2021 Volkswagen ID.4: E2 - Under The Hood
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 31 พ.ค. 2024
- Episode 2: 2021 VW ID.4 1st Edition - Rear Wheel Drive
If you like the content you're seeing, please consider visiting our website or subscribing to our Patreon group for exclusive content.
PATREON GROUP: / munrolive
MUNRO MERCH: teespring.com/stores/munro-li...
SUPPORT MUNRO: munrolive.com/support-%2F-shop
MUNRO LIVE WEBSITE: munrolive.com/
MUNRO LIVE TWITTER: / live_munro
MUNRO LIVE INSTAGRAM: / munrolive
MUNRO & ASSOCIATES MAIN WEBSITE: leandesign.com/
Outro:
Music from TH-cam Audio Library [Aka YAL]
Music provided by RFM: • Video
#VolkswagenID4 #VWID4 #ID4 - ยานยนต์และพาหนะ
I suspect the reason why Tesla has a frunk and the VW doesn’t is because the front of the Tesla is substantially longer than it needs to be and substantially longer than the VW. Also, putting common service items under the hood where access is easy makes it easier to service them, compared to something like Tesla where they are all hidden under covers, body panels, the dashboard, etc.
Regarding the fuses, some manufacturers have opted to remove fuses in favor of current-monitored transistors. Basically they watch the current draw of every circuit and use transistors to act as basically a circuit breaker. Tesla is definitely not the first manufacturer to do this. The problem is that, depending on the electrical fault, those transistors can be a one-shot deal as well, but instead of replacing a fuse that costs pennies, you’re replacing an entire module or fuse block that costs hundreds of dollars. I work as an automotive tech, I’ve seen this happen many times on the other vehicles that have used this setup for well over a decade.
The model 3 is only 4 inches longer (180,5 vs 184.8) - that is not really substantially longer. The ID 4 weighs in at 4559 pounds and the Tesla model 4031 pounds
Auto mechanic here,
Yep
because customers love getting told they need to spend 200+ bucks(instead of a 5 buck fuse)
Fuses are very simple and reliable,
Transistor systems are great when they work, very expensive when they break.
@@pierre.a.larsen I think the original post was saying the hood is longer on the Model 3. VW claim the short hood was a design choice to make the cabin larger.
@@scottwills4698 Ah, yes. My mistake. The front is indeed substantially longer on the Tesla.
Wait, you sound knowledgeable about this. In your opinion, why is Sandy saying fuses are such a bad thing?
Some suggested answers to the questions. 1. The cheap prop rod vs the Tesla auto-open can be explained simply because the Tesla frunk will be opened and closed a great deal whereas the VW 'hood' might get opened once a year. Why waste money and complexity on a fancier opening system? That should be a plus. 2. Are you sure you'll jump the 12V ever? My Kia simply has a reset button where the large battery recharges/jumps the 12V battery which is effectively a partition. Perhaps the VW has a similar feature. 3. The short front looks to be approximately what you'd have left in the Tesla if you removed the frunk. i.e. same stuff there and same space but just covered up with plastic on the Tesla. Also then in that small space on the VW having all the junk that usually goes under the dash such as the filter is a godsend. And further serves to free up space within the cabin even if it's dash space. Seems to me to be a superior setup vs the Tesla. 4. You mentioned the 4 vs 2 hood things, but you still couldn't get that dumb Tesla hood shut on the first try. When they make the hood shut on first attempt maybe then hold it up as superior. Ridiculous for a new vehicle to have a 'feature' that requires slamming it then pressing down with both hands just to shut the stupid hood.
Agreed about the Tesla hood.
The Tesla hood, being aluminum, hasn't the weight to self close. Which is partly the point Munro was making about steel v aluminum. The weight savings is more important than whether you need to close the hood differently between the two vehicles.
Aluminum is also more pedestrian friendly versus steel. Those crush cans on the VW are necessary because the steel gives less upon impact, even with the air space.
Cost to repair a damaged aluminum hood might be higher than a damaged steel hood, but it looks like a pedestrian collision would cause more damage to the VW (possibly headlights and some of that other stuff under the hood), raising the cost of repairs.
The design choice by VW led to having to choose different ways to mitigate pedestrian injury. Same end result (hopefully less injury), just a different method to achieve it. Not necessarily better or worse than the Tesla.
Weight isn't the biggest enemy of an electric car. It's drag. Of course a lighter car is always better - but the energy losses of weight are only the inefficiencies of your drivetrain and the recuperation. Everything else is restored. Drag is lost no matter what you do. So I don't get his point about the hood. And I think this cross brace is way too solid for only holding up the filters etc. I think it adds stiffness. Why else you should bolt it down with eight(?) M12(?) Bolts?
The bigger battery will charge your 12V, so no need to jump it
@@jBurn_ In city driving, stop and go, low speed, weight is far more important than drag. drag does not become an issue until above 70ish kph
one of our most cherished pastimes here in Europe is "hit the pedestrian" - that's why our hood-regulations are a little more strikt compared to the U.S.
Nah, its just that Europeans try to save pedestrians, whereas Americans don't care that they die
@@lukei1 Real reason is that Europe actually has pedestrians and cyclists. In the US everyone is required to drive oversized SUVs and pickup trucks. Apparently their heads are already damaged.
🤣 these comments
we have actually walkable cities (aka actual cities)
@@Miata822 not more, just that their streets are more narrow so it seems that way.
In America we blame the pedestrian for getting in the way 🤣
The pedestrian has the right of way, until they are in the way.
While it is true that pedestrians generally have the right of way, they do not always have it. For anyone who has ever stood at a crosswalk, you know you have to wait until it is your turn to cross the street, whether right of way is governed by flashing traffic signs or the age-old rules of a traditional 4-way stop.
@@danchatka8613 guess they’ll have to die 🤷♀️
@@MiesvanderLippe Actually, the Tesla has a very soft hood made of aluminum. It is built to also soften the impact in a pedestrian accident. The VW's hood is made of steel, so the design is different.
@@rogerheuckeroth7456 I'm replying to intersection rules dude. The guy he's replying to doesn't mention Tesla either. I hate SUV culture and the implications bigger cars have for other users so I hate the popularity the ID.4 has over the ID.3.
I think it's amusing that reviewers all seem to think that because VW did something differently, it was automatically wrong. Other folks have mentioned the lack of frunk opens up more interior space. It also lets you have a much shorter front overhang pushing the wheels to the ends of the car, like a Mini. This is a huge handling advantage and possibly contributing to why some think the ID.4 out-handles the Model Y and Mach-e. And there's still room for the front motor on the AWD version coming out later this year. That said, as someone who's worked on his own VWs for years, they do sometimes make really boneheaded engineering decisions.
It's the whole package from car to charging. In America is harder to charge this at the charge America chargers. You can charge a good easier that have who built the charger. So if you travel Tesla is the way to go. Nope, I don't have a Tesla. I.c.e. for me.
Given the "brick wall" front end profiles of US SUVs, your head is the last thing to worry about because the rest of you is like a fly on a windscreen, or a potato through a chipper...
Quick comments:
- The VW has no frunk because the hood and the part of the car in front of the windshield is so small.
VW has for now been the best at using one of the main advantages of EVs: flexibility in the architecture that allows you to max out the most important thing: cabin space. For reference, the Model 3 is almost half a meter longer than the ID3, but despite that, it only has 10 centimetres more in wheelbase. VW wheelbase optimization is incredible...the ID3 is kind of sort of the size of a Golf, but the internal space is closer to a Passat.
