Is This Chevrolet Volt DEAD? (Staff Car Update)
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 6 ก.ย. 2024
- While everyone on the team drives a plug-in vehicle, both Erin and Michael - who both rent houses -- own plug-in hybrids in the form of the second and first generation Chevrolet Volts, respectively.
But over the weekend, Michael's Volt started to experience some very bizarre behavior. And with rent prices continually on the rise, he's worried about the potential for a huge repair bill that might be difficult to stomach...
Can we help him and fix it without a trip to the dealer?
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Why 12-Volt batteries in EVs can do weird things: • Tech Primer: Why 12-Vo...
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Presenter: Nikki Gordon-Bloomfield
Michael Horton
Camera, Coloring: Michael Horton
Editor, Producer: Nikki Gordon-Bloomfield
Art and Animation: Erin Carlie
© Transport Evolved LLC, 2023
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I just went through the "reduced propulsion" issue with my 2017 Volt. In my case it turned out to be Battery Energy Control Module (BECM) which needed to be replaced under warranty, at no cost to me (8 year/100k mile warranty on battery). This is a somewhat common problem with these cars, and some people online are attributing it to cold solder joints, a manufacturing defect.
Cold solder joint is exactly the problem! it is also the same with the bcm.
This electric issue with the Electronic control modulator has been included in the new extended warranty for volts of 15 years or 150k miles.
The same for clogged egr and egr cooler
Thank you for covering the use case for us renters!
Always drives me crazy seeing all these great technological options that I can't use due to renting
I had a 2014 Volt for 6 years. Never had any issues with it except for one time it threw a code for low battery coolant. It was just a hair below the "Fill" line. Bought some de-ionized Dexcool and filled it back up. Never had any issues since. Traded it in last year for a Chevy Bolt EV.
The thermistor fault is probably not related to the 12V battery failing. It’s probably the thermistor failed, as stated in the TSB. 12V battery faults that cause low voltage are more likely to cause communication faults than individual component fault codes. The fault code that it is setting is likely a “correlation/implausibility” or “out of range” fault. A correlation fault basically means that the sensor, while technically reading within it’s operating range, is giving a reading that doesn’t make sense, like one sensor saying it’s -30F while all the others say around 40F. An out of range fault is just that, meaning that the sensor reading is outside of its operating range. On most automotive temperature sensors, that’s -40 to 300F.
I am a “retired” automotive tech who was ASE advanced level certified in hybrids, PHEVS and BEVs. I say “retired” because I’m only in my mid-30s but have switched careers. If you all decide you want to try and DIY this, I’d be happy to offer any assistance I can. I live probably about an hour away from your “approximate location”. If it needs reflashed, that’s a hard one to DIY unless the people on the Volt forums have a way to reflash modules and the flash files are available for that particular issue. You could also invest in an approved J2534 device and buy and short term subscription to GM TDS and flash it yourself, but by the time you do that, it’s cheaper to just have a dealer do the programming. Could make a good video though. If the thermistor needs replaced, that could be a DIY thing but you really need someone there to act at least as a safety advisor (like me), and you also need a way to get the car up in the air and a way to drop the battery safely. The battery in the Volt isn’t tremendously huge, so that’s way more doable in a garage than a long range BEV.
What year is your Volt? The Volt goes ABSOLUTELY crazy when the 12v battery fails. I believe you just need to get the codes reset and it should work again. You should look for a mechanic with a computer able to effectively reset the codes, not just the portable OBD II
This is very true, the OEM 12V battery in my 2013 Volt lasted 9 years which is remarkable. But it’s also not a traditional Cranking battery either. It does require the higher priced OBD2 scan tools to clear latched codes. The cheap scanners don’t have that capability.
15:30 For those playing along at home, the first of the two DTC codes (that is unreadable in the video) is P0a9e: "Hybrid/EV Battery Temperature Sensor 4 Performance". And the TSB in question is 18-NA-342.
GM should keep supporting it. I own a Gen1 Volt.
Curious whether it displayed "battery saver mode" before the 12V died? Or any other warning signs?
If you get a check engine light you take it to a mechanic that knows how to fix these. Just replacing the 12 volt battery doesn’t always help, sometimes there are electrical faults that are causing the battery drain.
I love my early 2011 Volt, with 127,000 miles, however it is in need of a new HV battery. I checked with Chevy on the replacement cost and after over a week of searching they finally came up with a price for a new replacement, that is over $21,000 with a new 8 year warrenty. That must be the they don't want to sell it price.
I've checked with green tech and there cost for a battery that they are currently building for me at $10,000.
buy a used battery and get it installed $5,000 -$6,000
What a really great discussion of the actual experience of us poorer, renter, car owners - EV or ICE we need the transport but struggle with the costs. Many thanks - feel encouraged to soldier on with my old Civic (1987 Hatch) till I can convert it to EV.
Still driving a 1987 Civic? That's brilliant, I knew they lasted a long time - just didn't realize how long. I spent the vast majority of my life buying and driving used cars to get me to work and back. Nothing fancy - Accords and Corollas mainly. If you're still renting and buying a home is a future goal, then stay on course - don't worry about the new shiny. EVs will eventually fall in price and become the obvious option, even for used buyers. While you can get a used EV for under $20k right now, they are the ones with under 120 miles of range and/or have other significant compromises. Hopefully that will change in the next few years.
