen with nearly every processor out there. So rather can make claims about how rotten the biggest one is (even though they're not doing anything different than everybody else) I feel we should learn to adjust our procedures to keep this from being a problem in the first place.
I didn't pay any attention to this Paypal "Theft Policy" until I had an Ebay buyer request cancellation of a $2000 camera sale. Silly me, I thought Paypal fees were payment for a service rendered. Nope, just an excuse to steal $68 from me.
You did pay for services rendered. You used their system to accept a payment quickly, easily, and securely. When your buyer canceled, you also used their system to process the refund quickly, easily, and securely. You could easily have done all of this using checks in the mail. Of course, then it would have taken a lot longer and caused you to spend time with mail. As I mentioned in the video, the simple solution to the problem you are outlining here is to use Authorization and Capture. PayPal provides this functionality. eBay has chosen NOT to include this functionality on their platform. Why? Who knows. But why don't you complain to them instead of PayPal? PayPal provides a simple solution, and eBay isn't using it. How is that PayPal's fault?
@@MarcoDaNub I am passionate about supporting small business. That's why I do what I can to make sure they understand the details about things like this and don't move forward with blinders on. Otherwise, they'll just keep running into the same problems.
Yes [aypal are making a fortune doing this it is daylight robbery and behold this account and video he is right up there defending them it is insanity ha
What can I do if PayPal refuses to refund me after I did everything they said ( Sent the item back to the address they gave me and added the tracking information on the case) PayPal closed the case without warning in the seller’s favor stating the reason that aI did not enter the tracking information as requested. Yet... I did add it and it is there listed in the case file. What is up with that? Now, not only did I waste time and energy but am out of my item that I paid for as well as the money spent on shipping. How unfair. Not cool PayPal. I thought I am protected when using PayPal. Clearly there is no guarantee even when you do everything according to the terms.
I lost $4500 through a PayPal scam transaction i was really affected i tried all options for recovery but non was helpful, i heard of hackbeign_ on insta i thought he was a bot but i actually got my money Refunded. Try him if you wa..nt he is 100% legit.
So, if someone's out to hurt your business, all they would have to do is order a high dollar amount from your site and then cancel it all. You would then be hit with the high fee from paypal. Paypal is just unethical at this point. I'll be moving my business over to Square asap.
Not if you follow the tips I outlined in this video, no. You would not pay any fees at all, and it would be nothing but a big waste of their time to do that. Take a look at Square's fees. They charge 3.5% for keyed transactions (which would be everything on your website, of course) vs. PayPal's 2.9%. So you're going to trade paying a higher fee for ALL of your transactions just to get a refund in the rare instances that you have to submit a refund?
Instead of refunding it is possible to issue a credit note to the customer, so they can use that credit with their next order. Many customers will agree to that as they often want to return for more. Regarding Paypal they should implement some kind of ACCEPT firewall for all payments that are sent to the seller. Seller then accepts the payment once they verify that all items are in stock. And if the seller wants a partial payment they accept a custom amount. Stripe does this, but Paypal does not. Too bad for Paypal, that's why many people quit using Paypal, unfortunately. Another thing with Paypal is their fees no longer 2,9% but more like 4% to 5% now.
It all doesn't make sense! The return fee should be flat and not depend on the amount ($1 for small amount, $2 for medium, $3 for large)! because their servers doesn't care if it's $10000 or $100, they don't really doing hard job returning the charge... no humans or real investigation is involved! And overall it's stealing! Because the fees include buyer and seller protection etc..... meaning if the buyer just changed their mind and want refund... PayPal just have to use nothing but a bit of server refund feature... which DOES NOT cost 3% out of $1000 refunded! and no one asked of used protection, no people involved, no investigation, no much server power used!
I can understand your frustration, but I have to respectfully disagree. Servers require man-power to administer and maintain them. This includes hosting charges, security, backups, performance improvements, and constant review to ensure everything is running smoothly. The banks also charge based on percentages, so countering that with a flat fee simply doesn't work. It's not stealing because you used their service and you were charged accordingly for that service. If you provide your service to somebody, and then they say nevermind I actually didn't need that, are you just going to say okay no problem? Of course, not. Yet you expect PayPal to not only give you their service to charge the original payment, but also give you their service to process the refund...all for free? They were doing this as a perk for a long time, but sellers got lazy (and didn't educate themselves) so it became too much unnecessary drag on the system. That's why this change was made. If you have a problem with buyers "changing their mind" then you should be using Authorization and Capture, as I mentioned in the video. There is no fee for an Auth, and if the order gets canceled you simply Void it. No fee charged, so no fee needs to be refunded. I would suggest that you educate yourself a bit more on this, and adjust your procedures accordingly. This really should not be a big problem for you. If it is, you need to make adjustments.
@@angelleye I see. Make some sense, I believe - regarding returned transactions and fees should not be based on amount but should be flat rate (small, medium, large amounts). 1. Do Ebay use Authorization and Capture? 2. What about Amazon Seller return fees? The same, they won't refund the fees as well? 3. What about if you directly Visa and MasterCard, same won't refund the fees? Very interesting, and curious. Thanks a lot!
@@ALPHAGENXCORP No, I have not seen Auth and Capture available in eBay. PayPal and Adyen both provide it (as do all payment processors) but eBay has not implemented it into their platform. I don't even see it included in their new "eBay Managed Payments" platform, which is very surprising to me. In my opinion we should be sending feedback their way to get that done. I am not very experienced with Amazon myself, but based on this thread it seems it's not quite as simple as will they or won't they. Seems it might be more of a per instance sort of thing based on a variety of variables: sellercentral.amazon.com/forums/t/does-amazon-return-their-fees-on-returned-items/54303/3 To process Visa/MasterCard/etc. you're going to need to get setup with a merchant account processor of some sort. PayPal is one, Adyen is another, Stripe, Square, and many more. They all have their own policies and procedures, and of course they compete with each other for business. The only one I see still advertising that they will refund fees is Square. However, Square's fees for processing keyed transactions (which would be the case for all of your website orders) are higher than PayPal's in general. As such, you'd be paying higher fees on every order in exchange for getting your fee refunded in the few instances (hopefully) that you're processing refunds. There are many things to consider when looking for payment processing services. In my experience, when all factors are considered, PayPal is the best, and this refund policy variable is very lightweight compared to other variables in the equation.
The problem is lack of PREAUTH (pre-authorization) function at Paypal. Here's one example of how EXPENSIVE it can become to receive payments: Buyer sends more money during a purchase than they should. Let's say they pay you $2500 instead of $1000. Paypal fee $110 which is 4,4% and yes, Paypal is now charging up to 5% or even more. Then you realize the stuff is not in stock and you refund say $1500 back to the customer since you have nothing else to send to the customer in order to avoid refunding and losing all that money to Paypal fees. So instead of paying $44 to receive $1000 you end up paying $110 to receive $1000 which is a whopping 11%! Well, at least Stripe has preauthorization procedure which prevents this from happening, yet Paypal does not have a preauth. I asked Paypal support what can I do to prevent this from happening and Paypal wrote they have no protection from this kind of overpayment happening. I had someone send $1 multiple times and within seconds place a chargeback. Paypal does not even have protection from this kind of nasty behaviour from happening. Not even a possibility to block these kind of people by IP or by their email address. Nothing.
@@angelleye how would you disagree? Do you work for them? You probably have some influence... why else make the video. I agree though... they are theives... they make profit and reputation from transactions, not refunds. To stop doing refunds? It's a BIG TIME THIEF MOVE to make.
@@polishpat95 No, I don't work for them. I am a payment integration specialist, and in my experience and humble opinion, PayPal is simply the best overall payment processing solution. If you can point me to another payment processor that is better, I'd love to review the details, and if they really are, potentially consider switching my recommendation. As I said in the video, they provide a service which you are utilizing whether you refund a payment or not. In fact, when you refund the payment, you're utilizing their service twice. Why should you get that service for free? The marketplace has set the price for payment processing, and PayPal is very competitive in that market. They all keep fees when you refund except for Square at this point, but Square charges a higher rate for all of your transactions in the first place, so that's really not a good trade. So I am curious, who will you be using besides PayPal?
I don't work for PayPal. I own my business, Angell EYE, where we do web development, and we specialize in payment integration. We work with PayPal and many other processors, but PayPal is generally what I recommend for people because it's quite simply the best all-around option for payment processing. Even if I did work for PayPal, though, what specific objection(s) do you have about anything I've said in this video?
@@angelleye ok the fact that you accept this change and have no concerns about it. I have been selling on eBay for 4 years and have sold 180k worth of items last year. During the summer of 2019 I had a customer order 4k worth of items to a car park, the transaction was cancelled because it was clearly a scam but if this were to happen now I'd have to pay £310 which is a lot of money.