- Since you'll never open the hood on a regular basis...no oil to check and stuff...why bother with the expensive pneumatic struts?
- I honestly can't believe Sandy skipped on the most important thing about steel: it's super easy to repair for bodyshops. While aluminium is great and all frames should be made out of it, body panels kind of shouldn't...they always get bumped, dented, scratched, crashed into...and with aluminium, repairs are more complicate, take longer and are ultimately more expensive. That's a contributing factor to why is such a nightmare to have any kind bodywork repair done on Tesla...heard of people being without their cars for a couple of months.
- The real reason US crash standards are so outdated on pedestrian safety is the fact that's very very hard to have pickup trucks comply to those norms. In fact, many brands have stopped selling their pickups in Europe after stricter pedestrian crash tests came into the picture...the market here is just too small anyway and it's not worth the effort. In the US, it would mean huge costs for Ford, GM and so on, so yeah, "you try not to hit pedestrians"
The M3 has a longer hood for better aerodynamics I gather, as well as a bigger crumple zone for more safety, as well as more storage.
@@2nd3rd1st Hood length doesn't matter for aerodynamics. The argument may be made for the tail compared to a "flat" hatchback, but as long as you do proper design, the front is not a problem.
As for the crumple zone...yeah, but as long as you achieve the desired result (5 stars in crash tests & stuff) how big is the crumple zone doesn't really matter
One of the few channels I turn off adblock for. Watch every single vid with a smile.
Thanks Josh. The ad revenue does cover part of our production of these videos.
@@MunroLive It’s a sympathetic gesture that will give Munro an extra $0.001. 😉
but I paid for youtube premium, I assume some breadcrumbs does drip to the channel.
@@Conservator. Yep... Ad's pay 1 or $2 per 1000 views if you're lucky.
@@edwardtse8631 yep, premium does pay out a bit more to the content creators but it’s till very little. Buying them a coffee or support them via patreon is more effective than spending your time watching an ad. I do appreciate the thought though, I just want to create some awareness of what watching an ad returns to the content creators.
They put the stuff in front, so that the cabin is more spacious. I think this is a good trade off. Also, the length of the hood on the VW is a lot shorter. A Frunk would have been in any case smaller than the one on the model 3 with the long stretched hood. Also, you have a lot smaller turn circle on the VW, because they increased the wheel arch, which is a big bonus point in European cities. All things combined made the Frunk not possible. But you get some nice benefits instead of the Frunk. Maybe should have mentioned that.
showmanship to get more viewership
Tesla was able to do all of this packaging with a large frunk and big under trunk storage space with no compromises in the interior space, on a car that's significantly smaller than an id4.
1) VAG designers and engineers are brilliant. The frunkless ID.4 means there's no added weight forward of the front axle, making the ID.4 handles like a RWD vs the MY frunk filled with stuff giving a FWD handling characteristics. Smart, very smart.
2) ID.4 small turning circle of 33.6 ft vs MY large turning diameter of 38.8 ft (C&D Tested). That's a whopping 6.2 ft difference.
3) ID.4 shorter F/R overhang vs MY longer F/R overhang
@@loganrossignolNo Frunk - RWD handling vs Frunk - FWD handling
@@loganrossignol that is not true. Model Y is longer than ID.4 and has less interior space.
Interior volume and a fantastic turning circle. Things I'd rather have than a small frunk.
Interior volume isn't much bigger than what the Model 3/Y have.
@@TBetter The Model Y is 6.5inches longer than the ID4, and has more rear head and leg room.
It's pretty amazing how much Sandy has become a Tesla acolyte. As an average consumer I didn't hear anything I'd consider to be "deal breakers" with the ID.4. Mechanical fuses instead of solid state? I can't think of the last time I had to replace a fuse in the last 20 years so it's not really a consideration for me. No frunk? Maybe that has to do with VW maximizing interior space, pushing the front forwards as much as possible. If you measure from the front windscreen to the front bumper on the ID.4 it's a shorter distance than the Model 3/Y. Fun fact - the ID.4 has more cargo carrying capacity than the Model 3/Y and even the Model X (7 seat configuration). Only the 5 seat Model X beats it and it's a much bigger car. Steel hood? It's heavier, sure, but if the car gives me the range I want do I care? Also - body shops know how to deal with steel and it's cheaper. VW is for the value-minded person who is prioritizing practicality and I see nothing wrong with that strategy. Why bag on it?
Mike, once you own one, trust, you'll care about the weight/efficiency! Think of it this way, at some point, you need to consider if you could save an extra 2k-5k over the life of the car, by just simply buying a lighter and more efficient car that can do more with less (since it's lighter). It's what I did, and with solar, I'm always in my budget, happy, and driving without a damn care!
Mike - Really, the VW iD4 is junk, its built like a GAS car from the 2000's .
Agree he seems very biased. Can't take his review serious.
@@michaelblue7852 Given Sandy's pedigree I wouldn't call him biased. It's just that when it comes to EVs, Tesla is the stick by which all others are measured. However Dandy does need to drive the ID.4. Overall Sandy's take seems to be a mostly positive.
All to do with cost, as you say. You don't have to worry about fuses or lack of frunk. (if they used one it would not store much anyway) IF you have to repair it will be much less expensive as is quicker to do. There is a trade off. pay a lot to gain what 2k of weight?
"We don't usually try to hit pedestrians." Why are there ~2.5 times the traffic related casualties per 100 000 compared to Europe then?
Europe: pedestrian safety
USA: we don't do that here
Cuz European drivers r much better drivers and more trained, roads are safer for pedestrian safety, and the safety organizations have much stricter and tougher pedestrian aeb tests than iihs or the us govt do. Just watch the id4 going through the euro ncap crash tests and it’s way tougher than what iihs does.
they try, not exactly succed
@@nickbien More pedestrians , people on bikes and riding scooters are hit in Europe than in the US. The US has a higher number of car crashes simply because they have more cars driving on the roads. Europeans make more use of mass transit in their cities and they are set up better for walking and biking to areas that you need to get to. The US is more spread out and even the cities and their roads are more open and spread out.
The first comment people from Europe say about American roads are that they are huge and wide. Even in our highly populated cities the roads are much wider than in Europe.
Less cars and pedestrians are in the same space and Americans don't hit pedestrians or 2 wheeled vehicles as often. It has never really been an engineering importance in design. They are more worried about head on collisions at higher speeds.
@@desertdan100 americans hit pedestrians less because the us is much less densely populated than europe, and we have much less people walking on/near streets. But our cars are much more dangerous to those pedestrians/vulnerable road users, because of the lack of regulations that help keep them safe.
Once completely done with ID4 we all would like to see a Tesla 3/Y vs ID4 chart detailing "The Good, The Bad and The Ugly." Thanks again Sandy for you and your team efforts in educating us mere morals! lol
VW have said they chose to move everything to under the hood to make more cabin space. From tests TeslaBjorn has done the interior size is second only to the 5 seat Model X! I had a Model 3, never used the frunk so this wouldn’t bother me.