@@JasonTaylor-po5xc we are almost there. The oldest model 3s are starting to hit the upper 20ks
I had a 2012 Volt until last year. I got myself a Model 3. I love it! But I also loved the Volt. Really I just love not buying gas!!
We have a 2013 Volt that has been the absolutely best car that we ever owned. We had only one problem, that being a stone somehow got lodged between the rear break pad and roter and the roter had to be replaced. Otherwise perfect. If I like a car I usually keep it until the body rots out or stuff starts falling off because of rust. We have heavy road salt issues here in Wisconsin and usually the cars only last about twenty years. When the dealership repaired the brakes I looked under the car while it was on the hoist. I was pleasantly surprised by how little rust was present on the underside of the vehicle. I am seventy five years old and hope the car lasts me the rest of my life. I have a 2006 HHR that isn't exhibiting exterior body rust and very little under body rust. I keep the cars washed and in our heated garage that might be helping with the rust problem. Although she hasn't been driving it in the winter for a number of years my daughter still drives my 1973 VW beetle every summer. I restored the beetle twenty two years ago and gave it to her as a high school graduation present. She used to drive it all over the country every summer but now says that considering the age she only drives it in Wisconsin and only in the spring, summer and fall. If the Volt does go before I die I plan to buy a Chevy or at least a GM ev.
I have a 2018 Chevy Volt that I bought new. I love it! I've had no problems. Its the best car I've ever had. I am going to be selling it withing the next month or so though when my New Tesla is delivered. I am definitely looking forward to being done with gasoline and all of the maintenance that goes along with an internal combustion engine.
I graduated to Tesla from a Leaf that worked OK. Yet I couldn't get enough range anxiety medication to keep it.
@@thayne559 are you still not having issues? I have EGR valve issues and the part is not available... the car has been at the dealership for 60 days. no loaners available... so frustrating!!
@@cyphi1 I got rid of it in March 2023 and bought a tesla.
It does drive me crazy that my Bolt will monitor and tell me if the battery in my keyfob is getting low, but it doesn't do that for the 12v... Really? ;-)
(Still love my car, but 12v monitoring should be included...)
Haven't had this issue wit the Volt, but two things that might help, and surprised reduce propulsion isn't enough to get places. It feels like driving a 1990s car when it happens, but maybe you are on the second level, where the meters goes grey and it only gets to about 30mph. 1) The Chevy volt message boards/forum tend to be very helpful when diagnosing issues or finding someone who has had a similar problem. 2) Call GM, there is an deanship assistant program for repairs that not under warranty but are very close to the warranty time period or mileage, where they might reimburse some of the cost.
Also, GM has a out of warranty repair insurance you can buy, that could help. It won't help this time as there is a grace period for it to kick in, but maybe next time.
You have to learn to cut to the chase, after 17 mins it was a case of TL;DR. Your TEN video is great because it does cover items quickly and efficiently.
low 12volt batteries do the same thing in new ICE cars...it is frustrating.
Can't afford much, but here is a little something to help with the Volt (and your silent bob character (did I get that right?))
I appreciated the early self congratulatory PHEV conversion mention you snuck in there.
Wish I knew more about the volt guts to suggest any additional tricks, like a few hours with 12v disconnected, or some deeper OBDii code reset app...
Ha! Actually, The Bob Chevrolet guy was me - Nikki
15:40 Kudos on a very solid discussion of thermistor operation and purpose.
What makes EV very expensive to own is the lack of mechanics who are able or willing to work on them for a reasonable price after the warranty expired.
@@tiepup The money saved on fuel is directly going into other costs of living that have increased, and into more frequent visits to the shop. So not really anything being saved.
@@tiepup the fuel saving depends on miles driven. For low mileage users, EVs don't make financial sense. The battery will age with time anyway even with low mileage. Especially if you keep it plugged in charged at 100% most of time when not using.. most people just don't get the concept how to maintain battery. Most still think charging to full is a good for battery.
12v failure in the early Volt is very common, it can cause all sorts of problems and can brick the car. you can re-set the modules but you need a VXC nano and software subscription to GM repair software.
This.
The fact the interconnects can come on(you can start the car) at very low voltage means the 12v can get very low before issue occurs.
I ran mine with a voltmeter at all times.
@@simonhenry7867 This sounds awesome. Can you give some background on how you did this? Would love to learn!
I have a 2017 volt. In October, on a long trip and 30 miles away from any city with a repair shop, my EGR valve created a short that caused a cascading effect that resulted in the cooling system not working. I didn't know this was the issue at the time so I had to leave my car 230 miles from home and my vacation was over. One month later I brought it back home to Portland because there is a back order on EGR valves. I have since found on some volt forums that this is a fairly common issue and some people have waited months for the part. I can still drive on electric and if needed can unplug the EGR valve so it doesn't short the fuse again. GM needs to get their supply chain together and figure this out for me and everybody else that has this issue. My car is still under warranty and needs to be repaired.