@@KrooNfps You clearly didn't watch my video or read my article on this. It would be great if you would do so before commenting in the future. As I mentioned in the video, the simple solution for fees on canceled orders is to use Authorization and Capture. In fact, had people been doing this more like they should be, PayPal likely would have never had to make this change. If you Authorization a payment it holds the funds so that you can capture them when you are ready to ship. If the order is canceled for any reason, you simply Void the Authorization, and no fee is ever charged to begin with. The problem with eBay is that they do not provide this functionality in their platform. PayPal, and all other payment processors, provide this as a standard feature. It's not their fault that eBay doesn't implement it. eBay's new Managed Payments Platform is built on top of Adyen Payments, which also supports Auth and Capture. However, I still do not see any evidence that PayPal has implemented this functionality. eBay is the one you want to be complaining to here. Not the payment processor(s).
@@angelleye You are not reading the comments carefully. KrooN is using Ebay. Same as me. I watched your video very carefully. I wish there was an "Authorization and Capture" feature on Ebay, but ther isn't. Around 50% of the buyer's on Ebay are really irresponsible, they aren't reading the item's description. I have users buying the wrong product 2 or 3 times before buying what they really need. PayPal is charging me 4 - 4.5% on average and that is not good at all for my business. It increases overhead by quite a lot to communicate with every user. I sell 50 items a day and it is impossible to get in touch with them before they pay for an item, or before i ship an item. Maybe PayPal should make a move to make buyers as responsible as possible before making a non well thought purchase? But again, why would they do that, to loose transactions? I will be building a website soon and I am personally looking to find a more friendly "non industry standard" processor. Thanks again for the vid.
@@hondapartseurope9931 The problem is at eBay, not PayPal. You said yourself, they don't provide the Auth and Capture functionality. How is that PayPal's fault? Why aren't you throwing hate at eBay? This has nothing to do with PayPal. When you switch to eBay's Managed Payments platform, which is now using Adyen payments, they still don't include Auth and Capture. Are you going to blame Adyen then, even though just like PayPal, they do provide Auth/Capture functionality? If you were selling on your own website with PayPal, Adyen, PayLeap, Square, Stripe, or literally ANY other payment processor you could easily do Authorizations and avoid this problem altogether. It's only when you add eBay to the equation that this becomes a problem. So again, why do you blame PayPal for that? I don't understand your logic. This is the same thing I said to Kroon. I did read his comment, and I replied accordingly.
Hi i got a refund how much time does it take for a refund to process ?Also do people face a lot problem getting their refund with 2-7 business or are there any steps to follow apart from emailing paypal thanks
If you paid with PayPal, and then you got a notice that your payment has indeed been refunded, the typical time is 3 - 5 business days depending on the banks involved. The refund would go back to whatever the original payment source was. This is industry standard.
Another way to offset PayPal not refunding their fee can be passed on to the buyers by informing them, after they ask for a refund, that PayPal does not refund their processing fee.
how do i set up "authorize only, capture later" for my ebay account? i'm sick of buyers giving me BS reasons to request a refund, usually stemming from them not reading the description, or lying about return reason when its really a buyers remorse reason.
Unfortunately, eBay has not implemented this option into their platform. PayPal provides it, and so does Adyen Payments, which is what the eBay Managed Payments Platform is built on. In no case, though, have I seen them offer Authorization and Capture as a feature. This is a glaring problem with eBay right now, and they need to address it.
I gave up on PayPal and switched to WooPayments(Stripe reseller); however I found out that they also will not refund fees now. Does anyone have an update solution on payment gateways that don't keep these fees?
If this is really that big of a problem for you, just like I mentioned in this video, I would suggest you make adjustments to avoid so many returns. Happy customers are the answer to your problem no matter who you're processing with. By the way, I would suggest you switch back to our plugin because it gives you PayPal and all of its button stack features as well as Direct Card processing just like Stripe...but with a lower fee. So if you do have to process a refund you won't be losing as much as you would be with Stripe. Also as mentioned in the video you can do Authorization and only capture when you know it'll be good without a refund. Or you can simply make a refund policy that says you're going to keep 5%. Lots of options.
All you are talking about is it cost money to refund, sure it may cost a few cents , but the fees include not just the cost, but juicy profits for PayPal. But let me tell you, it cost even more money for sellers to process returns and restock products, let alone in a refund situation, the seller will be losing all revenue, so what a shame for PayPal not only recover its cost but also retain its juicy profits when sellers are losing everything
I hate the new eBay/paypal changes. They really only care about buyer . If ur the seller ur out of luck Sold something 2 weeks go. A graphic card for $630-18 shipping . Buyer was using the item for 2 weeks than decided he didn't want it (buyer Remorse). Not only did I have to sent another 18$ Shipping label but the 20$ PayPal fee isn't refundable. So I'm out 56$ out of my pocket. Even tho I said no return n that I would only refund the minus transaction fee/ Shipping if decided to return. But I couldn't even do that. I'm done with PayPal n eBay.
Yes, it can be frustrating. My question for you, though...who are you going to switch to for payment processing? The only processor I'm seeing right now that still advertises they will refund fees is Square. However, if you study their fee structure they show higher rates for "keyed" transactions than PayPal, which would be every transaction entered on your website, of course. So you're going to trade fees on refunds for higher fees on everything? That doesn't sound like a good trade. Also, I wouldn't be surprised at all to see them change their policy before long. As mentioned in the video, the other options all typically show they will not refund fees when you refund your buyer. Are you going to go to cash/check/money order only? That's always an option, of course. Unfortunately, a "no return" policy is really useless these days. Not because of PayPal or other processors, but because of the card issuing banks. If a buyer files a dispute with the card issuing bank, they are going to side with them more often than not. That is their customer, and they want them to be happy to continue using their products. When that happens, PayPal can't do much about it other than put the procedures in place to make sure you get your item back in exchange for the refund. Again, all payment processors follow this same standard procedure. If this is something that is happening enough that it's becoming an issue for you, I would suggest that you need to reconsider the products you are selling, or do some additional due diligence on your buyers before shipping expensive products. "Buyer's remorse" means they weren't happy enough with the product to want to keep it. Maybe that product just isn't something you want in your product line anymore. Maybe focus on the stuff that's so cool and kicks so much ass that people would never want to return it. Or again, maybe you need to add an additional layer of due diligence into your procedure. You could process orders as Authorization so no fee occurs, and then contact the buyer directly to make sure they are fully comfortable with what they are getting and all of the details about condition, quality, what to expect, etc. It's up to you as the business owner to make these decisions based on all these different options and possible procedures. You'll need to consider these things no matter who you process payments with.
I lost $4500 through a PayPal scam transaction i was really affected i tried all options for recovery but non was helpful, i heard of hackbeign_ on insta i thought he was a bot but i actually got my money Refunded. Try him if you want he... is 100% legit.
I had to refund a buyer on a transaction due to his verified shipping address being incorrect. I could not contact paypal to resolve this due to covid19 so I contacted ebay. Ebay said the policy is to cancel the order and refund the buyer and have them re-purchase after he corrected the issue. I was not refunded the pay pal fee when I refunded the customer due to a bad verified address, and the buyer did not re-purchase.
So the way you leave that comment, it seems that you're upset at PayPal about this issue..?? My question would be, why? First, you have a buyer that did not provide a proper shipping address. I'm a little unclear on that, but are you sure this person wasn't trying to scam you? When people purchase something and then later try to get you to change the address, it's usually because they know you won't be covered by Seller Protection if you ship to a different address, and they're trying to scam you. The fact that he didn't follow through with a re-purchase after you canceled the order is further evidence that he may have been a scammer. Either that or he is legitimate and simply wasn't keeping his info updated properly. Either way, the buyer, the first party involved in this transaction, is causing problems. Second, you are selling on eBay. As mentioned in the video, Authorization and Capture is the best way to avoid this problem with canceled orders. PayPal makes this feature available. eBay does not include that feature in their platform. If they allowed you to take payments as Authorizations, and then only Capture those Authorizations when you are shipping the product, then you could simply Void the Authorization when an order is canceled, and no fee will have ever been charged in the first place. eBay does not provide this, though. So eBay, the second party involved in this transaction, is causing problems. PayPal provided the exact service they said they would provide. They processed that payment for you quickly and securely, and then they also processed that refund for you quickly and securely. PayPal, the third party in this transaction, is the only one that actually did exactly what they were supposed to, without causing any problems. Why should they not get to keep the fees that you agreed to pay them when they provide the exact service they said they would provide you? Look, I wasn't happy to see this policy change. Of course I'd rather get my fees back in the rare instances that I have to refund my customers. However, as a business owner, I understand perfectly why they've done it, and it's perfectly logical. You (and many others) see the fact that they are not refunding the fee as THE problem with this transaction. Why does the buyer (potential scammer) get a pass? Why does eBay get a pass for not providing basic, standard Authorization/Capture functionality on their platform? Why does the blame and frustration go directly to PayPal? Honest question.
hello. I would like to ask. I send money to my cousin 2x but pending that 2x that I send money. He refund the money to me.. But it no coming in my atm debit card or paypal balance. but I receive refund activities. what should I do?