I have never been in a VW ID4 but if you look at the numbers then the interiors of an ID4 and a Tesla 3 are very similar.
www.caranddriver.com/volkswagen/id4/specs
www.caranddriver.com/tesla/model-3/specs
That surprises me as the Model Y seems like the natural competitor of the ID4 and Model Y does have a bit more room (not to mention the option for a 3rd row of seats)
@@pierre.a.larsen no, the numbers are missleading. The official numbers are meassured from the widest space to the max lenght, and not the true volume. If you look at TeslaBjörns Bananabox test or the European meassurement for trunks which utilses normed 1l blocks and stuck the trunk full and count them, you'll see how the ID4 utilizes the space.
there are no Model Y in europe yet so we sadly don't have the direct competitor for comparisen yet, maybe Sandy could meassure the interiour space
I'm a Model 3 owner and I had 30 min with the ID4 two weeks ago. I'm 185 cm high and I can tell you the legroom ID4 provides is much better than in the Model 3.
Model Y is 16.5 cm longer than the ID4 and 7 cm wider so it better have more space inside: :)
@@arnorjonorvarsson6215 Model Y’s hood is approximately 30cm longer than the ID4 so I’d guess the ID4 had more interior space (although Model Y wasn’t in TeslaBjorns test as it’s not in Europe yet.
It looks like they decided on ease of maintenance combined with deformation structures at the expense of storage space. It does have excellent space in the rear.
and a shorter front and tighter turning circles. that matters in Europe.
I'm a bit disappointed at this analysis Sandy . It's pretty clear why they chose to move all of the mechanical and functional components forward instead of providing a frunk. As Nissan's head of design has said, you can really open up the cabin without all of that stuff cluttering up the interior. I personally have not been inside the ID4 but if they managed to keep the interior space similar or even larger than the Model 3, I would call that a smart decision considering the fact that the ID4 has a wheelbase that is 5 inches shorter and has significantly less overhang at both the front and the rear. Given that the ID4 was designed first and foremost for the EU market where maneuverability around tight streets is a significant concern, I would say this fundamental packaging decision shows an astute understanding of the target user's needs.
Sandy’s analysis shows that the ID4, while being a ground up EV design which is good, was designed using very old school ICE car principles.
Meaning that full advantage was not taken of the new platform.
Back in the old ICE days this sort of fundamental advantage (by Tesla) was lauded, many of the most highly revered cars had these sort of features.
This video shows me how far ahead Tesla is to the legacy car makers.
@@carsonj1 Just because a "legacy" car maker does something differently from Tesla does not make it old-fashioned. I wasn't responding to any of the other technical parts that Sandy mentioned, only the overall design decision to eschew the frunk. I think that utilizing the advantages of electric powertrains to shorten the wheelbase and overhangs while moving the A-pillars forward to preserve interior space is the anti-thesis of "Old school ICE car prrinciples". If anything, on this point Tesla is the old school one as the design decisions that VW made make the car easier to park on city street and lower the weight of the vehicle overall by reducing the amount of sheet metal. While the latter point is negated a bit by the use of steel over aluminum, you have to remember that VW and Tesla are hitting two different price points and aluminum is simply more expensive than steel.
@@carsonj1 Sorry I don't have an EV yet but with EVs that have a Frunk where is the funnel to fill up windshield washer fluid or the air cabin filters, I haven't been able to see them in any videos. Also have they removed the safety latch so the hood does'nt accidently fly open in the windshield? I thought it was a safety standard.
@@michelinereichert35 in a Tesla you add water next to the Frunk, the cabin filter is under the dash and the hood has primary and secondary latches all controlled by the car computer.
You won’t find a safer car than a Tesla.
@@carsonj1 thank you!
I am a simple man, I see a video uploaded from Munro Live in my subscription feed. I click and watch it.
Thank you so much. We are glad you enjoy!
The frame in front of the AC box is the radiator support bracket. They are made of glass reinforced nylon supported by the front bumper beams. The rad bracket is rigid but not especially heavy.
Regarding the lack of frunk. Appears that the ID4 hood is shorter than the Model 3. Also VW have used space to house HIVAC which frees up room in the passenger space
I was thinking the same thing.
Exactly, I don't know why everybody is so obsessed with a frunk. It seems like a solution to a problem that shouldn't exist, just make the hood smaller and get an extra foot of space inside the car.
If you compare the car hood 1:1 you have to take interior space into consideration aswell, seems like a pointless comparison otherwise. Lots of "stuff" can be hidden at the cost of interior volume
Interior space and car size. Id.4 is shorter than Tesla Y (good in the city, where most cross over SUVs are operated) but has more space inside. Furthermore VW did not add frunk to the RWD model, because the AWD model will require that space for the front engine, so they have one unified building process with less variation.
Sandy has been working with cars that have fuses all his life, until he saw a Model 3. Now anything less is not worthy...gotta love it.
The future is upon us.
@@MunroLive And it will be glorious!
@@MunroLive yes the future is the VW group products, review. Taycan
@@MunroLive My BMW is full of fuses and I'm always searching the internet to work out which fuse is which. I didn't even know Tesla cars have non-replaceable fuses.
Well Tesla is losing money on every car they sell if you exclude tax credits and regulatory credit sales, which aren't exactly sustainable. While it's cool they have really great hardware, for the prices they're asking for their cars, it simply isn't sustainable. Are there any advantages to that hardware? Probably not many. I've owned 5 cars now. Never once touched the fuse box. If I ever have to, I'm sure there will be a post or a video online explaining it as a common problem, and giving directions on what to replace. Not rocket science. The accessibility of its location pretty much makes it a no-effort / no-brainer to work with.
Sandy's really gone down the Tesla rabbit hole. I mean, what do we expect when the man made a huge amount of money on the Tesla stock bubble that he claims to have sold near the top, and he's gained internet fame by tearing down the vehicles and putting out almost entirely Tesla content. The Musketeers love to reward youtubers that are on their team, and it's creating a really biased feedback loop for people like Sandy. I mean, you can just see him trying to search for things so he can shout out "Oh, look at this here, Tesla did it better". LMAO.. ffs...
US has 3x road fatalities per capita compared to most of Western Europe. So why exactly is pedestrian protection a bad idea?! Also, it's shocking that Sandy overlooked the fact that the ID.4 hood is over a feet shorter compared to Tesla.
And the fact that the hood which will be opened once or twice per year is "heavy", wtf??
Indeed. Firstly, is it really so heavy or is just the fact that a Tesla hood feels light because of the gas springs pushing it up? And secondly, why not just check efficiency stats....
The fact that the Model 3 has 5 feet of hood area as opposed to the ID.4s less than 3 feet may have something to do with the lack of a frunk. The easy access to the components more than compensates for no frunk. As far as the fuses, I've had 16 VWs over 50 years of driving and haven't had to replace a fuse in 25 years. Personally I'm waiting for the ID Buzz. I hope we can reserve it late next year.
That's great, we don't all have to drive Teslas. Hope you get your Buzz! Personally, the Cybertruck best suits my needs.
That is nonsense, no way the difference is one foot, the iD4 has a slightly shorter but at the same time higher hood; the space beyond the hood is quite similar.
@@nilsfrederking62 if I remember correctly the hood of the good of the model 3 is 110cm and the ID.4 hood is 90cm. Or 2/3s of a foot.
@@Demobot1 So you do not remember correctly, see some other comments down below one commenter measured it, it is a few centimeters and you easily can see that when comparing images (side view) of both.
@@nilsfrederking62 Bjorn Nyland measured the hood of the ID.4 and the Model 3.
Instead of a little more space in the frunk VW opted for way more space in the cabin. Just as VW and they will tell you right away. The ID.4 is a really good car.