Call the gm support line. Get them to provide a rental or do a buy back.
@@_PatrickO Already did call their support. They call me back every week and ask if anything has changed. I'm not ready for a buyback...yet. Asked about a rental and they told me that they don't have anything available and I would have to do myself, the rental I needed to get home and to haul the car back can't be claimed until the car is fixed.
@@abrackensick Tell them you want a buyback if they won't provide a rental. You cannot trust that they are not playing hardball when they claim no rentals are available. I would never rent a car myself because you cannot trust them to pay up down the road.
I have this same problem... check engine light after a 250 mile road trip me. Took it to the dealership and they told me its a bad EGR valve. I've been waiting 2 months now for an EGR valve replacement. It was the first brand new car that I've purchased. I love my car but I'm a bit soured on GM. The dealership and corporate GM response has been horrible so far. No loaner available, poor communication. Worst experience ever!! I want to keep my car, but I my better judgement warns against it.. can't deal with this again. It's pretty devastating!!
@@_PatrickOtalked to them today and they told me they can reimburse $44/day, but claims for reimbursement can take 2 weeks for approval and up to 6 weeks for a check to be sent. it's already been 2 months. I don't know what to do...I can't afford to rent a car without a guarantee for reimbursement as my car sits at the dealership under a warranty repair.
The thing about 12V batteries aging on EVs is totally maddening. It's high time they are delivered with a lifetime lithium or sodium ion battery - no use for ICE but should become a zero maintenance item asap for EVs.
I have an old friend in Scotland with the UK version of this vintage of Volt, he was an earlier adopter than me with some sort of EV and has enjoyed it.
Thank you for covering the use case of someone who can't afford the ideal use case.
The big thing that makes the volt different to most other PHEVs is that there’s no transmission. It does have the Ability to mechanically connect to the wheels but only in one fixed gear ratio (overdrive, highway speeds required) whereas the majority of other PHEVs have a full blown CVT or even a slush box on older ones. The volt is fundamentally a BEV first, whereas others are electrically assisted ice. The volt is more similar to a diesel electric locomotive. The other PHEV most similar to the volt is the bmw i3 as the primary drive system is electric, but the i3 Rex has the range extender with the main difference being the Rex doesn’t have the single overdrive gear connection the volt does.
You are describing the 1st Gen Volts. The 2nd Gen began 2016 and have a transmission very similar to the Toyota Prius.
@@ronmorrell9809 all information I can find do not support your claims. All Chevy volts lacked any mechanical transmission (automatic, cvt etc) and ford does basically the same thing today in their eCVT vehicles.
the same crazy rental prices are happening here in Portland, Maine. Housing is no longer for humans; housing is for delivering profit to an owner, or a REIT.
Define crazy prices. Here in CT, ~1300 for 800 sq ft 1br to $1600 for a nicer remodeled one. Not cheap but not crazy here.
Own nothing be happy
Be an owner. provide your own housing.
We need multi family housing
remote work means you can find cheap housing in the middle of nowhere.
I have a 2013 Volt which went into limp mode and then gave a transmission solenoid code. Long story short, I was only abe to clear this code by disconnecting the 12V battery and grounding the positive terminal with a jumper wire. Apparently grounding the terminal causes a cold reboot which resets codes. This code did not reoccur but years later I had a battery coolant reservoir level sensor error. This error allowed driving but prevented charging. I could clear the code but it would reoccur. Dealer fixed with a software update.
Ghost in the shell!
You got it.
When you clear the latched codes it will be fine.
Excellent troubleshooting.
Hope you’re right!
@@transportevolved well something caused the codes to come up in the first place, probably there's a bad component that killed the battery.
I had something similar happened to my Fiat 500 E, where the 12 V battery was dying, it started throwing up errors and then it went into limp mode. I’ve bought and replace the battery much as you did, and I was lucky that it pretty much reset the vehicle. So therefore, all of the information popped back in and it was back up and running. But when I was doing research on what I would need to do, the first thing I found which you might be interested in exploring is there are batteries that can replace a 12 V battery that are the same lithium ion as the car battery itself, and so they are smaller and lighter. I didn’t end up getting them because they are quite a bit more expensive, and I was worried that I might void what was left of my traction battery warranty if I install that.
More importantly, there were notations about similar issues when replacing the 12 V battery in the Fiat. What seem to be the case is that there were secret modes that you could get into to assist. But the simplest thing that was recommended was to make sure that when you disconnected the old 12 V battery you left it disconnected for quite some time maybe a half an hour? That by doing that it would reset the vehicle completely to factory. One wonders if you continue to have these issues whether that would help or not.
Hey! This has probably been resolved by now. But I bought a Gen 1 volt about a year ago and it was also draining the 12v battery. Some clues GPS and clock weren’t working. I saw on some forums the gps/bluetooth module are common issue. I noticed mine was hot, so clearly drawing a lot of current even with the car off. Swapped it for a used module and it’s been great ever since. Hope that helps someone!
The Volt is 100% an EREV and not a PHEV. I’ve owned my 2011 Volt since brand new and it’s still my daily driver. I’m planning on getting another 3-5 years before moving on.