If PayPal was spending money on infrastructure to process unnecessary refunds, why wouldn't they charge another 0.30 cents once the refund is issued instead of not giving back the seller fee? Wouldn't that be more fair?
Also, I'm not saying that is the primary reason they stopped refunding the fees. It's part of it, though. Primarily, they advertise a rate for a particular service they provide, and they provided that service exactly as they said they would. Just like anything else that gets provided exactly as advertised, you should pay the fee you agreed upon when you decided to use the service. Look, I don't like it when I have to process a refund and I don't see that refunded fee amount any more than you do. I just see it a bit differently, and I decided to adjust my own procedures so that I avoid this as much as possible. That ends up better for everybody. Now I'm not processing as many refunds as I was before, which means fewer unhappy customers, and I'm seeing a better bottom line than I was before, even when I was getting fees refunded.
I'm a little confused. You refunded a payment that was sent to you, or you were given a refund on a payment you sent to somebody else? In either case, check the transaction details of the original payment and you'll see if it shows a refund or not. If PayPal's system shows the refund, then it will hit the bank soon. If PayPal's system doesn't show a refund, then no refund was processed.
Angell Eye, you're full of it, as is PayPal. PayPal was extremely profitable with the old policy. They just want more money. They're the ones who chose to make refunds a cost of doing business, which gave rise to their success. After becoming successful, they reach for a money grab. Did you know they don't charge fees for something called Friends and Family? I'm sure they're incurring a fee there, too. Finally, you're assuming everyone is processing a ton of refunds, which is simply not true.
Full of...logical statements backed by factual evidence..?? ;) I never said they weren't profitable with the original policy. I said there is a cost to it, and there most certainly is. As I mentioned in the video, if people were properly following the procedures for Authorization and Capture, this policy likely never would have been changed because it wouldn't have been such a glaring spot on their annual reports. Yes, of course I know about Friends and Family payments. When they are simply moving cash from a bank account or PayPal balance, and the sender is specifically listing the payment as a gift, then they will allow this with no fee because they don't have to pay the banks for it. When people are processing payments through credit cards there are additional fees PayPal pays for the banks to move the money around on credit accounts like that, and then move it back. This is more costly than cash from a bank or PayPal account balance. That said, people take advantage of this a lot, too, and if that continues this could be taken away as well. I still recommend Venmo for these types of payments anyway (which of course is PayPal owned.) Not sure how you're saying that I assume people are processing lots of refunds. I said IF this is a problem for you, then you must be processing a lot of refunds. If you aren't processing lots of refunds, then this policy change isn't even something you would likely notice because it would have no affect on you. If you aren't processing lots of refunds, but you're still here complaining, then I guess you just like to find things to complain about even when they don't affect you..??
I see you on reddit lots so I'm sure you see how much ebay sellers are affected by this. Buyer's remorse/ inattentive buyers/ etc are a big problem they face, refunding someone for an oopsie is getting harder. Unfortunately the only solution we see so far is to work these eventual losses into your prices, whatever that may entail.
As mentioned in this video, the solution to the problem with buyer's remorse / canceled orders prior to shipment is using Authorization and Capture. Both PayPal and Adyen Payments (the one eBay is using for their Managed Payments platform) provide this functionality. It's up to eBay to make it available to their merchants, and I agree that it's very important for them to do so. Again, though, the payment processors provide it, so eBay is the one causing the headaches for sellers here.
First, I would suggest that if you're processing enough refunds that this is an issue, you should address that problem, and figure out how to reduce your return rate in general. Second, if you don't include PayPal as an option on your site, you are going to lose sales, virtually guaranteed. Conversion rates on websites typically increase by around 23% when adding PayPal as a payment option. Third, Square shows the following on their pricing page: "Payments that are manually keyed-in, processed using Card on File, or manually entered using Virtual Terminal have a 3.5% + 15¢ fee." Every payment you process on your website is going to be a "manually keyed-in" transaction. So you're going to trade 2.9% for 3.5% just so that you can get a refund of that 3.5% in the (hopefully) rare instances that you have to refund your customer? That doesn't seem like a good trade to me. I see some third party websites saying that Square charges 2.9% for "eCommerce". However, I don't see this anywhere on the actual Square website. It's pretty clear about its pricing there, and based on what it says, it's going to be 3.5%. I would suggest you look more into this before making this decision.
Not specifically, as there are many options. Here is a video I did on how to get paid, though, which might be helpful. It's from the seller perspective, but it shows some examples of how the buyer would make the payment, so you could see that. th-cam.com/video/xpcwEM0lbIU/w-d-xo.html
@@BonkNosey You keep saying it's bad without saying why it's bad. Nobody can help you when you're making baseless claims, as I've said numerous times now.
The fee is 2.9% + 30¢. The .30 is what makes it expensive for low dollar items. So a $1.00 payment would be $0.33, which is expensive. For low dollar items like that it's best to use a MicroPayments account (th-cam.com/video/O_nZjfgVkig/w-d-xo.html). MicroPayments charges 5% + 5¢, so the fee in that case would only be $0.10 on a $1.00 transaction. That's still 10%, but that's sort of the nature of taking payments for such low dollar transactions. I would suggest you try to group those into larger payments at $100 increments or something like that.
So you think it's free to process hundreds of millions of refund transactions? The banks are still charging their fees for moving money back and forth. Somebody has to pay for the servers and the bandwidth running those transactions. I guess any time a business makes any decision that directly relates to their bottom line you could call it a cash grab if you want to.
Dump your Paypal account. Their software totally sucks anyway (e.g. the REST API is horribly incomplete and ugly). I'm switching to Square. Square doesn't make you eat your fees on a refund. I was fine with PayPal keeping the fixed $0.30 portion of transaction fee (that would be $3.90 - more than sufficient to cover PayPals costs), but keeping the 2.9% is usury. They just couldn't miss an opportunity to grab some hidden costs. The $0.30 fixed part of the fee is more than sufficient to cover costs. And it makes sense, like charging for a $0.00 transaction, which is what a refunded purchase is. The rest is taking advantage of unexpected situations. A greedy business principle is to take every opportunity to have your customers pay more than they had expected. That way you compete based on what your customer expects to pay, but profit from what they did not expect to pay. A business that puts integrity above greed does not do this. I had to cancel an event due to COVID-19. So none of the advice on this video applies to me.
Their REST API is the same as any other REST API, and they offer a lot more features than standard payment processors. What exactly are you expecting that you aren't seeing? Square does refund fees if you refund your customer (as of today.) Don't be surprised if that goes away before long. More importantly, Square charges 3.5% for "manually entered" transactions. For example, transactions that are keyed into your website. So you're going to trade higher fees for ALL of your transactions in exchange for a return of fees in the hopefully few instances that you have to refund your customer? Had you processed your event payments as Authorizations, and only Captured them when the event date was near, then you could have simply Voided all of the transactions without paying any fees at all (which was indeed covered in this video.) Look, it sucks, and I understand your frustration. We're all dealing with this thing in similar ways, and it's easy to get annoyed when you feel like you're losing money on top of everything else. Again, though, make sure you study all the differences if you're going to switch to Square or any other provider. Also, no matter who you go with, I would suggest you put the Authorization and Capture system into place. It's better for all parties.
@@angelleye you can't get a list of all transactions affecting your account. Pretty basic I think. PayPal tech support confirms this is not possible through the API.
@@Seehart You can do anything using the APIs that you can do with the interface. In fact, about 6 years ago I got most of that done in a demo called "PayPal Glass" (github.com/angelleye/paypal-glass). That was using the NVP API, which could still be used now, but that functionality has been moved into REST. I never got that thing fully completed, but it wasn't because of a lack of APIs.
You are the buyer and you were charged a fee? There's a chance it could have something to do with international payments / currency conversion, but typically the seller pays those fees. Can you provide a screenshot of the transaction details where it's breaking out the payment and fee?
Are you still upset by this change after reviewing the details discussed in this video? Let us know your thoughts on the matter!
Yes still upset. The video shares concepts that are relevant to a standard online merchant application. If I'm doing anything else, like event hosting, or person to person transactions, etc, I don't have the time or inclination to preemptively implement a complex strategy to deal with reducing refunds. I just want to post a simple payment link and be done with it.