It’s an average ev at best.
Mr. Munro, thanks for making engineering and car manufacturing fun for everything to watch and understand.
Thanks for tuning in Hamza!
@@MunroLive We need a Munro College of Engineering
I suspect the first design criteria was "cab forward, clear space in the cabin", resulting in no frunk?
Dude, maybe you should compare size of the front compartment, compare the turning radius and the extra space, which the wheels in ID4 need to achieve this turning radius and take into consideration that there will be a version with front motor soon. If you would do all this, you would come to the conclusion, that there is no space for a frunk. Tesla wastes space for a small trunk and a large hood and has a giant turning radius.
having a "frunk" sacrifices a large amount of space inside of the car
Funny how you never hear about people (owners) complaining about the Tesla's turning radius. It must not matter as much as you think
@@Tevon93 it matters more and less to different people.
Exactly, the AWD is coming in late 2021, and that hood is about half the size of the tesla. Also, have you seen what it takes to change the filter in a model s?
@@Tevon93 Come to Europe and you will complain about Teslas turning radius after driving ID3/4.
I just love how Sandy had an easy time getting to everything inside that trunk 😂🤣
"In America we try not to hit pedestrians." LOL. No we don't- we make basically 0 effort along those lines. Good point about the hood being heavy and their being no space though.
Depends on the State, in some States some people endeavor to love their fellow man as they love themselves, to the best of their ability, other states not so much.
@@SimonMichaelBenz if you don't like the way I drive, Stay off of the sidewalk.
Yes but somebody likes to shoot them
@@snookysnax :)
@@snookysnax Majority of the pedestrians are hit while walking on the sidewalk or while crossing the road, by drivers, who run red light.
These tear downs are a treasure chest for owners of these cars.
It's like an animated Chilton manual.
I don't think they are doing a tear down on one of these. I think this is just a look see...
So, out of all "interesting features" on this car, only blue water cap had positive reaction :-D
… You’re forgetting the HVAC filters which are a doddle for the driver to inspect and replace. It’s telling too that Sandy had _no_ problem closing the hood of the ID.4, versus the Model 3, which still seems to give him some bother. So maybe those four bump stops are worthwhile after all?
@@mrsneeklamy - Closing the hood is not that positive to ID4 as it is negative to T3. But for HVAC filters you are right, my bad.
@@mrsneeklamy I have no problem closing the hood with 3 fingers. Either they got a misaligned hood or dunno what. The2021 is extra easy to close
@@marcusbiller867 That’s great, Tesla are definitely some of the best at making continuous improvements, but they have had plenty of troubles with their frunk design too.
We’ve all seen comments, here and elsewhere telling people to just _Read the manual!_ and _You’re doing it wrong, you’ll damage the metal!_ Sandy got a lot of this in his Model Y teardown.
Really though, your experience with a brand new, premium, class leading, ’21 badge EV should be trouble free!
@@mrsneeklamy The 2021 is actually a lot easier to close than the previous one, I owned both. Like I said, maybe he got a unit that is not properly aligned, they do mess up the allignment sometimes. The trunk can be closed with 3 fingers on mine.
The first responders cutoff switch DOES NOT have to be cut nor does that bottle has to be removed. It is the little connector, you just push it out and disconnects the HV battery without even cutting a wire see here www.nfpa.org/-/media/Files/Training/AFV/Emergency-Response-Guides/Volkswagen/Volkswagen-ID4.ashx. Even the orange sticker that you hold clearly depicts that. So the firemen wont have to remove the washing fluid bottle before deactivating the HV battery. ID4 even has 3 possible locations for the firemen to shut off the HV battery (one at the front, one inside the cabinet and one at the trunk), the model 3 and Y have only one location!
If it's hidden it won't work. We double-cut battery cables. One isn't going to google to find a wiring diagram.
@@kayak_1 You dont even have to cut the cable! Its so fast to just unplug a connector!
@@iliaslolis1769 Training and procedures are to double cut the cable. A single cut can reconnect as can a connector. A double-cut will end with a good air gap.
@@kayak_1 Thats not true, as soon as you disable that connector you cant reconnect it. Also, there is not any standard practice on how these systems have to be implemented, so first responders have to have training in all of different cars or have documentation on site, sorry thats the law.
Also ID4 has 3 possible locations to disable the HV battery (in case one or more is not accessible). One on the hood, one inside the passenger compartment and one in the rear (which cuts a cable as you want!), way safer and accessible than any other system in the market.
@@iliaslolis1769 Your looking for a non-standard practice. Part of the normal procedure is to double cut the cables. Thus you remove the power to prevent it from getting to the air bags etc. One isn't going to google to search for how it's done for this car. SOPs are followed.
If I didn't know it was electric, my first impression would be that I was raising the hood on a gas engine. Odd.
VW only knows how to make GAS cars.
It looks the same for the same reason - this is a service access area, not a regularly opened storage space.
legacy auto..
@@jetah50 While VW is, the ID3 isn't legacy. On of the differences to the Tesla is the relatively longer wheel base which Sandy has yet to mention. VW went for interior space instead of some frunk.
@@rkan2 so they couldn't hide it better? again it sounds like legacy engineering.
Why are the fuses such a big problem? I have not blown a fuse in a car in more than 20 years. But hey, maybe he is used to american cars and silly me with european?
With all the amount of work and thought going into a new a car it is really strange to see a rant like this. From someone being a self appointed specialist it makes me worried that he does not realize what the reinforcement in the front is supposed to do...
There are some advantages. Shorter nose, full of components increases cabin area.
Decreases crash worthiness. No thx.
@@wolfgangpreier9160 no it doesn't
@@merzto Yupp it does. Look at the front and overlapping crash test results of the Model3/Model S and the ID3.
Not at the stars rating. At the actual crashes of course!
For the ID4 there are no crash test results.
I've heard a number of YT reviewers complain about the lack of a frunk. I hope this does not lead to pressure on the automakers to build in one as an expectation. Seems like one those features that are nice to point out in a review, but for actual owners of the vehicle more cabin space is much more useful. I appreciate what VW did here.
I'm not an engineer, but it's almost as if the front end of the VW is half the length of the front end of the Tesla....
Would you trust an engineer if they told you they're the same length?
I disagree, the purpose of the short hood is just keep it to hold washer fluid, coolant access, heatpump and or AC, battery etc and allow for more cabin space.
The hood is not short.....the difference to the Model 3/Y is marginal and the hood of the iD4 is higher than the Model Y´s. Another commenter named NO3V measured from scale matched blue prints in Photoshop::
iD4:
nose to front of door:1.34 m
nose to base of windshield: 1.06
Model 3:
nose to front of door: 1.31 m
nose to base of windshield 1.06
Teslabjorn measured a 20 cm difference.
Lots of talk in the chat about fuses. I remember changing one back in the 80's.
Well yeah, but Tesla doesn't use fuses, so it's something to ding VW on.
@@updlate4756 tesla DOES use fuses, its just that they're solid state fuses!
@@TitanSKiZlz I'm talking about these types of fuses. They're extremely cheap to add to a car, reliable, and cheap... no reason to ever ding a car company for using them... unless you're a Tesla fanboi like Sandy who saw that Tesla uses a solution that's WAY better (in what way, who knows??) and WAY more expensive... impressive. I've never seen a guy try so hard to find things to fault a company on while comparing it to a Tesla... a company he until recently owned and made a lot of money on their stock... and who gave him internet fame.