22mV, or 0.022V delta between cells is good for an older gen1 Volt. Although the delta can get worse with voltage sag under acceleration or voltage spike under regen. I’m wondering if the BECM or HCM2 are throwing codes for loss of insulation errors. There is an update for BECM and HCM2 to adjust the tolerance for loss of insulation to prevent false errors which were common with early Volts. You and your friend may want to invest in more professional scan tools. You can get the VXNANO for about $100 and pay for a 3 day subscription to AC-Delco GDS2 software for about $69, or you can buy a full year for about $650. This is the same software the techs at the dealership used. You will need a windows 10 laptop or netbook for GDS2. You will also want to get the SPS2 which is $45 for a single can/VIN. This is the software to flash/update the modules in the car. Many errors in the Volt require a full module re-flash to get the car to work correctly. If you want to get really serious into EV diagnostics for multi brands of vehicles, consider investing into the Autel MaxiSYS Ultra EV scan tool. It’s close to $5000 but their latest module is specifically designed for EV, PHEV, and Hybrids and includes many specialized diagnostic connectors to not only plug into the vehicle’s OBD2, but can plug directly into the battery itself to interface with the BECM (Battery Electric Control Module)
I HAD ALMOST THE SAME PROBLEM with my 2016 volt. Swapped battery, not 2-3 months later started having issues. Then more issues, then reduced charging, then it just stopped in the middle of the road. Chevy gave me such a hard time because they couldn't duplicate the problem at first. Then when they could they didn't want to admit it was an issue with the main battery. I still had both main warranties. Anywho, I sold it and now i have a gas van and a hybrid truck.
I had an interesting issue with a thermistor on my Model 3. Rodents had chewed through a wiring harness in the front of the vehicle that had the external temp sensor in it. This caused the external temp to read -- which was fine but when it got wet it read -40 and the HVAC would only run the heater full blast. In July, in Bakersfield CA. The only issues I have had with my car can all be traced to rodent damage. Joys of living rural.
Wiring harnesses are often manufactured with a soy-based plastic which rodents perceive as food. This is a well-known problem, across other brands, including my 2012 Rav4. The cost of labor for replacing harnesses causes insurance companies to declare some older cars as "totaled"
@@cyberoptic5757 yup, engine sensor on my Camry was hitting eaten by rodents every day for a week... took a wire cage and mothballs to keep them out.
Don't drop the battery. As you said the TSB is a software reflash so it will ignore a single failed Thermistor. Yes it may cost a few hundred in stealer fees.
Might be a simple thing to look at, if available, If any of your apps that can read individual battery voltage, might also read individual thermistor temperature Check all the temperatures. If any are reading way high or way low, like -40C or -273C or +100C, then the problem isn't a Latched code, it's an ACTIVELY malfunctioning thermistor. If all temperatures read similar then there is a chance you will be able to reset the code If the temperature is continuously reading incorrect, then likely the battery pack will need to be dropped, opened, and the thermistor, wiring or BMS replaced.
Looking forward to hearing about the Volt!
And that is a beautiful Insight in the background!! Would love to hear more about that one too
My 2014 Volt has 131,000 miles and works just fine with very few problems. Add gas 3-4 times a year excluding long trips.
Michael, you poor millennial. I wish I could donate to you because I am a fan of your editing style. They have given the channel a hard to miss style.
I have no clue what you are saying, please advise?
learning to build battery chargers is fun and hell all in one, the question of why we can't just use a positive temperature coefficient resistor comes up, it'd just be a regular resistor then, CHEAP. like many things in electronics, manufacturer choices affect other manufacturers and builders, it's almost as bad as knowing that most audio amplifiers are dc devices.
Shortly you will be able to buy a 2018 Tesla 3 for well under 30k.
Next time you change the battery back everything up with a motorcycle battery.
Given the timing with the 12v replacement I’d be getting the latched codes cleared and waiting for a reoccurrence before going down the thermistor rabbit hole. The Volts loose their mind when the 12v dies.
I'm very late to the discussion... And you may have figured this out already.
The first clue was the failing "12V" battery. As you noticed, when it failed, the car generates phantom error codes all over the car. I've had that happen to me the day before the battery failed outright. You need to fix the 12V battery issue first, before you can trust any of the other codes.
The problem is, that's not a standard 12V SLA (Sealed Lead Acid, "maintenance free", nominally 12.6V, charge at 13.8V) battery. The Volts standard battery is a 12V AGM (Acid Glass Mat) battery, and these operate at a slightly higher voltage (Nominal 13.5V?,14.5V charge). If you put an SLA battery where an AGM is expected, the SLA will always be overcharged and die an early death, and may still be generating phantom error codes.
So, install the correct battery, clear existing error codes, and drive for a week to verify the car is working normally.
The battery thermistor issue is likely one of these phantom errors codes that isn't real (I remember getting that code specifically, along with about 20 other phantom codes just before my car died (2013 Volt, with 109k miles, in Phoenix AZ). The correct battery restored normal operation. The fastest solution (not cheapest, but not by much) is to have the dealer replace the battery. They will also clear all the codes, and diagnose what reoccurs (nothing else in my case.)