I wasn't expecting to deal with refunds. I hosted an event, and covid-19 hits so I have to cancel. PayPal gets to profit from our misfortune.
The formula 0.30 + 0.29x conveys a fixed cost of performing the transaction plus a cut of the revenue. This seems reasonable, and that's what I signed up for. The actual numbers are subject to competition, so it's all good.
But if there's no revenue (after a refund), I don't think it's fare for PayPal to get a cut. It is fair for PayPal to get something for processing the transaction though. This is why I think it is fair to keep the fixed $0.30. That wouldn't be a hardship for me, and it obviously more than covers the incremental cost to PayPal of processing the transaction and refund.
The only rationale for PayPal to pocket the 2.9% revenue share is simply that it's a source of profit for PayPal that their customer probably neglected to consider when comparing to other options. In that sense the policy functions as a hidden fee, in other words, a source of free money that their customer wasn't expecting to pay. As such it represents low integrity on the part of PayPal, which is why I'm not inclined to do business with them.
Square could easily have implemented the same policy, but they don't. They revert the entire fee, and don't even keep the fixed part. This indicates that they are willing to forgo easy free money in favor of keeping their customers happy.
I'm committed to rewarding businesses that operate in that way. Which is why I intend to switch to Square, and why I'm encouraging members of my community to do the same (many are also event leaders). It's more about the principle than the money. I only lost a few hundred, but PayPal will lose much more.
I feel that competition in a free market functions best when everyone is operating with maximum awareness. Any time a company profits from an unexpected expense to their customer, that represents a market failure. The remedy is for people like me to make a lot of noise about it. The covid-19 outbreak provides a great opportunity for this. I'm sure there are others in exactly the same situation as me, and I know how to reach them.
I'm willing to hear your response though.
Joe xx . I am a buyer and the item I bought was really not as advertised. After weeks of e-mailing the supplier they were willing to refund me 20% back. I was not happy with this and went through a very tiring process to create a dispute with PayPal. They said I am eligible for a refund if I mail the item back to the address they provide and add the tracking information. I did exactly that. I paid for the shipping and thought at least I will get a refund now. WRONG. After waiting several weeks, out of the blue I got a message from PayPal.
Sorry, your claim was denied. Reason: Because I did not add the tracking information as requested. Yet, I did. You can even go to the case ( which is now closed) and see the tracking details as well as photos of the receipt and package. So, no Joe, PayPal does not always choose the side of the buyer.
This seller got away with advertising a very desirable beautiful item ( photos and videos showing this) and then shipping me a cheap knockoff. I was so disappointed and felt cheated. I really thought I would be able to get my money back because I used PayPal. But no. I think this supplier cheated thousands of people like me and are getting away with it because they somehow managed to get PayPal on their side. Maybe because they are a big client or maybe they are paying PayPal to close cases against them. Who knows? All I know is that something very unjust and sinister is going on. Thanks for reading my runting on. Hope you as a seller feel better that it happens to buyers too.
The same is true with any payment processor. If the buyer files a claim with their card bank, the card processor has to cover it. In these cases the buyer would have to provide tracking to prove the item had been returned back to the seller, and then the refund would be issued.
As you mentioned, Square is still showing that they will refund you your fees when you have to refund your customer. However, if you look at their fee structure you will see they charge 3.5% for "manually entered" transactions, which would be everything you process on your website. So you want to trade a higher rate for ALL of your transactions in exchange for a refund on the (hopefully) few occasions that you have to refund your customer? "Don't bite off your nose to spite your face".
I completely agree that competition and free market with maximum awareness is the way to go. With that mind, PayPal is simply the best value. That's the only reason I back them the way I do, as a software developer integrating payment solutions.
This particular situation you are facing is unfortunate. The fact remains, though, that if you had processed the original sign-ups as Authorizations, you could have simply Voided those Authorizations once you knew the event couldn't be held. This is a good practice to avoid refunds for any reason an event might get canceled. If you use Square, this same practice should be done in order to avoid unnecessary movement of money across the bank networks. If more sellers had been doing that, PayPal probably would have never had to make this change, and I wouldn't be surprised at all if we see Square making this change before long as well.
So again, shop around, and if you find one that really does beat PayPal overall, I'm all for it. Please let me know. Square isn't the one, though. I'd much rather pay 2.9% (or lower with higher volume) than 3.5% for all of my transactions, and combine that with a proper procedure that helps me avoid refunds.
If what you are saying is true (and I have no reason to believe it's not) then call PayPal and they should be able to open the case and look at it again. If there really is tracking in the dispute details that shows the returned item is delivered to the address it should be, and the system is saying it's not, then they will fix that for you.
I would recommend you give them a call, get them to look at what you're seeing, and logically it would make sense that it's clear a mistake was made with the automated system. They can reverse that for you. Just be kind and patient with them (especially now...might be difficult to get on the phone for a while) and they will help.
If all else fails, and you funded the payment with a credit card or debit card, then you could file a dispute directly with your card bank. You can show them the tracking info proving return, and you would get your money back that way.
I believe this practice is illegal and should has final in court. As soon as I send Bank Transfer to somebody I agree to pay transfer fees (can use different way if dissagree). By selling here on ebay if someone buys, pays and request cancel it is beyond our hands. The fees should be passed to the buyer at least because it is the buyer's fault not the seller. PAYPAL SEEMS TO BE A SCAMMER! , however, everybody knows that SCAM is a crime... I have contacted my local lawyer and been confirmed that such practice is at least suitable for CLOSER look by some financial authorities. Paypal should be classified as bank and be subjected to banking law , however, it is not. This "organisation" seems to be illegal at all. We all should sign global petition against paypal. This is not ethical what they are doing. They simply scam people, there is no question about it.
So with a given transaction you have the following parties: The seller, the buyer, the eBay platform, the PayPal platform, and card issuing banks.
eBay allows people to buy things and then cancel without penalty. eBay does NOT provide the Authorization and Capture feature that would solve this problem. A feature that both PayPal and Adyen Payments (the payment processor behind eBay Managed Payments) provides.
The buyer pulled the trigger and then canceled on you. The card issuing banks will almost always award disputes to the card holder (the buyer) if a chargeback occurs.
PayPal simply allowed you the buyer to send a payment quickly, easily, and securely, and allowed the seller to receive that payment quickly, easily, and securely. They provided their service exactly as advertised. Yet they are the ones that you blame for this problem? It makes no logical sense.
Why don't you get mad at eBay for not providing the Auth/Capture functionality that would solve this problem for good? Why does the disdain immediately go towards PayPal? I just do not understand why that is the natural reaction of so many when they are only one small piece of the puzzle, and they did EXACTLY what they said they would, and charged you their fee for it.
@@angelleye From what planet are you from? Are you serious by telling this bull? Did you sell anything on ebay? I guess not. Paypal keeps our money (billions of dollars, pounds, euros, etc). By having this money they can make even bigger money. Only this should be enough, however, paypal charge us unusual fees comparing to the banks. Do you know any bank who charge fee which is percentage on total amount? Ha? Do you know how much paypal takes on exchange currency? Probably the highest rates on the world!. Paypal became greedy and some day it will be GAME OVER for this company. Paypal shouldn't charge the seller if the buyer decides to cancel an order because it is beyond the seller hands. This is basically a scam. Can you imagine that someone has access to your bank account and transfer some money (your money) somewhere without your permition? This is exactly what paypal do. Ebay and paypal should create some rules regarding this issue and maybe charge the buyer for changing their mind... Seller shouldn't pay for somebody's mistakes. So don't be ridiculous. Just ask your local lawyer about this practicles and you will be clarified...
@@robsonicam So true!
Does PayPal also won't return the fees for Ebay returned sells or it's only affect some other third party sells?
thanks
Any payment received by PayPal and then refunded will not be refunded the fees.
Maybe not stealing if its a smalll transaction. Thats ok. Understandable. But what if you refunded a large amount of money, you didn't get any money from it but you need to still pay the fee?
It's super bonkers. I put in a large order (thousands) with a distributor last week, then realized I had over ordered some products. I asked them to reverse it so I could put through the proper amount. They told me they couldnt, because the processing fee would be $120+.
Turns out they could, because the fee doesnt take effect until Thursday-- but man, going forward, dont make a mistake, because youll be stuck. If they did have this fee, the distributor would either have to call paypal and beg for a refund, or I would have to pay it to continue doing business with the distributor OR they would just refuse to refund the order because of the fee.
They say its "Industry Standard". Which is nonsense. No other company does this. They WANT it to be industry standard... but its not, and hopefully it wont be, because its dumb and very customer unfriendly for both buyers and sellers. Time to drop paypal wherever you can... even if youre not a seller, youll need to be ready for sellers to be unwilling to cancel transactions because of the fee.