Sounds like Tesla has improved a lot in the fuse department... One of the "highest-risk" fuses is for the 12V outlet in the centre console. Now guess where that particular fuse is located on a '16 Model S (which uses a smaller version of the ID.4 fuses)...
It's behind one of the panels forming part of the front passenger door frame trim, just forward of the door frame itself in the footwell. You have to disassemble half the door frame trim to get to it. If anyone knows of a more inconvenient placement of a fusebox I'm not sure I want to know about it :-P
Tesla is using explosive fuses to disconnect the battery when the airbags deploy, which is pretty cool :-). Getting replacement fuses used to be easy, but there are a couple of different fuse sizes in use in cars now, so guaranteed the size you need in the amperage you need won't be available. Last time I needed a replacement fuses I had to pay €10 for a box of all the different amperages in the correct size instead of maybe 20c for the right one, but compared to the cost of owning and running a car in the first place it's pretty irrelevant overall.
Reminds me of most of my teachers. Asking questions to make sure we're paying attention, I like it.
O shqipe :)
Are you saying Sandy you prefer less damage under the hood of a car and more damage to the head of a pedestrian? Not clear what you were implying.
That sounds exactly like what he's implying. Literally sighing at the damage to the headlamp just to save a person's actual brain lmao.
feels like he is saying "Bro just don't hit the pedestrians man", instead of considering what if
Aluminium he said
3:24 the Most enemie of ev is called air resistance, not weight, because of recuperation.
VW choose to move the frunk space to the cabin where it would be better utilised. A good design decision in my opinion.
The reason for the traditional fuses will be cost. It's also cheaper to replace a blown fuse than an integrated circuit board full of solid state relays when one fails after having to clear a dead short.
And those regular fuses are available ALL OVER THE PLACE. Auto zone, Pep Boys, walmart, you name it. And CHEAP. That's what Tesla fanatics dont see why repairs are expensive. All proprietary shit.
The greatest enemy of electric vehicles is not weight; it's the drag coefficient combined with high-speed, since a doubling of speed requires an application of eight times the amount of power.
Such an underrated comment.
Always love seeing a new Munro vid. Learn something everytime, had no idea there a cavity in hood for European cars! Ride on brothers!!!
In europe we try to hit pedestrians on purpose. According to Sandy. ;)
If you compare road death rates between the EU and US it seems the opposite is more truthful, but most Europeans haven't been forced to be completely dependant on their cars by the very surprisingly racist history of American infrastructural development either, so fewer journeys are by car and less time is spent in cars in the EU.
@@matthewlibanio8227 It's called having a sense of humor.
It was a joke 😂🤦♂️ Offence defies physics, because more is taken than given
@@peglor can you elaborate on the racist development of transport by the British in the US? 🤔
@@DavidHRyall The British had been long removed from anything to do with running the US before cars ever existed. To see how racist reasons determined a lot of the way US infrastructure is laid out, look up the racist origins of suburban sprawl (Move white families away from the BAME communities in city centres to deliberately white housing developments and the highways to facilitate their massively wasteful commutes), the deliberate features in cities to close off whole ares of the city from easy access (Usually to prevent any traffic from passing through by disrupting the grid layout and using one-way streets to make well off areas quieter), deliberate design of chunks of NY, especially low bridges, specifically to make sure buses can't be used to reach certain parts of the city to keep public transport users away, deliberate policies to prevent black people particularly from owning suburban houses and to force them into rental only and even now, estate agents giving significantly lower valuations for houses owned by black people when they try to sell them evidenced by increased valuation/sale prices when they 'whitewash' their houses by removing things like family photos that show they're black before viewing/valuations.
Yeah, no frunk. But look how short that hood is. Plus they moved a bunch of stuff in there that would normally go under the dash. I’m guessing they focused on getting as much interior space as possible given fairly limited exterior dimensions. That said I would still like a small frunk that would at least hold my charging cables.
This is what Volkswagen has stated, they eliminated the frunk to give as much interior room as possible. Additionally, one thing he is missing is that there is a AWD version, and that version will need room for the motor, which is why there is "extra room" in that area.
I am curious to see how different the ID4 will be when the US version is made in the US (I beleive next year's model). It will be interesting to see if they redo the hood and a few other things to streamline production, since they'll only be making US spec cars, so won't need to worry about compliance with EU regulations.
indeed, and they also gave more room to the front wheels and much improve the turning circle
@@jh5kl Good point. How many people will take a frunk over more interior space, tiny turning circle, and short front end? Sandy just can't get over Tesla. He seems to have a crush on everything they do, as if Elon couldn't possibly do any wrong.
@@updlate4756 i sometimes hates the way sandy thinks he is a better engineer. The id4 even has a sliding roof cover inside for better insulation when it's too cold.
@@alanmay7929 Yeah, I'm waiting to see if he actually realizes the shade's there during the driving test since he didn't seem to know about it in the initial walk around.
no frunk, but easy access to cab air filter, windshield washer fluid, and other fluids, small battery ( compared to 82kwh battery) and fuses, and better turning radius, one of the things that impressed me during the test drive, hence why the wife and I are getting a ID.4
I think WV know very whell what they are doing and have their reasons for it even if Munro does not sea them. They created an awesome care which has about same range than Model Y charges fast so it is perfect for long trips while also being Bigger and less expensive than Model Y.
The hood of the Tesla is a bit longer. VW probably choose for more interior space over a frunk.
It is much taller though.
@@kennyg1358
You’ve got a valid point there.
@@Conservator. GM seems to have a similar idea of making their electric powertrains fill the engine bay like ice powertrains. Strange choice.
Then why waste the space with a far too large HVAC and a fusebox which nobody needs anymore.
Haven't they heard of semiconductor automatic fuses and central power control and distribution?
Melting fuses are such a old fashioned standard.
@@kennyg1358 The ID is a crossover while the model 3 is a sedan. Sandy doesn't have a model Y in his pocket which would be a direct comparison.
8:20 maybe because the nose is less long compared the model 3? Around 30cm i thought.
The problem for me is when you park ( in reverse) to charge you cant open the back trunk ( for cabels) , a front trunk for cables is usefull when the charge port is in de back.
In Europe this may be an issue since most charge stations require you to bring your own cord for L2 to L2. North America, most of the stations have the heads at the charging stations. you simply plug in, no need to use your own cables.
@@DarwinChaug in Europe DC fast chargers have already cabels, but for public AC charging you need your own cabels. Or for changing at home of course.
@@dantoes1 yea, agreed. Usually home chargers are hardwired and you simply plug in when pulling into the garage or driveway. The only time I've used the portable charging cable is when I've gone camping and had to plug into the RV electrical outlets to get some range there.
I don't agree. Tesla, Volvo, and Ford figured it out. This is a must have for EVs.
Few other people mentioned that big plastic support in front of the HVAC is actually the support for the radiator and cooling systems. It's glass fiber reinforced plastic it's quite rigid but not that heavy. I do like the fact that they have the HVAC system under the hood rather than under the dash.
If you do a poll on Tesla owners you will find that 95% of them rarely use the Frunk .
If I have to make a trade off for greater interior volume versus a front I will take interior volume.
The VW has a enormous amount of rum in it for the size of vehicle that it is.
I suspect a lot of the stuff under the hood is also there for easy serviceability.