- - - - -
A strong warning - Don't leave anything plugged into the OBD-II port. I left a OBD-II - bluetooth adapter in my car, and didn't drive it for about 2 weeks (during COVID shutdown) - it killed the battery, then killed the replacement battery for the same reason. Ouch!
One of the last firmware updates to my volt (a couple years ago) was about restoring cell charge balancing in the traction battery. It seems that prior to that update, charge balancing had been disabled (either from the factory, or by a previous update: not clear when). If balancing is restored without the cells already being too far apart, there's no permanent issue, and the battery recovers just fine.
Yes very true.
I love my 2017, but in October I was involved in a accident. Chevy is having an issue of missing components for the rear door and has no plan as of late to supply this replacement part. I know other cars have been waiting since August for doors. Hopefully I’ll have a door, soon! Prayers appreciated lol
WTH is going on with Chevy? did they get you sorted out? been waiting for 2 months for an EGR valve for my 2018 Volt.
You've totally convinced me that the Chevy Volt is more of a computer than a reliable vehicle. I was considering purchasing a used 2018 Volt Premier until I realized that many Chevy dealers don't have qualified service technicians trained in the Volt. THAT killed the whole deal as my regular mechanic also stated they don't work on them. Too bad though, as I believe the Volt would have been a great 2nd car for my family. But if you can't get it serviced, it would soon become an expensive yard ornament!
I doubt this is the problem with Michael's car, but something to be aware of... A friend had his Volt totally die while driving on the freeway. By "totally" I mean everything stopped working, including the motor, lights, power steering, and power brakes. Intermittent, no warning. Happened twice. They finally tracked it down to a TSB which pointed to a loose connection under the dash somewhere, one that was incorrectly done at the factory. If a dealer is engaged in the future, you might want to have them check this, as it can be extremely hazardous. In my friend's case he was able to get over to the side of the road without hitting or being hit by something, but it could have turned out very differently.
There is a temp sensor behind the passenger headlight that is for the temperature display on the dash.
I love that blue 1st gen Honda insight I see in the background. Need to get my hands on one.
What a wonderful explanation of a thermistor. Well done!
On the first version the thermistors that fail are simply taped under the car. It was added ad hock after the car caught fire are being driven to storage after a crash test.(after homogolation)
2012 Toyota Rav4 EV, similar thing, only Toyota said only they could clear the code and they wanted $300 to clear it. Plus they wanted $360, to replace a 12 volt that sits right on top. I replace 12v myself and had a fit and I think we compromised on $150 for them to clear me code. Everything fine once dealer reset codes.
We had a dead 12 volt issue with our 2018 BMW i3 w/REX which bricked the car. Luckily, it was covered by a combination of roadside assistance and warranty. It was just annoying because the BMW dealer had our car for an inordinate amount of time since it was the first i3 they had worked on. (West Texas) I recently passed my 2014 i3 on to my son and I'm just waiting for when his battery wears out. It is completely out of warranty at this point and he can't afford a lot to have the car fixed. Hopefully, we can do it ourselves with the help of the BimmerCode app when the time comes. I just got a Chevy Bolt which was also the first one the West Texas dealer where I live had seen. I wonder how it will go when it's due maintenance or if there are issues.
The Android equivalent app is called MyGreenVolt
My parents have a 2013 both of us the same color, it has a lot less miles. And so far everything is working fine. I am interested awaiting an update with hopefully a good result soon. I suspect that you have heard of atomic auto which is an independent mechanic that specializes in hybrids, mostly Toyota and Honda products. I'm not sure how much experience they have working with Volts but it might be worth contacting them to see what thoughts they might have if any re the issue.
Is there a way to do a cold reboot?
@@tiepup Yeah, obviously the latched errors wouldn't reset, but you know that computers can get weird errors that are cleared by a simple reboot. It could conceivably clear the root problem.
It occurs to me that the clearing of latched errors is pretty critical to debugging the problem, otherwise how do you figure out if you fixed it?
My 2014 Volt with 45k miles randomly didn’t start a month ago and turned out to be the original 12v battery failing. Displays turned on, radio, inside lights, and a message “service battery charge system”. I was able to jump start it perfectly 3-4 times with a compact battery before taking it to a dealer (would show check engine light). I would have just had AAA or some other place replace the battery if it were not for the location/access and all that could go wrong with that. Especially all the codes it might throw if you did it yourself. Especially without a device to connect maintain the power as the battery is disconnected.
As a happy 2015 Volt owner this was a very interesting and informative episode, thanks again for the great reporting you do. As an original owner with 67K (85-90% EV) miles on my vehicle, I'm happy to say its been pretty much problem free. I agree the Chevy Volt is a less than ideal car for owners without access to a home charger as it means driving alot off the engine, which in city traffic does not have stellar efficiency. For point to point commuting it's great, especially if you have charging at home and where you work. Living in CA, I also get the benefit of a state mandated 10y/150k warranty on the battery. But if and when I do need to replace the 12V battery I will keep in mind all the points you made. Great info!