It seems that you didn't watch my video. I provide details directly from the terms of service for other processors where they show they do not refund fees on refunded orders.
Also, the person you made this purchase from could adjust their procedure to do Authorization and Capture (again explained in the video) and could have avoided this altogether. If they had simply Authorized the order, and then you wanted to cancel it, they could Void the authorization and no fee would have ever been charged in the first place.
That's really what triggered this change. Too many unnecessary refunds were being processed because people are not following proper procedures.
@@angelleye I commented before finishing watching. I see you compared them to merchant services Ive not heard of (though, maybe they are huge and ive just yet to run into them). You didnt compare them to Square; which has no fee on returns, and refunds the fees. You also didnt compare to traditional credit card processors that use Verifone and similar hardware, like my stores use-- which likewise, returns fees (at least the one I use does). So in my experience, this is a total deviation from the normal... and as my example demonstrates, makes doing business harder and more expensive.
@@MikeSaltzman Adyen is the processor that eBay is now using for their Managed Payments system. I specifically used them because lots of eBay users are making comments like "I'm so glad eBay is leaving PayPal". The processor they are replacing PayPal with not only doesn't refund the fees, but also charges additional for the refund itself.
Square is still showing that they will refund the fees. However, their fees in general are higher than PayPal charges for web transactions. I'd rather deal with 1% or less refund rates than pay higher fees on every single transaction I process. Also, I wouldn't be surprised to see them make this change now that PayPal has. They tend to follow their lead on many things like this.
I've worked with many different processors, and most of them do indeed keep fees when you refund.
Square and Verifone, like you mention, are hardware based primarily. Square is more expensive on all transactions for integration into a website. I'd be curious to see what Verifone fees are for integrating into a website. I'm actually not finding any info about that on their website (although I haven't really dug deep.) Since they're doing hardware, POS processing, I would guess that they are using an Interchange+ model. So there again, if you integrate that service into your website you will likely be paying higher fees for all transactions than you are paying with PayPal's flat rate. Any keyed transaction at all, especially on a website, is going to be a "mid-qualified" or "non-qualified" rate, which can be anywhere from 2.5% - 5% depending on a variety of variables.
Just make sure you study all of these types of things before deciding to make a change. I truly feel that simply adjusting procedures to use Authorization and Capture will solve the problem for most people.
I feel for you but i am sure this person in the video will jump to paypals defence
Its a couple years later now, and i can report that I've basically not needed to cancel an order like this since... so its more or less been a non-issue.
The real issue I've seen is tons and tons of scam sellers using Paypal to perpetrate wrong item scams-- and using Paypals systems to help facilitate their frauds at scale.
I just found out about this in the worst way possible...I had $170 balance in paypal, I sell something on ebay for $3,500 the buyer immediately has remorse and wants to cancel the order, so after refunding them i look at my paypal balance and its now $60...so I was confused where the $110 went...i call paypal and they made me aware of this policy. So basically i lost $110 all because a buyer decided he didn't want the product anymore.
As I mentioned in this video and in articles I've written about this, the solution to that problem is to use Authorization and Capture. PayPal (and all payment processors) provide this functionality. However, it's up to platforms like to eBay to make this available to its sellers. Unfortunately, eBay does not include this functionality. As such, I believe the problem is with them, and that's where we should be aiming our concerns about this matter.
With Authorization and Capture, when the order first comes through it would be Authorized, but no money would be moved yet. Only when you Capture that Auth does the money get moved, and only then does a fee get charged.
If a buyer cancels before you capture, you simply Void the Auth, and no fee would have ever been charged in the first place.
Again, if eBay had this functionality implemented it would eliminate this problem that is indeed very common on their platform.
When a person pays by credit card (not debit) a large percentage of the fee is the Intetchange Fee which pays for reward programs. When a refund is done the card programs refund back a set interchange fee for card not present sales which depends on the card type but is about 2.20%. So PayPal is keeping around 2.20% of the interchange refund that they paid out to the card brands originally to fund reward and miles programs. So they are almost triple dipping thier revenue and keeping the refund given back by the interchange program. That means they were make (for arguements sake) 0.75% as thier fee after paying association fees and IC fees by getting back say a Reward Card Not Present IC fee of 2.20% they are making 2.95% instead of 0.75% that is over 3X the revenue than the original transaction. I think PayPal should at a min give the seller back the interchange refund fee or a certain percentage of the orig fee paid. FYI- I was a merchant sales officer for 15 years for a top 10 bank. This I think is unfair that PayPal is keeping money that is being returned by the card brands interchange programs. For 2 decades they gave it all back to turn around and say no more under the guise that all the other kids play that way is wrong I believe. I think a certain portion should be refunded, not all but more than 50%. That is my opinion.
The card programs don't always refund back, though. That's part of the problem.
The interchange change have literally hundreds of variables involved for what will get charged at transaction time, and based on some of those variables, the result of a refund can be affected.
There are just too many if's, and's, and but's involved, and that's why most processors have been keeping original fees after refunds all along.
PayPal was offering a perk that few others do by doing this. As of now, Square is the only one I can see that does it all, but they have lots of other things to consider like the fact that all of your transactions would be charged a higher fee when compared with PayPal, so it wouldn't be good to switch to them over this. Also, I won't be surprised at all to see them make the same change with their policy soon.
The fact is there are plenty of other things that people can do to avoid this problem...a problem that will happen with nearly every processor out there. So rather can make claims about how rotten the biggest one is (even though they're not doing anything different than everybody else) I feel we should learn to adjust our procedures to keep this from being a problem in the first place.
I didn't pay any attention to this Paypal "Theft Policy" until I had an Ebay buyer request cancellation of a $2000 camera sale. Silly me, I thought Paypal fees were payment for a service rendered. Nope, just an excuse to steal $68 from me.
You did pay for services rendered. You used their system to accept a payment quickly, easily, and securely. When your buyer canceled, you also used their system to process the refund quickly, easily, and securely. You could easily have done all of this using checks in the mail. Of course, then it would have taken a lot longer and caused you to spend time with mail.
As I mentioned in the video, the simple solution to the problem you are outlining here is to use Authorization and Capture. PayPal provides this functionality. eBay has chosen NOT to include this functionality on their platform. Why? Who knows. But why don't you complain to them instead of PayPal? PayPal provides a simple solution, and eBay isn't using it. How is that PayPal's fault?
@@angelleye It seems like you're the only one arguing for PayPal. Nice job supporting small bussiness.
@@MarcoDaNub I am passionate about supporting small business. That's why I do what I can to make sure they understand the details about things like this and don't move forward with blinders on. Otherwise, they'll just keep running into the same problems.
Yes [aypal are making a fortune doing this it is daylight robbery and behold this account and video he is right up there defending them it is insanity ha
@@angelleye here he is at PayPal defense before long he will ban my comments this person will defend Paypal regardless as he is commissioned.
What can I do if PayPal refuses to refund me after I did everything they said ( Sent the item back to the address they gave me and added the tracking information on the case) PayPal closed the case without warning in the seller’s favor stating the reason that aI did not enter the tracking information as requested. Yet... I did add it and it is there listed in the case file. What is up with that? Now, not only did I waste time and energy but am out of my item that I paid for as well as the money spent on shipping. How unfair. Not cool PayPal. I thought I am protected when using PayPal. Clearly there is no guarantee even when you do everything according to the terms.
Christoff Sonika does paypal make you ship back the item if you want to get refunded?
donut junior Yes. PayPal asked me to ship it back and gave me the address.
Yes, of course. If you purchase something and then want your money back, you have to return the item the same way you would a local retail store.
I lost $4500 through a PayPal scam transaction i was really affected i tried all options for recovery but non was helpful, i heard of hackbeign_ on insta i thought he was a bot but i actually got my money Refunded. Try him if you wa..nt he is 100% legit.
So, if someone's out to hurt your business, all they would have to do is order a high dollar amount from your site and then cancel it all. You would then be hit with the high fee from paypal. Paypal is just unethical at this point. I'll be moving my business over to Square asap.
Not if you follow the tips I outlined in this video, no. You would not pay any fees at all, and it would be nothing but a big waste of their time to do that.
Take a look at Square's fees. They charge 3.5% for keyed transactions (which would be everything on your website, of course) vs. PayPal's 2.9%. So you're going to trade paying a higher fee for ALL of your transactions just to get a refund in the rare instances that you have to submit a refund?
Instead of refunding it is possible to issue a credit note to the customer, so they can use that credit with their next order. Many customers will agree to that as they often want to return for more. Regarding Paypal they should implement some kind of ACCEPT firewall for all payments that are sent to the seller. Seller then accepts the payment once they verify that all items are in stock. And if the seller wants a partial payment they accept a custom amount. Stripe does this, but Paypal does not. Too bad for Paypal, that's why many people quit using Paypal, unfortunately. Another thing with Paypal is their fees no longer 2,9% but more like 4% to 5% now.