Not having the fuse box at least labeled is pretty stupid. But Ford does that also they do put a fuse number but you then have to look up what it is.
Looking forward to the other videos. I suspect we're going to find lots of places where the VW is not nearly as neat and tidy as the Tesla.
If I am not mistaken, on this car you don’t jump start the car directly through the 12v battery. That unlabeled 80 amp fuse on the fuse box has a shiny piece of metal next to it that you clamp the positive jump star cable to.
Its a very VERY bad idea to jump start a fossil car with a EV.
But maybe you like to spend a few thousand dollars every time?
You must renew the DC/DC Converter. Maybe the AC and/or DC
Charger and the MCU because this must all be encoded for the charging stations.
It's the other way around. You can jump start an EV with a dead battery with a ICE vehicle. Like the Mach-e's where they have a weird issue when they're left hooked up to a charger too long (multiple days without driving) the 12V battery goes flat due to a software issue.
@@wolfgangpreier9160 Im wondering what you do for a living?
because EV´s normally have no problem jump starting ICE vehicle´s
Best regards
a car mechanic that works on EV´s daily
@texasaltima2002
Your very right about that
@@storm4710 Yes they have problems. 12V Batteries of EVs have much to low cvapacity and amperage to jump start even a smal sized fossil car. Just look it up. Its even stated in every EV users manual that you ar not allowed to do so.
Of course you CAN do it, but do_'t come running that your DC/DC Converter is dead and has taken the MCU with it.
There is a current letter from Tesla that warns of such folly.
I think a short hood with more cabin space is better than a long hood with a frunk.
You mean a short hood WITH Frunk and a HVAC correctly dimensioned and no more fossil based blow out type fuses.
Sandy has spoken...frunk good, no frunk no good😉
@@wolfgangpreier9160 no he means more cabin space and a short hood with easily accessible battery and safety items.
@@wolfgangpreier9160 You like to spend $500 for new transistors compared to 5ct for a new fuse? They can fail aswell. And the ID4 is cheaper for a reason.
@@wolfgangpreier9160 "Blow out" fuses are better. Be nice if they were labeled though
Could it be that the ID4 is the car which has better crash safety including the bodies crashed into? (Something we in America avoid. 😂) beefier might be better for that
ID.4 has a lot more room for more steering angle. See the wheelwells bulging into the under-hood space. Turning radius in ID.4 is much smaller than Model 3/Y. Personally, I'd rather have a tighter turning circle, which I benefit from every day, than an infrequently used and somewhat flimsy feeling frunk.
The Model 3 and Model Y sacrifice Turing radius due to their “virtual ball” lower links on the suspension. But! Virtual ball contributes to a “BMW-like” feel. The iD4 has a basic macphersion strut which is lower cost, better Turning circle and decreased handling.
@@MunroLive I can't say I could feel any handling difference between my mcpherson strut car and the Model 3 I drove that would be worth sacrificing the turning circle, but my car is a lot more comfortable on rough surfaces. This difference is very much an EU-US car design issue. In the US there are very few properly narrow roads and drivers don't need to be able to thread their cars through wing mirror to wall/other traffic type gaps just to get from A to B, so a 'better' suspension design is more useful than tighter turning for the US market. The opposite is true for most of the EU - but a friend of mine got a Model 3 recently and I'll be interested to hear whether it's catching him out after a few months use. He's a very good precision driver, having grown up driving farm machinery from well before he could legally use the roads though, so if it's a problem for him then most normal drivers will be screwed.
Go Sandy!!! I tipped my cashier $5.00 yesterday, on your advice. She was shocked and pleasantly surprised. Funny thing is, I was a cashier at the same store until COVID-19 arrived. In 10 years I was tipped half a dozen times, $2.00 or less per tip. Cashiers are on the front lines. Let’s show our appreciation when we can
I tried tipping at a WM and was told she couldn't accept my money.
Clearly VW dipped into their IC parts bin for a lot of the parts used here. That fuse box that is half empty is a great example.
so what? its probably half empty because of different configurations on the different models of car. if your making tens of millions of cars every year it makes sense to have one fuse box thats compatible with every model in the VW group.
I think they can reuse those fuse boxes form ICE car. Maybe they can save the cost, but that big box just waste a lot of space.
Love this guy. He just takes a look at cars, make asumtions without any feedback from the engineers and publish it on the web. Is like a regular dude asking why NASA uses bolts in a rocket when nails are simpler. If you really want to make a serious review about the work of thousands engineers, go to the plant and ask for a tour and then comment. No value here!
Great review of the competition... Indeed they are coming
They've done that because in Europe you can drive very fast on freeways there and in case of an accident you need more protection in the front.
Plus more rigidity and less vibration.
Then why does the Teslas not have such a thingy when then current crop can go up to 250 km/h and the ID family only 160 top?
Wolfgang Preier / From 2 reasons :
1) The original design was for USA where you can't drive too fast.
2 ) Keeping a low selling price.
The german technological thinking is different than the american technological thinking.
@@mikel4879 How fast can you drive in the US?
85 mph. In Texas.
How fast can you drive in: Switzerland?
74 mph.-
In Austria?
80 mph.
In Norway?
68 mph
In Netherlands?
68 mph
In France?
80 mph.
ONLY in Germany there are SOME stretches where you have no speed limit.
And in North Korea...
@@wolfgangpreier9160 It's a German car with a shorter front end than a model 3, meaning a smaller crush zone, so the front end must be able to take more force over a shorter distance. You're quite negative about this car. Tesla owner and/or shareholder?
Wolfgang Preier / In Texas only which is one state from the all 50.
I told you that there's a big difference between the german technological thinking and the american technological thinking.
The german mind thinks FIRST from a technological engineering point.
The american mind thinks FIRST from the financial point.
This translates into overprotective technological design of the german cars.
Some interesting stuff on the MEB platform. If you look how short the nose of the car is compared to the model 3 you trade off a frunk for more cabin space. Another interesting one to cover Sandy is the rear drum brakes. Sealed units that last the lifetime of the vehicle (as electric cars are very light on rear brakes). Teslas often struggle with lots of corrosion on the brake discs (because you dont use them).
Don't agree with this. The only reason to use drum brakes now is to save money. Any other reason is just marketing justification. With electronic brake bias and multichannel ABS, autobraking, ect its easy for the car to do a clearing cycle to clear rust. If the rears are going to rust the fronts will too. There is a reason why no cars except the cheapest of the cheap cars use drums in the rear. Discs are superior performance wise and is much safer because they have much better cooling and heat capacity. Which is exactly what I want with a near 5000 lb car. I don't want to rely strictly on regen at highway speeds going down long stretches of highway especially in the American west where you can descend 10,000 feet or 3000 meters within a few miles. Energy needs to go somewhere, if you overheat your battery then you rely on your brakes.
James - the Brakes on Tesla last almost FOREVER as you use REGEN 99% of the time.
MEB platform is OUTDATED and needs to be Replaced.
How does it effect heavy braking, when you need them the most?
@@GlitterGuru Discs are Way better performance wise in every possible way.
@@GlitterGuru - Still Reliable, TESLOOP tested this Extensivly , they were able to get 300,000 MILE Performance out of the Brakes before they need Replacing, saing Customer $$$
I never understood the need for a frunk. Just make the hood shorter. This leads to a smaller car or more space inside the vehicle. I like the approach of VW. You also don't open the hood very often and therefore it is a minor inconvenience if the hood is a little heavier.