Hello transport evolved. I know you have talked about lack of charging at apartment buildings and condos and a few solutions But none of them are as nearly as good as having charging at your parking spot. (Retrofitting an apartment garage for level two charging is quite expensive) Question: do you think there will be a time, around 2030/35 Where most people who have home charging have electric vehicles, and most people who don’t (Apartment and condo people) still drive gas? This could be a wall of sorts to electric vehicle adoption. What do you think?
That's going to be the crucial question for the 80% of the US that lives in major cities. IF the industry can develop a standard megacharge, so you can pull into a power station and charge in under 5 minutes for a 400+ mile winter range, the cities can go EV.
IF the entire urban power grid is also rebuilt at double capacity to support that.
I wouldn't bet on both of those things happening, unless someone takes down the power grid and gives the utilities a chance to start from scratch with government funding.
I'm not holding my breath.
Apartment landlords can't drop a half million into retrofitting chargers, many if which will go unused for some years, without substantial rent increases. Ain't gonna happen.
So a long- term ICE presence is pretty much mandated by economics.
I am an apartment renter. And I just bought my first EV end of 2022. I live in Canada, where most people have access to 120v plug ins, since block heaters are important in the cold. You need a plug in for gas vehicles as well. I drive ~50km a day, and the slow level 1 charging is more than enough to cover my daily range. If I drove several hundred kms every single day, level 2 would be needed. Or the patience to sit at a level 3 charger. But for the average commuter, access to a standard house plug is more than enough. I think EVs are more accessible than people give them credit for, and we will adapt. 2035, no more new gas engines are being sold in Canada, so we will have to get creative. I have no idea how America will swing it, if they don't have plugs as accessible as Canadians. but I think it's feasible for my country.
@@hrksknfe I used to charge an early production Leaf on 120 volts, almost exclusively. Lived in an owned condo with no access to 240 volts, very similar to an apartment situation. It served me fine for daily commute of 30 to 40 miles (48 to 64 km). Only issue is it used more energy to charge the vehicle than 240 volts would.
You can drop the battery if you have a lift table and a car lift. It takes about a day. The dealerships wont help most of the time. The reason I will never ever buy a GM car ever again is the dealerships. I had damage to battery and the dealership basically refused to fix the car and no one else would touch it. I had to do it. My car had 25km.
When the Volt was announced, I was so excited for it. Just seemed expensive at the time.
Although poor choice in timing regarding the housing market - late 1970s/early 1980s was the height of the last great inflationary period such that mortgages were well above 12% APR - making those "affordable" houses not so affordable. I remember my parents paid $80k for a decently sized home (to me) just outside Dover, DE in the mid-80s - they must have paid a fortune in interest while we were there. Sure, they could have refinanced once rates dropped, but being in the miliary, we were not there long enough for that to happen.
Sure, my current house is way more expensive, but I locked in a 3% rate before things started going back up. Of course, that means I can't move.
If your life goals include buying a house one day and you're still renting, buying any new car is a financially poor decision. I spent the vast majority of my life buying quality used cars until I reached my mid-life, at which point, I was well enough that buying a new Tesla wasn't going to jeopardize my life goals and retirement.
I have found it takes 3 complete charge cycles to clear some errors on my 2015 Volt.
I have a 2013 Ford C-Max Energi and it will travel highway speeds on EV only (up to 80 mph) for around 15 miles. This is with climate control off. Coincidentally, I just replaced the low voltage (12V) battery.
Have a volt, have had a few problems spread out across several years, overall an excellent low cost reliable vehicle
When in doubt simply disconnect the NEG cable to 12v battery for 30 minutes and then reconnect. This gives a reboot to the system that might prove helpful. [2016 SmartED; 2012 ModelS; 2014 & 2016 SparkEV]. Also replace 12v battery after 4 years in an EV - give it away to an ICE owner while it still can start a cold gas engine.
Nope…
As more and more EVs age off warranty, we need a network of reliable, non-dealership shops. Anyone aware of such a company or association? Bjorn has done some shows with a company/association in Norway and Europe, but it's an opportunity for here in the USA. "Service Evolved"?
Electrified Garage in Maine and Ocala, FL.
I was fascinated by the engineering brilliance of the Volt, and had it come along before I recognized that pure EV was suitable for my needs, I probably would have bought one. The thought that GM put into the most efficient use of hybrid power was commendable, just a decade or so too late.
An ICE vehicle has one set of problems.
An EV has one set of problems.
A PHEV has both sets of problems.
There's a lot of ICE cars that freak out too when the 12v battery is low or dead.
I had a problem like this with my 12-volt battery. The car went into battery saving mode it caused many systems to turn off including your key fob. The owner's manual doesn't mention a word about battery saving mode. I watch a youtube video that had a similar problem, in in comments was the answer posted by someone on how to put it in and out. First turn on car then put on emergency flashers.push start button more then 15 seconds. May take a few miles before lites like engine go away.
Have you every seen/used large charging lot?
A close relative is on his 4th Volt and loves it. We drive a Tesla m3. My nephew drives a Chrysler plug in hybrid. We are all fans of our cars. We needed the range because we live in the country. We have just enough range (maybe). No superchargers in area.