All I'm concerned about is making sure the customer is issued a full refund. Does that happen?
Sorry PayPal doesn't refund any transaction fee.
It all doesn't make sense! The return fee should be flat and not depend on the amount ($1 for small amount, $2 for medium, $3 for large)! because their servers doesn't care if it's $10000 or $100, they don't really doing hard job returning the charge... no humans or real investigation is involved!
And overall it's stealing! Because the fees include buyer and seller protection etc..... meaning if the buyer just changed their mind and want refund... PayPal just have to use nothing but a bit of server refund feature... which DOES NOT cost 3% out of $1000 refunded! and no one asked of used protection, no people involved, no investigation, no much server power used!
I can understand your frustration, but I have to respectfully disagree.
Servers require man-power to administer and maintain them. This includes hosting charges, security, backups, performance improvements, and constant review to ensure everything is running smoothly. The banks also charge based on percentages, so countering that with a flat fee simply doesn't work.
It's not stealing because you used their service and you were charged accordingly for that service. If you provide your service to somebody, and then they say nevermind I actually didn't need that, are you just going to say okay no problem? Of course, not. Yet you expect PayPal to not only give you their service to charge the original payment, but also give you their service to process the refund...all for free? They were doing this as a perk for a long time, but sellers got lazy (and didn't educate themselves) so it became too much unnecessary drag on the system. That's why this change was made.
If you have a problem with buyers "changing their mind" then you should be using Authorization and Capture, as I mentioned in the video. There is no fee for an Auth, and if the order gets canceled you simply Void it. No fee charged, so no fee needs to be refunded.
I would suggest that you educate yourself a bit more on this, and adjust your procedures accordingly. This really should not be a big problem for you. If it is, you need to make adjustments.
@@angelleye I see. Make some sense, I believe - regarding returned transactions and fees should not be based on amount but should be flat rate (small, medium, large amounts). 1. Do Ebay use Authorization and Capture? 2. What about Amazon Seller return fees? The same, they won't refund the fees as well? 3. What about if you directly Visa and MasterCard, same won't refund the fees? Very interesting, and curious. Thanks a lot!
@@ALPHAGENXCORP No, I have not seen Auth and Capture available in eBay. PayPal and Adyen both provide it (as do all payment processors) but eBay has not implemented it into their platform. I don't even see it included in their new "eBay Managed Payments" platform, which is very surprising to me. In my opinion we should be sending feedback their way to get that done.
I am not very experienced with Amazon myself, but based on this thread it seems it's not quite as simple as will they or won't they. Seems it might be more of a per instance sort of thing based on a variety of variables: sellercentral.amazon.com/forums/t/does-amazon-return-their-fees-on-returned-items/54303/3
To process Visa/MasterCard/etc. you're going to need to get setup with a merchant account processor of some sort. PayPal is one, Adyen is another, Stripe, Square, and many more. They all have their own policies and procedures, and of course they compete with each other for business.
The only one I see still advertising that they will refund fees is Square. However, Square's fees for processing keyed transactions (which would be the case for all of your website orders) are higher than PayPal's in general. As such, you'd be paying higher fees on every order in exchange for getting your fee refunded in the few instances (hopefully) that you're processing refunds.
There are many things to consider when looking for payment processing services. In my experience, when all factors are considered, PayPal is the best, and this refund policy variable is very lightweight compared to other variables in the equation.
@@angelleye Gotcha. Thanks!
The problem is lack of PREAUTH (pre-authorization) function at Paypal. Here's one example of how EXPENSIVE it can become to receive payments: Buyer sends more money during a purchase than they should. Let's say they pay you $2500 instead of $1000. Paypal fee $110 which is 4,4% and yes, Paypal is now charging up to 5% or even more. Then you realize the stuff is not in stock and you refund say $1500 back to the customer since you have nothing else to send to the customer in order to avoid refunding and losing all that money to Paypal fees. So instead of paying $44 to receive $1000 you end up paying $110 to receive $1000 which is a whopping 11%! Well, at least Stripe has preauthorization procedure which prevents this from happening, yet Paypal does not have a preauth. I asked Paypal support what can I do to prevent this from happening and Paypal wrote they have no protection from this kind of overpayment happening. I had someone send $1 multiple times and within seconds place a chargeback. Paypal does not even have protection from this kind of nasty behaviour from happening. Not even a possibility to block these kind of people by IP or by their email address. Nothing.
Damn thieves
I would disagree with that statement.
@@angelleye how would you disagree? Do you work for them? You probably have some influence... why else make the video.
I agree though... they are theives... they make profit and reputation from transactions, not refunds. To stop doing refunds? It's a BIG TIME THIEF MOVE to make.
@@polishpat95 No, I don't work for them. I am a payment integration specialist, and in my experience and humble opinion, PayPal is simply the best overall payment processing solution. If you can point me to another payment processor that is better, I'd love to review the details, and if they really are, potentially consider switching my recommendation.
As I said in the video, they provide a service which you are utilizing whether you refund a payment or not. In fact, when you refund the payment, you're utilizing their service twice. Why should you get that service for free?
The marketplace has set the price for payment processing, and PayPal is very competitive in that market. They all keep fees when you refund except for Square at this point, but Square charges a higher rate for all of your transactions in the first place, so that's really not a good trade.
So I am curious, who will you be using besides PayPal?
@@angelleye How about starting my own payment processing service??
@@angelleye It doesn't cost $30 to deal with a $1000 refund.
You forgot to mention you work for paypal.
I don't work for PayPal. I own my business, Angell EYE, where we do web development, and we specialize in payment integration. We work with PayPal and many other processors, but PayPal is generally what I recommend for people because it's quite simply the best all-around option for payment processing.
Even if I did work for PayPal, though, what specific objection(s) do you have about anything I've said in this video?
@@angelleye ok the fact that you accept this change and have no concerns about it. I have been selling on eBay for 4 years and have sold 180k worth of items last year. During the summer of 2019 I had a customer order 4k worth of items to a car park, the transaction was cancelled because it was clearly a scam but if this were to happen now I'd have to pay £310 which is a lot of money.
@@KrooNfps You clearly didn't watch my video or read my article on this. It would be great if you would do so before commenting in the future.
As I mentioned in the video, the simple solution for fees on canceled orders is to use Authorization and Capture. In fact, had people been doing this more like they should be, PayPal likely would have never had to make this change. If you Authorization a payment it holds the funds so that you can capture them when you are ready to ship. If the order is canceled for any reason, you simply Void the Authorization, and no fee is ever charged to begin with.
The problem with eBay is that they do not provide this functionality in their platform. PayPal, and all other payment processors, provide this as a standard feature. It's not their fault that eBay doesn't implement it.
eBay's new Managed Payments Platform is built on top of Adyen Payments, which also supports Auth and Capture. However, I still do not see any evidence that PayPal has implemented this functionality.
eBay is the one you want to be complaining to here. Not the payment processor(s).
@@angelleye You are not reading the comments carefully. KrooN is using Ebay. Same as me.
I watched your video very carefully. I wish there was an "Authorization and Capture" feature on Ebay, but ther isn't. Around 50% of the buyer's on Ebay are really irresponsible, they aren't reading the item's description. I have users buying the wrong product 2 or 3 times before buying what they really need. PayPal is charging me 4 - 4.5% on average and that is not good at all for my business. It increases overhead by quite a lot to communicate with every user. I sell 50 items a day and it is impossible to get in touch with them before they pay for an item, or before i ship an item. Maybe PayPal should make a move to make buyers as responsible as possible before making a non well thought purchase? But again, why would they do that, to loose transactions? I will be building a website soon and I am personally looking to find a more friendly "non industry standard" processor. Thanks again for the vid.
@@hondapartseurope9931 The problem is at eBay, not PayPal. You said yourself, they don't provide the Auth and Capture functionality. How is that PayPal's fault? Why aren't you throwing hate at eBay? This has nothing to do with PayPal.
When you switch to eBay's Managed Payments platform, which is now using Adyen payments, they still don't include Auth and Capture. Are you going to blame Adyen then, even though just like PayPal, they do provide Auth/Capture functionality?
If you were selling on your own website with PayPal, Adyen, PayLeap, Square, Stripe, or literally ANY other payment processor you could easily do Authorizations and avoid this problem altogether. It's only when you add eBay to the equation that this becomes a problem. So again, why do you blame PayPal for that? I don't understand your logic.
This is the same thing I said to Kroon. I did read his comment, and I replied accordingly.