In EVs, you have the cables, quite a few and all other typical car stuff as washer liquid, yellow west, fire extinguisher (some markets), water etc. It is all the unwieldy stuff you don't like to keep in the trunk. True, there is the under-floor trunk compartment, but it is a moronic idea, as, according to Murphy's Law, it is only needed, when the trunk is full. All cars should have frunk!
In case of impact, longer hood gives you more time(space) to slowdown.
@@AndrewSienx I have an electronic car and these things are located in a side compartment in the trunk. No problems there.
@@GroxMirk Good point, but here are some tricks that improve the effect of a shorter hood. Operating large vehicle in European cities is sometimes inconvenient. I prefer smaller vehicles over additional storage in the front.
@@MMA4711 I prefer a large enough front with large enough crash zone to protect my family and me.
The current Tesla Models have just the correct amount for that. Nothing more. Nothing less.
Can I just say, I love Munro Live videos! Most interesting and informative channel I'm subscribed to, by far. Keep up the awesome work!
I watched all of the Tesla episodes and looking for the new ones of the ID3. Keep up the great work!
Thanks Skalli!
Unfortunately, this was unexpectedly superficial video. I would assume such from a piano man but not Sandy Munro. There was no context, unless the idea was such. For example, there are strict requirements for pedestrian safety, as I am sure Sandy is aware. You cannot just disregard them. More or less same is true for the stuff that’s normally put anywhere within the saloon but here is packed so that’s easily accessible. Are Tesla using some kind of antimatter so that they can hide the “technical” stuff without spending valuable saloon space? Or they just don’t expect anything to be touched without disassembling all the trims inside?
I just hope the Tesla doesn't need as much accessibility as the id4 to the technical
Isn't the crossbar used for stiffening the front up? For improved handling?
At the end of the day, that was a pretty good video.
Thanks for another great overview from the master of "let's see what happens" Sandy!
Thanks James!
@@MunroLive you're most welcome Sandy, I love your videos! You might want to consider developing some merchandise such as T shirts and mugs featuring some of your iconic moments and sayings, I think they would fly out of the warehouse! For some reason your merch link isn't working for me, not sure what you have currently. Greetings from Canada aka the Great White North, which is finally starting to thaw 🙂
hmm i see a lot of plastic for NCAP test numbers and that thick bar is also for impact as well. the hole front must be tailored for the NCAP test.
Of course it is. If you want to see how to do it cheap and ignore safety look up the dacia spring. You can see the road underneath from every angle you look into that engine compartment.
@@Psi-Storm you can see the road?
Those are mud exit points ;)
Also, that means nothing for the test. Did it fail?
Some of that space might be earmarked for extras related to AWD models. Part of the MEB platform that can accommodate different models with the same base, plus or minus certain things depending on the needs.
Given the car was purpose designed to be electric and Tesla had already released 3 cars, which all have 4WD options and storage space there, it looks like a massive miss to me. They did copy all the Tesla's models' inability to carry a spare tire and jack under the trunk floor though, so they copied one of the main missing features that completely puts me off buying Teslas (Apart from their 'you're renting the car from us even though you've paid enough money to buy it, because you can't get spares without their blessing and we'll sometimes turn features of your car that you paid for if you cause trouble' of course).
Turtil - VW needs to Abandon the MEB platform and RETHINK every from a TOP DOWN prespective , eliminating INEFFICIENCY , wasted space and overall Weight concerns.
Reading more of the comments I've come back to say I was extremely short sighted in thinking this was a miss. I'd forgotten about the shorter front end, massively bigger interior space and much tighter turning circle that the ID4 design allows. The space under the hood doesn't need to be pretty, it's not for the customers unless they're doing service work on the car such as checking fluid levels or changing filters, and all these items are way easier to access than the Tesla, where you have to remove panels to get at most of it.
@@peglor Yeah, it is a surprise sandy didn't mention that here yet.
@@rkan2 Sandy's a tesla fan boy now but i love it 😂
thanks for you videos! learning a lot..
Thanks Kurt!
@@MunroLive because of you I’ll most likely be a future Tesla owner
I prefer to have an easily accessible cabin filter which I can change myself rather than pay someonet to do it. My model 3 cabin filter is buried in the center stack and challenging to change for anyone over 40 😁.
The cabin filter in my 2008 Mazda 3 has never been replaced.
As I recall, the new hepa filter in the Model Y in China is also changed from under the hood. Hopefully this will happen in the American made Model Y too, as I’d love the superior filtration and ease of access.
I had 2012 Passat and now have a 2016 Passat and the fuses in both cars are not labeled. It was either pull a fuse and see what happened or go to the dealer. Crazy.
My Passat from 2003 is labeled.... good old times, where VW had built long-lasting vehicles
My Seat Leon 2000 has it labeled, at the site. (VW engine)
(on the driver's side - when you open the door, there you have fuses & labels, additional descriptions in the manual)
Really was a better time for VW quality.
Needless to say, hope I'll be able to afford an EV as the next car
Modern German engineering...keep the owner from doing any work themselves
You don't really need to know which fuse is what. A normal user checks for a defective fuse if he has a problem, and swaps that out. If you want to pull a fuse to work on a part, you either know which fuse it is or you look it up in the handbook.
@@Psi-Storm but sometimes you can't see from the back that the fuse is defective. A simple embossing on the plastic lid would solve that
Although model 3 looks sexier, this is a much more spacious car. I don’t mind not having a frunk if the cargo area is huge!
Again a good video and well explained things, Awesome Sandy. Will there be a in depth comparison between the Model Y and ID4? I look forward to it !
2 different ways of doing things!
The plot continues !
There is a positive pin in the fuse box for jump starting,
Very normal on newer cars.
Except that the owner's manual for the ID.4 specifically instructs to connect the jumper cable directly to the battery positive post.
@@pasad335 Have replied that to another comment,
I’m waiting on the driving reaction and maybe trying to charge it
Coming soon...
@@MunroLive I’ve noticed others struggle with Electrify America so I’m excited to see what you think.
Plenty of videos from out of spec motoring. Car looks really good and charges fast. 👍🏻
flatter charging curb than Tesla on a 150kw charger (sustains higher charger for a longer period of time). Ends up charging in about the same time as a Tesla even if it's on a 250kw charger. Rumor is Tesla will be opening up their superchargers to other brands, if true, free EA charging when available plus Tesla charging network if not available, best of both worlds.
Björn Nyland just had a week's worth of testing the ID.4. He's pretty impressed, and it achieved one of the best non-Tesla scores in his 1000 km standardised test.
You ask about why Tesla got so much usable space in the front and VW does not. Both cars next to each other but never even a simple comparison or measurement of the fron length and or overhang? Would hope to see that as well as both matter in trafic andit could as well be a reason for more or less free space.
I suspect that is the case.. I also suspect that a frunk is not anything like a make or break feature in terms of purchasing decision.
VW ID4:
nose to front of door: 1.34m
nose to base of windshield: 1.03m
Tesla Model 3:
nose to front of door: 1.31m
nose to base of windshield: 1.06m
What now?
@@NO3V Thank you very much. Great to know. So it is close to the same space in bith. Just used in a much different way. Happy to have this made clear.
@@TheEvilmooseofdoom go watch Björn Nyland videos on the id4, it has way more practicality and turning radius than the model3.
Steel hood: probably VW has a contract for 50+ years at some steel production plant in Germany...