Correction Ford C Max Energi will do 60 miles /hr. electric only.
At least 75mph in my experience. Google says up to 85mph.
FYI my 2016 Ford CMAX Energi does stay in electric mode even at 70 mph. It will go to gas if I accelerate quickly.
I ownded a 2014 Chevy Volt. My HV battery died / $34k cost under warranty. But it turned out bad for me any way. I got a certificate in the end but it did not cover my loss the way it should have. The dealer worked on in twice over 6 months. The first time it was put back together with a connector not tight enough and that caused arcing. Lucky for me I did not catch on fire. Now I am in a 2023 Nissan Leaf. I did have the 2014 Volt HV battery replaced at Greentec so I could trade the car in. They did good work and even give an 18 month warranty for the battery they install. $7500 for this warranty level, but you can try and haggle and see if they will make you a deal.
We have a 2017 that stranded us because of an egr valve problem. That was in November of 2022. Now here we are in June of 2023 and GM still can’t get us the part. We found the car can function by simply disconnecting the electrical connections to the egr valve. But it can’t pass an emissions test which is over due. We are going to have to park the car because the registration can’t be renewed without the emissions test. GM get your act together! Waiting 8 months now for an egr valve. WTF.
it boggles my mind that in a car with lithium batteries for traction systems, but for the 12v they throw a lead acid... why not a lifepo4? safe reliable and very long lasting... a failed battery triggering faults is a great way to make some extra quick cash for the dealerships.
@@EpicDrew15 I have a Full LFP RV and power backup for my house. they key is to warm before charge, which is easy in an ev. also being in the people box keeps it at a better temperature. If they wanted to go true low maintenance then they could go lithium titanate. discharge in cold, discharge in heat, drain to zero, moderate over charge, it doesn't care. but it is expensive.
I don’t know what the standard terminology is, but my mind a plug-in hybrid where the engine is a traction engine is a hybrid first and a plug-in second, whereas if you have a gas engine that does not drive the wheels, then I would consider that acceptable to call an extended range vehicle. You could call it a gas generator electric if you liked. By the way, one wonders if it would be practical, although obviously not preferred, to have an electric vehicle that only got its charge from a gas or propane generator. Are there any situations where there would be a benefit there? Obviously, you’re still putting out hydrocarbons, but would that be even more efficient than a plug-in hybrid? After all, in that situation the gas engine or propane engine or whatever could be designed to run more efficiently for electrical generation since it doesn’t have to worry about a transmission or gearing or anything like that, and then as we know battery electric vehicles are supremely efficient.
Again, this is just a thought experiment, but one wonders if there would be an advantage in situations where you are far a field and being able to charge a battery vehicle would be difficult, if there would be any benefit to having a generator on board for a vehicle that did not have to have the infrastructure for DC fast charging or even standard charging. Although one imagine that standard charging would take up very little space and weight in and of itself.
I've long thought that, to make a smoother transition to EVs, and give battery tech a chance to evolve further, hybrids should all become PHEVs/EREVs where, over time, as batteries become better, the batteries become larger and the engines smaller and smaller. Unforch, I think many manufacturers are making the engines larger... all anyone seems to want to talk about is "performance" (as in 0-60).
Thermistor: a two cent part, embedded inside a well sealed one ton battery pack. Cost to remove & reinstall pack? Easily $500. Another $500 to open and reseal the pack? And then only an hour more labor to change the two cent part.
That's lousy engineering design. But it would be way less reliable to seal the pack less drastically. And more expensive up front.
EV and ICE both suffer from crude engineering like this. If the ECU can be reprogrammed to ignore that thermistor...wonderful. Unless the sensor really is important.
German ICE cars are infamous for throwing codes and needing proprietary reprogramming on simple 12v battery changes.
Thermistors are discrete passive components that just don't fail unless crushed or melted by extremes, however the wires from it or the device that measure the resistance and convert to degrees is the thing that's more likely to fail.
Perhaps the thermistor is in a module with a CAN bus and it's struggling to communicate?
Thermistors can fail... My Sprinter's IAT sensor failed twice... It would drop to far lower resistance that its curves dictated. (600 vs 5000 ohms at 68F). The 1st replacement lasted a year. Repeated symptom, replaced again (new part number). They can go weird.
Thermistors can and do fail. Believe me, I've replaced them.
my 2020 bolt just got replace with 2023 bolt euv and on the way home at 53 miles I got 2 messages to service car soon for The Electric Drive Unit is not performing as expected and The Lithium-Ion Battery is not performing as expected 5 days later it had 6 codes all related to the same thing and its being checked at the dealer. gm is trying to help on this matter also. we will see how it goes.
I purchased a used 2016 Chevrolet Spark EV, about a Year ago, from an Independent Dealer.
I Requested The Dealer to replace the Low-Voltage Battery, before committing to Buy.
Thanks for keeping it real. Same on my channel. Had to get our 2.5 year old MG ZS EV towed last weekend so will be making a video on that soon. 🔋⚡☀️👍
Battery temp sensors are a symptom of a cell problem. Every one I've seen had some cell voltage issues also.