Hi i got a refund how much time does it take for a refund to process ?Also do people face a lot problem getting their refund with 2-7 business or are there any steps to follow apart from emailing paypal thanks
If you paid with PayPal, and then you got a notice that your payment has indeed been refunded, the typical time is 3 - 5 business days depending on the banks involved. The refund would go back to whatever the original payment source was. This is industry standard.
Angell EYE Thank you for your Reply
Another way to offset PayPal not refunding their fee can be passed on to the buyers by informing them, after they ask for a refund, that PayPal does not refund their processing fee.
Yes, some are adjusting their refund policies to account for the fee.
how do i set up "authorize only, capture later" for my ebay account? i'm sick of buyers giving me BS reasons to request a refund, usually stemming from them not reading the description, or lying about return reason when its really a buyers remorse reason.
Unfortunately, eBay has not implemented this option into their platform. PayPal provides it, and so does Adyen Payments, which is what the eBay Managed Payments Platform is built on. In no case, though, have I seen them offer Authorization and Capture as a feature.
This is a glaring problem with eBay right now, and they need to address it.
I gave up on PayPal and switched to WooPayments(Stripe reseller); however I found out that they also will not refund fees now.
Does anyone have an update solution on payment gateways that don't keep these fees?
If this is really that big of a problem for you, just like I mentioned in this video, I would suggest you make adjustments to avoid so many returns. Happy customers are the answer to your problem no matter who you're processing with.
By the way, I would suggest you switch back to our plugin because it gives you PayPal and all of its button stack features as well as Direct Card processing just like Stripe...but with a lower fee.
So if you do have to process a refund you won't be losing as much as you would be with Stripe.
Also as mentioned in the video you can do Authorization and only capture when you know it'll be good without a refund. Or you can simply make a refund policy that says you're going to keep 5%. Lots of options.
All you are talking about is it cost money to refund, sure it may cost a few cents , but the fees include not just the cost, but juicy profits for PayPal. But let me tell you, it cost even more money for sellers to process returns and restock products, let alone in a refund situation, the seller will be losing all revenue, so what a shame for PayPal not only recover its cost but also retain its juicy profits when sellers are losing everything
I hate the new eBay/paypal changes.
They really only care about buyer . If ur the seller ur out of luck
Sold something 2 weeks go.
A graphic card for $630-18 shipping . Buyer was using the item for 2 weeks than decided he didn't want it (buyer Remorse). Not only did I have to sent another 18$ Shipping label but the 20$ PayPal fee isn't refundable. So I'm out 56$ out of my pocket.
Even tho I said no return n that I would only refund the minus transaction fee/ Shipping if decided to return. But I couldn't even do that.
I'm done with PayPal n eBay.
Yes, it can be frustrating. My question for you, though...who are you going to switch to for payment processing?
The only processor I'm seeing right now that still advertises they will refund fees is Square. However, if you study their fee structure they show higher rates for "keyed" transactions than PayPal, which would be every transaction entered on your website, of course. So you're going to trade fees on refunds for higher fees on everything? That doesn't sound like a good trade. Also, I wouldn't be surprised at all to see them change their policy before long.
As mentioned in the video, the other options all typically show they will not refund fees when you refund your buyer. Are you going to go to cash/check/money order only? That's always an option, of course.
Unfortunately, a "no return" policy is really useless these days. Not because of PayPal or other processors, but because of the card issuing banks. If a buyer files a dispute with the card issuing bank, they are going to side with them more often than not. That is their customer, and they want them to be happy to continue using their products.
When that happens, PayPal can't do much about it other than put the procedures in place to make sure you get your item back in exchange for the refund. Again, all payment processors follow this same standard procedure.
If this is something that is happening enough that it's becoming an issue for you, I would suggest that you need to reconsider the products you are selling, or do some additional due diligence on your buyers before shipping expensive products.
"Buyer's remorse" means they weren't happy enough with the product to want to keep it. Maybe that product just isn't something you want in your product line anymore. Maybe focus on the stuff that's so cool and kicks so much ass that people would never want to return it.
Or again, maybe you need to add an additional layer of due diligence into your procedure. You could process orders as Authorization so no fee occurs, and then contact the buyer directly to make sure they are fully comfortable with what they are getting and all of the details about condition, quality, what to expect, etc.
It's up to you as the business owner to make these decisions based on all these different options and possible procedures. You'll need to consider these things no matter who you process payments with.
Text *Jameskosta2* on ¡nstagram. He did my paypal refund 🤗
I lost $4500 through a PayPal scam transaction i was really affected i tried all options for recovery but non was helpful, i heard of hackbeign_ on insta i thought he was a bot but i actually got my money Refunded. Try him if you want he... is 100% legit.
I had to refund a buyer on a transaction due to his verified shipping address being incorrect. I could not contact paypal to resolve this due to covid19 so I contacted ebay. Ebay said the policy is to cancel the order and refund the buyer and have them re-purchase after he corrected the issue. I was not refunded the pay pal fee when I refunded the customer due to a bad verified address, and the buyer did not re-purchase.
So the way you leave that comment, it seems that you're upset at PayPal about this issue..?? My question would be, why?
First, you have a buyer that did not provide a proper shipping address. I'm a little unclear on that, but are you sure this person wasn't trying to scam you? When people purchase something and then later try to get you to change the address, it's usually because they know you won't be covered by Seller Protection if you ship to a different address, and they're trying to scam you. The fact that he didn't follow through with a re-purchase after you canceled the order is further evidence that he may have been a scammer. Either that or he is legitimate and simply wasn't keeping his info updated properly. Either way, the buyer, the first party involved in this transaction, is causing problems.
Second, you are selling on eBay. As mentioned in the video, Authorization and Capture is the best way to avoid this problem with canceled orders. PayPal makes this feature available. eBay does not include that feature in their platform. If they allowed you to take payments as Authorizations, and then only Capture those Authorizations when you are shipping the product, then you could simply Void the Authorization when an order is canceled, and no fee will have ever been charged in the first place. eBay does not provide this, though. So eBay, the second party involved in this transaction, is causing problems.
PayPal provided the exact service they said they would provide. They processed that payment for you quickly and securely, and then they also processed that refund for you quickly and securely. PayPal, the third party in this transaction, is the only one that actually did exactly what they were supposed to, without causing any problems. Why should they not get to keep the fees that you agreed to pay them when they provide the exact service they said they would provide you?
Look, I wasn't happy to see this policy change. Of course I'd rather get my fees back in the rare instances that I have to refund my customers. However, as a business owner, I understand perfectly why they've done it, and it's perfectly logical.
You (and many others) see the fact that they are not refunding the fee as THE problem with this transaction. Why does the buyer (potential scammer) get a pass? Why does eBay get a pass for not providing basic, standard Authorization/Capture functionality on their platform? Why does the blame and frustration go directly to PayPal?
Honest question.
Paypal will sting both ends customer and seller it is amazing void paypal!!
Do you need money or getting paid to have an account and if your under 18 or under 15
You must be 18+ in order to have a PayPal account. If you are below that age you should have your parents create one that you can use.
hello. I would like to ask. I send money to my cousin 2x but pending that 2x that I send money. He refund the money to me.. But it no coming in my atm debit card or paypal balance. but I receive refund activities. what should I do?
Refunds can take a few business days to clear the banks. The cash will show up back in the original funding source you chose for the payment.
If PayPal was spending money on infrastructure to process unnecessary refunds, why wouldn't they charge another 0.30 cents once the refund is issued instead of not giving back the seller fee? Wouldn't that be more fair?
Maybe they will one day, just like many other processors already do. I hope not, but it wouldn't surprise me to see it one day.
Also, I'm not saying that is the primary reason they stopped refunding the fees. It's part of it, though. Primarily, they advertise a rate for a particular service they provide, and they provided that service exactly as they said they would. Just like anything else that gets provided exactly as advertised, you should pay the fee you agreed upon when you decided to use the service.
Look, I don't like it when I have to process a refund and I don't see that refunded fee amount any more than you do. I just see it a bit differently, and I decided to adjust my own procedures so that I avoid this as much as possible.
That ends up better for everybody. Now I'm not processing as many refunds as I was before, which means fewer unhappy customers, and I'm seeing a better bottom line than I was before, even when I was getting fees refunded.
I refunded something and it says that it was refunded but is not on my debit card what do I do
I'm a little confused. You refunded a payment that was sent to you, or you were given a refund on a payment you sent to somebody else? In either case, check the transaction details of the original payment and you'll see if it shows a refund or not. If PayPal's system shows the refund, then it will hit the bank soon. If PayPal's system doesn't show a refund, then no refund was processed.
Angell EYE SAME THING HAPPENED TO ME JUST NOW. It says refunded but its not in my bank acc!
Bro did u get urs?