They've also been doing this a long time and have driven a lot of the costs out. And this platform has to accommodate the other models they have planned.
VW probably has a 5 year contract for those fuses so they can't get rid of them yet.
I know that its extra money, but I would like to see the ability to plug in at both ends of the car. This is especially handy if you need to charge with a trailer attached.
That would be a nice feature. Sandy and Cory preferred the rare “pull-in-forward” Tesla supercharger when they took their 8,000 mile road trip.
The Audi E-Tron has this as a addon.
For other cars you don't jump directly from the battery you normally pull the fuse box cover off and there's a metal plate which I can see at 11:07, maybe double check manual?
I quickly googled it and couldn't find the information
Thank you!
Does your aluminium hood from the Tesla model 3 comply with the european standard, or are there different for different markets?
Those kind of pedestrian protection standards are one of the reasons that I think the Cybertruck will eventually look very different from the prototype
The CT will not be sold in europe. It will compete in the US with F150 etc. If Tesla had to consider pedestrian safety they would probably opt to have better collision avoidance software and perhaps a pedestrian airbag. Think like Tesla...they just don't copy existing solutions.
I was disappointed in the first video that you did not show the frunk.....now I see why, lol
Yep. No frunk.
No doubt Tesla fanboys like Sandy will milk that
@@GA-wq8xq It's so funny seeing people calling Sandy a "fanboy" since he was so critic of all the Tesla's flaws back in the day. The fact is that Sandy tells it like it is. The fact that he likes or dislikes a brand doesn't affect how critic he is of the flaws. And that's why I like him. And probably why he is so respected.
@@danielmonge2318 The term "fanboy" us used by people who want to object to something but don't have a reason.
@@danielmonge2318 yes he was respected but he bought and sold at great profit Tesla shares and owns a Tesla. Also until recently virtually all EV videos have been Tesla’s. Why not the Nissan Leaf, the Porsche and Audi models, Polestar 2 etx
@Munro Live Can you please have a look and see if there is power (12V) going to the rearview mirror?
My dad wants to add a dashcam to his ID.4, but does not want to run cables all the way from the fuse box!
To have 1200 comments just on hood items is indicative of our pent-up anticipation! Sandy, please go nuts on it😁
Always spot on. i was really surprised at all of the stuff under the hood of the non-frunk.Enjoyed your presentation Sandy. as usual.
Thanks for watching!
VW really hasn't learned anything.
It will sell aging ICE vehicles, but not against Teslas
@@elektrotehnik94 stop talking nonsense, they did it for the practicality, here is a video of a test by a very dedicated EV driver th-cam.com/video/8NDimpnRAO4/w-d-xo.html
Hood
@@carholic-sz3qv I love Bjorn but in the chart, he hasn't tried that with Model Y or Model 3... who cares about Model X and Y, it's not the same price point to them anyway
I was just wondering where the fuses would be found in my new Tesla....well that clears that up!
Sandy in 2045: „Keep tipping those cashiers.“ 😂
Thank you Sandy, always real and great technical analysis.
VW claims they don't have a frunk to make more cabin space.
and they achieved it cause the car is shorter than a model 3 and offers more trunk and a compartment below teh frunk
they also have used that space to give more room to the wheels, the turning circle is impressive
+ but in The same time, there needs to be a space for front motor in ID.4 X
The problem for VW is that when they came to design the ID.4 they started with a clean sheet but they used old ways of thinking. The hood volume of the Model 3 is much smaller than that of the ID.4 and yet it contains an electric motor with battery thermal management heat pump and still has room for luggage without compromising occupant or pedestrian safety. For efficiency of packaging Tesla has won this hands down.
Dear mr. Munro, Normally I really like your videos. You’re a very smart person with a lot of knowledge. So I’m a little afraid of writing this. There is a reason that the car is made like this. Like all designs, good or bad, if you like it or not. I prefer more interior space over a Frunk. I use the interior every day, the frunk not.
The front is used to store all the assessors normally located somewhere in the front of the cabin. It creates more space inside the cabin. The car has a shorter hood with this design and, now it comes, a significant smaller turning radius ⭕️ compared to the model 3. And again, You’ll notice this every day ( a design choice) . About the charging cable: All fast chargers have cables installed and at home, if you’re smart you have a charger also with a cable connected. For the on street ac charging, you’ll use it less frequently, and if they are mostly on the right hand side of your car. So opening the back of the car is no issue there. Correct me if I’m wrong but I think you’ve missed something here. The interior space is very spacious. Please check the banana box test done by Tesla Bjorn. You’ll see that it is far, far bigger inside , compared to the model 3. For everything else, a lot of respect for your opinions!
Weired, I use the frunk every day. Most comvenient place to put shopping bags, pizza, crate of beer, everything that fits, really.
@@tamasstrezi3873 so the frunk is for all your unhealthy lifestyle choices.... ok boomer 👍
The ID.4 has separate heating and cooling systems with multiple components. All together they take up a lot of room. Tesla has integrated their heating and cooling into one do all system. It all flows through the Octovalve. This allowed Telsa to cut down on space used and have much fewer components used as well. Tesla's component packaging is just superior. This allows Tesla to have some extra space in the frunk to be used for storage.
Also the Tesla hood is longer and the interior smaller, which is the main reason
It looks like the positive pole of the jump start cable has to be connected to the post next to the 80 A fuse (F1) to protect the small battery from being misused for ice start.
They traded the "frunk" to gain more interior space. Sounds like a good trade to me.
In Tesla the engine is not inside the cabin. It's more organized and compact compared to vw. Ford Mach e is way better than this VW in terms of compactness
@@adityasahasranshu7503 Of course the engine is not "inside the cabin", on a Tesla, but the engine and other components can be located much lower on the chassis because it has such a big frontal area (same as the Ford Mach-E). VW traded the long front hood in exchange for more area inside the vehicle. The result is they had no room left for a frunk. I personally think that is a good trade. Give me more room inside the vehicle anyday.
@@mikek2218 space with the rear seat flipped down : Tesla model Y - 68 cubic feet, VW id4 - 64.2 cubic feet. Tesla model 4 more space inside with a frunk.
@@adityasahasranshu7503 Yeah, but the VW has more occupant space and that is the big difference (not cargo). With EVs, you don't need that big front hood like you do with ICE vehicles. So a designer can choose what to do with it. Tesla decided to keep it as big as an ICE vehicle, but also provide cargo storage up there. VW decided to shrink it down, and provide more interior space in a smaller footprint. I personally like the latter approach. Just look how Canoo is designing their vehicles with almost no front "nose" at all, because there is no need for it, and providing huge interior space in a very small footprint.
@@mikek2218 Tesla Model Y - FLR- 41.8", RLR- 40.5", FHR- 41", RHR- 39.4".
ID.4 - FLR- 41.1", RLR- 37.6", FHR- 41", RHR- 38.4". (LR- leg room, HR - head room). interior space for occupants is smaller in id4, in every crucial aspect then how VW shifting the motors to the front created more space. Tesla is years ahead from VW they ant even make the same interior space by sacrificing the frunk.
That was a great video keep them coming please.
Thanks Edgar! Will do, thanks for watching!
I think you could assume the front brace is doing double duty as an HVAC mount, not the other way around. Absent the usual under-hood interconnections to chassis it's likely to be discernable to a casual driver (through excessive understeer or chassis twist) if you were to disconnect that bar.
Thank you