Used pack, reconditioned pack, or if you want to keep it another decade, get the new sections from GM
11:50 - I always want to call it ODB-2. It's like my brain in stuck in Brooklyn Zoo or something.
Nice interaction and clear story.
Get into contact with a dealer and see if the dealer with experience of this will give a good price to do it.
I think they just disable that thermistor because it has redundant sensors in the pack.
Replace the thermistor with a resistor xD. I did this with an apple ipod battery once. It's ok until the battery actually overheats and the thermal readout says the battery is still cool.
Every 4 or 5 years replace the 12 v battery in your EV. It's cheap insurance against problems related to the low battery can bus errors.
Good sleuthing folks.
Here's hoping for the best for you...
Got lots of random fake errors, replaced the 12voot battery and did a reset and were back up and runningm
25:04 "It's too cold, plug in" - I've had the same error message on my 1st Gen 2012 European Volt (Opel Ampera) for about 1 1/2 years now. It's only while driving (which makes no sense since how am I supposed to plug in while driving) and only for a few seconds before it disappears again. I don't think I had it in the summer but it appears on days when it's not actually very cold. Totally weird, maybe I should replace my 12V battery? I'm still on the first 12V battery and the car will be 11 years old in only 2-3 months.
I think there's a software update for battery temp sensors.
Extended Range EV is correct, since the Volt is driven by the electric drive train. PHEV is driven by the gas-powered drive train.
The Volt can in some conditions directly use the engine to drive the wheels, I think it’s above 110km/h if I recall correctly.
@@geraldh.8047 interesting. Mine is governed at 101 mph. I think there's a "jailbreak" hack available, but I haven't attempted it.
@@DouglasLippi th-cam.com/video/BVyNWmBDCzU/w-d-xo.html
@@geraldh.8047 very interesting. My Gen2 doesn't seem to operate that way. I drive 80+ mph without utilizing any gas. Perhaps the modes were changed for Gen2.
@@DouglasLippi This has NOTHING to do with how the car drives electrically. It's just that when in range-extended mode (battery low or "hold mode"), there the gasoline engine is in some circumstances not used purely as a generator but can also directly drive the wheels along with the electric motor.
I love my volt, even in her admittedly poor condition she has never treated me poorly. saving for a new hybrid battery for her
I love the Volt.
It is an extremely reliable automobile for the most part. After 10 years 100,000 miles it is time to move on or give it 2nd car duty.
As someone who drives a volt, they are not reliable in cold weather due to how sensitive it is to 12volt issues. The car was stupidly designed not to monitor the 12v and thus won't top it off while parked like any proper EV would. I keep a cold weather jumper pack in the car, pay for the most expensive AGM batteries, and swap it preemptively. Fun fact, leaving something plugged into the USB will drain the 12v because they don't turn off the usb power when the car is off making this issue worse.
@@_PatrickO I have been driving my 2012 Volt in Central Europe close to the alps (so can get cold in the winter though not ridiculously so) for almost 11 years now and am still on the first 12V battery.
The car has tons of weird software bugs, but 70% of those were present from early on.
@@_PatrickO My '14 has only had one 12V failure...at roughly 8 years on the original battery. Maybe I'm lucky?
@@geraldh.8047 I have gen 2. If you are talking about old volts, you need to specify. Most people don't care about a car warranty that expired already. The 2nd gens are still under warranty and have properly sized range extenders. GM is failing to maintain the vehicles still under warranty.
@@_PatrickO LOL, I did specify which Volt I am talking about, it is you who did neither specify the model year nor did your post say anything about being denied a warranty fix.
ESPECIALLY since the video we are commenting on is about problems with the 1st gen Volt.
"Technical Service Bulletin" is that just a recall they dont want to cover? I hope your GM dealer does the Right thing. Bring cameras, that might help.
An unplugged/broken NTC thermistor could read as a very large negative value. If that's the cause it wont clear since it would immediately register the wrong value.
Will the car start with just that rear battery?
Quite right Nikki, there is little point in 'paying lip service only' to green & environmental issues by driving & reviewing EV's. If your concurrently trashing the environment, with consumerism & conspicuous consumption on steroids. People need to walk the walk, not just talk the talk. Consumerism & greed is an anethema to living in a clean, green world of the future. People have to change their attitudes & lifestyles, we are not going to be able to continue, 'partying like it's 1994', after the Age of Oil is gone...
Best of luck, very informative.
Oh my. My 2018 Volt had the dreaded failed BECM which was fortunately repaired under the Voltec warranty. Do you have a reputable dealership that can do a deeper dive on the issue?
Is that blue one on the left at the beginning a GM EV 1 ? I thought they were all scrapped......What a nice little thingy....
Yes, replace the 12V battery in the rear every few years. Do not tow it with a strap around the rear axle, or you will be replacing it. On our model we also had an expensive braking computer replaced. And the front passenger sensor for the airbag safety system also had to be replaced at quite a lot of money. Also the fat pillars in the front of the vehicle make for bad blindspots. But otherwise, ours has worked well and we run off electrons for most of our around town driving and taking kids to school and sports. When we have to drive further the gasoline engine kicks in so we have no problems with range. 2013 Chevy Volt.