@@carlosg.6252 Refunds won't show up in your bank instantly. It will take 3 - 5 business days in most cases, depending on the banks involved.
Angell EYE okay so my situation is different from this video right?
Ways to bypass this is to send the refund back as friends and family.
I don't follow your logic.
Angell Eye, you're full of it, as is PayPal. PayPal was extremely profitable with the old policy. They just want more money. They're the ones who chose to make refunds a cost of doing business, which gave rise to their success. After becoming successful, they reach for a money grab. Did you know they don't charge fees for something called Friends and Family? I'm sure they're incurring a fee there, too. Finally, you're assuming everyone is processing a ton of refunds, which is simply not true.
Full of...logical statements backed by factual evidence..?? ;)
I never said they weren't profitable with the original policy. I said there is a cost to it, and there most certainly is. As I mentioned in the video, if people were properly following the procedures for Authorization and Capture, this policy likely never would have been changed because it wouldn't have been such a glaring spot on their annual reports.
Yes, of course I know about Friends and Family payments. When they are simply moving cash from a bank account or PayPal balance, and the sender is specifically listing the payment as a gift, then they will allow this with no fee because they don't have to pay the banks for it. When people are processing payments through credit cards there are additional fees PayPal pays for the banks to move the money around on credit accounts like that, and then move it back. This is more costly than cash from a bank or PayPal account balance.
That said, people take advantage of this a lot, too, and if that continues this could be taken away as well. I still recommend Venmo for these types of payments anyway (which of course is PayPal owned.)
Not sure how you're saying that I assume people are processing lots of refunds. I said IF this is a problem for you, then you must be processing a lot of refunds. If you aren't processing lots of refunds, then this policy change isn't even something you would likely notice because it would have no affect on you. If you aren't processing lots of refunds, but you're still here complaining, then I guess you just like to find things to complain about even when they don't affect you..??
I see you on reddit lots so I'm sure you see how much ebay sellers are affected by this. Buyer's remorse/ inattentive buyers/ etc are a big problem they face, refunding someone for an oopsie is getting harder.
Unfortunately the only solution we see so far is to work these eventual losses into your prices, whatever that may entail.
As mentioned in this video, the solution to the problem with buyer's remorse / canceled orders prior to shipment is using Authorization and Capture. Both PayPal and Adyen Payments (the one eBay is using for their Managed Payments platform) provide this functionality. It's up to eBay to make it available to their merchants, and I agree that it's very important for them to do so. Again, though, the payment processors provide it, so eBay is the one causing the headaches for sellers here.
Charge a restocking fee equal to the processing fee...
Square returns your fee's. We are switchin all our business to Square
First, I would suggest that if you're processing enough refunds that this is an issue, you should address that problem, and figure out how to reduce your return rate in general.
Second, if you don't include PayPal as an option on your site, you are going to lose sales, virtually guaranteed. Conversion rates on websites typically increase by around 23% when adding PayPal as a payment option.
Third, Square shows the following on their pricing page: "Payments that are manually keyed-in, processed using Card on File, or manually entered using Virtual Terminal have a 3.5% + 15¢ fee." Every payment you process on your website is going to be a "manually keyed-in" transaction. So you're going to trade 2.9% for 3.5% just so that you can get a refund of that 3.5% in the (hopefully) rare instances that you have to refund your customer? That doesn't seem like a good trade to me.
I see some third party websites saying that Square charges 2.9% for "eCommerce". However, I don't see this anywhere on the actual Square website. It's pretty clear about its pricing there, and based on what it says, it's going to be 3.5%.
I would suggest you look more into this before making this decision.
This opens way for a stronger competitor.
Care to elaborate? I think we've already seen the opposite.
Do you have a video the shows how to make a payment for a purchase. Thank you for your time
Not specifically, as there are many options. Here is a video I did on how to get paid, though, which might be helpful. It's from the seller perspective, but it shows some examples of how the buyer would make the payment, so you could see that.
th-cam.com/video/xpcwEM0lbIU/w-d-xo.html
Do not listen to this person he is endorsed by them he will remove my comment no dought, he is talking nonsense paypal have been screwing us for years
False and baseless claims help no one.
@@angelleye And you prompting how fantastic PayPal is when it is not is setting more people up for failures PayPal is the modern-day scammers.
PayPal is fantastic if we use it in a best way :)
@@angelleyekeep endorsing you are not once bias against how bad it is.
@@BonkNosey You keep saying it's bad without saying why it's bad. Nobody can help you when you're making baseless claims, as I've said numerous times now.
Charge a Restocking Fee if the reason for return is a seller caused issue.
They are not refunding this anymore!
What if a person sends you $1 USD. What are the fees then?
The fee is 2.9% + 30¢. The .30 is what makes it expensive for low dollar items. So a $1.00 payment would be $0.33, which is expensive.
For low dollar items like that it's best to use a MicroPayments account (th-cam.com/video/O_nZjfgVkig/w-d-xo.html). MicroPayments charges 5% + 5¢, so the fee in that case would only be $0.10 on a $1.00 transaction.
That's still 10%, but that's sort of the nature of taking payments for such low dollar transactions. I would suggest you try to group those into larger payments at $100 increments or something like that.
Its simple, if a buyer cancels through my website then I will charge a restocking fee. Mind you paypal isn't eating anything its a cash grab.
So you think it's free to process hundreds of millions of refund transactions? The banks are still charging their fees for moving money back and forth. Somebody has to pay for the servers and the bandwidth running those transactions.
I guess any time a business makes any decision that directly relates to their bottom line you could call it a cash grab if you want to.
@@angelleye Over 400 billion dollars a quarter. My heart bleeds for them, what a shill you are.
Dump your Paypal account. Their software totally sucks anyway (e.g. the REST API is horribly incomplete and ugly).
I'm switching to Square. Square doesn't make you eat your fees on a refund.
I was fine with PayPal keeping the fixed $0.30 portion of transaction fee (that would be $3.90 - more than sufficient to cover PayPals costs), but keeping the 2.9% is usury. They just couldn't miss an opportunity to grab some hidden costs.
The $0.30 fixed part of the fee is more than sufficient to cover costs. And it makes sense, like charging for a $0.00 transaction, which is what a refunded purchase is. The rest is taking advantage of unexpected situations. A greedy business principle is to take every opportunity to have your customers pay more than they had expected. That way you compete based on what your customer expects to pay, but profit from what they did not expect to pay. A business that puts integrity above greed does not do this.
I had to cancel an event due to COVID-19. So none of the advice on this video applies to me.
Their REST API is the same as any other REST API, and they offer a lot more features than standard payment processors. What exactly are you expecting that you aren't seeing?
Square does refund fees if you refund your customer (as of today.) Don't be surprised if that goes away before long.
More importantly, Square charges 3.5% for "manually entered" transactions. For example, transactions that are keyed into your website. So you're going to trade higher fees for ALL of your transactions in exchange for a return of fees in the hopefully few instances that you have to refund your customer?
Had you processed your event payments as Authorizations, and only Captured them when the event date was near, then you could have simply Voided all of the transactions without paying any fees at all (which was indeed covered in this video.)
Look, it sucks, and I understand your frustration. We're all dealing with this thing in similar ways, and it's easy to get annoyed when you feel like you're losing money on top of everything else. Again, though, make sure you study all the differences if you're going to switch to Square or any other provider. Also, no matter who you go with, I would suggest you put the Authorization and Capture system into place. It's better for all parties.
@@angelleye you can't get a list of all transactions affecting your account. Pretty basic I think. PayPal tech support confirms this is not possible through the API.
@@angelleye generally I expect from an API to be able to access anything that is accessible through the web UI.
@@Seehart The Transaction Search API should do that for you (developer.paypal.com/docs/api/transaction-search/v1/)
@@Seehart You can do anything using the APIs that you can do with the interface. In fact, about 6 years ago I got most of that done in a demo called "PayPal Glass" (github.com/angelleye/paypal-glass). That was using the NVP API, which could still be used now, but that functionality has been moved into REST. I never got that thing fully completed, but it wasn't because of a lack of APIs.
I got charged fee not much I bought something from my friend in the UK to be shipped to Canada
So if u use PayPal now they'll charge u a fee
You are the buyer and you were charged a fee? There's a chance it could have something to do with international payments / currency conversion, but typically the seller pays those fees. Can you provide a screenshot of the transaction details where it's breaking out the payment and fee?
Check on mikeraymond444 on ig
Void paypal for life they are relentless and always screwing someone
Sorry to know that your experience was not good with PayPal. May I know if there is anything I can help you with?
make shorted videos. Talk about most important. Stop reading fairy tales
Reading fairy tales..??
All this 22minutes video could be 3min
Angell EYE yea loser......